Defense/Military- Developments News and Exports (ONLY) [Archive]

UnitedPakistan

January 26th, 2005, 04:14 AM

Pakistanunited if you were such an expert in military aviation matters you would realise the nonsensical assertions you just made are 'hot air'.
Either you don't know what the word induct means or you have absolutely no notion of what a military purchase is.
100 J-10's by 2010??? Come on, the aircraft cannot realistically be inducted before 2007/08, Even at an optimistic 200-300 JF-17's by 2010??? This is the mrate of 24 per annum we could only hope to have a maximum of 48-60 by 2010.
ost ridiculous statement made so far. The JF-17 will not be inducted until 2006 when 6 will be inducted for extensive trials and familiarisation training. The year after 14-20 will be inducted and then 20 per annum after that. So by the end of 2010, the absolute maximum inducted will be 86.
The reason I asked whether you were a member of Pakdef was because it would help you understand more about Pakistan's military and not make childlike sweeping statements.
PAK2000 - Pakistan does not possess any J-10's, China doesn't officially acknowledge that the aircraft exists!!! Pakistan will probably buy it, but not for a few years yet.

Aziz
Escuse me!

but i dont know what your problem is i guess your probaly ticked off because i insulted the allmighty JF-17

you idiot i was giving him what our airforce would look like after 2010!

Not saying that in 2010 we will induct 100 aircrafts!

thats impossible!!!

i dont need to familarize myself with the military yet it is you who needs to!

i have you know that i used to own a Military site

Aziz M

January 26th, 2005, 08:23 PM

In 2010 Pakistan will induct at least 100 J-10 and we will have 30 F-16 MLU including 200-300 JF-17

So are you agreeing with me that you do not know the meaning of 'induct'. Your statement states that 'in 2010 Pakistan will induct', this means bring into service, you should be more precise in your language.

Also, it's 'excuse me' not eScuse me, but I digress.

I'm not interested in starting an argument over who knows more about military affairs e.g. my dad's bigger than yours, I prefer to stick to the facts.

You may have owned a military web-site at one stage, can you provide me with a URL? If the web-site is now defunct I ask myself why? It is all very well owning a web-site, but what information did it contain and why was it not very popular (if indeed this was the case).

You have still provided no viable information as to why the JF-17 is 'a crappy plane'. We have established that it is BVR equipped, gives Pakistan a domestic aerospace capacity, has similar agility to early block F-16's, is able to deal with over 80% of India's current or projected combat aircraft and is reasonably priced, if you still don't get it then you may not be the aviation expert you profess to be. Your non membership of Pakdef also surprises me considering it is THE online resource point for Pakistani military news.

Anyway, i'm not interested in getting involved in a purile discussion with you, please provide factually correct information or don't bother replying.

Aziz

UnitedPakistan

January 27th, 2005, 12:39 AM

So are you agreeing with me that you do not know the meaning of 'induct'. Your statement states that 'in 2010 Pakistan will induct', this means bring into service, you should be more precise in your language.

Also, it's 'excuse me' not eScuse me, but I digress.

I'm not interested in starting an argument over who knows more about military affairs e.g. my dad's bigger than yours, I prefer to stick to the facts.

You may have owned a military web-site at one stage, can you provide me with a URL? If the web-site is now defunct I ask myself why? It is all very well owning a web-site, but what information did it contain and why was it not very popular (if indeed this was the case).

You have still provided no viable information as to why the JF-17 is 'a crappy plane'. We have established that it is BVR equipped, gives Pakistan a domestic aerospace capacity, has similar agility to early block F-16's, is able to deal with over 80% of India's current or projected combat aircraft and is reasonably priced, if you still don't get it then you may not be the aviation expert you profess to be. Your non membership of Pakdef also surprises me considering it is THE online resource point for Pakistani military news.

Anyway, i'm not interested in getting involved in a purile discussion with you, please provide factually correct information or don't bother replying.

Aziz
Dont be a smart ass with me

Reasons why the JF-17 is not fit for Pakistan:

1. No anti-ship role or any planning to do so

The Indian navy is larger
We dont have enough ships to protect our coast

I have not heard of any plans to equip it with an AShM so the Mirage 5PA3s will serve on for some time in the maritime strike role.

the JF-17 was supposed to replace most of our current fleet namely the Mirage and the A-5's but looks like until those J-10's come in we are gonna be screwed.

Anyways, since i no longer pay much attension to the military can you please tell me if the stupid Sweedish Saab Awacs went through?

UnitedPakistan

January 27th, 2005, 12:53 AM

Pakistan will have the J-10 option available by 2010 and will most likely get ToT or at least pursue it.

here are some pictures

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v197/kt10208/Military/e7e14c3c.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v197/kt10208/Military/02dd923f.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v197/kt10208/Military/J-103D-DefenseTalk.jpg

UnitedPakistan

January 27th, 2005, 12:55 AM

http://mil.jschina.com.cn/Files/Upfile/20041210121421281.jpg

http://mil.longhoo.net/bbs/attachments/2004122720526907_R8Ms.jpg

WS-10A testing

Lets hope its a sucess Chinese cant really make good turbofans :bash:

Aziz M

January 27th, 2005, 09:33 PM

You are totally wrong. Currently PAF only has 12 Mirage 5PA's equiped to fire the Exocet anti-ship missile. The JF-17 will be equiped with a wide variety of air to air and air to ground munition, this is more than likely to include the C-802 long range anti ship missile (Chinese copy of Exocet).

Pakistan's navy is also being considerably strengthened with

- 3-5 more domestically produced Agosta submarines in the pipeline.
- 4 Jiangwe II Frigates with technology transfer being ordered.
- 8 P3C Orions being ordered taking our total to 10 (exceptional coverage of
our coastline).
- 4 Z-9 Helicopters to be ordered in the Anti SUb role.
- 4 Fast attack vessels ordered.
- 4 Special service vessels on order.

The JF-17's will replace the Mirages and A5's as part of the lo-mix and additional F-16's and potential J-10's will be force additions and be the hi-mix.

I don't know why you refer to the Saab AWACS as stupid. But anyway, it was tested in Pakistan late last year, no news on the outcome and the next official news we can probably expect is an order. Strong rumours are circulating that the Saudi's may come in on the project and fund it in exchange for sending Pakistani forces to KSA.

Aziz

UnitedPakistan

January 27th, 2005, 09:49 PM

I didnt call the specific AWAC's stupid i was just showing my frustration with the AWACS deal

Aziz M

January 27th, 2005, 10:56 PM

Ok, but hopefully your frustration will soon be at an end when a deal is signed.

Aziz

UnitedPakistan

January 28th, 2005, 02:59 AM

if it gets signed remember the Gripens

HasanB

January 28th, 2005, 07:00 PM

Saudis want Pakistani troops in Saudi ?? Now that would certainly be interesting !! Why do they want us there ?

UnitedPakistan

January 28th, 2005, 07:05 PM

To protect the "royal" family

We have many Special Services Group soldiers in Saudi Arabia

I have even heard that they want us to build Nuclear Silo's and we control it!!!!

HasanB

January 28th, 2005, 07:12 PM

To protect the "royal" family

We have many Special Services Group soldiers in Saudi Arabia

I have even heard that they want us to build Nuclear Silo's and we control it!!!!

Now that is certainly interesting ... can you imagine our troops on the soil of firstly the holiest land in Islam ... and secondly well our troops will therefore be in and controlling parts of Saudi. I think it may be a sort of changeover whereby a number of American forces would leave ... to be replaced by the forces of a muslim country. I think thats what they may be trying to do.

UnitedPakistan

January 28th, 2005, 07:13 PM

Did you know that the Saudi family built a palace OVERLOOKING MECCA!

HOW SCREWED UP IS THAT?

i say pull everything and everyone we got thier

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:01 AM

http://www.student.cs.uwaterloo.ca/~maanwer/images/Pakistan%20Air%20Force%20wallpaper%201%20copy.jpg

F-16 A&B
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/F16_GreenFrountires.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/2.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/f1607.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/F16_IX.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/f1639.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/f-16c.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/F-16B_Traning.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F16/F-16small.jpg

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:03 AM

JF-17 (FC-1/Super-7)

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/FC1_Side.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/fc1_cv.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/mvc-015f.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_New_001.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/FC1_Lines_2.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/FC1_Lines_1.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_001.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_002.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_003.jpg

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:06 AM

Army Photos

Special Services Group (SSG) Commandos

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/SSG/SSG_03.JPG

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/SSG/SSG_01.gif

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/SSG/SSG_05.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/SSG/SSG_04.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/SSG/SSG_06.jpg

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:07 AM

I'll post more later...

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:08 AM

I'll post more later!

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:09 AM

UN Peacekeepers

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/PakArmy_UN_MONUC_Medals_UN_001.gif
Peacekeepers are awarded medals at a ceremony in the Democratic Republic of Congo for MONUC. (March 2002). The Democratic Republic of the Congo and five regional States signed the Lusaka Ceasefire Agreement in July 1999. The UN Security Council set up MONUC on 30 November 1999 to maintain liaison with parties to the conflict and carry out other tasks. On 24 February 2000, the Council expanded the mission's mandate and size to include up to 5,537 military personnel and 500 observers. [Image Credit: UN]

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/PakArmy_UN_UNAMSIL_SierraLeone_UN_002.jpg
United Nations Peace Keeping Mission UNAMSIL in Sierra Leone. Ballot boxes arrive in Kono. On 22 October 1999, the Security Council established UNAMSIL to cooperate with the Government and the other parties in implementing the Lome Peace Agreement and to assist in the implementation of the disarmament, demobilization and reintegration plan. On 7 February 2000, the Council revised UNAMSIL's mandate. It also expanded its size, as it did once again on 19 May 2000 and on 30 March 2001. [Image Credit: UN]

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/PakArmy_UN_UNAMSIL_SierraLeone_UN_003.jpg
United Nations Peace Keeping Mission UNAMSIL in Sierra Leone. Delivering ballot boxes. [Image Credit: UN]

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/PakBDArmy_UN_%20MONUCL_Congo_UN_004_.jpg
Bangladeshi and Pakistani troops parade, Monday, September 1, 2003 at N'drodo camp in Bunia, Congo, during a handover ceremony.

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/UN_007.jpg
A United Nations peace-keeping soldier from Pakistan demonstrating the use of a mine detector at a de-mining school set up to train local armed forces. [Image Credit: UN]

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/UNSMIH%20_Hati_UN_005.jpg
United Nations Support Mission in Haiti UNSMIH peace-keeping soldier from Pakistan on patrol in the streets of Port-au-Prince [Image Credit: UN]

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/UNPeaceKeeping/UNSMIH_Hati_UN_006.jpg
United Nations Support Mission in Haiti UNSMIH peace-keeping soldier from Pakistan on look-out from his observation post near the Port-au-Prince [Image Credit: UN]

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 03:11 AM

Navy Photos

Agosta 90B

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/agosta12.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/Agosta2_PNS_Saad.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/Agosta2_PNS_Saad_2.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/Agosta2_PNS_Saad_3.jpg

Sharif110

February 1st, 2005, 05:29 PM

http://www.urbanpakistan.com/images/topics/griffon.jpg

http://groups.msn.com/Pakistan2000/larmepakistanaise.msnw there are photo's of the Pak Army.

cntower

February 1st, 2005, 05:32 PM

Is that a hovercraft?

Sharif110

February 1st, 2005, 05:32 PM

Pakistani Navy

http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn10.jpg
http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn4.jpg
http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn5.jpg
http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn3.jpg
http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn1.jpg
http://www.pakistanpage.net/gallery/main/pn2.jpg

Sharif110

February 1st, 2005, 05:43 PM

yes you can seen more photo's here, http://www.pakistanidefence.com (http://www.pakistanidefance.com) the official site in English about the pakistan Army

HasanB

February 1st, 2005, 07:00 PM

Great work cntower and sharif !! Great photos !!

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 01:11 PM

Yes is it

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 01:22 PM

AH-1 Cobra

http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/cobra10.gif
http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/COBRA04.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/pa_cobra3.gif
http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/101.jpg

Fighting Falcon F-16

http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/F1623.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/F1609.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/paf_puma/F1605.jpg

TallBox

February 2nd, 2005, 01:33 PM

cool

do you have any ideas about the numbers of these aircraft in service in the paf?

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 01:34 PM

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 01:36 PM

Oups, sorry for the 2 post

Shaun: yes you can seen that here (http://www.pakistanidefence.com/PakAirForce/PAF_Inventory.html)

cntower

February 2nd, 2005, 03:03 PM

cool

do you have any ideas about the numbers of these aircraft in service in the paf?

I'd take a look at: http://www.pakistanidefenceforum.com

You can always find some info there...

cntower

February 2nd, 2005, 03:05 PM

How many hovercraft does the PN have?

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 05:55 PM

boh? I don't know

Sharif110

February 2nd, 2005, 05:57 PM

boh? I don't know. I think you can seen that in the official Site of the pakistan army

http://www.pakistanidefence.com look to the navy rubric

cntower

February 2nd, 2005, 06:51 PM

http://us.news2.yimg.com/us.yimg.com/p/afp/20050202/capt.sge.gzn06.020205110608.photo00.photo.default-384x277.jpg

cntower

February 4th, 2005, 01:53 PM

Pakistan Requests F-16 Fighters From U.S.
Thu Feb 3,11:46 AM ET World - AP Asia

By SADAQAT JAN, Associated Press Writer

ISLAMABAD, Pakistan - A senior U.S. defense official said Thursday that Washington is considering an appeal from Pakistan for F-16 fighter aircraft — a request that has received a muted response from the United States in previous years.

U.S. Undersecretary of Defense Douglas Feith would not say whether the two sides were close to reaching any deal. "It is an important issue, and it will be dealt with at the right time," he told reporters in Rawalpindi, a garrison city near Islamabad.

Earlier, Feith took part in a meeting of the Pakistan-U.S. Defense Consultative Group — a forum set up in 1984 to promote military cooperation between the two countries. Defense Secretary Hamid Nawaz Khan led the Pakistani side in the talks.

Pakistan is a key ally of the United States in its war on terrorism. Washington recently agreed to sell $1.2 billion in weapons to Pakistan, but the deal doesn't include the F-16 aircraft that Islamabad has long desired.

Pakistan struck a deal with the United States to buy two dozen fighter jets in the late 1980s, but the agreement was scrapped in the 1990s when Washington imposed sanctions on Islamabad over its nuclear weapons program.

Pakistan's longtime rival, India, opposes the sale of F-16s. Yet Pakistan already has some of the fighter jets, acquired in the early and mid 1980s. In Thursday's talks, Pakistan again asked U.S. officials to help it get F-16 fighter aircraft.

Feith said the issue "is one that continues to remain under consideration." Standing next to Feith, Khan said both sides made "tangible progress in many areas," including the F-16 issue. But he gave no details.

"There is a lot of hope in the air," Khan said. Feith said military cooperation between the United States and Pakistan has improved. "Defense ties between the U.S. and Pakistan are good, and they got better over the course of our talks," he said.

On the war on terrorism, Feith said Pakistan had been "quite active" in going after al-Qaida, including groups that fled from Afghanistan (news - web sites) — although some elements of the terror network appeared to remain in Pakistan.

Feith, however, stressed the importance of the "ideological element" of the war on terrorism. "Merely taking down networks won't win the war. We also have to address the flow of people into terrorist organizations," he said.

Do you think the US will give us the planes? Serioulsy we deserve them; not only did we already PAY for them we're the most important ally of the US in there War on Terror in Afganistan. Without us Afganistan would be another Iraq!

omersheikh

February 8th, 2005, 07:40 AM

Did you know that the Saudi family built a palace OVERLOOKING MECCA!

HOW SCREWED UP IS THAT?

i say pull everything and everyone we got thier

why is that screwed up? i don't thik to much needs to be read into tha.

Does pakistan have any aircraft carriers, if so ho much do they cost.

how high would you put pakistans army in comparison to others, explainplease.

UnitedPakistan

February 8th, 2005, 06:49 PM

No aircraft carriers because we have no need for them

I would rank our army higher then the US BECAUSE WE BEAT THEM IN MANY MANY COMPETITIONS FOR ACCURACY

oogabooga

February 8th, 2005, 06:49 PM

UnitedPakistan

February 9th, 2005, 07:16 PM

This is very interesting news. Aziz could you please provide us with some more detail or perhaps a link to the source? I think if Pakistan sends troops to Saudi Arabia then it would further highlight Pakistan as a Global Power. Secondly Saudi investment is going to start pouring in. I think this would be a very mutually beneficial agreement. :)
i already said that we have SSG in Saudia Arabia

they even want nuclear silo's :runaway:

oogabooga

February 10th, 2005, 01:09 AM

i already said that we have SSG in Saudia Arabia

they even want nuclear silo's :runaway:

Source?

UnitedPakistan

February 10th, 2005, 01:34 AM

dawn is where i read or use the search feature or use google

Aziz M

February 10th, 2005, 10:05 PM

Ooogabooga if you go to www.pakdef.info/forum and use the search function you will be able to see all sources for the information I have provided.

Aziz

cntower

February 15th, 2005, 03:42 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/ArmyPersonnel/Army_Personnel_008.JPE

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/ArmyPersonnel/LoCArmy_Personnel_009.jpe

cntower

February 15th, 2005, 03:43 PM

Al-Khalid Main Battle Tank
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/MBT/Al_Khalid_MBT/alkhalid_rareview.jpg

T-85IIAP Main Battle
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/MBT/T85IIAP_MainBattleTank_Pics/T-85IIAP_CopyrightedPakistaniDefencecom_001.gif

T-80UD Main Battle
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/MBT/T80UD_MBT/T80UD.jpg

cntower

February 15th, 2005, 03:44 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/PN_Dock_JpnShip.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Navy%20Pics/PN_Dock_JpnShip2.jpg

cntower

February 15th, 2005, 03:45 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/C130_Landing.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/CobraFormation.jpg

cntower

February 15th, 2005, 03:46 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/F-16inLahore.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/F-16Pilot.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/F-16.jpg

NotiS

February 27th, 2005, 06:04 AM

Hmmm it looks like a modified F-16 with influences from the Mirage or Rafale fighter aircraft.

What about weapons, sensors and avionincs?

From what i know the Chinese are only good in copying Russian designs and upgrading them from time to time without showing anything impressive.

UnitedPakistan

February 27th, 2005, 06:37 AM

its a continuation of the Lavi Project of Isreal

Marshal

March 11th, 2005, 03:54 AM

J10 program is basically cancelled as even CHina is not showing interest in it anymore (what to say about PAF) as flankers are making their way into PLAAF!

Maybe its "research" will be inducted in another program or some sino european venture since EU is willing to life military sanctions!

Marshal

March 11th, 2005, 03:59 AM

Ooogabooga if you go to www.pakdef.info/forum and use the search function you will be able to see all sources for the information I have provided.

Aziz

One SSG anti-terror unit has been stationed for ages to "protect" the Royal Family!

The point is what's going on with the additional troops as rumors abounded that abdul aziz visited last year about troops as external threat otherwise, apparently the royals don't trust thier own arab forces to be loyal to them???

It is like saddam hussain created special republican guards in its army to protect himself (regular troops weren't even allowed in baghdad)..

Marshal

March 11th, 2005, 04:01 AM

And the whole SAAB deal is rubbish!!!

Either the PAF is being too secretive (which it isn't as not even janes mentions it anymore) or nothing is there....

SOmething concrete needs to be seen than just 'rumours'

UnitedPakistan

March 11th, 2005, 03:52 PM

UnitedPakistan

March 11th, 2005, 03:54 PM

One SSG anti-terror unit has been stationed for ages to "protect" the Royal Family!

The point is what's going on with the additional troops as rumors abounded that abdul aziz visited last year about troops as external threat otherwise, apparently the royals don't trust thier own arab forces to be loyal to them???

It is like saddam hussain created special republican guards in its army to protect himself (regular troops weren't even allowed in baghdad)..
Pakistanis arent arabs

oogabooga

March 11th, 2005, 04:20 PM

See what I was saying Marshal? :)

UnitedPakistan

March 11th, 2005, 04:21 PM

you are obviously here to cause trouble i am going to have to ask you to leave

Marshal

March 11th, 2005, 04:32 PM

what are you talking about?

Here you go,

"The J-10 is expected to achieve initial operating capability by 2005~2006, and the first operational regiment of the J-10 is reported to be the PLAAF 44th Aviation Division based in Sichuan Province. The PLAAF was estimated to have a total requirement of 300 aircraft, but this may be reduced to less than 100 as a result of the introduction of the more capable Su-30MK multirole fighter. The CAC is also trying to replace the Russian AL-31F with the indigenously developed WS-10A, which is said to be a Chinese copy of the AL-31FN. The J-10 may become available for export market in 2005~2006."

http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/j10.asp

Marshal

March 11th, 2005, 04:34 PM

See what I was saying Marshal? :)

Let's hear it..

UnitedPakistan

March 19th, 2005, 06:00 PM

PN and French navy to hold joint exercises

KARACHI: French fleet Commander in Indian Ocean Maritime Zone Vice Admiral Xavier Rolin says France and Pakistan will conduct joint naval exercises by the end of this month or first week of April.

He was talking to Pakistan Observer in an exclusive interview at a reception hosted by the Consul General of France in Karachi Jean-Yves Berthault.

The French Navy Commander who leads a 14-ship armada headed by a nuclear submarine said he carried out discussions with Commander Pakistan Fleet Vice Admiral Mohammad Haroon and Commander Karachi Rear Admiral Asad Qureshi at their respective offices to give final shape to the joint exercises. He had also called on Chairman KPT Vice Admiral Ahmed Hayat to know about port operations.

He disclosed that the French ships were also assisting a joint task force of 10 ships from Pakistan, US and Europe in combating terrorism and piracy on sea. There were apprehensions that the attack on Gwadar Port that killed three Chinese engineers and injured many could have been launched from sea. “So we have intensified patrol and taken extra precautions with an increased vigilance to protect the Gulf and Arabian Sea regions.

March 19th, 2005, 07:54 PM

Good news!

HasanB

March 21st, 2005, 11:33 AM

Yeah, as far as i know Pakistan has always had good relations with the french militarily and otherwise too. For example, Pakistan maintains a large fleet of mirage aircraft and then of course there are the Agosta class submarines.

Marshal

March 21st, 2005, 06:25 PM

Yeah the Pakistani flying coffins!!!

:D

UnitedPakistan

March 21st, 2005, 06:55 PM

how are they fly coffins? u may mean the F-7's?

UnitedPakistan

March 21st, 2005, 07:02 PM

Here you go,

"The J-10 is expected to achieve initial operating capability by 2005~2006, and the first operational regiment of the J-10 is reported to be the PLAAF 44th Aviation Division based in Sichuan Province. The PLAAF was estimated to have a total requirement of 300 aircraft, but this may be reduced to less than 100 as a result of the introduction of the more capable Su-30MK multirole fighter. The CAC is also trying to replace the Russian AL-31F with the indigenously developed WS-10A, which is said to be a Chinese copy of the AL-31FN. The J-10 may become available for export market in 2005~2006."

http://www.sinodefence.com/airforce/fighter/j10.asp
J-10 IS WHAT PAKISTAN NEEDS NOT FLANKERS SO THIS NEWS ITEM IS NOT TO OUR CONCERN

Marshal

March 21st, 2005, 10:56 PM

J-10 IS WHAT PAKISTAN NEEDS NOT FLANKERS SO THIS NEWS ITEM IS NOT TO OUR CONCERN

Are you a retard or what?? :weirdo:

Even China is reducing its production (no news what's happening with the whole project as of now i.e. is it going in the experimental dustbin??) and if even CHina is not interested, what makes you think PAF is when it wasn't in the past either when China was DEFINITELY INTERESTED in J-10!

Unless there is western (european) or russian (unlikely) input in the plane, it is a dead game!

UnitedPakistan

March 22nd, 2005, 12:57 AM

it doesnt say they arent intrested!

and would u mind putting up the figures of how much money china has put into this also including the amount of time put in Chine is not backing out, they will use it for export purposes if need be.

Marshal

March 22nd, 2005, 02:32 AM

Abbey gashti go find a customer instead of bother us intelllects!

And what's new if this ends up as experimental garbage, many failed chinese projects habe gone that way!

HasanB

March 22nd, 2005, 04:53 AM

Yeah the Pakistani flying coffins!!!

:D

nah dude Pakistan I believe has the advanced versions of the mirage fighters, i think they are actually pretty high quality fighters. The F-7 chinese aircraft (Ive been in one of these !) is rather crude indeed, you may have been referring to these. I think the entire F-7 fleet is about to be replaced anyway. Perhaps PakistanUnited will have more details on this ...

UnitedPakistan

March 22nd, 2005, 04:55 AM

F-7 to be replaced by JF-17

HasanB

March 22nd, 2005, 05:31 AM

Can we please discuss the issue here in a calm manner, obviously you two disagree on this, but calm down or the topic will be locked. Thanks.

Aziz M

March 22nd, 2005, 02:34 PM

This sinodefence report is contradicting all other reports on the J10. China has not ordered any further Su30's and actually tried to cancelled its licence for the Su27. The J-10 is already in service, and according to reports from Air Forces Monthly the Chinese are looking to increase production to around 60 per annum.

The Chinese are also working on a more advanced J-10 due to be available in 2009.

Pakistan is very interested in the J10 and this has been stated by the Air Chief Marshal and the JF-17 project Director. Currently PAF is concentrating on the JF-17. We can expect a deal for J-10's within the next two years and with deliveries beginning 2008/9.

We also continuing to pursue F-16's due to their quick availablity and excellent price.

Aziz

Marshal

March 22nd, 2005, 06:48 PM

How can deliveries start when the first operational prototype hasn't even flown yet??

The whole J-10 project is shrowded in history.. and frankly, I don't see what good J-10 can offer against having flankers??
And maybe Su27 was cancelled since china might be more interested in reverse engineering the newer su30 mkk's!

UnitedPakistan

April 2nd, 2005, 12:26 AM

Ballistic missile test-fired

RAWALPINDI, March 31: Pakistan successfully test-fired a short-range surface-to-surface ballistic missile Hattaf-II/Abdali, says a press release of Inter Services Public Relations issued here on Thursday.

The missile is capable of reaching targets up to 180 kilometres and can carry all types of war heads. All desired technical parameters were validated. As part of the usual confidence-building measures, prior notification of the test had been given to all concerned. -APP

UnitedPakistan

April 2nd, 2005, 02:30 AM

PDF is a shit site full of anti minority bastards

zees

April 6th, 2005, 12:39 PM

President General Pervez Musharraf Tuesday described the launch of JF-17 thunder aircraft production project as a giant leap towards indigenization and self-reliance. Addressing the launch ceremony of the production project of the multi-role fighter plane, jointly developed by Pakistan and China, the President said it reflects time-tested friendship between the two countries.

http://www.urbanpakistan.com/images/topics/jf17.jpg

The time-tested, all-weather and deep-rooted Pakistan-China friendship is going from strength to strength and will be further enhanced with the visit of Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao," he said hours before the arrival of Chinese leader for a three-day visit to Islamabad to re-enforce the relationship between the two nations.

"Pakistan has come a long way and stands at the threshold of a major leap forward by acquiring indigenous capability of manufacturing the JF-17 aircraft, which will form the backbone of Pakistan Air Force," he said at Pakistan Aeronautical Complex.

Pakistan, he said, stands for peace but jealously guards its sovereignty.

Pakistan has evaluated requirements of its armed forces for the next 15 years and declared that the country has both resources and skilled manpower to meet the targets of next 15 years and maintain and upgrade its defense. The President unveiled a plaque to mark the launch of the project at the ceremony, which was attended by Defense Minister Rao Sikander Iqbal, Information Minister Sheikh Rashid Ahmed Defense Production Minister Habibullah Warriach, Services Chiefs and senior officials. The President observed that Pakistan has identified certain targets for its air force and one of them is acquisition of high-tech aircraft like F-16, which will come by.

The President however added that the country would also continue to look for other options of the state-of-the-art fighter planes as it would be in line with the Government's policy of diversification.

With the induction of the state-of-the-art fighter planes, he said, Pakistan Air Force will become a force to reckon with.

"It is a momentous occasion for Pakistan and PAF," he said, observing that Sino-Pak collaboration in the field of defense is very significant, especially in conventional weapons.

"The joint production of Jf-17 symbolizes the great friendship which the two countries enjoy. It is deeper than oceans and higher than mountains. We would continue to maintain this friendship," he said.

The indigenization of JF-17 will lead to several benefits including acquisition of advanced technology and expertise, self-reliance capability, enhancement of growth in the private sector, creation of job opportunities, poverty reduction and socio-economic development of the area, he said.

The President commended the hard work, commitment and dedication of both Pakistani and Chinese experts, engineers and technicians, who contributed to the development of the project and offered them congratulations on the landmark occasion.

zees

April 6th, 2005, 12:59 PM

KAMRA: Musharraf inaugurated the production project of JF-17 thunder fighter jets in Aeronautical Complex.

Some of the jets would expectedly hand over to Pakistan Air Force till December 2006.

Pakistan and China singed an agreement in 1999 for the production followed by the training of Pakistani engineers in China.

After the production of airframe and avionics, Pakistan would join the club of countries having expertise in airplane production.

So basically, 50% of the plane would be made in Pakistan ?

zees

April 6th, 2005, 01:16 PM

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y38/Urbanpakistan/f22p_frigate.jpg

Pakistan and China on Monday signed contracts for the construction of F-22P frigate ships for Pakistan Navy, officials said.

The signing ceremony was held at Ministry of Defense Production, a Defense Ministry spokesman said..

"Both sides signed four contracts for the construction of state-of- the-art F-22P frigates with all related equipment/systems with special element of transfer of technology (ToT)," the official said.

"These ships, after construction, will be inducted into Pakistan Navy which would not only enhance the operational capabilities of Pakistan Navy, but will also help to make impregnable the seaward defense of Pakistan," he added.

According to defense sources, the F-22P frigates will be equipped with helicopters specially designed for anti-submarine warfare, surface to surface and surface to air missiles along with numerous associated self-defense systems.

China is Pakistan's neighbor in the northern Himalayan region and one of Islamabad's staunchest allies. China and Pakistan's ties date back several decades, and are deep-rooted. Both the countries are regularly involved in a number of joint defense projects, such as the JF-17 (Joint Fighter 17) aircraft.

Chinese Premier Wen Jiabao is scheduled to arrive Tuesday to attend a conference on promoting economic cooperation in Asia and to meet on the sideline with Pakistani leaders.

Wen will hold talks with the President Pervez Musharraf and his Pakistani counterpart, Prime Minister Shaukat Aziz during the three-day visit, Foreign Ministry Spokesman Jalil Abbas Jilani told a news conference on Monday.

UnitedPakistan

April 6th, 2005, 01:28 PM

most of the plane except the Russian Engine, avionics and a few other things

Sultan

April 6th, 2005, 11:12 PM

most of the plane except the Russian Engine, avionics and a few other things

JF-17 will use Chinesse avionics, and the ToT would come with time. The Chinesse are also producing there own version of the Russian Engine. The Chinesse version is called the WS-10, or something like that, and we'd get ToT for that as well.

Sultan

April 6th, 2005, 11:13 PM

http://www.urbanpakistan.com/images/specials/musharraf_jf17_model.jpg

KAMRA: President Musharraf being presented a model of the JF-17 plane by Kaleem Saddat, on the inauguration ceremony of the JF-17 production plant in Kamra. JF-17 is a Sino-Pak plane, jointly produced by both Pakistan and China.

UnitedPakistan

April 7th, 2005, 12:22 AM

are you sure you arent getting confused with the WZ-10, J-10 engine?

Marshal

April 7th, 2005, 03:24 AM

JF-17 will use Chinesse avionics, and the ToT would come with time. The Chinesse are also producing there own version of the Russian Engine. The Chinesse version is called the WS-10, or something like that, and we'd get ToT for that as well.

Care to give me a DEFINITE source that says it will have a chinese engine???

THe chinese engines are underpowered and the best that China can give (in case of russian refusal) would a notched up MiG-21 (F-7) engine, NOTHING MORE!!

And that would be underpowered.. :weirdo:

Marshal

April 7th, 2005, 03:48 AM

And oh yea,

PAF doesn't like Chinese avionics!!! :D

Aryan

April 7th, 2005, 03:49 PM

From what I've heard from Chinese sources, the WS-10A is turning out to be a pretty powerful beast. I'm not quite sure on its t/w ratio, but its said to have a trust of 25,000lbs, and is said to be superior to the Russian AL-31F engine the J-10 was using.

But with all the engine problems the JF-17 is having, as well as teh recent F-16 agreement, I'm worried the PAF/PLAAF might ditch it, which would be a real shame.

UnitedPakistan

April 7th, 2005, 06:58 PM

Its too late to ditch it by the way the WZ-10 is engine they are working on for the J-10

Aryan

April 7th, 2005, 11:59 PM

The correct designation is WS-10. WZ-10 is the name of a Chinese attack helicopter.

UnitedPakistan

April 8th, 2005, 03:28 AM

i got my WS mixed up sorry but yes its WS-10

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=173881

zees

April 8th, 2005, 08:52 AM

http://www.centurychina.com/plaboard/uploads/1_F22Pfrigate.jpg

elitecavalier

April 16th, 2005, 10:16 AM

The Chinese J-10 is equal to a BLK 52 F-16. its a cross bettween an F-16 and an SU-27. It was orginally intented for competition to the SU-27 but that has changed now.

UnitedPakistan

April 16th, 2005, 03:25 PM

Well Isreal went for the F-16 and trashed the project thats where china comes in

zees

April 21st, 2005, 06:30 AM

The Karachi Shipyard and Engineering Works has planned to start construction work on F-22P frigates, a fighting class warship, for the Pakistan Navy.

The frigates will be built in association with Chinese experts.

At present, the KSEW is busy in constructing two 250-ton fast patrol crafts, which will be handed over to the Navy in June this year.

General Manager Design and Shipbuilding KSEW, Capt Sarfaraz Inayatullah, presenting a report at a seminar on "Prospects of Shipping in Developing Eight Countries" here on Wednesday, said an institute of technology had been established in the KSEW for rapid transformation of ship-building technology.

"Efforts are in hand to augment the design department of shipyard and turn it into design bureau," he said.

He said the shipyard management was trying hard to improve productivity and bring qualitative changes.

"KSEW will be turned into a precision engineering yard by re-engineering its whole management system and improving the foundry and inducting high technology," he added.

The workforce of the shipyard was being imparted new generation skills capable of meeting future challenges, he said.

On the occasion, Federal Secretary Ports and Shipping, Fazal-ur-Rehman, said the transport industry particularly the shipping sector faced great challenges emanating from various directions.

Inaugurating a two-day seminar on the topic of "Prospects of Shipping in Developing Eight Countries", he said for D8 countries the issues related to shipping had lately acquired top priority status.

"Globally almost all matters related to trade and commerce are being handled under different parameters in the post-9/11 scenario," he said.

"We need to improve and continue to improve our productivity and services in terms of quality and economy," he told the seminar organised by the Directorate of Ports and Shipping in collaboration with the Ministry of Foreign Affairs.

He appreciated the efforts of Director General Ports and Shipping, Capt Anwar Shah, for upgrading the Pakistan Marine Academy to Marine University and said the D8 countries could make use of this institute.

Earlier welcoming the participants, Capt Anwar Shah said the purpose of the seminar was to examine the prospects of very vital industry of shipping in the group and establish a D8 Shipping Business Forum to create a relationship and coordinated shipping activities within the framework of D8 Charter so that trade and transport were institutionalised in broader perspective. He suggested D8 countries must consider mutual cooperation and assist each other in simplifying and improving visa procedures not only for seafarers but also for other business and working class.

Marshal

April 24th, 2005, 06:45 AM

F22 is a long-term project as I read while Pakistan needs something good for its fleet now..

I thought (read) that PN was interested in ex-USN warships??

UnitedPakistan

April 24th, 2005, 04:24 PM

I hope not or do i?

Remember the Ghazi was also a ex-USN sub. The Ghazi served well but i am skeptical of using old USN navy ships now

Marshal

April 24th, 2005, 06:59 PM

I hope not or do i?

Remember the Ghazi was also a ex-USN sub. The Ghazi served well but i am skeptical of using old USN navy ships now

Well do you think Type-21s are any better??

They are the veterans of the falkland war.. lol :D

And what other option does PN have??? Also looking at the corruption angle (how money for R&D or buying stuff is siphoned off by superiors..) the other biggest mistake (or kickback) the navy did was "leasing" INSTEAD of buying the damn ships so US basically cut the lease and gutted the ships (as they were too old for USN anyway) while leaving PN in a hole that it barely tried to fill...

I am talking about what about now?? since government is making all sorts of tall claims about gawadar, pasni, ormara etc. ports and with that you will need more ships and support a/c / vessels to patrol the high seas as well otherwise more bases wouldn't mean too much as then in today's case, there will be too many gaps in the pakistani zone..

UnitedPakistan

April 24th, 2005, 07:06 PM

The F-22 and will serve fine for now i think we can go to the turks for anything else we need for our navy as both our nations have a huge friendship!

Hope

April 29th, 2005, 01:44 PM

A German firm dealing in communication systems used by armed forces and law-enforcement agencies will shortly sign $200 million agreements with Pakistan President of the Rohde and Schwarz, Friedrich N. Schwarz, said at a press conference on Wednesday that his firm was one of the leading companies dealing in defence communication systems and it would invest $200 million annually in Pakistan.

“The firm was responsible to establish the first national frequency management and monitoring system for the Frequency Allocation Board,” he said.

The company, with the cooperation of the Pakistan Telecommunication Authority, would create awareness on quality service matters relating to GSM operators, he said.

“We would also provide technical support to all GSM operators to maintain quality and standard so that their subscribers could be facilitated,” he said.

He said his was the first foreign company which had directly invested in Pakistan without any government support in the field of communication and information technology.

The investment, he said, would allow development of local technical support and skills, employment generation and knowledge transfer.

Mr Schwarz said his company was providing its services to 70 countries.

He claimed that 80 per cent of GSM mobile phone sets in the world had been tested by his firm and 50 per cent Airbus and Boeing planes had its air communication system.

The company deals with testing and management instruments and system for communication and electronic systems for regulatory authorities and government agencies, radio communication, professional mobile radio, communication security, sound and TV broadcasting and measuring equipment.

zees

May 10th, 2005, 06:15 AM

Pakistan will begin production of the sophisticated JF-17 fighter aircraft this year, senior military officials said on Monday.

The light weight, all weather and multi-role aircraft is jointly being developed by Pakistan and China.

"The small batch production of JF-17 would begin in the second half of this year," Chairman Pakistan Aeronautical Complex (PAC), Air Marshal Aurangzeb and Chief Project Director of JF-17 Air Vice Marshal Shahid Latif told newsmen at Kamra.

The first consignment of four aircraft would be delivered to PAC Kamra in December next year. Another batch of four aircraft would be ready by March 2007.

The officials said fifty percent of the airframe would initially be manufactured in Pakistan and it would progressively be enhanced to hundred percent. Similarly, cooperation with original equipment manufacturers would be expanded over a period of time for co-production of avionics systems.

Twenty-two avionics systems would be co-produced at PAC including radar, self-protection jammer, high tech flight control and mission computers.

The aircraft would be capable of carrying short range, beyond visual range, anti-ship as well as anti radiation missiles. There would also be provision of carrying high and low drag bombs, laser guided, runway penetration and cluster bombs.

It would be equipped with state-of-the-art avionics package to provide an all weather navigation and attack capability. The state of the art on-board multimode radar would have the capability to track multiple targets and its advanced electronic warfare suite will have self protection and jamming capabilities.

The chairman PAC said the JF-17 project would ensure availability of a contemporary, affordable and sustainable weapon system for the PAF capable of meeting its operation requirements.

"There is also possibility of payback of the financial investment and profitability through aircraft sales to foreign countries as already a number of countries are showing keen interest in the aircraft," he added.

Replying to a question, he said the Aircraft Manufacturing Factory of the PAC is developing a high speed long range drone known as Comet.

It will have a speed of 300 kilometer per hour and a range of 60 kilometer with take off weight of 85 kilograms.

He also revealed that the PAC would soon start manufacturing aviation parts for Boeing 747, 767 and 777 aircraft under an arrangement with the Boeing company. "The know-how thus gained would also help in establishing JF-17 production line.

"The PAC has also recently completed avionics upgrade of Mirage aircraft in collaboration with French company Sagem. This modification substantially increased the air to air and air to ground precision weapons release capability of the aircraft," the official added.

"Similarly, F-16 engines are also upgraded to increase their operating life and performance characteristics saving 30 million dollars." To a question Air Marshal Aurangzeb said eight more Mushak aircraft are ready for delivery to Saudi Arabia by the end of this month.

"Another five would be delivered in September this year, completing the deal of twenty Mushak," he said.

Pakistan is also planning to introduce more state-of-the art F-16 fighter jets after the United States agreed to sell them to Islamabad in March after two decades of refusal. Pakistan bought 40 F-16s in the early 1980s when the country was serving as a base for the US-backed resistance against the former Soviet Union’s occupation of Afghanistan.

But another order for the purchase of 70 F-16s in the late 1980s failed to materialize because the United States imposed sanctions on the country for its clandestine nuclear programme. After almost a decade, Pakistan got its money back, having paid for the planes in advance.

UnitedPakistan

May 10th, 2005, 06:15 PM

This is a first for Pakistan!

MUBARAK HO!

We can finally create a aircraft at home

Lets hope we can get a nice 4th generation fighter now

Marshal

May 10th, 2005, 08:06 PM

What about the engine??

Russia has refused to export engines for third parties (i.e. Pakistan) and only to China..

Anyone?? :nuts:

:badnews:

UnitedPakistan

May 10th, 2005, 09:36 PM

Well Malay's have been offered JF-17's by us so who knows maybe they changed thier mind?

UnitedPakistan

May 10th, 2005, 10:31 PM

Pakistan's first women fighter pilots

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41129000/jpg/_41129935_pilot203.jpg

The Pakistan Air Force (PAF) academy has been all-male for more than 55 years - but now it is going through major change.

Women are now allowed to enrol on its aerospace engineering and fighter pilot programmes and are doing rather well.

To the great surprise of many men, some of the female recruits will soon start flying jet-engine planes.

Male cadets are having to come to terms with the fact that masculinity itself is no longer a condition for reaching this prestigious institute.

Up till now they have done very well

Air Vice Marshall Inam Ullah Khan

There are 10 women in two batches in the flying wing of the academy. Many more are competing with men in the engineering and aerospace wing.

These trailblazers may still be few in number, but many instructors and even some male cadets admit their presence is already being felt.

'Lifelong dream'

Until recently, most women in this conservative Muslim society would more likely have imagined marrying a dashing fighter pilot than being encouraged to become one.

"I always wanted to be a fighter pilot, and eventually with Allah's wish and the full support of my parents, I made it this far

Cadet Saba Khan

But this was not true for Saba Khan, one of four female cadets to make it through the gruelling first stages of training.

Coming from an enlightened Pathan family in Quetta, capital of otherwise conservative Balochistan Province, Saba was initially inspired by one of her uncles who had been in the air force.

And she says the first newspaper advertisement seeking female cadets was like a dream come true.

"I always wanted to be a fighter pilot, and eventually with Allah's wish and the full support of my parents, I made it this far," she said.

Women must achieve the same levels of performance as men

And Saba believes the first batch of women could provide much-needed inspiration for many other girls, who may follow suit.

Beaming with excitement, another aviation cadet, Ambreen Gill, said it was impossible for her to explain how she felt when she flew a propeller plane.

She said she hopes soon to fly the jets on her own, and perhaps at some stage even state-of-the-art combat aircraft like F-16s.

'Equals'

The air force academy is still male-dominated, and it's not clear what the real feelings of the male cadets have been to the induction of women onto the fighter pilot programme.

Saman Ahmed: 'Don't show us compassion.'

Officially, most have welcomed the move.

But when one male cadet said the women should be shown compassion, female cadet Saman Ahmed was swift to say they were there to compete on equal terms.

"We don't expect compassion, we don't get compassion, and we don't want compassion," she said.

And this confidence is not without reason for Cadet Ahmed has already won praise in her engineering studies, beating both men and women.

Her excellence is not confined to the classroom, either.

During a rifle exercise, I watched as she shot all five bullets right in the bull's eye.

Segregation
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41129000/jpg/_41129927_parade2_203.jpg
http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41129000/jpg/_41129925_shoot203.jpg

Many senior air force officials point out that bringing women into armed forces combat units has been a difficult decision in many countries.

In Pakistan the challenges of doing so were even bigger.

It's not just about size or strength - cultural and religious matters were also to be taken into account.

It's quite important that we maintain this level of segregation, mainly because we are a Muslim society

Squadron leader Shazia Ahmed

The head of the PAF academy, Air Vice Marshal Inam Ullah Khan, admits they had to take certain cultural sensitivities into account.

But he says allowing women to enrol has been a good experience, and some of the female cadets have done better than expected.

The academy maintains a degree of segregation between genders.

Although women march should-to-shoulder with their male counterparts during early-morning parade, some parts of the training, particularly physical exercises, are carried out separately.

"It's quite important that we maintain this level of segregation, mainly because we are a Muslim society," says squadron leader Shazia Ahmed.

A psychologist by training, and in charge of the female cadets, she says "in some ways it also gives these girls the much required confidence before they take up the bigger challenges".

But there is no compromise on standards - the women must achieve the same levels of performance as the men, or face being dropped from the programme.

For the moment it seems the few who have joined the ranks are doing extremely well.

And if that continues, when the current batch passes out in a year these cadets will become the first-ever women fighter pilots in Pakistan's history.

Marshal

May 11th, 2005, 12:38 AM

WHat?? :nuts:

How can Pakistan offer jets when China is the main party (and Malaysia is getting Su-30s anyway so never mind.. ;) :D ).

Marshal

May 11th, 2005, 02:21 AM

Marshal,

Honestly you piss me off with the wacko smiley

Mission Objective COMPLETE :D

lol

UnitedPakistan

June 10th, 2005, 02:51 AM

Modernization of Pakistans Armed Forces

P-3C Orion aircraft

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/8702/3006my.jpg

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/585/556744hp.jpg

[b]Pakistan has already committed to acquiring six additional Lockheed C-130B transports and is expected to sign a contract with the US government within two months to acquire eight ex-US Navy Lockheed P-3C Orion maritime patrols. [/b

UnitedPakistan

June 10th, 2005, 02:52 AM

F22p Friggate

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/6941/f22pp0ch.jpg

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/9825/f226vv.jpg

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/5089/1f22pfrigate5ob.jpg

Pakistan And China Ink Deal For Four F-22P Frigates with transfer of technology.

Z-9 Helicopter

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/5976/z9c31md.jpg

Pakistan will be getting 4 of these helicopters for its friggates. Helicopters primary role is ANTI-SUBs. ;) [You get the idea!]

UnitedPakistan

June 10th, 2005, 02:53 AM

F-16 fighter jets

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/2424/f160996no.jpg

75 of these will be purchased

Falcon® II radar

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/8/a2ey.jpg

This is one of the Radar that Pakistan already has gotten or will get it. B) ??

AIM-9-M missiles

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/5896/aim9m8rn.jpg

Pakistan will be getting Aim9-M missiles with new F-16s.

UnitedPakistan

June 10th, 2005, 02:54 AM

TPS-77 radars

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/1885/04radarlo5yd.jpg

Pakistan will get about 5-7 of these radars, i am not sure about the numbers, i forgot! :angry:

AMRAAM missiles

http://img251.echo.cx/img251/1711/amraam9ju.jpg

Pakistan will surely be getting these babes. ;)

Pakistans next aircraft after F-16s, choices are in order of recommendation from 1 to 4.

Rafale

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/2610/rafale20b01formationwide15ki.jpg

Gripen

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/2247/gripenlanding1jg.jpg

J-10

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/3461/j103ip.jpg

Mirage 2000-9

http://img14.echo.cx/img14/6660/mirage2020003md.jpg

(Note: This may be an advance or less advance version of Mirage 2000, but remember that they both have a same air frame)

Credit: Testament

Possibly more Agosta-90Bs?

http://img105.echo.cx/img105/3299/agosta90b3fw.jpg

Saab-2000 Erieye AEW&C

http://img105.echo.cx/img105/8162/saab20007qv.jpg

and/or E-2C Hawkeye 2000

http://img105.echo.cx/img105/842/imagevaw11514so.jpg

How could we forget JF-17? (atleast 150!)

http://img105.echo.cx/img105/5549/jf179kp.jpg

UnitedPakistan

June 10th, 2005, 02:55 AM

SD-10 Medium-Range Air-to-Air Missile

http://www.sinodefence.com/missile/airlaunched/sd10_1.jpg

http://www.sinodefence.com/missile/airlaunched/sd10_2.jpg

These are probably in service or we will get these:

MRTP-15

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/cheenamalai/mtp_33.jpg

MRTP-33

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/cheenamalai/mtp_15_d_03.jpg

C-130 J transport aircraft.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/cheenamalai/limage_c130j_jh_03.jpg

More Al-Khalids

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/cheenamalai/alkhalid9l.jpg

At least 3 Type-23 Friggates from Britain.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y43/cheenamalai/Type23.jpg

http://www.dutchsubmarines.com/specials/images/boat_rn_type23_frigate.jpg

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 01:12 AM

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/defaul...11-6-2005_pg1_1
Saturday, June 11, 2005

US sensitive to Pakistan’s security needs, says Bush

* Praises President Musharraf’s ‘bold leadership’
* Kasuri highlights Pakistan’s efforts in war on terror

By Khalid Hasan

WASHINGTON: President George W Bush, who received Foreign Minister Khurshid Mahmud Kasuri in the Oval office on Thursday, said that he was sensitive to Pakistan’s security needs and that the two countries enjoyed a “unique” relationship.

The meeting was not on the cards and should be seen as an overt expression of the importance the Bush administration attaches to its ties with Islamabad in the war against terrorism. According to a press release issued by the Pakistan embassy late on Thursday night, President Bush praised the bold leadership of President General Pervez Musharraf and hoped that the Kashmir issue would be resolved to the satisfaction of all relevant parties.

Kasuri thanked President Bush for his support to Pakistan and said that bilateral ties extended over diverse fields including political, economic, defence and other areas.

Foreign minister Kauri highlighted the need for US support to Pakistan in these areas and briefed the US President on latest developments in Indo-Pak relations including the visit of the All Pakistan Hurriyat Conference delegation to Pakistan and the resumption of the Muzaffarabad-Srinagar bus service.

Discussing the UN Security Council reform, Kasuri stated Pakistan’s view that these be comprehensive and holistic. President Bush said that real reform was called for and agreed with the foreign minister that there should be no artificial deadlines. He said that principles for reforms needed to be developed. At the request of President Bush, Foreign Minister Kasuri gave a comprehensive briefing on Pakistan-Afghanistan relations, the statement said. Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice Adviser to the President on National Security Affairs Stephen Hadley, Senior Director at the National Security Council Micheal Green and Assistant Secretary of State Christina Rocca were also present at the meeting.

In his meeting with Hadley, Kasuri briefed him on a range of issues, including Kashmir and Afghanistan. The foreign minister requested Hadley for an investigation into reports of desecration of the Holy Quran and urged punishment to those found responsible. He underscored Pakistan’s “unwavering cooperation in the international counter-terrorism efforts, the cost both human and material to Pakistan notwithstanding.” He also briefed him on steps taken by his government to establish a “sustainable democratic order” in Pakistan.

In his breakfast meeting with members of the Pakistan Caucus, Kasuri was assured bipartisan support to the promotion of long-term relations between Pakistan and the United States in Congress. The two co-chairs of the caucus, Congressman Dan Burton and Congresswoman Sheila Jackson Lee, indicted their intention to send a joint letter to the leaders of Pakistan and India, encouraging them to pursue the dialogue process for resolving outstanding issues.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:12 AM

This thread will give description of UAVs that Pakistan developed or have bought!

BORDER EAGLE
http://www.idaerospace.com/beagle/images/beagle.jpg

The BORDER EAGLE is designed for area surveillance and perimeter control. It has autonomous navigation capabilities with complete mission recording on a Laptop PC moving map display. Portable Ground Stations can be equipped with multi-mission capabilities. The endurance is in excess of 2.5 hours and its micro PTZ gyro stabilized electro-optic payload allows advanced detection capabilities. The BORDER EAGLE is a low cost, low altitude surveillance system with easy maintainability. Detachable fuselage pods provide easy installation of varied payloads. A two-man crew is required for operations and deployment.

Role: Low altitude border and perimeter monitoring UAV.

Weight: 15 kg.

Power plant: 2-6 BHP Twin-cylender piston engine.

Speed: 30-160 kmh.

Range: 30 km.

Endurance: 3 hours.

Stabilization: Digital autopilots with navigation and stability modules.

Tracking and telemetry: GPS and data telemetry module with software graphics interface display.

Payload capacity: 4 kg.

Typical payloads: Daylight TV camera. Onboard vedio recorder. Mission event recording still camera module. ELINT module. Chemical monitoring module.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:13 AM

HAWK SERIES
The HAWK airframes combine field-proven designs with rugged aerospace-quality composite construction and the latest in microelectronic Flight Control and GPS navigation. These airframes can be interfaced with our unique Telecommand and Control systems to bring MIL-standard reliability to an affordable level.

The HAWK series of aerial targets and surveillance UAV airframes forms a potent combination of field-proven and production platforms to suit a variety of user requirements. Ideally suited for short range tactical applications from 30-80 km, the HAWK aircraft have proven their multi-mission capabilities and reliability in a series of field trials ranging from experimental electronic payload test-beds, surveillance platforms and defense applications. The basic cantilever platform and composite structure provides a stable aerodynamic and payload-carrying configuration for the most demanding tasks. Wing hard-points and large access hatches enable different electronics or surveillance modules to be carried on demand.

Light and fast, the HAWK series of aircraft can be powered by engines ranging from 15-25 bhp and are ideally suited for rapid deployment and reconnaissance. A 4.25m (14ft.) wingspan (also offered as a clipped-wing version) and large payload area easily accommodate infrared, low-light and visible color video systems and still cameras.

In the surveillance UAV role, a low radar signature and refined aerodynamic design allows for extended operation over targets with minimal detection. Pre-programmed 'Smart Flight' routines, and the option of conventional landing or a parachute recovery system, greatly reduce operator training and improve aircraft survivability. Compact and mobile - a complete HAWK system can be delivered and is ready for operation in minutes.

HAWK MK-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/hornet/images/Hawk%20MK-1.jpg

The HAWK MK-1 is an ideal experimental payload ‘weight-lifter’. It can be powered by engines ranging from 10-18 BHP and is ideally suited for technology demonstrator applications. A 4.25m (14ft.) wingspan (also offered as a clipped-wing version) and large payload area easily accommodate infrared, low-light and visible color video camera systems and other payloads.

HAWK MK-2
http://www.idaerospace.com/hornet/images/Hawk%20MK-2.jpg

The HAWK MK-2 is a larger engined option to the MK-1 airframe. It is an ideal experimental payload ‘weight-lifter’ and provides increased endurance levels and improved fuel and payload carrying capabilities. It can be powered by engines ranging from 15-22 BHP and is ideally suited for technology demonstrator applications. A 4.25m (14ft.) wingspan (also offered as a clipped-wing version) and large payload area easily accommodate infrared, low-light and visible color video camera systems and other payloads.

HAWK MK-5
http://www.idaerospace.com/hornet/images/Hawk%20MK-5.jpg

The HAWK MK-5 airframes combine field-proven designs with aerospace-quality composite construction and the latest in microelectronic Flight Control and GPS navigation. These airframes can be used as aerial targets or surveillance UAV’s with our unique C4I systems to bring MIL-standard reliability to an affordable level. In the surveillance UAV role, the Mk-5’s refined aerodynamics allow for extended operation over targets. Pre-programmed 'Smart Flight' routines reduce operator workload and improve aircraft survivability. Compact and mobile - a complete HAWK system can be delivered on-site and is ready for operation in a short time span.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:14 AM

VISION SERIES

The VISION series of airframes were specially developed to cover a customer requirement for a family of modular composite airframes that could provide tactical surveillance capabilities in the 30-70 km range. The series of airframes that has emerged has been the subject of extensive field and operational tests and all models have demonstrated their reliability and ruggedness in battlefield conditions. Based on a single-boom T-tail layout, the aircraft can be equipped with a variety of stock or modified power plants, including tuned-exhaust and belt-driven modifications.

All VISION series aircraft support real-time video and data modules and flight avionics for at least 30 - 70 km range applications. The VISION UAV family consists of pusher configuration airframes with the largest aircraft in the series having a 4.90m (16 ft) wingspan. These aircraft are all-composite and offer increased payload and endurance. Multiple cameras and onboard video and data recording capabilities are easily accommodated. The VISION airframes can function over-the-horizon in autonomous and remotely piloted modes and are well suited for patrol and extended surveillance missions.

Multi-channel video and data downlinks are available and a variety of electronic and remote sensing payloads can be utilized. Our Gyro-Stabilized Platforms deliver stable, rock-solid images and tracking with various camera packages. Internal GPS navigation and Video Overlay systems ensure reliable platform tracking and ease of flight operation.

In patrol or surveillance operations, the VISION series advanced flight control and navigation system can be pre-programmed to autonomously patrol a specified area or survey multiple targets. This relieves the operator from demanding piloting duties allowing unrestricted operation of surveillance equipment and payloads.

VISION MK-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/vision/images/VISION.jpg

The VISION airframes can function-over-the-horizon in autonomous and remotely piloted modes and are suited for patrol and extended surveillance missions. In field operations, the VISION’s advanced flight control and navigation system can be preprogrammed to autonomously patrol a specified area or photograph multiple targets. This relieves the operator from demanding piloting duties. Complex payloads can be easily accommodated. The VISION MK-1 is an ideal system trainer for BVR UAV operations.

VISION MK-2
http://www.idaerospace.com/vision/images/Vision%20MK-2.jpg

The VISION MK-2 is a larger airframe in the VISION series that is designed to be a low-cost, stand-alone UAV system element. The MK-2 system is typically supplied with 6 airframes, complete with and digital data links, portable Ground Stations, Antenna Tracking & Positioning Systems and a choice of electro-optic payloads. Field-proven and rugged, the VISION MK-2 is without equal in its class.

VISION X-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/vision/images/Vision%20X-1.jpg

The VISION X-1 is the largest airframe in our fleet. It has the common features and C4I pedigree of our other systems and an increased endurance and range as compared to the smaller aircraft. It is the aircraft of choice for extended surveillance operations in autonomous mode in hostile environments.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:14 AM

SHADOW SERIES

The SHADOW series of airframes caters to the medium-sized UAV/RPV market. Larger than the VISION series aircraft, the SHADOW airframes boast modularity, ruggedness and accessibility that is second to none in field operations. With payload capabilities in the 40 kg range, and a nominal price tag compared to competing systems worldwide, the competitive edge they offer is obvious. The SHADOW airframes use bullet-proof Kevlar molded fuselage pans, Kevlar/Graphite reinforced equipment bays and side stress panels and high-tensile steel aramid-reinforced landing gears. A variety of INTEGRATED DYNAMICS payloads, or user specific devices, can be supported with the available onboard power supplies.

The SHADOW series of airframes were specially developed to cover a customer requirement for a family of modular composite airframes that could provide tactical surveillance capabilities in the 100-200 km range. Based on a classical twin-boom pusher layout, the aircraft can be equipped with a variety of stock or modified power plants, including tuned-exhaust and belt-driven modifications, based on user applications. All models support real-time video and data modules and flight avionics for at least 150 km range applications.

The SHADOW UAV family consists of pusher configuration airframes with the largest aircraft in the series having a 7m (23ft) wingspan. These aircraft are all-composite and offer increased payload and endurance. Multiple cameras and onboard Video and data recording capabilities are easily accommodated.

SHADOW MK-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/vector/images/Shadow%20MK-1.jpg

The SHADOW UAV family consists of pusher configuration airframes with the largest aircraft in the series having a 7m (23ft) wingspan. These aircraft are all-composite and offer increased payload and endurance. Multiple electro-optic payloads and onboard Video and data recording capabilities are easily accommodated. Comprehensive C4I data stations and Integrated Logistics Support (ILS) is available.

SHADOW X-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/vector/images/Shadow%20X-1.jpg

The SHADOW X-1 is an experimental payload test bed that can function with the same GCS, tracking and Flight control systems common to other INTEGRATED DYNAMICS surveillance systems. It affords a low-cost alternative for development of HALE (High Altitude Long Endurance) platforms.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:16 AM

VULCAN SERIES

The VULCAN HS-UAV series of high - speed aerial targets and decoys represent the next generation of air defense training and simulation. With power plants ranging from performance-matched, tuned-exhaust, reciprocating engines to mini-gas turbines - the VULCAN targets and decoys are a match for any modern air defense system during proving trials or operator simulation. Proven over many hours of field use, the airframes demonstrate a high degree of modularity, service ease and common features that allow interchangeability of parts and easy interface of payloads and operational electronics. Electronic payloads and subsystems including video, GPS navigation, MDI systems, height lock, sea-skimming and pre-programmed loiter and presentation profiles are standard options with our next-generation on-board flight computer modules and inertial sensor packages.

VULCAN MK-1
http://www.idaerospace.com/nishan/images/Vulcan%20MK-1.jpg

The VULCAN MK-1is a versatile decoy and target aircraft system available in a variety of configurations ranging from expendable piston engined target drones to high-speed turbojet powered versions with advanced remote-control and auto pilot systems to provide simulation of attack Aircraft, Sea skimming missiles and other guided munitions. The MK-1 forms the core of this family and is a high-speed, low-cost expendable target that is easily deployed and maintained.

VULCAN MK-2
http://www.idaerospace.com/nishan/images/nishan_mk1.jpg

The VULCAN MK-2 is part of the INTEGRATED DYNAMICS HS-UAV series of high - speed aerial targets/decoys representing the next generation of air defense training and simulation systems. With power plants ranging from reciprocating engines to turbojets - the VULCAN targets are a match for any modern air defense system. Proven over many hours of field use, the airframes demonstrate a high degree of modularity, and common features that allow interchangeability of parts and easy interface of payloads and operational electronics. Electronic payloads and subsystems include video, GPS navigation, MDI systems, height lock, and sea-skimming modules.

VULCAN TJ-1000
http://www.idaerospace.com/nishan/images/TJ-1000.jpg

The VULCAN TJ1000 is part of the INTEGRATED DYNAMICS HS-UAV series of high - speed aerial targets/decoys representing the next generation of air defense training and simulation systems. The TJ1000 has a mini-turbojet engine and its thrust-to-weight ratio and performance make it a unique system. The airframes are modular and common features allow interchangeability of parts and easy interface of payloads and operational electronics. Electronic payloads and subsystems include video, GPS navigation, MDI systems, height lock, and sea-skimming modules.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:17 AM

INTEGRATED DYNAMICS is a full-service UAV systems provider based in Karachi, Pakistan. We have been in business since 1997 and design and integrate UAV systems primarily for the Government of Pakistan and the Pakistan Armed Forces. We are commited to the use of the UAV system as a scientific and defensive tool that can be used to save lives and monitor potentially hazardous situations in environments hostile for human personnel.

INTEGRATED DYNAMICS is a 100% private company and is located in a 25000 sq. feet facility. After attending the IDEAS defence expo in Pakistan, and the Dubai 2003 Airshow, we are expanding operations globally for export and looking at international collaboration for technology partnerships, academic and training projects, and civillian and scientific R&D technology offset programs.

http://www.idaerospace.com/images/DSC01684.JPG

http://www.idaerospace.com/images/DSC03069.JPG

http://www.idaerospace.com/images/DSC01662.JPG

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:17 AM

TORNADO 2000
AERIAL TARGET / DECOY SYSTEM

The TORNADO is a lightweight high speed mini-turbojet decoy system with autonomous navigational track, pre-strike decoy and fire & forget capabilities. The system consists of 8 decoy aircraft, a pneumatic catapult launcher system and a portable ground station for pre-programming mission profiles. The TORNADO is designed for decoy missions where simulation of actual fighter aircraft is required and the ground control stations provides simultaneous multiple-vehicle flight capability with a range in excess of 200 km.

http://i2.photobucket.com/albums/y23/imaging100/tornado.jpg

Role = Aerial Target / Decoy Drone

Wingspan = 2.36m (7 ft. 3 in)

Length = 2.15m (6 ft. 6 in)

Height = 0.89 m (2 ft. 7 in)

Wing Area = 0.63 sq. m (6 sq. ft)

Dry Weight = 18.0 kg (38 lb)

Max. take off weight = 25 kg (53 lb)

Fuel Capacity = 20 litres

Power Plant = Two 40 Lbf thrust mini turbojets

Speed Range = 130 - 464 Kmph (82 - 290 mph)

Range (Autonomous) = 200 Km

Endurance = 35 minutes

Recovery = Fire-and-forget

Stabilisation & Navigation = Digital Auto-Pilot with heading control and Height-lock

Typical Payloads = Combinations of Flares and/or radar enhancement devices
may be carried as required and activated.

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:18 AM

VISION-I
http://www.awc.com.pk/vision.jpg

VISION-I is a tactical UAV system and operates at ranges of up to 80 km from the operating base. The UAV has an all-composite airframe. The use of the composite not only keeps the air frame weight down but is also very strong and makes it capable of surviving the rigorous battlefield environment. This, as a whole, results in a very efficient system.
The UAV is capable of flying autonomously on a pre-programmed flight plan that can be changed as per requirement during the mission as well. It can carry payloads of up to 25 kg. The typical payloads in this weight category include FLIR sensors, Infra-Red Line Scanners, CCD camera on fixed or gyro-stabilized platforms, ELINT or COMINT sensors.
The UAV can be launched by conventional wheeled take-off or rocket boosters and retrieved by wheeled landing or parachute recovery system. The parachute recovery system can also be used for emergency recovery.

Key Features

System Definition:-

Four air vehicles
Ground Control Station
Pay Loads
Field Support Equipment
Missions:-

The UAV can perform the following missions

Real-time Reconnaissance
Pre & Post Strike Imagery
Artillery Fire Support
Electronic Intelligence
Border Surveillance
Traffic & Crime Monitoring
Power Cables Monitoring
Search and Rescue Missions
Ground Control Station (GCS):-

Containerized Mission Control Unit
Mission Planning Software
Communication Control
Pay Load Control

Performance Specifications

Take-off Weight 120 kg
Payload Capacity Up to 25 kg
Endurance > 5 hrs
Range 100 km
Operational Ceiling 3000 m (3 km)
Maximum Level Speed 90 knots
Cruising Speed 55 knots
Engine 20 25 hp
Launch Wheeled Take off / RATO / Catapult Launcher
Recovery Wheeled Landing / Parachute Recovery
Guidance / Tracking Remote Controlled and / or pre-programmed autonomous return to base provision GPS-based

UnitedPakistan

June 11th, 2005, 04:19 AM

IDS develops target Drone Weapons
Pakistan Times Staff Report

KARACHI: After years of research and development, Integrated Defence System (IDS) has developed an Unmanned Ariel Vehicle (UAV) capable to rival any international target drone in terms of speed and performance.

HADDAF-1 is the latest addition to the existing fleet of target drones and reconnaissance/ surveillance UAVs in production at IDS through entirely indigenous efforts.

HADDAF-1 after completion of successful trials and tests would be inducted in the country's Armed Forces.

Global Positioning System and the capability to cater for target practice of both missiles and rounds, make HADDAF-1 an ideal and economic choice for any military force seeking to train its personnel in air defence.

Another noteworthy UAV of IDS is the Nishan Mk-II. It is a high speed Aerial Target with speed in excess of 370 km/hour.

http://www.pakistantimes.net/2004/09/18/top5.htm

Some infomation regarding specific UAVs.

Check these websites out look nice to me!

SATUMA (Surveillance and Targeting Unmanned Aircrafts)
http://www.satuma.com.pk

Integrated Dynamics
http://www.idaerospace.com/

AWC (Air Weapons Complex)
http://www.awc.com.pk/ (http://www.awc.com.pk/)

Akimatsuri

July 5th, 2005, 02:05 AM

Some pictures of the F-16 Block 52 that will soon be in the Pakistan inventory:

http://www.voodoo.cz/falcon/new5/16idf52plus.jpg

http://jiatelin.jschina.com.cn/fighter/gfx/f16/f16block52_2.jpg

Pakistan plans to purchase 86 new F16's + MLU for existing 35 F16's will bring
the total number of F16's in service with the Pakistan airforce to around 121.

121 F-16's! :eek2:

dingyunyang179

July 10th, 2005, 12:55 PM

COOL
Long lives the friendship of China and Pakistan!!

dingyunyang179

July 10th, 2005, 01:06 PM

Haha

Long lives the friendship of China and Pakistan!!
I hope J10 will appear in Pakistan!!

Hope

July 12th, 2005, 10:59 PM

ISLAMABAD: In an apparent balancing act following concerns expressed by Pakistan over the recently signed 10-year defence pact between India and US, Washington has offered to sell its Hawkeye-2000 surveillance planes to Islamabad.

The American offer to sell the planes was made during a briefing held for top Pakistani defence officials on board US aircraft carrier Nimitz, currently anchored 171 km off Karachi coast yesterday, a Pakistan TV network reported.

Two Hawkeye aircraft were also flown to Pakistan Navy station PNS Mehran in Karachi on Monday to display them for Pakistani defence officials.

A special demonstration of the planes and their features was also held by the commander of Nimitz on board the warship for the delegation of Pakistan defence officials.

US had earlier offered to sell surveillance aircraft, being used by US troops in Iraq and Afghanistan to spy on the movements of the terrorists, to Pakistan. Hawkeye-2000 is operated on ground and on board the US warships.

Gazil also inspected the F-18 jets during the visit of the US naval ship. The Pakistani team that visited the ship included officials from Army, Navy, Air Force and Pakistan's maritime security agency.

Source: Times of India

1st Division Marine

July 18th, 2005, 06:49 AM

i think for a person that is in university like me studing political science i would reaconmend a country to atleast have 250 ships and 250 submarines to be a force to be reacon with.

Vengeance

July 20th, 2005, 08:25 AM

i think for a person that is in university like me studing political science i would reaconmend a country to atleast have 250 ships and 250 submarines to be a force to be reacon with.

Wtf?? :nuts: :nuts: :bash: :bash: :bash: :bash: :deadthrea

dingyunyang179

July 23rd, 2005, 05:20 PM

Cool .
Long live the friendship of Chinese and Pakistan.

UnitedPakistan

July 23rd, 2005, 05:38 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/ArmyPersonnel/Army_Personnel_008.JPE

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Army_Pics/ArmyPersonnel/LoCArmy_Personnel_009.jpe
Cntower,

PakistaniDefence is jahil

those are no longer the uniform of the army any longer.

cntower

July 23rd, 2005, 06:04 PM

I know that...the website is poorly maintained. They have some rather odd members who can get away with disgracing other people's religions and ethinic backgrounds.

Not Impressive...

sher-e-lahore

July 24th, 2005, 01:49 PM

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/SSG_01.jpg
HISTORY: The SSG was formed ten years after the independence. Its main objective is to work where the regular army is not considered suitable to accomplish the Op as well as being assigned special tasks and covert ops. This may include high crisis situations on the National border to Hostage Rescue operations in country capitals, the SSG is trained to handle sorts of situations.

ORGANIZATION: Pakistani Elite Special Forces have 4 Brigades
First & Second Brigade is dedicated to Military Operations.

Third Brigade is an Anti-Terrorist Brigade, and it is known as Musa-Colony.

Fourth Brigade is Permantely stationed in Saudi Arabia for the protection of the Saudi Royal Family.

RECENT ANTI TERRORIST OPERATIONS:

It was a normal day in the National Capital, when the news of the kidnapping of a school bus carrying more than 35 primary school children, all of whom were below 12 years of age, as well as two teachers and a driver. Authorities immediately fell in stress and pressure about how to stop this chaotic situation. Not only were the Government worried about the lives of the children, they were also trying to figure out a way handle the mediocrity.

It was learned that the kidnappers were 6 Afghan militants, their motif was to get the Pakistani government to accept some of their extremely inexhorbitant demands that included giving them military assets along with fighter jets in the Pak-Airforce.

The news played hell with the parents of the children, who were on the verge on going hysterical. Parents and media both stormed the offices of the authorities, trying to find out what steps were being taken to end the situation.

The government fell a very tricky and difficult situation as the terrorists pressurized them at the same time. They indicated the terrorists that their demands were under consideration and the government will need a little time to fulfill their demands. The terrorists replied by saying that they will be allotted 72 hours before any "unpleasant event occurs". Then they asked for food for themselves and the hostages, which they were immediately given.

Internally the government had decided to no to give in their demands, and they were planning to take the terrorists down. Many tactical and intelligence teams were called to the operation. Including ISI and SSG, it was decided that there should be a way of contact with the inside world. The terrorists had drawn the curtains of the place so there was virtually no contact inside. It was figured out that the terrorists might be convinced to let an ill child hostage and a teacher walk out of the house and receive medical treatment then they will be returned to the terrorists. That was made their key to the inside world, the two hostages were allowed free. They reported that the hostages were held in separate rooms, guarded by armed terrorists, the terrorists were armed with Kalashinkov assault rifles and pistols, they were wearing typical Afghan dress and army boots and MAY have body armor.

During all that time they were supplied with food and water.

Day one had passed, the next day the hostages were contacted and told that an operation would be carried out at sunset time and it will be aimed to kill all the terrorists on the spot, therefore the hostages had to be prepared for the sudden outbreak of the breach. The hostages had to shift themselves on the floor or under any furniture just 1 minute before the showdown. Any confusion or carelessness could result in severe casualties. The news quietly spread between the hostages during mealtime.

The next day, at the given time the hostages moved to the appropriate locations. The terrorists were really very attentive now; they had their guns ready at all time, and seemed very less hesitant towards taking the lives of the hostages. It was also discovered later that they wore masked that covered their one eye so that they would only have point and fire without worrying to aim.

Then after one minute, a volley of gas and smoke grenades was fired through the house's windows and into the rooms. After an interval of 3 or 4 seconds SSG's commandos of the "Zarrar Jareeh" began entering through windows and doors, they were armed with MP5 sub-Machine guns, and Laser trained Glock and Beretta pistols. They were wearing camouflage dress, kevlar vests, and Gas masks, and spare gas grenades. The terrorists were not ready for the attack, but they blindly returned fire, putting lives of the hostages at risk.

It was difficult for them to see through the smoke and gas fumes irritated their eyes. Thankfully, no hostages went hysterical by the heavy the gunfire that rocked the whole neighborhood. By the first 40 seconds 2 terrorists lay dead, they were accurately chest and head shot through the deadly MP5 9mm bursts. The rest of the four terrorists also fell victims of the commandos' bullets within the next 1 minute! The commandos worked like greased lightening, they stormed the whole house with their guns on the ready, and every terrorist that fell in their way. One terrorist tried to shoot the hostages, just as he was about to execute one of them, two SSG-ians entered the room and pumped him full of lead. It was a really close call, were they late of a second, there might have casualties.

The breech ended within 2 minutes, all terrorists lying dead, all hostages rescued, with no casualties. The Afghan government denied any responsibility of the militants. The parents of the children commended the government and SSG especially for carrying out such a successful operation.

Pakistani Ballistic Missiles

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/shaheen1March23.jpg http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/ghauri2tv.jpg
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Support%20Pics/ghauri2March23.jpg

Missiles:

Name Origin Type* Max Range Km** Fuel Type Payload Kg

Hatf 1A Indigenous BRBM 100
Solid 500 Picture Deployed
Hatf 2 (Abdali) Indigenous BRBM 180 Solid 500 Picture In Service
Hatf 3 (Ghaznavi) Ingenious SRBM 290 Solid 500 Picture In Service
M-11 China SRBM 300 Liquid 800-1,200 Picture Stored
Hatf 5 (Ghauri 1) Indigenous IRBM 1,500 Liquid 700-1,000 Picture Deployed
Hatf 5 (Ghauri 2) Indigenous IRBM 1,800 Liquid 1,500 Picture Deployed
Shaheen 1 Indigenous IRBM 700 Solid 750 Picture Deployed
Shaheen 2 Indigenous IRBM 2,500 Solid 1,000+ Picture Developed
Shaheen 3 ? Indigenous IRBM ? 3,600+ ? Solid 1,000+ ? Research Unknown

Notes
* Types;
BRBM-Battlefield Range Ballistic Missile
SRBM-Short Range Ballistic Missile
IRBM-Intermediate Range Ballistic Missile
**Max Range Can Be Increased By Lowering Payload

oogabooga

August 27th, 2005, 09:34 AM

While Browsing through the streets of Karachi trying to identify places from a 180 degree angle, I stumbled upon something amazing! Its an Airforce base near the Airport! There are 34 Fighter jets standing on the Tarmac and 5 Cargo / Transportation Planes. I took snapshots and am posting them here for your viewing pleasure :D

This is the image of the unknown airstrip (unknown to me atleast)
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/3303/UnknownAirstrip.jpg

A close up of the Cargo / Transportation Aircrafts
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/5933/Zoomedup1.jpg

A close up of a Cargo / Transportation Plane
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/2782/ZoomedUp2.jpg

Another Cargo / Transportation Plane standing by what seems to be a hangar.
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/3561/Zoomedup3.jpg

Close up of a chopper. Cant makeout what type it is, but it looks like an attack helicopter (Judging by the slenderness of the body and and the formation of the Blades)
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/249/ZoomedupChopper.jpg

Heres the real deal! 7 Fighter Aircrafts. They seem to be F-16 or F-15 or someother version (perhaps the people who know a bit more about our military can tell us what these are) My guess is based solely on the wing design.
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/5033/ZoomedupFJ.jpg

Heres a whole squadron of what seems to be older aircrafts. 27 of them!
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/7134/MoreZoomedupFJ.jpg

Somemore
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/7681/ZoomedupFJ3.jpg

And Somemore
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/6673/MoreZoomedupFJ2.jpg

So does anyone know what this base is called and perhaps could elaborate as to what kind of Aircrafts we have here?

Tagga

August 27th, 2005, 10:06 PM

^Those arent F-16s and Pakistan does not have F-15s, I think that airforce does not operate from big cities, it has airbases (like Sargodah airbase for Lahore region, Kamra for Isloo, Mardan for Peshawer, I dont know about Karachi region) and even if airforce operates from Karachi, I dont think that they would just park the fighter jets like that in open air.

oogabooga

August 28th, 2005, 12:16 AM

Can you not see the pictures? Look at the pictures! Those are all fighter aircrafts and judging by, what seems to be a pointy tip and the wingdesign, I figured that its one of the American Planes (F-16, F-15, F-5 maybe?). The ones in the whole squadron look like older ones though because of the way their wings are designed and the nose of the aircraft.

The installation has a runway, a long one which i gather is for the bigger aircrafts to take off from and it also has some hangars. Now in the eleven years that I had lived in Karachi I never knew that we had an airforce base in Karachi but pictures dont lie! You can download Google Earth and zoom into those coordinates and see for yourself.

Heres another picture showing the Airport and this base
http://img6.imageshack.us/img6/756/largerpicture0vy.jpg

oogabooga

August 28th, 2005, 01:59 AM

I did a couple of searches online and found out everything there is to know about this base.

It is a Naval Air Arm its name is PNS Mehran (Faisal). Following is a neighbourhood picture of this airbase.
http://www.expedia.com/pub/agent.dll?qscr=mrdt&ID=3XNsF.&CenP=24.850624,67.008040&Lang=WLD0409&Alti=150&Size=656,532&Offs=4.878049,-18.045113&MapS=0&Pins=|3f25|

Following are the planes on the Runways.
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/5273/inventory5qp.jpg
http://img212.imageshack.us/img212/2196/inventory22op.jpg

The thing confusing me is that there is no mention of the Aircrafts in this picture? All the names mentioned in those charts are of Maritime surveillance aircrafts or helicopters, except the F27-200 (MPA). I have no idea what the F27-200 (MPA) is and what it looks like and what kind of aircraft it is. So does anyone else here know?
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/5033/ZoomedupFJ.jpg

sher-e-lahore

August 28th, 2005, 02:26 AM

oogabooga

August 28th, 2005, 02:37 AM

Air Forces of Pakistan matching F27-200

Aircraft Quantity
Fokker F27-200 10
Fokker F27-200 3
Total Air Forces 13

http://www.texelairport.nl/historie/PH-SAD.jpg
REG.
TYPE OF AIRCRAFT
NOTE

PH-SAD
Fokker F27-200

thats what they are you got the name wrong i'am looking for it more info very soon on this topic ..

The problem is that whenever the PAF inducts aircrafts from a foriegn airforce, it changes the names of the aircrafts. Thats why I am unable to find the names of these aircrafts.

sher-e-lahore

August 28th, 2005, 03:00 AM

I think they might be JF17 Jet .

JF-17 is a light weight, multi-role day-night, all weather fighter with max TO weight 12,700kg, max speed 1.7M, ceiling 16,500m, max weapon load 3,900kg, range 3,000km. It would be equiped with a Russian engine (probably RD-33, that powers MiG-29). PAF's version would carry a European avionics suite that includes a multi-mode Pulse Doppler radar, INS (Inertial Navigation System), multi-function displays etc and is expected to fulfil 70 percent of PAF operational requirments. Super Seven is designed to be fitted with vast array of weaponry. Weapon load includes short and medium range AAMs (Anti-Air Missiles) like AIM-9P/PL-9/Magic 2 and PL-11/Aspide/AIM-7E etc. In addition to that it includes new FBW system and a true BVR attack capability, which will allow Pakistan Air Force to have a major strategic upper hand over Indian Air Force.

http://www.geocities.com/haroon_nadeem/images/ss2.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/haroon_nadeem/images/jf17.gif

some might be F16A or B
http://www.geocities.com/Baja/Dunes/1107/paf-a1.jpg

http://www.geocities.com/Baja/Dunes/1107/pf-16.jpg
http://www.geocities.com/Baja/Dunes/1107/intro.htm

other you see in the pic are :

C-130
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/C130/C130_freefall_PakistaniDefece.com.jpg
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/C130/C130_23492&64144_PakistaniDefece.com.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/Mixed/F16&Mirage_Formation.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/F16_IX.jpg

Cobra :
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/CobraFormation.jpg

Flying Over Karachi Port:
http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/F-16.jpg

http://www.pakistanidefence.com/images/Wallpapers/F16LineUp.jpg

I have got good feeling it is X-35 - Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) :eek2: In the middel in the pic ...

X-35 - Joint Strike Fighter (JSF)
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/x-35abc.jpghttp://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/jsf-lockmart-chart2.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/jsf-lockmart-chart3.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/x-35c-0606_5.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/jsf96_5091.jpg
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/systems/aircraft/images/x-35a-0043P.jpg

pakboy

August 28th, 2005, 03:15 AM

and i thought this thread was for google earth. :eek2:

sher-e-lahore

August 28th, 2005, 03:30 AM

Just showing you what you want to know ... I think Pakistan dos have planes what we don't know about thats all it is a good thing ..

oogabooga

August 28th, 2005, 04:24 AM

Tell me, Why would the NAVY have C-130's(which is a Cargo and Transportation Plane)? Why would the navy have JF-17 (which hasnt even been formally inducted in the PAF)? And most importantly How would Pakistan have the X-35? A stealth aircraft that America is producing. its not even in service in the USAF yet, how would pakistan possibly have it? Seriously people on this forum dont think for a second before posting.

The 7 unmentioned aircrafts are most probably mirages or F-7's from the nearby Masroor Air Base.

August 28th, 2005, 09:42 AM

oogabooga

August 28th, 2005, 03:46 PM

See I dont know if these pictures are of the PAF Base on Sharea Faisal or not but still I dont think we should be posting this ..

It may seem stupid but why do we need to show the whole world our Airforce Base?

I understand pictures of the Airforce Museum, but why post pictures of an Airforce Base with a dozen aircrafts, possibly Fighter Aircrafts ?

Hope you guys understand what im trying to say ..

I was thinking the same thing but then I found all the detailed information about all our bases and every other countries bases is online on websites such as www.scramble.com. So thats why I posted this here. Besides if this were any secret the Pakistan Government would have restricted photography over our Military Installations.

Nonetheless you do have a point. So could the mods please delete this thread?

swerveut

August 28th, 2005, 10:06 PM

Theres no point!
If somebody is that desperate to get such info, it is easily available to them! this thread is very harmless cause this information is already out there for evberybody to see.

Also, Karachi has at least two functioning airforce bases that I am definitely sure of.
One is the PAF Faisal base, that has been pictured, and the other is above the port side on the North side of Karachi. That one is even larger, and can be seen easily on google earth.

August 28th, 2005, 10:44 PM

Im pretty sure Google Earth can give you Sat. Pics of Area 51 in the USA too, How bout we post them aswell?

Sultan

September 6th, 2005, 04:28 PM

Defence Day being celebrated in Pakistan today, Sept. 6th. Pakistan celebrates its Defense Day to mark the 1965 war over the disputed Kashmir region.

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/886/550232564fw.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/411/550135528jc.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/3610/549847797lu.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/4682/549801402xm.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/2097/549801360yj.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/4862/549801317lf.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/479/549801162hv.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/8426/549801203hv.jpg

http://img341.imageshack.us/img341/9631/549801253up.jpg

Sultan

September 6th, 2005, 04:30 PM

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/ap/20050906/capt.lhr10209061250.pakistan_defense_day_lhr102.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/rids/20050906/i/r3664836184.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/ap/20050906/capt.isl10509061225.pakistan_defense_day_isl105.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/rids/20050906/i/r3802204103.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/ap/20050906/capt.kar10109060945.pakistan_defense_day_kar101.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/rids/20050906/i/r2897030612.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/ap/20050906/capt.isl10109061124.pakistan_afghan_security_isl101.jpg

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/rids/20050906/i/r3401343808.jpg

Sultan

September 6th, 2005, 04:33 PM

http://us.news3.yimg.com/us.i2.yimg.com/p/rids/20050906/i/r2440461628.jpg

Sultan

September 6th, 2005, 04:34 PM

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/7530/pix06237fc.jpg

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/9987/pix06240cv.jpg

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/5522/pix06220tk.jpg

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/9720/app20066vl.jpg

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/5682/app11061fd.jpg

http://img309.imageshack.us/img309/7438/app09066vm.jpg

UnitedPakistan

September 6th, 2005, 06:48 PM

Just look how professional they look!

Now we hear reports of underground airbases in Kashmir area

cntower

September 6th, 2005, 07:55 PM

Happy Defence or Defense Day...

UnitedPakistan

September 6th, 2005, 08:13 PM

lots of specials on Geo tv today like Nishan-E-Haider

Sultan

September 6th, 2005, 09:05 PM

^^ Can you try and record some programs for Pakistani forummers ?

Intoxication

September 10th, 2005, 01:13 AM

Cool pics Sultan :applause:

Techno-Architect

September 10th, 2005, 05:59 PM

^^^^ keep it up sultan~!!

UnitedPakistan

September 11th, 2005, 02:22 AM

^^ Can you try and record some programs for Pakistani forummers ?
I got a few but i am going to start to need a media server soon. :sleepy:

Sultan

September 23rd, 2005, 01:36 AM

Joint Fighter 17 (JF-17)
PAF

Plane is still undergoing design upgrades. The production facility is being set up in Kamra, and hopefully, once the design has been frozen, the plane would go into production. The Kamra facility will build a few of these for the first batch, which the PAF hopes to induct by mid-2006.

I hope a JF-17 is unveiled at the IDEAS-2006 exhibition next year, because this plane has good export potential to friendly countries and allied states.

http://img241.imageshack.us/img241/979/jf17lerxdsipakistan2zm.jpg

http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/5513/jf17pakistan23dp.jpg

http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/6434/jf17pakistan0sm.jpg

http://img124.imageshack.us/img124/1354/jf17pakistan33zn.jpg

kronik

September 24th, 2005, 05:23 AM

Nice looking plane. You know what the engine will be?

oogabooga

September 24th, 2005, 07:23 AM

I'm not much of a military enthusiast like someother forumers but I think it has a Russian RD-93 Turbo Fan Engine.

P.S: This engine is also used in Mig-29's.

UnitedPakistan

September 25th, 2005, 06:21 AM

I will post Nishan-e-Haider tommorow

asfar001

October 26th, 2005, 04:29 AM

WASHINGTON (updated on: October 25, 2005, 23:53 PST): Pakistan is reconsidering its plan to buy scores of new and used American-made F-16 fighter jets following the devastating earthquake that killed 53,000 people, US and Pakistani sources said on Tuesday.

The Bush administration was expected to formally notify the US Congress next week of plans to sell the planes but Pakistani sources told Reuters the deal was being rethought.

"Pakistan is at this time in a situation where we are trying to assess the damages caused by the earthquake and how are we going to cope with tragedy," a Pakistani diplomat said. "The onus would be more on Pakistan whether to go ahead at this time," he said.

A US official said Pakistan was reconsidering the scope and timing of the transfer out of concern for the political and economic impact of making a multibillion dollar arms deal as it still copes with a devastating earthquake that has killed thousands of people.

The Pakistani diplomat, speaking on condition of anonymity, did not suggest the deal would be jettisoned. He said there were many options, including delay. "Everything is open to possibility," he added.

SALE DECISION SOON: Secretary of State Condoleezza Rice is to brief the House of Representatives International Relations Committee in classified session on next Wednesday. Congressional sources said they expected her to give formal notification of the sale then or soon after.

After formal notification, Congress has 30 days to pass a resolution of disapproval if it wants to block the sale.

India and some of its supporters in America question the sale. The US India Political Action Committee, which promoted Indian Americans' concerns, said the deal would encourage a regional arms race.

The group said in a statement that after the earthquake "it is very important to concentrate on the aid relief for the affected people rather than the sale of arms."

But a Pakistani diplomat argued the F-16 deal was a "strategic necessity". "You cannot afford to lower your guard or your defenses. At the same time, you have to cope with the rest of the difficulties of life as well," he said.

The administration last March announced its willingness to sell advanced fighter jets to Pakistan, reversing 15 years of US policy aimed at denying Islamabad because of its nuclear weapons program.

It also allowed sales to India, which wants to buy up to 126 fighters, including the F-16s and several non-US planes.

Some experts see the Pakistan F-16 sale as balancing the sweeping July 18 US-India nuclear agreement under which President George W. Bush promised New Delhi access to previously restricted nuclear material.

Lockheed Martin has sold more than 4,400 F16s to the United States and other countries. The firm is scheduled to produce the last F16 in 2008 and has been eager to close the deal with Pakistan in an effort to extend the production line.

Copyright Reuters, 2005

asfar001

October 26th, 2005, 04:31 AM

so sad...after years of being sanctioned and not allowed to buy the much needed f-16, now that we were going to get them, we have to rething because of the earthquake. i guess the economic implications of the earthquake have begun to appear.

2DashingCanadian

October 26th, 2005, 06:34 AM

We will get them inshAllah. Mr. Bush can work somethng out.

oogabooga

October 26th, 2005, 11:51 AM

I think this is a welcome initiative by our government. Currently our country does not face any aggression by a foriegn force. Right now millions of our brothers are homeless sitting under the open skies without shelter or food and we need to help them. I think this initiative will further strengthen the country and improve the credibility of our government, whom were being criticized by our intelectuals for this deal. I am proud of Musharraf, expescially in his ability to make difficult decisions without hesitation. He is indeed a true leader!

UnitedPakistan

October 26th, 2005, 01:21 PM

They have simply been delayed as per our request.

oogabooga

October 26th, 2005, 01:53 PM

They have simply been delayed as per our request.

Yes I know and thats good because we need to focus our resources on saving and rehabilitating our Kashmiri Brothers and Sisters.

Intoxication

October 26th, 2005, 02:24 PM

^ not forgetting the ppl in northern areas and NWFP

oogabooga

October 26th, 2005, 02:27 PM

^ not forgetting the ppl in northern areas and NWFP

Yes definately, my bad.

HasanB

October 26th, 2005, 03:59 PM

I think the delay is probably a good idea ... as this was not the time to be an nouncing such a deal. However the deal should definitely go ahead in the near future ... and there should be no cutting down on the number of planes that we buy either.

asfar001

October 26th, 2005, 05:09 PM

i hope they get the deal till Bush is in office. after 2008...u never know those democrats may come to power and as usual bulsshit their sanctions on us and cancel the deal ...thats all im afraid off.

UnitedPakistan

October 26th, 2005, 09:12 PM

We have 3 more years people....

The Lockheed Martin factory in Texas has already started production from what i have been hearing on Pakistani forums and that as soon as congress approves we will get them.

cntower

November 12th, 2005, 11:05 AM

Have you heard the recent discussions; F16s for Aid?

I think it would be a better idea...since were in the process of building that superfighter with China.

oogabooga

November 12th, 2005, 03:10 PM

Have you heard the recent discussions; F16s for Aid?

I think it would be a better idea...since were in the process of building that superfighter with China.

No I havent. Please shed some more light on this subject.

HasanB

November 12th, 2005, 04:27 PM

I personally think that would be a gross mistake ... the aid is coming in anyway, no country in their right mind will refuse us aid. After a few years we will not have the opportunity to get the F-16s its just not going to happen we have this small window of opportunity. The earthquake was a tragedy in all its right, but we cant forget about our military requirements aswell. Just my opinion though...

Gumnaam

November 12th, 2005, 04:49 PM

^^ we have similar opinion on this.. ;)

No offensive designs but a strong defence is vital to live in peace with our neighbour.

musiddiqui

November 12th, 2005, 09:12 PM

this deal is like now or never therefore they should go ahead with it

UnitedPakistan

November 12th, 2005, 10:27 PM

^ No its not where did you hear this from?

Please do not give a link to SAtribune....

I really think we should ban links from that site lmao

musiddiqui

November 13th, 2005, 01:10 AM

well that is what i think i didnt get it from anywhere

Manbil

November 14th, 2005, 06:19 PM

^^ we have similar opinion on this.. ;)

No offensive designs but a strong defence is vital to live in peace with our neighbour.

What makes you think they are coming "free of cost"?

The US always finds a way to make Pakis pay. :D

Pakistan instead should be buying chinooks and blackhawks if it could right now!

HasanB

November 14th, 2005, 09:47 PM

What makes you think they are coming "free of cost"?

The US always finds a way to make Pakis pay. :D

Pakistan instead should be buying chinooks and blackhawks if it could right now!

Dude aid to any country is free of cost, thats why it is called aid. What on earth would we do with chinooks after we have given out the aid. I havent really heard much else about this, so i dont thin theres any truth in this, i dont think were delaying our purchase of F-16s.

UnitedPakistan

November 14th, 2005, 09:51 PM

So much confusion in this thread thanks to people adding assumptions.

Here is the bottomline...

Pakistan is getting the entire package it was looking to purchase from the US in a month or so after the Earthquake news dies down. It was simple a stunt by our government to make us not look like war mongerers.

swerveut

December 18th, 2005, 10:25 AM

There was this topic about the Army GHQ that was started here a while ago... I wonder what happened to it. Was a good discussion.

Anyways, the army has been publishing press releases the past few days to talk about how its really going to be. I think it would be good to post it here.

swerveut

December 18th, 2005, 10:26 AM

New GHQ will be functional, not luxurious: ISPR

By A Reporter

RAWALPINDI, Dec 16: A military spokesman on Friday rejected as “ludicrous propaganda” the Opposition’s criticism of the new General Headquarters complex to be built in the federal capital. Unlike the “eighth wonder of the world” that some allege the new complex was planned to be, it would focus on the “improvement of functioning rather than providing luxury”, Maj-Gen Shaukat Sultan told a select group of mediamen invited to the existing 150-year-old GHQ building here.

Gen Sultan, who heads the Inter Services Public Relations (ISPR) department of the military, said the complex would house the Ministry of Defence and the Joint Staff Headquarters also.

Though 2,400 acres of land has been acquired in sectors E-10 and D-11 for the purpose, he said the Defence Services Complex will cover about 1,500 acres only.

Offices of Ministry of Defence, Joint Services Headquarters and all services headquarters will occupy 206 acres and the GHQ only 99 acres. The remaining area will be used for building flats, houses, schools and hospitals for over 17,000 employees of all grades, he said.

Much of the remaining land would retain its pristine nature, with 870 acres providing a security belt and some 350 acres covered with woods and running streams.

Gen Sultan dispelled “allegations” by politicians and “impressions” created by the media that the complex would cover 2,450 acres, that “17,000 luxury flats” were planned and lakes would be created in the complex grounds.

In fact, the area acquired for the complex was 2,400 acres — at the same price that other government departments paid to the Capital Development Authority (CDA) for the land allotted to them — and 14,000 flats are to be constructed for defence employees of grade 1 to 19, he explained.

As for the lakes, he said the reality was small reservoirs were being built to store clean water of the nullas flowing from Margalla hills to irrigate the green area so as to conserve sweet water for drinking purposes.

“There will be no personal property of anyone within the Defence Services Complex,” the general asserted, rejecting as “irresponsible statements by frustrated individuals” that a housing society was planned inside the GHQ.

Gen Sultan said the master plan of Islamabad provided for the establishment of the defence services headquarters and the decision to shift GHQ from Rawalpindi to Islamabad was taken by Zulfikar Ali Bhutto in 1972. CDA allocated land for the purpose in 1981. The GHQ would be shifted to new location in phases over the next five to 10 years, he said.

Seventy per cent of the barracks of the present GHQ complex constructed in 1852 when the site was selected as Sub Area Command of the British Army and was never designed to contain as big an installation as GHQ, he reminded.

http://www.dawn.com/2005/12/17/nat5.htm

UnitedPakistan

December 18th, 2005, 10:36 AM

The old topic was closed after excessive flaming and insults were thrown.

asfar001

December 20th, 2005, 06:58 AM

LAHORE, Dec 19: Harcharan Singh, 19, of the Nankana Sahib, is the first Pakistani Sikh in the country’s 58-year history who has been commissioned in the Pakistan Army as an officer.

The minorities in Pakistan are allowed to sit in all examinations, including the one conducted by Inter Services Selection Board (ISSB), but neither a Hindu nor a Sikh could get selected for the army service since the country’s inception. However, many Christians served in the army.

Harcharan was skeptical this year while appearing in the ISSB’s preliminary tests, thinking that such examinations were not meant for them (Sikhs) as he could not get through the initial phase last year.

“This year, I got through the preliminary phase and appeared in the ISSB examination. However, I was mentally prepared to take admission in BA (Architecture) in the National College of Arts”.

“It was the happiest moment of my life when I came to know about my selection in the army. I am privileged to have this honour which none of my predecessors could ever achieve,” Harcharan told Dawn.

Harcharan, who passed his FSc (pre-engineering) in 2004 with 726 marks, wants the government to open the doors for his community to the law enforcing agencies as well.

Harcharan passed his matriculation from the Government Gurunank High School, Nankana Sahib, with 677 marks. He says that his school should be equipped with modern laboratory and competent teaching staff.

He says when his fellow Sikhs in Nankana Sahib learnt about his selection in the army they really felt proud of him. It has also changed their perception. Now they believe that young Sikhs have a fair chance to join the country’s most prestigious institutions.

Having a younger brother and three elder sisters, he wants his brother to follow suit. He says after the death of his father, a shopkeeper, some seven years ago, the credit of their education goes to his mother. “My mother wants me to earn a good name for the country.”

He says that his family migrated to the Northern Areas at the time of partition and in 1970s shifted to Nankana Sahib.

dawn.com

asfar001

December 20th, 2005, 08:34 AM

sania shut the hell up with your stuoid ninsensical narrow minded remarks. indians have muslims sikhs christians hindus in their army...america has people from mexico, muslims, everyone in the army. why cant we. infact i am proud that pakistan army would have sikh soldiers. it clearly shows that our minorities are treated not as bad as people think and secondly and very importantly it shows that minorities are also patriotic pakistanis. only because we are muslims dosent make us patriotric pakistanis understand. now shut the hell up and please learn to broaden your mind and atleast mature a little bit.

im sorry UP for using such language but what she posted just blew my brain of. :sleepy:

Rkhan

December 20th, 2005, 09:16 AM

Starsat86

December 20th, 2005, 12:08 PM

Sikhs involved in terrorism and other crimes!!!! Are you being serious, because that is just not the case, Pakistani Sikhs are a hardworking, religious, generous people and are patriotic and should be allowed in our army, navy, air force, police and other institutions. You need to see what the sikhs are doing in Nankana Sahib and other Sikh Gurudwaras and areas in relation to the Earthquake and then maybe you will realise what they are really about. By the way I am A Muslim.

ahmed_s

December 20th, 2005, 12:34 PM

what are u on about sania? pakistani sikhs are patriotic all the way! just and look in lahore for that matter. anyway...this is fantastic news! we need to get more minorities involved. :thumbsup:

UnitedPakistan

March 17th, 2006, 11:12 PM

Bumping!

It has been a while

adil

March 18th, 2006, 05:17 AM

why are there so many F16 pics, considering they make up a small portion of our forces. not even one F7. Why?

UnitedPakistan

March 18th, 2006, 06:21 AM

ugly and they are being phased out

and we all know the pride in our F-16's

adil

March 19th, 2006, 09:25 AM

the f16s are unreliale since uncle sam can cut them off any time, like they have done before; our hopes lie in the JF17 and future chinese tech, i personally think F16s were a bad decision, but i also understand that free stuff is irresistable for pakis.

bro the F7s may be ugly but they are excellent machines, and for that they deserve respect.

UnitedPakistan

March 19th, 2006, 09:57 PM

No,

Pakistan can obtain parts from Turkey so they are not unreliable. F-7's? EXCELLENT?

Have you gone mad?

I suggest you pakdef.info to save you from these crazy statements you seem to be making.

Gumnaam

March 19th, 2006, 10:16 PM

Pakistan can obtain parts from Turkey so they are not unreliable

Again, subject to US permission!

UnitedPakistan

March 19th, 2006, 10:29 PM

Pakistan and Turkey are currently sending each other arms under the table. We have sent them Babur cruise missile and we are helping them increase the range of their missiles. This is all being done beneath the covers because Turkey would be in violation of MTCR. So it is not valid to conclude they wont provide spares even under the table.

merijanpakistan

March 20th, 2006, 02:00 AM

Salam,

Pakistan and Turkey are currently sending each other arms under the table. We have sent them Babur cruise missile and we are helping them increase the range of their missiles. This is all being done beneath the covers because Turkey would be in violation of MTCR. So it is not valid to conclude they wont provide spares even under the table.

UP, F-7PG with Griffo are not bad. They are pretty capable against most of IAF, leave Mig29s and MKIs.

Moreover, I do think Turkey is incapable of helping Pakistan under-the-table, unless US desires so. I am not sure, but I think this is because their F-16 installations are very strictly guarded and monitored by the US. With F-16s, even though they are capable, they are "subject to US permission!"

I am a big Rafale supporter. I like French planes. They are extremely capable machines, but they are slightly expansive. However, French are unlikely to put arms embargo to Pakistan, if we go for Rafale.

Also, I don't think Babar TOT to Turkey is a reliable news. Its an internet rumor at best.

But again, PAF knows whats best.

Peace.

UnitedPakistan

March 20th, 2006, 02:14 AM

UP, F-7PG with Griffo are not bad. They are pretty capable against most of IAF, leave Mig29s and MKIs.
They have been recorded complaints about the F-7's stability in flight. Perhaps you can open a thread at PakDef and they will have the articles and the correct quotes.

Moreover, I do think Turkey is incapable of helping Pakistan under-the-table, unless US desires so. I am not sure, but I think this is because their F-16 installations are very strictly guarded and monitored by the US. With F-16s, even though they are capable, they are "subject to US permission!"
What is the point of US permission when it will be done under the table? obviously Pakistani-Turkish ties are very strong after that article about the Babur cruise missile going to Turkey. Can you tell me where you have read that the installations are strictly guarded and monitored?

I am a big Rafale supporter. I like French planes. They are extremely capable machines, but they are slightly expansive. However, French are unlikely to put arms embargo to Pakistan, if we go for Rafale.
Yes, I also feel this way!

The French have no problem selling us the Rafales, infact they continue to harass our delegation to go for the Rafale everytime they go to see the Mirage's.

Also, I don't think Babar TOT to Turkey is a reliable news. Its an internet rumor at best.
I dont know it seems like a reliable piece of news. So far not many have questioned its validity.

asfar

March 20th, 2006, 07:01 AM

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F-7P_01l.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F7.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F7_Nightmission.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F7P_Para.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F7PTriFormation.JPG

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F-7PG_143_Pak_Batch2.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/F7/F7pg_Sq20.jpg

asfar

March 20th, 2006, 07:03 AM

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/Mirage/TouchDown.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/Mirage/Mirage_PDF.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/Mirage/Mirage_PDF3.jpg

merijanpakistan

March 20th, 2006, 07:05 AM

Salam,

They have been recorded complaints about the F-7's stability in flight. Perhaps you can open a thread at PakDef and they will have the articles and the correct quotes.

Even though I have been its reader since long, I searched some archives of PakDef again, and I feel the same. F-7PG with a modern radar, and re-designed wings is good enough to counter any thing in IAF, leave Mig29 and Sukhois.

I would not consider them inferior and therefore post. It would be a good idea to post some pictures from this PAF plane that is our second backbone, after Mirages.

What is the point of US permission when it will be done under the table? obviously Pakistani-Turkish ties are very strong after that article about the Babur cruise missile going to Turkey. Can you tell me where you have read that the installations are strictly guarded and monitored?
I was talking the "no objection" under-the-table from DOD. I tried to find the details for "Peace Onyx I" programs. Its conditions does not allow to sell any thing made by "Turkish Aircraft Industries" to foreign countries, except within the constraints of FMS (Foreign Military Sales) of the Pentagon.

I couldn't find the official details of PO-I program, but a general mention can be found on many sites, including F-16.net:
http://www.f-16.net/f-16_users_article21.html

Yes, I also feel this way!

The French have no problem selling us the Rafales, infact they continue to harass our delegation to go for the Rafale everytime they go to see the Mirage's.

Exactly. I have long believed that Rafales is the only answer to MKIs in IAF. I cant see Pakistan getting Eurofighter or JSF in near future, while IAF is building 150 examples of MKI + 126 of another kind.

Moreover, I love the aircraft even after listening to critics of Rafale. I believe JF-17 can learn a lot from Rafale, overtime.

I dont know it seems like a reliable piece of news. So far not many have questioned its validity.
I don't find it reliable, but I won't post my critic on Pakdef. I do believe that some of the members on that forum have knowledge of things that are yet to become public, and a lot of times they refrain from posting them in spirit of national interest. It could, therefore, be possible that Pakistan is considering such TOT to Turkey, but I find it hard to believe... for many many reasons that I will not post here.

If we have, then I am happy for that Muslim country.

Peace.

asfar

March 20th, 2006, 07:06 AM

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_New_005.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_New_001.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_New_004.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_New_003.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_001.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_002.jpg

http://pakistanidefence.com/images/Air_Force_Pics/FC1/JF17_IdeasExpo_PakistaniDefence.com_003.jpg

adil

March 22nd, 2006, 07:10 AM

UP if u dont like the F-7 that is fine but dont even begin to suggest that the fighter that formed the back bone of not only the PAF, but the IAF(as the Mig 21), PLAAF, and the countless others is not a reliable platform, especially equipped w/ western tech as many members have suggested.

As for the Rafale I agree it is a very good piece of equipment, but its is very expensive (which is why it has had little export success, and is why they keep pushing it on PAF) and if PAF does get it, it will only be in very small numbers. The JF 17 is a good aircraft (especially considering its price) and will form a good backbone of the future PAF, but rather than Rafale I think PAF will most likely end up investing in an improved J-10 from China (but rafale might still happen).
Eurofighter will likely never happen (germany will stop it ), and the US would never sell the JSF to Pakistan, since we are known for turning things over to the Chinese

Intoxication

March 22nd, 2006, 08:18 PM

http://www.aeronautics.ru/lockheed/f-16_falcon/f16-20-pakistan.jpg

http://www.aeronautics.ru/lockheed/f-16_falcon/f16-21-pakistan.jpg

http://www.aeronautics.ru/lockheed/f-16_falcon/f16-19-pakistan.jpg

UnitedPakistan

March 22nd, 2006, 10:11 PM

adil

March 23rd, 2006, 07:52 AM

What makes you think Germany wont allow it?
The new right wing gov't is what make me think they would not allow it. The other two major partners in the Eurofighter program ( i.e. UK, and Italy) both have good defense realtionships with Pakistan, and I wouldn't expect them to have any problems with it.
Many European gov'ts are uneasy about selling offensive weapons to India or Pakistan. Its also the reason why the Swedes have been reluctant to sell the Gripen to Pakistan.

UnitedPakistan

March 23rd, 2006, 01:26 PM

Germany might be selling the U-boat submarines to Pakistan soon so I dont expect there to be trouble getting the eurofighter.

asfar

March 24th, 2006, 07:00 AM

yea i dnt get it y would germany block any such proposal?

adil

March 24th, 2006, 09:23 AM

I am not saying that they will but I am simply expressing my strong suspicsion that the new rightwing government will be unwilling to make such a deal. Also I have read on sinodefence forum that when Turkey expressed interest in the Eurofighter, the German government refused permission to allow the aircraft to be shown off to the Turks.
So I have my doubts about deals with Germany. Members on sinodefence also reported that KSA's Eurofighter deal has faced opposition from Germany.
Many European countries dont like the idea of their weapons being used in a future conflict between India and Pakistan, and they would also be concerned about their tech ending up in Chinese hands, since they have an embargo on defense deals with China.

merijanpakistan

March 25th, 2006, 04:54 AM

Salam,

^^^^

True.

Moreover, it might be very expensive to maintain Eurofighter, since Europe would be unwilling to allow Kamra to even overhaul their planes.

Rafale, on the other hand, might do equally good or even better. Also with French, they are likely to not only give (EVENTUALLY!!) Kamra the overhauling know-how to Kamra, but might even allow Kamra to produce/modify some parts for Rafale, especially those that may not be too superior to Mirage series of planes.

We have dealt with France before and they are reliable with technology transfer and spare-parts issues. Moreover, they are unlikely to be politically blackmailed by some Western countries over co-operation with Pakistan.

Peace.

UnitedPakistan

March 25th, 2006, 05:39 AM

I really dont think PAF would be intrested in a ToT type deal for the Rafale unless it was really cheap. But if we can pull it off I will dance in the streets naked. But I agree with Merijan for once.

adil

March 25th, 2006, 09:50 AM

only problem with Rafale is its price tag. but i agree it would be the better option overall.

UnitedPakistan

March 25th, 2006, 05:19 PM

We could afford a small force of 25-35 aircrafts though. According to a French newspaper they said we were intrested in the Rafale and the Typhoon and we have even sent a delegation to Italy to see the Typoon in action.

Gumnaam

March 25th, 2006, 11:07 PM

Salam,
Rafale, on the other hand, might do equally good or even better. Also with French, they are likely to not only give (EVENTUALLY!!) Kamra the overhauling know-how to Kamra, but might even allow Kamra to produce/modify some parts for Rafale, especially those that may not be too superior to Mirage series of planes.

We have dealt with France before and they are reliable with technology transfer and spare-parts issues. Moreover, they are unlikely to be politically blackmailed by some Western countries over co-operation with Pakistan.

Peace.
^^ VERY TRUE! :yes:

You always speak my mind! :)

I really dont think PAF would be intrested in a ToT type deal for the Rafale unless it was really cheap. But if we can pull it off I will dance in the streets naked. But I agree with Merijan for once.
Personally, I hate to see PAF buying anything without ToT and I am also very much in favour of PAF going for Rafale (with ToT / Technical know-how).

If this deal ever happened, I will be joining you in streets but definitely with my clothes on. :lol:

UnitedPakistan

March 26th, 2006, 02:44 AM

But you will be missing all the fun!

adil

March 26th, 2006, 04:24 AM

I think ToT is a must for PAF in the future if we have any intention of building a domestic aviation industry. The more know-how we can get the better. It will cost money but in the long run it will have its benefits.

UP I think ur right a batch of 25-35 is most likely. I think they will probably start thinking about it in another 2 years or so once the F-16s have arrived.

UnitedPakistan

March 26th, 2006, 05:26 AM

We have sent delegations so I am guessing we should hear more about by 2007 once most of our recent purchases go through.

merijanpakistan

March 26th, 2006, 08:44 AM

Salam,

I would love to see a TOT for Rafale, and if such a thing happens, i would be the third one with you guys in the street... but certainly with clothes. So we're gonna have 2 crazy and one naked guy dancing in streets.. :D

However, I don't really think a complete TOT will happen if we go for Rafale. One of the concern of French is transfering sensative technology (especially regarding avionics, R.A.M and engine) to a country outside EU.

I was hoping for some parts manufacturing (which is different from TOT) and overhauling of Rafales in Kamra, so that we don't have to depend upon French during a crises. TOT for Rafales is not a real option for Pakistan, as French are unlikely to agree on that. If they do, then you guys know our dance plan...

Regarding F-16+1 theory of PAF, I am not really impressed with J-10 unless mass-aquired. I wanna see something comparable and exceeding MKI and new 126 fighters that indians are gonna decide.

Peace.

Peace.

UnitedPakistan

March 26th, 2006, 05:08 PM

The French are desperate for sales actually. Everytime we send a delegation the Rafales come up. I was actually speaking to a French friend of mine who also said that ToT for the Rafales with some tech not transferred is a good possibility. He cited the fact that we have been buying their equipment for quite sometime.

_BPS_

March 27th, 2006, 04:16 AM

Quality wise, the EF is better than the Rafale. Each was built based on different requirements. Rafale was built based on France's Navy's requirement of a small twin-engined plane which would fit on its carriers.

Plus, the tech on Rafale has not matured yet, and its radar is not ready.The only thing good about buying this AC is that it would be free of political problems. As you know, UK is America's bitch, and IF something goes wrong with the US, they may ask UK to sanction Pak along with them.

adil

March 28th, 2006, 08:35 AM

The j10 is not up to the MKI at this point, although some chinese forums would disagree, but the j-10c, underdevelopment, should easily be able to take on MKI, and from what I have read it should be ready soon. I think PAF is interested in that. Prez Mush. has hinted that the J-10 is on the future wishlist. The J-10c is expected to be very close to eurofighter's capability, the chinese also have a twin engine J-10 in the pipeline (j10c may be it, not sure). We dont know much about it, since the chinese are very secretive, that is why it seems shady, but PAF definately will have access to it and if they want it must be good.

asfar001

March 28th, 2006, 05:36 PM

i saw pictures of j-10 and some of the plane's details....i think the j-10c would be a great choice...since the supplier is very reliable i mean we wont have to worry about stuff like not getting spareparts additional planes etc etc...plus china is right next door and our most steadfirst ally...i think j-10c if it proves to be as capable as said should be a good counter to the MKI and a favorable choice for pakistan...

UnitedPakistan

March 28th, 2006, 09:11 PM

J-10 can not be compared to the Rafale yet and it hasnt been proven to perform well against the MKI.

adil

March 30th, 2006, 05:02 AM

Ur rite it hasnt been proven against the MKI, but it has all the goodies necessary to go up against the MKI. For example, the canards that give it manuverability, plus the planned thrust vectoring engine for future J10c, which I believe is under development. Its also suppose to have an advanced avionics package, future versions will also have two engines and stealth features. It cant be compared favouribly to the Rafale at this point, but the J10c should compare favouribly to Rafale and Eurofighter.
The J10 was based on an Israeli design, which I am sure had some western input. So, although not proven the J10c has a very good chance of doing well against the MKI. Plus the best thing for Pakistan in terms of J10 is that it will come with no strings attached and may even be produced in Pakistan.

asfar

March 30th, 2006, 08:16 AM

i hope pakistan would get the twin engine j-10

_BPS_

March 30th, 2006, 08:22 AM

Intoxication

March 30th, 2006, 08:24 PM

Pakistan gets women combat pilots

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41504000/jpg/_41504078_pilots2_220ap.jpg
The women had to go through the gruelling three-year training

The Pakistani Air Force (PAF) has inducted four women as fighter pilots for the first time.

The women were part of a batch of 36 cadets who were awarded flying badges after three years of gruelling training at the PAF academy at Risalpur.

Being a fighter pilot has until now been a purely male domain. Women could join the armed forces but only for non-combat jobs like the medical corps.

Three years ago the PAF decided to allow women to train as fighter pilots.

First batch

It was a passing out parade with a difference.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41504000/jpg/_41504082_pilots_203bap.jpg
Although few, the presence of women is being felt in PAF

Never before had any woman been part of the batch of fighter pilots being awarded flying badges.

And the difference was recognised by the vice chief of the army, Gen Ahsan Saleem Hayat, who handed out the certificates of honour to the successful men and women cadets.

Expressing his delight, Gen Hayat said the air force had taken the lead to induct women in the combat units of the armed forces.

When the BBC visited the training academy nearly a year ago, the first batch of four women cadets had just moved on to fly jet-engine planes.

There were six others who were in the second batch and a few others in the aerospace unit.

'Dream come true'

Although these trailblazers were few in number, many instructors admitted their presence was already being felt.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/41129000/jpg/_41129935_pilot203.jpg
Saba Khan, a fighter pilot, says it was her dream come true

One of the female cadets and now a fighter pilot, Saba Khan, then told the BBC that joining the air force to become a pilot was like a dream come true.

Other female cadets were equally excited.

At the passing out, one of the graduating women flying officers, Nadia Gul, received the trophy for best academic achievement along with two of her male colleagues who got trophies for best flying performance and general duties.

The air force academy is still male-dominated, and it is not clear what the real feelings of the male cadets have been to the induction of women into the fighter pilot programme. Officially, most have welcomed the move.

Even so, the fact that four women are now officially fighter pilots is a clear indication that the new policy of opening up the combat units of the Pakistani armed forces for women is here to stay.
http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/south_asia/4861666.stm
------------------
So what do you guys think about women being combat pilots? I personally think its a good idea, as it shows that ordinary Pakistani women are getting an equal chance to fullfil their dreams of joining the PAF. It would also give us a different point of view from the female side on how to defend our country and protect its national interest. Plus this might even go somewhere is reducing the large unemployment and underemployment rate of women in Pakistan.

UnitedPakistan

March 30th, 2006, 09:33 PM

Lets hope they are the ones to drop bombs on the terrorists and the extremists. Ohh how I would love that very much. This is also is a positive indiacator of how women are starting to climb the ladder in Pakistan.

musiddiqui

March 31st, 2006, 02:28 AM

RISALPUR, March 30: Pakistan Air Force on Thursday welcomed the first four women pilots into its cadre with ceremonial pomp and aerial acrobatics at a grand parade watched by the Vice-Chief of Army Staff.
Saba Khan, Nadia Gul, Mariam Khalil and Saira Batool were among 36 aviation cadets who received their wings after three and a half years of intensive training, breaking into an all-male bastion of Pakistan’s armed forces.
“I want to fly fighter jets and prove that girls can equally serve our country in the best possible manner as men are doing,” Flying Officer Gul, 22, said after graduating from the air force’s elite training academy in Risalpur.
Vice-Chief of Army Staff Gen Ahsan Saleem Hyat said the four had “shown the spirit and courage to rise above the ordinary and break new ground for others to emulate.” “If Pakistan is to rise to the height that it deserves ... both men and women of our beloved land must find equal space and opportunity,” he said.
Carrying rifles and dressed in the same blue uniform as their male colleagues — except for a kameez over their navy blue trousers, and one wearing a headscarf — they paraded before family members and diplomats, and took the military oath.
Two other women — along with nine male cadets — dropped out of the same training course because of air sickness and slow progress. They now work in ground branches of the air force.
The four women are the first women pilots in the 58-year-history of the Pakistan air force. They trained in MFI-17 Super Mushfhak and T-37 jets, and depending on their abilities and the needs of the air force could go on to fly fighter jets.
Three more women are due to get their wings in October, but the air force will see how they perform before deciding whether to induct more women trainees, said Air Cmdr Abid Khwaja, chief of the flight training college.
About 5 percent of Pakistan’s air force officers are women, mostly serving in areas like engineering, medicine, air traffic control and administration.—AP

http://img.villagephotos.com/p/2005-11/1113934/untitled.JPG

Source: Dawn

singaporean

March 31st, 2006, 03:44 AM

PAF’s first 4 women fighter pilots graduate

RISALPUR: Defence services are a challenging and daunting job but our aim to join Pakistan Air Force (PAF) is to serve Pakistan, said Saba Khan, one of the four women general duty (GDP) pilots who are the first women to earn flying badges from PAF.

Talking to reporters after the passing out parade at the PAF Academy, Khan, flanked by Nadia Gul, Mariam Khalil and Saira Batool, said that they were proud of joining PAF as cadets. They urged women to join air force “because it is an attractive and honourable service”.

The four women pilots joined the PAF Academy in October 2002 and during three-year stay they had gone through demanding general service training. Two of them are from Quetta, one from Peshawar and one from Bahawalpur. Air Commodore Abid Khawaja told reporters that the women pilots performed well in all fields during their training. He said although they faced some difficulties at the start of their training, they made rapid improvement to overcome all hurdles with hard work and dedication.

He said they had gone through strenuous academic education and rigorous flying training on MFI-17 Super Mushshak and T-37 Jet aircraft. He added that three more women pilots were getting training at the PAF Academy under the 117th GD Course and would pass out within six months. Khawaja said the induction of women GD pilots had been stopped. “We want to check operational fitness of these women officers after which a decision about the induction of more women officers would be taken,” he said.

Vice Chief of the Army Staff General Ahsan Saleem Hayat was the chief guest at the graduation ceremony. The VCOAS staff awarded the Quaid-e-Azam Banner to the 4th Squadron. The trophy for the best performance in General Service Training went to Cadet Taimoor Khan Jadoon. Female Cadet Nadia Gul was awarded with Asghar Hussain Trophy for best performance in academics. The Chief of Air Staff’s Trophy for Best Performance in Flying was lifted by Iraj Jamal. The graduation ceremony also included display of immaculate and thrilling aerobatics by the flyers of Karakoram-8 (K-8 Academy Hawks) and T-37 aircraft (Sherdils). APP

http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2006\03\31\story_31-3-2006_pg7_14