View Full Version : Is this a good review on BERLIN? (New York Times)


triboro
February 14th, 2008, 03:02 AM
http://travel.nytimes.com/2006/12/10/travel/10hours.html

36 Hours in Berlin

By DENNY LEE
Published: December 10, 2006

BERLIN is like New York City in the 1980s. Rents are cheap, graffiti is everywhere and the air crackles with a creativity that comes only from a city in transition. And few cities are changing as profoundly. Nearly two decades after the Berlin Wall tumbled down, the city’s two sides are still locked in a kind of cultural dialectic, as the center of gravity shifts to the once desolate boroughs of the East. Bullet-scarred buildings are metamorphosing from squatters’ homes, to artists’ studios, and then to retail showrooms. Gray Communist alleys are laboratories for trendy bars, restaurants and galleries. And, like the city itself, Berliners continue to reinvent themselves as cultural vanguards, pushing the boundaries of art, fashion and design. With so much to explore and create, the city never sleeps.

Friday

3 p.m.
1) REICHSTAG AIRLIFT

Berlin is a big city, about eight times the area of Paris, so get your bearings. Follow the tourists to the Television Tower, the Sputnik-like needle in Alexanderplatz (www.berlinerfernsehturm.de; 8 euro admission, about $11 at $1.36 to the euro). Or, for more intimate views, head to the Reichstag. Skip the hourlong line by making reservations for afternoon tea at the Dachgartenrestaurant, or roof garden restaurant (49-30-22-62-99-0; www.feinkost-kaefer.de). Afterward, you’re free to loop around the glass igloo.

5:30 p.m.
2) TRANS-EURO EXPRESS

Sightseeing mainstays like the triumphant Brandenburg Gate, the crystalline Potsdamer Platz (www.potsdamer-platz.net) and the sobering Memorial to the Murdered Jews of Europe (www.holocaust-mahnmal.de) are within an easy stroll. But don’t miss the Hauptbahnhof (www.hbf-berlin.de). Opened in May, the glass-and-steel spaceship is the Grand Central Terminal of Europe, a great place to watch daily life unfold.

9 p.m.
3) NOTHING WURST

Forget Bratwurst. For lighter versions of Teutonic cuisine, try Schneeweiss, a nouvelle German restaurant in the Friedrichshain district, Berlin’s equivalent of the Lower East Side (Simplonstrasse 16, 49-30-290-497-04; www.schneeweiss-berlin.de). Dishes like grilled trout in a red wine sauce and pork ragout in a red berry coulis are served in a sparse, candlelit room that draws young couples and trend-conscious diners. Entrees rarely exceed 12 euros.

11 p.m.
4) NIGHT OUT AT SPROCKETS

Stay in Friedrichshain. The smoke-filled cafes around Simon-Dach-Strasse are full of young Berliners priced out of the central Mitte district; beers are usually under 2.50 euros. Later, cross the Spree River into the borough of Kreuzberg, the former punk quarter and Turkish enclave that is experiencing a Williamsburg-style revival. The bars and clubs along Oranienstrasse offer something for everyone. For rollicking music, strut to S036 and hear live bands like Napalm Death (No. 190; 49-30-414-013-06; www.so36.de). Or, for drag queens and plastic Virgin Marys, sashay a few doors down to Roses, a kitschy lounge that sparkles until 5 a.m. (No. 187; 49-30-615-65-70). The night is still young, so pick up a copy of Zitty (www.zitty.de), a biweekly arts magazine, or Exberliner (www.exberliner.com), an English-language monthly, for the club of the moment.

Saturday

Noon
5) MITTE ART MILE

O.K., you’re still asleep. But when you do wake up, you’ll need some fuel before hitting the much-hyped art scene in the Mitte district. Do both at Monsieur Vuong (Alte Schönhauser Strasse 46; 49-30-3087-2643; www.monsieurvuong.de), a Vietnamese restaurant that serves as a kind of high school cafeteria for the neighborhood’s galleries. A spicy bowl of glass noodles with chicken is 6.40 euros. Then hop over to Auguststrasse, Mitte’s Art Mile, where the buzz originated at places like Galerie Eigen+Art (No. 26; 49-30-280-66-05; www.eigen-art.com) and Kunst-Werke Berlin, the city’s answer to New York’s P.S. 1. (No. 69; 49-30-243-45-90; www.kw-berlin.de). Like SoHo in its pre-mall days, the galleries can afford to be refreshingly uneven and irreverent. And new ones open every month. Goff+Rosenthal (Brunnenstrasse 3; 49-30- 4373-50-83; www.goffandrosenthal.com), an offshoot of a Chelsea gallery in New York, opened three months ago and showcases emerging artists from Berlin and elsewhere. For a handy gallery map, pick up the free Index (www.indexberlin.de).

3 p.m.
6) POSTMODERN SHOPPING SPREE

I shop, therefore I am. While global brands like American Apparel and Diesel have recently colonized Mitte, low rents mean that concept stores, micro-boutiques and street-wear designers are still around, blurring the line between gallery and galleria. Comme des Garçons opened one of its clandestine temporary stores in a hard-to-find alley (Brunnenstrasse 152; 49-30-280-45-338; www.guerrilla-store.com). Über is a retail chameleon, so it might sell handbags one month and garden crows the next (Auguststrasse 26A; 49-30-6677-90-95; www.ueber-store.de). And the Apartment looks like an empty white box, until you descend into the dark cellar crammed with fashion labels like Bernhard Willhelm and Caviar Gauche (Memhardstrasse 8; 49-30-2804-2253; www.apartmentberlin.de). How does anyone in this underemployed city afford 300-euro shirts?

7 p.m.
7) SAND, SUDS AND SAUNA

Ponder that question at one of the groovy beach bars that have washed up along the Spree. There’s the U.F.O.-themed Space Bar in Friedrichshain, behind the longest extant section of the Berlin Wall (Mühlenstrasse 63; 49-30-4606-84-91; www.space-beach.de). The BundesPresseStrand has two pools and a glass pavilion near the Reichstag (Kapelleufer 1; www.bundespressestrand.de). But the favorite of the skinny jeans and fauxhawk set is Badeschiff, just east of gritty Kreuzberg (Eichenstrasse 4; 49-030-533-20-30; www.badeschiff.de). During the winter, its swimming pool, on a barge, is cocooned under a bubble tent and turned into a floating sauna.

9 p.m.
8) WHAT’S BISTRO IN DEUTSCH?

In another sign of Berlin’s ascension, the city now boasts 10 Michelin-starred restaurants, 4 of them in the former German Democratic Republic. But as in Paris and Hong Kong, good food is not confined to white-tablecloth establishments. Take Altes Europa, a smoky tavern in Mitte (Gipsstrasse 11; 49-30-2809-38-40; www.alteseuropa.com). For around 15 euros, you get Old World ambience, a smart-looking crowd and bistro-quality fare like plump green salads, velvety soups and tender steaks. A neighborhood gem, to be sure, and one that isn’t rare.

11 p.m.
9) NEO-WEIMAR

Few streets have mutated as much as Oranienburger Strasse, the spine of Mitte. A squatters’ row as recently as the late 1990s, the street is now littered with bars and tourist traps that recall Bleecker Street on amateur nights. For a glimpse of Berlin’s quickly fading underbelly, grab a beer at the Tacheles art house (No. 54-56A; 49-30-282-61-85; www.tacheles.de), the ruins of a former department store that feels like the inside of CBGB’s legendary bathroom. Then flee to White Trash, a cabaret and tattoo parlor that resurrects the Weimar Republic inside a gaudy Chinese-Irish restaurant (Schönhauser Allee 6-7; www.whitetrashfastfood.com). Packed with out-of-work artists, punks rockers and assorted freaks, it’s fringe Berlin at its finest.

3:30 a.m.
10) ‘BEST CLUB IN THE WORLD’

Maybe it’s the hypnotic techno, hedonistic frisson or illicit party favors, but globe-trotting clubbers rave about Berghain, a huge disco in a weedy stretch behind the Ostbahnhof station in Friedrichshain (www.berghain.de; admission 12 euros). How else to explain the 45-minute wait at this ungodly hour? According to its detailed Wikipedia citation, “Berghain is best-known for its decadent, bacchanalian, sexually uninhibited parties which often continue into the following afternoon” And some stay even longer.

Sunday
1 p.m.
11) BIRDS AND BEERS

Need a break from the über-hipsters and existential banter? The huge and green Tiergarten — Berlin’s central park — is an urban oasis popular with joggers, bird-watchers and nude sunbathers alike. To shake off last night, take a long stroll through this swampy former hunting ground. Drop in on the pandas and penguins at the Zoological Garden and Aquarium (Hardenbergplatz 8; 49-30-254-010; www.zoo-berlin.de). Or grab an outdoor seat at Cafe Am Neuen See, a calming beer garden and restaurant that sits on the edge of a lake (Lichtensteinallee; 49-30-2544-93-00). It is your quiet time in Berlin.

3 p.m.
12) TRADE YOUR EUROS

Despite the lousy exchange rate, you’ll be surprised by how many euros you have left. Use them along Strasse des 17. Juni, the park’s main transverse, which turns into Berlin’s oldest (and priciest) flea market on weekends. Forage for early-20th-century antiques, used books and a jumble of odds and ends. Alternately, for some East Village flair, make a beeline for the Sunday flea market at Boxhagener Platz. It’s crammed with funky T-shirts, vintage Kraftwerk vinyl, plastic housewares and plenty of genuine junk. Don’t forget your camera: the crowd trends toward purple-dyed punks, nose-pierced vamps, dreadlocked crusties and, everyone’s favorite, aging hippies. In other words, it’s the 80s all over again, but with even more kitsch.

The Basics

Continental Airlines flies nonstop to Berlin from Newark, and Delta flies nonstop from Kennedy. Flights start at about $400 this month and take about eight hours on the outbound leg. Berlin’s tiny Tegel airport is five miles from the city center. The 20-minute taxi ride costs about 20 euros ($27 at $1.36 to the euro).

Sleep in grand style at the Hotel de Rome, the latest from the luxury hotelier Rocco Forte (Behrenstrasse 37;49-30-460-60-90; www.hotelderome.com). Opened in October, it occupies a former bank in Mitte, just off Unter den Linden. The 146 rooms are spacious, furnished in Art-Deco and neo-Classic styles, and start at 380 euros a night.

For modern style at a moderate price, check into Lux 11 (Rosa-Luxemburg-Strasse 9-13; 49-30-936-2800; www.lux11.com). With rooms starting at 99 euros, the boutique hotel keeps costs down by eschewing daily maid service and 24-hour attention, and focusing on what matters to its fashionable guests: sleek design.

If that’s outside your budget, try the nearby Circus Hostel (Weinbergsweg 1A; 49-30-2839-14-33; www.circus-berlin.de). Clean, friendly and efficient, the hostel has private rooms with baths starting at 62 euros for a double; dormitory-style bunks start at 17 euros.

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 08:24 AM
Yeah I think it's great review! It's geared toward funky hipsters, so I don't really know what your style/age is. I'm sure some older blueblood might read this and think "eww". :lol:

I can vouch for Berghain! :wink2: ...and Circus Hostel.

Of course you're asking people in the wrong forum. These Germans on here are huge Berlin haters, so they could give a rat's ass whether it's positive or not. :ohno:

Ludis_Multi
February 14th, 2008, 02:11 PM
Of course you're asking people in the wrong forum. These Germans on here are huge Berlin haters, so they could give a rat's ass whether it's positive or not. :ohno:

Now now... that's a lie.

KoolKeatz
February 14th, 2008, 04:25 PM
Kampfy hat Komplexe. Wir wissens doch alle...

Kampflamm
February 14th, 2008, 04:34 PM
In den 80er Jahren war NY ein einziger großer Haufen Shijze. Deswegen sehe ich die Review als negativ an.

Tannenschnaps
February 14th, 2008, 05:55 PM
Ich sehe das Review positiv, da es ja fast schon aussagt, dass Berlin in 20 Jahren geilo ist.

Ludis_Multi
February 14th, 2008, 06:08 PM
Ich fänds geilo, wenn Berlin in 200 Jahren geilo werden würde. Aber ich bin zu sehr Realist und zu wenig Träumer.

Tannenschnaps
February 14th, 2008, 06:38 PM
Glämteutschland wird bombardiert. >>> Jeder flüchtet in ze Hauptstadt. >>> Berlin wird geil.

Mal ernsthaft: es kann sowieso keiner abschätzen, wie die Welt in ein paar Jahrzehnten aussehen wird. Klar: zur Zeit sieht es mit Berlin nicht so gut aus (obwohl sich seit der Wende einiges um 180° gebessert hat). Aber wenn der derzeitige Senat wegkommt... Von daher halte ich mich bezüglich "Berlin bleibt scheiße" oder "Berlin wird geilo" zurück.

"Alles, das erfunden werden kann, ist erfunden worden".
Charles H. Duell, Beauftragter, USA Office von Patenten, 1899.

George W. Bush
February 14th, 2008, 07:08 PM
You should best ignore this kind of articles.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 07:20 PM
Yeah I think it's great review! It's geared toward funky hipsters, so I don't really know what your style/age is. I'm sure some older blueblood might read this and think "eww". :lol:

I can vouch for Berghain! :wink2: ...and Circus Hostel.

Of course you're asking people in the wrong forum. These Germans on here are huge Berlin haters, so they could give a rat's ass whether it's positive or not. :ohno:

There are enough "hip" places in Seattle so I certainly am not in search of that in my first visit to Berlin.

Besides the usual must sees, which are obvious it seems, I plan on the old and not the new.

Thanks for the feedback!

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 07:39 PM
You should best ignore this kind of articles.

why? explain please

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 07:46 PM
There are enough "hip" places in Seattle so I certainly am not in search of that in my first visit to Berlin.


Well, the article is highlighting the fact that Berlin has a really great cutting-edge art scene and nightlife/club scene. If you like art, you'll be in the right town. You don't anticipate delving even just a tad bit into Berlin's legendary nightlife?

Besides the usual must sees, which are obvious it seems, I plan on the old and not the new.

What do you mean by this? Do you mean you're only interested in old buildings rather than modern architecture?

George W. Bush
February 14th, 2008, 07:58 PM
why? explain pleaseBecause reading histrionic crap like "the air crackles with a creativity ", "the city’s two sides are still locked in a kind of cultural dialectic", "Berliners continue to reinvent themselves as cultural vanguards" or "bullet-scarred buildings are metamorphosing" really sends chills down my spine. Try finding something more down to earth.

KoolKeatz
February 14th, 2008, 07:59 PM
What do you mean by this? Do you mean you're only interested in old buildings rather than modern architecture?

If thats the case you choosed the wrong city triboro.

George W. Bush
February 14th, 2008, 08:02 PM
This is not true. Berlin is full of old buildings. But don't think that old is always beautiful.

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 08:27 PM
Because reading histrionic crap like "the air crackles with a creativity ", "the city’s two sides are still locked in a kind of cultural dialectic", "Berliners continue to reinvent themselves as cultural vanguards" or "bullet-scarred buildings are metamorphosing" really sends chills down my spine. Try finding something more down to earth.

I don't find those quotes histrionic. What would you prefer them to say?

"Berlin's pretty creative I guess, west and east sides are still different from each other, there's alot of cultural stuff there, and some of the buildings are being cleaned up." :lol:

It's a travel article. They want to convince people that Berlin is worth visiting. Plus, I am not melo-dramatic but I've always said there is an energy in the air in Berlin thats hard to describe but you feel like you are in a place that is creative and happening and becoming. For outsiders this really is true. Maybe if you live in Germany, you don't appreciate that and focus rather on the fact that all your tax money is going to Berlin or whatever.

George W. Bush
February 14th, 2008, 08:33 PM
Well, I only wanted to stress that I am not "reinventing myself as a cultural vanguard". I never did.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 08:34 PM
Well, the article is highlighting the fact that Berlin has a really great cutting-edge art scene and nightlife/club scene. If you like art, you'll be in the right town. You don't anticipate delving even just a tad bit into Berlin's legendary nightlife?



What do you mean by this? Do you mean you're only interested in old buildings rather than modern architecture?

I was a bit vague, I love Art especially modern art and architecture; new and old.
I'll probably do the traditional bars and breweries as opposed to the trendy bars I can find here in Seattle.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 08:35 PM
This is not true. Berlin is full of old buildings. But don't think that old is always beautiful.

Especially 1950's drab gray Sovietera monolithic buildings.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 08:36 PM
This is not true. Berlin is full of old buildings. But don't think that old is always beautiful.

Especially 1950's drab gray Soviet era monolithic buildings.

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 08:37 PM
Well, I only wanted to stress that I am not "reinventing myself as a cultural vanguard". I never did.

:lol::lol: Yeah, maybe that one was a bit histrionic. :)

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 08:41 PM
I was a bit vague, I love Art especially modern art and architecture; new and old.
I'll probably do the traditional bars and breweries as opposed to the trendy bars I can find here in Seattle.

I see. Don't miss the Hauptbahnhof!

btw - if you check your "is Berlin a walking city" thread, I listed some streets that are great for walking and enjoying "streetlife".

Can you tell I enjoyed Berlin? :cheers:

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 09:32 PM
I see. Don't miss the Hauptbahnhof!

btw - if you check your "is Berlin a walking city" thread, I listed some streets that are great for walking and enjoying "streetlife".

Can you tell I enjoyed Berlin? :cheers:


Thanks Darryl! I jotted down those names.

In seven days I should be able to do Berlin justice.

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 09:40 PM
Thanks Darryl! I jotted down those names.

In seven days I should be able to do Berlin justice.

no problem, I'm jealous!

btw I looked at some of your threads in wunderbar. Nice digs in Seattle! I really like Seattle. I was there in August 07. Cool NY accent too. :lol: Those barking dogs really piss you off huh? :lol:

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 09:53 PM
no problem, I'm jealous!

btw I looked at some of your threads in wunderbar. Nice digs in Seattle! I really like Seattle. I was there in August 07. Cool NY accent too. :lol: Those barking dogs really piss you off huh? :lol:


Thanks man. Actually that was for drama. They do piss me off but it is very infrequent that they bark.

Where do you live?

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 10:03 PM
Where do you live?

In Baltimore, Maryland.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 10:17 PM
In Baltimore, Maryland.

Have you read this? Pretty flattering. Again the NYTimes.







http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/05/20/travel/20hours.html

Tannenschnaps
February 14th, 2008, 10:44 PM
Berlin sucks (sometimes). Proof:

m4-dwCwFaVE aQGpSxVnwyE

utRDePbTJBM k6xOPfLpHZQ

037-7bUEAnc rK52lYRUsCg

Jetzt wird man sogar schon in der U-Bahn gebissen:

jXUjcgLyC8I

lol

kxkaSwVYq_E

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 11:15 PM
Have you read this? Pretty flattering. Again the NYTimes.







http://travel.nytimes.com/2007/05/20/travel/20hours.html

Wow, nice article. Thanks!

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 11:38 PM
Berlin sucks (sometimes). Proof:



Why is this always necessary? Can you not bear to let something positive be said about Berlin without saying something to the contrary? What exactly is your point? Does it bother you to allow people to like Berlin? Do you not want tourists to visit?

Please name for me one city of Berlin's size that does NOT have these same things happening? Does Paris or London or Rome or New York not have the occasional drunk on the subway? Do they not have groups of young male immigrants getting into trouble? Is Berlin unique in this?

Tannenschnaps
February 14th, 2008, 11:44 PM
[x] This constant bashing is necessary

[x] I can't bear to let something positive be said about Berlin without saying something to the contrary

[x] I don't have a point

[x] It bothers me to allow people to like Berlin

[x] I don't want tourists to visit

[ ] You understand the German section of the forum

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 11:57 PM
I get a prompt saying videos not available????

Darryl
February 14th, 2008, 11:57 PM
Do I detect some xenophobia? You don't want "outsiders" infiltrating your precious German forums?

You would be welcome in my local forums.

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 11:58 PM
So Tannenschnaps you don't want me to visit then? :)

triboro
February 14th, 2008, 11:59 PM
Do I detect some xenophobia? You don't want "outsiders" infiltrating your precious German forums?

You would be welcome in my local forums.

I doubt most Berliners are as insular as Tannen, Darryl. Just a hunch.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 12:00 AM
I get a prompt saying videos not available????

They're boring anyway. A drunk on a train, turkish teenagers fighting on the street. Just take a 10 minute walk outside your apartment in Seattle and you can see some of the same things. Yawn.

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 12:01 AM
Do you know what "irony" means? Plong. :ohno:

C'mon...how dumb are you?

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 12:02 AM
Do I detect some xenophobia? You don't want "outsiders" infiltrating your precious German forums?

You would be welcome in my local forums.

I don't want idiots (who can't understand fun, irony, etc.) in the German forums.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 12:15 AM
I don't want idiots (who can't understand fun, irony, etc.) in the German forums.

You have a strange sense of humor.

Tysklandsplikt
February 15th, 2008, 12:15 AM
The grafitti clutter shit must be dealt with!
In Berlin and in Stockholm and all other cities in this world!
The wankers who ruin cities with such crap should be shot! :bash:

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 12:29 AM
You have a strange sense of humor.

You have no sense of humor at all. That's the problem here.

triboro
February 15th, 2008, 12:34 AM
You have no sense of humor at all. That's the problem here.
It's sardonic humor mixed with self disparaging sarcasm.

Gallows humore.

I can appreciate that, it is a German characteristic and is hard to detect

when in written form.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 12:45 AM
It's sardonic humor mixed with self disparaging sarcasm.

Gallows humore.

I can appreciate that, it is a German characteristic and is hard to detect

when in written form.

Oh it's detected allright. I just don't understand it. It must be a German thing. The Germans are constantly using their "ironic humor" in this forum. It comes across to the rest of the world who don't share their sense of "irony" as a very unattractive form of self-loathing. I believe it to be born from the German "culture of guilt" since the war.

I say get over it! It's not cute anymore. Don't you see the value in self love/promotion????????

Do you see other nationalities airing their dirty laundry to the world and passing it off as "ironic humor"?

Kampflamm
February 15th, 2008, 12:47 AM
The problem is that Berlin really does suck. The city is from an architectural point of view crap, it's full of dog shit, crime is high, the local trains are in a pitiful state...there are much nicer cities in Germany (Munich, Hamburg...).

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 12:52 AM
You must be a nazi who doesn't want tourists to visit Berlin! Shame on you, Kampflamm! :ohno:

Ludis_Multi
February 15th, 2008, 12:56 AM
OMG, there are nasty auslanders here? I want them excommunicated immediately!

Patrick
February 15th, 2008, 12:58 AM
there are much nicer cities in Germany (Munich, Hamburg...).yes, cities and places that we are really very proud of. just look into the rat-our-talls architectural section e.g.
the thing is that we just don't conceal the truth when regarding Berlin. Of course, there are also nice developments like the Friedrichswerder Townhouses. But there are also so many things going wrong, that those who see things only through rose-colored glasses and partying all day how great it all is, need to come down to earth, and we help them ;) (well, I'm more an observer though;))

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 01:15 AM
The problem is that Berlin really does suck. The city is from an architectural point of view crap, it's full of dog shit, crime is high, the local trains are in a pitiful state...there are much nicer cities in Germany (Munich, Hamburg...).

Your opinion.

I've been to Berlin five times for a week each time and loved it. Every other non-German I've met who has visited Berlin has loved it as well, in fact all of us consider it to be one the best cities in the world we've ever been to. Only Germans dislike it for some unknown reason.

I've also been to Hamburg and Munich, and although I think Hamburg is very elegant, I do not like Munich that much and both of them aren't nearly as exciting as Berlin.

And Germans have no idea what crime is. :lol: Come visit me in Baltimore and I'll show you crime. Not to mention that any city in the US would KILL to have one tenth of the "crap" architecture that Berlin has!!!!

Poor Berliners, how can they bear living in such a shit city? My heart goes out to them.

Kampflamm
February 15th, 2008, 01:17 AM
Not to mention that any city in the US would KILL to have one tenth of the "crap" architecture that Berlin has!!!!

We're not living in the US though. Aside from a couple of buildings here and there, Berlin simply doesn't interest me. But to each his own. Some people dislike Brussels even though I think it's a great city.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 01:21 AM
Some people dislike Brussels even though I think it's a great city.

I am one of them. I have never thought Brussels was anything special. It certainly doesn't hold a candle to Berlin.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 01:25 AM
@ Triboro

Check out this thread to see pics of some of the terrible architecture in Berlin.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=404235

Make sure to let us know how awful Berlin was when you return.

Patrick
February 15th, 2008, 01:32 AM
cool, we're so different then ;) (ok, I have never been in Berlin though, but I'm also not one of the superbashers, more an observer) as I've fallen in love with Bruxelles when I was there, and want to go there again as soon as possible. I really got a special feeling when entering La Grand' Place.

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 01:32 AM
http://www.cdusz.de/daten/kv/bierpinsel.jpghttp://www.umbruch-bildarchiv.de/bildarchiv/foto/1008u.jpghttp://www.english.wayne.edu/fac_pages/ewatten/images/post29/plattenbau.jpg

Kampflamm
February 15th, 2008, 01:34 AM
The Grand Place, the area around the Royal Palace, Petit Sablon...Berlin just doesn't have that.

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 01:46 AM
Well, the Grand Place is wonderful. It's really the only thing that "wowed" me in Brussels.

I share your love Kampflamm for beautiful old architecture like Prague, or Bruges, or the beautiful reconstruction of Dresden, but that is not the only qualifier of a great city to me. Just because a city was bombed and doesn't have large areas of beautiful pre war architecture doesn't make it an awful city. What about the gallery scene, or the nightlife, or dining options, or an incredible subway system, or world class museums, or cultural offerings? Don't those things count?

How entertained and happy can a pretty building keep you?

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 02:09 AM
Of course you're asking people in the wrong forum. These Germans on here are huge Berlin haters, so they could give a rat's ass whether it's positive or not. :ohno:

Now now... that's a lie.


@Ludis_Multi-

You still say it's a lie? Sounds like I predicted pretty accurately what would happen.

KoolKeatz
February 15th, 2008, 02:16 AM
How entertained and happy can a pretty building keep you?

He lives in a 30.000 people village. SSC is his entertainment.

triboro
February 15th, 2008, 02:33 AM
Daryll I love the fact that German architects aren't afraid of building bold buildings next to older landmarks. Especially in Berlin from photos I've seen.

Ludis_Multi
February 15th, 2008, 04:05 AM
@Ludis_Multi-

You still say it's a lie? Sounds like I predicted pretty accurately what would happen.

Less a lie, more of an exaggeration really. It's fun pulling Berlin through a pile of shit back and forth. The truth is, what most germans feel about Berlin isn't hate but disappointment. But describing the reasons would take a very long time.

George W. Bush
February 15th, 2008, 10:44 AM
Just because a city was bombed and doesn't have large areas of beautiful pre war architecture doesn't make it an awful city.Actually Berlin does have significant areas of largely intact pre-war architecture. As it happens they are predominantely located in the "poorer" districts (Kreuzberg, Neukölln, Tiergarten-Moabit, Wedding), there you'll find the largest accumulations of Gründerzeit constructions in all of Germany. But for some reason they do not have the exuberance of, say, Viennese buildings from about the same time, partly because of the way they have been "mantained" over the last 100 years (keyword is "Entstuckung", i.e. ornamental depletion of facades).

Ludi
February 15th, 2008, 03:43 PM
Berlin= Beste

Alles andere is nur Neid :lol:

Party, abgefahren, viel kulturelles und man hat nie langeweile....

Und Kriminalität ist verdammt niedrig im Vergleich zu anderen großen Städten dieser Welt...
Außerdem ist Frankfurt viel gefährlicher als Berlin, was genug Statistiken beweisen...

In in München werden auch Leute in der U-Bahn zusammen geschlagen...

Und neuste Mode ist von Prolls: " Schnauze, sonst München" zu geil, darüber gabs neulich auch nen zeitungsartikel :lol:

Tysklandsplikt
February 15th, 2008, 03:55 PM
The Grand Place, the area around the Royal Palace, Petit Sablon...Berlin just doesn't have that.

True but then again not many cities do.
Grand Place is indeed a grand place.
Although Berlin´s Gendarmenmarkt
is also quite stunningly mighty
and somewhat unique:

http://www.polhotels.com/Berlin/Charlottenburger/Sightseeing/Gendarmenmarkt.jpg

http://www.*************/assets/images/Gendarmenmarkt_Berlin.jpg

Kampflamm
February 15th, 2008, 07:05 PM
How entertained and happy can a pretty building keep you?

How much entertainment does a visit to a museum or an art gallery give you? If you're interested in those things, I'd say a "a lot." To me these sorts of beautiful grand buildings are like works of art and Berlin is simply lacking in that department. Don't get me wrong, there are cities in Germany that are much worse...Cologne is a pretty depressing city from an architectural point of view. Since I'm interested in pre-20th century architecture though, Berlin isn't really all that great either. As someone else has mentioned even the old buildings that were left standing after WW2 look rather drab and dull.

Tannenschnaps
February 15th, 2008, 07:09 PM
I'm interested in all kinds of architecture and especially modern architecture. Therefore: Berlin = Hurra.

Maybe most of the architecture in Berlin is just average, but (and that makes it special/beautiful) all kinds of this average architecture are concentrated in one big...mess. Perfect. :applause:

Darryl
February 15th, 2008, 08:32 PM
from an architectural point of view.

This is what I'm saying. An "architectural point of view" is only one small point of view of many to judge a city by.

There are many other points of view that come into play when assessing a city. I mean to have this attitude of "Berlin is crap" just because it fails your architectural criteria seems short-sighted. There are so many other criteria that Berlin passes with flying colors.

Not to mention that your architectural point of view is very limited to only a very specific type of architecture. Berlin is to many an architectural dream! I know architecture students in the USA that take almost religious pilgrimages to Berlin because it is known as an architectural showcase city.

I understand that you despise post modern architecture so you do not agree on this front, but I'm just saying.

Conrad
February 17th, 2008, 12:23 AM
Teh awesomest Berlin picture thread there is: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=499851

by mlm

schmidt
February 18th, 2008, 08:13 PM
Was ist mir komisch ist, daß ALLE Leute, daß ich getroffen habe, sagt Berlin WUNDERSCHÖN ist und einige von den schönsten Gebäuden in dieser Welt hat! Jemand muss wirklich falsch sein. In 2 Wochen gebe ich euch meine Meinung. :D

BTW, Gerdarmenmarkt, Reichstagsgebäude, Berliner Dom, sogar die Gedächtniskirche, ist das nicht schon genug für eine Stadt?

Ludi
February 18th, 2008, 09:22 PM
Was ist mir komisch ist, daß ALLE Leute, daß ich getroffen habe, sagt Berlin WUNDERSCHÖN ist und einige von den schönsten Gebäuden in dieser Welt hat! Jemand muss wirklich falsch sein. In 2 Wochen gebe ich euch meine Meinung. :D

BTW, Gerdarmenmarkt, Reichstagsgebäude, Berliner Dom, sogar die Gedächtniskirche, ist das nicht schon genug für eine Stadt?

Alle Touris sind von Berlin begeistert und finden Berlin schön und "atraktiv" auf seine Art und Weise...

Bis auf 10 Blinde die hier herum irren...

Tannenschnaps
February 18th, 2008, 09:24 PM
Welche 10 Blinde? Namen.

fotowahn.com
February 18th, 2008, 09:58 PM
[IMG]http://www.*************/assets/images/Gendarmenmarkt_Berlin.jpg

Auch hier. DIESES BILD IST NICHT DAS EIGENTUM DES USERS!!!

Ohne Quellenangabe auf meinen Server gelinkt....!!

PLEASE REMOVE THIS LINK, ONLY USE: http://www.*************/html/panorama.html


!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Mercedes S600
February 18th, 2008, 10:02 PM
Das interessiert hier kein Schwein, wem hier welches Bild gehört. Kauf Dir 'n Keks.


@Tannenschnaps:

Ich denke mal, er meint Ludis_Multi, Moi, Kampflamm, Juano (?), :dunno:

Tysklandsplikt
February 18th, 2008, 10:03 PM
I'm interested in all kinds of architecture and especially modern architecture. Therefore: Berlin = Hurra.

I couldn´t have said it better myself actually! :righton:

Tysklandsplikt
February 18th, 2008, 10:08 PM
This place and picture belongs to the people of
Berlin Germany Europe and is for the rest of
the world to marvel at... :cheers1:

http://www.*************/assets/images/Gendarmenmarkt_Berlin.jpg

fotowahn.com
February 18th, 2008, 10:13 PM
Das interessiert hier kein Schwein, wem hier welches Bild gehört. Kauf Dir 'n Keks.




Klugscheisser.

Schon mal was von Urheberrecht gehört..

schmeiss DIR mal ne Pille ein.

Tannenschnaps
February 18th, 2008, 10:13 PM
Das interessiert hier kein Schwein, wem hier welches Bild gehört. Kauf Dir 'n Keks.


@Tannenschnaps:

Ich denke mal, er meint Ludis_Multi, Moi, Kampflamm, Juano (?), :dunno:

Das halte ich für ein Gerücht. :crazy:

erbse
February 18th, 2008, 10:14 PM
Bin morgen in Berlin. Für Fotos allerdings keine Zeit. Ein Hauptstadtdöner sollte aber drin sein.

Tannenschnaps
February 18th, 2008, 10:14 PM
Klugscheisser.

Schon mal was von Urheberrecht gehört..

schmeiss DIR mal ne Pille ein.

Arschlochalarm. Versteckt Luden und Kinder. Wie man in den Wald hineinruft...

Tannenschnaps
February 18th, 2008, 10:15 PM
Bin morgen in Berlin. Für Fotos allerdings keine Zeit. Ein Hauptstadtdöner sollte aber drin sein.

Was machst du dort (außer Döner essen :crazy:)?

Mercedes S600
February 18th, 2008, 10:19 PM
schmeiss DIR mal ne Pille ein.


Das sagt einer, mit zigtausend !!!!!! im Posting.:bash:

erbse
February 18th, 2008, 10:21 PM
Pöhses Wort.

Schon mal was von Urheberrecht gehört..

Guck mal in welchem Forum du dich bewegst, Kollege. Internationale Foren (zumal mit US-Server) sind nahezu rechtsfreie Zone.

schmeiss DIR mal ne Pille ein.

Keks > Pille

erbse
February 18th, 2008, 10:25 PM
Was machst du dort (außer Döner essen :crazy:)?

Frischfleisch vom Immobilienmarkt aufspüren. Vielleicht wird's ein Dönerimbiss, gehen ja bekanntlich gut :D

Tannenschnaps
February 18th, 2008, 10:27 PM
Äh...beruflich oder wie? Boomt es also doch in Berlin? Ich wusste es, ich habs die ganze Zeit gewusst... :crazy:

erbse
February 18th, 2008, 10:32 PM
Richtig. Ein Kollege hat mir was geflüstert, das ich mir nicht entgehen lassen wollte.
Vor Ort dann Visite, vielleicht lohnt es sich. Zumindest hoffe ich das.

Berlin boomt im Verborgenen. Man muss nur wissen, wo man suchen muss :)

Ludis_Multi
February 18th, 2008, 10:57 PM
Berlin boomt im Verborgenen. Man muss nur wissen, wo man suchen muss :)

Im Drogenmilieu

erbse
February 18th, 2008, 11:22 PM
Pankow http://i29.tinypic.com/1zmfj2b.gif

Ludis_Multi
February 18th, 2008, 11:42 PM
Auch ausserhalb des Kinderheims?

Baddiman Cao
February 19th, 2008, 01:38 PM
Pankow?? Inklusive Prenzlauer Berg und Weißensee?? Oder sprechen wir hier nur vom SED-Ring (Majakowskiring)???