What do you think how Asia and China will look like today, if the Communist force did not win and take control of China.

Then there would be WW3,Soviet Union had made Mongolia as its satellite country ,got Dalian seaport and Manchuria railway. (In 1946,the capitalism force admitted Mongolia seperated from China and gave Dalian seaport and Manchuria railway to Russia).Then Soviet Union could easily attack Beijing and occupied north China just like what Japan had done in 1937.Or what northern barbarian had done many years ago.

Then Korea and Japan would also be occupied by Soveit Union.Then it is SEA.In a word,East asia would be the first battlefield of WW3.

China would be richer , like taiwan

China would be richer , like taiwan
and soon be ruined,or ruined before China can protect itself, just like what Japan had done, too.

I always think Sovieit Union can ruin China much easier than US,especially Soviet Union got Mongolia and Manchuria railway.In Chinese history, North always conquered South while South never.

China would be richer , like taiwan

Bull Shit. What a stupid answer is this. :lol:

Hmm... my two cents:

The Chinese Civil War was a real close fought war. Things could easily have turned out differently. Aside from the reality that we all know, two alternative outcomes could easily have happened:

(1) The Nationalists win with massive US support. Perhaps even with the US armed forces getting involved. In such a scenario the CCP will devolve again into a guerilla army constantly playing a game of cat-and-mouse with the legitimate government. The Soviet Union will be only too happy to support it in order to destablilize this big, fat US ally. China becomes a banana republic with perhaps a decent economy. It will never grow very rich given that it has to deal with a permanent insurgency. It will also have no independent foreign policy, being indebted to the US for its continued survival.

(2) Split into north and south, the Communists gaining the north, the Nationalists the south. We will become Vietnam or Korea x 100. Hemmed between the USSR and a US backed South China the CCP cannot afford to break with the Soviets. There will be no Sino-Soviet split. There might be a shooting war between the 2 Chinas, there might be not. In the end no one can conquer the other because not only will they themselves be more or less balanced, their backers the US and the USSR will do everything in their power to prop up their proxies. So no Vietnam part II. No Germany part II either because the southern half could never gain that big an economic advantage over the north as to make it totally dependent. In the end we might end up like the 2 Koreas today.

Three possible outcomes and none of them bright and rosy. Let's all just learn from our collective mistakes and improve ourselves and the country...

Bull Shit. What a stupid answer is this. :lol:Not stupid at all. Wouldn't Korea's northern half be as prosperous as the southern half if the country didn't split up the way it did? Same thing with China.

deled

^^ 我虽不是中国人，但是跟中国人成为贸易伙伴，都知道他们的确很爱国，可不惜一切保卫国土，但万万没想到中国为什么以前会落败在外国人手上就是有像你这类卖国贼的存在搞分裂。所以说，中国需要的不是民主，而需要的是一个能遏制像你这种行为的人。

我只能一边看，一边笑。:lol: :lol:

[QUOTE=Danny Chua;13536330]Hmm... my two cents:

The Chinese Civil War was a real close fought war. Things could easily have turned out differently. Aside from the reality that we all know, two alternative outcomes could easily have happened:


Your two cents make the most sense to me. The Communist Victory of China was brutal and chaotic at first to a few rich and well off people just like chemo affect to a cancer patient which was China at the time. Just imagine two giant Chinese States at war(tension) with each other. The standard of living of two sides could be better off in the beginning with outside Powers' aids flowing in to pop up their respective interests. But the two Chinas would be second class power without any independent foreign policy and permanent indebted to the will of the West and Russia. Xinjiang and Tibet might be broken off. Look at the Taiwan problem right now and multiply it by a thousand.

Not stupid at all. Wouldn't Korea's northern half be as prosperous as the southern half if the country didn't split up the way it did? Same thing with China.

No. A united Korea infact might not be as powerful as S. Korea today. World events change things, and SKorea became what it is today because they needed to survive and have an edge over the North Koreans. When people are threatened and their very existance depends on how well they do they seem to develop faster. Besides Skorea only became wealthy starting the last 20yrs they were rulled by a military dictator. What makes you think a Korea that was never seperated will do better?

China would be richer , like taiwan

Taiwan wasn't rich when the KMT first settled there. They were still corrupt but they again too had to change in order to survive and have an edge over the Communist government therefore they made changes. If the communist never took over China the KMT could of ruined China with rampant corruption.

No. A united Korea infact might not be as powerful as S. Korea today. World events change things, and SKorea became what it is today because they needed to survive and have an edge over the North Koreans. When people are threatened and their very existance depends on how well they do they seem to develop faster. Besides Skorea only became wealthy starting the last 20yrs they were rulled by a military dictator. What makes you think a Korea that was never seperated will do better?South and North Koreans are the same people (or so I guess), so I would suppose that given the same conditions they would do similarly. That's a natural supposition. I don't see why a North Korean threat should have sparked an economic boom in South Korea. If that were the case North Korea should have prospered too as they feel equally threatened by SK. The only consequence from all this is that both countries became heavily militarized.

Regarding China, maybe you're right, maybe not, we can't know. In any case it doesn't sound plausible to me, as there is no region in Asia with a long standing free market economy and significant Chinese population which isn't at least reasonably prosperous, be it Taiwan, HK, Singapore, Bangkok and surroundings or some Malaysian states.

Xinjiang and Tibet might be broken off. Look at the Taiwan problem right now and multiply it by a thousand.
Oh that's a given in both alternative scenarios. Both sides of a fragmented China will not have the means, the stomach or the backing to "reconquer" these regions and so their independence will become a fait accompli. It will be a completely different case compared to the present Taiwan situation.

In fact from a Soviet POV it will make more sense (for them) to have some sort of Eastern version of the Warsaw Pact, and so in scenario #2 northern China might in fact be divided into 4 parts - Uyghuristan, Mongolia, North China and Manchuria.

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k150/swbfmac/possiblechina.jpg

Thanks to the U.S. and Soviet Union, China would be splitted into North China and South China.

Mongolia, Xinjiang (East Turkestan) and Northeast China (Manchuria) would be made independent communist states under Soviet control/influence.

Tibet would be made independent under U.S. influence but it would remain a theocracy and slavery would continue to be practiced while the Dalai Lama rules the country as both religious and political leader. But since U.S. has control, they could care less.

Taiwan would remain Japanese-occupied territory as even though the U.S. requested Japan to give it back to South China, Japan refused and U.S. had its hands full with dealing with the Soviet Union it decided to not backup South China and take the risk of starting a war between two of its allies.

Of course, this won't last long. After a decade or two, a full scale war would take place.

Overall, a very dark alternative future.

You're forgetting that many countries in Asia that are rich today are rich because China turned communist. The US was going to use China as the buffer state against the Soviet Union. But because China turned communist, the US turned to Japan and other countries to ally with to become buffers against the Soviet Union.

Then on the other end, if China didn't turn communist, communism would not have been a global force that it was and the Soviet Union would've either probably collapsed sooner than later than it did or WWIII would've broke out. The Cold War started when China turned communist not when Russia did. China gave communism the international push instead of before when it was contained in Russian and Eastern Europe. China had an identity in common with the rest of the world of being oppressed and occupied by Western colonialists. Because of the Cold War struggle to win hearts around the world, the West was seen as the "bad guys." They didn't care about human rights until communism pointed out to the world of the West's crimes around the world. To which is why the West decolonized during the Cold War. The West had to change or lose the world. So if there were no communism, the West would've never embraced the concept of human rights. They were the Nazis of the world before WWII.

So it's sort of pointless to ask such a question when the US and the West were anything but human rights and democracy advocates before the rise of communism. If China didn't turn communist, it only meant China was still under the control of Western colonialists. I'm not choosing a side. Just stating how it's not as easy as black and white to think either way was good or bad.

So if there's no communism,no Cold war,there's no decolonized.It is communism which made western colonial world collapsed,espically in the 1960s.A world formed 500 years ago.China is the last chain of this world,so when it finally joined in this world in 1840.The world started to collapse.Germany,communism,all against British world or colonial world .The rise of Germany can't be explained by British thought,or colonial thought.Then later it is Soveit Union.

I am not sure what would have happened if communist had lost. But I am sure if Mao Zedong had died 10 years later, there would not have been the rise of China.

If Mao died 10 years earlier, then China would be in the 2020 by now in term of economic development.

不想写英文了,实在太烂了,天知道外国人看了会怎么样.真是哑巴英语,看的懂但说出来全是错的,自己都看不下去.

There will be no Vietnam war, and Korean war would have been brief. Japan would not be the same as today. China will turn into militarism state or the king will return.

If so , none of us would meet here today. :lol:

it's hard to say .and i think it's a silly problem.

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k150/swbfmac/possiblechina.jpg

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In the that historical conditions, even if with out the Communist Party , China will still unified, just another clique to complete this matter, the only difference is --- China's political system may be different from now

http://i87.photobucket.com/albums/k150/swbfmac/possiblechina.jpg

Thanks to the U.S. and Soviet Union, China would be splitted into North China and South China.

Mongolia, Xinjiang (East Turkestan) and Northeast China (Manchuria) would be made independent communist states under Soviet control/influence.

Tibet would be made independent under U.S. influence but it would remain a theocracy and slavery would continue to be practiced while the Dalai Lama rules the country as both religious and political leader. But since U.S. has control, they could care less.

Taiwan would remain Japanese-occupied territory as even though the U.S. requested Japan to give it back to South China, Japan refused and U.S. had its hands full with dealing with the Soviet Union it decided to not backup South China and take the risk of starting a war between two of its allies.

Of course, this won't last long. After a decade or two, a full scale war would take place.

Overall, a very dark alternative future.

can i f*ck with this pic?

In the that historical conditions, even if with out the Communist Party , China will still unified, just another clique to complete this matter, the only difference is --- China's political system may be different from now
It's your right to disagree with me.

Historically, China have splitted up and unified many times already.

However, the main difference is, this time around there are two major FOREIGN influences in play, namely the U.S. and the former Soviet Union. My assessment of this "possible future" is based mostly on what happened to other nations that were caught between the two factions.

can i f*ck with this pic?
What does that even mean?