I am opening this thread because I think it is interesting to see how the economic development in EE and migration from EE countries to WE countries affects the labour market and how do countries deal with the labour shortage.

Just a few stories from Romania:

The first 'wave' of labour migration started before accession, when an Italian clothing factory in Bacau hired about 3.000 chinese female workers because it couldn't find Romanians to do that kind of job. In agriculture, large investors hired Moldovans.

Second 'wave' of labour migration started after EU accession in 2007, when construction companies especially, in big cities like Bucharest, Constanta or Cluj started hiring foreign workforce to do the building job mostly from Turkey, Ukraine, Moldova, and Albania. AFAIK, for the Transilvania highway, Bechtel hired Turks, in Constanta construction companies hired Albanians, in Bucharest, infrastructure and construction companies hired Turks, and Moldovans.

In the coming years, investors are poised to hire in the hundreds of thousands of foreign workers, especially from China, Moldova, other Asian countries and Ukraine to fill in the gaps for the construction works to be done following investments from EU funds in infrastructure.

Yep , there is a high pressure to "import" foreign workers in Bulgaria as there is a lack of qualified workforce and the companies are pressured to raise wages.

I don't think that importing foreign workers is a good decision though, this slows down the process of raising wages. Anyway, there are already people from abroad working in certain industries.

Yep , there is a high pressure to "import" foreign workers in Bulgaria as there is a lack of qualified workforce and the companies are pressured to raise wages.

I don't think that importing foreign workers is a good decision though, this slows down the process of raising wages. Anyway, there are already people from abroad working in certain industries.

Yeah, I admit labour migration slows down the rise in salaries, but this may also have as effect the continuation of migration of skilled people especially in construction from EE countries to WE countries. In addition, investors in construction make so much money that they could scrap a few percentages from their profits just to keep in the good workers. Bastards! :bash:

mostly from Turkey, Ukraine, Moldova, and Albania

Lol. If there is one place Ukrainian workers aren't going to it's Romania. If it has to be anywhere then it's Poland, or Western Europe. However, even now this won't be the case with Euro 2012 and all.

Lol. If there is one place Ukrainian workers aren't going to it's Romania. If it has to be anywhere then it's Poland, or Western Europe. However, even now this won't be the case with Euro 2012 and all.

Yes, you are right...the number of Ukrainians is the smallest among all the other groups I mentioned.

However, I'd be interested what has happened in Poland after accession and how did it solve the problem of labour shortage, given that Romania is going through the same phenomenon of large waves of labour migration after EU accession. Here is a big subject of the day, that's why I am asking. Thanks.

This is a good solution to the labour shortage: build a compund in large cities where to accomodate temporarily workers brought from other cities/abroad. :cheers:

Max Bogl to build campus to attract construction workers

standard.ro

The severe labor crisis in the construction market is prompting companies to look for alternative solutions to attract skilled workers. The local subsidiary of German company Max Bogl is to invest some €2 million to build a campus close to Bucharest, where workers from all areas of the country would be relocated.

“Max Bogl currently has 130 employees in Romania, but we are going to need hundreds more for the projects that we will launch in the coming years, while construction workers are very hard to find,” the company’s CEO, Mathias Kirr, told Business Standard. He added that the campus will host 250 workers, recruited from several parts of the country. “We must solve at least part of the problem in this way,” Kirr said.

He added that some 10 percent of the company’s employees, especially managers, are foreign citizens from Austria and Germany, while engineers are mostly Romanians.

The company is expecting €80 million in turnover in 2008, 30 percent higher than the €60 mln forecast for this year.

Were having lots of problems... Work Visas have been taken off for Ukrainians, Moldovans, Belarussians and Russians, also the process for companies to hire foriegn workers has been significantly made easier. The main beneficiaries are the Ukrainians, Moldovans, Romanians and Chinese.

Construction companies are prognosed to have hired around 10 000 foriegn workers since the legislation has come in June. The liberalisation of the labour market will have to occur to make sure we get all the workers we need to ensure growth and competiveness in this globalised world.
The lack of labour has also pushed average wages up to around 800-900 euros a month, which has lead to higher inflation today the highest inflation was recorded since febuary 2005 to 3.6%!!!!!

On the other hand we still have 9% unemployment (many employed in the hidden economy real unemployment est at around 6%). However the economy is doing well with circa 7% growth, 11 billion euros in FDI and 67 billion euros of EU funds to access over the next 5 years.

Things are looking up with the new govt and so on. For me imigrants can only be cultural enhancement and it proves a strong economy if people want to come and work there i mean the USA and to some extent the UK are countries of immigrants, both have highly prosporus economies. I cant wait till warsaw gets it own china town or i see my kids going to school with black kids who speak polish and multiculturalism can only be a positive thing in imo!! It will really help in my opinion Polish people to be more open and friendly

Were having problems... and work Visas have been taken off for Ukrainians, Moldovans, Belarussians and Russians however the process for companies to hire foriegn workers has been significantly made easier. The main beneficiaries are the Chinese, construction companies are prognosed to have hired around 10 000 foriegn workers since the legislation has come in June. The liberalisation of the labour market will have to occur to make sure we get all the workers we need. The lack of labour has also pushed average wages up to around 800-900 euros a month, which has lead to higher inflation today the highest inflation was recorded since febuary 2005 to 3.6%!!!!! On the other hand we still have 8.8% unemployment, the economy is doing well with circa 7% growth, 11 billion euros in FDI and 67 billion euros of EU funds to access over the next 5 years. Things will be looking up and for me imigrants can only be cultural enhancement cant wait till warsaw gets it own china town or i see my kids going to school with black kids who speak polish and multiculturalism can only be a positive thing in imo!!

We already have a China town :banana: and about 20.000 chinese in Bucharest alone!

Is it a london style china town??

No, it's more like a huge market place with hundreds of shucks, where they sell everything.

But:

Bucharest will have its own Chinatown

By: Teodora Bodeanu | Date: 2006-04-14

Niro Group will invest 200 million Euro in developing Bucharest's own Chinatown, Florin Suicescu, the group's executive manager, told BBW.
Located near Dobroiesti, on the outswkirts of Bucharest, the project has two phases, each involving an investment of 100 million Euro, with works set to be finished in 2008. "At the end of the first phase, the project will comprise Dragonul Rosu Mega Shop center, spaning 30,000 sqm, and two apartment buildings with about 120 apartments with one, two and three rooms," Suicescu told BBW. "To facilitate clients' access we built a 2.5 kilometers road, from the Fundeni Bridge till the shopping centers, which we opened last week," he added.
In the same area, five new shopping centers will be built, on a total surface of 60,000 sqm, five restaurants and more parking facilities will be added to the 1,700-space parking lot already existing near Dragonul Rosu. By the time the project is completed, Chinatown will have 4,000 parking spaces. This first phase should be finished at the end of 2006.
During the second phase, Niro Group will build an exhibition center on a 100,000 sqm area and five other apartment buildings with about 280 flats. "We'll also build a 16-storey business center, five other restaurants, one for each traditional Chinese cooking styles, and a leisure center," said Suicescu, adding that the apartment buildings and the business center will form a complex called China Towers.
The entire project should be finalized in the second half of 2008, and will span on 80 hectares. "Depending on the finishing level and extra utilities requested by clients, the price of apartments will vary, but the starting price will be 600 Euro per sqm," said Suicescu.
Commenting on the effects of the Chinatown project on the real estate market in the area, Suicescu said land and property prices in Voluntari and Dobroiesti increased by 30 per cent over the average growth level in Bucharest. "The real estate market in the area has seen steady growth in the three years since we launched our projects," he said. "Besides the increase in prices, the area has also seen an increase in business volume, especially in services and food trade," he added.
Niro Group had a turnover of 17 million Euro in 2005, increasing by 17.5 per cent compared to the previous year. For 2006, Suicescu estimates a further minimum increase of 25 per cent.
The group has a number of other projects. Between May 2006 and September 2007, Niro will invest about ten million Euro in modernizing and restoring the Grand Hotel du Boulevard. "The value of the project is just an estimation, because specialists in historic monuments are running the expertise at this moment," said Suicescu.
Niro is also the owner of the Central Park residential complex, located in the Stefan cel Mare - Barbu Vacarescu area, which includes 545 apartments and over 700 parking spaces. Launched in 2005, Central Park will be finalized in September 2007, with 80 per cent of homes already being bought.
Other projects include the Niro Business Center, a seven-level office building in Traian - Foisorul de Foc area, delivered in December 2004, which is home for advertising, distribution and IT companies, and the Herastrau multifunctional center, which comprises office spaces, shopping areas and the headquarters of Unicredit Bank.



©Copyright Bucharest Business Week 2006.

No, it's more like a huge market place with hundreds of shucks, where they sell everything.

Old football stadium by any chance ?:lol:

Is it a london style china town??

^^ Nope

Completed ... http://www.dragonulrosu.ro/photogal/index.htm

And whole project - Red Dragon Picture Gallery http://architecture-models.net/dragonul/architecture-models-dragonul.html

^^ Nope

Completed ... http://www.dragonulrosu.ro/photogal/index.htm

And whole project - Red Dragon Picture Gallery http://architecture-models.net/dragonul/architecture-models-dragonul.html

Soo, it's already completed....I thought they were still building at it. I will go there to visit...can't wait to eat some Chinese foood...yammy, it's so gooood. :cheers:

The flats, office buildings and some more commercial units are U/C

so its a chinese styled mall???
i mean summin like this
LA:
http://www.laphotos.com/china_town3.jpg
San Fran
http://www.theschoolbell.com/Links/Chinatown/chinatown.JPEG
London
http://www.tomorrowproject.net/pub/Media/-403_200.jpg

I cant wait till warsaw gets it own china town

Warsaw already has a 30,000+ community of Vietnamese. There is around 40-60 thousand Vietnamese in Poland on total.

Warsaw's "Vietnamtown"
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1091/03resizezd7.jpg

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/4141/05resizexn2.jpg

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/8822/14resizear5.jpg

http://www.michau.se/pics/my_pics/warszawa/2007/070111_praga/070111_praga_3825.jpg

http://www.michau.se/pics/my_pics/warszawa/2007/070111_praga/070111_praga_3827.jpg

http://www.szukamypolski.pl/sasiedzi/wietnam1.jpg

http://www.qbk.pl/blog.fotki/083.jpg

http://warsawpoint.com/pic/arch/warszawa-w-smachach2.jpg

http://bo.boo.pl/images/stories/Wietnam/mecz/1.jpg

http://bo.boo.pl/images/stories/Wietnam/mecz/2.jpg

http://bo.boo.pl/images/stories/Wietnam/mecz/8.jpg

http://bo.boo.pl/images/stories/Wietnam/mecz/4.jpg

http://bo.boo.pl/images/stories/Wietnam/mecz/7.jpg

^^ It looks like a slum hehe......... Oh and are they having some kind of cultural meeting in the park??
Anyway i heard about this comminity their legal status has always interested me lol :nuts:
The municipality should build them a proper cultural center with a thearter/ cinema maybe a museam as well. Poland has always had strong ties with Vietnam recently we loaned the vietnamiese government $600 million for social projects and so on.

btw is that eagle on the Polish flag without a crown i mean they should really update it and they definatley not let the Polish flag touch the Ground:ohno::ohno::bash:

Warsaw already has a 30,000+ community of Vietnamese. There is around 40-60 thousand Vietnamese in Poland on total.



^^ They look very happy...what jobs are they mainly doing in Poland? :cheers:

Warsaw already has a 30,000+ community of Vietnamese. There is around 40-60 thousand Vietnamese in Poland on total.

Warsaw's "Vietnamtown"
http://img293.imageshack.us/img293/1091/03resizezd7.jpg

http://img95.imageshack.us/img95/4141/05resizexn2.jpg



Damn, I hate I cannot find some pictures of our Complex Europa...hey, Romanian colleagues here, can you help me out? Thanks :cheers:

^^ They look very happy...what jobs are they mainly doing in Poland? :cheers:

As far as I know, they are mainly merchants, running their own little businesses, working their ass off and often earning much more than an average Poles. Of course they are also in restaurant and fastfood business.
I don't know if they are happy or not, but Poland has a 3rd biggest Vietnamese community in Europe, after France and Germany, so I guess they are doing just fine.:cheers:

As far as I know, they are mainly merchants, running their own little businesses, working their ass off and often earning much more than an average Poles. Of course they are also in restaurant and fastfood business.
I don't know if they are happy or not, but Poland has a 3rd biggest Vietnamese community in Europe, after France and Germany, so I guess they are doing just fine.:cheers:

Hmmm, its the same here. Chinese are mainly merchants and restaurant keepers. I think we'll never see a London style neighbourhood in EE, cause Chinese are making money here to buy modern style flats and houses. :cheers:

Business Standard:

Personnel crisis hits naval shipyards:ohno:

14 decembrie 2007

In spite of an explosion in orders and contracts signed in the past few years for ship construction and repair, Romanian naval shipyards are facing a new problem, namely a crisis of personnel, according to a declaration for Business Standard by representatives of various companies.
Most shipyards worked at full capacity in 2007, being forced to increase the volume of production. However, this rise is slowing, due to a lack of specialized engineers and workers.

“It is excellent that we have contracts until 2011, but the year 2007 has been a difficult one because the increasing production volume is obliging us to raise our production capacity. We have been unable to do this, due to the crisis in the Romanian labor force. This year Aker Tulcea hired 230 employees, and we still have a deficit in personnel. We are forced to work 10-12-hour shifts, which is a strategy that leads to a drop in productivity and an increase in costs,” said the General Manager of Aker Tulcea, Dumitru Ivanov, for Business Standard.

The Tulcea shipyard is expecting a slight rise in profit and turnover worth €130 million in 2008, compared to losses of RON 737,000 (€209,000) and turnover of €75.1 mln in the first nine months of 2007.

Aker Braila, controlled by Norwegian Aker Yards Group, will close the year 2007 with a turnover of some €80 mln, double year-on-year.

Damen Galati, part of the Dutch Damen Group, which delivers 30-33 ships annually to its buyers, told Business Standard that it has been forced to work with sub-contractors. In spite of increasingly more complex contracts and excellent orders, its 2007 profit was lower than the some €10 mln in 2006.

Business Standard:

Personnel crisis hits naval shipyards:ohno:

14 decembrie 2007

In spite of an explosion in orders and contracts signed in the past few years for ship construction and repair, Romanian naval shipyards are facing a new problem, namely a crisis of personnel, according to a declaration for Business Standard by representatives of various companies.
Most shipyards worked at full capacity in 2007, being forced to increase the volume of production. However, this rise is slowing, due to a lack of specialized engineers and workers.

“It is excellent that we have contracts until 2011, but the year 2007 has been a difficult one because the increasing production volume is obliging us to raise our production capacity. We have been unable to do this, due to the crisis in the Romanian labor force. This year Aker Tulcea hired 230 employees, and we still have a deficit in personnel. We are forced to work 10-12-hour shifts, which is a strategy that leads to a drop in productivity and an increase in costs,” said the General Manager of Aker Tulcea, Dumitru Ivanov, for Business Standard.

The Tulcea shipyard is expecting a slight rise in profit and turnover worth €130 million in 2008, compared to losses of RON 737,000 (€209,000) and turnover of €75.1 mln in the first nine months of 2007.

Aker Braila, controlled by Norwegian Aker Yards Group, will close the year 2007 with a turnover of some €80 mln, double year-on-year.

Damen Galati, part of the Dutch Damen Group, which delivers 30-33 ships annually to its buyers, told Business Standard that it has been forced to work with sub-contractors. In spite of increasingly more complex contracts and excellent orders, its 2007 profit was lower than the some €10 mln in 2006.

I've already heard that Damen Galati will import some 150 painters, welders etc from China to cope with the personnel crisis. Most of the workers left for the shipyards in Loussiana following the Katrina disaster which determined a lot of American workers to just abandon the state. They left from salaries of 400 EURO/month to 4000$/month.

Hmmm, its the same here. Chinese are mainly merchants and restaurant keepers. I think we'll never see a London style neighbourhood in EE, cause Chinese are making money here to buy modern style flats and houses. :cheers:

This has been the situation up to now - merchants/traders only. But in near future will be the labourers that will come to Romania to work on building sites/infrastructure projects ... they will not be rich but certainly better off than in China

BTW that “london style neighbourhood" is made of restaurants/shops only
http://img214.imageshack.us/img214/1295/aaaxh6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

Business Standard:

Construction companies to employ workers from Ukraine and Moldova
20 decembrie 2007

The severe shortage of skilled workers in the construction industry is prompting companies in the field to recruit personnel from neighboring countries. Construction employers and trade unions will open employment offices in Ukraine and the Republic of Moldova as of 2008 and send teams to Bulgaria, Turkey, India and China, to study the markets in those countries.

The deficit of personnel in the construction field is estimated at some 170,000workers, due to massive migration of workers to Germany, Spain, Italy and Israel, where construction workers are paid €10-12/per hour, compared to €7-8, in Romania.

The construction sector has experienced spectacular growth in recent years due to a real estate boom, although this development could slow due to companies lacking skilled workers.

“We have set up a committee to coordinate recruitment operations, to prevent uncontrolled personnel migration, and to dissuade companies from bringing poor workers from abroad and paying them little on the black market," said the President of the FGS Familia trade union, Dan Cristescu.

The deficit of personnel in the construction field is estimated at some 170,000workers, due to massive migration of workers to Germany, Spain, Italy and Israel, where construction workers are paid €10-12/per hour, compared to €7-8, in Romania.



somehow it seem to be ...I dont know ...but Im sure You know What I mean..

somehow it seem to be ...I dont know ...but Im sure You know What I mean..

Yeah, it's only now that I noticed...it seems to be something wrong about that rate/hour in Romania. But, the essence of the problem stays.

I`ve several questions to my Northern neighbours.According to the official statistics what is the current unemployment rate, what is the retirement age, of how many people is consisted the workforce and how many pensioers are there in Romania?

Check this out... (sorry, RO only:()
Dutch diagnosis: the workforce crisis in constructions is a false problem

Diagnostic olandez: Criza de forta de munca in constructii e o falsa problema
Criza de forta de munca din constructii, unde este estimat un deficit de circa 170.000 de salariati pentru perioada 2008-2009, ar putea fi rezolvata daca ar creste eficienta muncitorilor.

Eficienta muncitorilor romani din constructii se afla la unul dintre cele mai scazute niveluri din Europa, sub 30.000 de euro/ persoana, potrivit unui studiu efectuat de Asociatia Romana a Antreprenorilor de Constructii (ARACO), pe primele locuri fiind situate statele nordice - Norvegia, Finlanda si Danemarca, unde eficienta se situeaza intre 150.000 - 200.000 de euro/persoana.

"Daca va creste eficienta muncitorilor care activeaza pe piata constructiilor nu va mai fi nevoie de import de forta de munca din afara.

Nu ar trebui sa ne uitam doar la deficitul de muncitori, ci si la managementul lucrarilor. Muncitorii trebuie sa lucreze constant si maistrul sa dea instructiuni clare", a declarat Toine Kets, managing partner al companiei olandeze de consultanta in resurse umane Actinote, care a deschis anul acesta un birou pe piata romaneasca.

Kets a exemplificat cum poate fi imbunatatita eficienta muncitorilor, dupa ce a aratat o poza facuta pe un santier romanesc unde sase muncitori stateau rezemati de marginea drumului si unul singur lucra. "Daca din cei sapte muncitori ar fi lucrat macar patru, lucrarea ar fi terminata de doua ori mai repede si nu ar mai fi nevoie de atragerea unor noi salariati. Spre exemplu, podul care leaga orasul Bruxelles de aeroport este reabilitat o data la trei ani timp de opt saptamani. In cazul in care compania de constructii termina cu doua saptamani mai devreme i se acorda un bonus, din care jumatate trebuie sa mearga la angajati", explica Kets.

In opinia reprezentantilor ARACO, principalele cauze ale eficientei scazute a muncitorilor sunt lipsa de motivare, salariile scazute si numarul redus de maistri care sa supervizeze lucrarile.

Ei spun ca salariul minim brut in domeniul constructiilor va creste de la 1 ianuarie cu 27%, la 570 de lei lunar, nivel negociat de patronatele si sindicatele in domeniu. La sfarsitul anului viitor, nivelul salariului minim brut urmeaza sa se majoreze la 700 de lei, iar in 2009 va ajunge la 900 de lei. Insa pentru a putea fi competitivi pe piata europeana, constructorii va trebui sa ajunga in urmatorii ani la un salariu mediu de circa 600-700 de euro, similar cu cel din Polonia sau Ungaria.

"Pana la finele anului 2009 va fi nevoie de un total de 550.000 de muncitori in constructii fata de 380.000 cat sunt in prezent", a spus Laurentiu Plosceanu, presedintele ARACO. O solutie luata in considerare tot mai mult de companii pentru acoperirea deficitului de personal este aducerea muncitorilor din China, unde eficienta este similara cu cea a muncitorilor din statele nordice.

"Anul acesta am infiintat o companie specializata in productia de materiale de constructii. Ne gandim sa aducem circa 30 de muncitori chinezi pentru aceasta divizie, din totalul de 200 de salariati necesari", a declarat Tiberiu Andrioaiei, director de divizie in cadrul companiei de lacuri si vopsele Policolor.

Datele ARACO arata ca ponderea cheltuielilor cu forta de munca in costul total al produsului final se situeaza intre 5% si 22%, in timp ce materialele de constructii reprezinta 40-55% din total.

I`ve several questions to my Northern neighbours.According to the official statistics what is the current unemployment rate, what is the retirement age, of how many people is consisted the workforce and how many pensioers are there in Romania?

These are quotes from the official sttatistics for October, 2007:
(the whole report in EN+RO at http://www.insse.ro/cms/files/statistici/comunicate/lunar_indicatori/a07/sic10r07.pdf)

7. Labour force market
The number of employees (in the units having
4 employees and over) amounted to 4741.3
thousand persons in October 2007, by 2.4
thousand persons less than in September 2007.
Vacancies rate in the third quarter of 2007 (the
middle month of the quarter) was 2.17%,
increasing both as against the second quarter of
2007 (2.11%) and as against the third quarter of
2006 (1.82%).

By economic activity, the highest vacancies
rates, in the third quarter of 2007, were
registered in general government and defence
(7.16%), health and social assistance (6.16%)
and financial intermediation (2.73%); by major
groups of occupations, the highest rates were
registered for experts with intlellectual and
scientific occupations (3.48%) and technicians,
foremen and similar (2.28%).

8. Unemployment
According to the data provided by the National
Agency for Employment, the number of
registered unemployed at the end of October
2007 was 367.4 thousand persons. In
comparison with October 2006, the number of
unemployed registered at the agencies for
employment was by 86.1 thousand persons
lower. Of total registered unemployed, women
represented 45.8%.

The unemployment rate registered in October
2007 was 4.1% as against total civil active
population (5.1% in October 2006). Female
unemployment rate was by 0.2 percentage
points lower than male unemployment rate
(4.0% as against 4.2%).

High unemployment rates were registered in the
counties: Vaslui (9.7%), Mehedinţi (8.6%),
Caraş-Severin (7.2%), Teleorman (7.0%),
Covasna (6.1%) and Gorj (6.0%). The lowest
unemployment rates were registered in the
counties: Timiş (1.7%), Ilfov (1.6%) and
Bucharest Municipality (2.0%).

9. Social insurance
In the third quarter of 2007, the average
number of pensioners amounted to 5737
thousand persons, decreasing by 12 thousands
as against the second quarter of 2007. Social
insurance pensioners represented 99.7% of total
pensioners; in this category, in comparison with
the second quarter of 2007, the number of state
social insurance pensioners was by 3 thousand
persons higher and that of farmer pensioners
(923 thousand persons) decreased by 16
thousands.
In the third quarter of 2007, the monthly
average pension of state social insurance
pensioners was lei 385 monthly, increasing by
5.5% as against the second quarter 2007; the
monthly average pension of farmer pensioners
was lei 151 and increased by 7.9%. The ratio
between the average pension of state social
insurance for age limit, with full contribution
period (without tax) and the net average earning
was 51.1% in the third quarter of 2007.

Lithuania

The unemloyment in 2007, 3rd Q was 3,9% - 4th lowest in the EU

There were ~29,300 free job places in that same period of time - a 19% increase compared to last year

Foreign workforce is mostly brought in by bigger companies and among those brought, dominate Ukranians, Turks, Moldovans and Chinnese. The number of immigrants is still rather low and doesnt meet the demand, mostly because of strict lithuanian laws concerning immigrants from Non-EU/developed countries. They are in a process of beeign changed now though.

Ziarul Financiar:
Data: 24-12-2007

Pirelli recruits Romanian workers from Italy for local market



Italian tyre producer Pirelli will recruit skilled Romanian workers from Italy in 2008 for its Romanian-based plants, as part of a project conducted by the Ministry of Labour in partnership with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs and the Ministry of Interior. "The workforce shortage on the Romanian market is prompting companies to recruit Romanians working abroad, particularly from the Italian market, thus contributing to luring workers back to the Romanian market, even before the Government can do something about it. Pirelli is one of the companies which will bring people from Italy, for its plants in Romania," specified Paul Pacuraru, Labour Minister.

According to the Enrico Malerba, CEO of Pirelli Romania, the company will recruit around 1,500 people from the local market next year. Part of the 500 skilled Romanian workers to be hired by Pirelli in 2008 may come from the Italian market. "We are in favour of recruiting Romanians from Italy. We are currently examining the Italian market and recruitment opportunities there. What we are primarily looking for is skilled workers, but we cannot specify how many of the 500 skilled workers to be hired by Pirelli next year will come from the Italian market," says Malerba.

Ziarul Financiar
Data: 09-01-2008

The launch of production at the new Nokia plant, over 20 new malls and the continued expansion of major retail networks are the major events set to mark the labour force market over the coming year.

The constructions sector remains in pole position and requires at least 50,000 employees for projects in 2008. Many domestic construction firms have already started to import labour due to the current personnel shortage. Networks that specialise in construction materials are also expected to hire additional staff this year.

Retail will recruit 40,000 people, with more than 20 proposed malls set to open this year. Given that the average number of mall employees stands at 1,500, the total number of new recruits could reach 30,000 by yearend, which includes recruitment for retail networks already established within shopping centres.

The carmaker Automobile Dacia, which derived an estimated turnover worth over 2 billion euros last year, announced it would hire a further 3,000 individuals at its assembly plant, as well as 600 university graduates for its administrative departments in a bid to hit the production target of 400,000 cars for 2009, which was revised from 350,000 units.

The total number of employees who work in the domestic car industry revolves around 300,000, according to APIA deputy chairman Brent Valmar, of whom 10% work for importers' dealership networks.

In terms of banks, the rate at which new personnel is recruited is likely to slow down this year against last year, when over 7,000 people joined banks present on the market, according to NBR data. Around 1,000 new banking branches were opened in 2007, which is unlikely to be repeated this year.

However, recruitment may come from Millennium Portuguese bank, whose development strategy entails an increase in the number of branches to 100 over the next two years. Raiffeisen, Alpha Bank and Unicredit could also make similar announcements.

Finland's Nokia group is undergoing full personnel recruitment process both for its future plant in Jucu and for its research unit part of Enterprise Solutions. According to company representatives, by early this year, when production at the plant in Cluj county is due to start, 500 persons had been set for recruitment. This number will rise to 3,500 when the plant begins to operate at full capacity.

In their turn, service providers present on the market were among the most active employers in the private sector. Genpact representatives plan to double personnel again in 2008, to around 2,000 employees.

US firm TechTeam, which owns TechTeam Akela and TechTeam Global in Romania, is also expected to hire between 300 and 350 employees for its two units.

As far as I know, they are mainly merchants, running their own little businesses, working their ass off and often earning much more than an average Poles. Of course they are also in restaurant and fastfood business.
I don't know if they are happy or not, but Poland has a 3rd biggest Vietnamese community in Europe, after France and Germany, so I guess they are doing just fine.:cheers:


Our countries should import scientists, engineers, doctors and this kind of people from the third world, not the ones who only know how to run a restaurant or sell cheap clothes.

Things are looking up with the new govt and so on. For me imigrants can only be cultural enhancement and it proves a strong economy if people want to come and work there i mean the USA and to some extent the UK are countries of immigrants, both have highly prosporus economies. I cant wait till warsaw gets it own china town or i see my kids going to school with black kids who speak polish and multiculturalism can only be a positive thing in imo!! It will really help in my opinion Polish people to be more open and friendly


I assume that you´re living in Poland; you really don´t know how many people here in Germany are envious because of Polands ethnic homogenity.
They see it as our main advantage, think about it, I´ve seen many cities in western Europe, I don´t want to become polish cities like this. Do you really think multiculturalism is all about going to your local chinese or whatever nationality restaurant and eat your food there. Forget it, you will see how ghettos will be established, I mean, a chinatown is an ethnic ghetto too, really don´t understand what´s so good about it.
Hopefully our politicians are smarter and no multicult-ideologists who sacrifice their country and their people.

Our countries should import scientists, engineers, doctors and this kind of people from the third world, not the ones who only know how to run a restaurant or sell cheap clothes.

Scientists, engineers and doctors go the US, Britain, France or Germany because they are much better paid there and have more professional and employment opportunities.

On the other hand, EE countries do have enough engineers, doctors and scientists, but do not have enough people to work in construction, supermarkets, tourism, textiles etc. EE persons do not want to do that kind of jobs anymore, so they will be filled by low skilled immigrants from 3-rd world countries.

Scientists, engineers and doctors go the US, Britain, France or Germany because they are much better paid there and have more professional and employment opportunities.

This is right, but i think that we could attract students from this countries and let them stay in our countries after graduation. I bet there are enough of them in the third world who would take this option into consideration.

On the other hand, EE countries do have enough engineers, doctors and scientists, but do not have enough people to work in construction, supermarkets, tourism, textiles etc. EE persons do not want to do that kind of jobs anymore, so they will be filled by low skilled immigrants from 3-rd world countries.
Yes, but still you do not hear much about success in the field of science from EE countries, do you?

And I do not have nothing against construction workers from the 3rd world, but I suggest that we get this people and let them do their job. After having finished they should leave.
For example, in Poland we need a lot of this people to build motorways, stadiums, buildings etc. Why not give them a working permit until 2012 (when the Euro is over) and then let them go. The same thing is done in so many other countries, and nobody seems to be complainig about it.
It´s a fair deal - we get the job done, they get a higher pay than in their homecountries.

^^ No it is not. At least half a million Poles will remain in Britain forever, even though they thought they went there ... :nuts: temporary. I know they are part of EU etc etc ... however, it is not fair to take opportunities away from people ... you need to give them choice not rules/boundaries (only) :cheers:

^^ No it is not. At least half a million Poles will remain in Britain forever, even though they thought they went there ... :nuts: temporary. I know they are part of EU etc etc ... however, it is not fair to take opportunities away from people ... you need to give them choice not rules/boundaries (only) :cheers:

Why not? It´s the same thing like they do it with Indians, Pakistanis etc. in the GGC-Countries. From the beginning on, they now what they have to expect and can prepare for it. For a poor man from the 3rd world this is far much better than working (if he finds work) and live in his homecountry. With the saved money he can support his family and provide them a better future.
This is their choice, and I think that many would favour it.

You need to give the chance to stay if they want and deserve ... as they do in UK, US, Australia, Canada etc. You can not just use them, and once wasted, sent them home ... better do not let them in if you do not intend to treat them right or give them decent rights.

Look, if you have not been a migrant yourself - trust me on this one - let’s top the conversation here. You need to experience migration in order to talk about it

In Czech Republic the biggest foreign labour force are Ukrainians doing manual work, mostly on constructions. Vietnamese are selling cheap clothes, fruits and vegetables but they sre slowly overtaking regular small stores and many of chinese restaurants are in fact run by Vietnamese. Then some Chinese and people from Ex USSR and YU.

Number of legal workers according to Czech statistical office:

Ukrainians 102.594
Vietnamese 40.779

Number of total workers from Ukraine including illegal is estimated at somewhere over 200.000, number of Vietnamese is over 60.000.

I am not counting Slovaks of course as it is hard to consider them real foreigners.

In Czech Republic the biggest foreign labour force are Ukrainians doing manual work, mostly on constructions. Vietnamese are selling cheap clothes, fruits and vegetables but they sre slowly overtaking regular small stores and many of chinese restaurants are in fact run by Vietnamese. Then some Chinese and people from Ex USSR and YU.

Number of legal workers according to Czech statistical office:

Ukrainians 102.594
Vietnamese 40.779

Number of total workers from Ukraine including illegal is estimated at somewhere over 200.000, number of Vietnamese is over 60.000.

I am not counting Slovaks of course as it is hard to consider them real foreigners.

So, I take that Czechia does not have a big Chinese community?
What about a muslim/arab community?
What are the sectors in the Czech economy which sufffer from labour shortage and what has the government done for thhat?

It is really hard to estimate number of Chinese in Czech republic, there is no relevant data as many of these living here did not arrive by ordinary means of transport but for example were smuggled into Europe crossing borders illegaly in trucks. Also the community is very closed. But there sure is a significant number of Chinese as for example in some places chinese food joints succesfully eliminated Czech competition (unfortunately this was the case with my previous job, for one decent Czech restaurant there was 6 chinese ones, I wasn´t able to eat rice the whole year after).

Muslim community is really small and quiet so far counting some 10.000 people.

Shortage of workforce is typical - every sector of industry and services, manual labor in factories (mostly textile and automobile industry), Shortage of construction workers is nearly fatal. On the other side of demand are IT specialists.

Government is trying to do something with this but very little IMO. They want to for example set up a branch of Czech employment office in Ukraine to ease up process of legal work immigration. Also green cards should be issued to selected specialists and skilled workers.

edit

Map of Romanian work force crisis
http://www.hotnews.ro/english/business/articol_2196478/map_romanian_work_force_crisis.htm


Some 83,000 qualified workers are searched for by Romanian employers. A third of jobs included in the official data of work force deficiency can be found in constructions - the sector which exports the biggest work force to Spain and Italy. Labor Ministry officials intend to set up a plan to attract Romanian workers abroad to return in the country.

However, qualified workers argue that the salaries are too low and thus, unappealing.

Official data put forward by Labor Ministry officials reveal that the greatest work force deficit is registered in Bucharest (some 20,125 workers), the county of Timis in Western Romania (16,800) or Constanta, SE Romania with 6,700.

According to National Statistics Institute data, the national-level net average salary in construction works stood at 942 RON, or less than 300 euro, in November 2007. The level for the textile industry was of 758 RON, while very low levels of about 200 euro can be found in the wood processing industry, hotels and restaurants, leather processing and agriculture.

Gone west: Why eastern Europe is labouring under an abundance of jobs
www.ft.com


Jan Liman does not know how to safeguard the future of Meblat, his Warsaw-based kitchen furniture company. He has good sources of timber and plenty of orders. But he is short of skilled workers.

"Two [out of 12] workers have emigrated to Ireland. A third man has resigned saying he was also going to Ireland. Trying to find replacements has been fruitless," he says.

The Polish entrepreneur's complaints are echoed across the European Union's new member states in central and eastern Europe. The squeeze is worst in the construction industry but is also gripping sectors as different as baking and banking. Engineers, technicians and factory hands are all in short supply. Fuelled by strong economic growth and soaring foreign investment, employment is increasing in availability just as emigration has sucked around 5m workers from eastern to western Europe. According to Eurostat, the EU's statistics agency, labour costs are growing at their fastest rate since the end of Communism - with a 30 per cent increase in nominal costs in Latvia in the year to last September and rises of more than 20 per cent in Romania, Estonia and Lithuania. In Poland, the largest new member, the rise was just under 12 per cent.

In real terms, average gross wages in Poland rose more than 7 per cent in the first nine months of 2007 and in Romania by nearly 16 per cent, according to the Vienna-based Wiiw research institute.

While unemployment levels in western Europe have stayed at around 8 per cent since 2002, in the east they have slid from 14 per cent to under 9 per cent. In the region's booming capital cities, almost everybody who wants work has a job. Leszek Wronski, head of the central Europe division of KPMG, the accountant and management consultant, says: "We have a job market controlled by employees."

For many east European workers, this control is very welcome. For 15 years they watched as company owners won much of the benefit of the post-Communist transition. Now workers are securing a bigger share of the rewards. As Donald Tusk, Poland's prime minister, told the Financial Times recently: "The lack of labour in Poland is a problem in some industries...But it is also important for people to enjoy the fruits of economic growth."

However, for governments and companies alike, rising labour costs and growing skills shortages raise big questions about the region's future competitiveness. Everything from decisions on investment location to education, migration and population policies is coming under scrutiny.

There is no immediate need for panic. Even after the recent pay surges, differences between west and east Europe remain huge. In Germany, hourly labour costs are about €28 ($41.40, £21.15), compared with some €8 in the Czech Republic, €7.50 in Poland and €4 in Romania. Rafal Krasnodebski, a partner at the Warsaw office of PwC, the accountancy and consultancy group, says: "Poland and Slovakia were 70-80 per cent cheaper than western Europe in 2004. Now it's 60-70 per cent. So it's still cheaper [there] and likely to be cheaper for a long time to come."

The region has since 2002 seen a particularly sharp cyclical upswing in gross domestic product growth, averaging more than 5 per cent annually. Yet while east European economies slowly converge with those of western Europe, including in labour costs, the current pay surge contains significant one-off elements. An easing of restrictions on working in western Europe, which accompanied EU enlargement, has allowed millions to emigrate, particularly from Poland and Romania, the two most populous countries. Pay has risen fastest for those in greatest demand in the west. Building workers' wages last year rose 20 per cent in Poland, 25 per cent in Romania and 35 per cent in Latvia.

Now, with a credit squeeze hampering the US economy and clouding the western European outlook, economists are examining prospects for the EU's new members. While most see continued solid growth, they expect a slowdown from 6.5 per cent last year to perhaps 5 per cent in 2008. Some governments and central banks in the region are in any case slowing growth by trying to reduce high inflation and current account deficits. Zbigniew Kominek, a senior economist at the European Bank for Reconstruction and Development, the multilateral bank for the ex-Communist countries, says: "The cyclical increase in economic growth will not last indefinitely."

However, even if labour markets ease a little, there will be no return to the super-abundance of workers of five years ago. The region's populations are ageing even faster than in western Europe and, with the added effects of migration, the number of working-age people is falling in the Baltic states and central Europe. Eurostat predicts that the population of the new member states will decline from 103.6m in 2004 to under 100.6m in 2015, with particularly sharp drops in working-age people.

So companies and governments must prepare for a long period of tight labour markets. For policymakers, the first task is to raise employment rates. The region is burdened with low rates of participation in the labour market, especially among older people. In Poland, the employment rate at the end of 2006 was just 54.5 per cent, compared with 67.5 per cent in Germany and 77.4 per cent in Denmark, the EU's highest rate. Among people aged 55-64, the Polish employment rate was just 28.1 per cent, compared with 48.4 per cent in Germany.

The east European numbers are depressed by the use of early retirement and disability awards during the post-Communist restructuring. But political leaders are cautious about limiting access to welfare or initiating other policies that might provoke a backlash. After years of effort, the region is suffering reform fatigue.

Next, policymakers and employers will need to ensure wage labour productivity keeps pace with labour cost increases. According to a report this week by the Conference Board, a US business research organisation, labour productivity in the east is much lower than in the west. In Poland, for example, it was just 40 per cent of German levels. But the difference in unit labour costs is much greater, so employers continue to relocate labour-intensive operations from west to east - as Finland's Nokiaannounced this week it would do, closing a German mobile phone plant with the loss of 2,300 jobs and expanding a Romanian factory that will employ 3,500.

However, as Capital Economics, a UK-based research group, warns in a report this week, in Poland and the Czech Republic (though not in Slovakia) recent wage increases have exceeded productivity gains. In Romania, Christian Popa, deputy central bank governor, says further labour market reforms are needed to improve flexibility and so raise productivity. "I believe this is the solution and it's no quick fix."

The Lisbon Council, a Brussels-based think-tank, says in a report that governments and employers must redouble efforts to raise productivity through better education and training. "The countries of central and eastern Europe lag western Europe considerably in human capital acquisition and deployment." The report argues that while the region's schools are broadly as effective as western Europe's, there are big gaps in lifetime adult education, including on-the-job training. Older workers, trained in obsolete ways under Communism, face the greatest difficulties.

Companies are also responding to rising wages by demanding more from their workers. In business services, workers are being transferred to higher added-value operations involving direct contact with clients, while simpler functions are moved to China and India. Marketing and financial services groups, driven to pay €100,000 a year or more for experienced executives, are giving them tougher targets.

Even for high-paying international banks, personnel management is a headache. Stephen van Groningen, head of the Romanian subsidiary of Raiffeisen International, the Austrian bank, says: "The situation is unsustainable. People are becoming extremely opportunistic in job hunting. People come to work for the bank and leave after three months. Three months later they want to come back - and in certain cases I have to say yes."

Lower down the wage ladder, life is tougher for employers, particularly at smaller companies. Agnieszka Jagiela, recruitment manager at 5 a Sec, a Polish dry cleaning chain with 80 outlets, says: "High staff turnover is a constant problem even though we pay close to the national average wage and offer four kinds of bonus." Construction is booming at a time when workers are in demand across Europe. Diwaker Singh, managing director of Copper Beech, a Romanian property developer, says: "There is a desperate shortage of labour because there aremany projects happening and so many emigrants."

Many employers are responding by improving perks, such as company cars, and trying to retain staff through loyalty bonuses, training schemes and career development. For multinationals this is familiar territory. But for inexperienced local employers it is often new. Marek Masalski, head of Grupa Konsultacyjna, an employment agency in eastern Poland, says: "Some employers are still not fully aware of the importance of non-pay factors in motivating and employing people."

So far, rising labour costs are not affecting the region's overall attraction. The EBRD estimates that foreign direct investment into central and south-east Europe last year totalled $44bn (£22bn, €30bn), the fourth strong year in succession. Companies that see eastern Europe as a market as well as a cheap-labour base are glad of the increased spending power that higher pay brings. Also, a lot of current FDI is being generated by multinationals already well established in eastern Europe, notably car*makers, which are bringing their component suppliers into the region.

But among more mobile, cost-conscious investors, there is a clear shift away from hotspots including Prague, Warsaw, Budapest and Bratislava, where labour is short, in favour of locations offering more scope for recruitment. Favoured regions include Silesia in Poland and large parts of Romania, while pioneers are looking further east - beyond the EU, to Ukraine and Moldova.

Textile companies, particularly sensitive to labour costs, have led the way. But other groups are not far behind, such as Genpact, a US business services provider part-owned by General Electric, which started in eastern Europe in 2002 by opening a centre in Budapest. Now it is focusing on Romania, where it launched a Bucharest operation in 2005 and another in the northern city of Cluj last year. Patrick Cogny, chief executive of Genpact in Europe, says lower labour costs, including payroll and income taxes, have been decisive in investing in Romania; now Ukraine and Moldova are on his planning horizon.

Local companies are also heading to cheaper locations. Polish furniture makers have started outsourcing work to Ukrainian and Belarussian partners. Hermes Softlab, a Slovenian software developer, has created 200 jobs in Bosnia, Serbia and Montenegro - one-quarter of its total payroll.

But just as EU accession has made it easier for workers to move west, it has made life harder for would-be migrants from further east. Ukrainians, who enjoyed visa-free travel to Poland, now face bureaucratic hurdles. Moldovans have difficulty entering Romania. Employers want an easing of restrictions. They are also recruiting labour further afield by, for example, bringing in workers from Vietnam, China and North Korea on short-term contracts.

Whatever employers do, governments will sooner or later, as in western Europe, be obliged to consider the controversial question of migration if their region is to extend its rapid economic progress.

http://www.publicinfo.ro/pagini/_download.php?IDcamp=149&IDfile=46

A study ordered by the Agency for Government Strategies reveals that 1/3 Romanians in Italy want to return to Romania in the next 2 years.

I am curious how will the Government convince them to return.

I am curious how will the Government convince them to return.

If they don't they will use the methods of Vlad Ţepeş. :laugh:

Renault starts employing 1600 engineers worldwide for its tehnological center in Titu/Bucharest, Romania :banana:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Offres d'emploi de Renault Technologie Roumanie
Renault Technologie Roumanie, nouveau centre d'ingénierie de Renault s'inscrit dans le déploiement international de l'entreprise. Renault Technologie Roumanie, c'est :
- l'embauche de 1600 ingénieurs et techniciens d'ici 2009
- la mise en place de moyens informatiques modernes (CAO, calcul, etc..)
- la création de moyens d'essais mécaniques et véhicules (bancs et pistes)
- le maintien de l'assistance à l'usine Dacia de Pitesti.

http://www.renault.com/renault_com/f...nie/index.aspx

http://www.publicinfo.ro/pagini/_download.php?IDcamp=149&IDfile=46

A study ordered by the Agency for Government Strategies reveals that 1/3 Romanians in Italy want to return to Romania in the next 2 years.

I am curious how will the Government convince them to return.

Some will come back as in construction industry (skilled labour - electricians, carpenters etc) nowadays you can get about 1000$/month ... easily ...

in Poland its a disaster, we run restaurant but we cant find waitresses, cooks, salaries jumped so much recently, our eastern neighbors are hope for this situation, as Poles demand so much more, but it depends on Brussels, not us:(

[url]

A study ordered by the Agency for Government Strategies reveals that 1/3 Romanians in Italy want to return to Romania in the next 2 years.

I am curious how will the Government convince them to return.

maybe the italians will throw them out

May need to take Polish police example http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/worldnews.html?in_article_id=504532&in_page_id=1811

Nokia to offer workers from German plant new jobs in Romania - report

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::lol::lol::lol:

Sie comme nach Romania fur arbeit! :nuts::lol:



January 25, 2008: 05:36 AM EST


FRANKFURT, Jan. 25, 2008 (Thomson Financial delivered by Newstex) -- Nokia (NYSE:NOK) will be offering its workers currently based at its German plant in Bochum -- which the company plans to close down -- the opportunity to work in Romania, where the new production site would be relocated, instead, according to Rheinische Post newspaper, citing company sources.

The article said the trade union IG Metall is not aware that such a plan exists, but that it will discuss with members possible further steps they would take in order to keep the plant in Bochum.

It said also that Nokia executives plan to meet next week with representatives of the trade union and politicians in order to discuss a socially acceptable redundancy package for workers.

Copyright Thomson Financial News Limited 2007. All rights reserved.

The copying, republication or redistribution of Thomson Financial News Content, including by framing or similar means, is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Thomson Financial News.

Nokia to offer workers from German plant new jobs in Romania - report

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::lol::lol::lol:

Sie comme nach Romania fur arbeit! :nuts::lol:



January 25, 2008: 05:36 AM EST


FRANKFURT, Jan. 25, 2008 (Thomson Financial delivered by Newstex) -- Nokia (NYSE:NOK) will be offering its workers currently based at its German plant in Bochum -- which the company plans to close down -- the opportunity to work in Romania, where the new production site would be relocated, instead, according to Rheinische Post newspaper, citing company sources.

The article said the trade union IG Metall is not aware that such a plan exists, but that it will discuss with members possible further steps they would take in order to keep the plant in Bochum.

It said also that Nokia executives plan to meet next week with representatives of the trade union and politicians in order to discuss a socially acceptable redundancy package for workers.

Copyright Thomson Financial News Limited 2007. All rights reserved.

The copying, republication or redistribution of Thomson Financial News Content, including by framing or similar means, is expressly prohibited without the prior written consent of Thomson Financial News.

This is a serious infringement on the Romanian workers right to work. Germans should be refused the green card for working in Romania. We feel our jobs at peril. They come at lower salaries! :lol:

Poland eases labor market access for East Europeans
Posted: 2008/01/30
From: Mathaba

Poland has removed bureaucratic hurdles for workers from the Ukraine, Belarus and Russia.

The Polish Labor Ministry announced that citizens from those three eastern neighboring countries can work in Poland without a permit, effective February

Up to now, workers from the Ukraine, Belarus and Russia were forced to leave Poland after three months and were only allowed to resume work in that country following a three-month break.

More than one million Poles have left the country since 1994 in search for jobs.

Polish unemployment rate hovers around 11 percent, up three percent from the European Union average.

According to Deutsche Bank Polska chief economist, Arkadiusz Krzesniak, Poland's entry into the EU was "extremely beneficial for trade."

The East European country is the growth leader in the region and is expected to remain among the fastest growing in the world this year, he added.

Poland has pursued economic liberalization since the 1990s with mixed results.

The privatization of small and medium state-owned companies and a liberal law on establishing new firms has encouraged the development of the private business sector, which has been the main drive for Poland's economic growth.

The agricultural sector remains yet handicapped by deep structural problems, surplus labor, inefficient small farms, and a lack of investments. --IRNA
http://mathaba.net/news/?x=580049

:cheers:

^^ Romania should do the same for Moldova ... ^^ but they still need visa to enter Poland, don't they?

The hotel and restaurant association of Sunny Beach will hire more than 5000 Bulgarians from Moldova for 2008 summer season. There are many new opened hotels but not enough staff.:ohno:

http://mathaba.net/news/?x=580049

:cheers:

Does this mean that everyone from Belarus, Ukraine and Russia that can get a job in Poland are allowed in? They can simply go on a tourist visa and apply for jobs?

^^ Romania should do the same for Moldova ... ^^ but they still need visa to enter Poland, don't they?

Yes, they need visa unfortunately, that's Schengen zone rules. But there are two kind of visas, one for only Poland and another for the whole Schengen zone. The one for Poland only is much cheaper and more accessible and there are plans to liberalise it even further.

Does this mean that everyone from Belarus, Ukraine and Russia that can get a job in Poland are allowed in? They can simply go on a tourist visa and apply for jobs?

Yes, they just need to find themselves a job and that's it.

Yes, they just need to find themselves a job and that's it.

This is a very radical step, no? Don't you think there will be a tsunami of Ukrainians going to Poland now? I mean, what is the median wage of a plumber, construction worker or waitress in Poland compared to Ukraine?

^^ Romania should do the same for Moldova ... ^^ but they still need visa to enter Poland, don't they?

As of this moment, only 100.000 out of approximately 1.000.000 official requests for Romanian citizenship from Moldovans have been aproved by the Romanian Ministry of Justice.

I do not understand the arguments of EU requirements for visa for Moldovan citizens, since now Poland can employ Ukraininan and Belorussian citizens without a visa. :ohno:

I think it'd be so easy for construction, tourism, retail or textile companies to hire thousands of moldovans, since the salary in Romania is at least 4 times higher than in Moldova, and they would not have to travel for thousands of km to get back home, but only cross the border a few hundreds of km away. :dunno:

Why is Moldova so desperately poor? Was it such a huge gap between Moldova and Romania during the Soviet era as well?

Why is Moldova so desperately poor? Was it such a huge gap between Moldova and Romania during the Soviet era as well?

Moldova was reacher than Romania during Soviet times, it had a better managed economy in the USSR. In Romania, especialy in the 80's exported a lot of food to pay the loans taken in the 60's and 70' and there were huge shortages of food. I remember people were looking at Bulgaria for example, as a far developed country, because people there could buy foodstuff that we could not find in our stores.

However, Moldova after the collapse of communism did not develop its economy because it turned East and towards communism. I think this is the simplest and most comprehensive answer and does not need further details.

In order for Moldova to develop its economy (it was the only country in EE to drop its industrial output in 2007), it needs to change its leadership and strategic orientation to the west (EU and NATO), and, of course, get rid of Transnistria.

I remember people were looking at Bulgaria for example, as a far developed country, because people there could buy foodstuff that we could not find in our stores.

Actually, the wave of the economical collapse in Romania from the late 80`s didn`t miss Bulgaria.The higher living standard in Bulgaria in comparison with most of the countries from the Eastern Block wasn`t result of good economy but of many loans in foreigns currencies.That`s why when the Eastern Block fall apart, Bulgaria lost it`s export markets and lost the source of foreign currencies.This made the government unable to continue paying off the foreign debt and therefore it decreed moratorium over the foreign debt.The result was that the country fall into political isolation and the level of living standard dropped dramatically.In 1995, as a result of the political isolation, the government found itself forced to start paying the debt again, however many of the Bulgarian plants, based on the centrally planned economy, bakrupted because the communists used every single $ to pay off the debt.The economical crisis reached it`s peack at the end of 1996 and the cold winter additionally worsened the situation and many people were literally starving...Ofcourse the socialists(former communists) were forced to step back and since then the things are improving steadily.However the GDP per capita didn`t reach the levels from 1989 until 2004:bash:We lost two decades of develpment due to the incompetence of the communists:bash::bash::bash:Even with an average growth rate of 3%(quite conservative), today we would have nearly twice higher GDP:bash:
edit:I checked and BGRS is right.:cheers:It`s 2004, not 2006.But judging by the fact that the recession started in 1985 the lost period is still almost 2 decades.

^^ 2004.

Actually, the wave of the economical collapse in Romania from the late 80`s didn`t miss Bulgaria.The higher living standard in Bulgaria in comparison with most of the countries from the Eastern Block wasn`t result of good economy but of many loans in foreigns currencies.That`s why when the Eastern Block fall apart, Bulgaria lost it`s export markets and lost the source of foreign currencies.This made the government unable to continue paying off the foreign debt and therefore it decreed moratorium over the foreign debt.The result was that the country fall into political isolation and the level of living standard dropped dramatically.In 1995, as a result of the political isolation, the government found itself forced to start paying the debt again, however many of the Bulgarian plants, based on the centrally planned economy, bakrupted because the communists used every single $ to pay off the debt.The economical crisis reached it`s peack at the end of 1996 and the cold winter additionally worsened the situation and many people were literally starving...Ofcourse the socialists(former communists) were forced to step back and since then the things are improving steadily.However the GDP per capita didn`t reach the levels from 1989 until 2004:bash:We lost two decades of develpment due to the incompetence of the communists:bash::bash::bash:Even with an average growth rate of 3%(quite conservative), today we would have nearly twice higher GDP:bash:
edit:I checked and BGRS is right.:cheers:It`s 2004, not 2006.But judging by the fact that the recession started in 1985 the lost period is still almost 2 decades.

^^ BTW, I also remember I received a bottle of Schweppes from a friend who went to Bulgaria just before the collapse of communism. I was really indebted to the guy for making me that favour. It was something I had never experienced before. :nuts:

Holy shit! Did you know that we didn't have Schweppes during most of the 90s? I can now understand some communist-nostalgics :)

Holy shit! Did you know that we didn't have Schweppes during most of the 90s? I can now understand some communist-nostalgics :)

We didn't have it either until after 2000. Now, it's like a common soft drink in every store. And I hardly ever buy it! :bash::lol:

I like G&T during the summer so I must be a part-time customer :D They have some nice ads too :)

Anyway, nothing can beat a nice G&T with a piece of lemon and some ice cubes at your terrace after a hard day's work at 30-40 degrees temperature outside! It's soooo relaxing :)

I like G&T during the summer so I must be a part-time customer :D They have some nice ads too :)

Anyway, nothing can beat a nice G&T with a piece of lemon and some ice cubes at your terrace after a hard day's work at 30-40 degrees temperature outside! It's soooo relaxing :)

What is G&T?

^^ Gin & Tonic

^^ Gin & Tonic

Ah, OK, you can pretty much make that combination at home too: gin + tonic water + some ice cubes and a slice of lemon. :booze:

Yes, I'm mixing it at home :) Sorry, "terrace" and "balcony" are synonims in Bulgarian, my mistake :)

^^ BTW, I also remember I received a bottle of Schweppes from a friend who went to Bulgaria just before the collapse of communism. I was really indebted to the guy for making me that favour. It was something I had never experienced before. :nuts:

^^ I was a kid in 5th class of the elementary school when i passed through Romania with my family in September 1989 ... months before the changes started to happen.
I know what you are talking about. We had a big pack full of candies and i was throwing them through the window at many kids who were waving around the road... Anywhere we stopped, when seeing our registration number people came and were asking to buy whatever we could want to sell , from the clothes on our backs to the benzin in the car tank, anything ... And at each kilometer along the road a propaganda poster of Chausescu or the romanian kom party ...

Romania really looked worst than all the other east block states that i have seen at my first trip outside Bulgaria. DDR was just a shop window for the westerners to look at. Czechoslovakia was fine , but better of all the others were the Hungarians :) It was in Kechkemet when i first saw a 1l. bottle of Pepsi .... something I had never experienced before .. like you with the Schweppes ... :)

Anyways i believe it is amazing how much Romania have changed since than. I am planning a trip this spring to the Bucurest IKEA shop , and just can't wait to see all this with my own eyes . :cheers:

Holy shit! Did you know that we didn't have Schweppes during most of the 90s? I can now understand some communist-nostalgics :)
We didn't have it either until after 2000. Now, it's like a common soft drink in every store. And I hardly ever buy it! :bash::lol:

Really? No Schweppes? I hate it btw (except in gin&tonic), but I know my parents love it. They still keep cases of empty glass bottles from the eighties or something in their basement.

Anyways i believe it is amazing how much Romania have changed since than. I am planning a trip this spring to the Bucurest IKEA shop , and just can't wait to see all this with my own eyes . :cheers:

Plan yourself at least a 2 hour trip inside the store because it is huge...it is about 2 times larger than the largest Carrefour hypermarket. And get some food in the store. It has both a nice restaurant and a fast food area, with very good prices. For example, in the fast-food area, a hot-dog and a cup of Pepsi costs about 0.5 EURO. And you can refill the cup as many times you want without paying for the refills. :cheers:

Plan yourself at least a 2 hour trip inside the store because it is huge...it is about 2 times larger than the largest Carrefour hypermarket. And get some food in the store. It has both a nice restaurant and a fast food area, with very good prices. For example, in the fast-food area, a hot-dog and a cup of Pepsi costs about 0.5 EURO. And you can refill the cup as many times you want without paying for the refills. :cheers:

^^ Thanks ! :okay: Some friends from Greece already adviced me to take a good look in the online catalog first and to choose whatever i wanna buy from there ... as if i have to stroll all over the store and observe each product in details there I will need more than a day. :nuts:

This is a very radical step, no? Don't you think there will be a tsunami of Ukrainians going to Poland now? I mean, what is the median wage of a plumber, construction worker or waitress in Poland compared to Ukraine?

Yes, now the entire 46 million of us will move to Poland to work as plumbers :okay:

Originally Posted by Adams3
This is a very radical step, no? Don't you think there will be a tsunami of Ukrainians going to Poland now? I mean, what is the median wage of a plumber, construction worker or waitress in Poland compared to Ukraine?

Yes, now the entire 46 million of us will move to Poland to work as plumbers :okay:

I sense there the issue of the Ukrainian plumber in Poland. :lol:

Plan yourself at least a 2 hour trip inside the store because it is huge...it is about 2 times larger than the largest Carrefour hypermarket. And get some food in the store. It has both a nice restaurant and a fast food area, with very good prices. For example, in the fast-food area, a hot-dog and a cup of Pepsi costs about 0.5 EURO. And you can refill the cup as many times you want without paying for the refills. :cheers:


I don't know whether I should laugh or cry.

I don't know whether I should laugh or cry.

Whatever you feel like doing. :cheers:

I like G&T during the summer so I must be a part-time customer :D They have some nice ads too :)

Anyway, nothing can beat a nice G&T with a piece of lemon and some ice cubes at your terrace after a hard day's work at 30-40 degrees temperature outside! It's soooo relaxing :)

JD "with a piece of lemon and some ice cubes" and coke ... beats it :cheers:

Moldova was reacher than Romania during Soviet times

I remember my mom went on a trip to Chisinau and she bough me a bicycle from there. Romania wasn’t that poor (average salary was around 200$) but that was nothing to buy … nothing. And was very difficult to live the country. No wonder the foreigners were “mobbed” to sell everything they had with them … I can only imagine Turnovec’s face :lol: … “woow wild wild west here in RO” :doh:

I am planning a trip this spring to the Bucurest IKEA shop , and just can't wait to see all this with my own eyes . :cheers:

Ever been to Romania before?
BTW Baneasa mall near IKEA may be finished by spring
^^ http://img148.imageshack.us/img148/9885/1021590hp3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

^^What are the red "big box" stores? I am not sure I can recognize them.

When I was a kid I went to Romania and sold two master boxes of BT cigarettes and 3 pounds of coffee to an old gypsy woman. My first market economy experience. :):):)

^^ Carrefour, Bricostore, Mobexpert and some other stuff ...
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=13510672&postcount=117

Romania facing labour crisis
http://ukpress.google.com/

Romania is on the verge of a jobs crisis because between 1.2 and 2 million people have left the country to work abroad.
And the crisis could deepen in the next two years because fewer youngsters will finish their schooling, the country's labour minister, Paul Pacuraru, said.
The shortage in graduates is a result of the low birth rate in the early 1990s.
Mr Pacuraru said that the Romanian government should take emergency measures to prevent the crisis.
The measures should improve the social welfare system, stimulate the birth rate and offer job opportunities to people over 50, he said.
He urged the country to make every effort to employ Romanians before bringing in workers from Asia or Africa.
One of the first steps will be to organise a job fair in Italy in June, where employers who face a lack of qualified workers will try to lure thousands of Romanians back, offering them well-paid jobs at home.

Romania has an unemployment rate of 4.1%, its lowest since 1992.

In November, Economy Minister Varujan Vosganian estimated that Romania needed 500,000 more workers, especially in construction, heavy industry and car manufacturing.

Bulgaria plans to "import" thousands of foreign workers for the construction of the pipelines and NPP Belene. Energetics and tourism are the sectors with great workforce deficit and Bulgaria is planning to grant work permits to foreign workers. According to Maslarova (the social&employment minister), many foreigners already work here, mostly from Macedonia and Turkey.

Targeted countries are neighbouring ones, Ukraine, Moldova, Vietnam, India, Egypt.

Work permits will be valid for Bulgaria only, not for the EU.

България планира да внесе хиляди квалифицирани работници за строежа на големите международни тръбопроводи и за АЕЦ "Белене", заради острия недостиг в страната, съобщи социалният министър Емилия Масларова. "Говорим за десетки хиляди работници предимно в строителството, енергетиката и туризма", обяснява тя в интервю за Ройтерс.

"И без това внасяме работници, но сега се задават големи инфраструктурни проекти с огромни чуждестранни инвестиции и това ни принуждава да ускорим процеса", допълва тя. Ройтерс припомня, че чужденци предимно от Турция и Македония вече пълнят дупки по българските пътища и строят хотели и молове, но още от догодина трябва да започне работата по ядрената централа за 4 млрд. евро, а три транзитни тръбопровода за още милиарди са на хоризонта.

Според Масларова бързо се изчерпват незаетите квалификациран икадри и в групата на безработните остават само необразовани е необучени хора. Безработицата е под 7%, населението се топи, а емиграцията към Западна Европа и Северна Америка продължава, посочва Ройтерс.

Предстои уточняване с работодателите на подробен петгодишен план от какво точно имат нужда и в кои райони на страната да бъдат насочени чужденците, казва Масларова. Тя посочва, че първо ще бъдат привличани работници от съседните държави, Украйна и Молдова, но също и от Виетнам, Индия и Египет.

Министърът отхвърля опасенията, че чужденците може веднага да се прехвърлят в по-богатите държави от ЕС. Според нея разрешителните им ще важат само за България, където те щели да останат и заради ниските цени на стоките.

Bulgaria plans to "import" thousands of foreign workers for the construction of the pipelines and NPP Belene. Energetics and tourism are the sectors with great workforce deficit and Bulgaria is planning to grant work permits to foreign workers. According to Maslarova (the social&employment minister), many foreigners already work here, mostly from Macedonia and Turkey.

Targeted countries are neighbouring ones, Ukraine, Moldova, Vietnam, India, Egypt.

Work permits will be valid for Bulgaria only, not for the EU.
In spite of my rightist political beliefs, after reading the artical, now I realise how big was Kostov`s mistake to disband the construction forces.We`ll have to import foreigners and to pay them for doing what the soldiers could do absolutely free.The unnecesarrily big army of 45,000 active troops, 95%+ of whom men, would cover all demands for workers in the construction sector.Furthermore, we still have more than 200,000 jobless people and artificially employment in the public sector with many SUPERFLUOUS servants.

Lol. If there is one place Ukrainian workers aren't going to it's Romania. If it has to be anywhere then it's Poland, or Western Europe.

Or Russia :colgate: we even have a joke about that.

so, fox, wolf and bear are meeting after long and cold winter and they are discussing how they spent it.

Fox:"damn... i spent my first month in a hen house. I ate 1 chicken per day and everything was cool, but in the end of the month owner have counted all hens, found out that somebody is eating them, found me and fucked me up pretty bad... almost got killed..."

Wolf:" I've spent my first months in a hut with sheeps. I ate 1 sheep every 2 days and everything was cool, but in the end of the months owner have counted all sheeps, found out that somebody is eating them, found me and fucked me up pretty bad... almost got killed..."

Fat and all happy bear:"And i spent my winter on a construction sites"

Fox and woulf:"and what did you eat?"

Bear:"Ukrainians... nobody is counting them there..."

The Ministry of Labour in Romania is to organize a construction workers fair in Rome, Italy, on February 23rd, whereby Romanians working in Italy and Romanian construction company can meet. The ministry wants to attract Romanian construction workers back to the Romanian market.


Ministerul Muncii, Familiei şi Egalităţii de Şanse şi Agenţia Naţională pentru Ocuparea Forţei de Muncă organizează BURSA LOCURILOR DE MUNCĂ PENTRU ROMÂNI.

Evenimentul se va desfăşura in data de 23 februarie 2008, la Roma, sediul Centrului pentru Migraţie, Azil şi Integrare Socială, Via Assisi nr.41.

Scopul acestei actiuni este de a facilita intalnirea directă a angajatorilor de pe teritoriul României cu lucrătorii români care îşi desfăşoară activitatea în Italia, în domeniul construcţiilor.

Agenţii economici interesaţi să participe la această Bursă se pot adresa pentru informaţii suplimentare Ministerului Muncii, Familiei şi Egalităţii de Şanse, Direcţia Management şi Mobilitatea Forţei de Muncă, persoane de contact Mihaela Matei sau Liliana Stănculescu.

The first 60 Vietnamese textile workers come to Bulgaria in May

160.000 Bulgarians work in the textile&clothing sector. The official average salary in the sector rose up 17% in 2007.

Първите 60 виетнамски работници, които ще попълнят липсващите кадри в българската текстилна и шивашка индустрия, се очаква да пристигнат през май, заяви председателят на Българската асоциация на производителите и износителите на облекло и текстил Валерия Жекова, предаде БНР.

Тя участва в кръгла маса на тема "Бизнес възможности в текстилната промишленост и производството на облекла в страните от ЦЕИ". През първата половина на миналата година с 2,5 на сто е намалял броят на заетите в текстилната и в шивашката индустрия, посочи Жекова. В сектора работят около 160 000 души.

Средната заплата в бранша се е увеличила за същия период с 17 на сто - до 265,5 лева. Това обаче не е реалната заплата, заради практиката работниците да се осигуряват върху по-ниски суми, каза Жекова.

Според данни на асоциацията реалната заплата в сектора достига до 450 лева, а в добре работещите предприятия - до 800-900 лева. Ръстът на заплатите е заради 20-процентния ръст на производителността на труда. Става дума обаче не толкова за увеличаване на ефективността, а за ръст на брутната принадена стойност, създавана от един работник, и за увеличаването на обемите на износа на добри цени, което сумарно формира ръста на производителността в страната, обясни Жекова.

През първата половина на 2007 г. един работник е създавал принадена стойност в размер 3930 лева. По неокончателни данни износът на български текстил и облекло за миналата година е в размер на 1,8 милиарда евро. 88,6 на сто от износа през миналата година са били за ЕС. Прогнозите за тази година са, че България ще запази експортния си потенциал. Може би ще има известно намаляване в количествата, но ще има увеличаване в стойностно изражение, каза Жекова.

More money form Romanians working abroad than all FDI

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/7672/trgl4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://www.romanialibera.ro/a117967/transferurile-romanilor-mai-mari-decat-investitiile-straine.html

Investitii straine directe = FDI
Transferuri = money form Romanians working abroad
mld Euro = billion Euro

The first 60 Vietnamese textile workers come to Bulgaria in May

160.000 Bulgarians work in the textile&clothing sector. The official average salary in the sector rose up 17% in 2007.

^^ Are these Vietnamese allowed to bring their families with them? And are there many more coming?

^^ Are these Vietnamese allowed to bring their families with them? And are there many more coming?

^^ Btw, after the war in Vietnam in 70-ies & 80-ies of the 20th century a lot of Vietnamese were sent to work and study in Bulgaria on some commie friendship and suport programms etc. There were formed vietnamese commie blocks and small villages in some of the towns in Bulgaria. Since the fall of the iron wall most of them went back to their home land , but some stayed ... I have a friend at my age who is a child of a vietnamese-bulgarian marriage - He is called Stefan Chinguen :)

Those guys were very efficent in the prevention of the reproduction of homeless dogs ... each town that had vietnameses living in it , had an enormous decrese in the number of street homeless dogs :lol::nuts:

^^ Are these Vietnamese allowed to bring their families with them? And are there many more coming?

I suppose no, at least till the strategy for import of workforce is ready, which most probably will happen in the middle of the year.

^^ Btw, after the war in Vietnam in 70-ies & 80-ies of the 20th century a lot of Vietnamese were sent to work and study in Bulgaria on some commie friendship and suport programms etc. There were formed vietnamese commie blocks and small villages in some of the towns in Bulgaria. Since the fall of the iron wall most of them went back to their home land , but some stayed ... I have a friend at my age who is a child of a vietnamese-bulgarian marriage - He is called Stefan Chinguen :)

Those guys were very efficent in the prevention of the reproduction of homeless dogs ... each town that had vietnameses living in it , had an enormous decrese in the number of street homeless dogs :lol::nuts:

Great stories Turnovec! :)

I think every Eastern European country has Vietnamese as one of the absolute biggest immigrant groups as a result of that commie friendship program you're talking about :lol: But they are cool, gotta love the Vietnamese. :) 60 people doesn't cut it in the long run, since intermarriage is happening (is Stefan doing good? j/k) more people can be flown in, especially to prevent the population from falling like it has predicted to do.

More money form Romanians working abroad than all FDI

http://img172.imageshack.us/img172/7672/trgl4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://www.romanialibera.ro/a117967/transferurile-romanilor-mai-mari-decat-investitiile-straine.html

Investitii straine directe = FDI
Transferuri = money form Romanians working abroad
mld Euro = billion Euro

That's very good. I consider remittances sent from abroad back home better than FDI now, because the FDI does not directly affect people, as much as remittances do. Good stuff.

^^ Indeed ... I suppose this is what keeps most EE countries (families/citizens) afloat … and adds to real GDP/PPP/dick measuring smth that WE does not have

In fact, some Bulgarians didn't like the Vietnamese (and vice-versa), which to some extend proves the theory that many Bulgarians are indeed xenophobes. Thing is that when the communism was collapsing, some of those Asian dudes began dealing with crimes while the arising nazi-skinheads' enemies were the Vietnamese. I remember an old nazi punk about:

"zima, stud, bezumna nosht...vietnamsko obshtejitie. Narkomania, prostitucia, policeisko bezsilie...Van,van, gadnite jalturi, varvete si, prokleti drebosaci" (smth like that). Which translates to "cold night, a vietnamese dorm, drug addicts, prostitutes, helpless police. Go away f*cking yellow little men".

And there were some jokes about them like "Kakvo triabva da nauchi vseki vietnamec kogato otiva v druga strana? '2 tik-tak za 1 bau-bau'" which translates to:

"-What should a Vietnamese learn in the foreign language before going there?"
"- I give 2 watches, I take 1 dog, deal?"

And things like that. I wonder are we the same old racist idiots or those 18 years learned us to be more tolerant. Dunno.

BTW, I also had a Vietnamese-Bulgarian classmate back then.

http://www.thedailystar.net/story.php?nid=23894



Published On: 2008-02-18
Metropolitan
Romania to recruit more Bangladeshi RMG workers
Bss, Dhaka

Romania will recruit more Bangladeshi workers for its garment and textile industries.

Two executives, Antonello Gamba and Christina Curpanaru, of the Ware Company of Romania said this when they called on Foreign Affairs, and Expatriate Welfare and Overseas Employment Adviser Iftekhar Ahmed Chowdhury at his office yesterday.

After the meeting Iftekhar told reporters that after China, Bangladesh is the only country in Asia, which is exporting workers to Romania. He said the export of Bangladesh workers to Romania is very significant.

Adviser said Romania as a manpower importing market will help Bangladesh to find manpower markets in the East European countries. He said over 100 skilled garment workers have already left for Romania. Another 1,000 will get jobs there soon, he said.

Responding to questions after the meeting, Christina Curpanaru said Bangladeshi workers would get salaries as per pay structures of Romania.

Ministry of Expatriate Welfare and Overseas Employment Secretary Abdul Matin Chowdhury and Bureau of Manpower Employment and Training (BMET) Director General Abdul Malek were present during the meeting.

Bangladeshi immigrants are one of the worst integrated groups in Europe. The massive Bangladeshi oppression of women is a strong contributor.

Bangladeshi immigrants are one of the worst integrated groups in Europe. The massive Bangladeshi oppression of women is a strong contributor.

Yes, the government is stupid on this one :bash: I hope they will be sent back after finishing their job.

Romania government to organize job market for Romanians in Spain
http://english.hotnews.ro/stiri-business-2405000-romania-government-organize-job-market-for-romanians-spain.htm

Prime minister Calin Popescu-Tariceanu announced on Wednesday that the Government may organize a job "market" in Spain, in case the similar initiative in Italy works fine. The recruitment office for Romanians working in Italy will open on Saturday in Rome.

The office will offer jobs to workers who want to return home. Construction companies, entrepreneurs and Government officials will participate in the office opening. The new recruitment facility will offer some 7,500 jobs.

Last night I was looking through some pictures I made in Rome few years ago - loved that city:cheers:; and I was thinking who (Romanians) would want to go back to Romania and work for less money and live in underdeveloped/under-constructions (in comparison to Rome, Madrid etc) cities ?! Not to mention the villages majority of them come from ... :ohno:

Last night I was looking through some pictures I made in Rome few years ago - loved that city:cheers:; and I was thinking who (Romanians) would want to go back to Romania and work for less money and live in underdeveloped/under-constructions (in comparison to Rome, Madrid etc) cities ?! Not to mention the villages majority of them come from ... :ohno:

I think there are many Romanians in Italy and Rome who are not working there for more than 1000 EUR in different fields. I've heard that the construction companies in Romania are ready to pay them starting 500 EUR for the unskilled workers and up to 1000 EUR for the skilled ones. Already in cities like Bucharest, Cluj and Timisoara, construction workers get between 700-1000 EUR/month.

Last night I was looking through some pictures I made in Rome few years ago - loved that city:cheers:; and I was thinking who (Romanians) would want to go back to Romania and work for less money and live in underdeveloped/under-constructions (in comparison to Rome, Madrid etc) cities ?! Not to mention the villages majority of them come from ... :ohno:

Well... just because they live in a wonderful city, it doesn`t mean they all also have a wonderful life !

Well I personally know people who have worked in Spain in constructions and have now returned to Romania because they're starting to make more money here than the spanish would have paid them.

Majority (decent workers I mean) will never return ... they (on holiday) compare Romania with the countries they reside in; and as you can imagine, Romania will (always) be behind ...

Majority (decent workers I mean) will never return ... they (on holiday) compare Romania with the countries they reside in; and as you can imagine, Romania will (always) be behind ...

^^ Majority yes, will not return in the coming 7 years, but in the long run, you never know. I mean, the Italians and Spanish who went to work in Germany and France after WW2 did return after a while. :cheers:

I don't know what exactly what you understand through 'decent workers'. For example the people I've mentioned are highly skilled construction workers; I know this because I've seen their work first hand. So, if they came back, I don't see why on the long term more and more Romanians working abroad should not return home.

^^ Because they get used to higher standards ... not just a job and some bread/meat on the table; but a weekend in a beautiful country, decent transport, services, respect for who they are etc etc.

I don't know what exactly what you understand through 'decent workers'. For example the people I've mentioned are highly skilled construction workers; I know this because I've seen their work first hand. So, if they came back, I don't see why on the long term more and more Romanians working abroad should not return home.

When will they get paid 1500-2000 Euro in Romania?! This is what a skilled worker gets in Italy/Spain ...

Well they do make about 1000 per month now and I'm sure in a few years time they'll make even more. For some people it's not only about living in a 'beautiful country', but also about having all your family and friends close by.

wives and kids have joined them already ... I can assure you ...

One out of three Romanian immigrants in Italy plans to return to Romania in the next two years (http://www.transilvaniaexpres.ro/index.php?mod=articol&id_articol=73903). I'd say that all things considered it's not a bad number and I'm sure it will increase in the next few years.

same crap ... http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=572903

One out of three Romanian immigrants in Italy plans to return to Romania in the next two years (http://www.transilvaniaexpres.ro/index.php?mod=articol&id_articol=73903). I'd say that all things considered it's not a bad number and I'm sure it will increase in the next few years.


As salaries increase so will the number of immigrants that will return. Ireland is a great example for this...After the economy starter booing, Irish from all over the world return home and this after being gone for 20-30 years.

I think the final number will also depend on how the host countries (Italy and Spain mainly) will handle the issue. If they want the Romanian immigrants to stay and contribute to their economies rather than Romania's, we will have a "fight" on our hands.

^^ give me some facts / sources ... people say/dream they will return ... but in reality they do not

^^ give me some facts /sources ... people say/dream they will return ... but in reality they do not

Fact...My parents, after living in the US for about 20 years, are moving back to Romania this summer.

Not retirement :lol: :lol: :lol:

this is where we started the conversation ...

Romania government to organize job market for Romanians in Spain
http://english.hotnews.ro/stiri-business-2405000-romania-government-organize-job-market-for-romanians-spain.htm

Prime minister Calin Popescu-Tariceanu announced on Wednesday that the Government may organize a job "market" in Spain, in case the similar initiative in Italy works fine. The recruitment office for Romanians working in Italy will open on Saturday in Rome.

The office will offer jobs to workers who want to return home. Construction companies, entrepreneurs and Government officials will participate in the office opening. The new recruitment facility will offer some 7,500 jobs.

Not retirement :lol: :lol: :lol:

They are in their mid 50's...not that old yet.

Lol ^^ :cheers:
Well, most migrants say they will return one day ... but the earliest is 15-20 years. This was my point...

I think there are many Romanians in Italy and Rome who are not working there for more than 1000 EUR in different fields. I've heard that the construction companies in Romania are ready to pay them starting 500 EUR for the unskilled workers and up to 1000 EUR for the skilled ones. Already in cities like Bucharest, Cluj and Timisoara, construction workers get between 700-1000 EUR/month.

If they will earn let's say, 600 euros, and have to pay a rent of 300 euros like in Bucharest, they defenetly prefer to remain in Rome or Madrid. An unskilled work earn between 1000-1200 RON (~300 euro) so I would not be sa optimististic about their return. Most of them are from villages and will have to rent if they want to work in Bucharest, Cluj or Timisoara. Don't belive all is writen in the newspapers...

If they will earn let's say, 600 euros, and have to pay a rent of 300 euros like in Bucharest, they defenetly prefer to remain in Rome or Madrid. An unskilled work earn between 1000-1200 RON (~300 euro) so I would not be sa optimististic about their return. Most of them are from villages and will have to rent if they want to work in Bucharest, Cluj or Timisoara. Don't belive all is writen in the newspapers...

Workers who are brought in the big cities to work in construction are ussually offered at least free accomodation and transportation, if not meals also. I know some small !!construction companies in Bucharest who are offering 1.000 EUR/month to workers (the big construction companies are already offering them 800-1000 EUR/month). The reason is one cannot hold on workers unless they pay them that kind of money. And I also know one case of a BIG construction project in Bucharest which will be delayed by at least 6 months because the construction company did not pay the workers well and they left in big numbers, so the construction timeline had to be delayed significantly (with losses in the millions of EUR to the construction company).

One more example: a Portugese construction company has brought back from Portugal an entire team of Romanian workers paying them in Bucharest as much they paid them in Portugal!!!

http://www.ziuadecj.ro/action/article?ID=9283



Clujenii din Italia, momiţi cu 800 de euro lunar



AJOFM Cluj îşi propune să readucă în ţară 2.000 de muncitori în domeniul construcţiilor, cărora le promite salarii de 3.000 de lei.
Agenţia Judeţeană de Ocupare a Forţei de Muncă (AJOFM) Cluj estimează că va reuşi să convingă între o mie şi două mii de muncitori români din Italia să se întoarcă în ţară până la sfârşitul anului. Salariile cu care AJOFM încearcă să îi convingă pe muncitori să revină în ţară sunt de aproximativ 3.000 de lei lunar.

Directorul AJOFM Cluj, Daniel Don, a declarat ieri că va merge sâmbătă la Roma, unde se va organiza o bursă de locuri de muncă pentru românii din Italia. El va reprezenta 20 de agenţi economici din judeţ, care activează în domeniul construcţiilor. “Se merge la bursă pentru a se face cunoscută cetăţenilor români interesaţi în a se întoarce acasă oferta de locuri de muncă în judeţul Cluj.

Avem un deficit de forţă de muncă în judeţ de cinci mii de persoane”, a spus Don. Potrivit acestuia, în judeţ se derulează o serie de proiecte majore de infrastructură care au nevoie de forţă de muncă calificată, cum ar fi centurile de ocolire ale municipiului Cluj-Napoca, Autostrada Transilvania, autostrada urbană Cluj-Napoca - Dej, precum şi două mari cartiere de locuinţe în municipiul reşedinţă de judeţ.

“Este o forţă de muncă calificată în Italia. Ştim că au realizat lucrări importante acolo. Mergem să ne întâlnim cu ei şi pot să le ofer toate informaţiile privind nivelul de salarizare al firmelor de construcţii din Cluj şi condiţiile de muncă”, a explicat Don. Cele 20 de firme de construcţii pe care le va reprezenta oferă salarii care ajung până la 3.000 de lei net pe lună.

40.000 de “stranieri”

“Din primele estimări, solicitările muncitorilor români din Italia lor se referă la salarii cuprinse între 600 şi 800 de euro pe lună, iar ale cetăţenilor moldoveni, între 400 şi 500 de euro. Sunt foarte mari şanse să reuşim să convingem să se întoarcă acasă, în judeţul Cluj, între o mie şi două mii de muncitori”, a mai spus şeful AJOFM Cluj.

Potrivit lui Don, în evidenţele AJOFM Cluj figurează circa 40.000 de persoane care lucrează în străinătate. Don a precizat că are semnale din partea unor firme româneşti de construcţii din Italia, care au între 150 şi 2.000 de angajaţi, că ar dori să execute lucrări în subantrepriză în judeţul Cluj. Pe lângă şeful AJOFM Cluj, la bursa de la Roma vor participa, tot din partea judeţului Cluj, reprezentanţi ai companiei Bechtel.

Centru de milioane

AJOFM Cluj intenţionează, de asemenea, construirea unui centru de formare profesională, unde să fie obţinută calificarea în diverse meserii din domeniul construcţiilor, de către aproximativ o mie de persoane pe an. Daniel Don a declarat că este nevoie de un astfel de centru, datorită faptului că domeniul construcţiilor va avea mult timp o dinamică în creştere şi va fi nevoie de asigurarea, în permanenţă, pe piaţa muncii a forţei de muncă tânără şi bine pregătită.

“România are foarte mari perspective în construcţii şi de aceea trebuie să asigurăm o forţă de muncă calificată pe construcţii. ANOFM ne acordă întreg sprijinul în realizarea la Cluj a unui centru de formare profesională pe construcţii, după model italian”, a spus Don. Potrivit acestuia, realizarea centrului se va face prin finanţare de la Fondul de Dezvoltare Regională şi din fondurile structurale, urmând să se asigure infrastructura în ceea ce priveşte clădirea pentru centru şi fonduri pentru derularea activităţii.

“Estimările financiare pentru clădire sunt undeva la cinci milioane de euro, iar costurile cu formarea profesională se vor ridica la 1-2 milioane de euro pe an. Ar putea fi calificate anual 1.000 de persoane în toate meseriile din domeniul construcţiilor, în special al amenajărilor interioare”, a explicat directorul AJOFM Cluj.

El a mai spus că va fi nevoie ca Agen]ia să cumpere un teren de 5.000 de metri pătraţi pentru această investiţie.

Meserii noi

In cadrul centrului vor fi pregătite, printre altele, persoane în manevrarea de schele, meserie în care România nu a format oameni calificaţi. De asemenea, se urmăreşte şi modificarea nomenclatorului de meserii, prin introducerea meseriei de certificator termic al clădirilor, care va evalua clădirile înainte de vânzare.

Don a precizat că fondurile privind organizarea cursurilor în viitorul centru sunt ridicate pentru că li se vor asigura viitorilor cursanţi toate materialele de construcţii necesare cu care vor lucra exact ca pe un şantier.

“Le dăm faianţă şi gresie să monteze, le dăm ciment, iar ei vor învăţa cum se folosesc materialele”, a subliniat Daniel Don. Centrul ar putea fi dat în folosinţă în 2010.

Greu de convins

Românii care lucrează în străinătate nu vor fi deloc uşor de convins să abandoneze viaţa din Italia sau Spania în favoarea celei din ţara natală. Liviu Niculae locuieşte în Italia, în apropiere de Modena, şi lucrează în construcţii. “Nu m-aş întoarce să lucrez în România în constructii.

Munca e grea, lucrezi afară... Dacă nu eşti suficient motivat financiar, nu o faci, cauţi ceva mai uşor la aceiaşi bani. Aş veni dacă mai scad taxele, impozitele, dacă ar exista protecţie socială mai mare”, a afirmat Liviu, care câştigă, lunar, între 1.600 şi 1.700 de euro.

Plan visant à faire revenir les travailleurs en Roumanie
http://www.investir-roumanie.com/Plan-visant-a-faire-revenir-les-travailleurs-en-Roumanie,529395.html

Bucarest, 20 fév /Rompres/ - Le gouvernement a adopté ce mercredi un Plan de mesures visant à faire revenir en Roumanie les Roumains travaillant à l’étranger.

Selon le ministre du Travail, Paul Pacuraru, la mise en oeuvre de ce plan aura un impact particulier au plan social, en ce qui concerne la diminution des effets négatifs sur les enfants laissés en Roumanie, ainsi que du point de vue démographique.

Les mesures incluses dans cet acte législatif visent le maintien de la main d’oeuvre en Roumanie et la stimulation du retour des ressortissants roumains travaillant à l’étranger. Selon ce plan de mesures, à partir de décembre 2008 seront créées et actualisées périodiquement des bases de données sur les ressortissants roumains travaillant à l’étranger (le nombre des travailleurs roumains à l’étranger, les pays dans lesquels ils travaillent, les secteurs d’activité, les conditions de travail, les motifs de l’émigration).

Par ailleurs, des campagnes d’informations seront organisées sur les possibilités d’embauche en Roumanie et le recrutement de la main d’oeuvre pour les Roumains travaillant à l’étranger par l’organisation de bourses à l’emploi dans les zones où se trouvent des communautés importantes de Roumains.

Une première action concrète à cet égard sera l’organisation d’une bourse à l’emploi pour les Roumains de Rome, qui aura lieu le 23 février. Y participera aussi le ministre du Travail, de la Famille et de l’Égalité des Chances, Paul Pacuraru.

Dans le cadre de ce plan de mesures approuvé par le gouvernement, un système de stimulation sera réglementé visant le retour et la réintégration professionnelle des travailleurs roumains par l’octroi de facilités pour le développement des affaires sur leur propre compte, des programmes d’assistance destinés à l’adaptation et l’intégration/la réintégration des familles des travailleurs roumains revenues dans le pays, ainsi que la stimulation du rapatriement des travailleurs hautement qualifiés.

Les chantiers navals Daewoo, Mangalia veulent embaucher des ouvriers immigrés
http://www.investir-roumanie.com/Les-chantiers-navals-Daewoo-Mangalia-veulent-embaucher-des-ouvriers-immigres,4253.html?var_recherche=mangalia


Afin de pouvoir honorer leurs contrats qui s’élèvent à 1,1 milliard de dollars (environ 833 millions EUR), les chantiers navals Daewoo Mangalia (sud-est) ont besoin de 2 000 salariés supplémentaires d’ici la fin de l’année prochaine, outre le personnel actuel, soit un millier de personnes impliquées directement ou indirectement dans l’activité de la compagnie.

’’Nous ne trouvons pas des ingénieurs et des techniciens dans le pays et ceux qui s’y trouvent ont une faible formation. C’est pourquoi, nous sommes amenés à faire venir du personnel spécialisé de la République de Moldavie, la Bulgarie, l’Ukraine, l’Ouzbékistan, la Chine ou le Vietnam. Même s’ils remplissent tous les critères imposés par la loi, la finalisation des procédures en vue de leur cooptation dure deux à trois mois, une chose inacceptble’’, déclare Jae Bong Lee, directeur général de Daewoo Mangalia Heavy Industries (DMHI), cité lundi par Ziarul financiar.

Daewoo Mangalia a investi à ce jour un million d’euros dans cinq centres de formation, celui de Mangalia étant ouvert au mois de septembre, les autres devant être inaugurés à la fin de ce mois.

La compagnie veut construire, également, environ 500 appartements destinés aux ouvriers du chantier, l’investissement étant estimé à 15 millions de dollars (11,3 millions EUR). Les dix prochaines années, le nombre des nouveaux appartements pourrait s’élever à 2 000.

La direction investira cette année environ 38 millions de dollars (environ 28,7 millions EUR), surtout pour l’extension des capacités de production des navires, alors que des investissements pour 30 millions de dollars (environ 22,7 millions EUR) ont été prévus pour l’année prochaine.

Le principal objectif en matière d’investissements du chantier naval de Mangalia est la conversion du dock de réparations de navires dans un nouveau dock destiné aux constructions neuves. Selon les représentants de la compagnie, les réparations de navires ne comportent plus d’intérêt en raison du taux de plus en plus élevé de pollution et du profit réduit.

Pour ce nouveau projet, qui s’étend sur une année et demie environ, la compagnie a acheté un terrain de 11 hectares à Mangalia, le montant de l’investissement étant de 30 millions de dollars (environ 22,7 millions EUR).

Daewoo Mangalia Heavy Industries est contrôlé par le groupe sud-corréen Daewoo Shipbuilding & Marine Engineering Co, qui détient 51 pc des actions, les 49 pc restants étant dans la propriété de la société 2 Mai Mangalia, détenue par l’État roumain.

Business Standard
25 februarie 2008

Wage requirements of at least €1,000 per month demanded by Romanians working abroad to return to the country, could be met, provided their performance is high quality, say employer representatives interviewed by Business Standard.

During a job fair organized on Saturday in Rome for Romanian employees, some 700 people filed applications for employment with construction companies in Romania. Some 7,700 jobs, with salaries ranging from €400-€1,000, were available during the fair, according to Labor Minister Paul Pacuraru.

However, several workers visiting the fair said they would not return to Romania unless they are paid a monthly €1,300-€1,500. A further job fair is to be organized in the Italian city of Turin and similar events will take place in Spain, the Minister said. The fairs are an attempt by Romanian authorities to persuade workers abroad to return to the country, given that Romania is facing an increasingly severe shortage of both skilled and unskilled workers.

Employers are expecting that only skilled workers, for whom salary offers are above average, will return to Romania. “When an employee shows he or she can do good work, the salary can amount to €1,000-€1,2000, because employers are interested in quality workers,” said the First Vice President of Construction Company Employers Union, Marin Crutescu.

Qualified workers are also needed in the milling and bakery industry. The President of the employers union in the field, Rompan, Aurel Popescu, said he is to hold talks this week with employer representatives on conditions and salaries to be offered to workers abroad.

^^

Hundreds of Romanians show up at the job fair in Italy
23 Februarie 2008


More than 200 Romanians who work in Italy and want to return to their home country were present this morning at the job fair organized by the Romanian authorities in Rome. The event focuses especially on workers in constructions and it is managed by Romania's Ministry of Labor and the Labor Force Agency.

Seven companies which mostly come from Western Romania are offering 1,500 jobs in engineering both for skilled and unskilled workers. The Labor Force Agency also provides some 6,000 jobs in constructions, according to Cabinet secretary, Akos Derszi.

More Romanians are estimated to show up in the evening, Romanian Labor Minister Paul Pacuraru said, adding that the event has been successful so far. :lol:Pacuraru also mentioned that such fairs could be organized in Milan and Turin where the Romanian communities are larger as well as in Spain. The Romanian government plans to start a campaign to inform Romanians about not accepting work when not offered legal forms. The Romanian embassy will provide counseling on the matter.

Employers who came to lure Romanian workers back in the country generally offer salaries from 400 to more than 1,000 euros. :booze:Workers said they are not willing to return for less than 1,300-1,500 euros per month.

Some 17,000 Romanian workers are active in the constructions industry, in Italy's Lazio-Rome area.


Source: NewsIn

Romanian shipyards have orders from China worth of 4 billion EUR until 2012, and need 4.000 new employees, or risk not being able to fulfill the Chinese orders.

The Damen shipyard in Galati has already employed 60 Ukrainians, 20 Poles si 40 Bulgarians at the average wages of 900 EUR. Damen intends to hire another 100 Bulgarians to meet the labour demands of the shipyard.

The Constanta, Giurgiu and Mangalia shipyards are lobbying the Government to ease work visas for Chinese and Vietnamese workers.

Romania has recently become the 3rd world largest ship builder.


Business Standard
Santierele navale cer alte legi pentru importul de personal
26 februarie 2008

Managerii din domeniul constructiilor de nave ii cer premierului Calin Popescu Tariceanu sa simplifice procedurile de angajare a muncitorilor din afara Uniunii Europene, in caz contrar, multe dintre santiere riscand sa nu-si poata onora contractele angajate.

“Vom trimite o scrisoare atat catre premier, cat si catre ambasadele tarilor UE din care provin operatorii care controleaza santiere navale in Romania, adica Norvegia si Olanda. Vom informa asupra situatiei grave in care ne aflam si vom cere o schimbare a legislatiei, care sa ne permita sa aducem muncitori navalisti din afara Uniunii. Lucratorii romani migreaza spre santierele din Occident si, pe fondul cresterii volumului de comenzi la nivel mondial si national, santierele navale romanesti nu sunt in masura sa faca fata, pentru ca nu au personal corespunzator ca numar si ca productivitate”, a declarat pentru Business Standard, Gelu Stan, director general al santierului Damen Galati si liderul Asociatiei Nationale a Constructorilor de Nave, ANCONAV.

Concret, nivelul salarial al santierelor navale din Romania nu permite angajarea de muncitori care provin din tari membre UE. Daca doresc sa aduca lucratori din state non-UE, operatorii romani sunt obligati, prin legislatie, sa astepte 120 de zile pentru indeplinirea formalitatilor. “E inadmisibil ca se cere de catre autoritati ca santierul naval sa faca dovada ca nu are datorii catre stat ca sa obtina permis de munca pentru muncitori din afara UE. Este aproape imposibil ca un santier naval, ca specific al afacerii, sa figureze fara datorii intr-un anumit moment, chiar daca, pe termen lung, este o afacere profitabila. Noua ne trebuie muncitori acum, cand arde, nu peste cateva luni sau cativa ani! Legislatia nu este realista si trebuie schimbata de urgenta, pentru ca altfel nu ne vom putea onora comenzile intr-o perioada foarte buna pentru aceasta industrie si putem intra, in mod absurd, in colaps cu un domeniu care ar trebui sa mearga bine”, a explicat Gelu Stan. Desi lucreaza la capacitate maxima si au comenzi pana in 2010-2011, santierele navale din Romania au pierdut peste 4.000 de muncitori in intervalul 2006-2007.

In acest moment, la santierul naval din Galati, care numara 2.100 de angajati, lucreaza 60 de ucraineni, 20 de polonezi si 40 de bulgari. Conducerea Damen Galati, ca si santierele controlate de grupul norvegian Aker la Braila si Tulcea, intentioneaza sa aduca mana de lucru ieftina, din Vietnam, dar se loveste de problemele birocratice si legislative. Pe de alta parte, Santierul Naval Constanta face demersuri pentru aducerea a peste 200 de muncitori chinezi, confruntandu-se cu aceeasi problema a plecarilor masive de personal. Cei 40 de bulgari de la Damen Galati sunt platiti cu 50% mai mult decat muncitorii romani, ajungand la o medie salariala de 900 de euro. Au insa contract pe doar sase luni, in lipsa de alte variante, Damen dorind sa mai aduca, tot pe termen scurt, inca 100 de bulgari, pentru respectarea termenelor contractelor in curs. Migrarea fortei de munca a produs si un alt tip de pierdere santierului galatean, adauga directorul general. “Multi dintre cei 1.300 de oameni pe care i-am pierdut in ultimii doi ani nu au predat ce aveau pe inventar. Numai din aceasta cauza, am inregistrat o pierdere de un milion de euro”, dezvaluie Gelu Stan.

^^ Good news. BG and RO equals eternal love!

We're (have) entering a new era ...

41 illegal immigrants caught at Romania's border
BUCHAREST, Romania: Police detained 41 Indian immigrants who illegally entered Romania in an inflatable boat, authorities said Monday.
The immigrants — all male, aged 16 to 53 — were caught Saturday in northern Romania, where they had crossed the Tisza River from Ukraine, the border police said. Two guides who had been with them returned to Ukraine and escaped, police said.
Some of the immigrants were being treated at a hospital for exhaustion and hypothermia. The others were in immigration custody.
They have requested refugee status in Romania, police said.
Romania has increased border security and surveillance before the April 2-4 NATO summit in the country.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/03/10/news/EU-GEN-Romania-Indian-Immigrants.php

We're (have) entering a new era ...

41 illegal immigrants caught at Romania's border
BUCHAREST, Romania: Police detained 41 Indian immigrants who illegally entered Romania in an inflatable boat, authorities said Monday.
The immigrants — all male, aged 16 to 53 — were caught Saturday in northern Romania, where they had crossed the Tisza River from Ukraine, the border police said. Two guides who had been with them returned to Ukraine and escaped, police said.
Some of the immigrants were being treated at a hospital for exhaustion and hypothermia. The others were in immigration custody.
They have requested refugee status in Romania, police said.
Romania has increased border security and surveillance before the April 2-4 NATO summit in the country.

http://www.iht.com/articles/ap/2008/03/10/news/EU-GEN-Romania-Indian-Immigrants.php

The Indians will try again! They will persevere!

Business Standard
19 martie 2008

Romania’s employment deficit is up to some 100,000 workers, with half of that shortage in construction. To narrow this deficit, solutions are professional training and using workers from rural areas, while importing an extra-communitary workforce will be a last resort, according to Labor Minister Paul Pacuraru yesterday.

There are no precise estimates of the worker shortage, because all employers do not publish their vacancies. However, labor authorities say some 85,000-100,000 additional workers are needed in the Romanian economy.

However, only 24 financing human resource development applications were finalized, although 3,600 individuals and companies accessed the website for applications for the European Social Fund, Pacuraru told a human resource seminar.

The deadline for the applications is March 20.

“We do not know where they got stuck in the process of submitting their applications, as these are presently secret. We will only know after the deadline where they had difficulties and we will see what we can do about this,” Pacuraru added.

http://www.standard.ro/articol_35579/employment_shortage_up_to_100_000_workers.html

300.000 construction workers needed in Romania
http://www.evz.ro/articole/detalii-articol/796838/300000-construction-workers-needed-in-Romania/

The construction patronage says that over 300.000 jobs are available in the construction sites all over Romania. A qualified worker could earn a monthly wage of as much as 1.000 euros and an engineer could receive 2.000 euros.

Three of the largest recruitment portals in Romania have an over 3.300 job offers. Also, a recent study shows that the construction business has a net employment prevision of 54%, according to Manpower, a local recruitment company.

Chinese workers

The severe lack of workers has determined some companies to seek employees from other countries. Nicolae Bostina, manager of Consola Group, has decided to bring 40 workers from China and Sri Lanka, for a test period. “If they prove to be skillful we will bring 500 more men”, Bostina says.

Romanian workers don’t trust their employers

Still, there are some optimistic voices in the market. Some of the employers, who took part in the job fair organized by the Minister of Work in Rome, hope that Romanians will come back to work in their country.

“Many workers are calling us already. We have scheduled interviews with them by Easter time. I believe that after they try working for a month in Romania, they’ll decide to stay and call back many other workers from construction sites all over Europe. For now, they are distrustful”, says Calin Roman, manager of Selina, a construction company in Oradea. Seline currently needs 300 workers and 10 engineers.

The officials of Work Force Agencies from two other Romanian counties say that 3.500 workers are needed.

1.000 euros for a blacksmith

If they decide to comeback to Romania, workers could benefit from consistent salaries. That depends on their qualifications and their skills. “A blacksmith could have a salary of much as 1.000 euros” says Calin Roman. A young construction engineer, without any sort of experience, could earn as much as 600 to 700 euros. A project manager could get a “2.000 euros monthly payment, and even more, if he proves he deserves”, says Alexandra Oana, consultant of Von Consulting.

Changed vision

Wages are pretty good and the employers need some one that would take them. Because, as the patronage says, the best workers will have the highest wages, as it should be.

Yet, a perception issue is still a problem: the Romanian workers mentality. “I’ve been working just great with Romanians in Germany. When he came in Romania things changed. So, I asked him: ” «Haven’t you performed the same tasks there too?». And he didn’t reply”, says Adriana Iftime, the managing director of Construction Companies Patronage in Romania. “When they come back to Romania they get lazy because they say to themselves that the employer needs them and can’t have them fired”, Iftime added.

Offers

Unqualified workers, Bucharest, Capitol Construct Impex. Wage: 800-1.500 lei (215-400 euros) Tel: 0767.102.726

Draftsman engineer, Brasov, Mehexis. Wage: 1200 lei (320 euros) Tel: 0752.303.020

Plummer, Sibiu, Mario Construct. Wage: 1.200 lei (320 euros) Tel: 0269.244.880

Foreman, Bacau, Job Hunting Trade. Wage: 1.500 lei (400 euros) Tel: 0334.401.701

Painters,masons, carpenters, Bucharest, Alpaad 90 imob. Wage: 500 euros Tel: 0727.091.953

Companies like Bechtel, Selina, Bog’Art, Consola Grup, Holcim, Impact are also recruiting workers.

good news, but what about other jobs ( teachers, bus drivers) are the salaries there also rising?

We have deficiency of tourist workers so Bulgaria need from a lot of /cooks,animators,etc/.
Thats way a lot of workers from Moldova and Romania are coming to working here

We have deficiency of tourist workers so Bulgaria need from a lot of /cooks,animators,etc/.
Thats way a lot of workers from Moldova and Romania are coming to working here

As far as I know, the only Romanians who are coming this summer to work in Bulgaria are secutiry guards.Cooks, waiters, barmans, construction workers etc will be imported from Moldova, Ukraine and Macedonia.

IMO, the shortage of workforce in Bulgaria isn`t as serious as some politicians say.In fact there is no deficit of workforce but only deficit of cheap workforce.There were ~260,000 unemployed persons in February and the unemployment rate was more than 7%.
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc103/ivailotasev/unemp-feb08.gif

As far as I know, the only Romanians who are coming this summer to work in Bulgaria are secutiry guards.Cooks, waiters, barmans, construction workers etc will be imported from Moldova, Ukraine and Macedonia.

IMO, the shortage of workforce in Bulgaria isn`t as serious as some politicians say.In fact there is no deficit of workforce but only deficit of cheap workforce.There were ~260,000 unemployed persons in February and the unemployment rate was more than 7%.
http://i214.photobucket.com/albums/cc103/ivailotasev/unemp-feb08.gif

Yay, now all 46 million Ukrainians can go to Bulgaria to become cooks, waiters, barmen, and construction workers! :yes:

:hahano:

We have deficiency of tourist workers so Bulgaria need from a lot of /cooks,animators,etc/.
Thats way a lot of workers from Moldova and Romania are coming to working here

^^ That sounds a bit far fetched considering that Romania is going through a serious labour crisis and incomes in Romania are higher than in Bulgaria. The Romanian resorts at the Black Sea are already importing workers from Turkey, Albania, Moldova etc. I do not see why Romanians would go to work to Bulgaria. Do you have some official sources?

^^ Those Romanians are policemen and come to Bulgaria in according to some agreement between our and your ministers of interior. They are going to work together with the local policemen in resorts which are densely populated with Romanian tourists (northern BG - Balchik, Kavarna and Golden Sands I presume). Thus the communication problems between tourists and local police will be solved and the Romanian police will be able to take care of its tourists here as if they're in Romania.

^^ That sounds a bit far fetched considering that Romania is going through a serious labour crisis and incomes in Romania are higher than in Bulgaria. The Romanian resorts at the Black Sea are already importing workers from Turkey, Albania, Moldova etc. I do not see why Romanians would go to work to Bulgaria. Do you have some official sources?

^^ bgrs explained the situation well :) :cheers:

EDIT/ here (http://www.novinite.com/view_news.php?id=91342) is the news about it from a week ago .

It's a very good idea in order to standartize the prices for corrupted policemen. :lol:

^^ Those Romanians are policemen and come to Bulgaria in according to some agreement between our and your ministers of interior. They are going to work together with the local policemen in resorts which are densely populated with Romanian tourists (northern BG - Balchik, Kavarna and Golden Sands I presume). Thus the communication problems between tourists and local police will be solved and the Romanian police will be able to take care of its tourists here as if they're in Romania.

^^ Oh, yes. That I know. It's a joint Bulgaria-Romania programme. Good thing. I'd love to see some pictures of joint RO-BG police patrols. :cheers:

Yay, now all 46 million Ukrainians can go to Bulgaria to become cooks, waiters, barmen, and construction workers! :yes:

:hahano:

I didn`t say Ukrainians but just Ukraine because there is a Bulgarian minority in the region of Odesa:)The same is in force for Moldova.

^^ Those Romanians are policemen and come to Bulgaria in according to some agreement between our and your ministers of interior. They are going to work together with the local policemen in resorts which are densely populated with Romanian tourists (northern BG - Balchik, Kavarna and Golden Sands I presume). Thus the communication problems between tourists and local police will be solved and the Romanian police will be able to take care of its tourists here as if they're in Romania.


Evil doers the world over watch out...the Romanian and Bulgarian police have joined forces. :lol::lol:

^^ :D Corruption without borders :)

Asian workers sought for Daewoo shipyard in Romania

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=19235070&postcount=40

Novinite.com
7 April 2008, Monday


The Bulgarian Labor Minister Emiliya Maslarova is expected to restore the traditional social policy relations with Vietnam during her visit there.

Bulgaria will be short of 20 000 construction workers in 2008, and many Bulgarian construction firms are ready to hire laborers from Vietnam to fill up the shortage.

The news was announced Monday by the Deputy Chair of the Bulgarian Construction Chamber Ivan Boykov before the Bulgarian private Darik Radio. It comes at a moment when the Bulgarian Minister of Labor and Social Policy Emiliya Maslarova is on an official visit to the Socialist Republic of Vietnam that began on Monday, and will last until Saturday, April 12.

The Bulgarian and the Vietnamese delegations already discussed the draft of a memorandum for encouraging the cooperation in labor, social insurance, and social security between the governments of Bulgaria and Vietnam.

However, it does not include the question about the hiring of Vietnamese workers by Bulgarian firms the common rules of the EU do not allow the conducting of a separate labor policy by its individual members states.

Bulgarian companies do have the opportunity to hire Vietnamese workers through the legal procedure, which requires a permission by the Bulgarian State Agency for Employment, whose Executive Director Sotir Ushev is also in Hanoi as a member of the official delegation.

Representatives of the Employment Agency have announced that only one work permit to a Vietnamese citizen was issued in 2007, because there was only one applicant from Vietnam who wanted to work in Bulgaria.

In 2008, however, there have already been petitions for work permits for 29 Vietnamese bricklayers by the factory of Orgachim in the city of Ruse, and for 32 welders from Vietnam by the Ruse Shipyard.

Some half a million Vietnamese out of the total 85 million population work abroad in 40 different countries but mainly in Japan, South Korea, Thailand, Malaysia, and the Middle East. In 2007 75 000 laborers went to work abroad.

For the last 16 years, the Vietnamese workers abroad have transferred some USD 23 M to their home country. The country has a total work force of 43 million people, with 1,5 million entering the labor market each year.

The visit of the Bulgarian Labor Minister Emiliya Maslarova is expected to renew the labor and social policy relations between Bulgaria and Vietnam that were terminated 18 years after the break up of the former Soviet Block.

The crazy thing is that in this small town the number of work places is higher than the number of the entire town population (about 10.000 people).




Ziarul Financiar
09/04/2008

Fabricile de la Curtici fac angajari in Ungaria
Autor: Stefana Mladin, ZF Transilvania
Data: 09 Apr 2008


Orasul aradean Curtici se confrunta cu un deficit acut de forta de munca, mai multi investitori straini din Zona Libera anuntandu-si intentia de a face recrutari de personal in Ungaria.

Dupa ce in orasul aradean au fost construite in ultimii ani opt fabrici mari care totalizeaza investitii de peste 300 de mil. euro, numarul angajatilor a ajuns sa depaseasca populatia activa a localitatii.

"Suntem in situatia paradoxala in care avem in jur de 8.000 de angajati, mai multi decat totatul populatiei active a orasului. Pana la finele anului, in premiera, muncitorii vor fi mai multi decat numarul localnicilor", a declarat ieri Nicolae.

Business Standard
11/04/2008



Five-star hotels considering importing personnel

Bucharest five-star hotels are constantly searching for employees, because of the high personnel turnover, up to 30 percent. To cope with the deficit of skilled workers in luxury hotels, companies are considering importing personnel.

“Everywhere in the EU, in five-star hotels, immigrants make up at least 40 percent of hotel staff. In Romanian luxury hotels, only one percent of employees are foreigners. More relaxed visa conditions are needed to import a labor force,” according to InterContinental hotel’s Human Resources Manager, Emil Jascau.

In an attempt to increase the number of foreign workers, hotel companies focus on countries with lower salaries, such as Moldova, Ukraine, Belarus, China, India, Pakistan, Malaysia, and the Philippines.

The shortage in the labor force widened in recent years due to the emigration of skilled workers. “Five percent of Carol Park Hotel personnel have gone abroad. Romanians have no problem emigrating, but it is difficult to employ people from abroad,” said the hotel’s CEO, Sylvia Petre.

According to HR specialists, Romanians will have increasingly more opportunities to work abroad. “The problem will become more critical and the crisis will peak in the coming years,” Jascau said.

According to JW Marriott Bucharest Grand Hotel’s HR Manager, Camelia Buburuz, another cause of the personnel shortage is the decision of hotel employees to migrate to other industries. Jascau agrees that salaries in the hotel industry are lower than average wages in other industries. According to Sylvia Petre, entry level salaries for Carol Parc Hotel employees amount to €300 per month.

Foreigners could make up 30 percent of country by 2050

Workers needed to keep economy growing

April 9th, 2008 issue

(Updated April 14, 2008) Foreigners will make up 7.5 percent of the Czech population by 2020 and 30 percent by 2050, according to a study by demographers at Charles University, Hospodářské noviny reported Monday.

A plan being discussed by government and business officials to give qualified foreign workers green cards would make the Czech Republic one of the most open countries in Europe, according to Dušan Drbohlav, who led the research. Facing a shortage of qualified workers, big companies such as IBM are already scrambling to find workers from other countries.

Drbohlav said that most immigrants to the Czech Republic in the future will come from countries of the former Soviet Union, Vietnam and China.

http://www.praguepost.com/articles/2008/04/09/foreigners-could-make-up-30-percent-of-country-by-2050.php

200 filipinese female wokers have arrived yesterday in Romania. They will work in the Steilmann clothing factory in Sibiu for 400 EUR/month.

http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/294/filipemq5.jpg (http://imageshack.us)


PRO TV
http://www.protv.ro/stiri/social/filipinezele-sunt-asteptate-sa-munceasca-in-fabricile-din-romania.html

200 de filipineze vor începe curând lucrul la Sibiu. Pentru 400 de euro pe lună, ele vor croi haine bărbăteşti care vor fi exportate apoi în Europa de Vest.

Patronul fabricii de confecţii a fost nevoit să aducă muncitoare din Filipine şi să le plătească salariu dublu faţă de ce se întâmplă pe piaţa muncii din România, pentru că femeile care lucrau în domeniu au plecat la rândul lor la muncă în străinătate.

Pentru cele 200 de filipineze care vor lucra la Sibiu au fost amenajate dormitoare şi săli de baie în incinta fabricii. Muncitoarele asiatice urmau să-şi înceapă activitatea la începutul anului. Încheiarea contractelor durează însă foarte mult, astfel încât cele 200 de filipineze îşi vor face apariţia probabil în următoarele săptămâni.

Haha, you say what you want but I like those asian girls :D Ofc not including those from the photo above :D

Ziarul Financiar
24 Apr 2008


Romania faces biggest labour shortage in the world, Manpower survey says



Romanian employers are facing the most significant shortage of labour in the world, reveals a survey by Manpower, the biggest global personnel leasing company, which analysed 32 countries. The local labour market is the global hotspot this year in terms of labour shortages, after 73% of companies stated that they were unable to find any skilled personnel for the positions they offer.

Romania, which was included in the Manpower survey for the first time, is now faced with the most pessimistic situation in terms of personnel shortage, which is even more serious considering almost half of the companies on the domestic market (43%) intend to hire more people over the coming period.

"The shortage of skills needs to be correlated
with the need for people. In terms of hiring plans we are number one in the EMEA (Europe, Middle East and Africa) region and number two in the world. When the need for more people increases, it becomes more difficult to find specialised people for the respective jobs," says Camelia Stanculescu, general manager of Manpower Romania.

Next in the ranking, ten percent behind, is Japan where 63% of employers say they are having trouble finding people, followed by Hong Kong - 61%, Singapore - 57% and Australia - 52%.

Almost one third of the employers in the world (31%) have trouble finding suitable candidates for their vacancies, but the good news is that this percentage is down almost 10% from last year. The most sought after employees on the domestic market are engineers, skilled workers and managers.

Engineers' salaries reached as much as over 1,000 euros a month over the last few years, and in certain fields, such as IT&C they may go up to as much as 2,500 euros. In terms of top management, a CEO of a multinational makes at least 10,000 euros per month.

As for skilled construction workers, they may earn up to 1,000 euros on Bucharest's construction sites. The shortage of personnel on the Romanian market has caused one of the highest increases in salaries in recent years, with the average growth on the entire market put at 25-30%.

"Salary raises will probably be in line with the performance and productivity of employees this year," Stanculescu says.

"We are at the beginning of the workforce deficit, at which time both the behaviour of employers and of employees changes. Yet such changes cannot happen really soon, especially since Romania comes after a time when we had workforce surplus," Stanculescu explains. The high personnel deficit on the domestic market can be explained by the fact that employers have been faced with the serious migration of workers over the last few years. Romania has been a real "nursery" of skills for companies abroad in various fields affected by shortages, and has provided engineers, workers and hospitality industry personnel for a long time, Stanescu explains.

Moreover, certain specialties have been dropped by the education system over the last few years and the young people's interest in engineering and crafts has waned.


Source:http://www.zf.ro/articol_170053/roma...rvey_says.html

:cheers: Zenden

That's absolutely terrible.

Yes, it's as bad as it can get. However, I hope some of these companies which are in a crisis for workers to be convinced to pay more for the Romanian workers abroad. A few tens of thousand of Romanian workers in Spain and UK are bound to find themselves jobless because of the credit crunch. Hopefully, they will come back. :cheers:

In the meanwhile, more foreign workers are brought in. :ohno:

Yes, it's as bad as it can get. However, I hope some of these companies which are in a crisis for workers to be convinced to pay more for the Romanian workers abroad. A few tens of thousand of Romanian workers in Spain and UK are bound to find themselves jobless because of the credit crunch. Hopefully, they will come back. :cheers:

In the meanwhile, more foreign workers are brought in. :ohno:

That's also terrible from the demographic point of view. I don't think you'd love to see little Vietnamese children running around the streets of Bucharest.

Seen them. There were lots of Vietnamese during the 80s here. I was sitting next to a Vietnamese-Bulgarian girl at school back then.

Of course the skinheads hate them.

That's also terrible from the demographic point of view. I don't think you'd love to see little Vietnamese children running around the streets of Bucharest.

The are already plenty of arab children, mostly Lebanese and Palestinian in some quarters of Bucharest. Bucharest alone has a community of about 20-30.000 Chinese+arabic people, if not more than that. But this is a natural process. Economic development will demand more and more imigrants. Until now,they have integrated well. In 10-15 years from now Romania, as other EE countries, will find itself at a point when 10% of its population is made up of immigrants. The important thing will be how well will they be integrated in the mainstream culture and society. I think this is a irreversible trend for all Europe.

Business Standard
25/04/2008




Cab companies plan to employ drivers from Moldova

Romanian taxi companies plan to bring labor force from the Republic of Moldova to cover personnel shortage, estimated at some 4,000 employees.
“We are currently facing employee deficit of 1,000-1,200 people in Bucharest and some 4,000 nationally. To cover this shortage, we decided to ask support from the Ministry of Foreign Affairs to bring foreign in citizens,” said the President of Taxi Operators Employers Union, Remus Nedelcu.

Most taxi companies are willing to hire foreign citizens. “We want to import labor force from the Republic of Moldova, mainly because they speak the language and, with a GPS system, they could manage better than other nationalities,” Nedelcu said.

To attract workers from Moldova, the companies are willing to provide accommodation and salaries worth RON 1,000 (some €290) per month. Furthermore, drivers would earn a daily tip worth RON 40-50 (€11-13), according to Nedelcu.

If the employee shortage is not covered with workers from Moldova, cab companies owners are willing to hire drivers from Asian countries, such as Pakistan, India, and Bangladesh.

Romania prides itself as a Latin country, yet think it is a good idea to import people from Bangladesh instead of a Latin American country. Why don't Romanians think about which countries are the easiest to integrate people from? Or don't they care, thinking that all other countries outside Romania are the same?

Because it's a free country and it is the employer which decides whom to employ, and not the state. As cinically it may sound, it's similar to importing timber. The state should not tell you where to import it from. The same as businessmen are thinking to import thhe cheapest timper available out there, businessmen are looking for the cheapest workforce. You cannot bring Moldovans or Brazilians and ask them to work for 250 EUR/month because it's not a good gain for them. But you can bring Bangladeshi people from 25 EUR/month to 250 EUR/month.

In any case, the programme for importing people it's a strict one. At some point, these people have to be returned to their country. At least in theory. Yet, I've never seen it working all the way to the end.

For example, in the case of the Steillman factory in Sibiu, the employer chose to bring women from the Phillipines, because they were catholic, and the employer thought they can fit better in a city which is 100% of christian religion, be it protestant, orthodox or catholic.

Indeed, there's a totally different situation if you bring people from Bangladesh, which country still has a tribe-like mentality. We'll see. We are just at the begining of this phenomenon which I am sure most employees do not yet understand...

In addition, the good thing is that Romanians are very tolerant people with other nationalities, and this leads to better integration, I think. I have never heard so far of attacks at chinese, arabs or even black people who are becoming more numerous as lately.

^^ It doesn't matter how tolerant you guys are. What matters is how tolerant the people you import are.

When it comes to wage level, I would've thought that the employers were thinking about the ability of the employee to learn the language for example as well? You say that a Brazilian wouldn't work for the wage demanded, but how about a Nicaraguan, Colombian, Paraguayan or Phillippino? I really doubt that the only place you can get work force are from countries like Pakistan and Bangladesh which you will have a very hard time integrating because of the vast cultural differences.

^^ You say that a Brazilian wouldn't work for the wage demanded, but how about a Nicaraguan, Colombian, Paraguayan or Phillippino? I really doubt that the only place you can get work force are from countries like Pakistan and Bangladesh which you will have a very hard time integrating because of the vast cultural differences.

^^ :nuts:
For example, in the case of the Steillman factory in Sibiu, the employer chose to bring women from the Phillipines, because they were catholic, and the employer thought they can fit better in a city which is 100% of christian religion, be it protestant, orthodox or catholic.

^^ :nuts:

That just proves my point. It is silly to believe that the only people willing to work in Romania are people from Bangladesh and Pakistan. There's plenty of people in the Latin world willing to move there and the culture clash wouldn't so big and they would have a much easier time learning the language as well. You guys should learn from western europe. There are some cultures which are much harder to integrate than other cultures, the sooner you realise it, the better.

That just proves my point. It is silly to believe that the only people willing to work in Romania are people from Bangladesh and Pakistan. There's plenty of people in the Latin world willing to move there and the culture clash wouldn't so big and they would have a much easier time learning the language as well. You guys should learn from western europe. There are some cultures which are much harder to integrate than other cultures, the sooner you realise it, the better.

Philippines
http://home.iprimus.com.au/toddemslie/asia-map.gif

Philippines
http://home.iprimus.com.au/toddemslie/asia-map.gif

What is your point? Instead of one-liners, it would be better if you participate in the conversation. Is the problem the location of the Phillippines? You don't think they will like to come to Romania because of distance? Phillippines was just as example, I mentioned other countries as well. The point is that it is silly to believe that the only people willing to work in Romania are the people which are the hardest to integrate, so there's no need to go down that route. The Phillippines has had a very strong Latin influence btw, as part of Spain/Mexico for almost 400 years, only Cuba was part of Spain for that long, often said of the Philippines: "It is a Latin American country that was transported to the Orient by a gigantic marine wave."

--

--

^^ It doesn't matter how tolerant you guys are. What matters is how tolerant the people you import are.

That may be true.

When it comes to wage level, I would've thought that the employers were thinking about the ability of the employee to learn the language for example as well? You say that a Brazilian wouldn't work for the wage demanded, but how about a Nicaraguan, Colombian, Paraguayan or Phillippino? I really doubt that the only place you can get work force are from countries like Pakistan and Bangladesh which you will have a very hard time integrating because of the vast cultural differences.

Yes, I know that.....but the question is what to do if the employer wants to bring Bangladeshi people? Ban that because the race is not appropiate? You need to understand that it's the employer's decision to bring Pakistani and not Nicaraguan people. What can you do about that? Pass a decree saying that only Catholic or Orthodox people are allowed in?

That may be true.



Yes, I know that.....but the question is what to do if the employer wants to bring Bangladeshi people? Ban that because the race is not appropiate? You need to understand that it's the employer's decision to bring Pakistani and not Nicaraguan people. What can you do about that? Pass a decree saying that only Catholic or Orthodox people are allowed in?

It's not about race, sillypants. :) Latin people come in all races. Why doesn't Romania make it easier for people in the Latin world to immigrate to Romania, if the authorities believe you need labor? Make a deal with a few Latin countries which will give the employers the labor force they need. Many countries have done that.

We could follow the Polish way. The citizens of several states, I would say Panama, Nicaragua, Guatemala, Bolivia, Peru, Ecuador should be allowed to work without a work permit in Romania, while for others the permit would be very hard to get...Therefore, the employers have to search for work force in those countries, and due to to distance, Romania will not be inflooded with immigrants from tehre...What do you say?

It's not about race, sillypants. :) Latin people come in all races. Why doesn't Romania make it easier for people in the Latin world to immigrate to Romania, if the authorities believe you need labor? Make a deal with a few Latin countries which will give the employers the labor force they need. Many countries have done that.

That's what I am saying....the current law in Romania provides for some general steps that employers must follow to import labour...it doesn't say that only people from certain countries can be brought in. That is the point of a law. If employers deem fit, they can bring people from India or the US.

I am not saying you are wrong...I am just saying that our authorities are so scared by buzz words like 'discrimination', 'race' etc as a consequence of communism that they do not want to approve any other measures which may sound discriminatory.

That's what I am saying....the current law in Romania provides for some general steps that employers must follow to import labour...it doesn't say that only people from certain countries can be brought in. That is the point of a law. If employers deem fit, they can bring people from India or the US.

I am not saying you are wrong...I am just saying that our authorities are so scared by buzz words like 'discrimination', 'race' etc as a consequence of communism that they do not want to approve any other measures which may sound discriminatory.

Just keep the system as it is, but strike a deal with a few countries regarding labor import, and the employers will naturally import labor from those countries which you have good communication and a good regulatory system with. It will be the best for both Romania and the business community.

Here's your answer: companies hire more people from Pakistan to work in the clothing industry. 40 Pakistani workers will be hired by a company in Resita (NW Romania). In 2006, 1600 Pakistani workers were employed by Romanian companies. In 2008, the construction industry will import 10-12.000 foreign workers mainly from China, India, Bangladesh and Pakistan.

Soon, Bucharest will turn from little Paris into little Londonistan. :crazy:





Companiile locale apeleaza la forta de munca din Pakistan

24 aprilie 2008 de Raluca Lipan, Robert Iloviceanu

Firmele care activeaza pe piata locala, in special cele din industria textila, constructii si turism, intentioneaza sa angajeze muncitori din Pakistan pentru a-si acoperi deficitul de personal.

Astfel, circa 40 de muncitori pakistanezi vor sosi in curand in tara, pentru a lucra intr-o firma romaneasca din Resita, potrivit ambasadorului Pakistanului in Romania, Mian Sanaullah, citat de cotidianul pakistanez The Post. Acesta a mai precizat ca importul de muncitori ar putea constitui o noua dimensiune a relatiilor romano-pakistaneze si a amintit ca, in 2006, oficialitatile romane au oferit 1.200 de permise de munca pentru muncitorii din aceasta tara. “Importul de forta de munca straina este la inceput in Romania. A pornit de la o necesitate in anumite domenii aflate in criza de muncitori, in special in industria textila, constructii, turism si HoReCa”, spune Dana Patrichi, managing partner al firmei de consultanta in resurse umane Alexander Hughes Romania.

Dupa ce au epuizat posibilitatile de recrutare a fortei de munca din tari vecine, precum Ucraina, Moldova, Serbia si Macedonia, companiile de pe piata locala sunt interesate sa importe tehnicieni, ingineri si soferi din tari asiatice, precum China, India, Bangladesh si Pakistan.

“Muncitorii care lucreaza in constructii provin din Ungaria, Bulgaria, Turcia si din China. Alte solutii de import sunt tari ca Pakistan, India, Bangladesh, care vor fi folosite daca va fi cazul, daca toate proiectele anuntate vor obtine finantare. Ne asteptam ca, in 2008-2009, sa importam 10.000‑12.000 de muncitori straini”, afirma Laurentiu Plosceanu, presedintele ARACO.

Potrivit acestuia, salariile muncitorilor straini nu sunt mai mici decat ale romanilor, dimpotriva. Salariile depind foarte mult de tara de provenienta si pot varia intre 300 de euro si 700 de euro pe luna.

Just keep the system as it is, but strike a deal with a few countries regarding labor import, and the employers will naturally import labor from those countries which you have good communication and a good regulatory system with. It will be the best for both Romania and the business community.

Just wait until 2015-2020 when the Romanian baby-boomers will retire and the country will have to support them as well. THEN, we'll need a few MILLION IMMIGRANTS to work for them!!!

I estimate that by 2020 at least 5-7 % of Romania's population will be made of foreigners, mostly Chinese (but also Indian and Pakistani, if this trend with Pakistan and India continues). We are just at the begining of the labour crisis. In a few years, we'll have to import hundreds of thousand of people per year from third world countries to cope with the demand of the economy and the labour shortage. 2007 was the year when the labour shortage showed its teeth. In the coming years, with the explosive development of the economy and the construction sector, a few thousands this year will turn into a few tens of thousands or even hundred thousand.

Just wait until 2015-2020 when the Romanian baby-boomers will retire and the country will have to support them as well. THEN, we'll need a few MILLION IMMIGRANTS to work for them!!!

I estimate that by 2020 at least 5-7 % of Romania's population will be made of foreigners, mostly Chinese (but also Indian and Pakistani, if this trend with Pakistan and India continues). We are just at the begining of the labour crisis. In a few years, we'll have to import hundreds of thousand of people per year from third world countries to cope with the demand of the economy and the labour shortage. 2007 was the year when the labour shortage showed its teeth. In the coming years, with the explosive development of the economy and the construction sector, a few thousands this year will turn into a few tens of thousands or even hundred thousand.

And none from Latin countries. How stupid your government is. Not willing to learn anything from western european countries. I guess honor killings and forced marriages will be completely normal in Romania in the next few years. Probably terror threats as well, because you are an infidel country. :lol:

And none from Latin countries. How stupid your government is. Not willing to learn anything from western european countries. I guess honor killings and forced marriages will be completely normal in Romania in the next few years. Probably terror threats as well, because you are an infidel country. :lol:

Everybody understands the above....yet when it'll come to the point where the pensions will not be paid anymore because those who work are too few, then the bomb will really explode. Currently, for every working man, there are almost 2 non-working persons in Romania (retirees, children, disabilitated ect). In 7-10 years from now it'll be a lot worse. And the pension system will collapse.

You seem to fail to understand that I know every argument you adduce and agree to it in general. BUt when it'll come to the situation that pensioneers have no support anymore because the budgetary system is collapsing, then something will have to do about it. And such arguments like yours will not be working anymore. Canada about 20 years ago had Romania's population. Now it has 10 million more by immigration...because the pension and welfare systems reached to a point where they would collapse. This will happen in most EE countries....similar estimates are made for the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Hungary etc.

PS: I do not know the government's policies in this regard. What I expressed above is solely my opinion. However, it is estimated that the labour crisis will only deepen in the coming years and that the welfare system will be even more streched by the year. Something will have to be done about it, and the only solution is more people in jobs. That this will be achieved by immigration, or by delaying the retirement age from 65 for men to 70, when they generally die, or by a combination of these, we'll see. The problem remains though that Romania is in a special situation caused by the baby-booming phenomenon experienced throughout the 80s, and the collapse of natality in the 90s. When these two combine, after 2010, Romania will have a huge problem. I am also looking forward for the solution to be put up by the coming government, but immigration is surely part of it.

Romania prides itself as a Latin country, yet think it is a good idea to import people from Bangladesh instead of a Latin American country. Why don't Romanians think about which countries are the easiest to integrate people from? Or don't they care, thinking that all other countries outside Romania are the same?

It doesn't matter how tolerant you guys are. What matters is how tolerant the people you import are.

Imported people??? You know there is a difference between prostitute dealers and organized states but anyway...

I guess honor killings and forced marriages will be completely normal in Romania in the next few years. Probably terror threats as well, because you are an infidel country.
And of course anthrax attacks against Le Clerk. Probably then a huge nuclear attack against Timisoara. Poor Romanians :ohno:

Get serious dudes...

@Le Clerk
The problem with the ageing population exists not only in the EE countries but in the old EU states too.They have higher birth rate but the people live longer.

In the case of Bulgaria, the only solution of the problem is the retirement age to be increased from 60 for women and 63 for men to 67 for both genders.Yesterday was announced "the social strategy 2008-2015" according to which the average retirement age should be increased from 64,1 to 68.However, the current retirement age can`t be 64,1 simply because it`s lower for both men and women.On the other hand there is only one more year till the next elections, the opposition is de facto in pre-election campaign since the beginning of 2007, many voters of the socialists are in pre-retirement age and therefore I don`t believe that the governing coalition will have the political will for such an important decision.

Everybody understands the above....yet when it'll come to the point where the pensions will not be paid anymore because those who work are too few, then the bomb will really explode. Currently, for every working man, there are almost 2 non-working persons in Romania (retirees, children, disabilitated ect). In 7-10 years from now it'll be a lot worse. And the pension system will collapse.

You seem to fail to understand that I know every argument you adduce and agree to it in general. BUt when it'll come to the situation that pensioneers have no support anymore because the budgetary system is collapsing, then something will have to do about it. And such arguments like yours will not be working anymore. Canada about 20 years ago had Romania's population. Now it has 10 million more by immigration...because the pension and welfare systems reached to a point where they would collapse. This will happen in most EE countries....similar estimates are made for the Czech Republic, Slovenia, Hungary etc.

PS: I do not know the government's policies in this regard. What I expressed above is solely my opinion. However, it is estimated that the labour crisis will only deepen in the coming years and that the welfare system will be even more streched by the year. Something will have to be done about it, and the only solution is more people in jobs. That this will be achieved by immigration, or by delaying the retirement age from 65 for men to 70, when they generally die, or by a combination of these, we'll see. The problem remains though that Romania is in a special situation caused by the baby-booming phenomenon experienced throughout the 80s, and the collapse of natality in the 90s. When these two combine, after 2010, Romania will have a huge problem. I am also looking forward for the solution to be put up by the coming government, but immigration is surely part of it.

You completely missed my point I think. Nobody is denying any of this. I have argued strongly for Latin migration to Romania, that is the point.