No, I do not think Louisville would support the NBA. Its pretty obvious the city has decided to be a minor league college sports town and the NBA would never work.

Pretty much every other city Louisvilles size would get behind landing a major league franchise and look at it as a stepping stone to brighter things in the future. A majority of the people in Louisville look at it as a negative and do everything in their power to not allow it to happen.

Its comical how many times the city has fumbled away opportunities to land a franchise. I think at one point they even hired somebody to go out and lure an NBA franchise to the city only to sabotage the efforts as soon as it looked like a team was genuinely interested.

In Louisville a $13 million naming rights deal for a $300 million college arena is better than the $100 million naming rights deal they had in place for a $200 million NBA arena back earlier in the decade.

You should take the time to figure out the conditions on the ground before you blame a city for subpar attendance. Everyone knows Memphis will support a NBA franchise, but you have to put a quality product on the court. That's why both the Grizz & Hornets wanted to make the move to Memphis. If Michael Heisley wants to break even or profit instead of building morale then it comes as no suprise when seats aren't filled. He did the same thing in Vancouver. Charlotte wouldn't support a quality franchise because the public rejected ownership. Seems to be a lot of factors not taken into account.

Sorry, but Memphis is an epic failure when it comes to pro sports. The NBA has no business being there, they have the cheapest tickets in the league and still do a miserable job putting people in the arena. Even when the team was good they couldnt even average 17,000 for a season.

You would think the city embarrassed itself enough the year the Titans played there, but the NBA owners were too dumb to look at that as a warning sign.

You would think the city embarrassed itself enough the year the Titans played there, but the NBA owners were too dumb to look at that as a warning sign.

You would of thought you embarrassed yourself enough when I took apart that argument. Want a pop-culture barometer for attendance without the politics of sports franchises? Take John Mayer's hit arena tour that recently made stops in Memphis & Nashville. Memphis attendance = 17,000 & Nashville attendance = 11,000.

Um, you have never taken apart any argument.

What does John Mayer have to do with anything? and why do you even know the attendance for the stops?

Memphis recently had to cut ticket prices by about 25% to be the lowest prices in the league and they still only averaged 13,500 a game. Forbes also estimates that the Grizzlies lost 13% of their value (almost $40 million) in the past year and are now worth about $257 million and only ahead of the Bucks in the NBA.

Cashville,

Not all of your points are invalid, but it does seem like you have something personal against Louisville and some other cities. I am not a very frequent poster, but I read a lot. I am not 100% percent sure Louisville could support an NBA team, but that town does love basketball and would support a quality team. The basis for loving B-ball goes far beyond U of L. Personally, I think the new arena looks great and I don't get the trailer image you refer too. I am not going to bash Nashville, and I know you have some criticisms as well. However, you do seem eager to pick apart other metros when you could be a bit more supportive.

What does John Mayer have to do with anything? and why do you even know the attendance for the stops?

These numbers for the same event show raw drawing power. The Oilers' transient season is nothing to base any type of claim. It was a fluke that was very contraversial to Memphis with circumstances such as public disgust for Bud Adams who a lot of Nashville citizens don't even like (and don't trust), despite bringing an established franchise built on Houston money.

Memphis recently had to cut ticket prices by about 25% to be the lowest prices in the league and they still only averaged 13,500 a game. Forbes also estimates that the Grizzlies lost 13% of their value (almost $40 million) in the past year and are now worth about $257 million and only ahead of the Bucks in the NBA.

Well, I didn't say a young franchise with a frugal owner/manager would be worth the most. Makes sense to me -Don't spend the big bucks for seasoned talent and the value should be relatively low. Memphis isn't responsible for Heisley's failure. Also, the FedEx Forum pays its' bills unlike the "whatever its' name is this month Arena" that is subsidized into the millions every year in Nashville.

The arena just got another 4.6 million in sponsorships which brings it just 8 million shy of meeting its obligations from that particular source of income for its first decade of operation. Considering the economy it doesn't seem to have too much trouble in that category, it's still a few months to completion so I see it being able to get the rest of the sponsorship needed.

Cashville, I didn't realize you needed a pro team to be a "real" city. You might want to tell that to Austin, Las Vegas, Hartford, and Richmond that... We all know they have no legit forms of entertainment, I'm sure the 100k on average that attend the average Texas football game have nothing better to do in Austin. From what I hear Austin has a pretty good public transportation system for a podunk college town. I guess we should also tell the thousands of people moving there that Austin doesn't have a pro-team. Don't get me started about the lack of entertainment options in Las Vegas because we all know the only way to be entertained is by pro-sports.

Now I understand we are not talking about these cities, but my point is, there is more to a "real" city than pro-sports. I won't lie I would love to see pro sports in Louisville, however I can live without them. Which is the mindset of most Louisvillians, we don't object, we simply don't care. We're fine going to see the Cards (or the Cats), at least they can't up and leave if they don't get their way.

Louisville is not perfect, I understand that, we are behind our neighbors to the north (are you happy Cwilson?), and yes Cashville to the south as well in terms of population growth. Does that make Louisville a hell hole, no it's not, most people I know who have moved here love it. It's making progress, albiet slower than I would like, but like Mark Twain undestood, this is Kentucky, we're slow about everything. As long as I can continue to grow in my professional life, which I have every reason to believe I can, I will stay in Louisville, and hopefully I'll have a chance to leave my own mark on the city.

Man, the insecurity of these Louisville posters is just shining through. What an insecure city. Most would find incessant bashing of other cities to be a sign of insecurity. Well it's not. It is, in fact, and honest self-assessment of the city and our desires that is the guidepost of insecurity. How about that.

Synthesis of Cashville's take on Louisville.....

Louisville sucks, the arena sucks, the citizens suck, the leadership sucks, their are no jobs, no entertainment, we are incapable of anything, we pray at night to be like "our former peer cities that left us in the dust". Louisville is a fake city that doesn't really exist due to the absence of pro sports. Louisville should be nuked by the U.S. government due to the city's lack of contribution to the nation. Did I miss anything?

- I never said you had to have pro sports to be a real city, you all are just dwelling on something minor to avoid the major issue which is Louisvilles small town, minor league mentality. The whole NBA/college sports thing just magnifies that, but the mentality is all over Louisville. Its a big reason Louisville is a slow growth metro and has been that way for decades.

- To the Memphis guy, everybody realizes Memphis is a joke NBA market except you. You are either in denial, or trying to put on some kind of message board front. I looked over at your development thread to see where you took apart my argument, and to nobodies surprise that didnt exist. In that thread I said the team would be gone within 5 years, and I stand by that. In the next couple years the city of Memphis is either going to have to use $10+ million in taxpayer money to purchase remaining tickets, or the team will leave. With all the problems the city has no way the leaders can rationalize wasting that kind of money only to have the team bolt at some point any way. Face it, your city fails as a major league sports town, deal with it.

There is a big difference between college sports and pro sports, so Chicago can support the Cubs and Bears all they want. Major league teams are a legit entertainment option that only real cities have, thousands of podunk towns across the country have college athletics. Seems like you are still not getting the difference.

You never said that?????

Cash must have been drunk when he said that. Yeah, that's it! Druuuunk.

- To the Memphis guy, everybody realizes Memphis is a joke NBA market except you. You are either in denial, or trying to put on some kind of message board front. I looked over at your development thread to see where you took apart my argument, and to nobodies surprise that didnt exist. In that thread I said the team would be gone within 5 years, and I stand by that. In the next couple years the city of Memphis is either going to have to use $10+ million in taxpayer money to purchase remaining tickets, or the team will leave. With all the problems the city has no way the leaders can rationalize wasting that kind of money only to have the team bolt at some point any way. Face it, your city fails as a major league sports town, deal with it.

In that thread it became apparent that you had no idea what you were talking about. You didn't even know that the Grizzlies would be penalized with a massive amount of the FedEx Forum's debt service. You thought they could just walk away or something completely ignorant like that. That penalty sum doesn't even dip below $100 Million for some years to come. Also, Michael Heisley is quoted saying that even if he dies the Grizzlies wouldn't be leaving Memphis anytime soon because of having to purchase the team, pay for the Forum's debt service and pay all types of penalties & fees to the NBA, FedEx & City of Memphis for relocation, etc. Not to mention, Fred Smith has stated that he and other prominent citizens & business interest will step in if even a hint of sale/relocation becomes an actual prospect in the future. And read it again -The Memphis Grizzlies do break even or profit and the FedEx Forum pay its' bills. Also, the facility averages 16,500 for U of Memphis games and the Grizzlies' attendance & ticket prices are starting to climb again.

Everybody knows the absolute worst example for TN pro sports is the situation with the Nashville Predators. They are losing money hand over fist, being pursued intensely in the background by interest in Kansas City and elsewhere. Last but not least the Nashvil... I mean the Gaylord... I mean the Sommet... I'm mean the Bridgestone or whatever the hell its' name is this month is being heavily subsidized by taxpayers. Nashville will probably be paying on it long after the Predators are gone and as it starts to fall out of standards. The saddest part is that they are a decent team with not enough support to cover operation of the team itself and their facility. Not an example for any city under any circumstance. It is truly one of the rawest deals I've seen out there, financially speaking. Nashville leadership should take more care not to over-leverage its' massive growing debt load with poor business deals such as that. The Titan's model will hopefully work out in the long term since they are marketed as the state's team & being centrally located. It wouldn't have worked out any other way when considering how bad Ole' Bud ripped off Nashville. And, dear god, the financing package on the MCC is no joking matter. It's more like a crime.

There is a big difference between college sports and pro sports, so Chicago can support the Cubs and Bears all they want. Major league teams are a legit entertainment option that only real cities have, thousands of podunk towns across the country have college athletics. Seems like you are still not getting the difference.

Serious question for the Louisville people, do you all consider your metro to be more on par with Indianapolis or Omaha? I realize Indy is considerably larger, and Omaha is smaller but which do you think Louisville is more similar to?

- I never said you had to have pro sports to be a real city, you all are just dwelling on something minor to avoid the major issue which is Louisvilles small town, minor league mentality. The whole NBA/college sports thing just magnifies that, but the mentality is all over Louisville. Its a big reason Louisville is a slow growth metro and has been that way for decades.

- To the Memphis guy, everybody realizes Memphis is a joke NBA market except you. You are either in denial, or trying to put on some kind of message board front. I looked over at your development thread to see where you took apart my argument, and to nobodies surprise that didnt exist. In that thread I said the team would be gone within 5 years, and I stand by that. In the next couple years the city of Memphis is either going to have to use $10+ million in taxpayer money to purchase remaining tickets, or the team will leave. With all the problems the city has no way the leaders can rationalize wasting that kind of money only to have the team bolt at some point any way. Face it, your city fails as a major league sports town, deal with it.

Uh.....you did make a correlation between "real cities" and "pro sports".

In that thread it became apparent that you had no idea what you were talking about. You didn't even know that the Grizzlies would be penalized with a massive amount of the FedEx Forum's debt service. You thought they could just walk away or something completely ignorant like that. That penalty sum doesn't even dip below $100 Million for some years to come. Also, Michael Heisley is quoted saying that even if he dies the Grizzlies wouldn't be leaving Memphis anytime soon because of having to purchase the team, pay for the Forum's debt service and pay all types of penalties & fees to the NBA, FedEx & City of Memphis for relocation, etc. Not to mention, Fred Smith has stated that he and other prominent citizens & business interest will step in if even a hint of sale/relocation becomes an actual prospect in the future. And read it again -The Memphis Grizzlies do break even or profit and the FedEx Forum pay its' bills. Also, the facility averages 16,500 for U of Memphis games and the Grizzlies' attendance & ticket prices are starting to climb again.
I'll be fair on this argument, being a Memphian myself. Historically speaking, the Grizzlies have been poorly managed as a team (nevermind the fact they play in the toughest division of the Western Conference). Much of it has to do with bad decisions that were being made by the front office, let alone ownership, even going as far back as when the Griz were established in Vancouver. I'll be one to say that a lot of us here do not trust Michael Heisley in regards to some of the meddling he's done in making basketball decisions that should only be done by those who know the sport best. And it has resulted in a mediocre product as well as an alienation of their potential fan base who would much rather support the local college team instead of a team that seemingly has had no desire of being competitive over the past few seasons (yes, the Griz have won 40 games this year, but they essentially gave up near the end of the season). That's the real problem, and would be the case even if they were in another city. If you're not even trying to be a consistent winner, then why are you even here?

Everybody knows the absolute worst example for TN pro sports is the situation with the Nashville Predators. They are losing money hand over fist, being pursued intensely in the background by interest in Kansas City and elsewhere. Last but not least the Nashvil... I mean the Gaylord... I mean the Sommet... I'm mean the Bridgestone or whatever the hell its' name is this month is being heavily subsidized by taxpayers. Nashville will probably be paying on it long after the Predators are gone and as it starts to fall out of standards. The saddest part is that they are a decent team with not enough support to cover operation of the team itself and their facility. Not an example for any city under any circumstance. It is truly one of the rawest deals I've seen out there, financially speaking. Nashville leadership should take more care not to over-leverage its' massive growing debt load with poor business deals such as that. The Titan's model will hopefully work out in the long term since they are marketed as the state's team & being centrally located. It wouldn't have worked out any other way when considering how bad Ole' Bud ripped off Nashville. And, dear god, the financing package on the MCC is no joking matter. It's more like a crime.Poor deals happen, even in large cities like Nashville. Heck, Indianapolis is having similar problems right now with the long-term financing of Conseco Fieldhouse, and it's quite possible at this point that the Pacers may try to leave town in the future unless the city gets its ducks in a row with paying for that arena, not to mention for Lucas Oil Stadium and an expansion of the Indiana Convention Center.

I'm sorry Cashville,but I think Louisville would make a great NBA city!It has The Metro population-1 million+,crazy basketball fans, and soon an NBA ready arena,there is No pro sports in Kentucky, and I really think it would be a great One(1) pro sport city!

I'm sorry Cashville,but I think Louisville would make a great NBA city!It has The Metro population-1 million+,crazy basketball fans, and soon an NBA ready arena,there is No pro sports in Kentucky, and I really think it would be a great One(1) pro sport city!

Unfortunately, Louisville's small media market, while sandwhiched by much larger media markets, will always hinder its ability to land a pro team...never gonna get NFL or MLB and the NBA will not want to share with a DIV 1 school. Louisville may have hurt itself by building this for the Cards

I'll be fair on this argument...

I would agree. It's almost always a case by case basis if a major league pro sports franchise is successful in a mid-sized market, sometimes even major markets because of the politics of industry. A prime example is the NFL & Los Angeles, that says it all. With the issue of arenas & stadiums these days, I'd rather build a nice arena for a college team before a pro team. I wouldn't say the Pyramid was one of Memphis' best moments in financial terms, but the U of Memphis was deserving of it and at least the NBA got a few good seasons out of it too. But yeah, since the time it was built it fell out of standards with club seating, etc. as arenas took a pretty hard turn with design in the late 90's/ early 00's. Luckily for Memphis, the buliding is probably still the most recognizable structure in the state of TN and of course, Bass Pro Shops' proposed mega-store/museum/aquarium complex will be an incredible private investment of $100 million, not to mention the $250 million-20 year lease is looking mighty nice to the City of Memphis too. It's almost safe to say now, that with BassPro & Memphis in media blackout as the lease agreement is finalized, that the Pyramid's next 20 years may be better than the first 20.

Unfortunately, Louisville's small media market, while sandwhiched by much larger media markets, will always hinder its ability to land a pro team...never gonna get NFL or MLB and the NBA will not want to share with a DIV 1 school. Louisville may have hurt itself by building this for the Cards

I agree. Although I think it has more to do with the media market side than UofL. Another issue is the proximity to so many pro markets. In that sense, we are like Columbus (because I don't count the NHL as being bigger than major college athletics).

I also think the pro sports issue is overblown. The Trailblazers are not why people move to Portland. And Austin is doing fine without pro sports. There are ways to be attractive to young professionals and corporations without pro teams.

Unfortunately,.....the NBA will not want to share with a DIV 1 school. Louisville may have hurt itself by building this for the Cards
If building the arena for the UofL keeps the NBA from coming to a Louisville I'll like the arena a lot better than I do now! Any city that really wants an NBA franchise should think about it closely. It seems like more and more NBA players are becoming part of the undesirable crowd and they hardly present the image most people want their children around. It's happening with all professional sports but especially so with the NBA.:cheers:

I agree. Although I think it has more to do with the media market side than UofL. Another issue is the proximity to so many pro markets. In that sense, we are like Columbus (because I don't count the NHL as being bigger than major college athletics).

I also think the pro sports issue is overblown. The Trailblazers are not why people move to Portland. And Austin is doing fine without pro sports. There are ways to be attractive to young professionals and corporations without pro teams.

I agree with this statement. While pro sports are a great asset if you have good teams, Indianapolis would be a good example, I think Louisville at this point in time will be fine without one.

^^I couldn't imagine life without our two teams. The run the Colts have had with Peyton....some of those heart stopping games against the dreaded Pats..omg:nuts:!!! the Super Bowl win against daaa Bears and a million other memorable moments through the years with them, all the fun of the Manning/Brady thing...and to think of going through a winter without the Pacers (even though they are shitty now) makes me want to,........well...:badnews: since this is a skyscraper forum. :lol: The image of the NBA in general definitely could use some improvement though. Seeing ex-Pacer thug Artest competing for a title while the Pacers struggle is hard to watch.

I'm sorry Cashville,but I think Louisville would make a great NBA city!It has The Metro population-1 million+,crazy basketball fans, and soon an NBA ready arena,there is No pro sports in Kentucky, and I really think it would be a great One(1) pro sport city!I agree...and make Louie Dampier or Artis Gilmore the coach. What a story..:okay:.....or Issel!!!!

You never said that?????

No you are having comprehension problems (KY educational system at work) I never said that major league sports made you a real city. Again you all are harping on a minor point, which is common for Louisville since everything in minor league about the city.

And once again for Memphis Johnny Rail, I came with legit facts about the Grizzlies with sourced links and you talked out of your ass for the most part.

Memphis has been the single worst professional sports market in the history of major league sports, congrats on that. The team will be gone in the next few years and I will stop back by your thread to say hello when it happens.

If building the arena for the UofL keeps the NBA from coming to a Louisville I'll like the arena a lot better than I do now! Any city that really wants an NBA franchise should think about it closely. It seems like more and more NBA players are becoming part of the undesirable crowd and they hardly present the image most people want their children around. It's happening with all professional sports but especially so with the NBA.:cheers:

Not surprisingly a ridiculous statement.

I mentioned earlier in this thread about your UofL head coach boinking some old broad in a restaurant, and an assistant in a ticket scam that count people tens of thousands of dollars. Time to get rid of UofL basketball!!!!! the coaches are in the undesirable crowd!!!!!

UofL football players also had a lot of run ins with the brief era they were a decent team. Time to get rid of UofL football!!!!! the players are in the undesirable crowd!!!!!

Most NBA players are very good citizens, you are using the actions of a few to stereotype the rest and it has a hint of racism to it.

And for the record, I dont know the specifics of the arena deals of the Predators or the Grizzlies, but I do know they Predators average more fans per game and the price of the tickets are more expensive.

Considering the fact that Memphis is a basketball city, and people in Nashville dont know jack about hockey and the Titans are clearly the premier sporting option in the city thats not bad.

I'm sorry Cashville,but I think Jacksonville would make a great NFL city!It has The Metro population-1 million+,crazy football fans, and an NFL ready stadium,there is No other pro sports in Jacksonville, and I really think it would be a great One(1) pro sport city!

And the Jaguars have to tarp thousands of seats for every home game and the games are always blacked out.



Now to your actual post, true there are no pro sports teams in Kentucky, but Cincinnati and Nashville have pro sports and their media markets extend into KY. Outside of Kentucky basketball the Cincinnati Reds are clearly the #2 most popular team in the state. There are also tons or Bengals season ticket holders in Northern Kentucky, and tons of Titans season ticket holders in Southcentral Kentucky.

So while there arent any teams based in the state (but you can see an NFL and MLB stadium from its borders) its not exactly a market starved of major league sports.

Just looking around the internet trying to figure out when Louisville lost its balls.

Of course in the 1960s-70s the city had the ABA team that was one of the better supported franchised in the ABA or NBA.

In that same time frame the city struck a deal with the owner of the Kansas City Athletics to bring an MLB team to town, but the AL owners voted the relocation down 9-1 (they also voted the move to Oakland down 9-1 but the city kept pursuing and the As eventually moved there). I didnt copy the link by the mayor or governor vowed to bring Major League Baseball to Louisville soon, but of course that never happened.

After that it seemed the prospects of Louisville becoming a major league city just died outside a couple sabotaged attempts at an NBA franchise in the last decade.

Wow you are on a roll.... did mom say you couldn't have desert tonight so you had to let out your frustrations on a internet forum about skyscrapers?

Wow you are on a roll.... did mom say you couldn't have desert tonight so you had to let out your frustrations on a internet forum about skyscrapers?

^^LOL,anyways The arena is coming along nicely and will be a true gem for Louisville!

Just looking around the internet trying to figure out when Louisville lost its balls.

Of course in the 1960s-70s the city had the ABA team that was one of the better supported franchised in the ABA or NBA.

In that same time frame the city struck a deal with the owner of the Kansas City Athletics to bring an MLB team to town, but the AL owners voted the relocation down 9-1 (they also voted the move to Oakland down 9-1 but the city kept pursuing and the As eventually moved there). I didnt copy the link by the mayor or governor vowed to bring Major League Baseball to Louisville soon, but of course that never happened.

After that it seemed the prospects of Louisville becoming a major league city just died outside a couple sabotaged attempts at an NBA franchise in the last decade.


In all seriousness though, what does that fact that you took the time to look this stuff up so you can cut down another city on the internet have to say about you? You say Louisvillians on here have low self esteem but you go out of your way to cut down not only Louisville but I've seen many other cities that you've put down.

Most sports fans in Louisville like pro sports, and would like a pro team, but I would hate to see the city and state sign a bad deal for a team who may jump ship in 10 years if they don't get their way. If Louisville is approached with a good deal there will be plenty of support. With the economy the way it is, I don't see Louisville getting a pro team any time within the next few years, but like most people in this city, I'm ok with it, because Louisville has plenty to offer outside of that.

And for the record, I dont know the specifics of the arena deals of the Predators or the Grizzlies, but I do know they Predators average more fans per game and the price of the tickets are more expensive.

Considering the fact that Memphis is a basketball city, and people in Nashville dont know jack about hockey and the Titans are clearly the premier sporting option in the city thats not bad.

Always look on the briiiiight siiide of life - doodoo - doodoo - doo doo doo doo doo doo.

Louisville would be a good fit for the NBA, but could it really support it and UL basketball?. Another question is market size (Louisville is currently 50th in terms of TV market size) with two pro markets Indianapolis and Cincy in driving distance. For those who say that a metro doesnt really need pro sports are kidding themselves. Pro sports if anything else bring exposure to a metro area than it probably wouldnt get otherwise.

I steamrolled your intentional misinformation with ease for everyone to see. It's not that I want to argue with a non-credible troll (pointless), but you make it so easy to clear up any bad/false misconceptions about Memphis with your tired cliches and retarded theories about pro sports attendance & ticket prices being in direct correlation to a city's success and stature.

... in the next few years and I will stop back by your thread to say hello when it happens.

That's alright. You'll probably have grown up by then and stopped being a gay little forum troll.

Louisville would be a good fit for the NBA, but could it really support it and UL basketball?. Another question is market size (Louisville is currently 50th in terms of TV market size) with two pro markets Indianapolis and Cincy in driving distance. For those who say that a metro doesnt really need pro sports are kidding themselves. Pro sports if anything else bring exposure to a metro area than it probably wouldnt get otherwise.
We don't need pro sports! Or least we don't need the expense that goes along with them. Every professional sports franchise costs the city money whether people admit it or not. Cities come up with creative ways to try to make them look profitable but in reality they aren't. The latest proposal for a professional basketball team included a special tax district downtown. This may have made it look like the franchise wouldn't have cost local residents anything but in reality it probably would have reduced the number of conventions and other visitors because of the increased costs. Face it Louisville doesn't need professional sports to be a great city!

In all seriousness though, what does that fact that you took the time to look this stuff up so you can cut down another city on the internet have to say about you?
.

Half my family lives in Kentucky so I didnt have to look much of it up. And if you havent heard of Google it is a great way to find a lot of information quickly. The only thing I even had to look up was the MLB part. It is no different to Google something about a city than it is to look at a thread on this page about a city.

I steamrolled your intentional misinformation with ease for everyone to see. It's not that I want to argue with a non-credible troll (pointless), but you make it so easy to clear up any bad/false misconceptions about Memphis with your tired cliches and retarded theories about pro sports attendance & ticket prices being in direct correlation to a city's success and stature.



That's alright. You'll probably have grown up by then and stopped being a gay little forum troll.

No, you really didnt prove anything at all, only in your mind did you accomplish anything. The most pertinent fact in any of this is that the team lost $40 million in value last season by staying in Memphis. The 13% decrease in team value was tied with the Kings for largest decrease in the year.

I also find it humorous that you want to talk about me not being grown up, and then called my 'gay' all in one sentence. The gay insult is pretty typical elementary school trash talk, but if it makes you feel better roll with it.

But the fact that you actually take time to google this to put down Louisville, I mean whats the point?... Does it bother you that we don't care about pro sports at the moment? Does the look of our arena bother you that much, I mean I see buildings I don't care for in other cites, including Nasvhville, but you don't see me blasting that all over this site, nor do I see other people from Louisville doing the same. And you say we're the ones with the low self-esteem?...

Like I said before you are either a teenager, or a very sad individual...

On the topic of pro teams, they are not the secret to making a city credible, nor are they the economic wonder that you make them out to be, if anything, they take from other entertainment options, which in turn phase out any economic benefit. They do give the city exposure and add options for entertainment, but in reality they're not the most effective way in improving a region's economy. Usually tax considerations, logistics, workforce quality, infrastructure, and a city's environment (natural and built) as a whole are the biggest factors. Ever wonder why our largest cities are on water ways? They're are a few exceptions like Atlanta, but it's also a major airhub. Tennessee and the south in general have fairly favorable tax laws for business which is part of the reason for the sunbelt's growth in the past few years. Which would contribute more to Nashville's growth more than the Titans. The Titans don't make Nashville any more of a "legit city" over Louisville, any more than the Grand Ole Opy does.

Does it bother you that we don't care about pro sports at the moment?

False, people in Louisville have failed at landing major league teams for almost a half century, but since the city doesnt have one all of a sudden they dont care, lol.

If you are referring to me making them out to be an economic wonder, then please tell me where I said anything like that.

Louisville is a slow growth metro that has trouble attracting out of towners to move to the city. A big part of that is lack of entertainment options, and a major sporting franchise is a very visible form of entertainment.

Like it or not metros that are clearly above Louisville in terms of importance on the U.S hierarchal system all but a couple have an NFL, MLB, NBA, or NHL team. Places like Las Vegas and Austin are a couple exceptions, but they are also 2 of the most unique cities in what they offer as other entertainment options.

And of course metros that Louisville would like to consider themselves better than typically dont have major league sports.

Major league sports is not the only way of determining the importance of a city, but to a large percentage of the population it is the most visible.

Another way of looking at it since most metros of similar size to Louisville have pro sports these days. Not having a team clearly puts the city at a competitive disadvantage when a young educated person/family is looking at places to relocate.

There is a thread in the midwestern forum where somebody wrote an article grouping metros together. I dont recall the name of the group Louisville was in, but the description of the group was slow growth, less educated, older, and less diverse when being compared to other metros.

The demographic of people Louisville would need to attract to be competitive in the future is the type of demographic that would enjoy pro sports.

Ok. That doesn't have anything to do with my enjoyment of the city. I have a graduate level education, a challenging and rewarding job, an active social and leisure life, and a beautiful wife. I live in an active urban neighborhood where I walk to much of what I need. Sorry I can't catch a live NHL or NBA game.

I'm pretty happy and more than satisfied. Are you?

Also, please don't mistake J. Bruce Miller's obsession with the desires of an entire area.

Lastly, I actually find some secondary benefit to "slow growth." if you don't like it, fine. By the nature of all your posts on his forum, there is obviously very little in life you do like.

To say that a metro does not need pro sports to attract attention to itself and to attract people in key demographics to keep a metro moving forward is insane. Like it or not pro sports are an economic benefit and a great entertainment for mid size metros like Louisville, Birmingham, etc, etc.

Unfortunately, Louisville's small media market, while sandwhiched by much larger media markets, will always hinder its ability to land a pro team...never gonna get NFL or MLB and the NBA will not want to share with a DIV 1 school. Louisville may have hurt itself by building this for the Cards

The NBA or NHL will have no problem sharing an arena with a D1 school as it already happens. St. Johns shares an arena with NBA Knicks and NHL Rangers, Georgetown with NBA Wizards and NHL Capitals, Marquette with NBA Bucks, Memphis with NBA Grizzlies, and NC State with NHL Hurricanes.

George Shinn and interest in relocating the Hornets there ten years ago. If this arena had existed then, they most likely would have made the move.

To say that a metro does not need pro sports to attract attention to itself and to attract people in key demographics to keep a metro moving forward is insane. Like it or not pro sports are an economic benefit and a great entertainment for mid size metros like Louisville, Birmingham, etc, etc.

Don't get me wrong, it's a great entertainment option, personally I would love an NFL team in Louisville, and it is an economic benefit in a marketing since, but it is not a neccessity. I'm a professional, I'm 25, and working on my MBA, I'm a demographic that cities are striving for, pro teams aren't a must for me. Maybe for some it is, but there is lot more to a city that makes it great than pro sports alone.

That being said I do believe that eventually Louisville will get a pro team, yes the TV market is not that large, however you have to keep in mind that a team representing the state would also effect the other TV markets within KY, including Lexington.

Ok. That doesn't have anything to do with my enjoyment of the city. I have a graduate level education, a challenging and rewarding job, an active social and leisure life, and a beautiful wife. I live in an active urban neighborhood where I walk to much of what I need. Sorry I can't catch a live NHL or NBA game.



Again, you are thinking small-scale, the world works on a much larger scale.

Another way of looking at it since most metros of similar size to Louisville have pro sports these days. Not having a team clearly puts the city at a competitive disadvantage when a young educated person/family is looking at places to relocate.

There is a thread in the midwestern forum where somebody wrote an article grouping metros together. I dont recall the name of the group Louisville was in, but the description of the group was slow growth, less educated, older, and less diverse when being compared to other metros.

The demographic of people Louisville would need to attract to be competitive in the future is the type of demographic that would enjoy pro sports.
Cashville, seriously stfu. In one or two threads of you're postings, I thought people were just picking on you and giving you a hard time. Saying that you criticized every city besides Nashville. I wanted to believe that they were just overexaggerating the situation. But this is the fourth city's thread that I have seen you criticized and it's getting pathetic. What, you think Nashville is God beyond all others or something? I can easily criticize Nashville if you want.

Again, you are thinking small-scale, the world works on a much larger scale.

Oh. So small scale as in only seeing a very narrow slice of the situation and completely ignoring the big picture.

Huh. Who else on the forum would ever do such a thing?

Cashville, seriously stfu. In one or two threads of you're postings, I thought people were just picking on you and giving you a hard time. Saying that you criticized every city besides Nashville. I wanted to believe that they were just overexaggerating the situation. But this is the fourth city's thread that I have seen you criticized and it's getting pathetic. What, you think Nashville is God beyond all others or something? I can easily criticize Nashville if you want.

FALSE

A--> You have been following me around trolling for almost a year.

B--> I criticize Nashville as well.

Oh. So small scale as in only seeing a very narrow slice of the situation and completely ignoring the big picture.

Huh. Who else on the forum would ever do such a thing?

Card04, MsRandell, and pretty mush every other Louisville former/resident.

Yep. That pretty mush covers it. If only you were able to spend as much time in introspective thought as you do judging everything/everyone else.

Maybe if card04, Msradell and myself weren't so busy being so insecure we would be as enlightened as you. You think?

Card04, MsRandell, and pretty mush every other Louisville former/resident.
I wish you would least look at your spelling before you post criticism I am sure you wanted to say much not mush and my name is Msradell.

Anyways... back to what this thread is actually about. I am actually liking the grey color scheme on the arena, it looks a lot better than the white that they have in the renderings. My complaint is still that I would like to have seen more native stone (pehaps limestone) on the facade. The south side facing Main uses stone from what I've noticed driving past it and it look great. It would have went well with the river scheme.

I wish you would least look at your spelling before you post criticism I am sure you wanted to say much not mush and my name is Msradell.

Dont really care how your name is spelled, just know your opinions are probably the worst I have ever read on these boards. Dont understand why somebody like you even signs up for a skyscraper/urban development site in the first place.

Dont really care how your name is spelled, just know your opinions are probably the worst I have ever read on these boards. Dont understand why somebody like you even signs up for a skyscraper/urban development site in the first place.
I don't give a rat's AS_ what you care about but at least you could address me by my proper name when making derogatory comments.:ohno:

I also don't understand why you don't discuss the issues of the forum instead of making derogatory remarks about other cities and forum participants. Maybe you should concentrate on the subject at hand instead of worrying about other issues. This thread is about the new arena in Louisville. I sign up for these boards to discuss the buildings, architecture and construction techniques not the politics of the cities which is obviously what you want to discuss.

Maybe you should just slink back to Nashville and go back down your hole. As it is you contribute nothing but hatred and discontent to these boards.

Dont really care how your name is spelled, just know your opinions are probably the worst I have ever read on these boards. Dont understand why somebody like you even signs up for a skyscraper/urban development site in the first place.
Reported.

FALSE

A--> You have been following me around trolling for almost a year.

B--> I criticize Nashville as well.
Oh please, I visit about every city thread in this forum. And then somehow I come across a post from you trying to rip them apart. And I've posted more in the Nashville Development thread this year than you have. I could likely find 10 posts from Insighter to rip on, but won't.

Reported.

Yeah, Im sure you are the first person to do that.

Reported.
I already have also.

I vote that we ignore him, as hard as it is to read his annoying comments, it's as simple as that. People like Cashville like to see us get heated, it's obvious that's the only reason he gets on here. So if we ignore him, we take away his joy from being on the Louisville forums and he'll leave.

I vote that we ignore him, as hard as it is to read his annoying comments, it's as simple as that. People like Cashville like to see us get heated, it's obvious that's the only reason he gets on here. So if we ignore him, we take away his joy from being on the Louisville forums and he'll leave.
+1 :cheers:
Besides we all know he really loves Louisville since he spends more time at its forum that he does on the one for his beloved Nashville!

It's not only Louisville that he enters and trolls through, it's also Oklahoma City and Tulsa that I have seen him in and criticize. Nothing positive from him, just Nashville > OKC, Tulsa, Louisville, and every other city not Nashville. If he gets banned, he'll likely just make a new username and continue to troll.

The arena authority added an indoor web cam.....
http://oxblue.com/pro/open/ksfb/louisvillearena

First Music Act to play at Louisville Arena: The Eagles Oct. 16th

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100603/NEWS01/6030340/The+Eagles+will+be+first+act+in+Louisville+s+new+downtown+arena

^^Not a bad opening act!This is gonna be a gem for Louisville!

It's not only Louisville that he enters and trolls through, it's also Oklahoma City and Tulsa that I have seen him in and criticize. Nothing positive from him, just Nashville > OKC, Tulsa, Louisville, and every other city not Nashville. If he gets banned, he'll likely just make a new username and continue to troll.

Fact: You troll me more than I troll any city on this forum.

Fact: You troll me more than I troll any city on this forum.

That's because you don't troll just one city. You troll every city. But in the aggregate, no one trolls anymore on this forum than you.

KFC Yum! Center adds 5 sponsors


The KFC Yum! Center expanded its stable of sponsors Monday, adding five companies whose names will be on display in the new downtown arena.

Among them are four Kentucky-based businesses -- Park Community Federal Credit Union, John Conti Coffee and Sign-A-Rama Downtown of Louisville and Heaven Hill Distilleries of Bardstown -- and Anheuser Busch.

The deals, whose individual terms were not disclosed, are valued at $2.3 million and bring total sponsorships to $46.5 million over the next decade, according to Louisville Arena Sports and Entertainment Properties.

The announcements were made at Monday's monthly meeting of the Louisville Arena Authority.

Heaven Hill will sponsor two new clubs at the arena -- the Evan Williams Bourbon Bar and the Burnett's V Lounge -- that will be open only to club seat holders in the building's lower level. Burnett's is a Heaven Hill vodka brand.

John Conti will advertise its products and be the "official coffee, unbranded tea and hot chocolate" of the arena. Park Community will sponsor part of the Kentucky Athletic Hall of Fame on the concourse level.

Sign-A-Rama will provide signs in the building's concourse and be the building's "preferred signage company." Anheuser Busch, will have signs in the arena's bowl and on the main scoreboard.

Project estimates call for $52 million in naming rights and other advertising for debt payments over the arena's first 10 years. Jim Host, the arena authority's chairman, said Monday that he expects the arena will exceed that goal and will now aim for $60 million.

Louisville Arena Sports and Entertainment is a subsidiary of Learfield Sports, which was chosen in 2007 to market advertising and sponsorship for the project. Learfield has guaranteed $15 million to the arena authority for the first seven years the arena is open, and Monday it made its first $500,000 payment.

Work on the building at Second and Main streets remains on schedule for an Oct. 10 completion, said Bill Hedge, a construction executive with M.A. Mortenson, the project's construction manager.

Hedge said the arena's center-hung scoreboard was placed earlier this month, the practice court's flooring will be added this week and door installation is under way on all levels, including suites and locker rooms. About one-fourth of the seats in the upper bowl have been installed.

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100628/BUSINESS/6280360/1008/NEWS01/KFC+Yum++Center+adds+5+sponsors

KFC YUM! Center-I dont like The name but the arena is going to be awesome!

KFC Yum! Center may make Louisville a musical mecca

http://www.courier-journal.com/article/20100711/SCENE04/7120311/1008/NEWS01/KFC+Yum++Center+may+make+Louisville+a+musical+mecca

Haha, that could be the longest article I've ever read on the CJ Website, good read though, the Yum Center should attract more concerts and show, and better quality shows.

Yikes --- Unfortunately this is not good news:

http://www.courier-journal.com/comments/article/20100915/NEWS01/309150110/Tax-funding-for-KFC-Yum-Center-falls-short

Yikes --- Unfortunately this is not good news:

http://www.courier-journal.com/comments/article/20100915/NEWS01/309150110/Tax-funding-for-KFC-Yum-Center-falls-short
Can you imagine that? The financial picture for the Arena is not rosy like the politicians said it would be when the arena was proposed. They said it would be worth millions to the Louisville economy. Instead it's going to cost the taxpayers millions! Way to go Mayor Jerry!

Can you imagine that? The financial picture for the Arena is not rosy like the politicians said it would be when the arena was proposed. They said it would be worth millions to the Louisville economy. Instead it's going to cost the taxpayers millions! Way to go Mayor Jerry!

I'm ok with that.

Yikes --- Unfortunately this is not good news:

http://www.courier-journal.com/comments/article/20100915/NEWS01/309150110/Tax-funding-for-KFC-Yum-Center-falls-short
Same thing happened with the Sprint Center here.

Hotel/rental car tax didn't generate the revenue it was supposed to, so the burden fell upon us taxpayers.

To be fair, the arena isn't yet finished, and numerous businesses and hotels in the designated district are still planned or are already under construction.

It is probably worth the tax money invested in it, whether or not the politicians claim on taxes is accurate or not. That's just how these sporting projects work. Everyone hates the upfront investment, but it winds up bringing in lots of new revenue over the long run. Just moving the U of L games downtown for 25 years or so is worth it alone, that's not even counting all the additional events that will be held there. It should be fine and it is a beautiful new addition to downtown; plus, the morale boost alone during this recession is a major benefit.

But, just saying, if you are looking to boost revenue - one way to do so is to let UK and Calipari host a home game or two in there each year. That would bring a lot of new dollars downtown (and perhaps a scowl or two from Pitino) :)

I'm ok with that.
Would you please pay my share then! This entire project has been a joke from stage one. All of that plus the fact that is going to look like a KFC billboard instead of an arena.....
Same thing happened with the Sprint Center here.

Hotel/rental car tax didn't generate the revenue it was supposed to, so the burden fell upon us taxpayers.
I'm assuming that your politicians are as corrupt as ours.
It is probably worth the tax money invested in it, whether or not the politicians claim on taxes is accurate or not. That's just how these sporting projects work. Everyone hates the upfront investment, but it winds up bringing in lots of new revenue over the long run. Just moving the U of L games downtown for 25 years or so is worth it alone, that's not even counting all the additional events that will be held there. It should be fine and it is a beautiful new addition to downtown; plus, the morale boost alone during this recession is a major benefit.
What's the big deal? Normal citizens can't afford to pay for tickets to attend basketball games in the new arena because prices have gone up so much. I'm sure it was a great morale boost to the politicians but common citizens just stand by and watch their tax dollars go down the drain.
But, just saying, if you are looking to boost revenue - one way to do so is to let UK and Calipari host a home game or two in there each year. That would bring a lot of new dollars downtown (and perhaps a scowl or two from Pitino) :)
Calipari won't be there that long before the NCAA finds violations against UK like they did the last places he was. Wherever he goes sanctions follow!

But, just saying, if you are looking to boost revenue - one way to do so is to let UK and Calipari host a home game or two in there each year. That would bring a lot of new dollars downtown (and perhaps a scowl or two from Pitino) :)

Once UK can get more than 12,000 fans to one of their games in Louisville then it may be worth it. Otherwise, it would just look goofy with the arena half full.

Once UK can get more than 12,000 fans to one of their games in Louisville then it may be worth it. Otherwise, it would just look goofy with the arena half full.
I believe they'll show up in greater numbers to experience the new arena.

Kentucky had 15,368 in their Freedom Hall game last year against Asheville, Im sure if they had a legit opponent it would have no problem filling the arena.

http://www.ukathletics.com/sports/m-baskbl/stats/2009-2010/uk1130.html

A college team is a weak primary tenant for a $250 million arena, they need to take every event they can get to make the arena financially viable.

Anybody got any new pictures they can post of this arena? The view from the construction cam isn't too great --- just an overhead shot that shows a huge amount of gray metal roof. It would be nice to see how the outside finishes are coming along and what type of landscaping is happening. Thanks in advance if anyone feels like posting any recent ground level shots.

Check out their facebook page and click on photos.

http://www.facebook.com/louisvillearena

Also check out the first and second page of this blog for some pics.

http://uoflcardgame.com/

These pictures were taken by ULoverUK at insidetheville:

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs319.ash2/59948_1643498607529_1238767430

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs656.snc4/61601_1643497607504_1238767430_1794665_1758993_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs718.snc4/63814_1643496527477_1238767430_1794663_6796205_n.jpg

This is the 2nd street entrace

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-ash2/hs336.ash2/61674_1643494527427_1238767430_1794659_7170738_n.jpg

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs648.snc4/60844_1643493807409_1238767430_1794657_5343003_n.jpg

This is Whiskey Row looking towards the arena. Four of the buildings have been rehabed or are currently under construction but one idividual owns the rest and is in a fight with preservationists. The owner wants to turn the remaining buildings into this... http://ironquarter.com/

http://sphotos.ak.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ak-snc4/hs645.snc4/60501_1643491447350_1238767430_1794647_6211839_n.jpg

Thanks for the pictures - and for the links. The more pictures I see - the more I like it. The interior shots especially are looking good. I think it actually looks better from the inside looking out then it does just looking at the outside. Anyway --- its getting there. There's definitely no doubt who bought the naming rights. Those are some big signs!

There's definitely no doubt who bought the naming rights. Those are some big signs!
I think it looks like a billboard from the outside than it does an Arena. I am very disappointed the Arena authority approved this look. Especially considering how little YUM actually paid for the naming rights! :ohno:

Isn't there a U of L Women's basketball practice open house coming up soon at the arena? If so - and anyone goes - be sure to give an update on what the place is like on the inside and post your opinions here.

Arena Open House News: http://nky.cincinnati.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/AB/20101011/NEWS0103/10120306/

Courier-Journal feature: http://www.courier-journal.com/section/sports0203&template=sports0203_fullpage

Have all of the Louisville Forumers gone into hibernation? or is it that you're just feeling pretty lackadaisical about this arena? The sparcity of discussion seems to show a real lack of interest in the opening of this arena. Is that true? -- or is it just that you've already had your say? Was there a Midnight Madness basketball practice? Did anybody attend? What are your thoughts about the place - now that its pretty much up and running? Does anyone care anymore? Is it the arena that is causing the lack of comments? -- or possibly a frustration that so many of the other big things that were supposed to be finishing up downtown around the same time aren't happening? There's got to be a few things worth mentioning -- aren't there? No one from Louisiville has posted on here in over two weeks - since Oct. 1st. Anyway -- Just missing the updates from Louisville, I guess. ... I'll keep checking back.

I know I personally will lean more towards posting in the Louisville Discussion thread, shiz the Arena is now open and this thread title still says UC. I really would like to get down there to check everything out but work has kept me from doing so. The closest I've gotten to the building since opening was coming from IN over the Kennedy at night. It has some incredibly bright lights facing the river that could've ran me off the road. I personally am really excited about it, I can't wait to go downtown and see West Main more lively than ever, and to get a thorough look into what they've done. The only thing I'm not enthused about right now (something that came along with the new Arena) is the Clark Memorial Bridge's repaint. Seriously, the whole bridge is going to be painted pastel yellow? I can't wait for Thunder to darken that up a bit...

Have all of the Louisville Forumers gone into hibernation? or is it that you're just feeling pretty lackadaisical about this arena? The sparcity of discussion seems to show a real lack of interest in the opening of this arena. Is that true? -- or is it just that you've already had your say? Was there a Midnight Madness basketball practice? Did anybody attend? What are your thoughts about the place - now that its pretty much up and running? Does anyone care anymore? Is it the arena that is causing the lack of comments? -- or possibly a frustration that so many of the other big things that were supposed to be finishing up downtown around the same time aren't happening? There's got to be a few things worth mentioning -- aren't there? No one from Louisiville has posted on here in over two weeks - since Oct. 1st. Anyway -- Just missing the updates from Louisville, I guess. ... I'll keep checking back.
The arena like everything else in Louisville is a boondoggle generated by our mayor for life Jerry Abramson who fortunately it finally leaving office at the end of the year! I have to laugh when I hear them say it's a $236 million dollar arena would in fact over $100 million was spent getting this site ready prior to this. It's something Louisville taxpayers as well as the state of Kentucky didn't really need that we will be paying for for a long time. Now we're stuck with a giant toaster oven that is decorated like a billboard!
The University of Louisville does not bother with midnight madness and all the associated hoopla. They just worry about playing basketball. My disinterest for this project has nothing to do with anything else downtown since they are all private projects.

Thanks for the opinions. Its good to hear the latest and hear some opinions. Looking forward to hearing more about what it will be like when the first big event is happening there.

First big men's b-ball game tonight. I'll be watching on ESPN.

Me too....go Dawgs...:okay:

Well............that sucked. Anyway, enjoy your new arena Louisvillians.....

Go CARDS! It's a great environment on game nights, everything I hoped it would be. All in all I think this arena will be well worth the investment all things considered. On a positive side note ,with economy down, small businesses were able to get established first around the arena, I know one of the biggest complaint about 4th St. on here is the lack of local businesses so its nice to see them get a nice foot hold downtown.

Well............that sucked. Anyway, enjoy your new arena Louisvillians.....
Just an update on why indyfan didn't like the outcome of last night's game. Louisville beat 16th ranked Butler 88-73 to christen the new arena in style.

Pitino was so excited about the game that he shot one down his leg at halftime.

Well I guess Butler has made up for this loss to Louisville. :nuts: Whoever would have thought this after their 14-9 start. In fact, whoever would have thought this period! I am heading over to the campus when the team comes in after midnight tonight. Should be a hoot.:okay:

Open for Basketball!

http://farm6.static.flickr.com/5225/5596717897_09744fc45c_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/65215866@N00/5596717897/)
Framed by the Kennedy Bridge (http://www.flickr.com/photos/65215866@N00/5596717897/) by Fleur-de-louis (http://www.flickr.com/people/65215866@N00/), on Flickr