Being the vital link for the 2010 Games, these recent road closure are a real concern. Hopefully, all of these accidents are road construction caused.....afterall we did spend $600 million in improving the road, not to make it worst than before.

I wonder if VANOC is still going ahead with renting 16-high speed passenger ferries to shuttle spectators and officials from downtown to Squamish, where they will then disembark and get onto coaches to Whistler.



Another Highway 99 closure raises Olympic fears
Last Updated: Thursday, September 13, 2007 | 9:06 PM ET
CBC News

A rock slide closed the highway to Whistler for seven hours Thursday, just as officials of the International Olympic Committee were holding a news conference in Vancouver on preparations for the 2010 Winter Games.

It was the second time this week that a rock slide has closed Highway 99, a vital transportation link between Vancouver and Whistler that will be used by Olympic athletes, officials and spectators when the Games begin.

The B.C. Ministry of Transportation called the highway closure between the communities of Lions Bay and Furry Creek a construction delay. According to reports, construction crews were blasting and unintentionally caused the rock slide that forced the closure.

The seven-hour closure took place during peak morning and afternoon traffic periods.

John Furlong, the head of the Olympic organizing committee in Vancouver, said officials are working on contingency plans in case the Sea-to-Sky Highway, as the link is known, is blocked during the Games.

While upgrades to the highway are well under way, organizers still want to ensure there are backup plans for getting people to sporting events on time, he said.

Meanwhile, Olympic organizers have secured 93 per cent of the rooms needed to house media and spectators during the Games, Furlong said.

Among the other challenges Games officials are facing is creating a television schedule that allows sports to be broadcast in prime time to audiences around the world, Furlong said.

Certain sports are a huge draw in some countries and people want to tune in at specific times, he said, comparing the task to trying to stage close to 100 World Cups over a couple of weeks.

With files from the Canadian Press

I think it's your typical overreaction. Look at what happened when the I-35W bridge collapsed in Minneapolis; news agencies around North America all rushed to air with their scaremongering stories questioning the safety of whatever local bridge infrastructure existed.

Does anyone honestly think the Ministry of Highways is going to let a rock slide close the highway for any measurable amount of time during the Olympics? Of course not. It's also doubtless that engineers will do whatever is necessary to minimize the chance of rock slides and continuously monitor the slopes above the highway.

I wonder why they don't tunnel vulnerable areas, like they do on most other major mountain highways throughout the province?

I wonder why they don't tunnel vulnerable areas, like they do on most other major mountain highways throughout the province?

They're cheap?

Eaglebluff's should have been tunneled.....though I never did understand West Vancouver's reasons for wanting to preserve that environmentally sensitive area when they were going to develop that area for more housing.

Plan in works for Sea-to-Sky disruptions

Damian Inwood, The Province
Published: Friday, September 14, 2007

Vancouver 2010 organizers will soon start planning how to deal with unforeseen closures to the Sea-to-Sky Highway during the Olympics.

"Clearly, the organizing committee will have to be prepared to deal rapidly with things that possibly could happen," 2010 CEO John Furlong said yesterday.

He was responding to questions about what steps would be taken in the event of traffic accidents or rock slides, which frequently block the only road to Whistler venues.

Yesterday, the highway was blocked by a rock slide near Furry Creek for about an hour. In recent weeks, two serious traffic accidents closed the highway.

Furlong was speaking at a news conference marking the end of a three-day visit by the International Olympic Committee's evaluation commission.

Furlong said that the $600-million highway upgrade will be completed and traffic patterns will be different during the Games.

"During the evaluation commission visit [in 2003,] we created some traffic hardships for ourselves to see how we'd deal with them if they happened at Games time," added Furlong. "That's what I'm talking about -- actually creating scenarios and then managing them."

Terry Wright, 2010's head of service operations, said organizers will start working on scenarios in the late fall and continue testing them until six months before Games time.

"We'll use some of the organizers from past Games to come in and help us run through simulations and practise scenarios," Wright said.

He said buses will be put on roads leading to and from the mountain venues, during test events.

IOC officials said international bobsleigh and luge federation members are unhappy with a proposed 2010 schedule that would see races held outside of TV prime time in Europe.

Co-ordination commission chairman Rene Fasel also said that the 13-member IOC panel was shown the 2010 Olympic mascot -- to be officially unveiled in November. "It's wonderful," he said, but refused to give any details.

dinwood@png.canwest.com


© The Vancouver Province 2007

Furlong said that the $600-million highway upgrade will be completed and traffic patterns will be different during the Games.


The last figure I heard was $700 million a couple years ago. $600 M was the original estimate. Maybe the over-runs are similar to those of the convention centre, conveniently forgot about or transferred to another accounting column the media doesn't want to read.

They're cheap?

Eaglebluff's should have been tunneled.....though I never did understand West Vancouver's reasons for wanting to preserve that environmentally sensitive area when they were going to develop that area for more housing.

I think that answers the question. Rich NIMBYs didn't want a highway in their neighborhood, and the city wanted the tax dollars from another neighborhood. I don't think anyone outside West Vancouver was fooled by the protests into thinking that area residents were seriously concerned about the environment.

I think that answers the question. Rich NIMBYs didn't want a highway in their neighborhood, and the city wanted the tax dollars from another neighborhood. I don't think anyone outside West Vancouver was fooled by the protests into thinking that area residents were seriously concerned about the environment.

I agree.

And then there was an old First Nations granny that was part of the protested. The courts gave an older to stop the protest or else, quite a few people were arrested including her. She died of pneumonia while in prison....apparently, she also had undiagnosed lung cancer.

And then since, we've had that First Nations wannabe militia group against the 2010 Games.

What exactly is going on at Eagle's Bluff? As far as I have seen, they must have changed the traffic flow at least 10 times every month! :lol::ohno:

What is the status for the new routing through Eagle's Bluff?

What exactly is going on at Eagle's Bluff? As far as I have seen, they must have changed the traffic flow at least 10 times every month! :lol::ohno:

What is the status for the new routing through Eagle's Bluff?

They're building a interchange....instead of one road leading to both the Sea to Sky highway and Horseshoe Bay ferry terminal, there will be a interchange before the ferry terminal toll booths....and the new road to the Sea to Sky highway will slice through a mountain.

they should have built the option that created a new highway/road through coquitlam

at least there would be two routes to whistler from the LM

they should have built the option that created a new highway/road through coquitlam

at least there would be two routes to whistler from the LM

i disagree, that would've been a huge waste of money....it would've cost billions. there's no demand for two highways to Whistler, and there's no logic to build it for a 17-day event.

improving the Sea-to-Sky will just do fine, this highway needed upgrades with or without the Games.

its been nothing but problems since the 70's

it would provide a much quicker connection from the US border to Whistler

Some renderings for the Lions Bay area

Kelvin Grove interchange looking south
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nname/ssp/s2s1.jpg

Lions Bay interchange looking north
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nname/ssp/s2s2.jpg

Brunswick Beach interchange looking north
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/nname/ssp/s2s3.jpg

Hmm... With all these interchanges... I'm wondering if they'll assign exit numbers to the sea to sky after the project...

Hmm... With all these interchanges... I'm wondering if they'll assign exit numbers to the sea to sky after the project...

'Tis the future extension of the I-5.

It was originally numbered 99 as an extension of the old US-99 highway, but that has become decomissioned and obsolete.

I think Aurora Ave. North in Seattle is still marked as Route 99.

So is the Sea-to-Sky going to be a controlled access highway all the way to Squamish, and possibly even to Whistler?

So is the Sea-to-Sky going to be a controlled access highway all the way to Squamish, and possibly even to Whistler?
No, there will be only 8 interchanges:
3 in west van
3 in lions bay
2 in furry creek

The others will be at grade intersection.

No, there will be only 8 interchanges:
3 in west van
3 in lions bay
2 in furry creek

The others will be at grade intersection.

So it will be a contiguous freeway from the Upper Levels all the way to Furry Creek?

So it will be a contiguous freeway from the Upper Levels all the way to Furry Creek?
No.. I think there will be 3 (or 4) intersection in between... and a 2 lane section too...

Ughhhh

I hate the fact that the sea to sky won't be 2 lanes the whole way

Once just ONCE I'd like to see BC plan their roads for the future

**EDIT

I mean I hate the fact it won't be 4 lanes the whole way... 2 on each side

^^What about Richmond?

^^What about Richmond?

Richmond is it's own entity.

The sea to sky highway is under BC's jurisdiction is it not?

Ughhhh

I hate the fact that the sea to sky won't be 2 lanes the whole way

Once just ONCE I'd like to see BC plan their roads for the future

**EDIT

I mean I hate the fact it won't be 4 lanes the whole way... 2 on each side

they probably did it just to piss off chumps like you. i know i would if i was working on this project :)

I can't complain - it's a sure improvement than what we have now =/

And again, is there a need for two lanes on both sides for the entire route? We don't see congestion on the sea-to-sky, unless of course there is a car crash. Remember, expansion of the Sea-to-Sky is because of safety issues with the highway.

Oddly enough, there was a magazine about a year ago rated Sea-to-Sky as the best highway in the world (because of it's scenery).

Why the hell would we ever need a 4-lane Sea-to-Sky highway?

Another case of northwest2k pulling things out from his ass.

Why the hell would we ever need a 4-lane Sea-to-Sky highway?

Another case of northwest2k pulling things out from his ass.

So that he can whip it 140 km/h to Whistler without too much wear on his new brake pads.

So that he can whip it 140 km/h to Whistler without too much wear on his new brake pads.

and then a deer jumps right in front of his car....he hits it and swerves right off the cliff.

and then a deer jumps right in front of his car....he hits it and swerves right off the cliff.

Thus the need for the mile wide 100-lane highway, to reduce the chances of that happening.

Thus the need for the mile wide 100-lane highway, to reduce the chances of that happening.

keep dreaming

Why the hell would we ever need a 4-lane Sea-to-Sky highway?

Another case of northwest2k pulling things out from his ass.

Eventually the sea to sky highway will need 4 lanes all the way up. They're increasing it to 4 lanes in some spots. Why not just make it 4 lanes all the way up while they're already up there working on it.

And please don't mention the environment. Enough damage has been done already. No plants or wildlife will flourish anywhere near the sea to sky. Making it 4 lanes all the way up wouldn't have any more of an impact on the environment.

^^You should drive up there and suggest it to the construction crews...

^^You should drive up there and suggest it to the construction crews...

One day I'll be the minister of transportation in BC and you'll all thank me

^^Make sure you go to school first.

Eventually the sea to sky highway will need 4 lanes all the way up. They're increasing it to 4 lanes in some spots. Why not just make it 4 lanes all the way up while they're already up there working on it.

And please don't mention the environment. Enough damage has been done already. No plants or wildlife will flourish anywhere near the sea to sky. Making it 4 lanes all the way up wouldn't have any more of an impact on the environment.

When such capacity is needed, a four-lane road will be built. As of today, the highway sees about 10,000-12,000 vehicles per day (and that's the max. on only a few stretches)....the 2-4 lanes that are being built in time for 2010 will be sufficient for decades to come. Any additional capacity today would simply be a waste of resources and money.

One lane of road has a capacity of 1,500 vehicles/hour.

When such capacity is needed, a four-lane road will be built. As of today, the highway sees about 10,000-12,000 vehicles per day (and that's the max. on only a few stretches)....the 2-4 lanes that are being built in time for 2010 will be sufficient for decades to come. Any additional capacity today would simply be a waste of resources and money.

One lane of road has a capacity of 1,500 vehicles/hour.

So you mean the whole Sea-to-Sky upgrade is a white elephant rushed just for the Olympics? (Apart from the safety improvements, I mean.)

So you mean the whole Sea-to-Sky upgrade is a white elephant rushed just for the Olympics? (Apart from the safety improvements, I mean.)

In a sense yes, however, it would've been upgraded by 2012 anyway, as Provincial studies and archives said.

So you mean the whole Sea-to-Sky upgrade is a white elephant rushed just for the Olympics? (Apart from the safety improvements, I mean.)

Well no, it wasn't built just for the Games....as deasine mentioned, the Ministry had plans to upgrade the road by 2012 anyway.

And the road upgrades are really helping Squamish and the Sea-to-Sky corridor boom. And I'm sure the new interchange at Horseshoe Bay would do wonders for ferry car traffic, with a proper interchange to the Sea-to-Sky highway.

And as you mentioned, much of these upgrades are safety improvements....rock wall retainers, getting rid of unsafe and loose rocks, widened lanes, concrete divider between lanes, greater sightlines by improving turns, etc.

There are also future plans to run a Translink rapid bus service between Whistler and Squamish to Vancouver. And finally, the importance of Whistler to B.C.'s tourism economy should be considered....it generates more than $1 billion annually in tourism dollars for our province: that's 10% of our provincial $10-billion tourism industry.

Hardly a white elephant.

One day I'll be the minister of transportation in BC and you'll all thank me

By the time you're Transportation Minister, your lovely Richmond would be under sea level because the size of your very own carbon footprint would have caused massive rises in water level. And that's from your footprint alone. Imagine how big it will be when you add all the other numb nuts that think like you. Hmmm...driving underwater northwest2k....that would slow your commute time right?

idiot.

Richmond is a metre above sea level at the moment. And that's not including the dykes. We'll be fine. Worry about your own city wherever that is. I'm guessing somewhere in Surrey

and then a deer jumps right in front of his car....he hits it and swerves right off the cliff.


Lol reminds me of the lecture my buddy gave me after I told him that I and another friend made it from Kamloops to Merrit and back in less than an hour, including a 10 minute stop at a gas station in Merrit at like 1 am one summer.

Basically he pointed out that at 190 if a deer jumps out you either hit it and die, or swerve in response and die haha. Never drove that fast again at night.

One day I'll be the minister of transportation in BC and you'll all thank me

I'll run to Alberta. Or I'll be ur opposition and run u down =D

Richmond is a metre above sea level at the moment. And that's not including the dykes. We'll be fine. Worry about your own city wherever that is. I'm guessing somewhere in Surrey

I live in Vancouver numbnuts. Look at my signature. Moron. And is that supposed to be an insult, saying I'm from Surrey? I'd think twice before denigrating an entire city that way on a city forum.

Why don't you show some respect for the people on this forum and leave.

Lol reminds me of the lecture my buddy gave me after I told him that I and another friend made it from Kamloops to Merrit and back in less than an hour, including a 10 minute stop at a gas station in Merrit at like 1 am one summer.

Basically he pointed out that at 190 if a deer jumps out you either hit it and die, or swerve in response and die haha. Never drove that fast again at night.

Why did you drive to Merritt from Kamloops and back just to get gas?

So you mean the whole Sea-to-Sky upgrade is a white elephant rushed just for the Olympics? (Apart from the safety improvements, I mean.)

No, he means the platforms are long enough.:)

No, he means the platforms are long enough.:)

:lol:

Guys maybe instead insulting each other some of you could post some pictures of works? ;)
Or at least write a bit more about work progress?

Guys maybe instead insulting each other some of you could post some pictures of works? ;)
Or at least write a bit more about work progress?

We don't do it unless someone starts the fight. Some people are just looking for trouble...

Unfortunately, there aren't as many updates as the Canada Line thread as there isn't a person with full coverage of the construction.

Latest pics were from November:

http://www.seatoskyimprovements.ca/photo_gallery.htm

Traffic light on ramps aside, I can't wait for this project to be done in 2012. Along with the Sea to Sky widening and the highway 10 widening this province's roads are finally starting to get better :banana: I wonder what project will be next. Hopefully twinning the Massey Tunnel

Why did you drive to Merritt from Kamloops and back just to get gas?

That was back in those years when gas was stupid cheap. Remember that year that Safeway started that gas war and by winter gas was 44.5 around town. Back then I would sometimes just gas up and drive around town, or drive to totally random places. I once drove with my buddies to Kelowna, ate at the BP, and then drove back, for no apparent reason other than just to do it.

FYI, this was obviously before I became a hippie green guy lol. Nowadays the thought of burning fuel like that is just rediculous for so many reasons.

FYI, this was obviously before I became a hippie green guy lol. Nowadays the thought of burning fuel like that is just rediculous for so many reasons.
Nah burning fuel is never ridiculous. It's our god given right as canadians. I'm letting my car idle in the driveway right now.

Nah burning fuel is never ridiculous. It's our god given right as canadians. I'm letting my car idle in the driveway right now.

Alright, I've refrained from flamming online for probably the past 7 or 8 years, but you're really really walking on thin ice.

Maybe I will just recommend that you move to Texas. You can burn all the fuel that you want in the suburbs of Dallas, where you can drive "excellent" 10 to 14 lane freeways of the highest quality design on your beautiful 30 to 40 mile commute to downtown everyday. Afterall, you are the one who wants better roads, so you can have the pleasure of commuting 3 to 4 hours per day :)

wow nw2k the more of your posts i read the less serious i take you...


almost as if this is some cruel joke.

i call hax

wow nw2k the more of your posts i read the less serious i take you...


almost as if this is some cruel joke.

i call hax

o_O only now do you think that way? you should've done that long ago X_X

(haha my turn to take Mr. X's role)

wow nw2k the more of your posts i read the less serious i take you...

He's a hockey forum breed....they're all like that. Ignorant, arrogant, with a touch of insanity and a truck load of stupidity. You want to hurl once you read their comments.

*wink*wink* Buggernaut

Canada needs to adopt my way of thinking if it wants to avoid a recession

Canada needs to adopt my way of thinking if it wants to avoid a recession

Dude if this country wants anything that resembles a sustainable economy we can't keep investing in road infastructure.

The whole point that you're not seeming to get is at some point you can't widen the roads anymore, and then alternatives have to be considered. So why not development them now? There are lots of ways to stimulate our economy other than by using an outdated model of urban development that is based on what the US implemented in the 1950's.

The interstate system was a great idea then, but times have changed. Look at the US now, most of the major cities have hideous congestion. Have you ever driven in LA? I have, and it is freaking insane. Driving from in Orange County to downtown LA takes over an hour on the freeway, if it's not congested. Rush hour, who knows? It tooks me 2 and a half hours to get from LAX to my hotel in the OC (it was close to Disneyland).

Have fun man, there's no way in hell I'm living in a place with commutes like that.

He's a hockey forum breed....they're all like that. Ignorant, arrogant, with a touch of insanity and a truck load of stupidity. You want to hurl once you read their comments.

*wink*wink* Buggernaut

Hey nitronuts. :D

what did you just call me????

*shoves you into paddywagon*

Canada needs to adopt my way of thinking if it wants to avoid a recession

Adopting your way will drive our economy down for sure. Friviously expanding highways is just pouring money down the drain. That will be worst than the FastFerry incident.

Canada needs to improve their investment in PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. $500 million for the entire country is not close to enough.

The US adapted your way of thinking and it's heading for a recession. No thanks...

Dude if this country wants anything that resembles a sustainable economy we can't keep investing in road infastructure.

The whole point that you're not seeming to get is at some point you can't widen the roads anymore, and then alternatives have to be considered. So why not development them now? There are lots of ways to stimulate our economy other than by using an outdated model of urban development that is based on what the US implemented in the 1950's.

The interstate system was a great idea then, but times have changed. Look at the US now, most of the major cities have hideous congestion. Have you ever driven in LA? I have, and it is freaking insane. Driving from in Orange County to downtown LA takes over an hour on the freeway, if it's not congested. Rush hour, who knows? It tooks me 2 and a half hours to get from LAX to my hotel in the OC (it was close to Disneyland).

Have fun man, there's no way in hell I'm living in a place with commutes like that.
People are going to keep driving cars no matter what. Not upgrading the highways to accommodate the influx of drivers is idiotic.

"At some point you can't widen the roads anymore" <-- We're so far from this point its ridiculous. We need bigger roads plain and simple. Highway 1 and highway 99 have been the same way since the 50's. 4 lanes aren't enough for a highway plain and simple.

NW2K i hope they take away your liscence so you have to walk everywhere. cause youre obviously above transit

nw2k, we're not going to sacrifice the environment and people's health for the sake of your lazy claustrophobic attention-deficient comfort.

I say that we put every transit vs. private vehicle posts into its own thread and keep every other thread on topic...

nw2k seems to be the most realistic one in this thread. Kudos to your grounded nature! :-)

nw2k seems to be the most realistic one in this thread. Kudos to your grounded nature! :-)

I can't tell if people are being sarcastic on the forums anymore, but I hope you are.

Canada needs to improve their investment in PUBLIC TRANSPORTATION. $500 million for the entire country is not close to enough.

You're quite correct. $500 million is pathetic.

Not directed at you:

It's important to analyze projects on a case by case basis. This highway is very important. Building highways in urbanized regions isn't often smart growth, but this isn't an urban area. This is basic infrastructure connecting towns in the BC interior to Vancouver with a modern, safe, and much needed highway. It is important for the economic development of BC and Canada.

This isn't about building a massive freeway system from Chilliwack to BC Place Stadium. It's important to recognize the distinction. BC is destined to be a vastly more populated place than it is today and the Sea to Sky Highway is crucial if BC is to fulfill it's potential.

"At some point you can't widen the roads anymore" <-- We're so far from this point its ridiculous. We need bigger roads plain and simple. Highway 1 and highway 99 have been the same way since the 50's. 4 lanes aren't enough for a highway plain and simple.

Well that's a good point... the highway infrastructure in Metro Vancouver is notoriously outdated in terms of design, safety, reliability, as well as capacity and well getting around the region is very time-consuming... time = money.

That said, a balanced approach of highway/rapid infrastructure upgrades is very important.

Heck... even Calgary with its ever expanding C-Train lrt is also concurrently designing its highways (201 bypass) with an ultimate 16-lane collector/distributor cross-section.

http://www.infratrans.gov.ab.ca/INFTRA_Content/docType490/production/1106SWRR-FUNC-BOARD-bridge.pdf

You're quite correct. $500 million is pathetic.

Not directed at you:

It's important to analyze projects on a case by case basis though. This highway is very important. Building highways in urbanized regions isn't often smart growth, but this isn't an urban area. This is basic infrastructure connecting towns in the BC interior to Vancouver with a modern, safe, and much needed highway. It is important for the economic development of BC and Canada.

This isn't about building a massive freeway system from Chilliwack to BC Place Stadium. It's important to recognize the distinction. BC is destined to be a vastly more populated place than it is today and the Sea to Sky Highway is crucial to BC's development.

Unfortunately, some people don't see it that way...

Put tolls on the expressways (if not just the bridges). That'll thin out some of the unnecessary commuter traffic.

I can't tell if people are being sarcastic on the forums anymore, but I hope you are.

I doubt he was, nw2k is right, but ya transit is also needed. Its just that when Vancouver grows and grows and grows and the population hits 3 million people, you will need a better highway system to support that many people, and its not like its gonna happen in two years, but it will happen, probably before 2020. And when it happens, LOTS more people will drive on the highway. And yes LOTS of people will take transit. But, the amount of people commuting on the highway, the amount of people just trying to get from city to city, and the amount of people just arriving or leaving Vancouver for a vacation or work, will add up and will be twice as insane as it is now. And a 4 lane highway cant support that much traffic. It will be madness.

Wow I was so convinced that I was in the Gateway project thread, that I went out back to the BC section and clicked on this one, saw my comment, and was like what the fuck??

I doubt he was, nw2k is right, but ya transit is also needed. Its just that when Vancouver grows and grows and grows and the population hits 3 million people, you will need a better highway system to support that many people, and its not like its gonna happen in two years, but it will happen, probably before 2020. And when it happens, LOTS more people will drive on the highway. And yes LOTS of people will take transit. But, the amount of people commuting on the highway, the amount of people just trying to get from city to city, and the amount of people just arriving or leaving Vancouver for a vacation or work, will add up and will be twice as insane as it is now. And a 4 lane highway cant support that much traffic. It will be madness.

Well, the main problem with the road expansion program is that it serves mainly single-occupancy vehicles....and really, many of these people should be taking transit instead. Hardly any expansion for HOV is being made, and that's a fundamental problem with Gateway. Any progress to reduce today's congestion will only result in even more congestion five years later....even Environment Canada is questioning whether the B.C. government has low-balled the increase in car-use as a result of the project and the pollution as a result.

Hopefully, we'll see the twinned Port Mann tolled. And at the same time, the South of Fraser needs a lot more transit than what is being planned in the $14-billion transit initiative for 2020.

Heck... even Calgary with its ever expanding C-Train lrt is also concurrently designing its highways (201 bypass) with an ultimate 16-lane collector/distributor cross-section.

http://www.infratrans.gov.ab.ca/INFTRA_Content/docType490/production/1106SWRR-FUNC-BOARD-bridge.pdf

Calgary's freeway expansions have led to massive sprawl and auto-oriented neighbourhoods....it's ridiculous, and urban planners everywhere are calling it a huge urban planning disaster in the making. C-Train expansion is insufficient, and bus service is still dismal.

The whole point of Vancouver's highway system is to leave some congestion as is as it's a good thing...it's one of our greatest assets to building a well-planned region. It gets people to think twice about where they work, making them live closer to their work.

Calgary's freeway expansions have led to massive sprawl and auto-oriented neighbourhoods....it's ridiculous, and urban planners everywhere are calling it a huge urban planning disaster in the making. C-Train expansion is insufficient, and bus service is still dismal.

The whole point of Vancouver's highway system is to leave some congestion as is as it's a good thing...it's one of our greatest assets to building a well-planned region. It gets people to think twice about where they work, making them live closer to their work.

Adrian, that's all nice and fine theoretically but as ya live on the westside of Vancouver and attend UBC in close proximity, ya still have no clue or experience of what transpires in this metro region on a daily basis.

ALL DAY long the highways are congested... and those SOVs are business people, professionals, salesmen, seniors, etc. etc. travelling from one area to another not to commute to work but to meet with clients, deal with other services, etc.

The commute from the 'burbs to downtown Vancouver for the 9 to 5 is becoming a fallacy (unlike Calgary). People commute from one area to another all over the region and neither Skytrain, lrt, nor bus will provide timely service (and I mean TIMELY) for said commuting travel, let alone for the more important all day travel described above. Totally different travelling patterns and world out here.

At least with Calgary, a high proportion of the population commutes to the downtown core with its very high office-space ratio relative to Vancouver, which provides good linear lrt routes and ridership to the same areas.

In Metro Vancouver, Skytrain would need to run from Richmond to Surrey, for example, in order to have a somewhat similar effect. Metro Vancouver's proportion of transit user's (12%) is the lowest of any major metropolitan region in Canada ... guess why?

My name isn't Adrian...


Again, I never said we shouldn't expand our highways....but those additional lanes that will be built should be mainly for HOV, not SOV. Though I have to say that before the $14 billion transit plan was announced, I was against it. But now, we have a road and transit expansion working together hand in hand.



People commute from one area to another all over the region and neither Skytrain, lrt, nor bus will provide timely service (and I mean TIMELY) for said commuting travel, let alone for the more important all day travel described above. Totally different travelling patterns and world out here.

Well I never said I blamed them either for using their cars....afterall, we both know that transit is quite incompetent in the suburbs.

of course your name is not Adrian... Mr. K Chan?

Adrian, that's all nice and fine theoretically but as ya live on the westside of Vancouver and attend UBC in close proximity, ya still have no clue or experience of what transpires in this metro region on a daily basis.

ALL DAY long the highways are congested... and those SOVs are business people, professionals, salesmen, seniors, etc. etc. travelling from one area to another not to commute to work but to meet with clients, deal with other services, etc.

The commute from the 'burbs to downtown Vancouver for the 9 to 5 is becoming a fallacy (unlike Calgary). People commute from one area to another all over the region and neither Skytrain, lrt, nor bus will provide timely service (and I mean TIMELY) for said commuting travel, let alone for the more important all day travel described above. Totally different travelling patterns and world out here.

At least with Calgary, a high proportion of the population commutes to the downtown core with its very high office-space ratio relative to Vancouver, which provides good linear lrt routes and ridership to the same areas.

In Metro Vancouver, Skytrain would need to run from Richmond to Surrey, for example, in order to have a somewhat similar effect. Metro Vancouver's proportion of transit user's (12%) is the lowest of any major metropolitan region in Canada ... guess why?


/thread

so pretty much what youre saying is that the majority of residents make very poor decisions about where they live and work, and that i should subsidize them so they can do it quickly and for very little money.


no, i dont think so

of course your name is not Adrian... Mr. K Chan?

lol, not even close.

Where the hell did you find the name Adrian? .....

-___-?

Again I believe our roads need to be expanded, and I do agree with the Gateway program. I would prefer to see more HOV priorities though. Many other roads in the Lower Mainland also need expansions. But does that mean we can just give up transit? No. NW2K only focuses on roads NO TRANSIT WHATSOEVER.

hahaha i just made mine up.. but yeah where do u get Adrian...

Is it still Sea-to-Sky highway thread? :ohno:

lol, not even close.

Are you "youkilledken" on youtube?

So..........from what i've read on the BC Ministry of Transportation website, the entire Sea-to-Sky Highway corridor will be mostly four lanes, but some sections will still have 2- and 3-lane sections (by 2010)? I would think it would be easier to turn the entire thing into four lanes (not that i'm supporting any side in the argument above).

Are you "youkilledken" on youtube?

nope, my youtube account got deleted last year. why?

Is it still Sea-to-Sky highway thread? :ohno:

well mabey if you had some info to share it would be

I'm still very curious why Sphynx would randomly bring out the name Adrian (it's like out of no where). Just my curiosity =) Please tell us! This Adrian guy sounds smart XP

Tennis superstar Andre Agassi blasts Whistler highway as "shocker" after driving it

Agassi aghast

By BILL TIELEMAN, 24 HOURS

Former tennis superstar Andre Agassi showed his grand slam style while visiting Vancouver last week, calling the Sea-to-Sky highway to Whistler and the 2010 Olympics "a shocker" after driving it.

Agassi spoke to a crowd of nearly 5,000 at GM Place for "The Power Within" event along with style diva Martha Stewart, music producer Quincy Jones and other speakers.

But don't count on him driving to the winter Olympics despite B.C.'s $600-million highway improvement project.

"I like everything up here but one thing," Agassi said Wednesday about Vancouver. "We drove to Whistler yesterday and - what's up with your highways? That's a shocker! And it was that way a year ago."

Earlier at the event Toronto comedian and emcee James Cunningham also joked about the Whistler highway, calling it "so relaxing" to drive with "a sheer drop off to the sea on one side and guys packing dynamite into rock on the other."

Sounds like it was a "shocker" because it is still under construction after so long.

lol its a big project.... just printing something from the newspaper

Personally speaking, I can't understand the logic that is still held in Vancouver. The idea of constructing major arteries [limited access roads..or in other words freeways] is seen as a major blow to the city and province. I am not for the construction of many...but enough to alleviate the congestion that brings the entire metro area to a standstill everyday. Don't get me wrong again...Freeways alone are not the answer...but they do help in conjunction with other forms of public transport. We call them "arteries" because like the arteries that flow in our bodies....they help to bring areas "alive". We need them for commuting...going about on our daily drives for whatever reason it may be...for "TRADE" between the provinces and the states....for Tourism...among several other things. I've heard people praise Vancouver for its "highrises"....! People...I've lived in Canada and the USA and the one thing that I praise it for was the lack of people living in apartments. Here in Europe people are thirsty for that small patch of green that I remember having in Vancouver's west side...in Los Angeles and Orange County etc. High density is not the answer. Restricting the construction of roadways is just a political move that is only justified by me thinking that the politicians must have bought stocks in these construction companies and are securing their money. [All the buildings it seems are the same design, color etc. it can't be that many...and if it is...there are only a few that you see their signs all over the place.....just an observation]. Having Vancouverites stay idle in their cars does NOT make "smog" disappear.....There are other things to do to help the quality of the air....here in Athens, 20 years ago children grew up not knowing that there were mountains that surrounded the city because the poor things couldn't see them. Now, we can see them! Didn't we build a metro system? Yes! A tram system? Yes! A new four county bus system? Yes! An improved Urban Railroad System? Yes! Improve existing Expressways? Yes ! Build and construct new Freeways? Yes! Have more metro lines and Freeways under construction as you read this? Yes ! And to top it off....Greeks 20 years ago couldn't buy cars unless they had the money to buy their cars in full ! Now, almost every household has at least one car....in the capital's central area...we have over 2 million cars. Planners are trying to alleviate the mistakes made during the years high density planning was the norm in Europe and give a little leg room to people. A little sprawl hasn't hurt...it has actually made life better. People are moving around easier...breathing better air...and living in better homes. The city of Athens is NOT the comparison I should be making as the city is unique in its own right in every way and has had so many problems in its modern history with inter-regional migration, rural to urban migration as well as population exchange with Greeks that "had" to move from neighboring Turkey. There is no country ...never mind city.. that can handle 1.5 million people arriving within months...the only thing that they thought of was to "house" these poor souls as best as they could....At that time make shift housing and high density was the answer. Now though, we see that have got to correct that!

Back to Vancouver though...it isn't downright rotten to construct roadways that will have people drive smoothly and easily into Vancouver. The construction of the subway line is great ...but that is only for those traveling by air. MOST of the tourists to Vancouver and Canada come by car. They come from the USA. Why have your best customer get stuck at the light at Oak and 71st which used to have a no left turn sign when I lived there but the darn map shows that the highway just shifted over on a street that I can't travel on? Turn on Park? Sure if you haven't turned on some side street already. I remember almost every single person that visited me from the US got lost once they hit the city limits of Vancouver and I used to drive to the place they were describing to pick them up. Giving them further directions would have sent them everywhere but my house! :nuts: A major north south artery as well as an east west artery to connect to the existing TCH would drastically improve the flow inside the city's arteries.

The construction of a "proper" bridge through Stanley Park should also be thought out. Tree Huggers must consider the damage to the environment with cars in idle. I am environmentalist to the point where I have to see if I am overdoing a certain point. Replant the trees that must be removed. If you can't....make paper bags instead of plastic bags. You can do something that will balance the ills of having to construct a roadway that should have been 2 or 4 lanes from the beginning. Three lanes is absurd. Double deck the damn thing. Put in a tunnel. But having drivers stuck in 2 + 1 is rotten!

Furthermore...now with the introduction of your new metro government..."Maybe", people will start to think that Vancouver is not only the downtown peninsula, False Creek and the surrounding areas...and that most people live beyond that! Yet the laws only reflect the immediate center of the city and the needs of those people.

All my best to all of you and your upcoming Olympic Games.
Cheers:)

My only response would be a rare form of NIMBYism coming from me, I do not want to see an ugly mass of concrete in my neighbourhood. I work near the Georgia Viaduct, the aborted vestigials of a highway that wanted to weave through Vancouver proper and it can only be said to be a little depressing when I look at it outside my office.

While it would be nice to have traffic moving a little better, I do think that the city's aim is to do that not by making easier for all drivers but to frustrate enough of them so that they move to taking transit (which, despite many naysayers on this site) IS a viable option (mostly :) ). Thus, fewer cars on the road. That's probably not what City hall will tell you but I do feel that governments on the civic and provicial level really are trying to convince, if not coerce, people into switching to transit.

As for your supposed environmentalism, in Vancouver, it's a weird hybrid between true environmentalism and, more realistic, attraction to and preservation of natural beauty for our aesthestic purposes. We, and tourists, love Vancouver because of how 'pretty' it is, your highway would be great, but it would ruin that beauty.

Feel free to roll your eyes. Haha.

I may have rambled a bit and may have been misunderstood....I don't believe that the concrete ribbons that encircle the center of Seattle with 8-10-12 lanes ...double decked here and there etc are the answer.....for Vancouver I would have loved to see something similar to the parkways that one sees when they use Chicago's Lake Shore Dr.....landscaped with lots of green and trees etc. something that looks nice and can handle more traffic being limited access.

I for one opt not to take my car to work and use the subway here in Europe. I could use the freeway from the area that I live but don't. The same applies with almost all of my fellow workers. Though I do believe that sometimes in order to do something good we often have to make a sacrifice. I don't believe that replanting and re-landscaping the area or areas that would be affected make me environmentally unfriendly. It was in North America where I learned the advantages of recycling etc....which I brought with me to Europe...to Madrid, Rome and Athens. My ways of doing things has turned many a European to change the way they do things where I live and work. Nevertheless, correcting a problem like the Stanley Park Causeway and adding a lane or tunneling across the harbor is not cause for alarm in an environmental way. Whatever way you do it ...Vancouver is growing and there are going to be growing pains. My previous input to this thread has to do with Vancouver's growing pains of yesteryear. They were brushed aside for many years. Don't tell me you are for the old intersection of Cassiar and Hastings and not for the cut and cover roadway that it was converted into. It was absolutely horrible both to drive by on or to live by. Similar cut and cover options would have been feasible in making an east west connector in Vancouver's east side from the area you say you work in to the TCH. Cut and Cover gives you the option to make use of the area and turn it into parkland. Here in Athens they have recently constructed a roadway that was cut and cover with a beautiful park and athletic center etc above. It is something that transformed the area. Madrid's roadways with landscaping is something to be admired. Very nicely done. They have managed to encompass an array of transport systems as to move things in and out of the city quite easily.

A last note for environmentalism.....a true environmentalist would not buy most of the products that are available on a supermarket's shelf. They should bring cloth bags from home and buy bulk only! Look at the packaging on the many products you buy at your local supermarket and think of how many trees were cut to package the 3oz product you are buying.....Let's not go overboard. We CAN and SHOULD, ALL do our bit to save this planet because WE have turned it into a hell hole...but I highly doubt road improvement plans are the ultimate worst enemy here. It is the people that use their cars..how often they use them, where they use them to go to and a mixture of urban planning that must be taken into consideration etc. You cannot run a city of over two million residents on buses, a LRT alone.

Unfortunately, there is the downside of the climate as well...the gray damp days of fall winter and spring don't make it easy for one to opt for walking in the rain all the time the way to go. It is much easier to jump into a car and go about your business. So you do have a dilemma here. :nuts::ohno::bash::):)...Maybe I lived in sunny southern California too long???? :):):)

I'm actually not old enough to have known the last time Vancouver grew. I was only 2 when Expo86 was around and while I have nascent memories of expo and pictures to proove I was there, I am lacking in firsthand account of the growth of the 80's/90's...and really not until 2000 did I start really looking at Vancouver in any substantial way. Thus, I can't even recall the old Cassiar+Hastings intersection.

I just don't know where they'd have a cut and cover to conceal a tunnel/road. There are so few parcels of land left in Vancouver that are void of inhabitants. There's the big lots by Terminal but from other forums here, it seems a hospital may go there. How would those kinds of road improvements be accomplished in Vancouver? Where would you have them?

What the heck are you guys talking about?! My head hurts.

What the hell is Agassi shocked about?
That statement is bizarre.
It is a technically demanding excellent project.