Hello! :)

Does anybody here writes English (or German)?

I got some questions about Belarus.

Feel free to ask your questions in English or German hier.

Just remember - politics and provocation is not welcome :):cheers:

You're free to judge whether my question is provocative or not. It certainly is not meant to be. :)

It's a simple question:
Is it true that Belarusian language is dying out?
I've read this in different sources.

And a related one:
I've learned to distinguish Polish and Russian just by hearing. Do you think it's possible for a foreigner to distinguish Belarusian and Russian just by hearing?
I've listened to some audio examples, but I still cannot distinguish them. Any tips?

I'm just interested in languages.

Thanks!

Well, it is partly true. I think it is possible to distinguish for slavic language speaker. Don't think you will be able to do it because languages are very close.

It's a simple question:
Is it true that Belarusian language is dying out?
I've read this in different sources.


That is not true. I would say that the situation with the language is preserved at certain level and with the pass of time even improves slightly. If we compare the 70's when Belarus was part of the Soviet Union, and the language was really vanishing, with what we have now- it is a huge progress. At the same time if compared with the first half of the 90's it is a step back. Anyway the situation is far from 'dying out'. Belarusian is taught at all schools and at least officially has the same number of lessons per week as Russian. 25% of the schools (if I am not mistaken) are fully in Belarusian language (those where the entire education is in Belarusian not just lessons of Belarusian language and literature as in common secondary schools). Unfortunately those truly Belarusian schools are mostly concentrated in villages not in cities. Urban population speaks Russian. That is true and that is pathetic.


And a related one:
I've learned to distinguish Polish and Russian just by hearing. Do you think it's possible for a foreigner to distinguish Belarusian and Russian just by hearing?
I've listened to some audio examples, but I still cannot distinguish them. Any tips?

I'm just interested in languages.

Thanks!

At this point I would disagree with AlexRiga. The differences are big enough to distinguish between two languages just by hearing them. At least the Russians themselves don't either understand or can correctly reproduce spoken and written Belarusian. It goes not only about lexicon and grammar - the pronunciation of academic Belarusian shows a number of differences if compared with Russian. According to my observations the foreigners can perceive these differences.

For good samples of Belarusian I would recommend you to visit the following pages: www.belsat.eu - that is the Belarusian TV. On the homepage they have a flash video of their daily news block. Another good option is radio stations. Try visiting www.svaboda.org or directly http://realaudio.rferl.org/BR/news/news_BR.mp3 for their latest news block.

I hope you will share your findings with us. The topic is very interesting.

The TV clip sounds almost exactly like Russian while those videos of "underground learners of Belarusian" on YouTube sound much softer but I could understand them both. Radio news presenter sound a lot different from video clips and if I heard them without knowing which language it was I would have thought it is Slovakian and it's a bit hard to comprehend it. But then when it turns to female presenter it sounds more Russian again and is more understandable. I have just found what it could be, those that I understand better are probably speaking in Trasianka (Meshanka) and those whom I understand less are probably using pure Belarusian.

Thanks a lot!

It's still very hard to distinguish them, but I guess Belarussian sounds softer and breathier.

That is probably the main difference apart from grammar and vocabulary. Belarusian pronunciation is softer.

I have one little stupid question... Is it true that modern plastic windows are still very rare in Belarus ?

I have one little stupid question... Is it true that modern plastic windows are still very rare in Belarus ?

Why are you asking? :) Well, not very rare but in older buildings wooden frames are de facto widespread. Actually that is the common issue in the post-soviet countries :)

In some article few years ago they mentioned that in village where Lukashenko was born there are many plastic windows wich is rare in Belarus... Sometimes you remember weird things :)

Plastic windows are actually cheaper and uglier than wooden

I will also use this thread to address questions to those living in Belarus :)

Is it true that the last Belarusian school in Minsk was closed something like 5 years ago?
Is the amount of Belarusian taught in schools and universities increasing or decreasing?

Belarusian language is only an optional course at Belgrade University (while Russian and Ukrainian are provided for full studies). Anyway here is an interesting article on history of Serbs in Belarus (it's in Serbian though) http://www.rastko.org.yu/antropologija/ljcerovic_srbi_bru.html

I will also use this thread to address questions to those living in Belarus :)

Is it true that the last Belarusian school in Minsk was closed something like 5 years ago?
Is the amount of Belarusian taught in schools and universities increasing or decreasing?

Difficult question. At least here http://news.tut.by/society/114301.html it is written that on 01.09.08 a new Belarusian gymnasium is supposed to be opened in Minsk. It implies that the new one is not the only one and there are more of them in Minsk.

Russian and Belarusian are taught at the same level as far as secondary school is concerned. However the standard language of higher education (at the level of college or university) is Russian.

Are there any fully-Belarusian TV stations being broadcasted nationwide?

Are there any fully-Belarusian TV stations being broadcasted nationwide?

There is a satellite channel broadcasting from Poland. It is entirely in Belarusian and is financed through the polish government and partly EU.

www.belsat.eu


As for national TV channels those are mostly in Russian. Probably "LAD" is an exception but who watches it (that's a rhetorical question)? It is like cultural and educational. No politics, no economics.

http://www.lad.tvr.by/bel/

The main broadcaster (referred as "BT"- Belarusian Television) is in Russian. It has the homepages in Russian, Belarusian and English. If someone interested, the later can be found under:

http://www.tvr.by/eng/default.asp (official news etc.)

As I know, there are some schools in Minsk where all subjects are studied in Belarusian. In another schools Belarussian is using only for profile subjects, such as "Belarussian language and literature", "The history of Belarus", etc.

In the universites most subjects are studied in Russian, but "Belarussian language", "The history of Belarus" and "The History of Great Patriotic War" are studied in Belarusian. In fact, since as Belarusian as Russian are both official languages of the Republic of Belarus, the lecturer can teach his subject in any of them. Most lecturers prefer Russian, but, for example, in our university (I am a student of Belarussian State Universtity, the faculty of Mechanic and Mathematic) one lecturer (which speak Belarussian in common life) doesn't afraid to teach such difficult subject as "Mathematical analysis" exclusively in Belarussian! And students visit his lections with more pleasure, than lections of another ones!

2Burislav: there are no official fully Belarussian TV-channels, but the national radio station ("Belarussian radio. First national channel") is broadcasting almost fully in Belarussian! I'd like to emphasize that this radio station is acessible to most citizens of our country, because in Soviet time every house and flat (as in village as in city) should have been definitely connected to the official radio network.

Sorry, if I have some gramar mistakes in my message, my English is still not perfect...

in our university (I am a student of Belarussian State Universtity, the faculty of Mechanic and Mathematic) one lecturer (which speak Belarussian in common life) doesn't afraid to teach such difficult subject as "Mathematical analysis" exclusively in Belarussian! And students visit his lections with more pleasure, than lections of another ones!

2Burislav: there are no official fully Belarussian TV-channels, but the national radio station ("Belarussian radio. First national channel") is broadcasting almost fully in Belarussian! I'd like to emphasize that this radio station is acessible to most citizens of our country, because in Soviet time every house and flat (as in village as in city) should have been definitely connected to the official radio network.

Sorry, if I have some gramar mistakes in my message, my English is still not perfect...
Your English is great, Dr. Stein!

Why do students like the lectures in Belarusian better?
Is it because they feel more comfortable with Belarusian?

So basically in Belarus there is a high degree of bilingualism, with Russian being predominant in the cities and Belarusian in rural areas, and there's various degrees of mixing between the two languages. Am I right?

Why do students like the lectures in Belarusian better?
Is it because they feel more comfortable with Belarusian?
I think so. As for me, I'm just enjoy listening Belarussian words wherever they said. And at that lections I'm feeling something like proud of my native language, which can be succesfully used in such difficult science field. :)

So basically in Belarus there is a high degree of bilingualism, with Russian being predominant in the cities and Belarusian in rural areas, and there's various degrees of mixing between the two languages. Am I right?
I think, you are. In my opinion there is about 95% russian-speaking citizens in Minsk. 5% belarussian-speaking is formed by some students, culture figures and oposition leaders. As you can see, it is rather difficult to hear belarussian speech at the streets of our capital. It is very sad. :ohno:
In rural areas, in my observation, people usually haven't good education and they often use horrible mix of Russian and Belarussian. Urban people mockingly call this pseudo-language "trasyanka" ("trasca" == swamp, quagmire). It is not literary Russian, not literary Belarussian, in general it is gramaticaly and phoneticaly incorrect.

In my opinion there is about 95% russian-speaking citizens in Minsk. 5% belarussian-speaking is formed by some students, culture figures and oposition leaders. As you can see, it is rather difficult to hear belarussian speech at the streets of our capital. It is very sad. :ohno:
In rural areas, in my observation, people usually haven't good education and they often use horrible mix of Russian and Belarussian. Urban people mockingly call this pseudo-language "trasyanka" ("trasca" == swamp, quagmire). It is not literary Russian, not literary Belarussian, in general it is gramaticaly and phoneticaly incorrect.

Thank you Dr. Stein. I think the linguistic situation of Belarus is quite unique in Europe.

Not at all. I'll answer any question about Belarus with great pleasure! :)

Here's a very interesting post by Burislav:I'm not sure about asian republics. But I know that Georgia, Armenia, Azerbaijan, Moldova, Estonia, Latvia and Lithuania had mostly retained their languages, at least in their homes. Largely because 1. it is easier to russify ukrainians and belarusians because russian is also to an extent a slavic language 2. it was a state priority to russify Ukraine and Belarus by mass migration and a genocide of the 30's. Russification through migration failed in Moldova and the Baltics, there russians ostracized themselves from the rest of the population, while in Ukraine and Belarus they intermarried (my mothers sister in Minsk married a russian migrant from Siberia, the same with some of my relatives in Ukraine, for instance).

Russification of Belarus was 90% complete by 1990, wherein in Ukraine it was approximately 70% complete. Since Lukashenko's rise to power in Belarus, russification was continued and accelerated, the last Belarusian-language lyceum in Minsk was closed and transformed into a high security prison few years ago. They only learn Belarusian like a distant foreign language now, the Belarusian language class meets 2 times a week so it creates an illusion of protecting the language. Today russification of Belarus is complete, only very few intelligentsia youth use Belarusian (almost entirely from opposition), but even they only use it in formal situations, almost never when they socialize.

When my mother was growing up in Minsk in 1970's the language was ostracized from city dwellers and was only used periodically in a mix with Russian in the rural areas surrounding the city. The mix of Belarusian and Russian is referred as Trasyanka.

People still know the language, but it is socially unacceptable to use it in Belarus, while russification of Ukraine was mostly stopped by early 2000's (today, about 80% of all schools are ukrainian in Ukraine). But the fact remains is that millions of people of my generation and even one or two following generations in many cases will and do speak a foreign language as their first.

Thank you. I might have been wrong about the last belarusian school being transformed to prison in Minsk, I heard this from a Belarusian acquaintance of mine. Everything else is my opinion based on research and observations, if any of it in regards of Belarus is wrong, Belarusians should feel free to correct it. My cousins in Minsk only learned Belarusian as second-language (like we learn English or German in Ukraine).

The way I see it now is that during the last years situation with Belarusian stopped deteriorating as opposed to mid and late 90's.

Thank you. I might have been wrong about the last belarusian school being transformed to prison in Minsk, I heard this from a Belarusian acquaintance of mine.

Not in a prison. In Court.

In my opinion there is about 95% russian-speaking citizens in Minsk. 5% belarussian-speaking is formed by some students, culture figures and oposition leaders. As you can see, it is rather difficult to hear belarussian speech at the streets of our capital.
In spite of that, does everybody understand Belarusian?
Would you say that 95% of the population understand Belarusian even though 95% of them speak Russian?

belarussian and russian languages so close, that russian-speaking who never heard belarussian could understand belarussian language.

belarussian and russian languages so close, that russian-speaking who never heard belarussian could understand belarussian language.
Perhaps rather Trasianka?
Are Russians in general able to understand the Belarusian with no strong Russian influence?

In spite of that, does everybody understand Belarusian?
Would you say that 95% of the population understand Belarusian even though 95% of them speak Russian?

Yes, absolutely. And croomm is incorrect, Russians usually don't understand much of Belarusian, they think that when they hear trasyanka that it's Belarusian. Trasyanka, in my encounters, is 90% Russian.

>>Are Russians in general able to understand the Belarusian with no strong Russian influence?

Of course yes. Russians able to understand classical (but classical is not correct, because this languages was formed in 19 century by political motives) belarussian and ukrainian. So called
"classical" ukrainian and belarussian is a very close to russian. Some Belarussian trasyanka and ukrainian surzhik are the mix of russian dialetcs. So it understandable in 100% both for russian, ukrainians and belarussians people. If some ukrainians can not understand belarussian, it can be explained by low level of education in modern Ukraine.

croomm, every single statement you made is incorrect, try not to confuse foreigner here who want to learn something.

>>Are Russians in general able to understand the Belarusian with no strong Russian influence?

Of course yes. Russians able to understand classical (but classical is not correct, because this languages was formed in 19 century by political motives) belarussian and ukrainian. So called
"classical" ukrainian and belarussian is a very close to russian. Some Belarussian trasyanka and ukrainian surzhik are the mix of russian dialetcs. So it understandable in 100% both for russian, ukrainians and belarussians people. If some ukrainians can not understand belarussian, it can be explained by low level of education in modern Ukraine.

:lol: Before that barbarian so called "russian" language was created everyone spoke Ukrainian so youre propaganda is absolutely incorrect!

Burislav, every single statement you made is russophobian.

I am really don`t care what foreigners thinks about Russia)) But you are first specialist in all themes which touch Russia and Russians) I really think that you have a great problem with physical. Try to relax and go to vocations. Good luck my malorussian bro)

PS xolang, ask it another russian and you will get the same answer. And don`t touch ukrainians... Remember, that Chernobyl situated in 100 km from Kiev)

PS xolang, ask it another russian.
I'll do that.

On a side note, perhaps you're just one of those people talented in languages?

In spite of that, does everybody understand Belarusian?
Would you say that 95% of the population understand Belarusian even though 95% of them speak Russian?
Some days ago a strange incident happened in one market of Minsk. One woman asked the salesman about his goods. The question was asked in Russian. The salesman answered her in Belarussian (classical Belarussian). Was she so stupid or she just decided to show him what language must be used in our country - who knows - so she complained to the market manager on this salesman that he spoke with her on some "unknown language". :ohno: So the salesman was fined by market direction because of his "disrespectfull" attitude to the clients.
This incident was described on www.charter97.org (http://www.charter97.org)

I think that most of Belarussian citizens (even russian-speakers) could understand Belarussian. Even classical Belarussian. But not everebody would be pleased if you will speak with him in it. Some people (in general "komunists on pension" or pro-facistic organization's members) consider that Belarus is only a part of great Russia, not more. That we've no our own history, culture, literature. And they consider Belarussian language is one of great number dialects of Russian language. Fortunatelly, there are very few people who think so.

Are Russians in general able to understand the Belarusian with no strong Russian influence?
I think, they are, but not completely. Some words or phrases they may be won't understand, but in general, the main sense of sentence will be clear.

I hate to interrupt this discussion, but I just happened on to this site and thought someone here might be able to help me. I am an American City Planning student and I've been staying in Minsk for the summer. I am trying to find a few people to visit with about how City and Regional Planning works here in Belarus. I realize that isn't the main point of this site, but hopefully it's related enough that someone might be able to recommend a good contact (either another poster here, or someone in Belarus). Any tips or info at all would be great.

I can't add a lot to the language discussion, though it is a somewhat popular topic here too. I can verify that there are elementary schools that teach in Belarusian (I met a family whose children go there right now), but I'm not sure of the details, and it seemed to be a rarity. Also, many of the announcements on the busses and metro are also in Belarusian, but not all, which is confusing for someone just learning Russian.

Thanks for any help,
Ed

Some days ago a strange incident happened in one market of Minsk. One woman asked the salesman about his goods. The question was asked in Russian. The salesman answered her in Belarussian (classical Belarussian). Was she so stupid or she just decided to show him what language must be used in our country - who knows - so she complained to the market manager on this salesman that he spoke with her on some "unknown language". :ohno: So the salesman was fined by market direction because of his "disrespectfull" attitude to the clients.
This incident was described on www.charter97.org (http://www.charter97.org)

I think that most of Belarussian citizens (even russian-speakers) could understand Belarussian. Even classical Belarussian. But not everebody would be pleased if you will speak with him in it. Some people (in general "komunists on pension" or pro-facistic organization's members) consider that Belarus is only a part of great Russia, not more. That we've no our own history, culture, literature. And they consider Belarussian language is one of great number dialects of Russian language. Fortunatelly, there are very few people who think so.

That's a very sad story, my heart feels great pain for the difficulties that Belarusians have to endure in Belarus!

I have some other questions mainly concenring some economic indicators presented by 'great' amercian agency CIA (maybe they are wrong ;))


Exports - partners:

Russia 36.5%, Netherlands 17.8%, UK 6.3%, Ukraine 6.1%, Poland 5%, Latvia 4.1% (2006)

I am really curious what Belarus can export to the Netherlands? It's stated that it amounts to 17.8% so for Your ecomony it's a lot but I cannot imagine anything which can hide beside this number: maybe food? (but rather the Netherlands are exporter), reexport of oil? (but why from Belarus not directly form Russia), weapons?, alcohol ( :) ok I am joking)

what else can Belarus export to the Netherlands and why not at the same time to the other larger western european countries?


another more scary thing, some data comparison from Polish and Belarussian economy


Poland
budget
revenues: $85.25 billion
expenditures: $91.37 billion (2007 est.)

GDP (official exchange rate):$420.3 billion (2007 est.)

polish government expenditures in overall GDP: 21%

Belarus
budget
revenues: $20.76 billion
expenditures: $21.18 billion (2007 est.)

GDP (official exchange rate): $44.77 billion (2007 est.)

belarus government expendiutres in overall GDP: 48%



with almost 10x times smaller overall GDP, Belaruss has just around 4x smaller government spending. Polish government expenditures amounts to 21% of our GDP while in Belarus it's around 50%... :/ that's pretty much scary becasue if Your government will stop spend more money than Your economic growth will vanish.

The pics from Belarus I have seen on this forum are amazing but aren't You afraid that it will collapse?

I am really curious what Belarus can export to the Netherlands? It's stated that it amounts to 17.8% so for Your ecomony it's a lot but I cannot imagine anything which can hide beside this number: maybe food? (but rather the Netherlands are exporter), reexport of oil? (but why from Belarus not directly form Russia), weapons?, alcohol ( :) ok I am joking)
This can be oil (reselling) or petrol. Or potash fertilizer. But I doubt that this data is correct, Netherlands :?


with almost 10x times smaller overall GDP, Belaruss has just around 4x smaller government spending. Polish government expenditures amounts to 21% of our GDP while in Belarus it's around 50%... :/ that's pretty much scary becasue if Your government will stop spend more money than Your economic growth will vanish.

The pics from Belarus I have seen on this forum are amazing but aren't You afraid that it will collapse?
This is what is called belorussian economic wonder. In other words - market socialism :lol: That's why we've got such small unemployment and that's why we still produce so much of noncompetitive trash. Almost every big company in Belarus is goverment-owned, so the goverment is responsible for the most of GDP. No wonder that the goverment spending is so big.

Don't listen to those morons Burislav and Bandera, they are fascists. I'm belrussian and I spent some years in Belrussia. Well, it is surprisingly clean and safe country even compared to mine. Unfortunately belrussian language is endangered. It is much less used in cities. Anyway, my relatives speak real belrussian, not trasyanka and knowing russian you could understand 70% of it, not 90% of course. Anyway, in belrussia there are few sick radical guys like bandera here who try only to insult others. People are quiet nice but they have too few self respect I guess.

^^ Сам фашист хрен смердючий!

Don't listen to those morons Burislav and Bandera, they are fascists. I'm belrussian and I spent some years in Belrussia. Well, it is surprisingly clean and safe country even compared to mine. Unfortunately belrussian language is endangered. It is much less used in cities. Anyway, my relatives speak real belrussian, not trasyanka and knowing russian you could understand 70% of it, not 90% of course. Anyway, in belrussia there are few sick radical guys like bandera here who try only to insult others. People are quiet nice but they have too few self respect I guess.

Вы даже название страны не знаете как правильно писать, зато ярлыки на остальных вешаете успешно.

Вы даже название страны не знаете как правильно писать, зато ярлыки на остальных вешаете успешно.

Вот и я об этом подумал. Впрочем на таких товарищей внимание лучше не обращать.

???
Ngga ngertiii!!

This thread's title: "Questions in English".

:cheers:

Congratulations for Bate Borisov!!!
I hope you will make a nice surprise in the Champions League groups!

Steaua Bucharest salutes you! :cheers:

GROUP H
Juventus Turin
Zenit St.Peterburg
Real Madrid
BATE Borisov

I fear it will be quite hard for BATE...

..

Actually, I think that the Russians can understand Belorussian language .. I am Russian-Ukrainian or Ukrainian-Russian (50/50) and I understand almost everything in Belorussian. May be, if I were not able to speak both languages I would understand less. However, it is still understandable.

When I was telling that the Russians don't understand it, I was thinking above all about spoken language. With the reading it's different and certainly easier (at least for me it is so). Additionally, you know Ukrainian, which helps a lot.

another questions

traveling:

Few times I have seen in Warsaw cars with belarusian number plates and thus I wanted to ask whether it isdifficult to travel/study/work abroad for belarusian people?

Would You (in your own opinion) prefer to have easier access to Europe or to Russia, Kazakhstan etc. ?

ties with Russia:

I am always courious how do You perceive Your biggest neighbour Russia, is it really similar to Belarus or (except the language) those are two diffrent societies, nations?

Do belarusian people/ your government really want to make a union with Russia? Would You be happy with that?

another questions

traveling:

Few times I have seen in Warsaw cars with belarusian number plates and thus I wanted to ask whether it isdifficult to travel/study/work abroad for belarusian people?

Sorry man, seems to my you mix Belarus and N. Korea. Not so bad in Belarus like you're imaging (what your sources of information about Belarus? WSJ and NYT?) I visited USA (work), UK (study), Iran (study), Poland (travel) and other countries. No problem.

Would You (in your own opinion) prefer to have easier access to Europe or to Russia, Kazakhstan etc. ?

We have no the board with CIS countries, but we need a vise for other. I prefer to have similar access to any countries aroun the world.

ties with Russia:

I am always courious how do You perceive Your biggest neighbour Russia, is it really similar to Belarus or (except the language) those are two diffrent societies, nations?

Two different nations, one society.

Do belarusian people/ your government really want to make a union with Russia? Would You be happy with that?
We have a kind of union with Russia now. For me it's enough. Other level of union between such big counry like Russia and small Belarus is impossible.

^^ all this only my private opinion.

Belarusian language doomed? (http://belarus.blogsome.com/2008/09/05/the-belarusian-language-is-doomed.)

Belarusian language doomed? (http://belarus.blogsome.com/2008/09/05/the-belarusian-language-is-doomed.)

According to the article, Belarusian is doomed as well as any other language of the small ethnic group including Baltic languages, certain Slavic languages (Bulgarian, Slovenian, Czech etc.). If you believe in Friedman's theory of the 'flat world' (quoted in the article above) you can even predict that Russian, English, Chinese and Hindi will melt together to form a meta-language of the globalized world of tomorrow.

I am personally sceptical about such a vision. The languages will definitely merge but not that fast.

> Not so bad in Belarus like you're imaging (what your sources of information about Belarus? WSJ and NYT?)

I know some students on my University who study there but worry to go back.

Anyway I heard from many people that there is really complicated procedure to cross the boarder by car. You have to collect some stamps etc. but the same implies to Ukraine.

> Not so bad in Belarus like you're imaging (what your sources of information about Belarus? WSJ and NYT?)

I know some students on my University who study there but worry to go back.

Anyway I heard from many people that there is really complicated procedure to cross the boarder by car. You have to collect some stamps etc. but the same implies to Ukraine.

Denepd on were is your University (US, Poland, UK). I know a lot student who study abroad by political reasons. But i don't know any student who had a problem when backed home. Of course if you hate the government, It's impossible to make career in an official structures and usual People who study abroad, prefer to work abroad (only by economic reason).

About special stamps for travalling and so on. It's normal system: In Belarus we had to get special stamp to across the Board (It means you don't have any "bad bank debt", you don't under arest e.t.c.). In Russia, Canada and US you should get a foreing passport for travelling.
From this year we don't need special a passport stamp in Belarus, on the Board authorities just check your name in a list of people who can't laeve territory of Belarus.

Belarusian language doomed? (http://belarus.blogsome.com/2008/09/05/the-belarusian-language-is-doomed.)

One more "theoretical artical". Fore example, there are a lot small (micro) nations with population less than 50000 in the Caucasus, but they survive (and speak in own languages now) during a soviet time, when evrybody studied and speak russian language, in time of total assimilation. Those power was more stronger than current globalization....

Does Belarus pay High Salaries? Does it reward its employees well?

Are there modern offices like in the EU?

I havent been to your country but I understand your people are kind and welcoming and pleasant people
Thanks

Do Belarusan Citizens need Visa to enter the EU? Can Belarusen Passports travel around the world without many visas?

Does Belarus pay High Salaries? Does it reward its employees well?
Are there modern offices like in the EU?
Salaries differ. But not as much as in, say, Moscow.:)
In McDonalds, for instance, they offer USD250

Do Belarusan Citizens need Visa to enter the EU? Yes.

Salaries differ. But not as much as in, say, Moscow.:)
In McDonalds, for instance, they offer USD250

Yes.

Ok thanks. Would Belarus pay like Western Salaries? $250 USD for McDonalds is ok money.

I am an Australian do we need a visa to visit Belarus?

Is Belarus poor or a rich country?

Why do Belarusians need a Visa for the EU? Im sure Belarus is not that much of a problem

Thank you

Ok thanks. Would Belarus pay like Western Salaries? $250 USD for McDonalds is ok money.


Salary in Belarus isn't high, but cost of life is also chaep. Avarege salary is about 450$ per month, apartment's fee is about 50 $/month, apartment for rent - 300 $/month.
Premium gasoline - 1,5 $/liter, subway ticket - 30 cent.
1 kg beef - 6$

You may create a special topic in common trend, where people can compare price level in different countries:lol:


I am an Australian do we need a visa to visit Belarus?
Yep, You need Belarus visa.

Is Belarus poor or a rich country?

see above

Why do Belarusians need a Visa for the EU? Im sure Belarus is not that much of a problem
Visa is a tool which allow to control migration for UE's countries.

Salary in Belarus isn't high, but cost of life is also chaep. Avarege salary is about 450$ per month, apartment's fee is about 50 $/month, apartment for rent - 300 $/month.
Premium gasoline - 1,5 $/liter, subway ticket - 30 cent.
1 kg beef - 6$

You may create a special topic in common trend, where people can compare price level in different countries:lol:



Yep, You need Belarus visa.



see above


Visa is a tool which allow to control migration for UE's countries.

Ok how long does the Belarusan Visa last for?

I understand that there are certain rules for foreigners can you tell me what they are?

From what I have been reading Belarus has a very bad leader "Europe's last dictator" is that true from your point of view?

As Belarusans do you feel your lives are hard?

From what I have been reading Belarus has a very bad leader "Europe's last dictator" is that true from your point of view?

I think that is Gordon Brown you are talking about. He never even went to elections and no one supports him.

I think that is Gordon Brown you are talking about. He never even went to elections and no one supports him.

Sorry im confused I was referring to the Belarusan leader.

Is living in Belarus hard?

I understand that Belarus is stuck in a time warp can you clarify what things in Belarus are stuck in that time warp?

How long does the Belarusan visa last for?

Is the length of the Visa any longer for EU Citizens?

Why don't you go pester someone else?

Ok thanks. Would Belarus pay like Western Salaries? $250 USD for McDonalds is ok money.

I am an Australian do we need a visa to visit Belarus?

Is Belarus poor or a rich country?

Why do Belarusians need a Visa for the EU? Im sure Belarus is not that much of a problem

Thank you

GIYBF!!!

Translation: Google is your best friend. ;)

So what happened to that pro-EU/Democratic guy who was running for president vs Lukashenko back then? Is he still around in some party?..planing to run again maybe?..but thats a long time to wait:(

So what happened to that pro-EU/Democratic guy who was running for president vs Lukashenko back then? Is he still around in some party?..planing to run again maybe?..but thats a long time to wait:(

Are you in a harry? Don't skip your life:cheers:

Salary in Belarus isn't high, but cost of life is also chaep. Avarege salary is about 450$ per month, apartment's fee is about 50 $/month, apartment for rent - 300 $/month.
Premium gasoline - 1,5 $/liter, subway ticket - 30 cent.
1 kg beef - 6$

You may create a special topic in common trend, where people can compare price level in different countries:lol:



Yep, You need Belarus visa.



see above


Visa is a tool which allow to control migration for UE's countries.

It seems to me that the living standards in Belarus are quite low. The rent is 2/3 of the average salary (!!!) - that's a lot of money. Prices for transport, food etc. don't seem too cheap either. So, the $300 it's a rent for what type of apartment (size, number of rooms, city)?

It seems to me that the living standards in Belarus are quite low. The rent is 2/3 of the average salary (!!!) - that's a lot of money. Prices for transport, food etc. don't seem too cheap either. So, the $300 it's a rent for what type of apartment (size, number of rooms, city)?

This pricing for capital - Minsk. there is a typical situation for all countries.
In ex-USSR real estate sector is overvalued due to lack of investment, mortgage and etc ralative to avarege salary

It seems to me that the living standards in Belarus are quite low. The rent is 2/3 of the average salary (!!!) - that's a lot of money. Prices for transport, food etc. don't seem too cheap either. So, the $300 it's a rent for what type of apartment (size, number of rooms, city)?

Apartment in Minsk, one room or probably two but somewhere in the outskirts of the city. May the colleagues correct me if I am wrong. However you have to take into account the fact that the practice of renting an apartment is not that wide-spread in Belarus as let's say in the Western Europe. Most of the people live in the apartments which they own, so that they have to pay only communal costs (gas, electricity etc). Moreover a number of people live in the accommodations that are provided by the enterprise they work for or university (if it goes about students) at a very reasonable low cost (but unfortunately often the quality of these apartments is poor).

I will be please if someone can extend my answer. :)

Yes, I understand perfectly. A similar phenomenon occurs in Romania, too. Most (>90%) of the people own their apartments, so the rental market is small and informal, so the prices are extremeley high. In Romania too the salary/rent ratio is outrageous - close to 1:1 in Bucharest (for a small 2 rooms apartement). However the difference as I see it is that the state isn't involved anymore in economy in Romania, while in Belarus it's still pretty much present. So basically Belarus is more of a wellfare state than most of the former communist countries now in the EU.

I have two more question.

1. How do you perceive the EU and US critics towards Belarus? Do you see them as fair or highly biased?
2. Does Belarus has a high (temporary or not) work immigration? If yes, where do belorussians go to work mostly? Russia, Western Europe?

I have two more question.

1. How do you perceive the EU and US critics towards Belarus? Do you see them as fair or highly biased?
2. Does Belarus has a high (temporary or not) work immigration? If yes, where do belorussians go to work mostly? Russia, Western Europe?

1. As for me, Their critics is an objective, but I hate when other countries "put thier noses" in our internal business. Due to their "help" the situation becames more worst.

2. About 500 th work abroad (most of them in Russia) or 10% of work power.
This is a typical sitation for eastern regions, unclassified workers (builders). We don't have a border with Russia and we don't need to have any paper to get work in Russia.
Salary in many russian regions at laest in two times more than in Belarus

Hello. I want to know how do you belarussians see your country after 10 years, 20 years? What the majority of people in your country think about Russia and EU? And last question, i know that i can find it in internet but still, what was the amount of foreign investments for 2007? Thank you :)

Hello. I want to know how do you belarussians see your country after 10 years, 20 years? What the majority of people in your country think about Russia and EU? And last question, i know that i can find it in internet but still, what was the amount of foreign investments for 2007? Thank you :)

1. The independent state without Lukoshenka (looks unbelievable) between UE and China...
2. not more than 13% of total investment or 4-5% of GDP.

Hello. I want to know how do you belarussians see your country after 10 years, 20 years? What the majority of people in your country think about Russia and EU? And last question, i know that i can find it in internet but still, what was the amount of foreign investments for 2007? Thank you :)

FDI 2007 : 1.7 bn USD.
http://www.unctad.org/sections/dite_dir/docs/wir08_fs_by_en.pdf

1. The independent state without Lukoshenka (looks unbelievable) between UE and China...


laconic but interesting :)

Just remember - politics and provocation is not welcome :):cheers:

Can I ask why politics are not welcome?

Can I ask why politics are not welcome?

We are discussing architecture and construction here. There are definitely nice places on the web to talk about the politics.

Would anyone shed light on the impact of the current crisis on announced projects in Minsk? How many have been canceled, frozen, delayed or defaulted on investments?

Thanks

PS: Minsk is lovely; take it from someone who knows over 80 countries

Would anyone shed light on the impact of the current crisis on announced projects in Minsk? How many have been canceled, frozen, delayed or defaulted on investments?

Thanks

PS: Minsk is lovely; take it from someone who knows over 80 countries

None that I know of.

Would anyone shed light on the impact of the current crisis on announced projects in Minsk? How many have been canceled, frozen, delayed or defaulted on investments?

Thanks

PS: Minsk is lovely; take it from someone who knows over 80 countries

As a matter of fact, many of the current construction developments have been defaulted on investments because of the crisis and the turn of the year. On the other hand, none of them has yet been cancelled. Besides, there is a Resolution of the Council of Ministers of the Republic of Belarus № 2031 dd. 26.12.2008 "On some measures on activation of cooperation with foreign investors" with a Supplement List of 115 investment projects planned for realization in 2009 – 2010 according to decisions of the Head of State, the Government of the Republic of Belarus, local legislative and regulatory authorities. This doc imposes personal responsibility for the timely realization of the enlisted investment projects on the heads of the Republican public authorities and other state organizations under the Government of the republic of Belarus, regional executive committees, Minsk City Executive Committee etc.
I believe that most of the projects won't meet the deadlines, but there is practically no doubt that in the near-term outlook they will all be realized.

P.S. Thanks for the comliment. The soonest move out of production facilities and development of new parking lots will provide for even better impression on the citizens and the guests of Minsk.

(edit) moved to main forum.

Very interesting website - http://www.gorodalive.by/

hey,

I need to find 5 companies from Belarus that manufacture steel products (steel coils/plates) and have a website... it's for a school project. I'd be very grateful if anybody could give me some help. Also, belsteel is no good.

Anyways, thanks

hey,

I need to find 5 companies from Belarus that manufacture steel products (steel coils/plates) and have a website... it's for a school project. I'd be very grateful if anybody could give me some help. Also, belsteel is no good.

Anyways, thanks

There is also a plant in Mogilev called "Krasny Metalist" but they rather produce a different kind of stuff, not the stele coils (look up here) (http://www.kramet.ru/catalog.htm).

http://www.mmz.by/

http://www.belsteel.com/index-e.php

many bellarussinas study in poland (college) ! why ?

Any good photos/images/shots of Belarusian power plants, by any chance?

Hello my friends.

Can you please give me an help and tell me something about this? What is it?



http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/1.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/2.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/3.jpg

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http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/11.jpg

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http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/15.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/16.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/17.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/18.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/19.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/20.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/21.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/22.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/23.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/24.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/25.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/26.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/27.jpg

http://englishrussia.com/images/belorussia_birds_eye_view/28.jpg

Hello my friends.

Can you please give me an help and tell me something about this? What is it?
AFAIK, this is the russian nuclear submarine control center near Vileyka. 18 radio towers 300 meters tall hold 900-tonn antenna curtain. Range up to 10000 kilometers. Transmitter power 1 MWt.

AFAIK, this is the russian nuclear submarine control center near Vileyka. 18 radio towers 300 meters tall hold 900-tonn antenna curtain. Range up to 10000 kilometers. Transmitter power 1 MWt.

Isn't that like a top-secret facility?

Isn't that like a top-secret facility?
Maybe, but I found the description of it in public source (from the newspaper article) :)

ops sorry, i edit, i just read that it's better not to speak about possible "hot" themes.

but only one thing: you can imagine up which's militarist ass Belarus people must put these radio transmitters, cause they are dangerous for belarus people living (and also not so, cause if it has a range of 10k km...) nearby. :)

Isn't that like a top-secret facility?

Do you care? It's a facility of a foreign country anyway. Let them care about their secrets, you (we) have no obligation to keep them. Au contraire.

Do you care? It's a facility of a foreign country anyway. Let them care about their secrets, you (we) have no obligation to keep them. Au contraire.

So do I. That's their problems. As for my reply, I was just suprised how easly one can find the photos of the facility on the web. Seems that they don't care of it either.:)

Can someone tell us about economic situation in Belarus in this time of crisis? I'm asking especially about the economic growth, because there are minuses in almost all European countries. Poland has +0,8% and it's considered to be a success. What about Belarus? Luka told something about 1,5%?

Can someone tell us about economic situation in Belarus in this time of crisis? I'm asking especially about the economic growth, because there are minuses in almost all European countries. Poland has +0,8% and it's considered to be a success. What about Belarus? Luka told something about 1,5%?
GDP is +1,2, but GDP is just a sum of producted goods and services, not sold. If we look at trade balance, it is -2,6 billion $ in Jan-Apr 2009. While the belarussian ruble is tied to dollar it means the goverment spend credits and reserves just to keep ruble from falling. If it will continue in that way, Belarus will be forced to declare default on its foreign debt in the end of this year. Only devaluation may stop this, but this means the end of belarussian economic wonder.

Belarus part of Berlin -Moscow line to be ready by 2014

According to Interfax referring to the deputy Director General of Belarus Railways, by 2014 the Belarus part of a railway line from Berlin to Moscow through Minsk will be finished.

Works on this railway line will take 5 years. After they are done, trains on the Belarus part of the line will be able to reach a speed of 160 km/h.

These are great news! What about polish part? Is it under construction?

These are great news! What about polish part? Is it under construction?
You should ask it at Forum Polskich Wieżowców (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=45) :)

If they talk about 2014 so I think it will be prepared until Olympic Games will start... So, fans would be able to get at 2014 IIHF World Championship in Belarus. :)

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/forumdisplay.php?f=241

Exactly here, this is a part about trains and railways. However I don't think there is some special thread for the investment you mentioned above... you should ask there.

Hello!
I've got one question for you pals because I've never been to Belarus although our countries are neighbours. I've seen thread about Minsk and saw really clean city there. It's the same with rural areas close to the border with Poland. How do you do this ? :nuts: Is there any governmental program to prevent throwing garbage on the ground ? Does the government employ additonal cleaners ? Or maybe people have the way of thinking in their minds, to keep cities clean ? I'm asking because in Poland people have no respect for cleanness and they are throwing everything everywhere. The situation is getting better but there is still much work to do.

OK. You know, we had a flood some days ago in Minsk, maybe that's the answer? :D

I know, that approx. at 5-6am cleaners go outdoors and clean the streets, so morning-tourists can think our citizens don't throw garbage in the streets. In my city (Słucak) the problem was solved by installing trash cans everywhere. I think so. As for me, I learned myself to throw the rubbish to its place.
There's no any special "way of thinking", 'cause nobody has learned people what is that damned garbage sorting. Those popular recycle bins for glass, plastics, metals, etc... Yes, they exist. But nobody sorts the rubbish before they utilize it. So in a bin for glass you can find plastic bottles of Cola, beer, put out cigarettes... Sometimes you can find even crap of cats/dogs/etc.

The effect of cleanliness is achieved with crowds of cleaners employed as they will remain unemployed (all good places are already occupied, "not good" places are unwanted, IT-field is growing now, but you have to learn a lot before you'll be employed by a certain company).

So, I think the answer on your question is "the government employs additonal cleaners"...
----------
upd. Oh, I'm not the one who has the same opinion :) There's a comment for an article at charter97.org (http://www.charter97.org/be/news/2009/7/7/19847)

10:01, 8.07

Никакие грандиозные новостройки Минску не нужны при этой власти, которая и так уже испоганила и засрала многие пятаки в центре ужасными проектами 80-х годов. В рамках 1-ого и 2-ого кольца вообще необходимо строить только архитектурные шедевры, приглашая наиболее талантливых зодчих со всего мира. Совершенно не понимаю тех, кто восхищается Минском. Наверное потому, что кроме него н6ихера не видел. Кроме Красного костела не на что посмотреть. Колхозный город, а чисто здесь, не потому что люди уж такие культурные (хотя, надо отдать и им должное), а потому, что армия дворников трудится с 4-х - 5-ти утра, вот и весь секрет.
Хватит того, что испоганили площадь Независимости, постороив убогий ТЦ Столица", пабсолютно несовременный. Хотя бы в Европу кого командировали.
Колхозное быдло у власти и мышление на том же уровне, а люди - рабы, которые бояться раскрыть пасть, в то время, когда в тролейбусе готовы выплеснуть на тебя все свои комплексы и недовольство жизнью. Быдло, что возьмешь.
This government doesn't need those new buildings, because it has already f**ked the center up with ugly 80's projects. We must build masterpieces only in the middle of the 1st and the 2nd ring road involving the best architects from over the world. I can't realize why they all admire Minsk. Perhaps, they saw nothing before. There's nothing to see except Red Catholic Church. Crappy city, and it's clean here not 'cause of civilized citizens (though we should pay a tribute to them), but 'cause of crowds of cleaners working from 4-5am, that's the secret.
...skipped...

I hope you'll found out why we have such clean streets with the help of a middle-class citizen's point of view. :)

PS: yep, the translation sucks... But that's the only way to give the answer.

Do you think Belarus can become rich by 2020, similar to Czech Republic today?

Do you think Belarus can become rich by 2020, similar to Czech Republic today?

Well, what do you mean ‘similar to Czech Republic today’ -
either the economic circumstances or political organizations? :)

Well, what do you mean ‘similar to Czech Republic today’ -
either the economic circumstances or political organizations? :)

I am referring mostly to the economic circumstances. Do you think it will be possible by 2020 to be as economically developed as Czech Republic is today or do you think this is impossible?

Do you think Belarus can become rich by 2020, similar to Czech Republic today?

I think that it's possible, though not very probable. In any case, let's hope so.

I am referring mostly to the economic circumstances. Do you think it will be possible by 2020 to be as economically developed as Czech Republic is today or do you think this is impossible?

Well, If we keep going the way we're going :) I mean this way:
All is possible…
http://web.worldbank.org/WBSITE/EXTERNAL/NEWS/0,,contentMDK:22301788~pagePK:64257043~piPK:437376~theSitePK:4607,00.html

Top 10 Reformers
1 - Rwanda

2 - Kyrgyz Republic

3 - Macedonia, FYR

4 - Belarus

5 - United Arab Emirates

6 - Moldova

7 - Colombia

8 - Tajikistan

9 - Egypt

10 - Liberia

:)

Do you think it will be possible by 2020 to be as economically developed as Czech Republic is today or do you think this is impossible?

Not with current economic model IMHO: mostly administrative command system, aggravated by export-orientation. It's very hard to keep up with the competitors on the world-marked if you are bound by administrative directives, like fixed price, industrial output plan, etc. Recently it leads to the situation when companies are working mostly for stock.

I have a question, ja. How many Belarusians does it take to change a light bulb?

I think you are waiting the reply 11. 1 is holding the bulb, the others are drinking beer :cheers: untill the room starts rotating.... true?

I have a question, ja. How many Belarusians does it take to change a light bulb?
None, Belarussians will sit in the darkness and think it was meant to be in that way.

None, Belarussians will sit in the darkness and think it was meant to be in that way.
Haha, nice shot, dude! :D

None, Belarussians will sit in the darkness and think it was meant to be in that way.

Как в анекдоте прямо - "а мо так і трэба?" :lol:

I am from New Zealand and I hope to travel to Belarus in the near future and travel around the former Soviet Republics. I have two questions to ask.

What are the differences in the cyrillic writing that Belarus has when compared to other countries that have cyrillic as their writing?

Do I need a Visa? If so what is the right way to getting a Visa to go to Belarus?

Thanks

Do you think Belarus can become rich by 2020, similar to Czech Republic today?

Well most of the EU 10 States of 2004 have overtaken New Zealand in per capita terms and sometimes in Nominal GDP (New Zealand is my Country just in case you don't know). So yes the EU10 seem to be doing very very well.

What are the differences in the cyrillic writing that Belarus has when compared to other countries that have cyrillic as their writing?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belarusian_alphabet

Do I need a Visa? If so what is the right way to getting a Visa to go to Belarus?

Yes, you need visa. See more details here:
http://www.russia-ukraine-travel.com/belarus-visa.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Belarusian_alphabet

Yes, you need visa. See more details here:
http://www.russia-ukraine-travel.com/belarus-visa.html

Thanks that is good information there I will have a read over it.

"Russia Ukraine travel"... Belarus is considered to be Russia, or Ukraine?

lol I am pretty sure that websites dedicated solely to Belarus will give him more information. For an example http://www.belarus.by/en/ http://eng.belarustourism.by/ http://belarustourism.by/presentation/en/ http://www.belintourist.com/eng

What happened to http://www.gorodalive.by/ ?

What happened to http://www.gorodalive.by/ ?
Project is closed since 1.07.2009 in accordance to the customer (investor) decision.

That's sad. I wish they could at least transfer the data to somebody else.

That's sad. I wish they could at least transfer the data to somebody else.
I wish, too... :( Wonderful project (the maps were so-so, but live street views were really cool)...

With the Chernobyl accident what's the situation like in Belarus today?

Is there much being done about minimizing the effects on the children?

God I feel so sorry for the people of Belarus mother of devine god it must be awful for the children and the families.

Im glad that there is support and help for Belarus.:)

With the Chernobyl accident what's the situation like in Belarus today?

Is there much being done about minimizing the effects on the children?

God I feel so sorry for the people of Belarus mother of devine god it must be awful for the children and the families.

Im glad that there is support and help for Belarus.:)

Thank you for the touching words. Back in 1986 the situation was pretty scary. The worst thing about radiation is that when it kills you, you do not even notice this. And when notice - it is too late. Right now it is more or less back to normal. The places where radiation level is high are well known and marked so that you just avoid visiting these regions. But of course there are still a lot of traces left by the catastrophe that are just acting indivisibly influencing your health. Probably someone can write more about this.

Yeah, there's, for example, a place near Staryje Darogi, or Stolbcy (less then 100km to the east from Slutsk), where you cannot gather mushrooms 'cause they collect a lot of radiation...

As for me, some my friends recieve medical support as their parents have worked in those places (South-East Belarus).

What happened to http://www.gorodalive.by/ ?
It seems that interfax.by has bought the project.
The map of gorodalive can now be found on http://maps.interfax.by/minsk. With the street view!
:cheers:

:cheers:

Really cheers!!! :cheers: :beer:

Greetings Belorussian Forumers,

I am from Canada and do not speak Belorussian.

The reason I am posting in your forum is that I would like your help with posting pictures of new buildings built in traditional style. .

I would like to add some examples of Belorussian buildings built in traditional style which adhere to fidelity in design, materials, and/or construction methods of historic buildings.

For an example of what I mean, please see the thread below:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1022349


Thanks!

Greetings Belorussian Forumers,

I am from Canada and do not speak Belorussian.

The reason I am posting in your forum is that I would like your help with posting pictures of new buildings built in traditional style. .

I would like to add some examples of Belorussian buildings built in traditional style which adhere to fidelity in design, materials, and/or construction methods of historic buildings.

For an example of what I mean, please see the thread below:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1022349


Thanks!

You mean something like this: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=48699427&postcount=52 which is not a real building but a project of a hotel in Nesvizh that should share the same style with Nesvizh castle in the same town. But if I got it right only finished buildings can be considered?

You mean something like this: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showpost.php?p=48699427&postcount=52 which is not a real building but a project of a hotel in Nesvizh that should share the same style with Nesvizh castle in the same town. But if I got it right only finished buildings can be considered?

Yes precisely. :)

What is the name of this building and location?

Please post if you have more examples.

Yes precisely. :)

What is the name of this building and location?

Please post if you have more examples.

As I said, it is just a project of a hotel in Nesvizh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nesvizh) not a real building.

Would you accept sites that were destroyed in 19-20 centuries and restored now (e.g. Minsk city hall below)?

http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3510/igorkasan.f/0_2a616_7179fa5c_XL

Newly built pseudo "old style" church in Minsk:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2566/3971920296_a697135975_o.jpg

^^

Excellent. Yes please post more examples of reconstructions as well as new buildings.

I see the church is already done. Last time I saw it, it was still under construction. Eastern Orthodox Church is very conservative in the matter of architecture of churches, so most of them will be built in a very traditional form I guess...
But maybe it's better than the new catholic ones, because they like to experiment and build scary things sometimes ;)

As I said, it is just a project of a hotel in Nesvizh (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nesvizh) not a real building.

Would you accept sites that were destroyed in 19-20 centuries and restored now (e.g. Minsk city hall below)?

http://img-fotki.yandex.ru/get/3510/igorkasan.f/0_2a616_7179fa5c_XL

Newly built pseudo "old style" church in Minsk:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2566/3971920296_a697135975_o.jpg

What is the name of the Church?

Is there any more pictures of it?

What is the name of the Church?

Is there any more pictures of it?

This is the Church of All Saints.
A couple of more photos:
http://oldy-denis.livejournal.com/49369.html
http://dm-matveev.livejournal.com/352548.html

Which structures with public observation decks exist in Belarus? The only one I know is Ferris wheel in Gorky Park Minsk.

Which structures with public observation decks exist in Belarus? The only one I know is Ferris wheel in Gorky Park Minsk.

There is observation deck on the last floor of the National library of the Republic of Belarus. This is the most famous observation deck among foreign tourists. But I think this observation deck isn't the best in Minsk

Which structures with public observation decks exist in Belarus? The only one I know is Ferris wheel in Gorky Park Minsk.
You can try to make a parachute jump at Baravaja airfield. :) A good view and adrenaline overdose guaranteed. :)

Nothing except the National Library. But you can visit "Siomae nieba" reastaurant at the last floor of Belarus Hotel - there is probably the best view of the city and you can enter the balcony as well.

Nothing except the National Library. But you can visit "Siomae nieba" reastaurant at the last floor of Belarus Hotel - there is probably the best view of the city and you can enter the balcony as well.

"Siomae neba" is in near hotel "Minsk"

I'm from California (U.S.) and I have to say that Belarus is a very beautiful, clean country. I would like to visit Belarus one of these days. I have a few questions to ask (I'll try to avoid the obvious, political-related questions):

1.) Is it possible for anyone from the U.S. to visit Belarus? Do I need a visa?

2.) Is Belarus rail systems very comparable to other European nations? Are train fares -- affordable? Thanks.

-- Seabiscuit

I'm from California (U.S.) and I have to say that Belarus is a very beautiful, clean country. I would like to visit Belarus one of these days. I have a few questions to ask (I'll try to avoid the obvious, political-related questions):

1.) Is it possible for anyone from the U.S. to visit Belarus? Do I need a visa?

2.) Is Belarus rail systems very comparable to other European nations? Are train fares -- affordable? Thanks.

-- Seabiscuit

1.) Yes, of course you can, but I'm pretty sure you do need a visa.

Unfortunately I can't answer your second question, I don't know enough to be able to compare the rail systems and affordability and what not. :)

1.) Yes, of course you can, but I'm pretty sure you do need a visa.

Unfortunately I can't answer your second question, I don't know enough to be able to compare the rail systems and affordability and what not. :)

Thank goodness! That's great news! I hope to visit there soon! :)

As for the second question, its alright. I'm sure that its quite comparable to other european countries. Pricing shouldn't be too bad.

I have a personal question to ask (its a very small concern), if I were to go there alone....what precaution should I take once traveling to Belarus? Should I travel with a friend or in a group?

Between you and I, are Belarussians -- both friendly and tolerant towards people other ethnicities and races? I'm an American-born ethnic Asian, if that makes any sense to you.

Last question: What's the exchange rate like? You know, between the US Dollar and the Belarussian Ruble?

Thanks for the very helpful responses. :)

Visa requirements and some info - http://www.belarusembassy.org/

Concerning precaution - as in any foreign country. You can travel alone if it's convenient. I advise you to buy English-Russian dictionary because the majority of belarussians can't speak or understand english.
Belarussian people are tolerant in general and you won't have any problem because of your race or colour.
Av. exchange rate - 3000 roubles per US dollar

2.) Is Belarus rail systems very comparable to other European nations? Are train fares -- affordable? Thanks.

-- Seabiscuit
Regarding afordability of the train fares I can say that one ticket from Minsk to Mogilev (it's 340 km one way) in what is called economy class would cost you around 20000 BYR, i.e. 7 USD. I believe it's extremely cheap. Hope this information is of some help to you. :)

what precaution should I take once traveling to Belarus? Should I travel with a friend or in a group?

Between you and I, are Belarussians -- both friendly and tolerant towards people other ethnicities and races? I'm an American-born ethnic Asian, if that makes any sense to you.

In my opinion, the basic thing would be finding a "guide" who speaks Russian. :) People here do not speak much English (or any other foreign language). Moreover, you will hardly find any markings or signs in English; even you are lucky if you find a restaurant menu in English.
But all in all I think special precautions are not necessary. Belarus is a safe country with low street crime rate, people are basically tolerant although some lack political correctness.

del

Thank goodness! That's great news! I hope to visit there soon! :)

As for the second question, its alright. I'm sure that its quite comparable to other european countries. Pricing shouldn't be too bad.

I have a personal question to ask (its a very small concern), if I were to go there alone....what precaution should I take once traveling to Belarus? Should I travel with a friend or in a group?

Between you and I, are Belarussians -- both friendly and tolerant towards people other ethnicities and races? I'm an American-born ethnic Asian, if that makes any sense to you.

Last question: What's the exchange rate like? You know, between the US Dollar and the Belarussian Ruble?

Thanks for the very helpful responses. :)

Railroads are worse than in EU, but they are very affordable. The trains are old but are quite clean.

The best option for you would be to find a guide, like it has already been suggested. A typical guide would be a student that is studying English language at a University. Everything is very affordable if you're a middle class American. Belarusians are not known for racism, but you need to know beforehand that non-White people are still not very common sight in Belarus and the further away from Minsk you'll travel, the more "looks" you'll get. I also suggest learning some basic Russian phrases and words, at least like "Entrance", "Exit", "Police" etc. You will find it difficult to navigate by yourself around the city, the signs are in Cyrillic letters.

You can find more information here:
http://travel.state.gov/travel/cis_pa_tw/cis/cis_1033.html

As a citizen of Belarus, I confirm the answers above. People from US should have visa. The people are tolerant but in general they do not speak foreign languages, a guide may be required.
English-Russian dictionary is necessary, but a lot of signs are in Belorussian. I don't really know, is it possible to find English-Belorussian. But in ordinary life everyone use Russian language.

But language is no problem. I know some persons who do not speak Russian, but they feel themselves OK in Belarus.

Welcome to our beautiful and safe country!

A quick search brings up the National Library, Belexpo even the Hotel Belarus and of course the Polytechnic, but am I missing any others?

And what about any famous modernist Belorussian architects?

Kindest regards

James

National Library has been built in XXI c. and it's posmodernism. If you ask for classic modernism, maybe Josif Langbard (http://be-x-old.wikipedia.org/wiki/%D0%86%D0%BE%D1%81%D1%96%D1%84_%D0%9B%D1%8F%D0%BD%D0%B3%D0%B1%D0%B0%D1%80%D0%B4) will be satisfactory for you.

A quick search brings up the National Library, Belexpo even the Hotel Belarus and of course the Polytechnic, but am I missing any others?


Try:
- Agat hotel
http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll203/Bacian_photo/DSC_0298copy.jpg

- "Moscow" (Moskva) movie theatre
http://www.minsk-old-new.com/Image/old_images/moskva.jpg

- "October" (Oktyabr') movie theatre
http://www.pts2003.by.ru/reklama/october-01.jpg

- State musical theatre
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/434129.html

- Palace of Youth
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/396316.html

- Academy of Physical Culture
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/274602.html

- House of Writers
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/283392.html

- University of Culture and Academy of Administration
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/542223.html

- so called "Corn" residential buildings
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/377249.html

- research institute of computers
http://darriuss.livejournal.com/391008.html

- Nemiga residential and shopping complex
http://www.gdenemiga.by.ru/nemiga-02.htm

- National Airport Minsk air terminal
http://workandtravelusa.by/cms/images/Minsk2.jpg

- House of planning organizations
http://mgp.by/usr/templates/images/155.mnogofunkts3b.jpg (left)

- office tower on Melnikaite Str.
http://www.minsk-old-new.com/Image/old_images/%5B1%5D-243.jpg

- House of Trade Unions
http://www.minsk-old-new.com/Image/old_images/fotoalb-Pavl-42.jpg

- residential buildings on Kuibysheva Str.
http://i708.photobucket.com/albums/ww86/archigrafo/belokon07.jpg

- Palace of Sport
http://www.nemiga.info/turizm/dvorets-sporta-8.jpg

- Palace of the Republic
http://www.nemiga.info/turizm/october-palace-8.jpg

- Belarusian State Economical University
http://www.karta-minska.nemiga.info/foto-minska/bgeu.jpg

...and so on. Minsk has some first-class modernist architecture.

And what about any famous modernist Belorussian architects?

Yuri Grigoriev, Valentin Malyshev, Sergey Filimonov, Leonard Moskalevich, Sergey Musinski, Lev Pogorelov etc. But I'm afraid that they are famous only in Belarusian local architectural community.

Excellent reply. Brilliant list there to work through, thanks. Is that your own stuff in large part?

Is that your own stuff in large part?

Yeah, all from darriuss.livejournal.com.

quite soon i will start with learning Russian. is there way to learn Belarusan, too (by "way" I mean - possibility to learn it on internet)? what is diffrence? is it hard?

and I was always wonder myself, why do you even have Russian as official, Latvia for example have 25% of Russians and stil don't have Russian as official what-so-ever...

I think there is no need to learn Russian and Belorussian at the same time. Everybody in Belarus speaks Russian as a native language.
I'm pretty sure it's mach more harder to find in internet any materials to learn Belorussian than Russian. The difference between these languages is not very big. For example, some German dialects can be more differ from the official language.
What will be really hard when trying to learn both languages together - they may be "mixed" like it already happened in the country and provinces. It's hard to keep the languages pure and to separate one from another ;)

The difference between these languages is not very big. For example, some German dialects can be more differ from the official language.

@Ress Could you please prove your statement with some references to the renowned sources? No one in the scientific world seems to argue that Belarusian is a language. How could you ever compare it with some dialects?

@tonito_croat I appreciate your eagerness to learn foreign languages and Belarusian in particular. For some English references that may help you please look up here: http://pravapis.org

@Ress Could you please prove your statement with some references to the renowned sources? No one in the scientific world seems to argue that Belarusian is a language. How could you ever compare it with some dialects?

@tonito_croat I appreciate your eagerness to learn foreign languages and Belarusian in particular. For some English references that may help you please look up here: http://pravapis.org

i can even say i ignored his post even it didn't seem much mischievously... thank you for that site, my grandmother was Belarussian so i really wanna to lear language, just to satisfy 1/4 of myself :lol:

I would say that the different between Belarusian and Russian is similar to a distance between any Slavic language in relation to another Slavic language (except Yugoslavian-Slavic languages, where similarities are extremely close.) The reason why many Belarusians may wrongly assume that their language is closer to Russian, because they all know Russian and find it hard to imagine now knowing it.

Good luck learning Belarusian, it's a beautiful language. Although learning two languages at the same time may create some confusion for you.

I would like to talk to people familiar with small villages in Belarus. I am researching my family and need some help and advice.
I am researching my grandparents who lived in Belarus. Here is what I know so far:
Magdalena Helen Padnewitz (also spelled Podnevich, Padniewich) b. 1892 or 1894 (I have both dates on documents), from “Buczatin,” which I have narrowed to either Buchatino or Bushaten. At this point, I cannot limit the search any further. I have documents that show “Buczatin” for her, as well as other people who came from that town. Father’s name: Anthony, mother Teressa, brother Walter who had two children Valencia and Walter, Jr. According to one ship manifest, she was Greek Catholic. In 1909, Magdalena came to the US. She was married in Chicago, IL, at Holy Trinity Cathedral in May of 1910. I have found a person named Sinonia Maxemenja who came here to visit her in February. I assume this was her friend coming for the wedding. This person was from the same village. In 1911, my grandmother became pregnant and went back to Belarus, presumably the same village, to have the baby. The baby (a male) died there and she returned to the US in 1913. I am very interested in finding birth/death records for that child, as well as for my grandmother’s family. My dream is to someday travel to Belarus to locate the baby’s grave and quite possibly to bring him back to the US to be buried with his mother and father. At any rate, I need to find someone that will do some research in archives and churches for me. Or someone who has any information about the village in question.
Andro Stephano Najmolovski (also spelled Niemolowski, Najmolowski, Najmalowski) Here again, I have had difficulty locating much information. He was born 1890 in “Keaneche,” according to his US papers. I have researched the towns in Belarus, and I believe it is Khoiniki or Kanichi. I am more inclined to believe Khoiniki since he states on one paper that he was from Minsk. His father’s name was Stephan, sister named Eva and brother named Anton. Andro came to the US in 1907. Family members who have since passed away have always maintained that Najmolovski was not the family name; that it was “Valchek or Valchuk.” Supposedly, Andro’s father married a Polish woman and took her name for some reason. This could account for the problems finding any information. Again, I would like someone who would help find information or steer me in a direction to find information about Andro and his family. I have no idea what religion he practiced. Some say it may have been Jewish, but I have not established that and I know that my family was Russian Orthodox.
I would appreciate any assistance with information or “hints” for finding information.
Thank you for your time.
Pat House

PS: I hope that I can help people of Belarus find relatives in the US. I could do that for someone. Perhaps we can "trade" information.

Bučacina is not far from Slutsk where I have been living for most of my life. According to Radzima.org (http://www.radzima.org/eng/locality/buchacina.html) there was an Orthodox church of St. Peter and St. Paul (http://www.radzima.org/eng/object/6953.html) which was destroyed (probably by communists or nazis, doesn't matter).

A cemetery should exist somewhere not far from Bučacina, but I'm not sure that old graves still remain there. If there are any documents on that period of Bučacina, then they are at Slutsk District Archive.

Minsk Region Archive keeps some geneological documents (http://archives.gov.by/eng/index.php?id=615631) on Slutsk Uezd (now District), but they are dated 1918-1923 years, so it's not suitable for you.

Which is the tallest structure in Minsk and how tall is it?

At this moment National Library of Belarus is the tallest one. It's 116m high.

We're waiting for Parus (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=630104) building getting built up, it's gonna be 133m high, and Royal Plaza hotel (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=633702), it's 130m. They have 32 and 33 floors respectively.

Not 116. It's 72m.

Which is the tallest structure in Minsk and how tall is it?

http://s15.radikal.ru/i189/1104/fb/82720be8eed8.jpg (http://www.radikal.ru)

173 metres.

Not 116. It's 72m.
I took the numbers right from here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=878990). :(

potema, it's unfair :D

I took the numbers right from here (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=878990). :(

potema, it's unfair :D

116 Independence Avenue is the address
the highest object in Minsk is a TV tower (170m)
I'm not sure the truth may be there are some pipes above but it is unlikely

And what about the chimney of TES-3 in Minsk? How tall is it? I believe it is the tallest chimney in Minsk.

And what about the chimney shown on http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=793038&page=2? It looks very tall!

According Wikipedia the tallest structures of Belarus are
* Kolodischi TV Mast, 350 m
* Ushachi TV Mast, 350 m
* Polykovichi TV Mast, 350 m
* Novaya Strazha TV Mast, 350 m
* Central masts of Vileyka VLF transmitter, 305 m
* Ring masts of Vileyka VLF transmitter, 270 m
* Grodno TV Tower, 254 m
* Chimneys of Lukoml Power Station, 250 m

But I believe that the TV mast at Smetanichi ( http://vcfm.ru/vc/Europa/mozyr.htm#smetanichi ) and the radio mast of Sosnovy longwave transmitter are also taller than 250 metres. Does someone know their heights or further structures, which belong in this list?

And what about the chimney shown on http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=793038&page=2? It looks very tall!
it is not in minsk, but near the city

Nevertheless, how tall are these chimneys?

I propose to move this conversation into the appropriate topic (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=678994)

And Vitebsk TV Tower about 250m
http://img69.imageshack.us/img69/7231/jkljkl.jpg

Hello.
First of all I can say that I know very little about your country. I have some questions well what is the average salary in Belarus? Also what is the perspective of the country are you happy with you government because I have read on in the news these days about the nondemocratic regime. Ok so yes this is not political forum but I was curious about the future are the young people interested for accessing to European Union and working there? Also how much the visas and other papers are stopping the people to travel free?

Hello.
First of all I can say that I know very little about your country. I have some questions well what is the average salary in Belarus? Also what is the perspective of the country are you happy with you government because I have read on in the news these days about the nondemocratic regime. Ok so yes this is not political forum but I was curious about the future are the young people interested for accessing to European Union and working there? Also how much the visas and other papers are stopping the people to travel free?
Damn, guy, why have you reminded that we have the non-democratic regime here? I just got it out of my head. :) I keed, I keed.

Average salary sucks. It get's lower and lower, while black market rouble-to-dollar exchange rate goes high.

Hello.
First of all I can say that I know very little about your country. I have some questions well what is the average salary in Belarus? Also what is the perspective of the country are you happy with you government because I have read on in the news these days about the nondemocratic regime. Ok so yes this is not political forum but I was curious about the future are the young people interested for accessing to European Union and working there? Also how much the visas and other papers are stopping the people to travel free?
Hi. I will gladly answer your questions.
1. Average salary in Belarus is around 1.2 mln. belarusian roubles that is USD400 (as per official exchange rate). But as we are on the verge of national currency devaluation, the real exchange rate is not known. Most probably belarusian rouble will fall by 30%, so the salary in USD will fall accordingly.
2. I am not happy with our government. The regime has nothing to do with democracy.
3. Young people are interested in accessing EU.
4. Shengen visa costs EUR60. Taking into account the average monthly salary, the Shengen visa is quite expensive. I think this stops people from travelling.

Hei, I have few questions.

1. Ice hockey is most popular team sport in Belarus?

2. Is it true that countryside of Belarus are dying (I mean people move out)?

3. Chernobyl disaster did affect large areas of Belarus?

I'm also very interested Belarus politics but it is better to not go there. I'm sure you are very tired of speaking your country's politics to foreigners who are read few paragraphs on news and tell what kind of country you have.

Hei, I have few questions.

1. Ice hockey is most popular team sport in Belarus?

2. Is it true that countryside of Belarus are dying (I mean people move out)?

3. Chernobyl disaster did affect large areas of Belarus?

I'm also very interested Belarus politics but it is better to not go there. I'm sure you are very tired of speaking your country's politics to foreigners who are read few paragraphs on news and tell what kind of country you have.

1. If president prefers hockey most of all, it doesn't mean it's the most popular team sport in Belarus at all. I can't say which sport is the most popular in Belarus, but I know exactly that it isn't hockey. Football is more popular than hockey, for instance.

3. Chernobyl disaster affected a part of Gomel region, because it's the closest region in Belarus to Chernobyl

^^
1. Not only :) At least football, voleyball, handball and field hockey are popular as well.

2. Unfortunetly it is true. People frome countyside move to towns. It's about 74% of population lives in towns.

3. See this site http://e-dom.net/news/?c=sp&i=10

Thanks to answers. I was really believe that Ice hockey is really popular in Belarus. Media brainwashed me. :lol:

Thanks to answers. I was really believe that Ice hockey is really popular in Belarus. Media brainwashed me. :lol:

Anyway ice hokey is popular in Belarus, I've just said that it is not the only one :)

I was really believe that Ice hockey is really popular in Belarus

Certainly ice hockey is popular sport in Belarus, but it isn't the most popular. There are a lot of sports

Hi.

I'd like to visit Minsk and Grodno for couple of months and as I found out I have to apply for touristic visa. I saw some details regarding this in one of numerous travel potals but I'm not fancy (and I have no enought time) to collect a documents and eventually aplly for it. I have beaucracy especially that like Belarussian ones.

Is that possible to buy a touristic visa in border crossing? I will travel from Ukraine and I considered about purchasing a visa in border crossing.

Does someone knows any prices? Can I get any link with information?

Hi.

I'd like to visit Minsk and Grodno for couple of months and as I found out I have to apply for touristic visa. I saw some details regarding this in one of numerous travel potals but I'm not fancy (and I have no enought time) to collect a documents and eventually aplly for it. I have beaucracy especially that like Belarussian ones.

Is that possible to buy a touristic visa in border crossing? I will travel from Ukraine and I considered about purchasing a visa in border crossing.

Does someone knows any prices? Can I get any link with information?

Well too bad for you then.

Well too bad for you then.

I found out some details regarding visas to Belarus and eventually I gave up.

I found out some details regarding visas to Belarus and eventually I gave up.

Before complaining you should check the list of requirements for Belarusian citizens who want to travel to the UK (even to catch a flight in the UK airport it costs $85)

An invitation from a tourist company in the United Kingdom showing hotels and accommodation conditions.
Letter describing the route from the local tourism companies.
Confirmation of your financial situation (reference from employer indicating position and salary for the last 6 months, painted on a monthly basis, bank statement)
Evidence of any additional sources of income of your family, including information about the income of husband / wife, and savings, proof of property in Belarus.
A letter from your manager / employer, which stated the following: your name, title, office address, phone number, how long did you work in an organization, at what time you leave is granted and the date of return to work.
A letter from the institution of higher education in the Republic of Belarus (for students), with accurate information about you as a student (faculty, courses, etc.).
A copy of the hotel reservation
A copy of airline tickets reservation
Gradebook (for students).
Employment history.
Valid passport
1 photo (color on a light background) 3.5 x 4.5 cm

+USD 125 (in a country where it is a bit more than in the UK)

:ohno:

Hi.
Is that possible to buy a touristic visa in border crossing? I will travel from Ukraine and I considered about purchasing a visa in border crossing.
No, it is not possible, unless you arrive at Minsk-2 airport. In the airport, you can apply for a tourist or business visa. Anyway you will need an invitation letter (for a business visa), a letter from and a contract with a Belarusian travel company (for a tourist visa), and will have to pay $342,00 if you are a citizen of the UK (the price depends on the country).

Before complaining you should check the list of requirements for Belarusian citizens who want to travel to the UK (even to catch a flight in the UK airport it costs $85)



+USD 125 (in a country where it is a bit more than in the UK)

:ohno:

I have no disrespect for Belarussian but you must consider some important details.

Belarus keeps kommunist economy and one party government, really one person government. In Belarus wage are several smaller than in UK and even 3-4 times lesser than in neighbourhooding UE members. Nobody wants here next stream of immigrants especially when they arriving here stright up from comunist country with agressive leader in power and big of people living in poverty. Belarus's government must make a move towards normalisation of politics and economy to become reliable for anyone else except Russia. Belarussians could travel abroad- for example to Poland, Latvia or Lithuania regardless they going to work or just for holidays. Belarussian leader Lukashenka cousing a lot of problems and nobody in UE is fancy to treat him as equal partner.

You found this (http://united-kingdom.visahq.com/requirements/Belarus/resident-United_States/) and I really understand their point of view. Price is very high - it means they don't wish to let into the country the hords of beggars. And those requirements concern to Belarussian citizens whose live in USA.

I examined one issue and I noticed Ukraine doesn't required visa from me - Ukrainian visa not requires for UE citizens (http://ukraine.visahq.co.uk/) but it doesn't work the same when Ukrainians desire to there, they have to require for visas - UK visa for Ukrainians (http://united-kingdom.visahq.com/requirements/Ukraine/) For me Ukrainian's authorities provide a much better politics than Belarus's ones and they ceased comunistic circus long time ago. They still have apply for visas and I met a lot them here in UK, I've never met any Belarussians.

As I said I don't mind about visit in Belarus but I'm very unhappy if I have to require for visa by sending a lot of documents to their embassy or consulate.

80$ for flight? Very cheap flight, very cheap.

Singidunum - can I ask for link to those requirements those you quoted?

No, it is not possible, unless you arrive at Minsk-2 airport. In the airport, you can apply for a tourist or business visa. Anyway you will need an invitation letter (for a business visa), a letter from and a contract with a Belarusian travel company (for a tourist visa), and will have to pay $342,00 if you are a citizen of the UK (the price depends on the country).

$342 bucks for touristic visa? Lukashenko is mad mate, really he is crazy. :lol:

I regret but I had to give up. I going to Ukraine and probably to Moldova. That country doesn't requires visa from EU citizens as well.

As I said I don't mind about visit in Belarus but I'm very unhappy if I have to require for visa by sending a lot of documents to their embassy or consulate.

Too bad for you then. My country is not communist blahblah but it keeps cordial relations with Belarus and thus I don't need a visa to visit Belarus and Belarusians don't need a visa to visit us. We also don't need visas for any of the EU countries EXCEPT the UK. So I guess the "hordes of immigrants" are just waiting for the UK, they don't want to go to any of the other 25+ countries, no they are just waiting for the UK. Give me a break. Just because there were hordes of Poles and Lithuanians, it doesn't mean there would be hordes of Belarusians (plus we are talking about tourists visas here not work visas)

80$ for flight? Very cheap flight, very cheap.

No, read what I write, $85 needs to be paid to the British Govt to be allowed to catch a flight in the UK airport. It's called an "airport transit visa". With such pathetic treatment of course you haven't seen any Belarusians in the UK. For as long as such laws are in place I would evade it like a plague myself. Punishing ordinary Belarusian tourists for political reasons (Lukashenko) is the saddest idea the UK could come up with.

Singidunum - can I ask for link to those requirements those you quoted?

http://ukinbelarus.fco.gov.uk/be/by-visiting-uk/by-visas/supporting-documents

$342 bucks for touristic visa? Lukashenko is mad mate, really he is crazy. :lol:

I regret but I had to give up. I going to Ukraine and probably to Moldova. That country doesn't requires visa from EU citizens as well.
$342 is for those British citizens who apply for visa at the airport. In the Belarusian consulate in London it may cost less.
As to Belarus' leader, I fully agree to your assessment of his mental condition. Oddly enough, he pleads to develop tourism in Belarus. But when you look at visa fees at the airport, it becomes clear that he does not really want any foreigners here, and British citizens are among the most unwelcome (second only to Americans with $420 fee).
Nevertheless, I hope some time you will have a chance to visit Belarus and meet Belarusians. Believe me, we are not so hostile as Lukashenko is.

$342 is for those British citizens who apply for visa at the airport. In the Belarusian consulate in London it may cost less.
As to Belarus' leader, I fully agree to your assessment of his mental condition. Oddly enough, he pleads to develop tourism in Belarus. But when you look at visa fees at the airport, it becomes clear that he does not really want any foreigners here, and British citizens are among the most unwelcome (second only to Americans with $420 fee).
Nevertheless, I hope some time you will have a chance to visit Belarus and meet Belarisians. Believe me, we are not so hostile as Lukashenko is.

I know Belarussians are normally nice people because I have been there when I was young and after I met some of them in Poland and Lithuania. They hosted us, shore food with us etc. I just want to visit in country which couldn't be called as McDonald country if you caught what I mean.

I think I will go there after Lukashenko's fall. That guy is really retarded and he is dragging al of the country's citizens down into big loo instead to let spread their wings.

$342 is for those British citizens who apply for visa at the airport. In the Belarusian consulate in London it may cost less.
As to Belarus' leader, I fully agree to your assessment of his mental condition. Oddly enough, he pleads to develop tourism in Belarus. But when you look at visa fees at the airport, it becomes clear that he does not really want any foreigners here, and British citizens are among the most unwelcome (second only to Americans with $420 fee).
Nevertheless, I hope some time you will have a chance to visit Belarus and meet Belarusians. Believe me, we are not so hostile as Lukashenko is.

It costs (http://www.uk.belembassy.org/_modules/_cfiles/files/Stoimost%20viz%20dlja%20sajta%2013.06.2011_1634.pdf) GBP 75 ie. USD 120 ie. the exact same as the British visa. It's called reciprocity and the blame is on the British side. If they gave visas to Belarusians for GBP 10 then they would also pay GBP 10 to visit Belarus. And just before someone says this is another Lukashenko madness - many countries maintain this policy for an example Brazil which is not a communist dictatorship and whatnot. Some countries do not maintain full reciprocity for practical reasons (UK citizens do not require visas for Serbia but not vice versa, not all EU citizens can travel to the USA visa free but US citizens can travel to all EU countries visa free etc) but Belarus is simply not one of them. Take a look at that table (http://www.uk.belembassy.org/_modules/_cfiles/files/Stoimost%20viz%20dlja%20sajta%2013.06.2011_1634.pdf), "Visa fees for the citizens of Japan and Serbia - GBP 0". You can whine about Japanese and Serbian Govts being better at making consular agreements but that's all.

I know Belarussians are normally nice people because I have been there when I was young and after I met some of them in Poland and Lithuania. They hosted us, shore food with us etc. I just want to visit in country which couldn't be called as McDonald country if you caught what I mean.

If you really wanted to visit you would. Instead you are whining because of the paperwork which is ironically much smaller than the one that is imposed by the UK. But when Belarus seeks documents at the embassy it's "mad dictator" while when the UK does the same (x3 on the number of documents) then it's perfectly fine?!

I think I will go there after Lukashenko's fall. That guy is really retarded and he is dragging al of the country's citizens down into big loo instead to let spread their wings.

Yeah he should tell them "Go and see London my fellow citizens. God will pay for your fees".

It costs (http://www.uk.belembassy.org/_modules/_cfiles/files/Stoimost%20viz%20dlja%20sajta%2013.06.2011_1634.pdf) GBP 75 ie. USD 120 ie. the exact same as the British visa. It's called reciprocity and the blame is on the British side. If they gave visas to Belarusians for GBP 10 then they would also pay GBP 10 to visit Belarus. And just before someone says this is another Lukashenko madness - many countries maintain this policy for an example Brazil which is not a communist dictatorship and whatnot. Some countries do not maintain full reciprocity for practical reasons (UK citizens do not require visas for Serbia but not vice versa, not all EU citizens can travel to the USA visa free but US citizens can travel to all EU countries visa free etc) but Belarus is simply not one of them.
Well, I think all this is a matter of what you really want. I know about reciprocity: it's our government's favourite excuse. The point is that they claim they want to develop tourism in Belarus, they shout about it all the time, they pretend doing everything for it. But in fact it's just hot air. If they wanted to make Belarus attractive for tourists, they would forget about reciprocity, like Ukraine did. Our country can insist on this reciprocity for ever and never move any further. Eventually someone should give way, and I don't see why it should be the EU. Since Belarus is more interested, it should make the first step forward and cancel visas for EU citizens. In fact it is Belarusian people who are interested, but not Belarusian authorities, that's why the government will keep talking about reciprocity.

Well, I think all this is a matter of what you really want. I know about reciprocity: it's our government's favourite excuse. The point is that they claim they want to develop tourism in Belarus, they shout about it all the time, they pretend doing everything for it. But in fact it's just hot air. If they wanted to make Belarus attractive for tourists, they would forget about reciprocity, like Ukraine did. Our country can insist on this reciprocity for ever and never move any further. Eventually someone should give way, and I don't see why it should be the EU. Since Belarus is more interested, it should make the first step forward and cancel visas for EU citizens. In fact it is Belarusian people who are interested, but not Belarusian authorities, that's why the government will keep talking about reciprocity.

I agree, I am not defending authorities but I am saying that I don't see much difference between the behavior of the EU/UK authorities and Belarus authorities. They are both wrong here. And yes Belarus is a weaker player there so it will either have to give up reciprocity like Ukraine or Serbia or prolong this state because the EU is even more stubborn and they will not give up. My point is that there is no excuse, when Lukashenko yells reciprocity or when the UK yells mad dictator while they are both doing the same thing. Neither side is doing anything to cancel its own visas or make them easier to obtain so I don't see much difference between them ie. finger pointing that the other side is guilty of something while you are doing the exact same thing is ridiculous.

Also there is another issue, does the EU want to be compared with Lukashenko in its style? Because if Lukashenko wants to maintain reciprocity so be it, the EU should at least make visas free. But they wont, because they are equally stubborn.

If you really wanted to visit you would. Instead you are whining because of the paperwork which is ironically much smaller than the one that is imposed by the UK. But when Belarus seeks documents at the embassy it's "mad dictator" while when the UK does the same (x3 on the number of documents) then it's perfectly fine?!


I'm not whining I'm consider where I can go for my short holidays, that's all.


I don't claim British fees are ok, but fact is in UK nobody would being imprisoned someone else just for different point of view regarding basic issues. In Belarus nobody could feel safe, in UK people could feel safe. There in Lukashenkoland people have to keep their month shut and they can't afford to say anything against their leader, not loud I mean. In UK political criticism is common and everyone could say "I disagree with this or that". In UK most of people could develop their careers, could buy a house anywhere etc, in Belarus people have to struggle how to survive to end of current month.

There are no revolution or riot in Belarus because Russia takes care of Lukashenka regime and prevent against any disturbances those might occured. Without Russian's and their breath behind Lukashenka's back, Belarus would be a free country with more or less happy poeple whose might work for themselves not for regime.

Earlier or later that paper economy provided by Lukashenka will fall. Nowadays he sell some key industries just for loan from Russia. 3 billion dollars to cover the debt but as some economists from Belarus saying regime needs much more money to survive. After that big purchase could getting worser in Belarus because Russians would find Belarus as colony. The country could become state-dependent of Russia.

Lukashenka is banned in UE, his high-ranking officials as well. Maybe he feels jealous and he'd like to force everybody else to the same - if I couldn't you couldn't as well. Sick guy looked like typical director of kolhoz.

I don't claim British fees are ok, but fact is in UK nobody would being imprisoned someone else just for different point of view regarding basic issues. In Belarus nobody could feel safe, in UK people could feel safe. There in Lukashenkoland people have to keep their month shut and they can't afford to say anything against their leader, not loud I mean. In UK political criticism is common and everyone could say "I disagree with this or that".

Politically yes you are right. However chances of getting stabbed randomly in the street are almost 0 in Belarus while in the UK the chances are rather high and extremely high in certain areas. So it's all a matter of perspective. I'd personally prefer a place where I can control if something will happen to me (ie. if I don't go around spreading my opinion on authorities, and I can live without doing that in a foreign country or better say I leave it to the citizens as it's none of my business) over a place with random violent crime.

Btw talking badly about the King of Thailand will get you in a far worse situation than talking badly about Lukashenko yet I don't see the UK calling on sanctions against them. I wont even mention places like Saudi Arabia which are also British allies. I guess it's also a matter of perspective. My perspective is that such double standards are unacceptable, you either care about undemocratic countries and start from the worst (KSA) or you don't. There is no in the middle where you are extremely concerned about the low to medium intensity dictators while you don't care about totalitarian Medieval like regimes.

In UK most of people could develop their careers, could buy a house anywhere etc, in Belarus people have to struggle how to survive to end of current month.

While Belarus was a Polish or Russian colony, the UK was the one that held colonies all over the world. If it was the other way around I am sure the current economic situation would have been different too.

There are no revolution or riot in Belarus because Russia takes care of Lukashenka regime and prevent against any disturbances those might occured. Without Russian's and their breath behind Lukashenka's back, Belarus would be a free country with more or less happy poeple whose might work for themselves not for regime.

Could be but then again Ukraine and Serbia got free of the regime but due to the EU giving Ukraine a finger and Serbia a cold treatment both countries still haven't defeated the old regimes. As the matter of fact they are now back in power in Ukraine. Before turning their back on Russia Belarus should seek guarantees that it will not be forgotten on day two.

The country could become state-dependent of Russia.

And it will if the west doesn't help Belarus because Belarus cannot fight huge Russia by itself.

Singidunum, I can't get why you, a citizen of Serbia, defend Lukashenko regime all the time? It is extremely funny to observe someone defending something which he doesn't realize in a proper way. The fact that you liked Belarus as a tourist doesn't mean that Belarus is a normal European state. For me as for a inhabitant of this country it looks just stupid when someone like you compares Belarus with UK or even with adjacent Lithuania or Poland without having any experience of living here.

Forseeing your possible response I would like to tell you that I have an experience of living in Western Europe so I have a possibility to compare.

Singidunum, I can't get why you, a citizen of Serbia, defend Lukashenko regime all the time? It is extremely funny to observe someone defending something which he doesn't realize in a proper way. The fact that you liked Belarus as a tourist doesn't mean that Belarus is a normal European state. For me as for a inhabitant of this country it looks just stupid when someone like you compares Belarus with UK or even with adjacent Lithuania or Poland without having any experience of living here.

Forseeing your possible response I would like to tell you that I have an experience of living in Western Europe so I have a possibility to compare.

I already said I am not defending his regime so I don't see the point of your post :dunno: Maybe you didn't read carefully. I specifically said that it's pathetic for the west to justify their own actions with similar actions of Lukashenko. If Lukashenko is mad why copy his actions? That's all. If both Belarus and UK charge each other with $120 for a visa why is Belarus mad and the UK is not. And why is Brazil not mad for doing the same thing as Belarus. And how could Japan, undoubtedly democratic first world country, find common language on visa issues with Belarus and the UK can't. Those are the things that bother me, and they have nothing to do with who is in power. Like I've said - finger pointing that the other side is guilty of something while you are doing the exact same thing is ridiculous. However the burden of sanity is on the EU, or at least it is supposed to be.

The only part when I was defending Belarus when compared to the UK are crime rates. You can't deny that there are no "no go" suburbs of Minsk where you would get stabbed etc. But this is not related to politics so I don't see how could you interpret it as such. I didn't compare it with Poland or Lithuania, I just said that while Belarus was a colony, the UK and Poland and Russia were colonizers hence their economic advantage that they would have even if Belarus was run by the most efficient and democratic Govt.

I did compare Belarus with Saudi Arabia though by asking why is the UK more concerned with dictatorship in Belarus which, while it definitely is one, is completely mild, if not even democratic, when compared to that same KSA, a country that the UK calls an ally and to whom they don't have anything to object regarding human rights despite the fact that people there get stoned or beheaded for things like infidelity. It's nice that they care about the state of democracy in Belarus but it's not nice that they ignore much much worse place at the same time. And it's not nice that they keep calling Belarus to join the west if they are going to leave it out in the open like they did with Ukraine.

All in all, criticizing mistakes of the EU doesn't mean being pro-Lukashenko (and while criticizing Lukashenko is futile, I hope the EU listens to critics). Or the life under Lukashenko has made you think like him, that critics = foreign funded supporters of the opposition? :)

As for me not having any idea what's it like - check my location.

Maybve it could be better if Belarus would fall nowadays than later. Earlier that lunatic Lukashenka will be kicked out. Nation must get an opportunity to create its own history and repleace primitive communitic economy to modern one. Today Russia keeps Belarus poor borrowing money to dictator but that situation would take place forever. Any day the history would say - this is day zero. It was once in Europe in several countries more than 20 years ago and Belarussians have the same rights to get rid of the sick man and his sick ideas.

Maybve it could be better if Belarus would fall nowadays than later.
I think it would be nice that Belarus live forever and never fall, and I think that we Belarusians should not listen to people who want Belarus to fall.:evil::evil::evil:

I think it would be nice that Belarus live forever and never fall, and I think that we Belarusians should not listen to people who want Belarus to fall.:evil::evil::evil:
Perhaps, marcin954 meant not Belarus falling, but Lukashenka's falling.

I hope that Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will be one country again soon.:)

I hope that Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will be one country again soon.:)

NEVER:bash:

I hope that Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will be one country again soon.:)

You wish that metropoly gets back its once occupated colonies, that now have independence? Why don't you wish Mexica gets back Texas? Why do you think that Belarusians and Ukranians want to unite with Russia, are you Russian living in America?

I hope that Russia, Ukraine and Belarus will be one country again soon.:)

It's ironic that your avatar is a flag of the State of Texas, which stands, or at least stood, for your state's independence, yet you wish others to be subjugated to renewed colonization against their will.

1)

http://www.russiablog.org/DontFeedtheTrolls.jpg

2)

He is not Texan but Croatian.