http://i31.tinypic.com/r09jsz.jpg

http://i32.tinypic.com/maa0q1.jpg

http://i32.tinypic.com/2yni1vo.jpg

Many thanks CBP. This is probably the most activity I have seen at the site since launch!

They are digging out the lift core and cutting off the piles at the lower level.

Blockwork at the high level for pile caps.

Cheers TB for the info!

It's very good to see that our project continues to move forward in spite of the current economic situation. Very nice photographs, thanks.

08/September/2009

Botanica

http://i25.tinypic.com/b6sjkm.jpg

very fast progress here

18/September/2009

Botanica

http://i26.tinypic.com/xf6kxi.jpg

http://i29.tinypic.com/15h6dz.jpg

http://i27.tinypic.com/14v1isw.jpg

http://i28.tinypic.com/2eebgwo.jpg

http://i31.tinypic.com/14wbplt.jpg

took there time too pull there finger out

took there time too pull there finger out

Amazing progress, those 2 chaps have been busy !!

Working 24hrs here now and around 40 labour on the job. Looks much better organised than the typical DCE site.

Choosing someone different than DCE has been a good move IMO.

Anyone have pics this week? as we hear there has been lots of activity at the site!

Any chance of an update here Imre?

Thanks mate,
Paul

I tried today also , still difficult parking and stop there contractor closed both sides of that road, maybe someone can post from the Royal Oceanic.

:( no problem
Did you see any ativity though?

Why has this forum gone dead??? Where has everyone gone???

Paul I arrive on 22nd for 10 days so I will get some pics.

Nice one CBP :)

Unable to upload pictures... but visible progress and work going on through the night.

19th October;

http://img38.imageshack.us/img38/2508/img0413wi.jpg

http://img21.imageshack.us/img21/5507/img0412pe.jpg

http://img14.imageshack.us/img14/7149/img0414vr.jpg

October 2009 update:
http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties/images/botanica_oct09_1.jpg

http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties/images/botanica_oct09_2.jpg

Chances of them forming the basement structure by end of January 2010 is ZERO. They look about a month away from pouring the ground slab.

This one is done slightly differently from most other towers which just have one big raft over all the piles (quicker but needs more steel and concrete so costly). Here they are forming indiviual pile caps over pile groups which carry most of the loads from the structures main columns and walls (slower but saves money on less materials). Once all pile caps are cast they cover the lot with a thinner ground slab.

There is 2.5 to 3 years work left here so about Sept 2012 would be more realistic rather than making unrealistic claims and then shouting Force Majeure along the way, as they always seem to do.

True Blue -Thanks for your info (and pics earlier).

Sept 2012 = 2 years from the original promised handover date. This also means a loss of around £30,000 for loss of rental income for average 1 bed apartment buyers.

I am no expert, but the construction site looks a lot organised, neater and tidy than other select developments.

True Blue -Thanks for your info (and pics earlier).

Sept 2012 = 2 years from the original promised handover date. This also means a loss of around £30,000 for loss of rental income for average 1 bed apartment buyers.

I am no expert, but the construction site looks a lot organised, neater and tidy than other select developments.

Hi Paul
I assume you have bought here, would you have done so knowing handover would be 2 years later than stated in your contract ?

Yes unfortunately, I have bought here.
I was always expecting a 1 year delay as this is the 'norm' in Dubai so i was told by many agents and investors. 2 Years delay is pushing it as this means my money would be tied up for 5 years in total without earning anything and even losing capital value.

However, I am not a flipper, so not too worried about the long term. In another 10 years time (after I have nearly paid off my LPP), I am pretty sure we will do well - Location, Location, Location!!!

......................................
I am no expert, but the construction site looks a lot organised, neater and tidy than other select developments.

You don't need to be an expert to notice the difference between a clean tidy and well organised site from a chaotic waste tip.

I said from the start that not going with DCE here was the first positive step.

Agree TB this is a lot more organised.
http://i38.tinypic.com/33o4ajn.jpg

http://i33.tinypic.com/2uh1e8h.jpg

http://i37.tinypic.com/28tvncy.jpg

http://i35.tinypic.com/2m3h9mu.jpg

http://i37.tinypic.com/2z6i91y.jpg

^^ Nice pics CBP - looks very organised; makes bay central and DCE look even worse!

FWIW I will post yours later the 512 connection is real slowwwwwwwwww.

FWIW I will post yours later the 512 connection is real slowwwwwwwwww.

Thanks m8! You can always email them to me if it get's too stressful!

It appears two cranes have risen from fertile soil at Botanica site.

http://picasaweb.google.com/Rune.L.Jorgensen/Botanica#5398668752404280978

Any views on the impact on the Schedule by having two of them?

:banana:

Taking Photos is not allowed newly!!!
http://img211.imageshack.us/img211/8067/dsc07155l.jpg
http://img337.imageshack.us/img337/2558/dsc07156f.jpg
http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/138/dsc07167z.jpg

^^ Nice pics CBP - looks very organised; makes bay central and DCE look even worse!

i suppose 2000 aed psf buys a bit better quality ?

POTANIC BEEN DELAYED FOR ALMOST 2YEARS, AS BEEN PROMISED THAT WE WILL RECEIVE OUR FLATS IN SEP 2010, AND UNTILL NOW THEY EVEN NOT FINISH THE PARKING, AND THE BAD THING THAT THEY ARE SO RUDE TO ASK THEM CLIENTS FOR PAYMENT ... EVEN THEY GET FROM EACH OF US MORE THAN 30% FROM THE TOTAL AMOUNT AND THEY DIDN'T DO EVEN 10% "AND THEY BELEIVE THAT THEY WILL FINISH BOTANICA IN AUG 2011 " I DON'T KNOW HOW BUT I THINK THEY ARE VERY STUPID BECASUE PARKING IT TAKE 2YEARS HOW THEY CAN FINISH THE 40STORY BUILDING IN 20MONTHS ... SO WE ARE GROUP OF 11FLAT IN BOTANICA AND WE ARE LOOKING FOR MORE BOTANICA OWNER TO OPEN CASE IN RERA SO PLEASE.
IF YOU ARE BOTANICA FLAT OWNER. AND YOU ARE WILLING TO MOVE IN THIS CASE PLEASE LEAVE A REPLAY.
AND WE ARE SURE WE WILL WIN THIS CASE AS WE WENT TO RERA AND THEY INFORM US WE CAN PAY UP TO CONSTRACTION.
SO NOONE WILL DISTURBE YOU ANYMORE

i suppose 2000 aed psf buys a bit better quality ?

And daily overall change, green monday blue tuesday plus clean crane. Some progress here now long may it continue.

POTANIC BEEN DELAYED FOR ALMOST 2YEARS, AS BEEN PROMISED THAT WE WILL RECEIVE OUR FLATS IN SEP 2010, AND UNTILL NOW THEY EVEN NOT FINISH THE PARKING, AND THE BAD THING THAT THEY ARE SO RUDE TO ASK THEM CLIENTS FOR PAYMENT ... EVEN THEY GET FROM EACH OF US MORE THAN 30% FROM THE TOTAL AMOUNT AND THEY DIDN'T DO EVEN 10% "AND THEY BELEIVE THAT THEY WILL FINISH BOTANICA IN AUG 2011 " I DON'T KNOW HOW BUT I THINK THEY ARE VERY STUPID BECASUE PARKING IT TAKE 2YEARS HOW THEY CAN FINISH THE 40STORY BUILDING IN 20MONTHS ... SO WE ARE GROUP OF 11FLAT IN BOTANICA AND WE ARE LOOKING FOR MORE BOTANICA OWNER TO OPEN CASE IN RERA SO PLEASE.
IF YOU ARE BOTANICA FLAT OWNER. AND YOU ARE WILLING TO MOVE IN THIS CASE PLEASE LEAVE A REPLAY.
AND WE ARE SURE WE WILL WIN THIS CASE AS WE WENT TO RERA AND THEY INFORM US WE CAN PAY UP TO CONSTRACTION.
SO NOONE WILL DISTURBE YOU ANYMORE

Hi I own a apartment on the 13th floor and am willing to take this to rera
there is no way this will be complete until summer 2012 at the earliest.

To Under C .

Rebars already visible from the road , rising soon after taking pics will be easy :)

http://i50.tinypic.com/10xblzk.jpg

Big old pour yesterday, looking good.

http://i49.tinypic.com/16gli8g.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/1zn74.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/j7u3yo.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/dwx7qv.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/1rxkis.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/11l1zlf.jpg

Nice pics CBP, keep them coming! Much appreciated.

Progress looking good.

Paul

They have very good progress here , this contractor quality is much better than the DCE, it was good idea from the Select to choose this one.

Yeah! That decision might just be the one that rescues their reputation in time for the property market recovery.

Credit where its due.....

From Select today...

http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties/images/botanica_dec09_1.jpg

http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties/images/botanica_dec09_2.jpg

http://www.tigerzilla.com/properties/images/botanica_dec09_3.jpg

The top part of the core is already visible from the road , with this speed they will do the handover just before the Bay Central :)

The top part of the core is already visible from the road , with this speed they will do the handover just before the Bay Central :)

Just for interesting, same constractor (GCC) as at the MBA.

They have done fast job at the JLT (Mazaya Business Avenue) 3*50 floors.

16 months and 150 floors

29/Aug/2008

http://i45.tinypic.com/34y4tgo.jpg

10/December/2009

http://i50.tinypic.com/20h2dk7.jpg

Imre that is fantastic progress, great news for Botanic investors.

18/December/2009

Botanica

http://i45.tinypic.com/qx2lh5.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2eksuux.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/2lxzdxj.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2r7c8ea.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/300e62s.jpg

Thanks for the pics Imre :)

Just for interesting, same constractor (GCC) as at the MBA.

They have done fast job at the JLT (Mazaya Business Avenue) 3*50 floors.

16 months and 150 floors

29/Aug/2008

http://i45.tinypic.com/34y4tgo.jpg

10/December/2009

http://i50.tinypic.com/20h2dk7.jpg

Let us hope that speed and quality goes hand in hand. As said earlier, I'm impressed if they are topped out 31/12-2010. :banana:

08/January/2010

Botanica

http://i48.tinypic.com/142shac.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/23k41kx.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/155j6mb.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/xpv6va.jpg

Thanks Imre for the pics.

Progress..So far so good.

Just curious to see where people are at regarding Botanica payments on the SPP.
We're 50% paid and made our last payment in Feb 2009.
Has anyone been chased for (or indeed paid) more than 50% on the SPP?

13/January/2010

Botanica

http://i49.tinypic.com/15pir1s.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/2jb9xdu.jpg

15/January/2010

Botanica

new owner here or just the name has been changed?

http://i49.tinypic.com/nx8589.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/1zbcsb8.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/2vwe97p.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/tashhs.jpg

15/January/2010

Botanica

new owner here or just the name has been changed?

http://i49.tinypic.com/nx8589.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/1zbcsb8.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/2vwe97p.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/tashhs.jpg

Star Group Global is an investment arm of select group.

Star Group Global is an investment arm of select group.

I know but this is Global Group International LTD without the "Star" :)

Imre,
Global Group International Ltd has always been the company I have been paying my installments to, so its nothing new here.

Still the same company except they seem to be advertising themselves now!

Thanks for the info!

Imre,
Global Group International Ltd has always been the company I have been paying my installments to, so its nothing new here.

Still the same company except they seem to be advertising themselves now!

And yet Select properties advertise it as one of their projects. Confusing!

Why does it need to be so complicated?

I bought in to the Royal Oceanic Tower in Dec 2006-by Star Group Global (SGG); they had financial issues (abusing peoples money-our money-and were found out; they lost a lot of money gambling our money apparently)-EMAAR got involved and I think some of the people at the top did a runner or something; anyway Select took over SGG and then SGG's name was changed to Global Group (in early 2009 I think-we had to sign a paper which let Rahail Aslam change the name over; they were still liable for SGG's responsibilities though-incl financial); I think Global Group was registered in the freezone at Jebel Ali so I think the reason for the name change was financial :)

We bought in Botanica in December 2007 and we were contracted with Global Group then.

Incidentally, we have not paid the June or December 2009 instalment and have not been chased for payment. Is anyone else in the same situation? We are 50% paid up on the SPP. It's just a bit bizarre that we haven't heard anything at all. We had asked for a payment delay but Select wanted to charge for this and we didn't agree to signing the paperwork because it stipulated that we should comply with the remaining contractual payments on time, i.e. that we would only get the one payment delay and no more.

I suspect that RERA has been on their case, with progress and payments not being in line with the regs.

29/January/2010

Botanica

http://i46.tinypic.com/2505ru1.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/zlxjck.jpg

Vijay, I have tried RERAUK - for everybody's information they are nothing to do with the official Dubai RERA. They are simply another company running from the UK who will offer you another apartment (basically selling you something that is supposed to offset against what you have paid for your current property in Dubai) and as a bonus they will get your dubai property.

You might as well look for another property on the cheap AND keep your current one!

We have just created a facebook group for people who have bought an apartment in this tower. Search for:
Botanica Dubai Marina

You have to request to join the group.
Will be open for discussions, queries, you can upload your own photos, videos, and simply get to know your future neighbours! :cheers:

Regards,
Paul

We have just created a facebook group for people who have bought an apartment in this tower. Search for:
Botanica Dubai Marina

You have to request to join the group.
Will be open for discussions, queries, you can upload your own photos, videos, and simply get to know your future neighbours! :cheers:

Regards,
Paul

All of which can be achieved here n input from non-Botanic investors should be welcome. For example, Imre splendid photo updates wont be on your facebook group pages as he is not an Botanic investor. Anyhow, no harm to create one and administer it

Hi buster007,

Absolutely, this forum will be here for us investors during construction, but post completion, is what the group has mainly been created for.

Paul

05/February/2010

Botanica

http://i45.tinypic.com/2ltrifm.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/r2ollu.jpg

Thank you so much Imre for all the pics - it's wonderful to see Botanica making excellent progress. I don't know how you do it, managing to take so many pictures - and all in your own time I presume? It must take a lot of time to do, so I for one really appreciate what you do. A BIG THANK YOU!

12/February/2010

Botanica

http://i48.tinypic.com/eripep.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/m8p4ch.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/2kmptx.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/2m7dmhl.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/sxooqh.jpg

from royal oceanic

http://i48.tinypic.com/2z9mgpu.jpg

They are checking the SSC , the client logo has been removed :lol:

15/January/2010


http://i47.tinypic.com/1zbcsb8.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/2vwe97p.jpg

Imre,
Global Group International Ltd has always been the company I have been paying my installments to, so its nothing new here.

Still the same company except they seem to be advertising themselves now!

Paul I’m puzzled here. Does botanica tower still belongs to Select Group?

Paul I’m puzzled here. Does botanica tower still belongs to Select Group?

Yes, Botanica is still Select Group's as far as i am concerned. But thre seems to be a lot more players and name changes going on and trying to confuse us all! :nuts:

At this pace will be ready way before Bay Central.

How much does a 1bed in this development cost?

We have always been contracted to Global Group International right back from dec 07 when we bought. They are under the Select umbrella. This is probably a tactic on Select's part to limit their liability in having a different company formed for each development. A fairly common business practice.

At this pace will be ready way before Bay Central.

How much does a 1bed in this development cost?

You can probably pick out a small 1-bed for AED 850,000

I just entered Rera's homepage, and they seem to have updated their report with new text/pictures. See:

http://rpdubai.ae/rpdubai/jsp/ProjectIndicator.jsp?imageLoc=../SharedFolder/ProgressIndicator/297_102.jpg&projectName=Progress Indicator of Botanica

(Imre pics are more up todate - thnx. Imre)

However, RERA judge the progress percentage to be the same as in previous report.

Does anybody know if this has any relation to the payments they are entitled to claim?

To be fair I think 20% is low in comparison to progress made already, thinking of all the work related to the design that needs to be done, as well as the permits that needs to be obtained etc.

Anyways - judged on current progress any guestimates about when it is topped out?

My guess: 40 floors = 60 weeks = March 2011

:banana:

You can probably pick out a small 1-bed for AED 850,000




Think so.I can't get rid of a 2 bed in the torch for around this.

^^ Can you send me a link to a 2 bed in the Torch for 850k. Cheapest I can find is a 2bed non marina view on a lower floor for 1.35m. You will be able to sell easier when the units become cash flow assets (ie. are rentable).

^^ Can you send me a link to a 2 bed in the Torch for 850k. Cheapest I can find is a 2bed non marina view on a lower floor for 1.35m. You will be able to sell easier when the units become cash flow assets (ie. are rentable).


http://www.expatriates.com/cls/8295466.html

840 AED/SQFT

Think so.I can't get rid of a 2 bed in the torch for around this.

At around AED 850,000, I would be very interested!
PM me if you are serious.

Paul

http://www.expatriates.com/cls/8295466.html

840 AED/SQFT

That is a good deal at 1.07m ! Sounds like someone who cant make all the LPP payments before completion.

^^ Can you send me a link to a 2 bed in the Torch for 850k. Cheapest I can find is a 2bed non marina view on a lower floor for 1.35m. You will be able to sell easier when the units become cash flow assets (ie. are rentable).



SP has been trying to sell mine as 6 months.Give them a call, 870,000.

Well sounds like paul is going to grab a bargain then :D Why would you sell at that price, after paying off your LPP plan you will be left with less than £16k.

Well sounds like paul is going to grab a bargain then :D Why would you sell at that price, after paying off your LPP plan you will be left with less than £16k.


Iam not on a LPP,which is probably the reason I can't sell at present.

Paul drove by here earlier and was very happy with the progress, no worries here mate.

Cheers for the update mate! fingers crossed this may well be finished by Christmas 2011... party will be at mine guys!
:)

19/February/2010

Botanica

http://i45.tinypic.com/2q1c3sk.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/f42oi8.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/20u3m1y.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/rw19pt.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/5x23ia.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/4vfhjn.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/2m815dd.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/30hpkjn.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/29z553o.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/1z6vzpk.jpg

Guys, i am on a LPP on a studio apartment in Botanica, i have already paid up approx 35%. The total cost of the studio on LPP for me was approx 1.2 Million AED. What i want to know is? What is it worth now , if i want to sell it in the current market? Is it beneficial to wait till the project completes ? do you think it would be better to sell now or after complition? I am just looking for some comparisons as i am not in dubai, i live in Ireland and would just like to have some idea to make a decision, thanks in advance and any information is appreciated..!!

Who would you sell it to when this is the progress so far? Off plans are not attractive unless they are nearing completion.

A completed studio in the marina might fetch 1200-1400 AED/ft as they tend to have a bigger market than larger more expensive units but to be honest 1.2Million could buy you a 2 bed nowadays.

Thanks "true blue", i meant 1.2 Mill was the price on LPP, the original price was 750K , so i guess the offer becomes a bit better once the unit is built hence easier to sell, how is the market sentiment? does any one see any recovery soon enough or maybe a year or so, any idea?

You should follow the investment thread as you can pick up on the press reports and market sentiment from there

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=490764&page=1140

I expected market to reset this year at around 2007 levels however market sentiment seems to be no recovery until around 2011. The apparent government insolvency is harming the market.

Thanks again TB. How is the rental market in dubai now, how much could a studio fetch/ year in rental yields?? any guesses or ideas?? just looking for an approximation..in comparison to the 15336 AED LPP every Q how much can one expect to get back after the units are handed over?

You would be lucky to cover 4 x 15,336 + maintenance at current rental rates.

What is the worse case scenario, i might be optimistic to think that the market has corrected ..!! so assuming this as my worse case scenario, would i be able to recover 70% of 15336 x 4 + maintenance costs? i just looking for a gustimate

Thanks "true blue", i meant 1.2 Mill was the price on LPP, the original price was 750K , so i guess the offer becomes a bit better once the unit is built hence easier to sell, how is the market sentiment? does any one see any recovery soon enough or maybe a year or so, any idea?


It always amuses me to see people using words like "correction" and "recovery". These words are very over used, especially by property speculators and inexperienced investors.

Perhaps you could define "recovery" for me. I'm not being deliberately obtuse but reading your posts i think you might be hoping for something that just aint gonna happen. :ohno:

24/February/2010

Botanica

http://i45.tinypic.com/287mcn4.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/2w5ov1e.jpg

Studios are available for rent from 24,000 in International city, 30000 in Discovery Gardens, 30-40000 in Marina, 25000-35000 in JLT & Barsha.

^^Keep dreaming.

Every now and again people register just to bring down rents and then disappear just to re-register.

HT, i understand the sentiment in the market and i am not by any way fooled with the current situation, i am just trying to see if it's worth my while to hold on to my unit and keep paying the LPP or just forget it as a poor investment..It's about balance and weighing to think what works for me personally.

My advice to you would be that Dubai has changed significantly in the last year or so. Speculation is dead and the market is a very dangerous place for investors who are not in it for the long haul and are adequately capitalised to fund this term of investment (5-10 years).

There are a few people who invested in Dubai 2004-2007 and they are still able to look at their position with a degree of contentment. For anyone who invested between late 2007 – 2008, it is a very different story indeed.

I know that some people paid around Dh1,700 here. From what you have said your 496sqf studio cost you Dh750,000 which is Dh1,512 psf. This wont handover until late 2011 in my opinion and your LPP costs are about Dh 60,000. Service charges will be around Dh20 psf minimum. so that’s Dh10,000 per annum and rising.

So for the next 2 years you need to find Dh60,000 a year. From 2012 you will need to find Dh 70,000 a year.

I don’t think you will be able to sell your unit for anything above Dh1,000 until it's complete (that's if you can sell it at all). I don’t think marina property will hit Dh1,500 for at least 2/3 years (unless it's prime or has unique qualities).

You need to decide if you can fund the next 2 years payments and then cope with void periods as the rental market in Dubai will be saturated with new property over the next 3 years. This will bring net yields down and occupancy levels with it. If you can afford to pay the LPP payments for 3-5 years with no tenant then I would keep it up and hope the Government of Dubai decide they want to finish what they started.

If rental yield was critical to affordability from 2012 onwards you might be better to cut your losses.

This is only my opinion. Good luck.

My advice to you would be that Dubai has changed significantly in the last year or so. Speculation is dead and the market is a very dangerous place for investors who are not in it for the long haul and are adequately capitalised to fund this term of investment (5-10 years).

There are a few people who invested in Dubai 2004-2007 and they are still able to look at their position with a degree of contentment. For anyone who invested between late 2007 – 2008, it is a very different story indeed.

I know that some people paid around Dh1,700 here. From what you have said your 496sqf studio cost you Dh750,000 which is Dh1,512 psf. This wont handover until late 2011 in my opinion and your LPP costs are about Dh 60,000. Service charges will be around Dh20 psf minimum. so that’s Dh10,000 per annum and rising.

So for the next 2 years you need to find Dh60,000 a year. From 2012 you will need to find Dh 70,000 a year.

I don’t think you will be able to sell your unit for anything above Dh1,000 until it's complete (that's if you can sell it at all). I don’t think marina property will hit Dh1,500 for at least 2/3 years (unless it's prime or has unique qualities).

You need to decide if you can fund the next 2 years payments and then cope with void periods as the rental market in Dubai will be saturated with new property over the next 3 years. This will bring net yields down and occupancy levels with it. If you can afford to pay the LPP payments for 3-5 years with no tenant then I would keep it up and hope the Government of Dubai decide they want to finish what they started.

If rental yield was critical to affordability from 2012 onwards you might be better to cut your losses.

This is only my opinion. Good luck.

Good advice HT. Well done for putting it so nicely! :applause:

for rent, it's not worth it. but if you can keep up with the payments until or near handover, imo you will be able to sell at OP given that it has the LPP. it will be like selling an apartment with a mortgage, but there is no need to apply for any mortgage! GL

HT, i understand the sentiment in the market and i am not by any way fooled with the current situation, i am just trying to see if it's worth my while to hold on to my unit and keep paying the LPP or just forget it as a poor investment..It's about balance and weighing to think what works for me personally.

Good advice HT. Well done for putting it so nicely! :applause:

Here Here, well said aul chap!!!

The basic principle of property investement has not changed i.e. that property investement is a good long term investement.

We are where we are in Dubai (on the floor or close to it) and in 10 years from now property prices will have risen somewhat and we will have a mature property market.
The biggest challange is to make sure we are all still around to enjoy it!!!

Now imagine this: 2020, mid summer evening, 35C, sitting in Dubai enjoying a cold drink, "tut tuting" about the old days and all the fuss over that "property crash" thingie!!!

^^People always need somewhere to live and caves are out of fashion these days!

^^People always need somewhere to live and caves are out of fashion these days!

Yeah, caves are like so last year !!!!! :lol:

24/February/2010

Botanica

http://i45.tinypic.com/287mcn4.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/2w5ov1e.jpg


So does it match or is there any changes. Anybody have had a close up?

http://www.billedeupload.dk/upload/files/2010-02/fc56ed21.jpg

Maybe we are in for some ekstra sqft....

:banana:

^^People always need somewhere to live and caves are out of fashion these days!

Here is the problem.

Dubai has a people shortage, and does not have the authority or means to create the population increases needed year on year to satisfy the continually rising housing stock it has created.

Its easy to get $10 a day labour into the city to beef up the stats. This place needs $100,000 a year earners and wealth creators to turn up and join the party, about 1 million of them would do the trick.

I digress.

Imre I do hope these pictures were not taken from your appt as The Atlantis will be gone from view in 6 months the way this outfit are going.

No, pics were taken from the roof.

HT, thanks for a nice clarification, i was expecting something on those lines and very well said. The next question i have is , if it would takes 70000AED 2012 onwards , what kind of rent do you think would offset this cost, this will really give me the input to make my mind up if i could hold up my investment for a longer term, assuming the current market rental of 35000AED, i would need to come up with the rest, so the situation could be slightly better than what it is now once the units are delivered?

Hi Imre can you take some pictures on your travels thanks

12/March/2010

Botanica

http://i43.tinypic.com/m9t2mf.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/k0o9z9.jpg

Thanks Imre

Welcome:)

18/March/2010

Botanica

http://i39.tinypic.com/wuf4v8.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/2uhvl86.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/eryi36.jpg

Do you think handover will be on time August 2011?

No!

40 floors allow 40 weeks then roughly a year to complete interiors. Takes us to end of 2011 or first quarter of 2012. This is just a guide and we know this contractor can move fast so we will need to monitor the actual rate and adjust as necessary.

No!

40 floors allow 40 weeks then roughly a year to complete interiors. Takes us to end of 2011 or first quarter of 2012. This is just a guide and we know this contractor can move fast so we will need to monitor the actual rate and adjust as necessary.

What other project has the contractor completed.

^^Read further back on this thread for info supplied by Imre.

Mazaya Business Avenue

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=439040&page=7

Same contractor .

Just for interesting, same constractor (GCC) as at the MBA.

They have done fast job at the JLT (Mazaya Business Avenue) 3*50 floors.

16 months and 150 floors

29/Aug/2008

http://i45.tinypic.com/34y4tgo.jpg

10/December/2009

http://i50.tinypic.com/20h2dk7.jpg

hi Imre
do you know if there is a thread open for this contractor on MBA
thanks

hi Imre
do you know if there is a thread open for this contractor on MBA
thanks

Mazaya Business Avenue

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=439040&page=7

Same contractor .

Thanks Imre

I am looking to purchase an off plan apartment in Dubai Marina from a reliable developer. Need your suggestions

I am looking to purchase an off plan apartment in Dubai Marina from a reliable developer. Need your suggestions

Cayan.:banana:

http://cayan.net/inc_search.inc.php?developer=CAYAN&project=Silverene


http://cayan.net/inc_search.inc.php?developer=CAYAN&project=Infinity

I am looking to purchase an off plan apartment in Dubai Marina from a reliable developer. Need your suggestions

Strange that you posted that on here!

Jeetha is right though, Cayan are one of the few left in the marina that are still progressing their projects at full speed and delivering quality that matches the original price. Fairest maintenance charges on completed units also, so no Trident ambush at handover or Emaar continuing high charges.

I am looking to purchase an off plan apartment in Dubai Marina from a reliable developer. Need your suggestions

Why do you want off plan? There are plenty near ready at 700psf, go grab a bargain.

http://i43.tinypic.com/28l9d6s.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/29fca2v.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/ngstqx.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/34t1szq.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/2j3qssh.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/296lr9h.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/2wqd7iv.jpg

Dubai investor says she's been cheated

Investor finds her purchase contract for a one-bedroom unit cancelled after paying nearly Dh500,000

By Jay B. Hilotin, Chief Reporter
Published: 00:00 March 25, 2010

DUBAI : An accountant fears losing half a million dirhams she had paid for a Marina tower unit after she skipped three payments while negotiating for a discount from the developer.

Costly penalty

Dimple Bhatia, 29, a US-educated Indian raised in Dubai, said because the construction and hand-over of Botanica Tower was facing delays, she negotiated in August 2009 for a reduced price or payment scheme. The developer, Select Property, cancelled her contract despite her offers to pay the unpaid instalments.

Till then, she had already paid Dh497,259 to Select Property for the one-bedroom unit, representing 36 per cent of the cash value of the Dh1.38 million property (or 24 per cent of the purchase price of Dh2.07 million based on the payment plan). Bhatia had bought the unit at Dh2,654 per square foot at the height of the property boom. Dubai's real estate market saw a freefall for 18 months with property prices falling over 50 per cent from their mid-2008 highs.

Bhatia now wants to withdraw the money. "I have asked for a deferred payment plan or payment relaxation — since Botanica is expected to be delayed by a year-and-a-half," she said.

She said she is clueless how to get her money back. "They cheated me. At one end, they were negotiating and at another end, they cancelled my contract."

http://gulfnews.com/business/property/dubai-investor-says-she-s-been-cheated-1.602475

She paid AED2654psf.:nuts:

If she did not get a cancellation notice from Rera then the cancellation is void as far as I know. But she could walk away and buy a nearly ready Silverene for less than 1000psf and make a saving that would cancel out her loss:)

Maybe I should become an accountant, this counting money stuff seems easy:lol:

the AED 2,654 psf includes interest. without the interest, she probably paid around AED 1,750 psf.

the AED 2,654 psf includes interest. without the interest, she probably paid around AED 1,750 psf.

That’s lots of interest.

the AED 2,654 psf includes interest. without the interest, she probably paid around AED 1,750 psf.

So by my calc's that means it must be around 780ft2. Given that she already paid AED500,000 for something that had barely started construction, seems she has been harshly treated. Select will be lucky to re sell this for more than 700k in the current market. Might have been better for them to negotiate with her and others.

As I said, if this cancellation has not been approved via Rera, Select could be in trouble. How can a developer cancel a contract where more money has been paid than reflects the amount of construction?

So by my calc's that means it must be around 780ft2. Given that she already paid AED500,000 for something that had barely started construction, seems she has been harshly treated. Select will be lucky to re sell this for more than 700k in the current market. Might have been better for them to negotiate with her and others.

As I said, if this cancellation has not been approved via Rera, Select could be in trouble. How can a developer cancel a contract where more money has been paid than reflects the amount of construction?

I wonder how the RERA rules on construction % affects people on 15 year payment plans where investors enter into a mortgage like payment scenario ?? anyone know the rules hear ??

Rera is a joke. They haven’t a clue.

When I had a problem with a developer in JV South, I filed a complain with them (Rera). They gave me case number and all that. Then the person in charge went on holidays and I got a letter to say to re-send the whole complain and start from the very beginning.

They wanted me to redo the whole process, just because the person in charge went on holidays.

They haven’t a clue.

But I did get my money back in the end, no thanks to Rera.

I wonder how the RERA rules on construction % affects people on 15 year payment plans where investors enter into a mortgage like payment scenario ?? anyone know the rules hear ??

In the case of LPP, payments are not linked to construction milestone or percentages.

^^That is what the new laws and Rera were introduced to sort out, payments linked to progress so they don't exceed the value of the work done.

I know what you are getting at HT, but it's a ludicrous situation that payments under the LPP actually went ahead of the construction progess. That surely indicated that it is the developer who is in serious breach of the agreement and not the investor. The pricipal of the interest charge on the LPP is to cover the debt obligation as the contractors spend profile exceeds the payments made by the investor. This never happened so where is the entitlement to the interest being charged?

Just booked 4 nights for 5 people at Oceanic with mydubaistay for £588. About £30 pppn, good deal for botanic owners wanting to see whats going on. The appt is 1405.

http://gulfnews.com/business/property/dubai-real-estate-investor-says-she-s-been-cheated-1.602475?showComments=true&pageNumber=2

29.03.10
http://i44.tinypic.com/15wcadz.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/2dcgadi.jpg

thanks ronnie for the pics

So has anyone else had the e-mail from Select, detailing a RERA-agreed schedule of payments, linked to identifiable construction milestones?

On the face of it, the proposal seems OK, but I'd be interested in what other people think before moving ahead on it.

So has anyone else had the e-mail from Select, detailing a RERA-agreed schedule of payments, linked to identifiable construction milestones?

On the face of it, the proposal seems OK, but I'd be interested in what other people think before moving ahead on it.

Is this for SPP only or does it equally apply to those on LPP?

Don't know about LPP
We're on SPP

So has anyone else had the e-mail from Select, detailing a RERA-agreed schedule of payments, linked to identifiable construction milestones?

On the face of it, the proposal seems OK, but I'd be interested in what other people think before moving ahead on it.

Flossy

Any chance you can post that on here please ?

:cheers:

The bones of the RERA schedule are:

20% at signing of contract
15% at completion of basement and foundation
15% at completion of floor 5 (done 31 March 2010)
20% at completion of floor 20
20% at top out
10% at hand over

We are 50% paid so far, and this would mean another 20% in around 15 weeks

The bones of the RERA schedule are:

20% at signing of contract
15% at completion of basement and foundation
15% at completion of floor 5 (done 31 March 2010)
20% at completion of floor 20
20% at top out
10% at hand over

We are 50% paid so far, and this would mean another 20% in around 15 weeks

So 90% at top out --good deal for SG -they can sit back then and take their time - it could be 18 months until handover after that ? --looK at TRIDENT GRAND RESIDENCE

http://i39.tinypic.com/2ym9f9f.jpghttp://i39.tinypic.com/4pzqe.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/2czylg5.jpghttp://i43.tinypic.com/zvx98z.jpg

Click here for other angles (http://www.skyscraperlist.com/showthread.php?370)

The RERA approved schedule doesn't look too bad. We are on the SPP with 50% paid up so far. We hadn't paid the June and December 09 instalments and so that was a bonus as far as we were concerned. If this new payment schedule has the seal of approval from RERA I don't see how we can avoid not signing it. They seem to be making very good progress which is great to see.

^^ people on BC will end up having the same thing done.. well the people who havent paid in full!

The bones of the RERA schedule are:

20% at signing of contract
15% at completion of basement and foundation
15% at completion of floor 5 (done 31 March 2010)
20% at completion of floor 20
20% at top out
10% at hand over

We are 50% paid so far, and this would mean another 20% in around 15 weeks

hi im 6o% paid so i will have to pay 10%more in 15 weeks.i havent received any info from select about this yet.does anyone have any idea when top out should be and what does it mean. tks

^^ people on BC will end up having the same thing done.. well the people who havent paid in full!

whats BC sorry im new at this im on spp

Based on 40 floors, I assume that top out will be around 34 weeks from now (Jan/Feb 2011?), if they achieve one floor per week for the next 8/9 months.

We had the info on this from Select in Dubai both by e-mail and recorded delivery letter. They are actually now answering e-mails quite promtly, which is a novelty.

BC probably refers to Bay Central, another Select development in the Marina.

One thing I have to say is that progress does seem to be fairly good on Botanica at the moment. After all the delays and uncertainty earlier in the project, at least it is under construction....

whats BC sorry im new at this im on spp

I think its Before Christ. That about when Bay Central started.

16/April/2010

Botanica

http://i43.tinypic.com/xdw4yp.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/w9ie0g.jpg

http://i44.tinypic.com/2rvyh4l.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/33z3drk.jpg

23/April/2010

Botanica

http://i39.tinypic.com/2gxix74.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/2ps3jvq.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/1zobypt.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/25ho7dg.jpg

30/April/2010

Botanica

http://i41.tinypic.com/sec86v.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/10f2np2.jpg

http://i42.tinypic.com/5v0pyp.jpg

Thank you for the pictures Imre - always nice to be updated :) 2 floors in 14 days is very acceptable, I think.

Anybody knows if it is possible to get a look a IFC (issued for construction) - drawings of the typical floor plans? The columns that can be seen on the pictures seem to spoil both balconies - by taking up the space - and living areas - by making them darker.

Could balcony areas be complimented by additional steel framework and be fitted later?

Finally I want ask if anyone out there knows why there is two double height floors (or it at least appears so? (the two on top of reduced height car parking floors (I assume).

Have a nice Friday!!

:banana:

http://img685.imageshack.us/img685/9739/image0142z.jpg

Got this picture today. Taken about 18.00 so site emptying.

Between the two mid columns it looks like there is a hole in the floor. Anybody got an answer to what that could be? A crane more?


:banana:

From Select today...

http://www.tigerzilla.com/developmentphotos/botanica_2010_05_06_a.jpg

http://www.tigerzilla.com/developmentphotos/botanica_2010_05_06_b.jpg

07/May/2010

Botanica

http://i42.tinypic.com/izp69u.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/21dn0k8.jpg

http://i43.tinypic.com/24lj5o8.jpg

13/May/2010

Botanica

http://i43.tinypic.com/13yjrjl.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/1z3mih1.jpg

http://i39.tinypic.com/15mkbrq.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/258m2di.jpg

Paul these are a week old as I have been travelling with the welsh man, but enjoy anyway.

http://i45.tinypic.com/fljb78.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2vrv1qs.jpg

http://i45.tinypic.com/v474te.jpg

Hope you can see the great sea views the rear appts here will have over the mariden.

Lol! thats cool, thanks mate.

Hi guys, can anyone let us know (looking at the structure) how many floors have been built and how many more to go?

anyone have any latest pics here to share in the absence of Imre?

Paul I will arrive on 28th and post then. MANUTD is in town, perhaps he will splash out on a new camera and do the business.

Paul I will arrive on 28th and post then. MANUTD is in town, perhaps he will splash out on a new camera and do the business.

Justr struggeld for the airfare this time mate -so camera out of question ??

BTW Botanica on 14th floor

28/June/2010

Botanica

http://i48.tinypic.com/uxzzb.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/11alqo3.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/sfi1bl.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/b8w74p.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/fkw5jr.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/ieji44.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/27ycnle.jpg

Thanks Pete and Imre for the pics!

Construction seems to be going at a good pace around a floor every week.

Paul

http://i47.tinypic.com/332z03n.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/2ztdojd.jpg

Very healthy progress since the contractor landed on site. Maybe we will see some cladding starting after ramadan.

Feasible to top out before Bay Central if they can keep a floor a week going versus 2 floors a month at BC.

This one is flying. They are pouring every night. At the moment they are lifting on the jib to the 4th tower crane. Unbelievable. Keep it up.

http://i50.tinypic.com/59xwuh.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/usnig.jpg

http://i47.tinypic.com/o70ims.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/6707yo.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/es14k0.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/sevedk.jpg

http://i50.tinypic.com/2woal1k.jpg

http://i46.tinypic.com/15n945k.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/3308kkl.jpg

http://i48.tinypic.com/30ksgu9.jpg

http://i49.tinypic.com/2mze6f5.jpg

Nice one Pete, thanks for the great pics.
Floor # 18 now ..... not bad going!

09/July/2010

Botanica

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/9203/dubai12.jpg (http://img687.imageshack.us/i/dubai12.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

http://img687.imageshack.us/img687/9726/dubai15.jpg (http://img687.imageshack.us/i/dubai15.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

http://img594.imageshack.us/img594/2644/dubai16.jpg (http://img594.imageshack.us/i/dubai16.jpg/)

Uploaded with ImageShack.us (http://imageshack.us)

hi just wondering has anyone on spp tried to switch to lpp due to lack of bank lending .im 70 per cent paid up to date now.

Switching from SPP to LPP was a question we asked very early on and were firmly told no. But things have changed a lot since then and it would be interesting to see what they say now.

has anyone received a payment request that is not linked to the milestone indicator?

Switching from SPP to LPP was a question we asked very early on and were firmly told no. But things have changed a lot since then and it would be interesting to see what they say now.

well you were right a polite no was the reply.anyone know if you can access finance in dubai as a non resident.

well you were right a polite no was the reply.anyone know if you can access finance in dubai as a non resident.

Impossible at the moment. Your best bet is to remortgage in your home country if you have enough spare equity.

Last year I wanted to switch from lpp to spp because I did not want to pay all the interest and I had the cash so I made a request to sp and to my shock they accepted but I had to pay about AED 80k penalty so I told them to forget it. I am still on the lpp.

Impossible at the moment. Your best bet is to remortgage in your home country if you have enough spare equity.

Not good advice at all !! Unbelievable !!

You'd be moving your debt onto your own residential property in the UK and would be at a position where you'd have paid 90% with the tower only topped out, with loads more work to be done. That's a massive risk to your capital....... and to the roof over your head in the UK.

Much better to stay on LPP where your exposure will be less and when Botanica is completed and you have your keys, then consider about raising finance in the UK to pay the LPP off.

Also the LPP is actually weighted so the quasi "interest" is loaded heavily in the first few years and you've already paid this now, so best to stay with it for a few years more, you've little to gain by comming off the LPP.

Another factor if you wished to sell your unit it's much more attractive to sell with LPP in place. I sold my BC unit last year (via SP who did a great job) and I doubt it would have sold had it not been on LPP......I'd have been unlikely in the present market IMO to have found a cash buyer given it's nowhere near completion.

Your LPP is a great asset as no mortgages are available, my advice would be to stick with it.

Not good advice at all !! Unbelievable !!

You'd be moving your debt onto your own residential property in the UK and would be at a position where you'd have paid 90% with the tower only topped out, with loads more work to be done. That's a massive risk to your capital....... and to the roof over your head in the UK.

Much better to stay on LPP where your exposure will be less and when Botanica is completed and you have your keys, then consider about raising finance in the UK to pay the LPP off.

Also the LPP is actually weighted so the quasi "interest" is loaded heavily in the first few years and you've already paid this now, so best to stay with it for a few years more, you've little to gain by comming off the LPP.

Another factor if you wished to sell your unit it's much more attractive to sell with LPP in place. I sold my BC unit last year (via SP who did a great job) and I doubt it would have sold had it not been on LPP......I'd have been unlikely in the present market IMO to have found a cash buyer given it's nowhere near completion.

Your LPP is a great asset as no mortgages are available, my advice would be to stick with it.

I'd second that, very sound advice

Not good advice at all !! Unbelievable !!

You'd be moving your debt onto your own residential property in the UK and would be at a position where you'd have paid 90% with the tower only topped out, with loads more work to be done. That's a massive risk to your capital....... and to the roof over your head in the UK.

Much better to stay on LPP where your exposure will be less and when Botanica is completed and you have your keys, then consider about raising finance in the UK to pay the LPP off.

Also the LPP is actually weighted so the quasi "interest" is loaded heavily in the first few years and you've already paid this now, so best to stay with it for a few years more, you've little to gain by comming off the LPP.

Another factor if you wished to sell your unit it's much more attractive to sell with LPP in place. I sold my BC unit last year (via SP who did a great job) and I doubt it would have sold had it not been on LPP......I'd have been unlikely in the present market IMO to have found a cash buyer given it's nowhere near completion.

Your LPP is a great asset as no mortgages are available, my advice would be to stick with it.

Is it just me???

The original question related to switching from Short payment plan onto long payment plan. What I understand that to mean is that the individual wants to release equity. Not being able to do so in Dubai I suggested he/she uses their domiciled property.

Switching from SPP to LPP was a question we asked very early on and were firmly told no. But things have changed a lot since then and it would be interesting to see what they say now.


Pay attention to the question if you are giving out advice!!! Unbelievable!!!:bash:

I'd second that, very sound advice

You too!!:laugh:

You too!!:laugh:

Humble apologies, didn't read correctly. The post would have been correct if already on LPP and not SPP in my opinion given the current state of affairs. The Estate agents do seem to think the LPP gives the seller more options ion the market:cripes:

Anyone have latest pics of the construction stage?

http://www.rpdubai.ae/rpdubai/SharedFolder/ProgressIndicator/297_102.jpg

^^Again missleading report suggesting progress is at or about 60% complete. A blind man can see the structure is less than 50% done so logic tells us overall progress must be less than 50%. Maybe it would help if they had titles on the bars or some form or nomeclature.

Rera pub crawl;
1st bar foundations complete, 2nd bar basement complete, 3rd bar structure complete, 4th bar wind and weather tight, 5th bar brown envelope received, etc:)

Got it sussed! Note they got a green arrow:)

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=62508359&postcount=6700

Paul this is going well. Will take you a few pics and post later.

Thanks Pete.. look forward to seeing your pics.

Paul

http://www.skyscraperlist.com/showthread.php?370-BOTANICA-TOWER-40F-Res-m

Does anyone know how many floors done here?

http://i53.tinypic.com/23wa1rb.jpg
http://i56.tinypic.com/2cdtoua.jpg

Thanks for pictures Jeffers. ^^ Good to see it growing.

Judging from the render and the height aren't they reaching the Botanical "floor" cf. the nice animation in the beginning of the thread?

Anyone has an idea of the impact constructing that floor will have on the progress?

Another question to you knowledgable guys out there. The infinity started the cladding when the tower still was young in its making. Is there any benefits related to construction from not doing that on Botanica? (Not thinking of the cashflow for the developer, but rather in terms of quality/safety etc.)

Keeping up the high spirit and hope of having a nice home in August 2011

:banana:

The exterior works have started on the seafacing side of the building. :)

Still apr. 15 floors to go. Top out - Feb 2011.

No pics - but news is better than nothing.

:banana:

Drove down to Botanica today and took a few pictures. It looks like floor #31 is ready to be cast. There is a test facing/balcony/frontage completed on the see view side for the corner apartment on floor 15.
http://lh3.ggpht.com/_UU9gwazY5MA/TK3KlRRJnZE/AAAAAAAAACE/1gxrz133fqM/s144-

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_UU9gwazY5MA/TK3KnzwVXRI/AAAAAAAAACE/NuDxG9gwAIs/DSC00475.JPG

http://i1046.photobucket.com/albums/b465/u057mica/Botanica%207Oct2010/DSC00479.jpg
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_UU9gwazY5MA/TK3Koym5u6I/AAAAAAAAACE/y2HBMXes48g/DSC00479.JPG

http://i1046.photobucket.com/albums/b465/u057mica/Botanica%207Oct2010/DSC00480.jpg

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_UU9gwazY5MA/TK3KqSfBSMI/AAAAAAAAACE/ps8KTsjxjl8/DSC00481.JPG

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_UU9gwazY5MA/TK3KrEXqkMI/AAAAAAAAACE/Al6Iu-JuPr4/DSC00482.JPG

Thanks u057mica for the great pics - it is startling to see the pace. The cynical side of me says they are going so fast so they can reach top-out as quickly as poss to then apply for the next payment stage. The million dollar question will be whether the pace slows somewhat after this. Hope not!

On a different note I have registered with Select Group my deep unhappiness and anxiety at the finishes they have used in the Point, Torch and Bay Central. I have asked them not to use those cheap tiles throughout, the cheapest kitchen equipment, the awful dark doors and the cheapest and nastiest looking granite I have ever seen in my life. I think it is worthwhile making our feelings known as investors in advance. We should all be making a request for a better finish in Botanica NOW, especially as we have all paid a much higher rate per square foot. The response I received was that they would be following the contract - they refused to be drawn as to what exactly the finish would be. I was just asking them if they intended to use the same finish as the others because if they do, this would be completely unacceptable. They did say that a show apartment would be ready soon for us to look at so hopefully we will all see soon enough.

One can but hope that SG is learning from each development and that the finishing will gradually improve. By having a tower in the marina that stands out from all the cheap and nasties has to be a good PR exercise for them and would engender some good feeling back towards SG. Investors would then be more likely to spend money with them again, instead of this "over my dead body will I ever invest in SG again" feeling!

So, SG, if you are reading this and I know you are - please take heed. Investors do have a voice that needs listening to if you want to continue successfully in business. If you believe in karma and do the right thing by Botanica investors, it will come back to you a thousand times.

Thanks u057mica for the great pics - it is startling to see the pace. The cynical side of me says they are going so fast so they can reach top-out as quickly as poss to then apply for the next payment stage. The million dollar question will be whether the pace slows somewhat after this. Hope not!

On a different note I have registered with Select Group my deep unhappiness and anxiety at the finishes they have used in the Point, Torch and Bay Central. I have asked them not to use those cheap tiles throughout, the cheapest kitchen equipment, the awful dark doors and the cheapest and nastiest looking granite I have ever seen in my life. I think it is worthwhile making our feelings known as investors in advance. We should all be making a request for a better finish in Botanica NOW, especially as we have all paid a much higher rate per square foot. The response I received was that they would be following the contract - they refused to be drawn as to what exactly the finish would be. I was just asking them if they intended to use the same finish as the others because if they do, this would be completely unacceptable. They did say that a show apartment would be ready soon for us to look at so hopefully we will all see soon enough.

One can but hope that SG is learning from each development and that the finishing will gradually improve. By having a tower in the marina that stands out from all the cheap and nasties has to be a good PR exercise for them and would engender some good feeling back towards SG. Investors would then be more likely to spend money with them again, instead of this "over my dead body will I ever invest in SG again" feeling!

So, SG, if you are reading this and I know you are - please take heed. Investors do have a voice that needs listening to if you want to continue successfully in business. If you believe in karma and do the right thing by Botanica investors, it will come back to you a thousand times.

16 Oct
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4083/5085640603_1b1dfa3f71_b.jpg

Thanks u057mica for the great pics - it is startling to see the pace. The cynical side of me says they are going so fast so they can reach top-out as quickly as poss to then apply for the next payment stage. The million dollar question will be whether the pace slows somewhat after this. Hope not!

On a different note I have registered with Select Group my deep unhappiness and anxiety at the finishes they have used in the Point, Torch and Bay Central. I have asked them not to use those cheap tiles throughout, the cheapest kitchen equipment, the awful dark doors and the cheapest and nastiest looking granite I have ever seen in my life. I think it is worthwhile making our feelings known as investors in advance. We should all be making a request for a better finish in Botanica NOW, especially as we have all paid a much higher rate per square foot. The response I received was that they would be following the contract - they refused to be drawn as to what exactly the finish would be. I was just asking them if they intended to use the same finish as the others because if they do, this would be completely unacceptable. They did say that a show apartment would be ready soon for us to look at so hopefully we will all see soon enough.

One can but hope that SG is learning from each development and that the finishing will gradually improve. By having a tower in the marina that stands out from all the cheap and nasties has to be a good PR exercise for them and would engender some good feeling back towards SG. Investors would then be more likely to spend money with them again, instead of this "over my dead body will I ever invest in SG again" feeling!

So, SG, if you are reading this and I know you are - please take heed. Investors do have a voice that needs listening to if you want to continue successfully in business. If you believe in karma and do the right thing by Botanica investors, it will come back to you a thousand times.

You guys are in a little better situation as DCE is not your main building contractor. As far as Select is concerned, I doubt that they will take any more care of Investors at the Botanica any more than they have done at The Point, Royal Oceanic, Yacht Bay, The Torch and Bay Center. However, they have found a new milking cow i.e. Service Charges, which they extort from the Owners. It is far more profitable than constructing buildings.

Hallo Vijay
Could you give us the specifics of the milking that you are suffering. This would be very helpful to all of us on this forum. What are you paying in service charges per square foot and at what building?

Hallo Vijay
Could you give us the specifics of the milking that you are suffering. This would be very helpful to all of us on this forum. What are you paying in service charges per square foot and at what building?

Select are trying to push as much as AED 22 psft for The Point. :ohno:They reduced it to approximately AED 19 psft after the first IOA meeting. The majority of members of the IOA Board have refused to endorse the new Service Charges. Furthermore, the building barely functions. You can find details of the problems by visiting The Point posting on SSC.:bash:

:)... trying to push as much as AED 22 psft for The Point ... reduced it to approximately AED 19 psft after the first IOA meeting...
Vijay ... there is hope ... RERA will be doing something about service charges, owner associations and the like ... extract from Gulf News below.

The September 5 circular from Real Estate Regulatory Agency states:
All unit owners must pay the Rera-approved service charges and the developer must pay the service charge for any unsold units.
In respect of any existing projects where the owners association has not been formed, the developer shall determine the service charge in accordance with the procedures outlined in the Land Department Direction and Rera, and submit same to Rera for approval, on the condition that the developer submits to Rera an audit report prepared by an approved auditor in respect of all money collected on behalf of service charges.

Maybe this will help ... the rates you quote are not unusual ... we pay around AED 17.50 at MVT in the Marina.

Thanks u057mica for the great pics - it is startling to see the pace. The cynical side of me says they are going so fast so they can reach top-out as quickly as poss to then apply for the next payment stage. The million dollar question will be whether the pace slows somewhat after this. Hope not!

On a different note I have registered with Select Group my deep unhappiness and anxiety at the finishes they have used in the Point, Torch and Bay Central. I have asked them not to use those cheap tiles throughout, the cheapest kitchen equipment, the awful dark doors and the cheapest and nastiest looking granite I have ever seen in my life. I think it is worthwhile making our feelings known as investors in advance. We should all be making a request for a better finish in Botanica NOW, especially as we have all paid a much higher rate per square foot. The response I received was that they would be following the contract - they refused to be drawn as to what exactly the finish would be. I was just asking them if they intended to use the same finish as the others because if they do, this would be completely unacceptable. They did say that a show apartment would be ready soon for us to look at so hopefully we will all see soon enough.

One can but hope that SG is learning from each development and that the finishing will gradually improve. By having a tower in the marina that stands out from all the cheap and nasties has to be a good PR exercise for them and would engender some good feeling back towards SG. Investors would then be more likely to spend money with them again, instead of this "over my dead body will I ever invest in SG again" feeling!

So, SG, if you are reading this and I know you are - please take heed. Investors do have a voice that needs listening to if you want to continue successfully in business. If you believe in karma and do the right thing by Botanica investors, it will come back to you a thousand times.

I think this is wishful thinking on your part. If they had intentions to get anything 'right' they would of done from the beginning. They don't care, they have your money, so they will continue to provide shoddy workmanship and materials. Think if it like this, when do you your job, do you do it the same way every day,or one day do you make a hash of it, and then the next day you make a superb job of it,You will put the same effort in day in and day out YOU can't change the makeup of people or companies, 'it is what it is' so except that will it be the same standard as the other buildings, why should they change now. They won't, never in a million............But keep your chin up and just be glad that you will have a completed apartment, and then work on what you have to do when you get handover.

I think this is wishful thinking on your part. If they had intentions to get anything 'right' they would of done from the beginning. They don't care, they have your money, so they will continue to provide shoddy workmanship and materials. Think if it like this, when do you your job, do you do it the same way every day,or one day do you make a hash of it, and then the next day you make a superb job of it,You will put the same effort in day in and day out YOU can't change the makeup of people or companies, 'it is what it is' so except that will it be the same standard as the other buildings, why should they change now. They won't, never in a million............But keep your chin up and just be glad that you will have a completed apartment, and then work on what you have to do when you get handover.


We have to have hope - all I am saying is for mutual investors in Botanica to make your feelings known now, rather than after the event when they present a shoddy apartment. They are using a completely different contractor to DCE who built the Point, Torch and Bay Central. The Botanica contractor appears to be building to a good standard, keeping the site tidy and perhaps they will have a different set of tiles and doors to finish with rather than DCE's shoddy tiles. And yes, I shall be thoroughly pleased to have a finished apartment as opposed to nothing which some people have had to go through.

my humble apologies, i didnt realise it was a different contractor, in which case it throws a whole different light on the matter, i wish you guys luck and hope everything turns out well.Even if it isnt a first class standard, you can always make the changes so it is.

I believe that the main contractor here was the one who also did the Al Mazaya business avenue in JLT. From the outside (on pictures) it looked very good. Has anybody had the opportunity to have a look inside? - as it might give an indication of what is in store...