Found this picture on Flickr today:

http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1057/3172088463_f662c5c651_b.jpg

^^

I kindof wish it would stay purple. At least it's interesting with that color.

When the beige EIFS is slathered on, all one will be able to think of is birthday cakes and cruise ships when looking at that building.

^^

I kindof wish it would stay purple. At least it's interesting with that color.

When the beige EIFS is slathered on, all one will be able to think of is birthday cakes and cruise ships when looking at that building.

:lol: A cruise ship! LMAO! Hadn't heard that one before. Now that's all I'll be able to think about. Now all it needs is some porthole windows...

Ablerock, I tend to agree. Driving by on the interstate it definitely sticks out with the purple

My father in law stayed with us for the holidays and when we took him down on the avenue, his words, "Its going to be purple??"

*doink*

The funny thing though is that after explaining it, he seemed to think it was going to be a nice place once finished as long as it didnt end up purple. LOL

I thought the same cruise ship thingy. I keep thinking of the movie Titanic when they are peering over the edge-scene. Kinda like the purple. But you know the thing does look imposing at that angle.

My father in law stayed with us for the holidays and when we took him down on the avenue, his words, "Its going to be purple??"

*doink*

The funny thing though is that after explaining it, he seemed to think it was going to be a nice place once finished as long as it didnt end up purple. LOL

Or in other words, as long as it doesn't stick out in the crowd and blends in like a nice little clone.

My parents would probably say the same thing. :-)

I'll try to remember my camera next week. The window I look out at work looks down on 3 Mass. I'm on the 12th floor of Indiana Square. It's coming along nicely.

Are the balconies going to be a real curve, or have the flat part like the frame of it is?

i think its ganna be pretty cool. i passed by there today and cant wait for it to be done.

I thought the same cruise ship thingy. I keep thinking of the movie Titanic when they are peering over the edge-scene. Kinda like the purple. But you know the thing does look imposing at that angle.

From that angle, it looks like it will be a good anchor for Mass Ave. (Bad pun intended.)

Here are a few pics from earlier today.

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/Picture014.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/Picture017.jpg

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/Picture018.jpg

It still amazes me how much of an impact this building makes. Certainly an entirely brick building would have looked better but... I don't think the white will look horrible. We'll have to see the final project. At any rate, this is a great infill project.

^^ It isn't white, it's egg shell you serf! >=0
Anyhow, I like it. It is modern yet blends in with the victorian beauties around it.
I love the height too.

http://i247.photobucket.com/albums/gg148/Spidermonkey317/Picture017.jpg

I'm not sure about that first floor yet. It looks like any business entrances will be via lobby.

ak72...

One day we'll be farther north on Mass Ave, say at the Old Point. We'll be looking south at the great new glass on One Indiana Square, but our view will be partially obstructed by a giant beige wall. The view from Omalia's parking lot says it all. If you haven't had a chance yet, check it out.

It's going to look like a giant beige Carnival Cruise ship just docked on Mass Ave.

I applaud your optimism, but it's really going to damage the Mass Ave Neighborhood skyline when viewed from the north or east. The only things that are going to save the view are decent-height developments on the lots north and east of it. (Which the developer probably anticipated and is why they went with such a craptastic surface.)

I wonder what the eventual height limit, and how high buildings in the future will top out at on Mass Av? We discussed this somewhat last summer, I am sure it will be some time before another building goes up. I am thinking 4 or 5 floors like the race car guys place up the road.

Able- I don't share your concerns. I think this is great for the area and any time you get a chance to add more foot traffic, all the better.

Able- I don't share your concerns. I think this is great for the area and any time you get a chance to add more foot traffic, all the better.

Are you referring to my first floor comment or my disdain for giant beige walls? :)

IndyYeah is right - the historic district overlay put in after 3Mass will guarantee nothing over 5 stories goes in, more or less.

^^ What do you propose we do with historic districts?

I think there are some probably truly genuine historic districts. The North Meridian district and perhaps Lockerbie Square come to mind. But I would rather see is individual structure landmarking rather than districts. Also, where there is a district, the guidelines should be written to make it much more difficult for arbitrary rejections that use the guise of historic preservation to achieve other land use goals like density reduction.

Finally, we need to encourage redevelopment and density, not be against progress or throwing red tape in the way of development. Today it requires almost herculean determination - or boatloads of clout - to build anything in the center city.

Speaking of which, a more pressing concern is a new zoning ordinance for central Marion County that doesn't mandate suburban style redevelopment.

Are you referring to my first floor comment or my disdain for giant beige walls? :)

The design being a "cruise ship."

The design being a "cruise ship."

So you're in the "I see a birthday cake" crowd? ;)

I think there are some probably truly genuine historic districts. The North Meridian district and perhaps Lockerbie Square come to mind. But I would rather see is individual structure landmarking rather than districts. Also, where there is a district, the guidelines should be written to make it much more difficult for arbitrary rejections that use the guise of historic preservation to achieve other land use goals like density reduction.

Finally, we need to encourage redevelopment and density, not be against progress or throwing red tape in the way of development. Today it requires almost herculean determination - or boatloads of clout - to build anything in the center city.

Speaking of which, a more pressing concern is a new zoning ordinance for central Marion County that doesn't mandate suburban style redevelopment.

I like your ideas about changing guidelines and limitations.
However, I think when it comes to historic buildings themselves it is pretty well done. Districts are designed to preserve whole historic areas. However, if there is empty space or structures without historic value(like a 1960's gas station.) they should be cleared and developed in a dense fashion. A 30 story tower next to 19th century mansions probably wouldn't work, but rowhouses, condos, etc shouldn't be an issue. As a city we should preserve the areas of history we have(especially after we razed half the city in the 20th century).

They have removed the plastic from the above photos to reveal a light tan colored nearly stucco looking finish on those two floors. It doesn't look too bad but it is toned down with it sitting between brick. I anticipate that this is about what it will look like over the rest of the building as well. Very reminiscent of the look to the Villagio.

Taken this weekend:

http://www.filehurricane.com/photos/1272009123224AM_3mass.jan.09.jpg.jpg

The Vienna(the building on the corner in the mid-right.) used to have a corner tiled dome with finials. Just a spoon full of history there.
I like it. That avenue lot to the left needs to be filled with some small development.

Very reminiscent of the look to the Villagio.

That's what I was afraid of.

At least this is a "nicer" version of the Villagio. This is not as cheap looking as that thing! I am glad some nice small buildings that are quite old are around. Nice to have some historic buildings decorate the area.

At least this is a "nicer" version of the Villagio. This is not as cheap looking as that thing!

You're right, 3 Mass Ave got things right for the most part, regarding urban development. It's just lacking in the aesthetic department.

I saw the new "white" part on the fifth and sixth floors of the NW side of 3 Mass Ave today. It looked better than I was expecting. While driving past, the view of the white material looked more like a "stony" (limestone type?) surface as opposed to a pseudo-pressed stucco look, like I was afraid of. Not too bad. Now my concern is what the upper four floors will look like. If it is all the same white material, I think it will be a little too much of that. Hopefully there will be a few other materials to provide at least a little more contrast. Perhaps the balconies will have some metal or brick trim or something to provide a change from all white. Also - with its green roof, I guess there will be some green plantings up there as well that will help add a little color. I guess we should know by April or so --- maybe sooner.

This building is partially modelled after my past favorite Knights of Pythias building. Anyone have a scan of the Knights that we can somewhat compare the two?

^^ One of the greater losses of architecture in this city. :(

^^ One of the greater losses of architecture in this city. :(

You got it. One of the reasons why I am picky about architecture!

This building is partially modelled after my past favorite Knights of Pythias building. Anyone have a scan of the Knights that we can somewhat compare the two?

I think this building was put on the chopping block when One Indiana Square was built..could be wrong. 3 Mass Ave seems like a solid development but doesn't compare to buildings like these..
http://www.emporis.com/images/6/2004/12/324876.jpg

http://www.emporis.com/images/6/2004/12/324877.jpg

You are right.
A whole city block was destroyed for that box. I think the only structure spared is an early 20th century building on the North West corner of the block.
Another tragedy is the loss of a portion of Massachusetts Avenue.
A great deal of our unique city layout has been lost.
Kentucky Avenue does not even exist downtown anymore. The only intact avenue is Virginia, and it has been altered greatly.

I think this building was put on the chopping block when One Indiana Square was built..could be wrong. 3 Mass Ave seems like a solid development but doesn't compare to buildings like these..
http://www.emporis.com/images/6/2004/12/324876.jpg

http://www.emporis.com/images/6/2004/12/324877.jpg

Nice! I wish that building was still here. I'll go ahead and make the obvious statement that it's like a small version of the "Flatiron" building that anchors Madison Square in Manhattan.

Knights of Pythias should have NEVER gone down...but when One Indiana Sq was proposed, the City was begging for anything downtown, so they essentially gave the farm.

This building is partially modelled after my past favorite Knights of Pythias building.

Do you mean it reminds you of the Knights of Pythias building? No offense, but there's no way 3 Mass was modeled after it.

We used to have dozens of flatirons. Indy's original, unbroken grid was a great breeding ground for them.

Do you mean it reminds you of the Knights of Pythias building? No offense, but there's no way was 3 Mass modeled after it.

We used to have dozens of flatirons. Indy's original, unbroken grid was a great breeding ground for them.

Not my thoughts. Read Emporis about 3 Mass

Not my thoughts. Read Emporis about 3 Mass

Thanks for the clarification. Didn't you question that at all when you read it? 3 Mass doesn't look anything like the Knights of Pythias building. There is not a single piece of Knights of Pythias' architectural DNA in 3 Mass.

Here's what Emporis (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=3massavenue-indianapolis-in-usa) says:

"It will ...mimic the size, shape, and scale of the Knights of Pythias Building, which stood on the adjacent block to the southwest until the late 1960's."

I'm sorry, but that just sound like some developer BS. (Most of the "facts" sound like they were lifted from a promotional pamphlet, not the result of research by the Emporis team.) They probably said that 3 Mass mimics K of P to appease any NIMBY complaints about its size. "Look, there used to be this other big building down the street and it was historic! It's ok to build this one!"

3Mass may not be inspired by the Knights of Pythias building, but I think the scale and massing are neverthless excellent. The thing that the Pythias building shows is that 10 or so story buildings are right in place along Mass Ave. - historically accurate. Unfortunately, the city caps heights at around 4 stories now - yuck. The big downside of 3Mass is the extensive use of EIFS, which is really visible even along the Mass Ave frontage as I noticed just this morning walking past it.

Knights of Pythias should have NEVER gone down...but when One Indiana Sq was proposed, the City was begging for anything downtown, so they essentially gave the farm.

But why at that location? There were plenty of other places the building could have gone.

Thanks for the clarification. Didn't you question that at all when you read it? 3 Mass doesn't look anything like the Knights of Pythias building. There is not a single piece of Knights of Pythias' architectural DNA in 3 Mass.

Here's what Emporis (http://www.emporis.com/en/wm/bu/?id=3massavenue-indianapolis-in-usa) says:

"It will ...mimic the size, shape, and scale of the Knights of Pythias Building, which stood on the adjacent block to the southwest until the late 1960's."

I'm sorry, but that just sound like some developer BS. (Most of the "facts" sound like they were lifted from a promotional pamphlet, not the result of research by the Emporis team.) They probably said that 3 Mass mimics K of P to appease any NIMBY complaints about its size. "Look, there used to be this other big building down the street and it was historic! It's ok to build this one!"

Yes I did question it. However since the somewhat triangle lot, and rounded top area, I figured that I would open the conversation, and compare. Heck, at least it got some discussion going. That is why I asked for both buildings to compare. I sometimes go out there to change a conversation to something like these 2 buildings, and I was surprised at what was said in the blurb, so I ran with it.:)

Yes I did question it. However since the somewhat triangle lot, and rounded top area, I figured that I would open the conversation, and compare. Heck, at least it got some discussion going. That is why I asked for both buildings to compare. I sometimes go out there to change a conversation to something like these 2 buildings, and I was surprised at what was said in the blurb, so I ran with it.:)

Thanks for keeping the discussion going! I hope you know I'm not chastising you or anything, just trying to get to the bottom of your statement. :-)

Thanks for keeping the discussion going! I hope you know I'm not chastising you or anything, just trying to get to the bottom of your statement. :-)

No problem. It is obvious that the people promoting the building wanted a devise of some sort to get it going, and sell it. My points are just that tiny inkling of a smidgen of well... Wish the real thing was still standing across the street! If someone was to get close to the real Knights building, even a 6 story one, I would love it! I personally would not have a problem with a new one like the real one in the above picture. Really do not think it will happen.:bash:

They removed all of the concrete baracades and fencing from Mass Ave last night. There are still some orange plastic baracades, but they may be coming out today too.

With the removal of the streetside baracades you can really get a feel for the street presence the buidling will have.

I do think it is unfortunate that there is only one Mass Ave entrance though. I would have preferred a setup similar to the Davlan for first floor retail.

They removed all of the concrete baracades and fencing from Mass Ave last night. There are still some orange plastic baracades, but they may be coming out today too.

With the removal of the streetside baracades you can really get a feel for the street presence the buidling will have.

I do think it is unfortunate that there is only one Mass Ave entrance though. I would have preferred a setup similar to the Davlan for first floor retail.

I saw that this morning as well. But it does look like there may be slender doors on either side of the main entrance. I'll take a look at lunch.

I'm very disappointed with the size of the windows. There's more brick along the street than glass. It's like the Conrad: you can see what's going on inside, but it doesn't really feel welcoming or public. They're not designed for display or for people outside to see really see what's going on inside. Thank heaven they're not tinted though.

It's really too bad, there are a lot of good examples of proper storefront window design along Mass Ave, such as the Davlan, which you mentioned.

I wonder what kind of businesses they're hoping to draw or have contracts with already.

No problem. It is obvious that the people promoting the building wanted a devise of some sort to get it going, and sell it. My points are just that tiny inkling of a smidgen of well... Wish the real thing was still standing across the street! If someone was to get close to the real Knights building, even a 6 story one, I would love it! I personally would not have a problem with a new one like the real one in the above picture. Really do not think it will happen.:bash:

I think it would be great if we had a flatiron renaissance in Indy. We could build them at so many intersections.

It's one reason I hate the Villagio so much, it ruined a great opportunity for a contemporary flatiron.

I think it would be great if we had a flatiron renaissance in Indy. We could build them at so many intersections.

It's one reason I hate the Villagio so much, it ruined a great opportunity for a contemporary flatiron.

That would be amazing.
I would love to see structures like the Pythias built again.
I would like seeing some classical and dare I say ornate flatirons and than some more sleek modern flatirons.
Diversity is key to life!

The intersection of College & Mass Ave is SREAMING for this type of renaissance

Definitely at NE corner of Mass and College. Also - the SW corner of Mass and Alabama - just across Alabama Street to the west from Marsh / O'Malias. That parking lot needs to be replaced with a new flat-iron.

Let us protest for flat-irons!! :cheer:

Definitely at NE corner of Mass and College. Also - the SW corner of Mass and Alabama - just across Alabama Street to the west from Marsh / O'Malias. That parking lot needs to be replaced with a new flat-iron.

Why don't we just say they need to be at pretty much any undeveloped intersection along what is left of the diagonals! :) That includes the soft spoken loner, Fort Wayne Avenue.

Why don't we just say they need to be at pretty much any undeveloped intersection along what is left of the diagonals! :) That includes the soft spoken loner, Fort Wayne Avenue.

About a year ago, a building by the Zipper Building was up for sale. Cannot remember what happend with it. It had a small triangle lot. My point is maybe some day a neat lot will get snatched up and someone will give the city back a cool Flatiron. I think that small lot was a triangle, either way it looked neat for a cool vision.:wave::wave:

Was on the end of the avenue last night getting some pizza. Had my point and shoot. Thought a few would work here on the board.

Enjoy

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3577/3328463498_f135dcd7ac.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3399/3328463352_9fd0607b0b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3636/3327628521_2221e3d78b.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3545/3328462604_0683fbf4ae.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3627/3327627739_7a6da4a34e.jpg

I like the cavernous type feel that 3 Mass gives the area. Instead of openness, feels neighborhoody.

Am I the only one who dislikes the ground level?
They could have done something great with it, like stores and a more interesting entrance.
The entrance looks like a copy of McNivens(or whatever it is called) except stripped of decorations.

Am I the only one who dislikes the ground level?


Um, nope. I've been bitchin' about it for weeks.

Am I the only one who dislikes the ground level?
They could have done something great with it, like stores and a more interesting entrance.
The entrance looks like a copy of McNivens(or whatever it is called) except stripped of decorations.
Yeah, the ground level is pretty bad. I'm less impressed with the architectural details of this building every day. Sure, the massing and land use are good, but they stopped well short of making this an interesting building.

The fly-through video shows awnings above the retail spaces and some flare sticking out above the main entrance. We'll see how those turn out.

The fly-through video shows awnings above the retail spaces and some flare sticking out above the main entrance. We'll see how those turn out.

I rewatched the fly-through. I just noticed that the street-level windows are tinted in it. If they do that, so help me... :-)

I was picturing a wider-more enticing entrance. I had seen the video, and went too fast for me. Maybe There was a way to stop it to take it all in. Still like the big feel of it, but that ground level?

I rewatched the fly-through. I just noticed that the street-level windows are tinted in it. If they do that, so help me... :-)
Thankfully the odds of that are pretty low! The windows are already in. To tint them now would require pimpmobile-style aftermarket tinting, which doesn't really make sense. Not that tinting makes sense in general....

Still like this building and the height. When I was downtown at the circle 2 weeks ago, I am still floored that the newer replacement buildings on the circle are so bland, no real dramatic touches. Still like the Germanic looking one. As for this building, at least it is somewhat in the right direction and has some character. I would have went further, but the step is at least not a plain-bad building.

Still like this building and the height. When I was downtown at the circle 2 weeks ago, I am still floored that the newer replacement buildings on the circle are so bland, no real dramatic touches. Still like the Germanic looking one. As for this building, at least it is somewhat in the right direction and has some character. I would have went further, but the step is at least not a plain-bad building.

What are you talking about?


I do think, that glass bank on the circle needs to be faced in some kind of stone (it doesn't have to be ornate) so it can go with the sort of formal limestone feel.

This building looks like its giving the middle finger to the near northeast side in the same way the villagio gives the finger to fountain square.:toilet:I have officially wiped my butt with any respect I had for this building.

What are you talking about?


I do think, that glass bank on the circle needs to be faced in some kind of stone (it doesn't have to be ornate) so it can go with the sort of formal limestone feel.

Go to the circle, look at the newer or refaced buildings and that is what I am talking about. If you like the newer ones, or if they were refaced with a newer look, that is my point. I do not like them, I am not going to say that I like them, to act as though everything on the circle is beautiful! Not everything is. Got it?

This building looks like its giving the middle finger to the near northeast side in the same way the villagio gives the finger to fountain square.:toilet:I have officially wiped my butt with any respect I had for this building.

Let them finish first. And comparing this to the villagio is a stretch. At least this aligns to the street and is mostly brick.

As for me, I will wait to see the finishing touches to judge.

Let them finish first. And comparing this to the villagio is a stretch. At least this aligns to the street and is mostly brick.

As for me, I will wait to see the finishing touches to judge.

Your point about aligning to the street is right, but this building definitely isn't mostly brick. :-)

I'd say it's probably 25% brick and 75% EIFS, minus the glass and limestone, of course. The brick is really only on the first 6 floors of the Mass Ave Facade. It's also on the base of the building and there's a tiny bit along New York, but other than that this building is made out of beige EIFS.

Go to the circle, look at the newer or refaced buildings and that is what I am talking about. If you like the newer ones, or if they were refaced with a newer look, that is my point. I do not like them, I am not going to say that I like them, to act as though everything on the circle is beautiful! Not everything is. Got it?

Which structure?
The one where the English hotel used to be?
I'm confused! :crazy:

This building looks like its giving the middle finger to the near northeast side in the same way the villagio gives the finger to fountain square.:toilet:I have officially wiped my butt with any respect I had for this building.
The Villagio is a cheap ass attempt at 'traditional'.
It looks like suburban traditional.
It is a complete insult to that area.

This, I'm not sure, at least it sort of flows well and is faced with brick.
I am angry that it does not have street level retail.

Which structure?
The one where the English hotel used to be?
I'm confused! :crazy:

Why am I even trying. Notice the newer ones, screw it, not going there tonight! I am sure you know the newer looks I am talking about. They are boring. I am hungry, cannot believe I am somewhat answering this stupid question. Otta here for the night

Why am I even trying. Notice the newer ones, screw it, not going there tonight, if am sure you know the newer looks I am talking about. They are boring. I am hungry, cannot believe I am somewhat answering this stupid question. Otta here for the night

What the hell?
I am trying to understand what you mean.
Yeah, the new ones on the circle are dull and lack taste.
At the very least, they are uniform.

The Villaggio is an absolute smack in the face to the Fountain Sq / Fletcher Place neighborhood. When driving from the Fountain to downtown, I cringe at the back of that building with its tiny windows and monument to EIFS

The Villaggio is an absolute smack in the face to the Fountain Sq / Fletcher Place neighborhood. When driving from the Fountain to downtown, I cringe at the back of that building with its tiny windows and monument to EIFS

I'm thinking, due to the fact that it is made of cheap ass material, it will either
1) fall down
or
2) an angry mob of architects will burn it to the ground. :)

I want a great looking,eye popping,jaw dropping building or tower some day in the next 10 years! No cheap materials,no bad parking situations,no bad frontage-sidewalks and no whatevers to cheapen it! Indy deserves a great building or tower. Yes I would prefer more than One!

I want a great looking,eye popping,jaw dropping building or tower some day in the next 10 years! No cheap materials,no bad parking situations,no bad frontage-sidewalks and no whatevers to cheapen it! Indy deserves a great building or tower. Yes I would prefer more than One!

Indiana tower? :D

Indiana tower? :D

It could be great if a serious plan could be done. It could be cool, real cool, but that last one in the 1980's was at best ok. The politics, and drawings would have to be represented well for the tower.

It could be great if a serious plan could be done. It could be cool, real cool, but that last one in the 1980's was at best ok. The politics, and drawings would have to be represented well for the tower.

The arches and use of limestone should be kept in the design (if it were revived).
However, the shape, I'm not sure.

Apparently 21 of the 44 units have been "sold". That's nearly half and this building isn't even complete yet. I'd say that is pretty impressive.

Also, if you look on the webcam you can see the window treatment on the SW side of the building is looking pretty interesting. (Right above the Hammond Block Building)

http://3mass.com/

Apparently 21 of the 44 units have been "sold". That's nearly half and this building isn't even complete yet. I'd say that is pretty impressive.

Also, if you look on the webcam you can see the window treatment on the SW side of the building is looking pretty interesting. (Right above the Hammond Block Building)

http://3mass.com/

I drive by this thing every morning and those windows above the Hammond Block Building are quite impressive. I don't remember seeing them on any rendering. They have a very "Mondrian" style to them; presenting a sleek, contemporary contrast to the historic Hammond Block right below them. Me likes.

I hadn't heard about selling half the units already. That's good news. Hopefully the rest are snatched up quickly as soon as it opens. Unfortunately, not by me...

I drive by this thing every morning and those windows above the Hammond Block Building are quite impressive. I don't remember seeing them on any rendering. They have a very "Mondrian" style to them; presenting a sleek, contemporary contrast to the historic Hammond Block right below them. Me likes.

I'm glad you like them, but they're the same asymmetrical prefab windows that are being used generically all over the country right now. Locally, they were used in Keep Indianapolis Beautiful's new headquarters in Fountain Square and they're all over Allen Plaza on Pennsylvania St.

The windows weren't on the renderings and look like a failed last minute attempt to modernize the design. I appreciate the density and that it's (barely) mixed-use, but 3 Mass is a hulking, awkward jumble of architecture. Bleh.

Apparently 21 of the 44 units have been "sold". That's nearly half and this building isn't even complete yet. I'd say that is pretty impressive.

Also, if you look on the webcam you can see the window treatment on the SW side of the building is looking pretty interesting. (Right above the Hammond Block Building)

http://3mass.com/
That's a solid pre-sold percentage. But the discouraging thing is I don't think the number of units sold is all that different than it was 6 months ago. I think they pre-sold most of those units as soon construction began.

If you check out the floor plans section on their webpage, you'll also note that most of the cheapest, easiest to move units have already sold. I think they're going to be working on selling out this building for a long time.

Jason has a quick review of 3 Mass up on Circle and Squares:

http://circleandsquares.blogspot.com/2009/05/333-mass-ave.html

http://i155.photobucket.com/albums/s289/corrnd/random/Photo2816.jpg

I try very hard not to be bitchy when providing architectural critiques. But I can't help but compare this building to a mullet. Up front, its clean and business like with the use of brick and glass. But in the back, they use EIFS (fake stucco), a 180 from the front. In fact, its worse than a mullet. At least a mullet has a party in the back.

^^ Ugh. That is one terrible angle. You wouldn't know that there were any redeeming architectural qualities at all judging from that shot.

(Not knocking the photography...just the fact that the building presents such a crappy EIFS backside...)

What gets me is if you're going to put EIFS on a structure (yes, it kinda sucks and is a cheap cop-out by the developer), put something interesting on. EIFS has come and long way and can replicate a lot of surfaces (even reflective metal panels). Why people always stick with that bland, beige "fake limestone" look is beyond me.

I like that angle, however before I read the last couple posts, I was really wondering if there would be a redeeming quality of this finished side. One day I would like a really non cheap looking building to go up. Quality materials and great architecture!

http://www.kma-ae.com/publish/_assets/46b35a4e-4748.jpg

http://www.kma-ae.com/publish/_assets/46b35a4e-4748.jpg

Those architects obviously know what they're doing, whereas the "designers" of 3 Mass, Schmidt (looks like) Ass-ociates do not.

Seriously, Schmidt Associates should be banned from creating another building in Indy.

Check out the webcam, they got the green roof and vegetation installed I believe. :cheers:

http://3mass.com/

They couldn't have found a better view?

...or a better background song. Yuck.

Those architects obviously know what they're doing, whereas the "designers" of 3 Mass, Schmidt (looks like) Ass-ociates do not.

Seriously, Schmidt Associates should be banned from creating another building in Indy.

I actually think 3 Mass Ave is much nicer than that (as far as architecture goes).
Don't you think it is a little much to say such things?
This isn't the greatest design, but it isn't a bad one either.
I think they should have worked on using more brick where they used EIFS and on street level shops but other than that I like the design.
It reminds me of structures in Athens (and I'm not talking about classical).

Is it just me, or does the fenestration on the first floor appear almost to discourage retail? It seems far more suitable for FIRE or other white-collar offices, but it would be hard for me to believe a good restaurant or merchandiser would want to locate there.

Apparently 21 of the 44 units have been "sold". That's nearly half and this building isn't even complete yet. I'd say that is pretty impressive.
If their online unit sales are up-to-date, just one unit has been sold in the four months since Indy Rock's update back on 4/30 (though I noted back then that the majority of those sales occurred near the groundbreaking). Sales on the cheaper floors are good: 17 of 21 units sold on floors 3-5. Sales of the larger, more expensive units are abysmal: just 5 of 23 units sold on floors 6 and above.

If their online unit sales are up-to-date, just one unit has been sold in the four months since Indy Rock's update back on 4/30 (though I noted back then that the majority of those sales occurred near the groundbreaking). Sales on the cheaper floors are good: 17 of 21 units sold on floors 3-5. Sales of the larger, more expensive units are abysmal: just 5 of 23 units sold on floors 6 and above.

Most people in the Indianapolis area dont have a million or so to spend on a home. If they do, most are not urban dwellers. The pricing on any of the recent condo buildings is not practical for the population that actually wants to live downtown. Villagio still has some vacancy....if you look at the properties for sale downtown...you can buy a lot nicer than any of the newer projects in a refurbished building in the wholesale.

I was told that this will not have on-site parking. I thought that the basement part was a parking garage. Just a discussion I had with a local the other day. Seems odd if it is true.

I was told that this will not have on-site parking. I thought that the basement part was a parking garage. Just a discussion I had with a local the other day. Seems odd if it is true.
There's parking. Just go to http://3mass.com/ and click on 'Floor Plans' and you can see that there are two underground parking levels.

Urban Times has a small article this month mentioning that one of the retail spaces on the Mass Ave side has been leased, to open as a "quiet bar" called The Hub.

There's parking. Just go to http://3mass.com/ and click on 'Floor Plans' and you can see that there are two underground parking levels.

Urban Times has a small article this month mentioning that one of the retail spaces on the Mass Ave side has been leased, to open as a "quiet bar" called The Hub.

Thanks. The person that I was talking to must have been thinking of another building. Seems as though these were the condos in question. Thanks again.

Since there hasnt been a picture posted proper in a while, I snapped this on the way home from school last night

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3454/3986454267_7cd24a4b34_o.jpg

How is this thing coming along? I still feel that it would be something that Austin, Tx. would have. However, it would look nicer, in my opinion.

It pretty much is done. I suppose they're doing plenty of interior work still - and there is supposed to be a new restaurant / lounge going in on the first floor pretty soon. Primarily, they're still trying to sell the upper floor condos at this point. About half of the condos have been sold - mostly on the lower floors, where the lower priced units are located.

Did we talk about the "quiet bar" that's going in on the first floor?

http://www.urbantimesonline.com/?p=786

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/St951XZEqlI/AAAAAAAADmA/o2ydj1EG_dA/s512/photo%2036.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/St951_Dg_WI/AAAAAAAADmE/lotOqP7HVvo/s512/photo%2037.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/St952sdnp5I/AAAAAAAADmM/bsXYmgQicBM/s512/photo%2039.jpg

I think that it looks like they chopped the top off of a cruise ship and plopped it on top of a building. I like it!

Something about "the deck", I thought would not have the framing look to it. I thought it would be smooth on the rounded parts.

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjLtOmjdI/AAAAAAAADpY/Wl0Zj7VbsQY/s720/photo%202.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjLz5Rn9I/AAAAAAAADpc/Cltvnyv3gBQ/s720/photo%203.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjgGLA0TI/AAAAAAAADqA/WCjLDZmvFj4/s576/photo%202.jpg http://lh4.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjgWqqO8I/AAAAAAAADqI/2zdqPXbyhNQ/s576/photo%204.jpg

It seems odd to me that the fire department water supply would be in such a bad place. I think they should have put more emphasis on the entrance of the building. (I suppose that they did have rather limited space, but still...)
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjgGJaJYI/AAAAAAAADp8/Dm3bInt3hKE/s576/photo.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjLjWceAI/AAAAAAAADpU/KlDE2QkUF0U/s720/photo.jpg

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjgSm4pAI/AAAAAAAADqE/mZkM04i4WQs/s576/photo%203.jpg http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjgfUt6xI/AAAAAAAADqM/2SMxSuTuSAs/s576/photo%205.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjVhFB0sI/AAAAAAAADps/XzCm1vhE6hQ/s720/photo%202.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/SuhjV7gf-6I/AAAAAAAADp0/xvEbSS-fnxs/s576/photo%204.jpg

Thanks for all of the pics EddieB!

I really like the front-looking shot from above Mass Ave. I think this is easily the best infill the downtown has seen in quite some time.

The Fire Dept. thing looks odd there.

I wonder if it is against code to put two large planters in the entry way to hide it. I'm sure it is but it would also help bring focus on the entry way.

------
Brandon Quigley
theqstyle.com

Yeah, but there also isn't much room to put planters. The sidewalk is bigger than many in Indianapolis, but this is still rather narrow for most downtown areas.

As for the entire entrance, I think that this building should have had a great permanent glass/stainless awning to really add curb appeal to the condo's. They could have also looked to get the city to let them incorporate the parking divider in front of the entry into some kind of grander entrance walkway...

The building is still great, but I think it could have added more to the community feeling on the street level of Mass Ave.

Yeah, but there also isn't much room to put planters. The sidewalk is bigger than many in Indianapolis, but this is still rather narrow for most downtown areas.

As for the entire entrance, I think that this building should have had a great permanent glass/stainless awning to really add curb appeal to the condo's. They could have also looked to get the city to let them incorporate the parking divider in front of the entry into some kind of grander entrance walkway...

The building is still great, but I think it could have added more to the community feeling on the street level of Mass Ave.
My guess is that they're not done with the ground level flourishes. There will almost certainly be awnings for the retail spaces, they might just be waiting for businesses to move in. Actually, if you watch the fly-through video on their site, it shows awnings. Interestingly, it also shows a glass awning above the resident entrance -- you may get your wish yet!

Is this project completed or still under construction?

They are still working on finishing out the inside. The outside is complete though if I am not mistaken.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7Df1nUHgfI/AAAAAAAAEeQ/Pg-K8BbhlAU/s640/photo.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7DhK8IAF3I/AAAAAAAAEfE/9P9Z-Bz28XE/s640/photo%202.jpg

I take bak my comments on the white portion that I talked about on the other section. Up close the other day, the white portion seemed to look quite nice. I would not have planned it, however it did not appear cheap looking.

I would even say the white EIFS had more attention paid to its detailing than the brick masonry did. The brick design on this building is just so boring! Save for the floor setbacks, it's terribly flat and monotonous. I would have thought that for such a high-profile project, the brickwork would have been more interesting.

There was a photo spread in the Indy Star today (4/20/2010) showing a 4500 sq foot, recently purchased condo at 3 Mass Avenue. It sold for $1.7 million. Couldn't find a link to the photo spread -- but a search might bring up a link.

Here's a link to the article^^

http://www.indystar.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=20104200329

From May 1st 2009:

Apparently 21 of the 44 units have been "sold". That's nearly half and this building isn't even complete yet. I'd say that is pretty impressive.That's a solid pre-sold percentage. But the discouraging thing is I don't think the number of units sold is all that different than it was 6 months ago. I think they pre-sold most of those units as soon construction began.

If you check out the floor plans section on their webpage, you'll also note that most of the cheapest, easiest to move units have already sold. I think they're going to be working on selling out this building for a long time.
Almost exactly one year later, May 4th 2010, 3 Mass sales look like this (according to their webpage's (http://www.3mass.com/) listing of available units):

3rd Floor: 7 sold / 7 available
4th: 4/7
5th: 3/7
6th: 1/7
7th: 2/6
8th: 1/5
9th: 2/3
10th: 0/2

That's 20 out of 44 sold. In a year, they actually lost a sale they thought they had? This is an amazingly tough time for condo sales.

According to that Indy Star article (http://www.indystar.com/article/20100420/BUSINESS04/4200329/0/frontpagecities11) mentioned above, the one penthouse unit that sold recently was under contract in 2008, so it was probably included in Indy Rock's number from last year.

From May 1st 2009:


Almost exactly one year later, May 4th 2010, 3 Mass sales look like this (according to their webpage's (http://www.3mass.com/) listing of available units):

3rd Floor: 7 sold / 7 available
4th: 4/7
5th: 3/7
6th: 1/7
7th: 2/6
8th: 1/5
9th: 2/3
10th: 0/2

That's 20 out of 44 sold. In a year, they actually lost a sale they thought they had? This is an amazingly tough time for condo sales.

According to that Indy Star article (http://www.indystar.com/article/20100420/BUSINESS04/4200329/0/frontpagecities11) mentioned above, the one penthouse unit that sold recently was under contract in 2008, so it was probably included in Indy Rock's number from last year.

Looks like the $300k to maybe $4 or $500k area has done pretty well. I know we had a discussion about middle class condos being financially difficult to pull off, but could something in the $200k-$500k range work?