INDIANAPOLIS | Indianapolis Cultural Trail | U/C [Archive]

ablerock

July 13th, 2007, 01:05 AM

This is an excerpt from the November 2006 Dwell Magazine piece on the Indianapolis Cultural Trail (as part of a 4-part series on transportation):

Imagine if, in the near future, you could fly to Indianapolis, capital of car-racing America, and abandon your vehicle and tour the city just on foot, on purpose. Imagine if the city built a hiking trail not off into the woods or out to the city park, but right through downtown. It’s an idea that is so radical as far as civic transportation goes that it sounds a little crazy, but that’s what Indianapolis is building, an eight-mile bike and pedestrian trail that circles, in a zigzaggy way, in and through downtown Indianapolis—a trail that links neighborhoods and business districts, that would allow you to hike in the street. This is the plan, and this is the trail that is in the first stages of planning, a separate trail out in the street that is not quite a sidewalk, not quite a traffic lane, a $50 million redesign of how people might use a street. When Brian Payne, president of the Central Indiana Community Foundation, a nonprofit community group that is the lead partner on the trail, imagines the trail, he knows that the transportational stakes are high, since no city has tried this before, since they will be redesigning the downtown of the third-largest Midwestern city. “If you screw it up, you’re going to set everybody back by 30 years,” he says.

Touring the trail is an act of imagination at the moment: You have to imagine the markers, the pavement that is tiled or patterned somehow, the path as it is engineered through busy intersections—which is why Payne picks me up at the airport and drives me the ten minutes to downtown. The wide highway carries us onto equally wide downtown streets. “One of our problems is that we do too good a job of getting people out of town,” he says. “They’re going too fast to notice anything. I’m one of those people who does 50. No one does 25, because the capacity is there to do 50.”

But then, in one right turn, we are in a small neighborhood of Victorian houses and cobblestoned streets, a neighborhood that I have, on previous trips to Indianapolis, completely missed—the kind of neighborhood Payne hopes that the trail will help highlight. “Too often Midwestern cities look to the west and east and say, ‘What do we need to copy?’ Well, we don’t need to copy anything—we don’t want to copy. We want to be unique. I mean, we’ve got to concentrate on what’s unique. That’s what New York and Chicago do so well.”

As we park at his office, Payne describes his eureka moment, the day he was walking the Monan Trail, a hugely successful rails-to-trails project that runs on an old rail line out of Indianapolis to the north. “I was walking the Monan,” he says, “and I thought, We could build an urban version of this right downtown!” At his desk, we pore over a map of downtown, and he shows how the trail would link neighborhoods—it’s as if there would be a hiking path through SoHo, then onto the East Village and down to Chinatown.

With Gail Swanstrom, the director of marketing and communications for the Central Indiana Community Foundation, we start out near the American Legion headquarters, a vast mall in the center of the city, a beautiful war memorial that is like a miniature of the Mall in Washington, D.C. (The downtown of Indianapolis was designed by Alexander Ralston, who as an apprentice helped French-born architect Pierre L’Enfant design D.C.) When Payne takes people around, he is amazed at how many people have never seen this Beaux Arts view of their own place. “I grew up in San Diego, lived in Santa Cruz. I’ve studied cities most of my life. And we’ve got a great downtown. And yet the rest of the world doesn’t know anything about us.”

We head down Walnut Street, to see the old church about to change—to go co-op, to condoize. “People are selling condos,” he says, “on the basis of being on the trail.” I ask if the trail’s potential success kill people’s chances to afford to live near it. Payne points to Fall Creek Place, a downtown neighborhood with an affordable mix of historic and new housing, where residents agree to stay for five years and not turn the place over for sale. “Indianapolis is a community that watches over itself,” he says.

The centerpiece of the trail—and the town and my trip—is Monument Circle, the very center of the city, as designed by Ralston, and bustling with people and cars. The soldier on the 284-foot-high war monument faces south, to troops returning, and around him are buildings of all eras, from chain stores to the symphony’s headquarters, the Art Deco office building, the old Christ Church Cathedral.

In completing the loop, we move along a straightaway section of the proposed trail to Fountain Square, a neighborhood full of vintage stores and old sandwich places and artist’s studios and small galleries that have lately closed quickly upon opening. “Things start up and they get going but then they can’t keep it up and they close down,” says Payne. He sees the trail as helping gallery owners stay open—outside the main square, it feels beat up, cut off from the city center by an interstate. At lunch at a Greek restaurant, Payne talks about his hopes for the trail as an economic development tool and as a tourist destination. He talks about how he envisions it being used. “Eighty percent of all users will be walkers,” he says.

We end up downtown on Massachusetts Avenue. We pass by galleries and shops and pass through a little alley through which the trail will be built. We end up at the beginning of the Monan Trail, where the idea first hit Payne. I’m amazed at how determined he is and at how much he enjoys touring his own city, without any car at all. I’m amazed at how much I really like Indianapolis, after previously having only driven through it. I’m appreciative of him taking time off to tour what is not yet there.

“Are you kidding?” Payne says. “This is fun.” The trail might not be finished until 2009, but when you see Payne walking it, you can see him seeing it anyway, and you can see him seeing a whole new way of visiting and living in a downtown. “We want to create a journey that’s beautiful and inspiring and wonderful and as good as the destination,” he says.

IndiexInxIndy

July 13th, 2007, 01:19 AM

As we park at his office, Payne describes his eureka moment, the day he was walking the Monan Trail, a hugely successful rails-to-trails project that runs on an old rail line out of Indianapolis to the north. “I was walking the Monan,” he says, “and I thought, We could build an urban version of this right downtown!” At his desk, we pore over a map of downtown, and he shows how the trail would link neighborhoods—it’s as if there would be a hiking path through SoHo, then onto the East Village and down to Chinatown.

:lol:

ablerock

July 13th, 2007, 04:55 AM

mobyhead

July 18th, 2007, 07:03 PM

Speaking of trails and walking. What does your neighborhood score?
http://www.walkscore.com/

aavmarine

July 19th, 2007, 03:05 PM

CorrND

July 19th, 2007, 06:34 PM

You would think with the $1 Billion dollar construction we have and are going to have on South and Capital street, that they would have planned the trail to pass by these two wolrd class design. Also, have it pass by one of the best looking AAA stadiums in the country. I mean, once LOS is done, there will be nothing in the world that will even come close to it or looks like it. But that is just my opinion.
In my mind, the purpose of the Cultural Trail is two-fold: one, to promote non-car transportation in downtown and two, to get people to go to cultural attractions in downtown that they wouldn't normally go to. Sure, they could have had the trail go to these areas, but I'm guessing there isn't too much demand for bike lanes in this area (yet). And LOS/ICC/Victory Field don't really need a trail directing people where to find these attractions.

Now, I certainly wouldn't be opposed to extending the trail -- I fully support augmenting the cultural trail with "generic" extensions in the future -- but I can understand why they didn't connect to these destinations with the original, main trail.

Matt986

July 19th, 2007, 10:47 PM

Speaking of trails and walking. What does your neighborhood score?
http://www.walkscore.com/

Nice concept but needs a little work! When I put in my Fountain Square address it lists "Freedom Express" as my closest grocery store, only 0.4 miles away. What the hell is Freedom Express? So I click the link and find out that Freedom Express is located at 801 Center Street in Warsaw, Indiana. A might bit farther than 0.4 miles. It lists the Wagon Wheel Theater, Zales Drugs and an Ace Hardware all in Warsaw, Indiana. At least it got the DQ right as my closest restaurant (0.17 miles) and the Iron Workers as my closest bar (0.12 miles). Yee Haw! :banana:

Given all the errors, my Fountain Square address got a 63 out of 100.

moochie

July 21st, 2007, 05:55 AM

In my mind, the purpose of the Cultural Trail is two-fold: one, to promote non-car transportation in downtown and two, to get people to go to cultural attractions in downtown that they wouldn't normally go to. Sure, they could have had the trail go to these areas, but I'm guessing there isn't too much demand for bike lanes in this area (yet). And LOS/ICC/Victory Field don't really need a trail directing people where to find these attractions.

Now, I certainly wouldn't be opposed to extending the trail -- I fully support augmenting the cultural trail with "generic" extensions in the future -- but I can understand why they didn't connect to these destinations with the original, main trail.

If they ran a spoke down Market or Ohio to Highland Park, perhaps continuing North from there to 10th street, where it met the Monon trailhead.. I'd be a millionaire.. A man can dream can't he?

ablerock

July 23rd, 2007, 10:55 PM

If they ran a spoke down Market or Ohio to Highland Park, perhaps continuing North from there to 10th street, where it met the Monon trailhead.. I'd be a millionaire.. A man can dream can't he?

I'm hoping once the trail is complete, many affluent people in their respective neighborhoods will fund the trail's expansion.

Then you can be affluent with them and fund some proper developments! :-)

CorrND

July 23rd, 2007, 11:10 PM

Get the Latest Scoop

Bring your lunch and join us for our monthly brown bag lunch meeting this Tuesday, July 24, at the Indiana History Center, 450 W. Ohio Street – right on the canal. Meet the engineers, designers, and other team members, and learn the latest about the Cultural Trail’s progress.

Save the date of our next brown bag, Tuesday, August 28, 12 p.m. We'll meet at the Indiana War Memorial, 431 N. Meridian St. For future dates and locations, check the Get Involved page or call 317.713.3333.

http://indyculturaltrail.org/get-involved.html

IndiexInxIndy

July 24th, 2007, 08:28 PM

The Indianapolis Cultural Trail, for now marked by orange construction cones along Alabama Street, takes a big step forward next week with the addition of decorative paving.

The Trail – Details
Official name: The Indianapolis Cultural Trail: A Legacy of Gene and Marilyn Glick

Purpose: To connect the arts offerings of the Cultural Districts and add in new public art along the way.

Funding: Includes $15 million from Gene and Marilyn Glick, plus $1.5 million from the couple to create a series of public art displays as a monument to peace.

The Idea: Brian Payne, president of the Central Indiana Community Foundation, helped envision the pathway after he was appointed to the Cultural Development Commission.
“When (visitors) are on the trail and they're having a great experience, maybe they'll think … ‘I had a great time today on this thing called the cultural trail walking into cultural districts, walking by theaters and seeing public art …’”

The latest in a series of regular progress reports on the trail was scheduled for noon at the Indiana History Center.
The first phase of the 7.5-mile urban bike and pedestrian path is under construction on Alabama Street between Market and North streets.

Today the path is concrete. But crews are expected to begin putting down asphalt and concrete “pavers,” similar to paving stones, next week, said Gail Swanstrom, a manager on the project.

The first phase of the trail should be ready for use this fall, but the decorative plantings, a major attraction for the project, will be ready next spring. The entire project is scheduled for completing in 2009.

“Everything is on track,” Swanstrom said today.

“Where there used to be parking or a lane of traffic, there will be a separate trail as wide as 25 feet, which includes a buffer area, an actual trail and $2 million worth of public art.”

The next phase will lead from the south end of the Monon Trail at 10th Street west to the Alabama Street section and beyond that to Blackford Street west of Downtown. :cheers: :cheers2:

For more information: http://www.indyculturaltrail.info/

(What a buncha ignorant idiots on the Star Boards) :bash: :ohno:

CorrND

July 24th, 2007, 08:36 PM

I attended the trail lunch today. Mostly the same details we've all seen but there were a couple interesting items:

1. The red-ish pavers indicating the bike section of the trail should start to go down over the concrete substructure on Alabama next week.

2. The Mass Ave crossing near Park Ave will have a signal at it. I'm not sure if it's going to be a full-blown traffic intersection or just a Mass Ave signal to allow the trail to cross. There's not much vehicle traffic getting on or off Mass Ave at that intersection -- hence no current signal -- but it would probably be safer for the trail for there to be a full-blown set of traffic lights. And it never hurts to have more traffic calming features on Mass Ave in general.

3. They're planning a similar type of intersection at the corner where Mass Ave curves into Bellefontaine before terminating at 10th St. There will be a three-way crossing with Davidson at that intersection.

4. The alleyway they're going to use from Mass Ave to College (see ablerock's picture below) is currently original brick that's not in very good shape (at least not good enough for bike traffic). The trail designers want to maintain the historic brick alley feel of this section so they're not going to use the standard pavers from the rest of the trail. Instead they're going to replace the original brick with a close match and will make it smooth enough for bikes. I love the way these people think.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t206/ablerock/walnutsiteaerial2.jpg

5. The designers have teamed up with Indy Department of Public Works to do an extensive redesign and rebuild of St. Clair from Indiana to the Canal. There seem to be three factors here: one, to redesign things to accommodate the addition of the trail, two, to realign St. Claire at the intersection of West to accommodate the trail and three, the road is crumbling there and needs to be redone anyway.

The east side of the intersection of West and St. Claire is particularly tight, so they're going to shift the road slightly north and make the lanes narrower so the trail can pass on the south side of the road. I imagine they're going to use every bit of space between the apartment complex garages on either side of the road to make this work.

(in case anybody else was there and wants to put a face to a name, I was the guy that asked the question about West and St. Clair)

mobyhead

July 24th, 2007, 08:39 PM

I see this guy everyday. See I told people Santa Claus didn't just deliver toys....

http://cmsimg.indystar.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Dato=20070724&Kategori=LOCAL&Lopenr=70724039&Ref=AR&Q=80&MaxW=500&MaxH=400&Site=BG&Q=80&Border=0&Title=0

CorrND

July 24th, 2007, 09:22 PM

IndiexInxIndy

July 24th, 2007, 11:40 PM

MobyHead, I like how ya changed your icon thingy to the soon-to-be design of One Indiana Square... It's pretty sweet! :nuts:

k2h

July 25th, 2007, 08:51 AM

Another detail I forgot to mention. According to the presenters, there will not be any traffic lane elimination on Alabama. I thought the trail was basically going to take one of the Alabama traffic lanes because they determined there was "excess capacity" on Alabama but today they said that the 5 lanes on Alabama -- two parking and three traffic -- will each be narrowed slightly to accommodate the trail.

Also, they held up this rendering of Alabama in front of O'Malias and talked about the widths of each section:

http://indyculturaltrail.org/assets/images/Alabama_After.jpg

There will be an 8ft pedestrian section, 4ft buffer (the benches, pole lights and planters in this rendering), 8ft bike section and another 4ft buffer for a total of 24ft! They said some sections of the trail, those with already wide sections of sidewalk, could end up with as much as 30ft of combined trail width.

Thanks for the update. It seems the planning process has been thorough, but is there any concern that the "decorative pavers" might become a maintenance issue long-term (crumbling brick comes to mind)?

CorrND

July 25th, 2007, 03:49 PM

Thanks for the update. It seems the planning process has been thorough, but is there any concern that the "decorative pavers" might become a maintenance issue long-term (crumbling brick comes to mind)?
During the questions section yesterday, one person recommended that they purchase as much as 5% in extra pavers for exactly this purpose, so that they can maintain the same shade of red even after repairs. The planners said that they have been considering this as they order the pavers. The entire paver order is coming from one company -- one of the "oldest and best in the country," according to them -- so there should be good color and quality continuity across the entire trail.

They also mentioned that these are asphalt pavers, not brick, so I imagine they should generally stand up to the kind of wear that bikers will inflict.

Also just thought of another detail from the meeting. They talked about the crosswalk areas, which will be color-coded with a kind of plastic sheet -- the same material used for lane and crosswalk markings on roads, just larger -- that will be pressed into the road. There will be three zones: blue for bikers, green for walkers and a white middle section (in line with the colors of the Cultural Trail logo). The green walkers section lines up with the sloped curb and the white section is intended for "overflow" of walkers and will not have the sloped curb. The white section will also have the Cultural Trail logo on either end.

(note: I may have the blue and green backwards, but it's not really important)

ragerunner1

July 25th, 2007, 05:06 PM

This really is an incredible project. Very European in its approach to bicycle and pedestrian environment and how you should integrate it into you street grid. This is much more than just a bike trail on an vacated railroad line.

mobyhead

July 25th, 2007, 05:40 PM

MobyHead, I like how ya changed your icon thingy to the soon-to-be design of One Indiana Square... It's pretty sweet! :nuts:

Yeah it's a bit blurry though. Have too much down time at work. :)

ablerock

July 25th, 2007, 07:12 PM

Another detail I forgot to mention. According to the presenters, there will not be any traffic lane elimination on Alabama. I thought the trail was basically going to take one of the Alabama traffic lanes because they determined there was "excess capacity" on Alabama but today they said that the 5 lanes on Alabama -- two parking and three traffic -- will each be narrowed slightly to accommodate the trail.

Also, they held up this rendering of Alabama in front of O'Malias and talked about the widths of each section:

http://indyculturaltrail.org/assets/images/Alabama_After.jpg

There will be an 8ft pedestrian section, 4ft buffer (the benches, pole lights and planters in this rendering), 8ft bike section and another 4ft buffer for a total of 24ft! They said some sections of the trail, those with already wide sections of sidewalk, could end up with as much as 30ft of combined trail width.

Man, I hope this shakes up people's ideas of what a sidewalk should look like in downtown Indianapolis. Most of the sidewalks downtown are going to look positively anemic when the trail is completed.

CorrND... Thanks for the detailed info. I've been to the last few trail lunches, this was the first one I missed. Did they mention any decision on the Market St. vs. Washington St. alignment?

I really like the way the designers think also. I wish that much detail and consideration was put into the recent buildings we've seen proposed for downtown.

CorrND

July 25th, 2007, 07:38 PM

Man, I hope this shakes up people's ideas of what a sidewalk should look like in downtown Indianapolis. Most of the sidewalks downtown are going to look positively anemic when the trail is completed.

CorrND... Thanks for the detailed info. I've been to the last few trail lunches, this was the first one I missed. Did they mention any decision on the Market St. vs. Washington St. alignment?

I really like the way the designers think also. I wish that much detail and consideration was put into the recent buildings we've seen proposed for downtown.
This is actually the first one I've made since they had the original open house! I really had no excuse not to go -- the Indiana History Center is only 2 blocks from where I work.

Somebody asked about the central corridor and they said they hadn't made a decision yet. They're still in the process of doing a traffic analysis. (if I remember, this was the exact same question I asked you when you first joined SSC!)

I can't remember the exact numbers, but they said the NE corridor -- from North & Alabama to the Monon -- is about 60% designed and the north corridor -- from North & Alabama to St. Clair & Indiana -- is about 30% designed. They intend for there to be a public parking area of some sort near 10th St. to serve both Monon Trail users and Cultural Trail users.

Man, I just keep remembering details! They had a slightly updated version of the map ablerock posted a little while ago. It looks like this:

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/cult_trail_map.jpg

The change on the SE corridor makes a lot of sense because they've facilitated the Lilly extension while also eliminating the trail crossing at the already crazy East/Virginia/South intersection.

cwilson758

July 25th, 2007, 08:45 PM

This is a great project and I can't wait for completion!

ablerock

July 26th, 2007, 08:38 PM

Somebody asked about the central corridor and they said they hadn't made a decision yet. They're still in the process of doing a traffic analysis. (if I remember, this was the exact same question I asked you when you first joined SSC!)

Ahhh, memories...

Life was so simple then. ;)

The change on the SE corridor makes a lot of sense because they've facilitated the Lilly extension while also eliminating the trail crossing at the already crazy East/Virginia/South intersection.

Hopefully the new alignment will spur development in the little cluster of buildings on New Jersey.

Did they specify what the "combined walk and bike trails" will look like and what makes those areas different from what we're seeing in the first leg?

CorrND

July 26th, 2007, 09:20 PM

Did they specify what the "combined walk and bike trails" will look like and what makes those areas different from what we're seeing in the first leg?
The only time I remember it being mentioned was when they talked about the Mass/Davidson/Bellafontaine intersection. The trail is combined north of that intersection. They had a rendering of it and if I remember correctly, it looked like a wider bike segment.

My guess is that they don't have enough ROW in those areas for the full width so they started eliminating the buffer areas and ended up with a large, combined trail instead. They did mention that the trail will be a minimum of 16ft, which is exactly the width of the "default" pedestrian and bike segments without buffers.

CorrND

July 30th, 2007, 05:06 PM

Concerns about cost, traffic may prompt planners to change the final leg of 7.5-mile trail

By Francesca Jarosz

The course of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail may be changed to avoid Monument Circle.

Concerns about interfering with Downtown traffic, pedestrians and businesses -- as well as considerations over cost and site conditions -- have prompted planners to contemplate a new route for the final leg of the 7.5-mile project.

They're also trying to figure out how to keep the six-phase project linking Downtown cultural districts within its $50 million budget and on schedule, which would mean a 2009 completion date.

The project, which supporters say is drawing national and international attention, is funded mostly through private donations. Federal transportation dollars channeled through city government make up the difference. The city recently asked the federal government for an extra $1 million for the project.

Plans now call for the final portion, dubbed the Central Corridor, to start at the Robert D. Orr Plaza, jog south to Washington Street for several blocks, then turn north to Monument Circle and continue on Market Street. An alternative route would run straight along Washington Street.

"Determining the route is a balance of mobility, safety and cost," said Melody Park, the trail's program manager with RW Armstrong, the engineering firm overseeing design and construction.

This portion of the project has elicited concern from some business owners, who say the construction could hurt outdoor seating areas and block entrances to their venues.

Doug Stephenson, who owns Downtown Comics on East Market Street, just east of Monument Circle, said he's worried about how the completed trail will be integrated into the dense commercial landscape in the Wholesale District.

He said he thinks the trail will hamper traffic flow and make the tough tasks of parking and unloading merchandise more difficult.

"We're so pressed for space, it's going to have a big impact," Stephenson said. "They really have to look at how it's going to work."

Park said her crew plans to work with business owners to "ensure minimal impact."

The Central Corridor, in particular, will be expensive to build, because old buildings along Market and Washington streets were designed with vaults or extended basements that used to hold the coal that heated the buildings. Constructing a sidewalk over them, Park said, could require creating bridgelike structures over the gaps.

She said planners are looking into less expensive methods, but they might have to cut back on other parts of the project to compensate for the additional cost.

Meanwhile, the city is seeking more federal money for the project.

Lori Miser, the city's project manager through the Department of Public Works, said the city applied for a $1 million federal grant in March, on top of the $15 million already in the works. Miser said the city always expected the last leg to be challenging.

Park said her firm also guessed the central route would cause hiccups, but the extent of the problem didn't become clear until the project got under way.

Park said she expected the final portion to be completed at the end of 2010. When asked why the project would not be completed by the 2009 deadline, she said it could take until 2010 to complete landscaping.
She said factors such as site conditions, weather and other Downtown construction also could delay completion.

"Sometimes you just have to open it up in order to see what's inside," Park said. "We're finding out some design components that may lengthen the project based on site conditions."

Mayoral spokeswoman Margie Smith-Simmons maintained that the project was "completely on schedule."

"Right now, we have every reason to believe we'll be complete by 2009," she said.

http://cmsimg.indystar.com/apps/pbcsi.dll/bilde?Dato=20070730&Kategori=LOCAL18&Lopenr=707300387&Ref=AR&Q=80&MaxW=500&MaxH=400&Site=BG&Q=80&Border=0&Title=0

Work in progress: Chris Eason, a worker for Trans Tech Electric, loads an old streetlight from the corner of Ohio and Alabama streets as part of construction on the Indianapolis Cultural Trail. Work on the East Corridor should be completed by November. The entire project is slated to be finished in 2009, although it is running into higher costs than anticipated.

Project timeline
The Indianapolis Cultural Trail consists of six phases. Their anticipated completion dates:

November 2007
• East Corridor: Alabama Street from Market Street to North Street.

2008
• North Corridor: North Street to intersection of Indiana Avenue and Blackford Street.
• Northeast Corridor: North Street to the Monon Trail at 10th Street.

2009
• West Corridor: Intersection of Indiana Avenue and Blackford Street to West Street and around the Central Canal.
• Southeast Corridor: Connects with Pennsylvania Street Downtown and runs along Virginia Avenue to Fountain Square.
• Central Corridor: Robert D. Orr Plaza to Washington Street, then through Monument Circle and east on Market Street.

---------------------------

I'm not seeing the problem with the coal vaults. Aren't they currently covered with a sidewalk and/or road? What's the difference if they put the Cultural Trail over the vaults instead?

They should stop talking about it and just pick Washington St. They've been hemming and hawing for months! Nobody is going to miss Monument Circle when the trail crosses Meridian and this could really help the revitalization work on Washington between Meridian and Alabama.

mobyhead

July 30th, 2007, 05:14 PM

It's drawing International attention? This has to be something that other cities have, isn't it?

CorrND

July 30th, 2007, 06:08 PM

It's drawing International attention? This has to be something that other cities have, isn't it?
As far as I know, this is one-of-a-kind. A handful of US cities have city bike lane networks -- Boulder, CO has a particularly extensive one -- but nothing approaching the aesthetic quality of the Cultural Trail.

pleasantlyinclined

July 30th, 2007, 06:26 PM

I came from Chattanooga where we had greenways

http://www.tpl.org/content_documents/tn_chatt_greenway_map_2003.jpg

cwilson758

July 30th, 2007, 07:02 PM

ragerunner1

July 30th, 2007, 07:04 PM

As far as I know, this is one-of-a-kind. A handful of US cities have city bike lane networks -- Boulder, CO has a particularly extensive one -- but nothing approaching the aesthetic quality of the Cultural Trail.

This project is some what unique in the US because its being integrated into the street network. Very much like many European cities are doing.

CorrND

July 30th, 2007, 07:18 PM

This project is some what unique in the US because its being integrated into the street network. Very much like many European cities are doing.
Agreed, very European. Boulder's system is actually pretty impressive and is also part of the street network. Here's an example where you can see the difference in design quality, though:

http://www.sustainablecommunitysolutions.com/wp-content/uploads/2007/04/bike-lane-passing-pearl-st-small.JPG

Here's an example that compares more favorably with Indy:

http://www.bikearlington.com/cImg/Boulder%20cycle%20track.jpg

It's a great system, and much larger than Indy's, but they don't have a cohesive design for the whole network.

ragerunner1

July 30th, 2007, 07:52 PM

I just hope the Indy project is such a hit that they expand it in the future and that other communities in the region start investing in this type of transportation improvements as well.

ablerock

July 31st, 2007, 04:41 PM

I just hope the Indy project is such a hit that they expand it in the future and that other communities in the region start investing in this type of transportation improvements as well.

Agreed.

Thanks for posting the article CorrND. I missed that one. :-)

I'm surprised at the business owners reluctance to have the trail pass right in front of their shops. Do they not understand the walk-in business this will generate?

A decision to bypass the Circle would be fine, and is probably the better design choice to improve downtown Indy as a whole. I would always like to see the Circle's amenities improved, but it's pretty nice as is. There's no reason people can't just leave the trail to bike on it. It's certainly already got pedestrian draw, arguably the most of any area in the city. If it ain't broke don't fix it, as they say. I support the bypass. East Washington needs some more love! There are great buildings there just waiting to be used. :-)

arenn

July 31st, 2007, 10:51 PM

First off, I think the Cultural Trail is by far the most exciting project happening in Indianapolis. It's definitely attracting attention, as the Dwell magazine article will attest.

I actually think avoiding the Circle is a good idea. If you look at the map, that was a pretty useless detour. It would actually make someone circling the trail go out of their way. Market is already fine as is and so is the Circle. I would not mess with the decorative brick work, except to repair what is already there.

IndyYeah

August 1st, 2007, 04:14 AM

I would prefer for the trail to stay away from the circle. Enough traffic goes on there. Accidents would seem to really be part of life on the circle if this would go in that area.

CorrND

August 8th, 2007, 05:52 PM

The pavers have finally started to go down for the trail. They appear to be starting at the intersection of North and Alabama and working south. As of yesterday afternoon, the only part that's done is right at that intersection.

Honestly, I don't know what the hell they're doing because the pattern that's being put down doesn't look anything like the renderings. It doesn't even look particularly patterned at all. The section between North and Michigan is classified as a combined trail so maybe things will look more like the renderings when they start working on the separated bike and walking sections south of Michigan.

ablerock

August 8th, 2007, 07:18 PM

mobyhead

August 12th, 2007, 04:55 PM

From the Indystar 8/12/07

If Indianapolis Cultural Trail planners have to reroute part of their operation, they have a plan to sweeten the deal:

They'll use a "lollipop."
Minds behind the trail have discussed the possibility of taking the Wholesale District portion down Washington Street instead of Market Street, but if that happens, they said, it will stay linked to the Circle via Meridian Street.
Figuratively speaking, Meridian would be the stick of the so-called lollipop, and the circle itself would be the candy.
It's always been part of the plan to keep Monument Circle in the 7.5-mile stretch of pedestrian and bike pathways to connect the city's cultural districts, planners said last week. But it was the first time we'd heard lollipop in their lexicon.
Planners are still deciding whether the Circle will be paved to match the rest of the trail, or if they'll rely on just a sign to distinguish the link.
-- Francesca Jarosz

Unionstation13

August 12th, 2007, 05:13 PM

they should keep the circle all in uniform, it would look stupid to have one portion with these flowers and plants,
monument circle is a uniformed plaza, not a biking trail. There is a reason it doesent have the cultural trail look, it is simply stone and brick, and thats how it should stay, as to not draw attention away from the monument while keeping a walkable aesthetic look.
The elemination of curbs on the circle has basicalyl made it extremely walkable, adding a cultural trail would be a little much, and would overcrowde it, not to mention take away space for festivals.

IndyYeah

August 12th, 2007, 09:32 PM

CorrND

August 12th, 2007, 09:53 PM

Given that they're already projecting cost overruns and they're not even done with the first segment, I expect they will simply use signage for Monument Circle. Honestly, they don't even need that -- as I've said before, nobody is going to miss the circle.

Yesterday, I again went past the completed paver sections -- the SE corners of North & Alabama and Michigan & Alabama -- and it looks like what they've done is just the corner "landings" or whatever they call them. That probably explains why they don't really have any discernible pattern. I think they're just intended as places for people to gather and wait for crossing signals and therefore don't really have the defined "lanes" of the renderings we've seen. North & Alabama is defined as combined and the SE corner of Michigan & Alabama is the point where the trail needs to merge to the combined section north of that.

ablerock

August 12th, 2007, 10:37 PM

mobyhead

August 28th, 2007, 09:15 PM

I am loving the look of the trail thus far. They have made great strides. My commute takes me down alabama after work. OMG yesterday they had it down to one lane in front of the interim library. Waited 4 light cycles to get through the Ohio Street intersection. It won't last forever.

IndiexInxIndy

August 29th, 2007, 08:57 AM

I walked past it last venture i had thru downtown last week. And boy was it amazing. I must say it looks MUCH better in person... Even though they arent even done with the section i looked at! I really cannot wait. 'Nor can i wait to hear of more condo or apartment proposals along the trail! :cheers2:

cityfan

August 29th, 2007, 06:34 PM

Urban Times has a nice spread about the Cultural Trail in their new September issue.

http://www.brookspublications.com/files/CULTURALTRAIL_sept07.pdf

IndiexInxIndy

August 29th, 2007, 08:18 PM

Post that Urban Times article on here? My comp. is being ultra lame and wont let me see it! Thank you... :nuts:

CorrND

August 29th, 2007, 08:40 PM

Post that Urban Times article on here? My comp. is being ultra lame and wont let me see it! Thank you... :nuts:
It's 8 pages long, a little more effort than I think is worthwhile. All you need is Acrobat Reader:

http://www.adobe.com/products/acrobat/readstep2.html

or if that isn't working, try another reader like Foxit:

http://www.foxitsoftware.com/pdf/rd_intro.php

unvrsty07

August 30th, 2007, 12:01 AM

Fantastic article. Reading things like that and seeing development like that, which is completely one of the most creative things I have ever heard, is what makes me proud to live here. What an amazing project, staying on their timeline and deadline, getting funding, design, pedestrian friendliness. WOW! So absolutely refreshing, man I am so excited about these projects u/c and and planned to break ground this year!

moochie

September 13th, 2007, 04:53 AM

Sections of the cultural trail are open to foot traffic now.. No landscaping yet, and they're far from complete, but worth checking out.

IndiexInxIndy

September 13th, 2007, 05:18 AM

Is it not? :)

unvrsty07

September 13th, 2007, 03:51 PM

Moochie, how does the sidewalk colors look? Does it actually resemble the renderings or is it completely different?

CorrND

September 13th, 2007, 05:15 PM

Moochie, how does the sidewalk colors look? Does it actually resemble the renderings or is it completely different?
Wow, wow, wow. Scratch everything. I just took a walk around the trail and basically every quicky observation I had was wrong. Pics to come later.

mobyhead

September 13th, 2007, 05:55 PM

'Marble' sculpture pulled from Cultural Trail
Thu. September 13 - 2007

IBJ Staff

Indianapolis-native Emily Kennerk's public art won’t be part of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail, a trail spokeswoman said today.

Kennerk proposed sculpture, "Play," depicted five oversized marbles at the intersection of Alabama and Vermont streets and Massachusetts Avenue. Kennerk and trail officials could not agree on the timing or budget for the piece, causing the trail to drop the plans.

Kennerk's was the first public art piece announced by trail officials. The public art advisory committee now will work with other already-vetted artists to find a piece for that section of the trail. The trail's total public art budget is $2 million.

CorrND

September 13th, 2007, 06:10 PM

That's terrible. If you ask me, I think the trail is very quietly having budget problems.

IndiexInxIndy

September 13th, 2007, 06:11 PM

moochie

September 13th, 2007, 07:12 PM

Moochie, how does the sidewalk colors look? Does it actually resemble the renderings or is it completely different?

Darker than I expected. Mostly standard brick. It isn't done though, just the brick sections are open, so I'm a little unclear how the finished product will appear. It is much different than the renderings however.

unvrsty07

September 13th, 2007, 08:17 PM

^^ would you say better or worse?

CorrND

September 13th, 2007, 08:17 PM

First of all, I deleted my previous post about the look of the trail because I was spouting horribly inaccurate information. After grabbing lunch, I took a walk and snapped a couple pictures of the trail. Since pictures don't lie, I'll let them do the talking this time:

In front of Elements and Subway (how can you NOT love that culinary juxtaposition?!)
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-3.jpg

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-4.jpg

Approaching the SE corner of Michigan and Alabama (I don't think this guy was pleased about being in my shot):
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-5.jpg

Look south at that corner landing:
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-8.jpg

"Combined Trail" in front of the Murat:
http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-7.jpg

unvrsty07

September 13th, 2007, 08:22 PM

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/2007-09GibsonBuildingandCultural-5.jpg

I really hope this middle part is going to be flowers, trees, bushes, etc... Am I right about this assumption/question?

I think it looks really good though. Would have liked to see some blue mixed in to the bike portion of the trail though.

Unionstation13

September 14th, 2007, 02:19 AM

its looking good!
I wish they'd spread it to cottage home infront of my house hehehe.

ablerock

September 14th, 2007, 03:05 AM

That's terrible. If you ask me, I think the trail is very quietly having budget problems.

Not too quietly. They've mentioned this at meetings. I hope some local philanthropists step up and help fund what's lacking.

I'm disappointed about Emily's separation from the project. She's a friend of mine. I was very proud that she was involved.

I don't think that these are omen's of the trail falling apart, just a logistical rough spot. They'll get it figured out. Indianapolis always pulls together to finish what they start, good or bad. :-)

Thanks for posting the pics CorrND. I've been meaning to for weeks!

CorrND

September 14th, 2007, 05:28 PM

Not too quietly. They've mentioned this at meetings. I hope some local philanthropists step up and help fund what's lacking.
Ahhh, good point -- since it's not a city project with defined funding limits, they can always just get more donations. It might be a little cheesy, but they could designate a small section of the trail for bricks with the names of the donors on them. They'd probably see a big increase in "small fry" donations from people that just want to see their name.

Thanks for posting the pics CorrND. I've been meaning to for weeks!
No problem. I love getting out and taking pictures, though I don't really know what I'm doing! Your pictures of the Central Library and Ambassador Apartment building were incredible.

ablerock

September 16th, 2007, 08:47 PM

Ahhh, good point -- since it's not a city project with defined funding limits, they can always just get more donations. It might be a little cheesy, but they could designate a small section of the trail for bricks with the names of the donors on them. They'd probably see a big increase in "small fry" donations from people that just want to see their name.

No problem. I love getting out and taking pictures, though I don't really know what I'm doing! Your pictures of the Central Library and Ambassador Apartment building were incredible.

I think the donor bricks are a great idea. The City Market raised quite a bit of money years ago doing the same thing.

Thanks for the complement. :-)

I am really looking forward to the new lights being installed. They are going to make the city look a bit more sophisticated and glamorous.

I love this project!

IndiexInxIndy

September 17th, 2007, 01:06 AM

Here's to success on the rest of the Cultural Trail! :cheers2:

IndiexInxIndy

September 22nd, 2007, 09:13 PM

If they are running this trail thru The Circle OR are they bringing it across Washington Street? I really, REALLY hope it's the Washington St. plan! :)

ablerock

September 26th, 2007, 06:37 PM

If they are running this trail thru The Circle OR are they bringing it across Washington Street? I really, REALLY hope it's the Washington St. plan! :)

I went to the Indianapolis Cultural Trail lunch yesterday. Not much in the way of new developments, just a few tidbits. There was one interesting comment regarding your question, IndiexInxIndy.

The trail representative said the Indianapolis Star's recent article was very misleading. She said, "There's never been a question of whether the trail will go around The Circle. The Trail will definitely go around the circle." The decision they are working on now is whether to connect The Trail to The Circle using Market Street, or Washington Street (the lolliop alternative). I've been back-and-forth on my opinion of this, but I trust the designers. They won't ruin The Circle. It will be a great asset to The Circle, and a completely unique amenity that no other city can claim.

The Trail's lights will be about 45 feet apart, and you can see similar examples at the roundabout in front of Lilly's Faris 2 building (right across from The Slippery Noodle). For those that haven't seen examples, they are slim tubes with lights at the top. I think the lights for the ICT will be better. Lilly's have been painted a bad shade of beige to match the campus. They look very contemporary and chic at night. I think the lights are going to help the city's aesthetics immensely.

Parking along The Trail will utilize kiosks. The Trail will be open 24-7, as it is along public streets that are open, you guessed it, 24-7.

Emily Kennerk's artwork proposal fell through because of timing logistics. They have a well-qualified board working on artist selections, and they've got quite a long list of local and international artists they'd like to employ.

The ICT has been designed for very heavy use, is extremely durable, and will last a very long time. They expect over 1 million users in its first year of the use (after the complete trail has been constructed).

CorrND

September 26th, 2007, 07:23 PM

Regarding the Washington vs. Market routing: I don't question the designer's ability to integrate the Cultural Trail into the Circle. I question the necessity of designing and building a trail segment on the Circle -- seems like a waste of money. It's already a slow-moving, pedestrian and bike-friendly area, one of the few in the city. Why do we need specific markings and lanes to reinforce this?

Oh, and thanks for the update ablerock!

ablerock

October 4th, 2007, 12:53 AM

Big day for the trail! (At least, I was looking forward to it.)

They installed most of the lights today. They're bigger and more closely spaced than I imagined. They're about 12' tall and according to the last meeting, 45' apart. I think they give the trail a bit of an Art Deco feel in some sections. It's a much more powerful aesthetic impact on the urban fabric than anything we've seen yet, as they're much more visible from far away.

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1222/1479549890_eb1bc7a277_b.jpg

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1007/1478686225_e7eb41afa3_b.jpg

There are a couple more pictures of them on my flickr page (below). :-)

IndiexInxIndy

October 4th, 2007, 03:16 AM

Those are MUCH more closely together than i first thought! Nice. I really LUST the Cultural Trail! And yea... on a side note, aerial photos really don't do Indy justice. If you wanna see how urban Indy reeeally is, street life shots are where it's at! :cheers2:

mobyhead

October 4th, 2007, 03:54 PM

I am digging those lights!

CorrND

October 4th, 2007, 04:29 PM

This was probably a foregone conclusion, but last night the IHPC officially approved the removal of the old pavers on the alleyway between Mass Ave and College. There was simply no way to make use of the old pavers in a pedestrian project that was up to the standards of the Americans with Disabilities Act. Instead, they're going to use the new pavers with the edge lined with the old pavers, slightly raised. I got confused during the presentation and couldn't tell if they're going to line both sides or just one side of the trail. The old pavers are going to be "nicely" pulled up and stored by DPW, to be used by Chatham Arch in future brick alleyway refurbishments.

ablerock

October 4th, 2007, 05:07 PM

mobyhead

October 11th, 2007, 05:39 PM

The west side of Alabama Street is all tore up. Are they re-doing the sewers on that side to accommodate for the trail?

CorrND

October 11th, 2007, 05:40 PM

The west side of Alabama Street is all tore up. Are they re-doing the sewers on that side to accommodate for the trail?
I know they're redoing all corners of any intersection the trail passes through, not just those associated with the trail. Maybe it has to do with that?

mobyhead

October 11th, 2007, 06:07 PM

They are tearing up the sidewalk and curb in front the old apartment building across from the Subway, south of gas station too. All in all it's coming along nicely. That have had decent dry weather all summer to work on it too.

idyllic indy

October 16th, 2007, 06:08 AM

I hadn't realized that the trail was going to completely avoid Mass Ave from Alabama to College. Apparently, all the perpendicular parking on the Ave was indispensable. Not sure if I'm in the minority, but I never thought the parking configuration had anything to do with the success of Mass Ave. I was excited to see how the City would manage to fit the Trail onto Mass Ave. Even though they're not putting the trail there I'd like to see something different, perhaps reverse angle parking, if not parallel. That would seem to free more space for landscaping, outdoor seating, and whatever, as well make it safer to pull back out into traffic.

Unionstation13

October 16th, 2007, 06:03 PM

ablerock

October 16th, 2007, 09:03 PM

Urban Indy (http://urbanindy.blogspot.com/) found a nice write-up of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail in Streetsblog (http://www.streetsblog.org/), which is based in NYC.

http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/15/indianapolis-paves-the-way-for-bikes-and-pedestrians/

UrbanIndy

October 16th, 2007, 09:55 PM

Unionstation13

October 16th, 2007, 10:06 PM

^^ Interesting blog, I never knew the cultural trail was such a bold idea. If anything, I thought it was just merely the start of a pedestrian oriented city.

ablerock

October 17th, 2007, 10:03 PM

Thanks Able, I was just thinking about posting that in this thread, but you saved me the self-promotion.

I wrote the cultural trail peeps and told them about it (and our thread) too. They said they didn't know anything about lil' ol' skyscrapercity.com but had gotten lots of messages about the streetsblog story. Just FYI, I let them know I found it through your site. :-)

k2h

October 18th, 2007, 07:28 AM

^^ Interesting blog, I never knew the cultural trail was such a bold idea. If anything, I thought it was just merely the start of a pedestrian oriented city.

It is definitely a bold and brilliant idea. This trail will be a city amenity that will be the envy of other cities. I can't wait until this thing is completed.

ablerock

October 18th, 2007, 04:57 PM

It is definitely a bold and brilliant idea. This trail will be a city amenity that will be the envy of other cities. I can't wait until this thing is completed.

Word. It's impact is going to be huge. Just this first little section is changing the feel of the area it runs through so much. And that area is already doing fairly well, especially where Mass and Alabama intersect. I can't wait to see the positive effect it has on the uglier areas of the city it runs through.

CorrND

October 18th, 2007, 09:27 PM

Word. It's impact is going to be huge. Just this first little section is changing the feel of the area it runs through so much. And that area is already doing fairly well, especially where Mass and Alabama intersect. I can't wait to see the positive effect it has on the uglier areas of the city it runs through.
Agreed. I'm REALLY curious about the Walnut St. section from the canal to the American Legion Mall. Between Senate and Capitol, they originally said they intended to vacate Walnut for exclusive trail use. That could be very interesting, particularly since there are two old buildings on that block begging to be refurb'd for little shops/cafes on the ground level. Maybe I'll try to make it out to the next brown bag lunch so I can ask them about that.

http://indyculturaltrail.com/get-involved.html

Unionstation13

October 18th, 2007, 11:38 PM

Agreed. I'm REALLY curious about the Walnut St. section from the canal to the American Legion Mall. Between Senate and Capitol, they originally said they intended to vacate Walnut for exclusive trail use. That could be very interesting, particularly since there are two old buildings on that block begging to be refurb'd for little shops/cafes on the ground level. Maybe I'll try to make it out to the next brown bag lunch so I can ask them about that.

http://indyculturaltrail.com/get-involved.html

I wonder how much dense development this could encourage?

k2h

October 20th, 2007, 08:05 PM

http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/ti/91CB63A9/ict_nl_hdr.jpghttp://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/ti/91CB63A9/_space.gif

October Trail Talk Update

This is an updated version of Trail Talk with a few minor changes. Please disregard the previous version of Trail Talk sent to you earlier today. Thank you!

Alabama Street to be Repaved
http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/ei/27AD65DD/qclu/DSC01822.JPG
Alabama Street from North to Market streets will be milled, repaved, and re-striped the last two weeks of October. “Since Alabama Street is especially wide, the Cultural Trail does not take away a lane of parking or traffic,” explained Lori Miser, Department of Public Works lead administrator for the Cultural Trail. “The street will be repaved and re-striped with slightly more narrow lanes to maintain the current number of lanes for parking and traffic.”
The photo (right) shows Alabama Street looking south, between North Street and Michigan Street in front of the Murat Theatre. It also shows the recently installed Cultural Trail light fixtures.
The Department of Public Works (DPW) advises you to take alternate routes around Alabama Street from approximately October 22 through November 2.
For more information, please contact the Cultural Trail office: 317.713.3333 or contact@IndyCulturalTrail.org (Contact@IndyCulturalTrail.org).

NYC Streets Renaissance Posts Glowing Blog on Cultural Trail

The Project for Public Spaces (PPS), a nonprofit urban design and planning organization based in New York City, posted this blog on the Cultural Trail after visiting Indianapolis earlier this month to provide placemaking training for regional neighborhood and parks planners:
http://www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/15/indianapolis-paves-the-way-for-bikes-and-pedestrians/ (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/t/1/l/hylit/awjkhd/www.streetsblog.org/2007/10/15/indianapolis-paves-the-way-for-bikes-and-pedestrians/)
“Indianapolis, Indiana is making what could be the boldest step of any North American city towards supporting bicyclists and pedestrians,” said Ethan Kent, vice president for PPS.
For more information on the Project for Public Spaces, visit www.pps.org (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/t/1/l/hylit/awjkhd/www.pps.org).

Next Brown Bag Lunch: Tues., Oct. 23

Please join us for our next update on the Indianapolis Cultural Trail.
When: Tuesday, October 23, 12:00 to 1:00 p.m.
Where: One America Building, Main Auditorium, first floor, located on the northwest corner of Ohio St. and Illinois St.
Bring: Your lunch, questions and curiosity
Register: Not necessary
Bring your lunch and join the Cultural Trail team the fourth Tuesday of each month to ask questions and learn more. All Brown Bag lunches are from 12:00 to 1:00 p.m.
November Brown Bag Lunch:
Tuesday, November 27, 12:00 to 1:00 p.m.
IUPUI – HR224 in Eskenazi Hall, home of the Herron School of Art and Design, 735 West New York Street. Off campus visitors can park in the Natatorium garage to the west of the building or take the IndyGo Red Line (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/t/1/l/hylit/awjkhd/www.indygo.net/red_line.htm) FREE Downtown/IUPUI Circulator.

Considering Year-End Contributions?
Believe it or not, the end of the year is only 10 weeks away! Making a charitable contribution to support the Indianapolis Cultural Trail is a great way to support this unique project, honor a friend or loved one for the holidays, and receive a tax deduction on your 2007 tax return when you make a gift by December 31.
To date, we have raised nearly $40 million of our $50.35 million budget and more than half of this has come from generous private donations from individuals, foundations, and businesses. Help us thank the donors (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/t/1/l/hylit/awjkhd/www.indyculturaltrail.org/donor-recognition.html) who are playing a major role in making this project possible.
For more information on making a gift to the Cultural Trail, contact Gail Swanstrom, 317.713.3333 or e-mail Gail@IndyCulturalTrail.org (Gail@IndyCulturalTrail.org).

http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/ti/91CB63A9/_space.gifhttp://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/ti/91CB63A9/indy-cicf-logos.gif
Contact Us: 317.713.3333 Contact@IndyCulturalTrail.org (Contact@IndyCulturalTrail.org) www.IndyCulturalTrail.org (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend1.com/t/1/l/hylit/awjkhd/www.IndyCulturalTrail.org)
This email was sent by:
Indianapolis Cultural Trail Union Station, 300 S. Meridian Street Indianapolis, IN 46225 USA

ablerock

October 22nd, 2007, 08:13 PM

Agreed. I'm REALLY curious about the Walnut St. section from the canal to the American Legion Mall. Between Senate and Capitol, they originally said they intended to vacate Walnut for exclusive trail use.
http://indyculturaltrail.com/get-involved.html

The map indicates it will be vacated.

I did a driving tour of the trail on Friday. You are right CorrND, the area of Walnut to be vacated has amazing potential. That area may feel the most impact. It's hidden away, but beautiful with factory building just screaming for rehab. I can't wait to see the whole trail lit up. I wish I could flash-forward 10 years to see what happens!

Does anyone else feel the lights are too closely spaced? I don't hate it, but it feels a little cramped. It's fine when viewed perpendicularly, but when you look down the street, it makes a wonky line. It doesn't look very high-end.

I think they could variate lighting styles at the current spacing, or double the spacing they have now.

Unionstation13

October 22nd, 2007, 08:20 PM

The map indicates it will be vacated.

I did a driving tour of the trail on Friday. You are right CorrND, the area of Walnut to be vacated has amazing potential. That area may feel the most impact. It's hidden away, but beautiful with factory building just screaming for rehab. I can't wait to see the whole trail lit up. I wish I could flash-forward 10 years to see what happens!

Does anyone else feel the lights are too closely spaced? I don't hate it, but it feels a little cramped. It's fine when viewed perpendicularly, but when you look down the street, it makes a wonky line. It doesn't look very high-end.

I think they could variate lighting styles at the current spacing, or double the spacing they have now.

I think we will see ALOT on Virginia avenue once the trail is finished.
Maybe they did it to make people feel safer or something like that(like its really going to make a difference).
I am curiouse if they are going to remove the old looking antique street lamps on Mass ave, they are pretty nice the way they are. I love the new street lamps, very art-deco-ish, but I'd like to see more types of street lamps.

arenn

October 22nd, 2007, 08:52 PM

ablerock, I love the high density lighting. Indy has one of the poorest street light systems around. The light standards for the Cultural Trail are handsome and will do wonders for the downtown. The alignment and spacing are not quite as exactly regular as I would like, but it is pretty good.

IndyYeah

October 24th, 2007, 03:10 AM

UrbanIndy

October 24th, 2007, 03:20 AM

Are bikes and people alowed on parts of the trail yet, or do complete sections have to be finished first?

Yes, in fact the other day some guy was really racing his bike down it...

IndyTampaTom

October 24th, 2007, 08:32 PM

Unionstation13

October 24th, 2007, 08:40 PM

^^ is it still going to be known as Walnut street?
Wasen't there a proposal to do the same with Virginia avenue?

IndyTampaTom

October 24th, 2007, 09:12 PM

I guess I do see what you mean on the cultural trail map - how the roadway (in white) is not shown for Walnut between Senate and Capitol. I guess for only that block - it probably shouldn't cause too much of a problem to vacate the street.

UrbanIndy

October 24th, 2007, 09:14 PM

CorrND

October 24th, 2007, 09:18 PM

Are you sure they're going to VACATE Walnut Street? That doesn't make any sense to me. The roadway is very wide and has very little traffic. Currently the street is wide enough for about four lanes, as far as I can remember. They could easily just make the roadway half as wide, leaving room for two lanes of motorized vehicle traffic and then still have room to put in a bicycle path and pedestrian walkways. That would make a great, all-purpose street. Why would anyone want to make the right-of-way unable to be used by cars as well when all there's plenty of room. I love bikes and walkways but don't see why cars couldn't use this street as well. Removing an historic street from downtown doesn't seem like it would help with future development in this area.
The very wide section you're talking about is between between Capitol and Meridian. You're right, it's at least 4 lanes wide, marked for 1 lane each direction and two parking lanes. The plan for that segment is for the trail to go right down the middle of the road, I think as a raised median.

The section to be vacated is between Senate and Capitol and it's very narrow, just enough for a travel lane each direction. The road continues to the west for about a half-block where it dead-ends at the canal, so losing the previous block to vehicular traffic is really no loss.

You can see the difference in width on this overhead shot:

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/walnut.jpg

(sorry, looks like the conversation continued while I was preparing this post and things were already cleared up!)

IndyTampaTom

October 25th, 2007, 09:51 PM

Thanks for the information and the aerial photo. That helps explain the reasoning for vacating that block.

Unionstation13

October 25th, 2007, 10:55 PM

The very wide section you're talking about is between between Capitol and Meridian. You're right, it's at least 4 lanes wide, marked for 1 lane each direction and two parking lanes. The plan for that segment is for the trail to go right down the middle of the road, I think as a raised median.

The section to be vacated is between Senate and Capitol and it's very narrow, just enough for a travel lane each direction. The road continues to the west for about a half-block where it dead-ends at the canal, so losing the previous block to vehicular traffic is really no loss.

You can see the difference in width on this overhead shot:

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/walnut.jpg

(sorry, looks like the conversation continued while I was preparing this post and things were already cleared up!)

That area is in desperate need of renovations and infill. The area behind the SRC would make a nice courtyard/cafe area.

IndyYeah

October 26th, 2007, 02:21 AM

I did not know an area, or areas would be vacated for only bikes and foot traffic? I have never really seen a big town have a cultural trail especially for bikes. All cities I have paid any attention to with bikers they are on the streets watching out for their lives every second. Will this trail ease the tension, even at intersections? Alot? Alittle?

mobyhead

November 2nd, 2007, 11:09 PM

I swear this project is taking forever on the Alabama stretch.

CorrND

November 5th, 2007, 08:51 PM

From the most recent Cultural Trail email update (aka "Trail Talk"):

Alabama Street Paving

Depending on the weather, Alabama Street will be paved beginning Tuesday, November 6, and it will be completed by Saturday, November 10. To minimize disruption and to reduce conflicts with pedestrians and vehicles, the paving will be done in the evening, beginning at 8:00 p.m. and continuing to 6:00 a.m. each day until it is completed. Paving will start at Market Street and continue north to North Street over that 3 to 5 day period or approximately 2 to 3 nights. The approaches on the side streets will be completed during the rest of the week.

Also, while crews pave the lanes on Alabama, through traffic may be affected at various intersections. Those include North Street, Michigan Street, Vermont Street, New York Street, Ohio Street and Market Street.

Finishing Touches

Most of the “hardscape” items (pavement, lighting) will be completed by the end of the year. The “softscape” (trees and perennials) and the intersection treatments will be installed in late spring 2008.

Next Brown Bag Lunch Meeting

You're invited to learn more about the Cultural Trail and meet the team at our monthly brown bag lunch sessions, offered the fourth Tuesday of each month from 12:00 to 1:00 p.m. The next brown bag lunch is Tuesday, November 27, at the IUPUI Herron School of Art & Design, 735 West New York Street, Room HR224 of Eskenazi Hall. Off campus visitors can park in the Natatorium garage to the west of the building or take the IndyGo Red Line FREE Downtown/IUPUI Circulator.

Indianakid

November 7th, 2007, 05:45 AM

I didn't know Indianapolis was building such a pretty trail.
I hope I can ride my bike on it next time I go to Indianapolis. :)

Unionstation13

November 7th, 2007, 05:47 PM

YET AGAIN. sorry! :)

Indywatch

November 7th, 2007, 07:33 PM

^^ONCE AGAIN: I believe this project is being funded mostly through private donations and not the city of Indianapolis.

Unionstation13

November 7th, 2007, 08:10 PM

^^ONCE AGAIN: I believe this project is being funded mostly through private donations and not the city of Indianapolis.

Oh, I thought it was being somewhat funded by the city.

CorrND

November 7th, 2007, 10:19 PM

The Cultural Trail is being funded by a public-private partnership. There is a total budget of $50M, $15M of which came from a Federal Transportation grant earmarked for non-highway projects (I forget the exact designation). The city had a part in applying for and getting that money. The trail boosters like to point out that no local tax money went into the project, but just because it wasn't local doesn't mean our tax dollars aren't going into it.

As for the private side, I think they've raised about $25M in private donations so far -- with $15M from the Glick's. Aside from the Glick's and the Federal grant, they've only raised $10M and need $10M more. That's a lot of small donations left to collect.

hoosier

November 7th, 2007, 11:15 PM

mobyhead

November 19th, 2007, 09:20 PM

The Alabama Street street stretch is almost complete. I have to say I am very impressed.

CorrND

November 19th, 2007, 10:16 PM

Agreed.

One thing I'm mildly upset about -- and this is not a complaint about the trail itself -- is the fact that the city repaved Alabama strictly in the Cultural Trail zone. The section north of North St. up to Ft. Wayne is BADLY in need of resurfacing and it would have been logical to replace that section at the same time as the rest of the Alabama. Where's the foresight in planning these things?

hoosier

November 24th, 2007, 12:12 AM

IndyYeah

November 24th, 2007, 03:14 AM

You know, I am torn about the Cultural Trail "skirting" by the Circle. One side of me says that it should definitely go to the Circle, yet the other side says that the Cirlce should be left alone...hmmm.

When I am on the circle and envision the trail there, I think no. With traffic and the monument, and all the people. It seems as though, the freedom of biking will really be hampered. Sure the space is quite limited in an urban area, but the circle is pretty tight.

mobyhead

December 11th, 2007, 08:27 PM

The walk signal buttons at each intersection beep. I don't hear a change in this beeping when I am clear to walk. I understand this is an ADA thing but I don't know how it's supposed to work?

pig

December 12th, 2007, 08:03 AM

The walk signal buttons at each intersection beep. I don't hear a change in this beeping when I am clear to walk. I understand this is an ADA thing but I don't know how it's supposed to work?

I was thinking that they only beep when it's clear to walk, but thinking about it right now I'm not sure how you're supposed to know which direction is clear. I've never really payed enough attention to them, I guess. I do know that ones installed on the cultural trail are far less annoying than the ones Purdue installed a few years ago.

OSUBucks#1

December 12th, 2007, 03:21 PM

ablerock

December 14th, 2007, 06:52 PM

Some of the lights on the cultural trail were lit up today. I have to say, I think they look pretty sharp when lit. I can not wait for the spring when they put in all of the landscaping. Now if we can just get the market square site developed with the kosene development, that part of the cultural trail would be awesome.

This must be why! I just received this in an email from the ICT:

You're Invited to a Trail Lighting Celebration

Wednesday, December 19, come help us thank a few of the generous donors who are making the Indianapolis Cultural Trail: A Legacy of Gene & Marilyn Glick possible and celebrate the permanent illumination of the Cultural Trail lighting.

Where: Davlan Park, on the corner of Alabama St., Mass Ave., and Vermont St.
When: 5:00 p.m. - FREE Starbucks hot chocolate and coffee and FREE giveaways from Mass Ave merchants for the first 100 people.
5:30 p.m. - Trail Lighting

Next Brown Bag Lunch Meeting

Due to the Christmas holiday, our next Brown Bag will move up one week to Tuesday, December 18, 12:00 to 1:00 p.m. Bring your lunch, questions, and curiosity ...or just come for the festive entertainment.

Where: English Foundation Building, 615 N. Alabama St. (corner of North St. and Alabama St.), Conference Room 8 (basement)

Parking: South lot adjacent to building or at street meters.

Brown bag lunches are typically held the fourth Tuesday of every month, 12:00 to 1:00 p.m., in different locations throughout the downtown area. Check www.IndyCulturalTrail.org/GetInvolved for more information.

cwilson758

December 14th, 2007, 09:09 PM

Oooh...I just may have to go to that1 It sounds like it could be a good time and I LOVE Starbucks hot chocolate!

ablerock

December 22nd, 2007, 01:00 AM

The illumination was a blast! It was a bit anticlimactic because it wasn't very dark at 5:30pm, but an hour later, those suckers were lookin' sweet!

More shots at &DAGGER. (http://and-dagger.blogspot.com/2007/12/ict-east-corridor-illumination.html)

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2045/2125276177_13e55dbf60.jpg?v=0 http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2408/2126055372_0f24699ece.jpg?v=0

IndyYeah

December 22nd, 2007, 10:49 PM

IndyYeah

December 22nd, 2007, 10:51 PM

Sorry, did not see the other caption.

Wu-Gambino

December 22nd, 2007, 10:58 PM

The first is on Mass Ave. That's the Barton Building in the background, not the Lugar Tower.
The second is on Alabama.

IndyYeah

December 27th, 2007, 04:06 AM

The first is on Mass Ave. That's the Barton Building in the background, not the Lugar Tower.
The second is on Alabama.

Thanks, I love that area, I just don't get to tour that area alot. I am bringing my new mountain-street bike there in the spring. This thing is a great touring bike as well. Thanks

ablerock

January 18th, 2008, 05:38 PM

From ibj.com January 18, 2008:

Permanent Opie piece coming to downtown

By Jennifer Whitson

Good news for fans of Julian Opie’s pop-art-inspired exhibit that ended a year-long run on city streets in September—Indianapolis is getting a permanent piece by the London artist to add to its growing public art collection.

The work created for Indianapolis is called “Ann Dancing.” It’s reminiscent of the four-sided LCD display dubbed “Sara Dancing” that made its home at the northwest corner of Illinois and Maryland streets. But this female stick figure has a bit more juice in her jive than Sara did with her sedate sway.

The Indianapolis Cultural Development Commission and the Indianapolis Cultural Trail are splitting the $150,000 tab to buy and install the piece. Sara’s display case will be reused, but the new piece will make its home in front of the Old Point Tavern on Massachusetts Avenue.

“This is a vibrant part of downtown with a lot of nightlife,” said commission Director Jenny Guimont. “Ann” will begin dancing Jan. 22.

And local businesses are finding ways to get involved in the city’s burgeoning public arts scene—something that could continue to pay off as new exhibits arrive.

Sign Craft Industries Inc. helped rehab and install Sara’s display case, while construction-management firm R.W. Armstrong uploaded the animation program and ran the finished piece through modeling programs to check its structural integrity. The two companies were paid for their work.

Public art costs vary greatly depending on the medium, said Mindy Taylor Ross, director of public art at the Arts Council of Indianapolis, which manages the city’s public art exhibits and will handle acquisitions for the Cultural Trail. The trail’s $50 million budget includes $2 million for art.

Opie was paid $125,000 for the temporary exhibit of 11 pieces that dotted Indianapolis through September; another $125,000 paid for setting up, publicizing and maintaining the work.

That money used to go mainly to out-of-town firms because local companies didn’t do the work, Ross said. But that’s changing as local firms step up to go after the contracts.

“While this may be a small overall part of what they do as a business, it’s a new niche [more companies] are getting into,” she said.

That’s true for Sign Craft, whose work on the Opie exhibit was its first foray into the public art arena.

“A lot of his work was pretty close to signage,” said owner Greg Beyerl. The Opie fee was a “drop in the bucket” in the company’s overall revenue—which he declined to disclose—but he said it helped “get our guys doing something a little different.”

Employees saw themselves on TV news programs or other media installing the pieces and took some extra satisfaction away from the job.

“Our guys are very proud to be a part of it,” he said.

RW Armstrong already has parlayed its work on the Opie display into a similar job with the upcoming Chakaia Booker public art exhibit; Booker will be creating sculptures by cutting and shaping used tires. The firm also is the program manager for the Cultural Trail.

In its day-to-day business, RW Armstrong’s engineers do safety reviews on buildings, airports and road projects. They double-check how much weight a building’s foundation can bear and what wind load construction materials can withstand.

The firm does the same kind of review for public art—making sure the Opie piece won’t snap off in the wind or that a Booker tire creation won’t tumble down on a viewer. But since the computer models often aren’t set up to deal with art, programmers must figure out ways to tackle the evaluation.

“[Employees] are competing to be on the team to work on public art pieces,” said Senior Project Manager Melody Park. “It unleashes a creative side that they don’t get to work on a lot.

“We hope to be doing more of this in the future,” Park added. “When you’re hiring a lot of creative talent and want to attract more talent, you need to show that your company is not stagnant. The younger generation really wants to work on these unique pieces.”

ablerock

January 18th, 2008, 05:42 PM

Here's a link to images of the piece (and others) by Julian Opie:

http://www.barbarakrakowgallery.com/exhibition/exhibition_details.php?id=5208

SpiderMonkey

January 18th, 2008, 08:32 PM

I was just walking back from lunch at the Rathskellar and we caught the first testing of the piece since install. It is similar to all the other pieces that were around town. It is 4 sided of a woman dancing side to side. Nothing spectacular, but like mentioned it will spark conversation and is in general a nice addition to the cultural trail.

Too bad I didn't have my camera. I could have had the first shot of the new piece.

k2h

January 24th, 2008, 08:09 AM

Check out photos of the Julian Opie sculpture unveiling at nuvo.net...

http://www.nuvo.net/

ablerock

January 24th, 2008, 05:02 PM

Check out photos of the Julian Opie sculpture unveiling at nuvo.net...

http://www.nuvo.net/

Here's a direct link to the gallery:

http://www.nuvo.net/photos/20080122Julian_Opie_Sculpture_Unveiled_on_the_Cultural_Trail/

By the way, it was butt-ass-cold that day. A decent turnout, considering.

The trail has some 2 million dollars for public art, with an additional 1.5 million for "Luminary Monuments." I'm looking forward to seeing what those looks like, and what other pieces are chosen in the future.

CorrND

January 24th, 2008, 05:17 PM

I'm fine with 'Ann Dancing,' but I think 'Marbles' would have been more interesting at this intersection. Too bad that didn't work out.

mobyhead

January 24th, 2008, 11:12 PM

marbles would have been slick i agree. Now people can have something to stare at while enjoying a brew at the Pointe.

ablerock

January 31st, 2008, 01:41 AM

CorrND

January 31st, 2008, 04:24 PM

The February issue of Urban times has an update article about the next two phases of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail.

You can view a PDF of the article (and others) here:

http://www.brookspublications.com/News_2007.html
I'm curious about their plans for dot A on the map, with this description:

"Trail crosses the pedestrian bridge at the U.S.S. Indianapolis Memorial, then heads north over new terrain to St. Clair Street."

First of all, I think it's hilarious that they talk about "new terrain" for the Cultural Trail, like they're building I-69 or something.

But I'm curious about what they intend to do. Will they just rip up the entire walkway in that area and rebuild it as the Cultural Trail? Actually, I don't see any other way. There isn't really any "new terrain" to build a separate, parallel walkway for the Cultural Trail and the current walkways are much too narrow and curvy to work for biking on the Cultural Trail.

Do you know if anyone has brought this up at a brown bag lunch, ablerock? If you haven't heard anything, I'm planning to go to the one at the end of the month so I'll ask then.

ablerock

February 1st, 2008, 01:42 AM

CorrND

February 4th, 2008, 06:25 PM

^^

Which walkways are you referring to? The ones along the canal, or over the bridge near the memorial? I attended the lighting of the new sculpture, but didn't go inside the Old Point for the meeting this month. I had prior lunch plans.

I'm now curious about the canal section too.

The diagram says "Walkways along the canal will also be designated as part of the Cultural Trail, although no new pavement will be laid."

I hope they still get lights, more landscaping, signage, etc. The canal is so dark at night in sections. Those lights would do wonders for it.
These walkways:

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/canal_cult_trail.jpg

I'm guessing they're going to have to rip up all the curved walkways in this area and rebuild it wider and more direct for use as the Cultural Trail. They should have this section pretty much 100% designed at this point, so I'll see what I can find out at the end of the month.

Regarding the canal itself, I bet they use medallions to indicate it's part of the trail. One of the designers I talked to about their plans for the American Legion Mall said that's the most likely plan and I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing on the canal.

Unionstation13

February 4th, 2008, 06:28 PM

I wonder if the cultural trail will start up more nick and nack shops along it for tourists and more high density development.

IndyYeah

February 5th, 2008, 03:14 AM

I wonder if the cultural trail will start up more nick and nack shops along it for tourists and more high density development.

Probably depends on what people will offer, and if the shop owners have the know how to keep a small business afloat. Mass. Av.,seems to do well, some other areas are slow at developing. I for one frequent small business establishments alot in Indy and up here as much as possible. However, not for some of the prices say like the art shops are asking. Helen, you get around alot in the areas, do you think businesses will move along the trail?

Unionstation13

February 5th, 2008, 03:22 AM

Oh yes, especially along Virginia avenue. Its not as busy as it used to be in its heyday but I think the cultural trail will bring alot of development to that part of town as it is very intact and quiet charming. I also think that we will be seeing more infill along mass ave. After the cultural trail is finished I think much of the loop will be fully restored/renovated and we will see alot more projects popping up that are pedestrian friendly.

ablerock

February 5th, 2008, 04:09 PM

Helen, you get around alot in the areas...

Are you just going to take that? ;)

ablerock

February 5th, 2008, 04:11 PM

After the cultural trail is finished I think much of the loop will be fully restored/renovated and we will see alot more projects popping up that are pedestrian friendly.

Almost certainly. Let's hope so, at least.

arenn

February 5th, 2008, 04:39 PM

The first quarter IRTIP amendments are posting and they show that phase 2 and 3 of the Cultural Trail have been deferred from 2008 to 2009. Not sure if this is real or some financing BS.

CorrND

February 5th, 2008, 05:45 PM

You're so on top of these government reports, arenn!

I'm going with financing BS. Funding is in place for these phases and the designs are nearly complete. Why wouldn't they move forward?

(As I've said before, I'm a little worried about funding the final phases. They've gotten a $15M federal grant, $15M from the Glicks and $10M "small" donations. They need to double those "small" donations to hit $50M. No easy task, but they've still got time.)

There's also an error in that report: "North section from the intersection of Blackford and West Streets to Alabama St." Last I checked, Blackford and West don't intersect. I think they mean Blackford and Indiana.

Unionstation13

February 5th, 2008, 09:00 PM

Are you just going to take that? ;)

actually yes I do. Ever since the fax machine broke no one wants to send documents to the other offices and we dont have a scanner so they use the desk lady for shipping I guess.:nuts:

IndyTampaTom

February 6th, 2008, 01:50 AM

Could the "deferred" dates simply be because they are using the state's fiscal year to define the timeline - and the 09 fiscal year starts July 1? That sounds about right because I had heard that they thought it would likely be around June or July before they would be able to start construction on the second and third phases. They will be doing the landscaping on phase 1 during the spring and then start on the new construction for the next sections once it gets to be summer time.

IndyTampaTom

February 22nd, 2008, 06:40 PM

Hopefully in the next month or so the landscaping crews will start finishing up the work on the trail along the Alabama Street corridor. That's really going to be nice to be able to see the "finished" project. Can't wait to see the trees, plants, benches etc. get put in. That's really going to let us start getting a feel for how great this is going to look.

ablerock

February 29th, 2008, 05:02 PM

I went to the monthly ICT lunch meeting on Tuesday. Here are some tidbits I found out:

They are indeed closing the Walnut St. section to automobile traffic. It will still be open for deliveries for the businesses, but regular car use is a no-no. They have created a boulevard with the trail running right down the middle, with brick pavers replacing the traffic lanes on either side. It looked nice from the aerial rendering they showed.

The section along the canal that Corrnd was asking about a few posts ago: From what I understood they will leave the pedestrian paths and add bike lanes. They specifically mentioned the pedestrian ramp heading west towards the canal as an example. Definitely too narrow to accommodate pedestrians and cyclists.

The rest of the Canal will see no changes, other than signage. It is simply being marked as part of the trail. This is also the case for the small grass area south of the Library in the American Legion Mall. The designer cited that this is a nationally historic site and has its own aesthetic already. It would be very difficult, and not really in the site's best interest, to make changes to the design.

The deferred dates may have happened because of government red tape. The project is 80% private $ and 20% federal transit grant $. According to the designer, to get the federal money they have to go through INDOT, which can take more time than one might want, as is the case with all government agencies! They didn't say anything about starting in 2009. From what I understood,they will begin construction on the North and Northeast corridor in August of this year. That was a delay from when they'd like to start, as they're losing most of the good weather, but certainly not 2009.

The good news is the Southeast Corridor has been moved up and will be built in conjunction with the West and Central Corridor. The Central Corridor may start later because of design issues, most likely involving all the underground vaults along Washington and the debate over Washington vs. Market St.

From the look of it, they have most of the trail's design laid out. They had a stack of construction plans several inches thick for people to look over. I didn't have time to check them out, but next month I'm checking them out for sure.

arenn

February 29th, 2008, 11:48 PM

Great info, ablerock. Thanks for posting.

CorrND

March 1st, 2008, 12:17 AM

Damn, I need some kind of organizer to help me remember these meetings! This one was only a 2 block walk from where I work.

Thanks for the info, ablerock, especially about that canal section.

ablerock

March 21st, 2008, 07:51 PM

The Indianapolis Cultural Trail website recently posted a new, interactive Google Map:

http://indyculturaltrail.org/map/map.htm

You can, of course, turn on satellite view for a better perspective. Street view is curiously absent.

This will help those unfamiliar with the less-traveled areas of Downtown Indy get a better idea of the impact it will have.

I can't believe how little of the complete trail has actually been completed. Just eyeballing it, I'd say the almost-done east corridor is only about 1/15 of the whole trail. It looks great and they haven't even done landscaping yet.

Also, just a reminder: The next brown bag lunch is Tuesday March 25, at the IMCPL Fountain Square branch (at the fountain intersection of Virginia, Shelby, and Prospect), from 12-1pm.

unvrsty07

March 22nd, 2008, 08:54 PM

Construction Update: Plantings, Intersection Treatments Arriving Soon

East Corridor: Alabama Street from North Street to Market Street
In April and May, look for 61 trees, 528 shrubs, and more than 10,000 other perennials, ornamental grasses, and groundcovers to be planted in the existing plant beds. The intersection treatments will also be completed this Spring. The treatments are special patterns embossed into the asphalt with a product called “Duratherm." Duratherm is a material that is similar to the thermo-plastic that is sometimes used on road surfaces for intersection and lane markings. By embossing the patterns into the asphalt, the material is flush with the pavement, reducing damage from cars or snow-plows. The blue, white, and green design patterns, including the Indianapolis Cultural Trail: A Legacy of Gene & Marilyn Glick logo, provide a continuous Cultural Trail experience from curb to curb and offer another visual sign telling motorists to slow down and yield to Trail users.

Northeast Corridor: North St. and Alabama St., to the Monon Trail and 10th St.
The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) will be scheduling this next phase of Trail construction. At this time, it’s anticipated that the construction of the Northeast Corridor will be bid in July or August with work beginning four to six weeks after the bid has been awarded.

North Corridor: North St. and Alabama St., to Indiana Ave. and Blackford St.
Similar to the Northeast Corridor, INDOT will schedule this corridor for construction and it is anticipated that the construction bidding will be in August or September with work beginning four to six weeks after the bid has been awarded.

Construction on the Northeast and North Corridors will continue through the winter season to be completed by fall 2009. Similar to the East Corridor or Alabama Street construction, every effort will be made to maintain access to all properties and traffic will be maintained along the route during construction.

For more information about the construction schedule visit http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/timeline.html or call 317.713.3333.

SpiderMonkey

April 18th, 2008, 11:04 PM

More national/international praise for the Cultural Trail.

http://www.metropolismag.com/cda/story.php?artid=3273

k2h

May 5th, 2008, 03:59 AM

For us out-of-towners, can someone provide an update on the status of the spring plantings near the Cultural Trail.

SpiderMonkey

May 5th, 2008, 05:06 PM

It looks like the majority of the plants are in. The trees are all in and the were planting the shrubs last week. They still need to add the annuals and the mulch. I will try to take a few photos this afternoon and post up later today or tomorrow.

CorrND

May 5th, 2008, 05:43 PM

That seems about right from what I saw on Saturday. I'd guess the annuals and mulch are just waiting for the watering system to be completed and covered.

See the new crosswalk markings here (http://dig-b.blogspot.com/2008/05/photos-indianapolis-cultural-trail_05.html).

SpiderMonkey

May 6th, 2008, 09:31 PM

Um make that second to www.dig-b.blogspot.com/

New York and Alabama Crosswalks going in

While I was out during lunch today I noticed the thermal plastic crosswalks being installed across New York St. at Alabama and I decided to snap a couple photos. You can see the lane markers for bikers and walkers. The colors will be green, blue and white. I think they will look very nice when finished.

Without furtherado...

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010004-2.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010005-2.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010014-1.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010007-2.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010008-3.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010006-2.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010009-3.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010010-2.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010011-2.jpg

SpiderMonkey

May 6th, 2008, 09:35 PM

Here are some photos of the plantings along the Cultural Trail outside of Marsh.

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010001-3.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010002-3.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010003-3.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/P1010015-1.jpg

runNgunn

May 6th, 2008, 09:57 PM

CorrND

May 6th, 2008, 11:05 PM

Looks great! I mostly lurk, but have to thank you for these photos. I saw some of the thermal plastic work on someone's blog, but couldn't see how it sits slightly below street level.

I am also glad to hear the colors will still be going in. I almost thought for a second they were just going to only use the yellow thermoplast for the crosswalks. I really should have known better.
runNgunn -- you probably saw the photos on my blog. Those photos are of the intersection of Michigan and Alabama that was completed late last week. I also thought it was odd that they only used one color since I heard it was going to be a tri-color crosswalk like SpiderMonkey is showing here (great photos, btw).

It occurs to me now that the Michigan crosswalk only has the green color because the Cultural Trail is classified as a "combined trail" north of that intersection. That also explains why the biker, walker and handicapped logos switch position all across that crosswalk. I guess they're trying to tell people that they have to share space.

runNgunn

May 7th, 2008, 06:39 AM

When I went back to look at the photos in your blog, I noticed the inlay a bit more than I originally did. Thanks for the photos there too. I've been following the Cultural Trail's development closely, but haven't actually gotten a chance to go see it in person yet. Hopefully soon.

k2h

May 9th, 2008, 08:07 AM

Thanks for posting the photos!

k2h

May 26th, 2008, 08:49 AM

Indiana Stadium and Convention Building Authority announced today that it will construct the Indianapolis Cultural Trail to connect the new convention center and Lucas Oil Stadium.

CIB will utilize its federal transportation funding to construct the Cultural Trail on the west side of Capitol Avenue from Maryland St. to South St. This section will be a separate bike and pedestrian trail design. The connection from Maryland St. to Washington St. will be included in the Cultural Trail's South Corridor construction scheduled for 2010.

Mayor Greg Ballard will make this announcement at the official Cultural Trail East Corridor Ribbon Cutting, Saturday, June 7, 9:00 a.m., from the northeast corner of Market St. and Alabama St.

For more information on the Capitol Ave. extension or June 7 ribbon cutting, contact Gail Swanstrom: 317.713.3333 or Gail@IndyCulturalTrail.org (Gail@IndyCulturalTrail.org).

cwilson758

May 27th, 2008, 02:18 AM

Great news!

This thing looks so nice.

ablerock

May 27th, 2008, 05:20 PM

For those downtown, the Cultural Trail Brown Bag Lunch is today from 12-1pm. Come check out drawings and renderings before anyone else gets to see them!

May 27 - Scottish Rite Cathedral, Double Eagle Cafe and Truman conference room, 650 N. Meridian St. (parking available in parking lot west of building or in lot across Walnut Street, north of building).

IndyIndependent

June 14th, 2008, 09:15 PM

Path's 1st leg done; The Luke to be included.

Brian Payne sees a day when a family leaves its car in Broad Ripple and pedals Downtown, maybe to enjoy jazz in Military Park or ice cream along Massachusetts Avenue.

The biking journey might include a visit to the expanded Downtown branch of the Indianapolis-Marion County Public Library or to take a look at the new Lucas Oil Stadium.

Those trail trips came a step closer to being doable when the city on Saturday opened a five-block Downtown stretch of side-by-side landscaped walking and biking paths along Alabama Street that Payne describes as "transformative for the city."

Completion of an eight-mile Downtown trail is planned by 2012 to provide a vital greenway link from the Monon and Pleasant Run trails to Indianapolis' core, which is home to many entertainment, shopping and dining venues.

The Monon Trail already goes from 10th Street north through Broad Ripple and into Carmel and Westfield in Hamilton County. The Pleasant Run Trail is on Indianapolis' Southside.

"This will tell the rest of the country and the world that we are a vibrant, progressive 21st-century city to be reckoned with," said Payne, president of the Central Indiana Community Foundation, who conceived of this Cultural Trail project.

When finished, the eight-mile, $52.5 million Cultural Trail will loop through the north side of Downtown's business district and past many major attractions.

Project managers say the trail is distinctive because it runs through the heart of the city.

Payne said he studied greenways in several places, including Seattle, and found that residents will use them, even seek them out, when choosing where to live or to spend their vacations.

The Cultural Trail designers anticipate people will get hooked on visiting Downtown via the trail, and designed the trail to encourage its wide usage.

"We didn't want to just put a red line in the middle of the sidewalk and call it a trail," said Gail Swanstrom, a spokeswoman for the trail program. Planners said the Downtown streets were wide enough that a slice of them could be put to trail use without affecting the flow of vehicles.

"Many city centers are already packed in so tightly this wouldn't be possible," Swanstrom said.

"Chicago could not have done this," she said. "I can't say this loud enough: This is unlike anything in any other city. We are bringing you into Downtown on a path that is spacious, landscaped and eight miles long."

Payne said the Cultural Trail will be a celebration of the city. "I see people from all over the country saying, 'Let's go to Indianapolis and do the trail,' " he said.

The $4.5 million first stretch on the east side of Alabama Street has side-by-side lighted walking and biking paths, 61 newly planted trees, 16,000 square feet of native plants, bushes and shrubs, plus 14 contemporary benches and 18 bike racks.

It is punctuated by "Ann Dancing" at the intersection of Massachusetts Avenue and Alabama and Vermont streets. The sculpture depicts the electronic animated outline of a woman dancing, an invitation to sample the Mass Ave. district's vibrant nightlife.

At Saturday's ribbon-cutting ceremony, Mayor Greg Ballard and civic leaders announced the second phase would begin in the fall. That two-mile leg will connect Alabama to both the Monon Trail, to the east, and Indiana Avenue, to the west.

In addition, officials said another spoke has been added to the trail's master plan that will connect it to Lucas Oil Stadium, the Indianapolis Colts' new home, in the 500 block of South Capitol Avenue.

Using a $2.5 million federal transportation grant, the Indiana Stadium and Convention Building Authority will develop three blocks of the path from Maryland Street to South Street along Capitol.

The complete Cultural Trail will vary in width from 15 to 27 feet and be landscaped throughout with perennial mixes, such as evening primrose, terra cotta yarrow and ornamental strawberry. Large curbside planters feature autumn moor grass and sea green juniper. Zelcova, honey locust and accolade elm trees will shade the route. It also will be open around the clock, and 16-foot candlestick-style lights will brighten the trail throughout the nights.

Downtown businesses are expecting big rewards.

Elizabeth Garber, owner of The Best Chocolate in Town, is ready.

Garber, 34, is selling Cultural Trail Mix, a combination of chocolate, fruits and nuts, for $6 a bag at her store at 880 Massachusetts Ave. The store will be along the portion of the trail that connects with the beginning of the Monon on 10th Street, east of College Avenue. A dollar in proceeds from each bag sold will go to a fund for trail upkeep.

"It's both an energy food and a sweet, something I think trailgoers will like," said Garber, who opened the shop 18 months ago.

She said that even without the Monon connector, the popular path already lures plenty of people Downtown.

"I have people stop in who rode here on the Monon from Carmel, even Zionsville," she said. "This will only increase the traffic. Everyone on Mass Avenue I've talked to is very excited."

Patti Perrin, who owns the Old Point Tavern, 401 Massachusetts Ave., said "Ann Dancing" outside the front door is a conversation piece for customers.

"I don't have any gimmicky tie-ins currently planned," Perrin said. "I have thought about putting together an ad that says, 'Not only can you see Ann Dancing at the Old Point, you can also see her making cocktails, since one of our bartenders is Anne."

The trail program plans to place one piece of art on each of the trail's seven sections, and businesses and institutions already are chipping in.

The Indianapolis Public Schools' Center for Inquiry in the 700 block of North New Jersey Street dedicated a sculpture called "Leaves of Grass II" last month.

Scott Armstrong, a parent who wrote the grant application for the sculpture, said the school just scored another grant -- for $4,975 -- that will be used to buy 30 bicycles, helmets and a storage shed.

"The seventh- and eighth-graders will take field trips riding the Alabama trail and go through Mass Avenue and the Chatham Arch neighborhood, learning its history," Armstrong said. "They will study it over the winter and then next year, they will lead tours themselves.

"It's a very good educational opportunity for them, and I think this trail is good for the city and Downtown," he said. "This part of town will have gone from being kind of dangerous 10 or 15 years ago to being livable and fun."

IndyIndependent

June 14th, 2008, 09:18 PM

Shared vision transforms dreams into reality

Our position: Cultural Trail is an example of progress that public and private teamwork can bring.

The Indianapolis Cultural Trail is another example of what can happen when this city's public and private interests work together to build a stronger community.

The eight-mile trail through Downtown, the first section of which formally opened last Saturday, is attractive, inviting and innovative. It's already gaining national attention, including recent mentions in the Washington Post and Metropolis magazine.

The $52.5 million project, driven by the vision of the Central Indiana Community Foundation's Brian Payne, is being paid for largely with private donations, although $15 million in federal transportation funds has been allocated. The trail is subtitled "A Legacy of Gene and Marilyn Glick" on the city's Web site in honor of a $15 million gift from two of the city's most generous philanthropists.

As with Indy's successful Super Bowl bid, this amenity would not have become a reality without strong teamwork between public officials and private leadership.

It's a model that should be employed in addressing many of the city's other challenges, including reducing the number of abandoned houses and redeveloping long-neglected neighborhoods.

The first section of the trail, along Alabama Street, cuts across Mass Ave, with its thriving business and arts district. New townhomes and condos line the trail near New York and Ohio streets. The area's revitalization, which has attracted an influx of Downtown residents, is spreading several blocks to the east and west.

But to the south sits a two-block stretch of gravel-covered, dusty parking lots. The site, once home to Market Square Arena, has been vacant since 2001 awaiting the city to find the right developer and the right plan. The area around the Market Square site is blossoming, but the city-owned parcels, which should be at the center of redevelopment, remain an ugly blank spot made all the more noticeable by the alluring ribbon of trail that stretches past them.

The Cultural Trail represents what this city is getting right. The Market Square site, which five years ago was the center of development plans that proved much too ambitious, represents what the city has gotten wrong.

Five more sections of the Cultural Trail are scheduled for completion in the next two years. They'll be a welcome addition to a Downtown that has become ever more attractive and livable through the efforts of a committed private sector and its public partners.

arenn

June 16th, 2008, 06:49 AM

Actually, the MSA site being empty is a good thing. Imagine if, in the city's haste to get something built there, another Firehouse Square had been erected. There are certainly far worse things out there than empty lots.

GarfieldPark

June 17th, 2008, 06:42 AM

Yeah, I agree a parking lot is better than something like Firehouse Square - but It would have been good to see at least one of the big proposals put in place - that would have had 300 - 500 residential units in buildings 20 - 30 stories tall. Hopefully one of these years we'll see someting good go in there. There are 2 1/2 blocks to be redeveloped - including the boarded up old bank office to the east of the MSA site. For something really great, I guess I can wait a little longer.

k2h

July 7th, 2008, 04:21 AM

Cultural Trail featured in Northwest Airlines WorldTraveler Magazine
http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend.com/ei/25DFFCEC/jdiyq/NWAWorldTravelercover.png

If you’ve flown Northwest Airlines recently, you cannot miss the 18-page spread in its in-flight magazine promoting Indianapolis, courtesy of the Indianapolis Convention and Visitors Association (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend.com/t/1/l/cmhj/l/www.indy.org). The full page article, “A Cultural Coup” shows a large rendering of the Cultural Trail and opens with: “Indianapolis, home of the Indy 500, is well known for its ‘zoom’ and ‘va-room.’ And now there is development afoot that will enhance Indy’s reputation as an innovation – and green – capital of culture.”
Read it online: http://digitalnwaworldtraveler.com/ (http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend.com/t/1/l/cmhj/l/digitalnwaworldtraveler.com/). Indy's article begins on page 79 with Cultural Trail article on page 83 - 84.

________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

The Indianapolis Convention and Visitors Association is getting it right lately when it comes to marketing Indy. I think i only read "family friendly" once in the NWA article, which is certainly a positive change. From the updated website (http://www.indy.org/) to a much more focused and enlightened marketing approach, the ICVA is doing a great job for Indy.

cwilson758

July 7th, 2008, 09:07 PM

Great "Spotlight." I wonder how much this cost the ICVA?

Thanks for the heads-up Kevin.

CorrND

July 21st, 2008, 04:34 PM

From the Cultural Trail Newsletter.

===============

Southeast Corridor Planned for Spring 2009

The Southeast Corridor, connecting downtown Indianapolis to Fletcher Place and Fountain Square, has been moved up in the design/construction schedule to begin construction in spring 2009. It was originally planned for design and construction in summer/fall 2009.

Due to IUPUI's plans to redesign portions of its campus near Blackford Ave., the West Corridor, connecting Indiana Avenue to White River State Park on Blackford Ave., will be rescheduled once IUPUI has completed its planning process.

The Southeast Corridor will also include a connection to the East Corridor. The trail route will be constructed from Market and Alabama streets, to Washington St. on Alabama St., on the north side of Washington St., and turn south on the east side of Pennsylvania St. to connect to Virginia Ave.

Fletcher Place Neighborhood Association and SEND/Fountain Square Cultural District formed a Cultural Trail committee to stay informed about design and construction. It meets the third Wednesday of each month at 6 p.m. Locations vary. For more information, contact Bill Lovejoy, blovejoy123@yahoo.com or (317) 491-1985.

================

Next brown bag lunch: Buggs Temple, July 22nd (tomorrow), noon

ablerock

July 21st, 2008, 07:07 PM

Due to IUPUI's plans to redesign portions of its campus near Blackford Ave., the West Corridor, connecting Indiana Avenue to White River State Park on Blackford Ave., will be rescheduled once IUPUI has completed its planning process.

I'm very interested in this little blurb. I know that they hired a planner to update the plans for IU Bloomington and IUPUI. I wonder when the planning will be done. I hope the planner recommends that New York and Michigan be reverted to 2 way streets with medians down the middle. It is crazy both to cross and drive down those streets when school is in session. They've got to slow down traffic.

Unless I space it, I'm going to the meeting tomorrow. I'll try and remember to post an update.

CorrND

July 21st, 2008, 10:51 PM

I'm very interested in this little blurb. I know that they hired a planner to update the plans for IU Bloomington and IUPUI. I wonder when the planning will be done. I hope the planner recommends that New York and Michigan be reverted to 2 way streets with medians down the middle. It is crazy both to cross and drive down those streets when school is in session. They've got to slow down traffic.

Unless I space it, I'm going to the meeting tomorrow. I'll try and remember to post an update.
I couldn't agree with you more, but I certainly wouldn't bet on them reverting the streets. I think the more likely thing is that they're going to make Blackford 2-way, 2 lanes each direction from Indiana south to New York (a la Barnhill between Michigan and New York).

And bad news: the Cultural Trail people just sent out an email canceling tomorrow's brown bad lunch:

Tomorrow's Cultural Trail Brown Bag is cancelled

The Cultural Trail Brown Bag Lunch scheduled for tomorrow at The Grille at Buggs Temple has been cancelled. Please join us for our next Brown Bag Lunch on Tuesday, Aug. 26, at NIFS – the National Institute for Fitness & Sport, 250 N. University Boulevard. More information will be included in the next issue of “Trail Talk.”

Indywatch

August 25th, 2008, 09:39 PM

Does anyone know what happened to Jullian Opie's "Ann Dancing" installment on Mass Ave and the Cultural Trail? I thought it was a permanent installment. I drove by and noticed it was gone yesterday.

CorrND

August 25th, 2008, 09:47 PM

arenn

August 25th, 2008, 10:07 PM

ablerock

August 25th, 2008, 11:27 PM

Does anyone know what happened to Jullian Opie's "Ann Dancing" installment on Mass Ave and the Cultural Trail? I thought it was a permanent installment. I drove by and noticed it was gone yesterday.

Speaking of that, what does everyone think about the way it is displayed, particularly the base?

IMO, the base is a huge problem. It's actually wider than the piece and it's made of brick. A pedestal is supposed to neutrally support a work of art. This base actually becomes part of the work by sheer force of size and contrast of material. I would've preferred to at least seen a base the same width and metal as the piece, if not smaller.

CorrND

August 26th, 2008, 08:39 PM

I hit up the brown bag lunch. Honestly, very little new information. Couple small tidbits:

1. The trail is not being constructed during this summer construction season because the next couple phases of the trail will be using the federal grant money, which requires coordinating through INDOT. The Alabama phase went directly through the city so there was less red tape.

2. Only the NE corridor is being constructed this fall. The north corridor was also scheduled for the fall but is on hold for now. Didn't really get an explanation for that.

3. I asked about whether they were going to use the JW Marriott pedestrian bridge over Washington St. No decision has been made yet but it sounded like the height of the bridge (in order for trucks to clear under it) and whether it would be ADA compliant was an issue.

4. The on-going Washington-or-Market debate....goes on. They're continuing with their line about Washington being the likely choice but that a final decision had not been made.

I also met GarfieldPark there. It's always nice to put faces with names here. If I messed up any details, I'm sure he'll correct me.

GarfieldPark

August 27th, 2008, 06:24 AM

I think you got it all right CorrND. One other thing that was discussed though - kind of as the meeting was ending - was a little discussion about the idea of starting up a bike rental program - similar to what has become famous in Paris, Copenhagen and a few other cities. Nothing is really planned yet, but it is being looked into. The bike rental program is a system of renting bikes at a low cost at dozens of stations throughout the city - where you then ride to another location - leaving the bike at another station. You would want to have the stations located throughout the city at locations along the many bike routes and at the many major visitor locations and local attractiions. They have been investigating this over the summer - learning from the European cities and talking with some people in D.C. and Chicago - where they are also looking into getting one of these systems up and going. I think it could work well here with the many attractions throughout the central city and the existing and growing connecting bike system: greenways, canal pathways, cultural trail, and on-street bike lanes that will soon be seen on Michigan and New York streets from White River to Arlington Avenue and up north along Allisonville Road beginning next year. I think it would be great to see something like that coming on line in the next year or two - around the time the cultural trail is projected to be completed - in late 2011 or so.

indyfiend

August 27th, 2008, 03:50 PM

arenn

August 29th, 2008, 03:55 PM

The lack of durability isn't a good sign.

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080829/LOCAL18/808290415/-1/ARCHIVE

Dancing sculpture needs electronic facelift
Animation problems force $150,000 piece to be removed for repairs
By Scott Thien
Posted: August 29, 2008

"Ann Dancing" had been there only about eight months, and already she needs an electronic facelift.

That's the word on the four-sided, life-sized illuminated fixture, which disappeared about a week ago from her perch at the intersection of Massachusetts Avenue and Alabama and Vermont streets.

"We were having issues with the LED panels themselves; the animation was stopping or freaking out," said Mindy Taylor Ross, director of public art for the Arts Council of Indianapolis. "It was just safer to take it down, take it inside and diagnose it."

Atlas Signs of Indianapolis -- the same company that worked on Lucas Oil Stadium -- will run a diagnostic check on the $150,000, 900-pound piece to determine what repairs are needed.

"She's taking a short dance break. . . . She'll come back and be re-energized shortly," said Ross, adding that a sign will go up at her tarp-covered pedestal to inform passers-by and dispel concerns about vandalism.

Repair costs will be paid by private contributors to the Indianapolis Cultural Trail, a 7.5-mile, $50 million pedestrian/bike trail project connecting neighborhoods, cultural districts and entertainment venues.

The moving human figure, depicted by thousands of light-emitting yellow diodes, is the work of London-born Julian Opie, considered a leader in computerized art. A previous version titled "Sara Dancing" had been at the corner of Maryland and Illinois streets.

Indywatch

September 25th, 2008, 06:25 PM

I walked the Cultural Trail last night from St. Joe down to Starbucks for a cup of coffee last night and noticed MOST of the pylon barriers along the cultural trail have the tops of them severly dented and scratched.... apparently from skateboarders jumping off of them. Its extremely sad and something needs to be done about it. :ohno:

hoosier

September 26th, 2008, 02:35 AM

TrafficSignal

September 26th, 2008, 02:55 PM

A dedicated skateboard park needs to be built so that this doesn't happen.

Absolutely, then they'll all definitely go to it instead of whatever is the closest available thing to destroy. </sarcasm>

Really, what they need is to realize that destroying public property is bad. What ever happened to personal responsibility, a sense of right & wrong? Maybe they don't have anywhere else nearby to do it, but that doesn't mean they should be breaking stuff in their pursuit of enterainment.

Besides, where would you build said skateboard park that would draw them from the Cultural Trail? And how would you pay for this park?

hoosier

September 26th, 2008, 07:56 PM

Absolutely, then they'll all definitely go to it instead of whatever is the closest available thing to destroy. </sarcasm>

Really, what they need is to realize that destroying public property is bad. What ever happened to personal responsibility, a sense of right & wrong? Maybe they don't have anywhere else nearby to do it, but that doesn't mean they should be breaking stuff in their pursuit of enterainment.

Besides, where would you build said skateboard park that would draw them from the Cultural Trail? And how would you pay for this park?

I am not absolving the skaters of their culpability in damaging public property.

But part of the solution is a dedicated skateboard park to give these people a place to do their wheelies, flips, etc. These facilities can be built cheaply and there is plenty of vacant land DT where it could be located.

paytonc

September 27th, 2008, 12:53 AM

Again, I'm not saying that narrowing the street is bad. Only that it isn't necessarily required to improve pedestrian friendliness.

Isn't necessarily, but still strongly recommended in most cases for two reasons:
1. Spatial enclosure. A street should look and feel like an urban "room" with walls and a floor; the usual ratio at which things start to "feel urban" is a 1:3 ratio of height:width; better to have 1:2 or 1:1. The Champs-Élysées works because it's lined with strong vertical elements: multiple rows of huge trees and a wall of 6-8 story buildings. A six-lane American street would need a continuous wall of 3.5-story buildings alongside it just to maintain a 1:3 ratio, and how often do you really have that in Indianapolis?

2. Impact of traffic. People drive faster on wider roads, and the impact of traffic (visual, aural, and yes, physical danger in terms of crashes) increases exponentially as traffic speed and volume increases. Pedestrians are tiny and vulnerable next to cars; even with lots of separation, walking alongside a highway is justifiably a frightening experience. Another big difference between the Champs-Élysées and anywhere in middle America: traffic congestion keeps traffic speeds down.

k2h

September 27th, 2008, 11:55 PM

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x320/kehughes1/IndianaTrip-September2008125.jpg
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x320/kehughes1/IndianaTrip-September2008129.jpg
http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x320/kehughes1/IndianaTrip-September2008131.jpg

CorrND

September 29th, 2008, 11:31 PM

http://i184.photobucket.com/albums/x320/kehughes1/IndianaTrip-September2008129.jpg

Is that guy peeing on O'Malias?

Thanks for the pictures k2h!

arenn

September 30th, 2008, 05:37 AM

ablerock

September 30th, 2008, 06:18 PM

One thing I noticed today: the only bike racks along the trail segment on Alabama seem to be at Mass Ave. Now that I finally got with the program and bought a bike, I was scoping out parking and that was one of only two bike racks in all of downtown I've seen so far. There should be massive amounts of bike parking along this thing if the trail designers actually expect people to stop at any of these cultural attractions.

Good point.

I know there's a rack across from the city market. I'll bike it today at lunch and get a specific count.

I've also been frustrated by the pedestrian foot-traffic on the bicycle side of the trail. It may be a design flaw. The dark color and paver shape of the bicycling path definitely draw your attention more than the pedestrian area. I've had to maneuver around large groups of pedestrians just strolling down the middle of the bike path, oblivious to bicyclists. I'll give them a couple of years until the whole trail is complete, after that, they get my wrath! ;-)

CorrND

September 30th, 2008, 08:37 PM

Good point.

I know there's a rack across from the city market. I'll bike it today at lunch and get a specific count.

I've also been frustrated by the pedestrian foot-traffic on the bicycle side of the trail. It may be a design flaw. The dark color and paver shape of the bicycling path definitely draw your attention more than the pedestrian area. I've had to maneuver around large groups of pedestrians just strolling down the middle of the bike path, oblivious to bicyclists. I'll give them a couple of years until the whole trail is complete, after that, they get my wrath! ;-)
Yeah, I've noticed pedestrians on the bike side as well. Part of the problem was O'Malias, where they had a large chunk of the pedestrian section closed for the facade repairs they were doing. Is that done yet?

Mostly I blame TOO MUCH SIGNAGE. Pedestrians probably don't even know that that's supposed to be for bikes because they're mentally blocking out all the signs.

ragerunner1

September 30th, 2008, 08:54 PM

It like building your first roundabout, in time people will figure it out.

ablerock

September 30th, 2008, 10:42 PM

It like building your first roundabout, in time people will figure it out.

You're probably right. Hope so. :-)

benjaminooo

November 24th, 2008, 08:33 PM

Construction Update

In the last issue of Trail Talk and at the October 28th Brown Bag lunch meeting, it was reported that the Northeast Corridor construction contract had been awarded to Sunesis Construction Company. The Indiana Department of Transportation (INDOT) conducted the bid process and granted the notice to proceed on Friday, Nov. 14. Next, Sunesis and the Cultural Trail team will have a pre-construction meeting to coordinate plans.

In addition to the Northeast Corridor construction starting soon, which will connect North St. and Alabama St. to the Monon Trail at 10th St., the North Corridor, connecting North St. and Alabama St. to Indiana Ave., will be bid through INDOT in spring 2009. Capitol Ave., from Washington St. to South St., will be done in conjunction with the Indiana State Convention Center Construction in mid-2009.

The Southeast Corridor construction has been pushed back from spring 2009 to its original schedule in fall 2009. Three blocks were added to the Southeast Corridor so that the existing Cultural Trail at Market St. and Alabama St. could connect to the Southeast Corridor. The schedule change is due to time needed for designing these extra blocks, additional work required for INDOT processes and procedures, design updates and more time needed to raise private funding for this corridor. The Southeast Corridor will bid through the City of Indianapolis.

CorrND

January 19th, 2009, 05:09 PM

New Year, New Construction

This new year brings plans to build nearly four miles of the eight total miles of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail: A Legacy of Gene & Marilyn Glick. (Photo: One of 50 new trees planted along Alabama St. in 2008) Here's a quick update on what's ahead:

http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend.com/ei/r/CD/8BE/886/hjfdr/plantingtrees2.JPG

Northeast Corridor - Sunesis Construction will begin construction this spring on the next mile, which connects North St. and Alabama St. to the Monon Trail at 10th St. A more specific timeline will be announced at a later date.

North Corridor - Similar to the Northeast Corridor, the North Corridor, connecting North St. and Alabama St. to Indiana Ave., will utilize federal transportation funding and be awarded by the Indiana Department of Transportation later this spring.

Capitol Ave. Corridor - The half-mile from Maryland St. to South St. on Capitol Ave. is paid for and will be built as part of the Indiana Convention Center project this summer. To connect this corridor to the Cultural Trail, one block, from Maryland St. to Washington St., will be paid for and built by the Cultural Trail at the same time.

Southeast Corridor - This 1.3 miles connecting Alabama St. and Market St. to the Fountain in Fountain Square will be paid for by private donations and bid through the City of Indianapolis this fall.

We will continue to provide updates in Trail Talk and on our Web site throughout the year. For more information, see our construction schedule or call 317.713.3333.

Cultural Trail May Be Used As National Case Study

Just before Christmas, Santa gave an early gift to the Indianapolis Cultural Trail. Brad Ball, a landscape architect and planner with Toole Design Group (TDG), LLC in Washington, DC, visited the Cultural Trail December 23 and spoke with lead designer Kevin Osburn of Rundell Ernstberger Associates and trail project manager Mark Zwoyer of RW Armstrong. This visit was part of TDG’s ongoing research and analysis of bicycle and pedestrian facilities and policy for the 2009 edition of the American Association of State Highway and Transportation Officials (AASHTO) Design Guidelines for Bicycle Facilities and the new edition of its complimentary publication for Pedestrian Facilities. (See photo from left: Brad, Kevin and Mark review Cultural Trail plans.)

http://indianapolisculturaltrail.createsend.com/ei/r/CD/8BE/886/hjfyk/DSC03669.JPG

“What’s the gift?” you ask? All designers, architects and engineers must follow the lengthy list of AASHTO Design Guidelines for building public works projects. Just imagine how it must feel to have the people who write the guidelines ask to use YOUR project as a case study for all of your colleagues to follow and reference all across the country!

It’s not confirmed that the Indianapolis Cultural Trail will make the final print guidelines, but Brad was pretty impressed: “I learned a lot from the work you have done, and I'm excited to see the progress over the next few years!”

Kudos to our fabulous team who continues to knock this project out of the park on so many levels.

runNgunn

January 20th, 2009, 09:20 PM

Really excited to see how this affects the businesses along Alabama and Mass Ave once the NE section is completed.

CorrND

March 20th, 2009, 08:47 PM

The new Cultural Trail newsletter came out today. It notes:

To date, we have raised $42.5 million toward the $55 million budget. To finish this project in time for Super Bowl XLVI, we still need to raise the remaining $12.5 million.

Interesting. Their budget has silently increased by almost 10%. The "Support the Trail" webpage still indicates this:

As of November 30, 2008, we have raised $41.61 million of our $50.35 million budget!

IndyYeah

March 21st, 2009, 04:09 AM

I have about seven decorative bricks in my garage if they want them.

CorrND

March 21st, 2009, 07:51 PM

I went to the Ransom Place Neighborhood Association meeting today where they had a special Cultural Trail presentation about the north corridor. They went through that corridor block by block showing the schematics for the trail. This is a lot of info, but here are all the new details I can remember:

1. All parking on St. Clair will be eliminated. This almost elicited cheers from the attendees. Apparently they don't like IUPUI people parking in their neighborhood and would rather have not have parking at all. I don't blame them! The presenters said that was the first time they've ever gotten a positive response to telling people that parking was to be reduced or eliminated.

2. St. Clair's West St. crossing will be re-timed so people can actually cross. On my way to the meeting, I used that crossing. I started walking as soon as the light changed and had to run the last third because there simply wasn't enough time to get across before the West St. cars wanted to run me over. I pretty much speed walk everywhere, too, so this is no joke. There will also be a safe crossing time period where NO vehicles will have the right to move across the trail (think of the red left-turn arrows currently on Alabama).

3. On northbound West St., the left-turn-only lane to St. Clair will be eliminated. Instead, the existing center island is going to be extended full-width up to the intersection, providing a safe stop-over area for those that can't cross the street quickly enough.

4. St. Clair is going to be redesigned and repaved from Indiana to the Canal. (They really should extend that one block to Senate because the pavement is "sub-standard" from the Canal to Senate as well.)

5. From St. Clair down to the Walnut St. pedestrian bridge, the existing canal-access sidewalk will be partially used and widened, and a new piece of trail will be created beside the Gardens of Canal Court apartments. The existing sidewalk has too much grade change to be ADA compliant, so they had to make a new piece above the existing retaining wall.

6. On Walnut, the Cultural Trail will occupy the whole street from the canal pedestrian bridge east to Capitol (they previously said that would only be the case between Senate and Capitol). There will be signs attempting to limit vehicle traffic on this section, but because there are condos with garages west of Senate and businesses that may need truck access east of Senate, vehicles will NOT be restricted from this section of the trail. In accordance with trying to limit vehicle traffic, the handful of parking spaces on Walnut near the canal will be eliminated.

7. New traffic signals will be added to Capitol and Illinois at Walnut to allow for safe trail crossings. There will be bump-outs so trail users will only have to cross 4 instead of 6 lanes. These intersections were also designed to accommodate future bike lines on Capitol and Illinois (I'm not sure exactly what accommodations they made, but they specifically mentioned it).

8. As was previously announced, Walnut between Capitol and Meridian will be on a raised median. This section will feature a special art exhibit commissioned by the Glick's with an additional $3M donation that will honor great humanitarians (there were a dozen total, names like Franklin, King, Einstein, Lincoln, Roosevelt, etc). The vehicle traffic areas on these two blocks will also be bricked similar to Monument Circle in an effort to mark this special location.

9. Through the American Legion Mall, the trail will be lightly marked. They want to be sensitive to the design of the mall and not have the trail interfere with or take away from the ambiance. (This may end up one of the few places without signage overload.)

The rest of the trail from Penn east to the Alabama/St. Clair intersection is pretty much as you'd expect given the existing design on Alabama.

k2h

March 28th, 2009, 09:41 PM

Construction Begins March 30 on Northeast Corridor; Traffic Restrictions Start April 1

March 27, 2009 -- Construction on the Northeast Corridor of the Indianapolis Cultural Trail will begin the week of March 30 in the Mass Ave. Cultural District. The Northeast Corridor will run from Alabama and North Streets to the Monon Trail at 10thStreet.

The contractor is anticipating several traffic restrictions throughout the construction process. Please note two upcoming restrictions:
The first restriction is anticipated April 1. This restriction will be onNew Jersey Street between Walnut Street and North Street. Currently,New Jersey Street in this area has two-way traffic, one lane northbound and one lane southbound with parking on the east curb lane of New Jersey. The contractor will make New Jersey Street one-way northbound and there will still be parking available in the east curb lane during this construction. This restriction will be in place approximately ten weeks.

The second traffic restriction will be on Walnut Street from New Jersey Street to Park Avenue. This traffic restriction is scheduled to start April 8 and will last approximately 20 weeks. Currently, Walnut Street is one lane westbound and one lane eastbound with parking mainly on the south curb lane. The contractor will make Walnut Street one-way east-bound with parking on the south curb lane.

Again, other traffic restrictions will be needed in the weeks and months to come. We will keep you updated throughout the construction process.
For more information on the Indianapolis Cultural Trail and the construction sechedule: http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/timeline (http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/timeline).

SkywlkrSnd

April 15th, 2009, 08:36 PM

The IBJ just ran this story (http://www.ibj.com/html/detail_page_Full.asp?content=35528) about three new public art pieces coming to the trail. There is more detail on the Cultural Trail's official site regarding the three proposals.

Prairie Modules 4 & 5 (http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/prairie_modules.html) - will be located on the north side of North Street between New Jersey and Alabama streets. The two architectural sculptures will use tall grass, solar panels, black reflective pavers and LED lighting.
http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/assets/images/M12_exterior.jpg

Chatham Passage (http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/chatham-passage.html) - will be installed in the alley adjacent to Metro Bar. Derry is creating a sunken concrete vault, covered with an ornate steel grate, that will release a faint floral scent.
http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/assets/images/derry.jpg

Care/Don’t Care (http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/care-dontcare.html) - will be located on the east end of Massachusetts Avenue, north of St. Clair Street and College Avenue. The project makes use of a traditional pedestrian signal, programmed to change its message from "Don't Care" to "Care" at random intervals.
http://www.indyculturaltrail.org/assets/images/pawlus.jpg

Interesting ideas, but not sure I'm really "getting" the Chatham Passage one. :? However I do like the solar and LED concept behind Prairie Modules; and Care/Don't Care is just funny.

ablerock

April 15th, 2009, 10:43 PM

More images of Prairie Modules from the M12 website:

http://www.m12studio.org/images/modules_elevation.jpg
http://www.m12studio.org/images/modules_frontelevation.jpg
http://www.m12studio.org/images/modules_jointplates.jpg
http://www.m12studio.org/images/modules_layout.jpg
http://www.m12studio.org/images/modules_roof.jpg

ablerock

April 15th, 2009, 10:57 PM

Here are some interesting perspectives from the Cultural Trail designer's site:

http://www.reasite.com/

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3370/3444890669_ef8ec2c45e_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3582/3444890489_a1669f7097_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3596/3445707160_4298b6c96f_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3602/3444890415_0dc1b84e94_o.jpg

socrates#1fan

April 16th, 2009, 01:14 AM

Why do they show us the plate details?
You can tell what they looked like from a block away!
I don't care for these designs, but if they are temporary I don't care at all.
If they are permanent, than I think this is a huge mistake.
What is with that scent thing? 0_o

runNgunn

April 16th, 2009, 03:35 AM

*Edit: It appears there will be even fewer bicycle racks in this addition by the look of those photos.

Sunday_Bloody_Sundae

April 17th, 2009, 07:13 AM

The prairie module looks and sounds like a good idea, but the whole "prairie grass" thing wont work. A library in Johnson county tried growing a "native prairie" not to be mowed. It looked horrible, weeds grew up and it looked like overgrown brush rather than a prairie. Indiana isn't quite suited for "plains-like" prairies. Instead, we grow brush, weeds, and trees. The cubes might be cool, but the prairie grass is dumb downtown.:ohno:

GarfieldPark

April 19th, 2009, 03:13 AM

I don't know for sure -- but from looking at the "blueprint" for the project, it looks like the prarie grasses could be growing in pots, placed very close together. (Which hopefully would prevent the "weed" problem from occurring. Actually - as I looked at the plans more -- it seems better than I initially thought. I think it will be an interesting experience to be walking or riding a bike through an urban environment and then all of a sudden, begin going through a field of tall grasses - only to suddenly begin going through an LED lit up giant box - and again momentarily feel like you are in an urban setting - being able to view the city again - and them go back into the grasses again - then another LED box - and then again - more grasses. Just a different experience - kind of like walking through the middle of a corn field - going down a row and being completely enveloped in the corn on both sides. I don't know. Kind of strange - and a bizarre experience --- but sometimes, that is what art is about.

Whoever keeps complaining about not seeing enough "classical" art -- take a trip to the Indianapolis Museum of Art. They have hundreds of beautiful paintings and sculptures from Europe, America, Asia, Africa, etc.

GarfieldPark

April 19th, 2009, 03:29 AM

Or - maybe not. In looking at the "Cubes" proposal again - I realized the grasses are only about three or four feet tall -- so so much for the idea of being swallowed up in tall grasses like walking through a corn field. (Unless they might get that tall by July or August -- who knows?) Anyway -- I guess we'll find out what it will be like when it gets put in place.

In other arts news, the annual "bring in a star artist to set up a bunch of their works throughout the city" event should be getting started soon. I think I will like these pieces that will be put up this year. They are by George Rickey - who is originally from South Bend. I've seen several of his art pieces at various museums around the US and in other parts of the world. They are usually large (fifteen to thirty feet tall), usually stainless steel, movable, balanced pieces of art. It is great to watch them move slowly in the wind. I think they are supposed to start putting them up in May. Here is the link to more information:

http://www.publicartindianapolis.org/project_detail.aspx?id=44&active=1

socrates#1fan

April 19th, 2009, 04:55 AM

I Whoever keeps complaining about not seeing enough "classical" art -- take a trip to the Indianapolis Museum of Art. They have hundreds of beautiful paintings and sculptures from Europe, America, Asia, Africa, etc.

Don't be shy. You're talking about me. :)

There is also a lot of modern art, so using your argument we should just wrap that style up and finish up with it. ;)
First of all, give me a good reason as to why we should abandon classic styles just because we already have some.
Shouldn't we encourage diversity of fashions? Different types of art?
Shouldn't we encourage a world that has more than one style of art still in use?
Why should we close the book and classic art? Eh? Let the skill die?
If you notice, most of this city's classic art is also extremely old (that is why most of it is in the IMA).
The Romans had a lot of Ancient Greek artwork, but they still created classic pieces.
Europeans during the renaissance had a lot of roman art but they created classic works, as did the artist of following centuries.
Show me why we shouldn't put in classic public art.
Those who encourage more contemporary public art should simply head to the IMA and see the multiple pieces of contemporary art. ;)

My point is, we need diversity in public art, even if that means violating artists weird phobia of anything ornate or classical and their conformity to ‘traditional = evilness!’.

GarfieldPark

April 19th, 2009, 05:14 AM

socrates#1fan

April 19th, 2009, 05:25 AM

What is my argument? I wasn't arguing with anyone. I was just saying - if someone wants to see Classical art - there is plenty at the Indpls Museum of Art. I didn't say that should be the only place where someone should be able to see Classical art. Also - there is a good amount of Classical art throughout downtown. Have you ever seen the Soldier's and Sailor's Monument? The Hendricks statue or the Morton statue on the grounds of the State House? The beautiful fountain with the statues of pan and the children playing in the water in University Park? The amazing huge, bronze statue on the steps of the World War Memorial? The portraits throughout the Statehouse? The mosaic art on the ceilings in the Federal Court House building? The stained glass in many of the downtown churches? There are many more.
Downtown is also covered with multiple pieces of contemporary art, modern buildings, etc.
Does that mean we should stop?
BTW, this city isn't exactly Florence, we have some classic architecture but in general, not a lot, and even though we have some classic architecture, why the hell should we just stop making classical things?
Also, slowly, little by little this city loses its historic architecture, whether it be fires, natural disasters, or demolition, the city will naturally lose older buildings over time and with it, classic art.
Also, maybe if someone wants to see modern art they can go to the IMA rather than build their sculptures downtown.

I have nothing at all against classical art. I think it is wonderful. I never said there shouldn't be any more downtown. If a beautiful piece of classical art were installed somewhere downtown or anywhere else in the city - I think that would be fantastic. You're not going to get any argument from me. I like all types of art. :)

If you are so open to new classical art than why did you make that comment?
Your comment implied that classic art should not be a part of a modern lives and that it belongs to museums.
That it shouldn't be alive, but rather be the pretty corpse we all look at (In no way am I trying to imply that classic art is dead and like a corpse).
I don't see new classic art projects, it almost makes me think that the arts community ignores classic artists as 'backward' and 'boring' and would rather building something contemporary and "unique".

Why can't we have classic statues on the cultural trail? Why not a classic arch or fountain?

GarfieldPark

April 19th, 2009, 06:01 AM

Sorry for implying that. I definitely didn't mean to imply that. I think you are just a little sensitive to the possibility that someone might have negative thoughts about classical art. I love Van Gogh, Rubens, Seurat, Manet, Monet, Turner, and others. I love Indianapolis' monumental structure; its formally planned street layout; The Dome on the Statehouse; the arched entry to the Majestic building; the beautiful columns and statues around the Court House and the old city hall / state museum / library. I'm not an expert on architectural styles, so I'm not going to try to discuss gothic vs. romanesque vs georgian, etc. Anyway -- there's room for all types of art, architecture, style, design, etc. That's enough of this conversation from my perspective. Lets talk about the Cultural Trail and its related issues.

On that topic -- anyone have any renderings to post yet of the new building along Virginia Avenue and the SE leg of the cultural trail showing the planned new mixed use building to which the IMOCA is supposed to be moving? I'd love to see the design and how it is going to impact that corridor.

socrates#1fan

April 19th, 2009, 07:44 PM

Sorry for implying that. I definitely didn't mean to imply that. I think you are just a little sensitive to the possibility that someone might have negative thoughts about classical art. I love Van Gogh, Rubens, Seurat, Manet, Monet, Turner, and others. I love Indianapolis' monumental structure; its formally planned street layout; The Dome on the Statehouse; the arched entry to the Majestic building; the beautiful columns and statues around the Court House and the old city hall / state museum / library. I'm not an expert on architectural styles, so I'm not going to try to discuss gothic vs. romanesque vs georgian, etc. Anyway -- there's room for all types of art, architecture, style, design, etc. That's enough of this conversation from my perspective. Lets talk about the Cultural Trail and its related issues.

No, I don't mind people hating classic art, what I dislike is the fact that new public artwork is rarely (if ever) anything other than contemporary and people almost seem offended when you imply that maybe this city should build a few new classic pieces.
It is like we are a slave of one style alone.
You don't have to be an architectural expert to love architecture and beauty.
Yes, back on topic I suppose.

ablerock

April 20th, 2009, 04:09 PM

In other arts news, the annual "bring in a star artist to set up a bunch of their works throughout the city" event should be getting started soon.

Thank/Don't Thank Mindy Taylor Ross for that.

ablerock

April 20th, 2009, 04:15 PM

So... Socrates#1fan,

Don't take this the wrong way, but when did you decide to become classicism's great champion?

I enjoy reading your posts, but the majority of them tend to revolve around defending and promoting classical tenets.

When did you discover this love of yours? :-)

socrates#1fan

April 21st, 2009, 03:10 AM

So... Socrates#1fan,

Don't take this the wrong way, but when did you decide to become classicism's great champion?

Thanks for asking. :)
I can't really tell you I suppose.
I suppose it is just my observation and my love of fine craftsmanship that makes me wonder why this style is ignored or considered stuffy or conservative.
I don't think modern architecture is progressive or works. I believe anything that tries to reject everything of the past and try to be in the future is doomed to failure (except in a few rare occasions).
I'm not saying we should be a slave to our past, but why must we reject something that is a part of our heritage and considered beautiful?
Now, I don't hate modern art, I think people should be free to do what they want, especially in art but I don't think architecture is a blank canvas to express one's deepest emotions. I believe architecture is a form of art, but because it is so large, so permanent, so out there, it will have some restrictions (not saying we should have architecture police).
I think a structure can be cutting edge without trying to be foreign to every other structure or trying to be the most unique structure out there.
The Vatican was cutting edge and modern for its time, yet it reflected elements of the past.
To me, classic art and architecture is not something that belongs only to the past.
To me, it seems that classic art is treated like a fading beauty we look at, not daring to revive it or keep it around.
Everything will end and even today we lose bits of classic art with nothing replacing it that follows that style.
I think we must keep it alive, and with it the skill.
I can sit here for hours and tell you why I love classic architecture and why it saddens me that we neglect it so.
I just think it works well and reflects so much about us.

I enjoy reading your posts, but the majority of them tend to revolve around defending and promoting classical tenets.

Thank you, I hope I do not come off as simply bitching at everyone about developments.
That is not my goal, I apologize if I come off that way.
To me, nostalgia is toxic but I don't think that means we should reject the past.
There is a big difference between nostalgia and taking positive aspects of the past to use in the present (Europeans did it in the Renaissance and that we can agree was not nostalgia).
Almost everything about us comes from the past, our language, food, technology, music, politics, fashion etc which seems to live in peace with a progressing world.
Why must we try so hard to reject it (which doesn't mean we should suddenly reject modern art and architecture either)?

When did you discover this love of yours? :-)

Gosh, I can't remember. I was raised in a very artsy home (we went on museum trips religiously).

Now enough about me.
I suppose I should return the favor and ask you where your fondness of architecture (I'm assuming you like architecture) came from.
? :)