According to todays Globe (page A11) "next week directors of the non-profit MaRS discovery district are scheduled to announce a private-sector investment of more than $300 million to complete the second phase..."

"The new building will more than double the laboratory and office space available in the complex, making it bigger than any single office tower in the financial district...." It will grow to 1.6 million square feet by 2010. And the best part, "the potential market for research-oriented office in that district, five minutes from the hospitals in one direction, five minutes from the university in the other, is as much as 10 million square feet according to city economic-development officer Kyle Benham.

Excellent news for the health of the city! The stronger we get in Research and Development, the better.

Moving to high-rise.

Potential for 10 mil square feet? Thats sounds a tad optomistic...thats like 3.5 FCP s!!! Thats a ton of space...

Phase two will be significantly taller than phase one.

It seems Toronto's future lies in research and development. Hopefully, we become a world leader - if not the.

It seems Toronto's future lies in research and development. Hopefully, we become a world leader - if not the.

There is NO better thing to become a leader in. Beats call centres any day.

There is NO better thing to become a leader in. Beats call centres any day.

So 10 million sqf of research space downtown? That's a shitload of office towers. Seems our future is bright!

So 10 million sqf of research space downtown? That's a shitload of office towers. Seems our future is bright!

I think what they mean is if you add in all the space from the hospital research wings, and the extra hospital buildings, and all of the uoft buildings, the potential is to expand MaRS influence to 10 million.

Either way, I hope this gets done ASAP. Canada just ranked really horribly on a bunch of rankings in R&D related matters, I hope we can start reversing that trend.

I think what they mean is if you add in all the space from the hospital research wings, and the extra hospital buildings, and all of the uoft buildings, the potential is to expand MaRS influence to 10 million.

Either way, I hope this gets done ASAP. Canada just ranked really horribly on a bunch of rankings in R&D related matters, I hope we can start reversing that trend.

I'm not up to date on the subject, but I was under the impression that Toronto was doing extremely well in that area... has something changed?

I'm not up to date on the subject, but I was under the impression that Toronto was doing extremely well in that area... has something changed?

Yea, I was under that impression too... We should be thankful for having such a strong sciences related university next door to all of this - R&D at UofT is a major player. I think what Epi meant was that R&D doesn't get much government support? (Though I could swear I read that Schwarzenegger recently signed a contract at MaRS with McGuinty - something research related).

Mars 2 is 23 storeys, 113m tall


So 10 million sqf of research space downtown? That's a shitload of office towers. Seems our future is bright

some of those planned, u/c & built off the top of my head

-St Mikes is building a 9 storey research building
-Womens college will be redeveloped with two new highrises,
-Mount Sinai is expanding their new 4 storey research building to 12 storeys
-Sick Kids has a building planned for one of the parking lots by the Nightmare on Elm.
- Leslie L Dan Pharmacy Building
- CCBR building

Mars 2 is 23 storeys, 113m tall




some of those planned, u/c & built off the top of my head

-St Mikes is building a 9 storey research building
-Womens college will be redeveloped with two new highrises,
-Mount Sinai is expanding their new 4 storey research building to 12 storeys
-Sick Kids has a building planned for one of the parking lots by the Nightmare on Elm.
- Leslie L Dan Pharmacy Building
- CCBR building

So I heard about most of these but what are:
Women's College? Where is that first of all:S
Sick Kids has had that planned for over a year hasn't it? Still no news (that I know of).

Womens College is west of Burano

report from this week
http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2007/te/bgrd/backgroundfile-4737.pdf

(Though I could swear I read that Schwarzenegger recently signed a contract at MaRS with McGuinty - something research related).

For stem cell research, I work at a stel cell research lab. California and Ontario will work together in funding new stem cell research. I work at McMaster which is building Innovation Park which is pretty much a carbon copy of MaRS.

Government support for R&D from the province is good but the problem is with the Conservatives at Ottawa. Their extremely picky at what can and can't be funded for R&D such as stem cell research.

I'm not up to date on the subject, but I was under the impression that Toronto was doing extremely well in that area... has something changed?

Hmm was thinking of this: http://www.thestar.com/article/224616

But then of course those reports are always somewhat misleading. I remember reading in the G&B version of that, something that also critized our R&D, but maybe I'm wrong.

Either way, Toronto needs all the R&D jobs it can get, the more the better!

Womens College is west of Burano

report from this week
http://www.toronto.ca/legdocs/mmis/2007/te/bgrd/backgroundfile-4737.pdf

Thanks for this!

Good to know that R&D jobs will be aplenty around here. I thought of going into sciences, biological and chemical - but then I backed out. Too bad.

Great news. I haven't been in the area for awhile (hope to change that soon). Is phase two the building at University and Queen's Park, or is this something different? I thought the latter was already progressing.

As for R&D, I think the city does well. As a country, many businesses, whether Canadian owned or otherwise, relied heavily on the weak dollar, and haven’t invested heavily in R&D for some time (COUGHS … American Auto Industry).

Great news. I haven't been in the area for awhile (hope to change that soon). Is phase two the building at University and Queen's Park, or is this something different? I thought the latter was already progressing.

As for R&D, I think the city does well. As a country, many businesses, whether Canadian owned or otherwise, relied heavily on the weak dollar, and haven’t invested heavily in R&D for some time (COUGHS … American Auto Industry).

Yes, phase two is at the corner of College and University. I hope they chose a more daring design now - to cement that intersection a bit further.

I'm so friggin glad I took biotech science for my post secondary education lol. Finding jobs in research has been pretty easy for me. I've applied to MaRS and they've offered me a job but I had to reject the offer, took McMaster instead (closer to home). But as I gain more experience I intend to apply to MaRS again.

I'm not up to date on the subject, but I was under the impression that Toronto was doing extremely well in that area... has something changed?


My understanding is that Canada as a whole is good at research but is not very good at turning research into patents (something the USA is very good at). MaRS is intended to correct this problem.

I'm so friggin glad I took biotech science for my post secondary education lol. Finding jobs in research has been pretty easy for me. I've applied to MaRS and they've offered me a job but I had to reject the offer, took McMaster instead (closer to home). But as I gain more experience I intend to apply to MaRS again.

My mom works occasionally on projects at MaRS. I once thought of doing what she did (chemical engineering) but then decided I'm not the type.. I'm more of a sleazy businessman.

^ Assuming you got that from your father's side? lol Manager of Sam.

^ Assuming you got that from your father's side? lol Manager of Sam.

:D

I don't have the scientific personality. I loved sciences in school - I did amazing in Chemistry and Physics, but I decided that I'm just not interested in having a life that revolved around them. So, I noticed I'm way more a linguistics type, I love talking, convincing people - I love math and business courses. So, I decided business was the best bet for me - maybe one day I'll do something I like, like working in a major international financial corporation. I'd love to work in Royal Bank's London offices for example.

Or you could be a Program Manger of a research lab! lol

This is the lab that I work at: www.fhs.mcmaster.ca/SCCRI

I'm so friggin glad I took biotech science for my post secondary education lol. Finding jobs in research has been pretty easy for me. I've applied to MaRS and they've offered me a job but I had to reject the offer, took McMaster instead (closer to home). But as I gain more experience I intend to apply to MaRS again.

Amazing! I graduate next year in biochem/biotech and i'm working with nanotech too. Hopefully the building will be as exciting as the research!

I never had any luck finding a job in the biotech industry unfortunately :( Stupid degree.

There is NO better thing to become a leader in. Beats call centres any day.

Um, that's New Brunswick, not Toronto.

For stem cell research, I work at a stel cell research lab. California and Ontario will work together in funding new stem cell research. I work at McMaster which is building Innovation Park which is pretty much a carbon copy of MaRS.

Government support for R&D from the province is good but the problem is with the Conservatives at Ottawa. Their extremely picky at what can and can't be funded for R&D such as stem cell research.


...kinda like Diefenbaker and the Avro - if it doesn't involve farming (and now Nascar) the Conservatives just won't get it.

Conservatives are allergic to the modern world. Think - most of the Conservative MP's are from hillbilly country anyway's!

Since R&D doesn't translate into "Lower Taxes" - they don't get it.

With our dollar on par - our businesses need to get their shit together and begin to get competitive.

Yes, phase two is at the corner of College and University. I hope they chose a more daring design now - to cement that intersection a bit further.

Thanks Filip ... I thought so ... meant College.

Go to the link below and watch a recent news clip about embryonic stem cells (ES cells) research and how the Conservatives are slowly trying to dismantle ES cell research in Canada. Mick Bhatia in the video clip is my boss.

http://www.cbc.ca/clips/rm-hi/mackinnon-stemcells-070212.rm

Basically summed up in that video clip is that currently a new ES cell research committee is being set up, they will regulate what can and can't be approved for ES cell research. So far every single committee member that Harper has appointed is against ES cell research. So take a wild guess what's going to happen eventually.....soon these committee members will start to deny new ES cell research in Canada.

Um, that's New Brunswick, not Toronto.

Got it in one! :cheers:

Hey Guys, don't knock call centres. Many of my peers went on to work at one of the numerous ones here in London after getting there Master's. Of course, aside from some manufacturing and a few insurance companies, not entirely sure what else there is to do here. And the city wonders why graduates don't hang around.

Hey Guys, don't knock call centres. Many of my peers went on to work at one of the numerous ones here in London after getting there Master's. Of course, aside from some manufacturing and a few insurance companies, not entirely sure what else there is to do here. And the city wonders why graduates don't hang around.



That is my point, entirely.. call centres provide "jobs", just like fast food places do.. but it is better for a city to go after R&D than more call centres. Pharmaceuticals is another good field to try and attract.

Personally, I think the world needs more political analysts. Eventually, I’ll run out of degrees to do, and no call centre will want to higher me.

Despite both Ottawa and Kitchener-Waterloo’s claim to be “silicon valley north,” the area including north-east Toronto, Richmond Hill, and Markham has the highest concentration of high-tech computer related industry I believe. We seem to do well in that department, but, aside from AMD (formerly ATI), I’m not sure how much R&D goes on up there (Nortel in Brampton, I guess … but not the greatest success story anymore).

Toronto could be a hot bed for R&D if we pushed kids into technology related education, rather than having so many graduate from the social sciences and humanities. The one thing KW has going for it, is so many computer graduates (York and Toronto's programs suck by comparison).

As an aside, I wonder if BCE can move its headquarters to T.O. after it sells or merges itself with another company.

Since R&D doesn't translate into "Lower Taxes" - they don't get it.



Well, R&D does translate into lowe taxes........for me. I get an R&D tax credit on my stock options.

It is an incentive that the those conservatives implemented to retain R&D workers.

Son of a gun.

Personally, I think the world needs more political analysts. Eventually, I’ll run out of degrees to do, and no call centre will want to higher me.

Despite both Ottawa and Kitchener-Waterloo’s claim to be “silicon valley north,” the area including north-east Toronto, Richmond Hill, and Markham has the highest concentration of high-tech computer related industry I believe. We seem to do well in that department, but, aside from AMD (formerly ATI), I’m not sure how much R&D goes on up there (Nortel in Brampton, I guess … but not the greatest success story anymore).

Toronto could be a hot bed for R&D if we pushed kids into technology related education, rather than having so many graduate from the social sciences and humanities. The one thing KW has going for it, is so many computer graduates (York and Toronto's programs suck by comparison).

As an aside, I wonder if BCE can move its headquarters to T.O. after it sells or merges itself with another company.

You are absolutely correct. Canada's Silicone Valley has been and still is in Richmond Hill and Markham. Ottawa made quite a bit of hay for itself by claiming the title, but everyone in the industry quietly knew it was here.

You are absolutely correct. Canada's Silicone Valley has been and still is in Richmond Hill and Markham. Ottawa made quite a bit of hay for itself by claiming the title, but everyone in the industry quietly knew it was here.

Let's not confuse Silicon with High Tech. It is a subset. There is lots of semiconductor work happening in Ottawa. Not so much in the GTA.

There's a lot of pharmaceutical companies in Mississauga like GSK, Biovail and AstraZeneca.

There's a lot of pharmaceutical companies in Mississauga like GSK, Biovail and AstraZeneca.

Montreal very wisely has cultivated the pharmaceutical companies over the decades. Toronto has played catch-up by being strong in the generic ones.

http://img370.imageshack.us/img370/6594/phase2homepagebadgemh7.jpg

Hard to tell from such a small render, but it looks good. A mashup of sorts involving the nearby Leslie Pharmacy building and CCBR.

- 900,000 sq. ft.
- connected to the subway
- showcase "front room" that will server as entry point to the city's discovery district.

Looks interesting from that point of view. It will complement that intersection nicely.

^I'm more concerned with how it compliments the rest of the MARS complex (and the greater TGH block) than the intersection

^I'm more concerned with how it compliments the rest of the MARS complex (and the greater TGH block) than the intersection

Well it seems to have a bit more flair than the Tower on the other side, so it may not provide a certain sense of symmetry.

I dunno if I like it or not. I'll wait for more renders.

900,000 sq. ft? That's massive! It's bigger than Telus!

Well it seems to have a bit more flair than the Tower on the other side, so it may not provide a certain sense of symmetry

at 23 storeys, symmetry was already out of play. I like it however a mirror of this side on the east would not be good

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/3243/mars2rk4.jpg

Me likey, likey!

Looks like a block guy hugging the building.

^^OMG HAHAH IT DOES! It looks like a guy is squatting/sitting and hugging the building! LOL! What an awesome observation! Beautiful tower btw.. LOVE IT!

Yea a headless and one legged block guy squatting and hugging the building.

Yea a headless and one legged block guy squatting and hugging the building.

Hah awesome! It so does.. I love it

huh? all I see is an arrow pointing up

Ya I see an arrow too.

I'm not sure it looks like 900 000sf of space.

Okay. After seeing that bigger render, which I missed earlier. I love it! Loooove it!

great renders here:

http://www.marsdd.com/phaseII/

I love it. It's going to look so good on University. This is a truly great Canadian success story in the making.

Really awesome building, however would of prefered if they designed to be curvy to match the Toronto Hydro building to create the perfect gateway for University Avenue looking down from Queen's Park. Now that would be the money shot!

is it just me or does that pic make downtown look kinda sprawly and lowrise? i definately know toronto is none of those things, but that picture looks odd.

ohh i like and i want to work there too.

OHH and from the release page.
http://www.marsdd.com/portals/mars/story_images/phase2/ph2-arial-lg.jpg
http://www.marsdd.com/portals/mars/story_images/phase2/ph2-south-lg.jpg

Yes, and it does look wierd beside the curvy hydro building.

Equipment on site.

I love this complex. A nice, big, quiet food court downstairs too :cheers:

I didn't realize the design would be changed from being anything but a twin of the first (East) tower, but this looks pretty good. I wish it was a twin of the first tower, to create symmetry around the old building onsite.

Original render of the MaRS west tower:


MaRS Discovery District - West Tower
http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/marswest.jpg

More equipment on site.

Took some photos today of the excavation taking place at the MaRS Phase 2 site


http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2129/1912789390_d72949d472_b.jpg

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2105/1912789374_acaef1cb81_b.jpg

university avenue is going to look ridiculously impressive in 5 years. from st. clair all the way down to the lakeshore.

Has the subway entrance on that corner been demolished yet or are they going to wait until this building is done?

university avenue is going to look ridiculously impressive in 5 years. from st. clair all the way down to the lakeshore.

Walking along University Ave near St. Patrick station yesterday, it occurred to me that if Toronto ever gets a mega-supertall this is where it should / would go. The scale of the street certainly could handle it, there's some distance from the CN Tower so that it wouldn't compete with it in the skyline, and there are plenty of non-descript mid-rises in the area that no one would miss. Also, shadows over NPSquare wouldn't be an issue if located closer to Dundas and the University subway line would get a major boost, relieving some of the pressure on the Yonge line.

So here's my proposal: a 130-storey, Renzo Piano / Cesar Pelli / Norman Foster-designed skyscraper with offices, courts, a hotel, a U of T dep't, gov't services, etc. Such a tower would still be 50-storeys lower than the CN Tower thereby maintaining its position as Toronto's premier landmark.

Anybody with me on this? Maldive, care to do a rendering?

Renzo Piano / Cesar Pelli / Norman Foster-designed skyscraper with offices

I'd be okay with Piano or a top quality Foster (the firm is so big now it's become a factory of recycled gimmicks and gizmos) but Pelli does nothing for me. IMO, Richard Rogers would be perfectly suited for Toronto as well as a great rival to that British designed engineering marvel going up out west

^^Richard Rogers is fine by me.

Great to see this one back on the radar.

Lookin' good. Just wish they'd demolish the hyrdo building across the street.

Lookin' good. Just wish they'd demolish the hyrdo building across the street.

Huh? Why? That's a great building. It has a beautiful curved facade that suits the intersection perfectly. While I'd love to see an example of this style built a lot taller, it would have to be built somewhere else because the current height is in keeping with the surrounding architecture.

Your statement is another example of someone that just doesn't understand the International Style of architecture. Sometimes less is more. Simple clean lines instead of ornate doohickeys do have their place in good architecture.

I would be very disappointed if the Hydro Building were demolished. Like it or not, it is actually a landmark building in Toronto, just not to the same degree as much taller ones.

I like the Hydro Building too. Too bad it's not taller. But I can think of many more buildings that should be demolished to make way for new projects, but this isn't one of 'em.

This thread has been dead for a couple months, thought I'd breath some life into it - by asking a question! Does anyone have new photos of the site? Anything?

no pictures, but they have been digging! it's not too deep yet, probably 10 or 15 feet. this is truly a massive footprint.

Right about that Yin, the site is massive.

Photos courtesy rbt from his March Construction updates (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=596573) thread.


Mars West (http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/mars_west/)
http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/photograph_mars_discovery_district_west_tower_2008_03_15_7856.jpg

http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/photograph_mars_discovery_district_west_tower_2008_03_15_667.jpg

http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/photograph_mars_discovery_district_west_tower_2008_03_15_9476.jpg

http://www.urbandb.com/canada/ontario/toronto/photograph_mars_discovery_district_west_tower_2008_03_15_7335.jpg

Doesn't that mean that the status needs to be changed from 'planned' to 'under construction'?

Huh? Why? That's a great building. It has a beautiful curved facade that suits the intersection perfectly. While I'd love to see an example of this style built a lot taller, it would have to be built somewhere else because the current height is in keeping with the surrounding architecture.

Your statement is another example of someone that just doesn't understand the International Style of architecture. Sometimes less is more. Simple clean lines instead of ornate doohickeys do have their place in good architecture.

I would be very disappointed if the Hydro Building were demolished. Like it or not, it is actually a landmark building in Toronto, just not to the same degree as much taller ones.


... well the building "might be nice" - but the way the building meets the street is horrible.

If "International Style" means - impersonal, bland, generic buildings - well this would take the cake. It loses points for not being square - so we know they didn't hire a Canadian architect.

Thanks for the quick reply everyone - and thanks for the pics of the site. Much appreciated. This is one of my favourite developments in the city. I can't wait to see this jewel rise. That intersection is going to look sweeeeet when it's finished!

July 3

From University and College looking southeast.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3290/2659882604_5291b74a6f_b.jpg

From College looking southwest.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3112/2659882608_394b5f9b96_b.jpg

Looking south.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3168/2659882614_501b1ece53_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3272/2659882618_fa0689eb7d_b.jpg

last pic is very very very nice current...good shot!

Thanks for the pics current. Looks like they're making good progress.

I get really excited about this building, and office towers like Bay-Adelaide, because of what they represent for the vitality of Toronto's economy. The success of MaRS bodes very well for Toronto's future.

Current, you are progressing in leaps and bounds with your photography... really nice to see it happen! :)

I see two cranes, maybe a third for the north end?

^Yes the third crane on the north west corner is now up as well. Three cranes total now, ramp to be removed soon.

What is the estimated completion date for this baby?

I will be using this subway station a fair amount, which adds to my curiousity. The MaRS complex never really got me excited until I visited and was absolutely blown away by how expansive and well executed it is. It's also rather exciting being a research centre. :)

^^ agreed. I find the idea of the burgeoning research community in Toronto to not only be exciting, but it bodes well for the future of our downtown.

Wonder if Steven Hawking is going to jump to Waterloo, as they are suggesting in the press lately.

^^ Waterloo is where I currently spend my time, and that made front-page news the other day... but then the rumour was quashed when Stephen Hawking's representatives from Cambridge said he won't be making the move. :(

He is, however, visiting us for a week or so, I believe. :cheers:

Even if he has every intention of moving, his staff would automatically say he was not. That is always the case until deals are signed, as he is currently employed in Britain.

As for Hawking, I don't think we know one way or the other right now. Either way, Waterloo is becoming a very interesting place for researchers and scholars in a number of fields.

Is the subway stop going to be built into MaRS?? and the current stop torn down?

I love this building, it really is a beauty, now if only it was like twice as tall..

Is the subway stop going to be built into MaRS?? and the current stop torn down?

Yes, and yes to both questions..

They better re-do the station cause its a dump. Except for the mosaic mural.

Thanks everyone for the comments. I am trying to improve and from that picture of Mars I learned how important lighting is. Light from the setting sun made that picture, and I happened to be there to take advantage of that opportunity.

Photos of the three cranes taken July 25.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3074/2704782596_328ff97446_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3274/2704782638_ef0071b6aa_b.jpg

you are doing a brilliant job, current. We all owe you a beer at the next meet up!

Is there any plans for a MaRS III? ... simply in proposal stage

No I don't think so this is it.

Anyway where would it go?? The lot will be full after this one.

Hahah another phase of MaRS would be way down the road, I'd imagine, but not soon.

September 28

From College looking south, Mars is reaching ground level.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3219/2897686828_652c6f68a9_b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3046/2897686856_e61065ac1c_b.jpg

November 5

Mars is now above street level.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3187/3017913348_e51ed02d6c_b.jpg

The Mars site with Murano reflected in the Hydro building on the right.
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3232/3017913370_1089d547d8_b.jpg

Some people over on UT are reporting that this project is on hold and the cranes will be coming down!! Apparently an announcement is immanent.

http://www.urbantoronto.ca/showthread.php?t=620&page=19

Not sure how much I believe all this but sure would suck if it was true!!

It's official; we have epic fail.

Toronto's MaRS project a step too far

By Garry Marr, Financial Post
Published: Tuesday, November 18, 2008

It's one trip to Mars that's going to take longer thanks to a slowing economy, says the vice-president of the $300-million Medical and Related Sciences complex in Toronto's hospital district.

The second phase of the two-square kilometre project, dubbed MaRS, has been put on hold because the developers can't find enough tenants ready to move into the 750,000 square foot complex by the completion date set for 2010. Phase I of the project was finished in 2005 and its 700,000 square feet are filled.

"The construction has been suspended. It's a reflection of the market conditions right now," says Randal Froebelius, vice-president of real estate for MaRS, a not-for-profit corporation. "We don't want to build an empty building."

While rumours have floated for weeks that many condominium and office projects could end up being halted mid-construction, MaRS is the first company in Toronto to admit it does not make sense to go ahead. A two-floor parking garage has already been built, along with a concourse extension connected to the subway line, but both will all be mothballed until the economy turns around.

The decision was made by MaRS' development partner, Pasadena, California-based Alexandria Real Estate Equities Inc. Alexandria itself has been a victim of the slumping stock market, with the value of the company dropping by about US$2-billion in just under two months.

MaRS developed Phase I on its own but for the second phase it leased the land to Alexandria which is responsible for building and renting the space. Many of the potential tenants for the building are dependent on venture capital funding, a market that has all but dried up as wealthy investors refuse to part with cash on risky investments.

A spokesman for Alexandria was not available for comment yesterday.

"If leasing catches up we could end up back on track and be finished by 2010. The project was ahead of pace," said Mr. Froebelius, adding MaRS fully supported the decision by Alexandria.

The MaRS complex is billed as an innovative centre for companies in the science and technology sector in the embryo stage of their development. The idea was to hook those small startup companies up with business leaders. Firms like RBC Venture, a division of the Royal Bank of Canada, are on site.

MaRS received $70-million in funding from the Ontario government and another $20-million from the federal government but it has been largely funded by the private sector. The company's board of directors reads like a who's who of Toronto's elite, including Royal Bank chief executive Gord Nixon, First Marathon Inc. founder Lawrence Bloomberg and Roy-L Capital chief executive Joseph Rotman.

"This a lot like what happened with the Bay-Adelaide Centre," said Bryan Kerdman, partner at Toronto-based Edgestone Capital Partners which deals with venture capital.

The Bay-Adelaide Centre, now being completed by Brookfield Properties Corp., had its foundation constructed when the market crashed in the early 1990s. The developer closed it off and left just a parking garage and the site became known at "The Stump" for a decade -- a symbol of overbuilding during the last real estate cycle.

"I think it's a wise move. How much can space can be absorbed in this type of economic environment? That type of space is very specialized space too," said Mr. Kerdman. "These are very different times now."

In the case of MaRS, he says, so many investors are afraid to part with their money that small start up firms simply are unable to get off the ground. "These high-net worth individuals had some portion of their assets in the market and now they are less high-net worth than they used to be," said Mr. Kerdman.

Colliers International head of research Ross Moore says this could just the beginning of projects that end up getting mothballed in the coming months.

He points to the proposed new Calgary headquarter of oil and gas giant EnCana Corp. and notes how much trouble the developer of the site seems to be having getting financing for the project. Analysts have speculated H&R Real Estate Investment Trust, one of the largest publicly-traded players in real estate, will have to make some drastic decisions, like cutting its dividend, to finish the project.

"If H&R cannot get a project done today, how are mere mortals going to do it?" said Mr. Moore.

this is bad news.

Our first casualty, and such an important one too.

I'm sure there will be many more. This is a very bad moment in the development world.

Ouch... let's hope for the best that there are not too many casualties.

now does anyone want to admit RECESSION... even in CANADA....Taller?

now does anyone want to admit RECESSION... even in CANADA....Taller?

The existence of recession is a fact-driven assessment, and is not based on subjective indicators, such as the postponement of a particular project.

now does anyone want to admit RECESSION... even in CANADA....Taller?

? I think you are confusing me with someone else. I have never even mentioned recession.

Our first casualty, and such an important one too.

Success II has also been postponed. The crane is down and there is no advertising at the sales centre anymore.

Since we have a huge trade deficit, we've decided to export calamity from the US. :nuts:

The cause: loaning money to deadbeats. One of my friends said, "Even my six year old knows not to loan money to people that can't pay him back".

Anyway, this is really bad. Very prominent corner, very important for high tech, high paying jobs, and they are millions of dollars into it already. I hope that the stopage is of short duration.

Although this is bad news, I kind of wish they would take this time to make a slight change in design. I think it would look much better had they added a slight curve to the building to complement Ontario Hydro across the street. That would fit the street quite well, and build up to Queen's Park.

Although this is bad news, I kind of wish they would take this time to make a slight change in design. I think it would look much better had they added a slight curve to the building to complement Ontario Hydro across the street. That would fit the street quite well, and build up to Queen's Park.

Exactly what I was thinking:cheers:

The site is too narrow to have a building with an inward curve.

The site is too narrow to have a building with an inward curve.

you're right, they're already in trouble, they're not going to reduce their profits by reducing usable space. Although i agree from a design perspective it makes sense.

Even ignoring economics and practicality, there is just no room there to have a curved building like Hydro.

isaidso
the new republic




Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: The Big Smoke
Posts: 4,319 Quote:
Originally Posted by Sixrings
nothing... theres a recession

You've been watching too much foreign television. Various foreign nations are in recession, but Canada is not.

Sorry Taller shoulda cheked first

What exactly does your post mean?

that their is a recession and this is the first proof. You wrote that the recession was only in the states and that we were seperate in the forum for city hall redevelopment.. maybe now u can admit that our economy isnt just fine and dandy right now.

that their is a recession and this is the first proof. You wrote that the recession was only in the states and that we were seperate in the forum for city hall redevelopment.. maybe now u can admit that our economy isnt just fine and dandy right now.

A recession = negative economic growth. This tower being canceled does not = negative economic growth. It could very well happen, but as already been said, "The existence of recession is a fact-driven assessment, and is not based on subjective indicators, such as the postponement of a particular project."

that their is a recession and this is the first proof. You wrote that the recession was only in the states and that we were seperate in the forum for city hall redevelopment.. maybe now u can admit that our economy isnt just fine and dandy right now.

If you're going to use economic terminology, it's necessary to understand what the word means. A recession is not an arbitrary term, but defined by very strict parameters. A recession is two consecutive quarters of contraction. We haven't even had one yet.

If you're going to use economic terminology, it's necessary to understand what the word means. A recession is not an arbitrary term, but defined by very strict parameters. A recession is two consecutive quarters of contraction. We haven't even had one yet.

What everyone seems to be missing is the fact that GDP growth (contraction) is a lagging economic indicator. By the time revised GDP numbers actually come out for this and the previous quarter it won't matter. That is why the technical recession parameters aren't all that usefull. It will tell you that there was a recession, but can never say that we are currently in one. There is no doubt in my mind that Canada is on the brink of recession, whether we're in the negative GDP numbers or not is largely irrelevant at this point. Technical GDP parameters are for historians, what traders look at are jobless claims, retail reports, Forward and trailing P/E ratios and other more current indicators to judge current GDP. All of the above point to a recession.

^^ I don't think people are missing that it is a lagging indicator. We simply haven't discussed it.

What everyone seems to be missing is the fact that GDP growth (contraction) is a lagging economic indicator. By the time revised GDP numbers actually come out for this and the previous quarter it won't matter. That is why the technical recession parameters aren't all that usefull. It will tell you that there was a recession, but can never say that we are currently in one. There is no doubt in my mind that Canada is on the brink of recession, whether we're in the negative GDP numbers or not is largely irrelevant at this point. Technical GDP parameters are for historians, what traders look at are jobless claims, retail reports, Forward and trailing P/E ratios and other more current indicators to judge current GDP. All of the above point to a recession.


All of that is true of course, but it's still counting your chickens before they hatch. There's always a bit of a catch 22. Since consumer confidence is an important factor, and one that is both quick to measure, and affected by speculation, tends to promote self-fulfilling prophecies.




KGB

^^ All the more reason it's just not as cut and dry as people are making it seem.

All the more reason it's just not as cut and dry as people are making it seem.

You're right...it's the topic of the moment, not because everyone has done indepth research...but because the media has been bombarding everyone with headlines like "in these difficult times". Say anything enough, people will think it...and people react on what they think.




KGB

ya but who has confidence these days. Doesnt seem like many. So as much as like to avoid one I dont know how I could pretend I cant see it coming. Especially with ford gm and chrys going under. I hate those cars but theyre good for our economy. Maybe they should have built quality products and not given their unions sooo much power.

This is the stuff that the R thread was made for, by the way.

I've left a brief announcement regarding MaRS in the 'R' thread. I suppose I'll find out shortly how reliable my source is.

Here is the inside scoop:

Phase two of MaRS will be moving to MISSISSAUGA!

Mayor Hazel McCallion and the City of Mississauga will be making a formal annoucement soon.

Louroz

Here is the inside scoop:

Phase two of MaRS will be moving to MISSISSAUGA!

Mayor Hazel McCallion and the City of Mississauga will be making a formal annoucement soon.

Louroz

That doesn't make sense, as they have already built the basement??

Especially with ford gm and chrys going under. I hate those cars but theyre good for our economy.

Are they really? They live on coporate welfare and the jobs they provide can be easily filled by others.

Couldn't Mississauga start up their own project instead of poaching MaRS? I guess that is the extent of "innovation" and "cooperation" in this country.

This really makes no sense at all ...

Why would they build it half way (to the foundation) and then decide to move the entire project.

Here is the inside scoop:

Phase two of MaRS will be moving to MISSISSAUGA!

Mayor Hazel McCallion and the City of Mississauga will be making a formal annoucement soon.

Louroz


I don't believe it. Mars is located where it is because of it's proximity to the U of T and the Hospitals in the area. They might get something similar but it wouldn't be the same. If there is no money for Mars then there wouldn't be for Mississauga either.

Yeah sorry, but that isn't likely to happen, if its already somewhat built, but on hold, if they suddenly got money or more tenants or whatever, they would just continue to build. The only reason I could see them moving is cheaper lease rates, but still that is such a long shot... Where are u getting this information Louroz, or is this just a hope for u? Its just too ideal a spot and the complex is already 2/3 built.

^^ He claimed in the Ontario section that he attended a public meeting in which Mayor McCallion stated MaRS would move to Mississauga. If this was true there would be major media coverage.

Sure, I agree that it makes no sense but why would the Mayor lie to him ... unless she's confused i.e. Possibly phase 3?

It really makes no sense at all otherwise.

I think Future Mayor said that because he's bored because UT is still down, lol. It makes no sense for them to move Mars to Miss.

From what I recall on UT he's not one to lie and usually has accurate information.

All I can say is if it's true as reported this will be a very sad day for Toronto ... it makes no sense at all. The reasons for it;

It can NOT be the cost of construction ... they would have not considered the Toronto location at all if that was the case.

It may be the fact that rental rates are less there and they feel that may attract more clientele. But I mean the tenants are supposedly in medial research area ...

Moreover the city should have attempted to fight this ...
Whatever the case is I hope all the details come out. This makes no sense whatsoever.

The whole point of MaRS was to have all these companies together in one place. Putting part of the project in Mississauga makes no sense.

Maybe he means M.A.R.S is getting a new building. Mississauga Animal rescue services. :nuts:

The reason it was canceled was because they couldn't get tenants. How would Mississauga fix that?

It's not going to Mississauga.

This makes absolutely no sense, from a financial, research, scientific basically any point of view...

Louroz man, I know you're high up on all this, but this really makes no sense.

As happy as I would be to hear that this project is moving to Mississauga... I have to side with everyone else. WTF?!?

It would be offensive to the research community to move this to Mississauga.

I wouldn't go so far as to say it's offensive. That's ridiculous. But I also think the prospect of moving MaRS from TO to Missy would be ridiculous.

The whole reason MaRS is where it is, is to benefit from the synergies created in the area by the astounding amount of research done in the hospitals and the university next door.

Putting this magnet of research and innovation in Mississauga is akin to building an ice rink the middle of the Sahara.. It simply does not make sense!

The whole reason MaRS is where it is, is to benefit from the synergies created in the area by the astounding amount of research done in the hospitals and the university next door.

Putting this magnet of research and innovation in Mississauga is akin to building an ice rink the middle of the Sahara.. It simply does not make sense!

It does make sense for the city of Mississauga to want a development like MaRS, and would make sense for MaRS if they were given a good deal. Its not like Mississauga is a 5 hour plane ride away from Toronto. In todays world, most communication is done by phone, email and fax. MaRS can be successful anywhere it sets up.

What doesn't make sense is why move it now? Unless the decision to halt construction was made soley by Alexandria, and MaRS wants to move in asap, I see no reason why they would abandon the current site. Even if that is the reason, im sure the prospect of losing MaRS as a tenant would force Alexandria to resume construction.

It's not the same, sure communication enables us to have customer service reps in India, but this is not the same.

I'm afraid I can't even give Louroz the benefit of the doubt here, it just makes no sense, nearly from every perspective.

It's not the same, sure communication enables us to have customer service reps in India, but this is not the same.

I'm afraid I can't even give Louroz the benefit of the doubt here, it just makes no sense, nearly from every perspective.

You missed my point. Mississauga isn't far enough that it would become a problem for MaRS. You're right, its not the same... Mississauga isn't India.

Mississauga might as well be India for what this project means. The reason it's THERE is to be able to be from walking distance from the largest cluster of research in Canada, hence the Medical and Related Sciences (MaRS) project.

The project is either there, or dead. Mississauga might be getting another sort of research complex, that is no way affiliated with MaRS. I think old Hazel is seeing things again, let's just hope she doesn't end up in a light pole again.

Mississauga might as well be India for what this project means. The reason it's THERE is to be able to be from walking distance from the largest cluster of research in Canada, hence the Medical and Related Sciences (MaRS) project.

But the need for it to be walking distance does not exist in this day and age. Its a minor detail.

I can assure all of you that this project is very much a reality and all the details will be released very soon.

I was making a deputation to Mississauga City Council regarding the 2015 Pan American Games Bid last Wednesday, November 26, 2008. The meeting was broadcast live on Rogers Cable 10.

Council Agenda:
http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/2008CouncilAgenda_november26_.pdf

The Economic Development Office made a presentation prior to mine. (see press release below "Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster").

While commenting on the presentation, Mayor McCallion mentioned specifically how the MaRS project in Toronto was cancelled and that the project would now proceed with construction in Mississauga, which would further grow the Life Sciences sector in this city.

The Mayor revealed that a large Mississauga-based pharmaceutical company was suppose to lease several floors of the stalled MaRS Toronto project, and as a result will now anchor the MaRS Mississauga project.

She indicated that this hasn't been announced to the public yet, however a press conference was forthcoming very soon where all the details on including partners and exact location.

Louroz

Mississauga's Life Sciences Sector Flourishes under the Microscope in New Study http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/EDO_Final_Life_Sciences_Study_Bookmarked.pdf

http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/EDO_30_2008.wmv

Dec 02, 2008

The City's Economic Development Office (EDO) has launched a new study focusing on Mississauga's expanding life sciences sector. Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster Study and Directory, and the Life Sciences Focus brochure update findings of previous studies and provide a more detailed directory of the many companies that actively support the growth of this sector in Mississauga.

A key finding of the study is a continual increase in the level of employment of this sector, adding more than 5,000 knowledge workers from 2003 to 2007. According to the study, Mississauga is home to the third largest life sciences cluster in Canada, with more than 375 companies employing approximately 24,800 people.

"Exceptional talent, innovative companies and the convergence of many related industries in Mississauga are propelling this leading economic cluster forward," said Larry Petovello, director of the Economic Development Office. "Mississauga is well-positioned to provide employment opportunities for its citizens as we build a city for the 21st century."

The study specifies that the life sciences industry requires talent that focuses on two main areas of expertise: the industry must have highly-skilled scientific and technical personnel, and it also requires experienced management to lead production and drive the marketing of products and services.

"It's apparent that life sciences firms are attracting highly-skilled candidates in Mississauga," adds Petovello. "The City is surrounded by some of Ontario's finest post-secondary institutions offering a wide variety of educational opportunities. Within an hour commute of Mississauga, there are nine major universities and six technical colleges with programs pertinent to life science-related occupations."

For more information regarding this comprehensive study, contact EDO at 905-896-5016, or download Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster Study and Directory at www.mississauga.ca/business.

Mississauga is Canada's sixth largest city with a population of more than 700,000. With well-established infrastructure and state-of-the-art facilities, the City is considered to be an employer of choice, delivering quality municipal programs and services to its citizens. Mississauga is a dynamic, diverse and progressive municipality, known for its economic strength and for being Canada's safest city.

-30-

Louroz

In that context, as a viable alternative, it makes perfect sense. Let's hope they build the new facility in the MCC.

Hey Tuscani01, I think our Toronto/Ottawa friends are in shock :poke:

Filip

Were you aware of this fact before you sounded off?

"A key finding of the study is a continual increase in the level of employment of this sector, adding more than 5,000 knowledge workers from 2003 to 2007. According to the study, Mississauga is home to the third largest life sciences cluster in Canada, with more than 375 companies employing approximately 24,800 people."

Toronto as a city really needs to start doing a lot more to prevent things like this from happening.

Whether it be lower taxes in particular market areas or provide funding for smaller pharmaceutical companies.

----------

Let's just hope they build it in MCC as if you've seen any of the recent office development in Mississauga ... it's terrible. Strips near the airport seem to be home to the majority of them (aka RIM just to mention one) - with absoltly no connection whatsoever between them ... I'm not sure what the name of that road is but does anyone walk outside there? I was working in the area for 2 years and I hated it! It's a lot worse then Hi-way 7 around Lesile.
BUT if those goes in MCC at least there's a chance it'll help the community a lot more. I wonder if it'll still be the same size. Or if they're reduce it and change the plan all together.

Sad day.

To be honest I wonder how legal this even is ... I'm sure it's legal but it sure will send a bad image.
There was so much hype about this project, the Mayor was out to the opening event - there was a lot of talk all around. Now to suddenly pick up and move the entire project.
It really makes no sense if you stop and think about it.
If there's a company in Missi that's want office space they can build their own tower. This should be a seperate project all together to complement MARS I.

So what is this now ... officially we have the new BA stump of the 21st century. See there's no getting rid of it, we looked to be in the clear but nope. I guess it's not much of a stump.
At the very least one could hope they attempt to build this office building as is when the time is right ... I mean millions must have been spent on the planning / permits / DIGGING THE FOUNDATION! which was just about complete.

Ridiculous! You'd think the city would get involved ... I guess there's not much they can do though.


You know what if someone wanted to they could go straight to the source:
jsylksiegel@rxir.com
from Alexandria Real Estate and confirm with them.

But I'm not sure if the information is still meant to be confidential so I won't.

I don't mind the idea of having it built in Mississauga, but like others have said, why now? Construction was well underway.

So now we have a stump in front of the Ontario Legislative Building at one of the most important intersections in Canada...

Don't count your chickens before you hatch....lets see how far mississauga actually gets with this. THe Toronto project still has a basement, and as of now this is just a proposal, and to me it doesn't even seem to be the same thing exactly, and I don't think it will be the same as what we have in MaRS already in built form in Toronto. Mississauga can do what they like, but when they talk of Universities within commuting distance, they are all in Toronto essentially, aside from Mac, which is still a good 40 mins away.

Anyway, this is just a study they are having, does it even say anything about MaRS, and also, what nine school are within an hour of Mississauga? Are they counting London, Brock, Petebourough? Those are more than 1 hour and aren't going to help if MaRS was built in Mississauga. Sorry but Im still skeptical.

Hurray for Mississauga!! we'll take it thank you.

I can assure all of you that this project is very much a reality and all the details will be released very soon.

I was making a deputation to Mississauga City Council regarding the 2015 Pan American Games Bid last Wednesday, November 26, 2008. The meeting was broadcast live on Rogers Cable 10.

Council Agenda:
http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/2008CouncilAgenda_november26_.pdf

The Economic Development Office made a presentation prior to mine. (see press release below "Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster").

While commenting on the presentation, Mayor McCallion mentioned specifically how the MaRS project in Toronto was cancelled and that the project would now proceed with construction in Mississauga, which would further grow the Life Sciences sector in this city.

The Mayor revealed that a large Mississauga-based pharmaceutical company was suppose to lease several floors of the stalled MaRS Toronto project, and as a result will now anchor the MaRS Mississauga project.

She indicated that this hasn't been announced to the public yet, however a press conference was forthcoming very soon where all the details on including partners and exact location.

Louroz

Mississauga's Life Sciences Sector Flourishes under the Microscope in New Study http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/EDO_Final_Life_Sciences_Study_Bookmarked.pdf

http://www.mississauga.ca/file/COM/EDO_30_2008.wmv

Dec 02, 2008

The City's Economic Development Office (EDO) has launched a new study focusing on Mississauga's expanding life sciences sector. Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster Study and Directory, and the Life Sciences Focus brochure update findings of previous studies and provide a more detailed directory of the many companies that actively support the growth of this sector in Mississauga.

A key finding of the study is a continual increase in the level of employment of this sector, adding more than 5,000 knowledge workers from 2003 to 2007. According to the study, Mississauga is home to the third largest life sciences cluster in Canada, with more than 375 companies employing approximately 24,800 people.

"Exceptional talent, innovative companies and the convergence of many related industries in Mississauga are propelling this leading economic cluster forward," said Larry Petovello, director of the Economic Development Office. "Mississauga is well-positioned to provide employment opportunities for its citizens as we build a city for the 21st century."

The study specifies that the life sciences industry requires talent that focuses on two main areas of expertise: the industry must have highly-skilled scientific and technical personnel, and it also requires experienced management to lead production and drive the marketing of products and services.

"It's apparent that life sciences firms are attracting highly-skilled candidates in Mississauga," adds Petovello. "The City is surrounded by some of Ontario's finest post-secondary institutions offering a wide variety of educational opportunities. Within an hour commute of Mississauga, there are nine major universities and six technical colleges with programs pertinent to life science-related occupations."

For more information regarding this comprehensive study, contact EDO at 905-896-5016, or download Mississauga: A Leading Life Sciences Cluster Study and Directory at www.mississauga.ca/business.

Mississauga is Canada's sixth largest city with a population of more than 700,000. With well-established infrastructure and state-of-the-art facilities, the City is considered to be an employer of choice, delivering quality municipal programs and services to its citizens. Mississauga is a dynamic, diverse and progressive municipality, known for its economic strength and for being Canada's safest city.

-30-

Louroz

MaRS is not moving to Mississauga, rather there is an initiative to set up a Life science cluster in that city - just as there are life-science cluster initiatives in Ottawa, Kingston and other cities. MaRS already exists, the spaces are occupied in phase one, and there is a waiting list to get in.

The cranes on the MaRS site were moving stuff around today... maybe closing stuff up. It made me sad because I realized that I won't be seeing activity on that site (ie. building up) for perhaps a long time. Time will tell.

This cancellation flew under my radar. Very unfortunate. This was one of the most exciting office projects the city had.

I'm very skeptical about this illicit cancellation. First, I wasn't aware that MaRS would be home to a major life sciences company. It was supposed to be the centre for research and to provide a means to finance research projects into new start-up companies.

The contstruction is fairly well under-way. Why would they cancel it now to move to Mississauga? Seems ridiculous. The purpose of MaRS is the proximity to all the research hospitals along University avenue as well as U of T and Ryerson within walking distance. Mississauga has nothing like that. Yes the city is a big employer but they don't have such a dense area for cross-collaboration.

I hope that this cancellation is bogus and MaRS phase two continues forward to completion.

So basically a Mississauga-based company that was planning on leasing space in MaRS will now find space in Mississauga instead. Not a huge deal, the whole project is not moving to Mississauga.

I'm very skeptical about this illicit cancellation. First, I wasn't aware that MaRS would be home to a major life sciences company. It was supposed to be the centre for research and to provide a means to finance research projects into new start-up companies.

The contstruction is fairly well under-way. Why would they cancel it now to move to Mississauga? Seems ridiculous. The purpose of MaRS is the proximity to all the research hospitals along University avenue as well as U of T and Ryerson within walking distance. Mississauga has nothing like that. Yes the city is a big employer but they don't have such a dense area for cross-collaboration.

I hope that this cancellation is bogus and MaRS phase two continues forward to completion.

The likely culprit in the cancellation is the American development company that the MaRS project was in bed with:
The decision was made by MaRS' development partner, Pasadena, California-based Alexandria Real Estate Equities Inc. Alexandria itself has been a victim of the slumping stock market, with the value of the company dropping by about US$2-billion in just under two months.

Most Life Sciences companies have warehouses in Mississauga such as BD Biosciences and VWR. Invitrogen recently relocated from Missy to Burlington. Thermo Fisher has a warehouse in Whitby. Those are the big four.

I work in a lab and deal with these pesky reps all the time.

MaRS already exists and it's not going anywhere. Phase 2 will get built, just maybe not in our lifetime.

Most Life Sciences companies have warehouses in Mississauga such as BD Biosciences and VWR. Invitrogen recently relocated from Missy to Burlington. Thermo Fisher has a warehouse in Whitby. Those are the big four.

I work in a lab and deal with these pesky reps all the time.

What about Baxter? Aren't they pretty big? I remember BD when I used to be on dialysis back in the day, but Baxter seemed big, so did fresinius?

I shoot the dud driving by on a snowy December afternoon:

http://i252.photobucket.com/albums/hh33/urbandreamer4ever/constructionpixtorontobyurbandreamer4ever/DSC00523.jpg

What about Baxter? Aren't they pretty big? I remember BD when I used to be on dialysis back in the day, but Baxter seemed big, so did fresinius?

I don't think Baxter is a Life Sciences company. Think they deal more with patients.

I'm still betting that FutureMayor and/or Hazel McCallion simply misheard and/or misspoke. Relocating MaRs from its current prime location to the fields of Mississauga seems to go against the whole reason for building this thing in the first place.


And I understand that there are (strangely) some pretty big Mississauga homers on this forum (Mississauga pride!!..or whatever), but as a resident of neither Toronto nor Mississauga, I'd have to say I'd be very disappointed if this project does get canned in favour of a Missy location. Why would any architecture or skyscraper fan (aside from the weird Mississauga homers) want to see this:
http://www.marsdd.com/MaRS-Centre/Office-and-Lab-Facilities/Phase-II/mainColumnParagraphs/0/image/ph2-main-med.jpg
http://www.marsdd.com/MaRS-Centre/Office-and-Lab-Facilities/Phase-II.2.html

Turn into this?
http://i40.tinypic.com/2nk51lc.jpg

haha!!

It's IBM!

There lab to be specific.

I'm still betting that FutureMayor and/or Hazel McCallion simply misheard and/or misspoke. Relocating MaRs from its current prime location to the fields of Mississauga seems to go against the whole reason for building this thing in the first place.


And I understand that there are (strangely) some pretty big Mississauga homers on this forum (Mississauga pride!!..or whatever), but as a resident of neither Toronto nor Mississauga, I'd have to say I'd be very disappointed if this project does get canned in favour of a Missy location. Why would any architecture or skyscraper fan (aside from the weird Mississauga homers) want to see this:
http://www.marsdd.com/MaRS-Centre/Office-and-Lab-Facilities/Phase-II/mainColumnParagraphs/0/image/ph2-main-med.jpg
http://www.marsdd.com/MaRS-Centre/Office-and-Lab-Facilities/Phase-II.2.html

Turn into this?
http://i40.tinypic.com/2nk51lc.jpg

I would be most happy if the first render would show up in MCC and not too happy if the second would show up anywhere else in Mississauga.

I shoot the dud driving by on a snowy December afternoon:

And this is typical of the joy you try to spread with your pictures and comments.

So, ho ho ho and seasons greetings to all lovers of this place.

This place we call home.

The MaRS complex in Toronto (which is one part of the much greater Discovery District) has 800 to a million square feet built and leased with the first two phases. They aren't going anywhere.


If the City of Mississauga has sponsered they own version of Mars and have attracted a potential tenant from Toronto well, that's good for them. It's nothing to get overly excited about on both sides of the coin.

You're referring to the first phase or the second, or both?

Just to be clear, MaRS Phase Two isn't canceled out right and being moved to MCC as has been reported by a form member?

We all know it's on hold now...

You're referring to the first phase or the second, or both?

Just to be clear, MaRS Phase Two isn't canceled out right and being moved to MCC as has been reported by a form member?

We all know it's on hold now...

MaRS phase 2 is simply an additional building built for the MaRS complex. Moving the second building to Missy would make little to no sense, as it would be miles away from the rest of the complex. Which is why so many people here are so skeptical about Futuremayor's claims. I think Valantino is probably spot on.

I would be most happy if the first render would show up in MCC and not too happy if the second would show up anywhere else in Mississauga.

In all the years I've been posting or reading development related forums, I can't remember a single time where any non-residential development (that isn't a Tim Hortons/Starbucks/McDonalds etc..) went from "lets hope it is built in MCC" to "Gee golly, its great that they're building this in MCC". Lets not delude ourselves, we all know what we're in store for if this gets built in Missy.

You're referring to the first phase or the second, or both?

sorry, ment to say first two "buildings". (Second tower but, third building is on hold)

A lot of hope is resting on non-residential highrise development in MCC. I just don't see it happening in the forseeable future. Lease rates just aren't there.

Is there any potential to build a public square, or something, on this stump for the meanwhile?

An UT member says this building is starting in October 2010. Hope he's right.

Good, the last thing we need is another Stump or Metropolis cement pad for a few years. The government should have just had this funded and built instead of halting it.

An UT member says this building is starting in October 2010. Hope he's right.

Hope that he's right. They can't let the place be like Ryugyong Hotel in North Korea.

As heard on UT.

Great news that this project is confirmed in restart September/October this year.

I do hope that you are correct.

Contact at MARS.

Excellent.

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/3243/mars2rk4.jpg

Let's hope the design hasn't been compromised.

Here is the inside scoop:

Phase two of MaRS will be moving to MISSISSAUGA!

Mayor Hazel McCallion and the City of Mississauga will be making a formal annoucement soon.

Louroz

Will you be having your crow with or without BBQ sauce?

FutureMayor will be in tears! :lol:
Probably a relative of the Dried Apple Doll mayor.

FutureMayor will be in tears! :lol:
Probably a relative of the Dried Apple Doll mayor.


No he's not, I've met him a few times. She is a huge idol to him though. He's just waiting in the wing like many others for her to step down or not wake up one day.

or not wake up one day.


Which by my reckoning should be somewhere around 2084, give or take a month! :lol:

Prince Charles has the same problem.

Posted by Tuscani01 on UT.

I also have a contact at MARS who claims they are in discussion with stakeholders once again. Renderings have been circulating at MARS. Its going to be the exact same building that was planned. Apparently they are considering demolishing what was already built and starting from the hole again.

Good news. I love the old proposal. It's a nice big fatty! :colgate:

I wonder why they would start from scratch? It looks like they kept the foundation in great shape over the past 2 years. Unless they plan on changing around the interior layout of the building.

I wonder why they would start from scratch? It looks like they kept the foundation in great shape over the past 2 years. Unless they plan on changing around the interior layout of the building.

That is indeed the rumour at UT.

Aecon is the new project builders for this project.

By androiduk on UT.

Saw some workers scurrying in and out of the construction trailer today. I mentioned it to one of the maintenance workers in MaRS and he said it was supposed to be starting up again very soon.

http://andrewfare.com/UTB/mytoronto10/marstump1.jpg