Nye Oslo Sentralstasjon (Oslo S)
Oslo - Norway

Space Group has won the invited competition for the redesign of the Oslo Central Station organised by the developer ROM Eiendom. The ambition
of the 2.9 billion Nkr project is to make the station become one of the most modern public transport hubs in Europe. The Oslo Central Station
project is led by Space Group partner Gro Bonesmo. The 80,000 sq m design includes station facilities, hotel, shopping, offices, conference,
restaurants and an event space.

Oslo Central Station once was the gate to the city from East. The situation with two polarising stations in Oslo is now history and Space Group's
strategy is a natural and delayed architectural response to this. The strong East – West axis has outplayed its role - and is replaced by a North-
South axis, from the forest to the fjord - from the inner city to Bjørvika and the new Opera House. The new station axis neutralises the old
stigmatised division between East and West.

Oslo Central Station belongs to the whole city. The grand move, gathering the station functions in a clear linear structure with a strong
architectural identity makes it visible in the cityscape with recognisable announcement of entrances from North, South and West. Whereas today
all types of shopping, station functions and circulation compete for space and dissolve without the experience of architectural definition – the
ambition is now to liberate and strengthen each individual architectural element with its dedicated functions and give them all a clear connection
to the station axis.

Construction will start in 2013 with an estimated completion date of 2018-2023.

COMPANIES: Space Group (http://www.spacegroup.no/index2.html) (architect) | ROM Eiendom (http://www.romeiendom.no/) (developer) | Luxigon (http://www.luxigon.com/) (visualizer) | Atkins (http://atkins.com/) (logistics)

http://i53.************/x26hbt.jpg

The project are been divided into three new buildings, Fjordporten which will be a 95m/23fl tall hotel, Krystallen a bigger office/public building
and Stasjonsalléen with is a 230m long terminal with a design inspired from traditional built Norwegian railroad bridges. Here you will see a few
renderings published in 2010 showing the latest version of the planned new station.

http://i55.************/10750d3.jpg

http://i51.************/2q8zudu.jpg

http://i55.************/wmf3b8.jpg

http://i53.************/2la6gas.jpg

http://i53.************/16aczg8.jpg

http://i52.************/aayr82.jpg

http://i54.************/2zsqnms.jpg

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Original proposal (2008)

Detailed information in Norwegian
The renderings and text in the detailed description below is taken from the original winning design from 2008. Parts of the project has changed a
lot since, so this information is outdated.

Fjordporten
Dagens flytogterminal som endestasjon vil miste sin rolle når alle flytogene skal gå videre mot Asker. Dette vil samtidig frigjøre et stort kommersielt
potensiale for denne tomten. Vi foreslår en høyere utnyttelse her med handelsareal i to etasjer i tilknytning til stasjonen, kote +5,0 og kote +9,0.
Over handelssenteret reises et kontorbygg med to slanke tårn – splittet av synsaksen fra Karl Johan. Det høyeste tårnet blir opptil 95m høyt med
23 etasjer.

Dette gir et nytt og synlig tyngdepunkt i stasjonsstrukturen mot syd - og blir en ny magnet og egen shoppingdestinasjon – som motsats til Byporten.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/fjordportennoisesmall1.jpg
Copyright@Luxigon

Nye Øvre Torg
I stedet for å strekke stasjonen ut i byen ønsker vi å dra byen inn mot stasjonen. Den tilreisende turist får et direkte møte med Øvre plass og byen
som gir en umiddelbar oversikt, letter orientering, sirkulasjon og gir en ny opplevelse av ankomst til Oslo. Trafikanten relokaliseres her.
Nivåforskjellen som følger jernbanesporenes tunnel, gir god sikt mot Domkirkespiret som orienteringspunkt, Europarådets plass og det nye
Jernbanetorget med viktige forbindelser til trikk og buss. Gatehandel under kontinuerlige baldakiner leder sirkulasjonen i begge retninger.
Jernbanegata, i dag en vareleveringsgate, åpnes opp og reetableres som gågate og den eldste stasjonsbygningen får igjen tilhørighet til
adkomstgaten med handel i 1. etasje. Varelevering til alle funksjoner konsentreres under bakken i en utbedret versjon av dagens løsning som vil
betjene hele området. Triangeltomten utenfor jernbanetunellen utnyttes for hotell som markerer en klar avgrensning av Jernbanetorget og som
samtidig inneholder publikumsfunksjoner som beriker stasjonens tilbud for den reisende og for byen.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/krystallenx1000.jpg

Stasjonsalléen
Stasjons Alleen muliggjør de andre prosjektene. Den forløser en stor grad av autonomi og fleksibilitet til de tilliggende eiendommer, både i form av
program og faseutbygning. Samtidig er dette grepet robust nok i seg selv til å overleve fremtidige endringer i stasjonens kapasitet og behov.
Konseptet for stasjonsfunksjonen og logistikken løses ’en gang for alle’ innenfor stasjonsaksen. Fremtidige tilføyelser eller fjerninger av tilliggende
strukturer vil være underordnet og uten betydning for den nødvendige kontinuerlige drift av stasjonen.

I spennet mellom syd og nord dekkes alle stasjonsfunksjoner internt. Stasjonen blir igjen markant i bybildet med en tydelig arkitektonisk identitet og
geometrisk klarhet og definerer plasser og innganger på alle sider. Grepet forutsetter en skjæring av Østbane hallen tilbake til den opprinnelige
symmetriske struktur - der det nyere påbygget er fjernet for å gi en optimal løsning bymessig og internt. Vi mener dette skaper den beste løsningen i
det store perspektivet, men har også illustrert alternative løsninger som kan bli aktuelle i en vernediskusjon. Kote 9 er ikke lenger enerådende, men
stasjonsgulvet legges som en bred paradegate som deltar i byens sirkulasjon ved å være ’soft’ i snittet – den tilpasser seg den tilliggende kontekst og
gir myke overganger inn i stasjonen.

Mot syd strekker den seg ut mot fjorden og operaen via det planlagte vannspeilet – og avgrenser samtidig Christian Fredrik plass. Områder for taxi og
parkering defineres med sjenerøse inngangspartier.

Mot nord åpnes dagens flaskehals opp og stasjonsgulvet senkes ned mot gatenivå og introduserer nytt inngangsparti og aktivisering av gatelivet i
Schweigaardsgate. Mot vest legges bredsiden mot nytt adkomsttorg som faller jevnt ned mot Europarådets plass med i siktlinjen mot Domkirken.

Inne i stasjonen er det en enkel orienterbarhet uten retningsendringer for den reisende fra toget og inn i stasjonsområdet og videre ut i byen. De
dynamiske stålbuene i taket leder den reisende både i lengderetningen og på tvers gjennom bygget - gjennom et lyst og spektakulært rom med en unik
utsikt som velkomst til byen. Det har vært en viktig prioritet å få åpnet opp for en visuell forbindelse mellom stasjon og plattformer ved at fotavtrykket
på AV bygget er redusert til et minimum – som nå i stedet bidrar ved en klar grafisk utforming å lede den reisende ned til riktig perrong. Tavler og
billettkjøp er ellers distribuert i stasjonshallen slik at man hindrer oppsamling av reisende på kritiske punkter med kryssende trafikk.

Øvre nivåer av stasjonen er benyttet som kontor og konferanse senter. Mot syd er det en konsentrasjon av publikumstilbud som restaurant, skybar og
park på taket med optimal utsikt mot byen og fjorden. Med klare referanser til historiske stasjonsstrukturer er konstruksjonssystemet basert på en ny
fortolkning av en buekonstruksjon i stål. Buenes spenn varierer med de tilgjengelige fundamenteringspunkter – der skilleveggene i jernbanetunellen gir
de lengste spenn. Konstruksjonen er underdelt med diagonale buestrukturer i begge retninger for jevn fordeling av laster.

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/fjordportennoisesmall2.jpg
Copyright@Luxigon

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/stasjonsalleensmall1.jpg
Copyright@Luxigon

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Skyscrapercity/AAAAA1100.jpg

WHY WOULD THEY WAIT UNTIL 2013 TO START?

They have justed released the idea. Before they can start building, they will need new regulations for the area, and many other approvals. Were talking many years of political process here. But I'm keeping my fingers crossed!

Is this the building who will be 130m high or is that a other building?

Edit: no its not (checked)

Very cool proposal!

Is this the building who will be 130m high or is that a other building?

Edit: no its not (checked)

Right, its the other building situated next to Postgirobygget. That one has not a thread yet, since its in a even earlier stange than this one. This hotel will be between 70m and 90m tall.

WHY WOULD THEY WAIT UNTIL 2013 TO START?
It's Norway ;) We cherish our bureucracy like we do viking helmets. Or olympic gold medals. Or high prices.

It's not just the approval, lot of work has to be done in planning the construction for such a large project, remember that it is Norways busiest trafik-hub, and it can not close down during construction.. =)

edit

A couple of renderings (or just 3D models) of the future Oslo S area in the Oslo Nå magazine for this month (october 09). It's the same proposal as before, only this shows one very tall tower instead of two medium tall ones. The text doesn't say more about it than: "Her er forslag til ny stasjon supplert med et høyt tårn".

http://www.oslo.kommune.no/getfile.php/oslo%20kommune%20(OSLO)/Internett%20(OSLO)/Dokumenter/Oslon%C3%A5/oslonaa_05_09.pdf

Krystallklar is also in the model. Think of this 5 high rise cluster (and the roof):
http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k439/marshol/OsloS4.jpg?t=1255888614

http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k439/marshol/OsloS3.jpg?t=1255888744

This is the possible Oslo 2060 scenario from the charette in august, still just one tall tower :D
http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k439/marshol/OsloS5.jpg?t=1255888761

Not much fantasy put into that tower, but it looks ~150-160 metres tall...

Great! If you ask me I say the tower is 200-220 m!!! :cheers:

Twice as tall as Posthuset? Maybe you're right. It certainly looks like that in at least of the renders.

Well, it's hard to say really. The drawing is weird, but this will probably never happen anyway, so... right now I think I'll go back to my TV and the Brann-VIF match.. :)

That tower would really make the skyline awesome. :applause:

Why isn't this thread named OSLO | Fjordporten | 23fl | Pro ? That's it's official name anyway...

The ~200 m scraper was part of the Portal/Snøhetta vision for the area around Oslo S back in the days of the charette we all remember. As mentioned earlier, Fjordporten may get the tallest part heightened to make the lower part lower. This project probably shows how it would be if all the squaremeters were put in one single thin tower. Can't say I don't like it, but of course, we need a real design before we make our final judgement, or...?

As a reminder:
This link (http://arkitektnytt.no/page/page/preview/10831/news-4-3194.html) from Arkitektnytt gives an impression from the charett. According to original schedule, we will have a plan for the Oslo S area out on hearing in Nov/Dec, as I remember...

Yes, it looks about 200 m tall. I'm more positive to one single tower than two lower ones. But of course nothing is decided yet.

Oo0oo00ooOoooOOOo00ooOOo0O0o.... me likey the thought! :happy:

By the way - the article (or more spesifically the article preceding that one in OsloNå) says "Forslag til arkitekturpolitikk ligger ut til høring med frist 18. oktober 2009." - the deadline for comments on the proposed new official architecture policy was/is today. Did anyone in YIMBY have the presence of mind to give a statement?

Well, it's hard to say really. The drawing is weird, but this will probably never happen anyway, so... right now I think I'll go back to my TV and the Brann-VIF match.. :)

i saw brann stadion was lit up from fjellveien :) it looked really cool!!

lets not talk about the results of the game, though..

just kidding! i really couldnt care less, anyway!! :lol:

but yeah, the lights from the stadium were incredibly strong...

Oo0oo00ooOoooOOOo00ooOOo0O0o.... me likey the thought! :happy:

By the way - the article (or more spesifically the article preceding that one in OsloNå) says "Forslag til arkitekturpolitikk ligger ut til høring med frist 18. oktober 2009." - the deadline for comments on the proposed new official architecture policy was/is today. Did anyone in YIMBY have the presence of mind to give a statement?

Well, yes we did actually. You should follow us on Yimby.no:):cheers:

One single tower would be awesome of course, though thats not going to happend.

With the current twin, with the lowest tower lowered and the highest section taller we will probably see Fjordporten almost as tall as Posthuset. :)

And we will have 4 towers at exactly the same height... Brussels all over again.... :ohno: Hopefully Skylinestudies will force them to make more variations with the new areaplan :)


http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k439/marshol/OsloS3.jpg?t=1255888744

I like this idea a lot, this is imo. one of the best locations for a real skyscraper giving us a cooler looking skyline looking from south/north direction, marking the ending point of Karl Johan aswell as the superterminal, balancing the skyline in East/West would be simple by replacing Hotell Opera and Oslo Atrium by highrises (Might also be needed to finance the superterminal.) :)... When they did the presentation Planningdirector De Vibe just laughed at it tough.

Did she laugh at the tower, or the idea of adding floors to Hotell Opera and Atrium? Or did she laugh at the hole plan??? Damn, why do we have to struggle with these politicians..:bash:

She laughed at the idea that someone had made plans for buildings dwarfing Plaza and PGB. Not very weird, considering some of the plans through the years in Oslo, but lets wait and see what the Oslo S plan figures out.

Well, I'm not surprised that city planning is just a big joke to her..:D Who is she to laugh at ideas that works fine in most parts of the world? :ohno:

I guess we just have to wait and see what happends here, but I cant help feeling some growing irritation!

^^ mhm, agree. It's a perfect thing - a signal tower at the best possible location. Nothing to laugh about.

She sounds arrogant:ohno:

A so thin building would be perfect there, but 200 metres would be too good to be true, I bet the max height will be 150 metres...

Thumbs up for a taller one, suport to Ingenioren idea. But it will look a bit out of place from east/west, so they should do something about Atrium and Hotel Opera. A good idea would be to tear them down and do a continuation of Barcode!

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten2c.jpg

:cool:

Nice work! That would have been amazing. You should send it to the city council. I can't really see a negative side with such a project.

Hmm, that was pure magic. Maybe one day.. ;)

http://bildr.no/thumb/510224.jpeg (http://bildr.no/view/510224) (clicky)

different angel... Yes Im a beginner ;) Difficult to intigrate a lightning building in a photo with daylight...

Thumbs up for a taller one, suport to Ingenioren idea. But it will look a bit out of place from east/west, so they should do something about Atrium and Hotel Opera. A good idea would be to tear them down and do a continuation of Barcode!

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten2c.jpg

:cool:

:drool: Fantastic … A wet dream I fear never will come true. Imagine the Norwegian mind set vs. the awesomeness of that picture. You do the math.

Anyway, one can always hope. There are a lot of good arguments for building a sleek, tall tower in that location. When it comes to Atrium and Hotel Opera, I would rather see some sleek towers added between them/in the back/or to the right, than to see them torn down.

Btw, did you copy that tower from a Bangkok project?

Would be great if you could make a version with the rest of barcode, also.

:drool: Fantastic … A wet dream I fear never will come true. Imagine the Norwegian mind set vs. the awesomeness of that picture. You do the math.

Anyway, one can always hope. There are a lot of good arguments for building a sleek, tall tower in that location. When it comes to Atrium and Hotel Opera, I would rather see some sleek towers added between them/in the back/or to the right, than to see them torn down.

Btw, did you copy that tower from a Bangkok project?

Would be great if you could make a version with the rest of barcode, also.

how on earth did you do that? me wanna makey.

just think how cool it would look like. and so very fitting as well. they will never ever tear down buildings that are 10 years old and "new". yes, they were a mistake in the first place. but to rectify i think we need to go higher right next to Oslo Atrium and perhaps one or two thin tall ones in the back as well. and eventually, sooner rather than later, a new bus terminal on the top of train station. but from the bridge and in towards.

wouldnt it be great if they just started by taking two or three tracks underground that are nearest barcode and behind of hotel opera and oslo atrium. this alone would open up for a hole lot of beautiful new tall buildings.

how on earth did you do that?

A couple of minutes on Photoshop ;)

Btw, did you copy that tower from a Bangkok project?

Would be great if you could make a version with the rest of barcode, also.

yeah its about 200m from the 313m tall MahaNakhon in Bangkok. Its design fits Oslo since its squarish (and awesome!), a good exemple for a taller tower in Oslo.

Completing Barcode is what i had in mind too, but that is quite a big task when i have to more or less draw them up from start from that angle and at night! Did a try with Isfjellet, transforming the renderings i got of it to fit the perspective of the image, it works out fine, but making it a night picture is hard since the picture is so small.

Thumbs up for a taller one, suport to Ingenioren idea. But it will look a bit out of place from east/west, so they should do something about Atrium and Hotel Opera. A good idea would be to tear them down and do a continuation of Barcode!

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten2c.jpg

:cool:


PERFECT :)

nice job, trondheimer.

if this was to ever become real, then that would be freaking amazing..

it looks kinda weird an unbalanced when its far apart from all the other ones, instead of being in the middle of the cluster, though. maybe we should build some more highrises on the other side of it ;)

Forgive me for being a bit NIMBY here, but isn't that a bit too tall yet? I just think Oslo first needs more buildings at 20, 30 and 15 floors, to make a good balanced skyline. and THEN top that off with really cool stuff at 40-50 floors with spires and crap:p

^^ don't think its that bad doing it the other way around really.

Oslo S will go before anything happends to the plots on the tracks, maybe it will look like this 5 years later?
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten3a.jpg

hahah.. thats even better :)

add the barcode buildings and oslo will have one of the meanest skylines in all of europe!

^^ don't think its that bad doing it the other way around really.

Oslo S will go before anything happends to the plots on the tracks, maybe it will look like this 5 years later?
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten3a.jpg

Now we're talking ... this is starting to look much better. The proportions between the buildings are much more pronounced... me like it:nuts:

See, now that is what i'm talking about, more infill of nice looking and unique buildings!:banana:

^^ don't think its that bad doing it the other way around really.

Oslo S will go before anything happends to the plots on the tracks, maybe it will look like this 5 years later?
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten3a.jpg

I really like this render, as well as the MahaNakhon building which is one of my favorites, I have to say that the second one from the left also fits Oslos futuristic skyline quite good. Would it be one of the new WTC buildings in New York that you got this idea from?

^^ i like your username! :okay: (and welcome to the forums)

Yes, small bits are taken from the new WTC to make all the three buildings infront of Posthuset. :)

If they ever build anything like this though...NIMBYists..

What i don't get though, why bother opposing highrises in this spot, when this place is already "ruined" by them, not like it will make any difference...:ohno:

Maybe someone somewhere will lose their view towards Ekebergåsen. That would be good enough reason to oppose anything with a passion in Oslo:nuts:

It's a damn hill, a hill, seriously, are some people really that stupid that they are willing to sacrify the development and future of a great city. Just for some views at a pretty generic hill that barely really stands out? God, i just can't beleive NIMBY people and their utter mindless, and selfish stupidity...

I have been in Oslo before, and yes Ekeberg is very nice looking, but it's not exactly that good that they need to prevent blocking the views of it from some angles... Same goes for the fjord. if the NIMBYists want to enjoy the fjord then they can just get the hell out of their appartments and just go over to the waterfront already :|

Imagine if people were like this in New York, "Oh no, we can't build highrises because it blocks views to the Hudson River, whatever will we do, oh we are doomed if we can't see the river! It's the end of the world!"

Well, if a skyscraper like that could stop some of those awful oversized suburban office projects that seem to be popping up everywhere today then I'm all for it.

That's a very cool picture too, nice. :)

Fitting into this debate is the current issue of ”Næringseiendom”. The front cover states; Build high by Oslo S: -Good for the environment, -Good for the employees, -Smart economy. Inside they have three texts dedicated too the issue, and they are all positive with a lot of good arguments. Erling Dokk Holm is the writer of one of these texts, and while he is generally positive to building high, he has, in my opinion, some weird views about central business districts. He states; “Central Business Districts er uten unntak begredelige steder. Jeg har ikke vært overalt i verden, og kanskje fines det et superkoslig CBD ett eller annet sted, men jeg har enda tilgode å oppleve et slikt bymiljø som appelerende.”.

Do really every city district have to be “koslig”? To me there is a quite different appeal with the CBDs.

Anyway, interesting issue, so pick it up if you have the chance.

I agree with Dokk Holm here. Areas only occupied by offices aren't part of the living city. Office areas must be complemented by shopping, restaurants and culture to be well functioning parts of the city.

Aker Brygge is the CBD of the nineties with companies as Sparebanken NOR and Storebrand, and it has some great qualities of "cosyness" in spite of this...

I agree with Dokk Holm here. Areas only occupied by offices aren't part of the living city. Office areas must be complemented by shopping, restaurants and culture to be well functioning parts of the city.

That’s true – and it might be what Dokk Holm means, but he claims that CBDs are never an appealing place. Off course there is the problem with definitions, but from a broad sense, downtown NY, HK and so on could be classified as those city’s CBDs. On the other hand an isolated business district with street life only during business hours and a cold and hostile environment for normal pedestrians is not a very appealing city environment – at least on street level (it still contributes to the city in terms of visual impact, landmarks etc.). As he points out, though, Bjørvika is on the right track to a living cityscape with a lot of residential development and focus on pedestrians, meeting places, and offerings.

But I do like a different feel in different districts of the city – and that’s my main point – all districts don’t have to be “koslig”. Personally I find appeal in the cold, professional, imposing environments some of the CBDs represent.

Aker Brygge is the CBD of the nineties with companies as Sparebanken NOR and Storebrand, and it has some great qualities of "cosyness" in spite of this...

Agree, altough sun is important to making an area cosy aswell as mixed use - space between the towers themselves can provide sunlight, but senseless open spaces at streetlevel makes the place desolate, cute streets and squares like Aker-brygge with open 1st floors does the trick..

Large renderings|

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/fjordportennoiseMedium.jpg

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/aerialmedium.jpg

^^But they don't show the final design;)

^^ of course not, but its the best we got/the only good renderings we got! :P

Large renderings|

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Architecture/aerialmedium.jpg

Hm, are they planning to build a roof over the tracks between the station and the bridge? Very cool if that is the case. It's not easy to see what kind of material that is ... anyone knows more about this?

^^ i think its just one of many different ideas of what to do with the tracks. So what you see there is more like a vision i guess?

^^ Oh, I was hoping it was part of the winning proposal.

http://media.aftenposten.no/archive/01095/Christian_Frederik_1095030x.jpg

Rather see this one again :)

Aswell as this one (Old!):

http://i289.photobucket.com/albums/ll218/Ingenioren/ssc-tegninger/Bearbeidetoslos.jpg

Preliminary Oslo S plan allows for a 80 meter and a 42 meter tower to be built in this location. 35 % off the squaremeters are supposed to be appartments, and these are to be located in top of the building.

Everybody, everybody!
Årsmøte YIMBY (http://www.yimby.no/forum/thread.aspx?id=51)
(with discussion about Oslo S Områdeplan)

Please reply, if you are not there and live in Oslo/Norway/or is connected, register ASAP!

Time to revive this thread.

My suggestion is a name change and concept change. This thread should be a thread for the "Nye Oslo Sentralstasjon"-project as a whole, since Fjordporten doesn't exist without it. All discussions about Nye Oslo S should then be kept here, as Tjuvholmen and Sørenga threads. ("Krystallen"-thread (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=708182) should of course be closed)

With the re-launch comes this bunch of new renders from ROM eiendom:

Overview from north-west. Roof will be walkable and covered with grass.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS.jpg

Krystallen replaces Øvre Torg, as here seen from Europarådets plass. Integration with Jernbanetorget kollektivknutepunkt will be greatly improved when removing the height difference barrier.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS2.jpg

Station entrance as seen from Oslo Plaza. Station entrance though here appearing open, will be covered by a glass wall. Will be interesting to see how this works IRL.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS3.jpg

Opposite direction. Moving pedestrian axises down to road level is important to livin' up this hood!
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS4.jpg

South entrance from Christian Fredriks plass (this render is old, though)
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS5.jpg

Inside the main train hall.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS6.jpg

Looking out the west entrance (current main entrance). Two new roads will lead you out from this entrance: Left one is a reopened Jernbanegata(?) and right one is a new one, including new opened southern facade of Byporten.
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/OsloS7.jpg


So mail a mod with a name-change then, or do people disagree?

Kinda awesome, reminds me of ancient churches actually. :) The Cathedral of Mass Transit, if you will. :P

I have to say I really like this proposal! Remember the PBE didn't were to found of it(or, at least the people from PBE working with the Oslo S area), but I think that mostly was because they want all to fit in to the overall plan.

I like the new axis, which is much needed instead of the chaos today. Also that you enter to the street(Schweig.) and not directrly into Oslo City(!), which is insane. To bad parts of the axsis is indoor, maybe resulting in a nighttime closure?

My suggestion is a name change and concept change. This thread should be a thread for the "Nye Oslo Sentralstasjon"-project as a whole, since Fjordporten doesn't exist without it. All discussions about Nye Oslo S should then be kept here, as Tjuvholmen and Sørenga threads. ("Krystallen"-thread (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=708182) should of course be closed)

Hear, hear

So mail a mod with a name-change then, or do people disagree?

I agree

@ Icecheese, done (swede fixed the title).

Im updating the first page with new info, but awaits updating the renderings to i get proper renderings of the newer design.

Freaking call ROM eiendom then, if it's that important!:D

^^ actually i've sent them an e-mail, to space group as well! :D

If i don't get any reply i will update the first thread with the renderings on ROM Eiedoms page.

To bad parts of the axsis is indoor, maybe resulting in a nighttime closure?

You think so? Does Oslo S close at night the way it is now?

^^Yes:lol: Or else all the bums would sleep there at night. I think it's closed from ~2:15 til around 4:30, or something...

I think it's closed from ~2:15 til around 4:30, or something...

Take that you evil bums!!!

yeah, it closes during the night.

sucks as itd be nice to be able to sleep on a bench there after having attended a concert :p

whats the deal with homeless people even existing in norway, though? i mean, do they rent out the apartments theyre given by the state, in order to buy drugs? seriously, its pretty hard to get my head around.

^^They don't get to sleep when the station is open either. If you fall asleep at the station at evenings, the guards are pretty quick to wake you up, and chase away people that don't have any business there.

yeah, it closes during the night.

sucks as itd be nice to be able to sleep on a bench there after having attended a concert :p

whats the deal with homeless people even existing in norway, though? i mean, do they rent out the apartments theyre given by the state, in order to buy drugs? seriously, its pretty hard to get my head around.

Many drugusers have to get to Oslo to get ths stuff they need, while actually belonging to an other city. Oslo doesn't have the capacity or funds to offer all these people coming from different parts of the country, a shelter or help. So the alternative for drugusers is to either commute to Oslo, or stay there in periods, pastly living outside and begging.

Many drugusers have to get to Oslo to get ths stuff they need, while actually belonging to an other city. Oslo doesn't have the capacity or funds to offer all these people coming from different parts of the country, a shelter or help. So the alternative for drugusers is to either commute to Oslo, or stay there in periods, pastly living outside and begging.

Or give them a prescription @ the farmacy so they don't need to flock into the city to buy it illegally... :ohno:

Anyway..
I can't see this project getting started b4 they decide on a masterplan for the next 50 years.. New tunnels staitons etc. C'mon let's get busy..!!

Go rail!

Tell me about it, a friend of mine's mom just went to Oslo a merely a week ago, just to get some drugs, poor girl's devastated. :ohno:

Tell me about it, a friend of mine's mom just went to Oslo a merely a week ago, just to get some drugs, poor girl's devastated. :ohno:

thats horrible.

we really should have a nulltolleranse for druguse and drugdealing.. the way it is now people are dealing while the police officers are looking the other way pretending not to know whats going on right behind their backs.

my friend was just in oslo and she said that she was offered drugs twice while walking from oslo s to karl johan.. in bergen, the area around nygård is pretty bad as well.

thats horrible.

we really should have a nulltolleranse for druguse and drugdealing.. the way it is now people are dealing while the police officers are looking the other way pretending not to know whats going on right behind their backs.

my friend was just in oslo and she said that she was offered drugs twice while walking from oslo s to karl johan.. in bergen, the area around nygård is pretty bad as well.
Oslo is the overdose capital of the world, and, sadly, has been for a long time. Most countries (including our own) try to solve that by adopting harsh policies with long prison sentences, and nobody can say it has been a successful fight. You want to prescribe more of a medicine that isn't working? Most of the "drug dealers" on Karl Johan and in Sentrum are just selling weed. I can't say I support neglecting other, more imporant part of police work, just to pursue some symbolic fight against a drug that is no more harmful than alcohol.

If they want to fight drugs, fight the REAL drugs (meth, heroine, etc.) and do it PROPERLY. But they aren't sold so openly on Karl Johan. And yes, that might include not only turning a blind eye on, but even working with, those who sell softer drugs. Might not sound good for politicians, but it can still be the reality.

I believe the ultimate measure of a police force being successful is citizens feeling safe. I feel perfectly safe walking in Sentrum (all the while being approached by Africans (yes, they all seem to be African nowdays) who are smiling and wants to be my friend) until about 03.30 - 04.00, when all bars have closed and nobody except gangs are left in the streets.

Oslo is the overdose capital of the world, and, sadly, has been for a long time. Most countries (including our own) try to solve that by adopting harsh policies with long prison sentences, and nobody can say it has been a successful fight.

(Off topic)
To say that Norway is trying to solve the drug problems by applying harsh policies with long prison sentences is incorrect. Drug trading is done openly in the center of our capital and if the police makes the odd arrest, the offender is back on the street the next day.

Our drug policy is an utter failure, but harsh restrictions and penalites has not been used for a long long time and is thus not to blame.

(Off topic)
To say that Norway is trying to solve the drug problems by applying harsh policies with long prison sentences is incorrect. Drug trading is done openly in the center of our capital and if the police makes the odd arrest, the offender is back on the street the next day.

Our drug policy is an utter failure, but harsh restrictions and penalites has not been used for a long long time and is thus not to blame.
(still off topic, but just to reply)
That's where I disagree. The punishments for drug related crimes in Norway are on par with molestation of kids, torture, slavery and murder: the maximal punishment ("strafferammen") is 21 years, and has been since 1984. The more recent practice of "letting small fish go" is in response to the utter lack of success this harsh policy had in the 80s and 90s.

What a cool entrance to the station. Like a gothic church. Really cool

Områdeprogram reworked:
http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=2644753

Highrises lowered to 90m and 70m...:cry:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omrdeprogram.jpg

Ekeberg:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omr1.jpg

Langkaia:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omr2.jpg

Royal castle:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omr3.jpg

Egeertorget:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omr4.jpg

All inncomming statements:
http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=2646768

Rom has some interesting stuff in their appendix:
http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Fjordport1.jpg

http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Fjordport2.jpg
I guess politicians will realize that this follows the intentions of the plan very well. No need to lower it to 70 meters.

http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Fjordport3.jpg

Summing them up:
http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=2646769


Yimby Norge, 28.08.2010 52
Yimby Norge går imot tunnelforslag, øking av kollektivframkommeligheten må prioriteres og
viser til utviklingen av Carl Berners plass.
Yimby Norge peker på at plassering av bussterminal har betydning for om trikketrasé kan
beholdes i Schweigaards gate.
Yimby Norge ser det som betenkelig at områdeprogrammet legges ut til høring før Ruters
utredning om bussterminalplassering er offentliggjort og ser for seg bussterminal plassert
under Christian Frederiks plass.
Yimby Norge ser positivt på innføring av boliger og gjenåpning av Akerselva,
Yimby Norge vil avvente Jernbaneverkets kapasitetsutredning før løsning velges, men peker
på senking av hele sporområdet som gir mulighet til ny byutvikling og bedre integrering av
mot nord og sør.
Yimby Norge tar til orde for kreativ høyhusutforming som kontrasterer den historiske byen og
at området får romme detaljhandel som utfordrer perifere kjøpesentre med nye handlegater,
samtidig som god lyssetting understrekes som viktig.


Short seminar about Østre Tangent and lowering Nylands bridge:
http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=2646770

So that means the death of Krystallklar, then?

Btw; why do they insist on having a height limit on those two? They will be subject to individual scrutiny on the political level anyway; but still they want some excuse for more beaurocratic red tape. Norwegians.....

And one more thing: how the hell do they picture anyone wanting to invest in an overbuilt area with just 30m buildings?

So that means the death of Krystallklar, then?

I would've thought that was very weird. It's strong forces wanting to build here, and Brevpostterminalen is going anyways. What I think, is that they will heighten the two lower towers to keep the same sqm. A more boring building, but it satisfy the politicians fright of heights.

And one more thing: how the hell do they picture anyone wanting to invest in an overbuilt area with just 30m buildings?
The ground beneath are supposedly making it limited for how tall you can build there.

^^ and they din't know about it when they built Posthuset and SAS Plaza?

Its not the ground itselfs (was a bit dim there), but the fact that there will be running train in tunnels under the lock makes it limited how much this pilars can hold since they need to be placed between the jungle of tracks.

Still no excuse for heightlimits on plots that have little to do with the track-area, such as Krystallklar or Clarion Hotel.

Its not the ground itselfs (was a bit dim there), but the fact that there will be running train in tunnels under the lock makes it limited how much this pilars can hold since they need to be placed between the jungle of tracks.

And that's why YIMBY suggests digging down the tracks, while at the same time constructing a new fundament that can withhold taller buildings/higher density.:D

^^ exactly. Hopefully they will decide on that before they build Fjordporten/Krystallklar so that they can be taller!

Started a thread in the World Development News Forums > General Urban Developments

LINK ~ OSLO | New Oslo Central Station (http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1136925)

Lets see if it impresses the world.

Seems the general reception so far is positive :)

Still no excuse for heightlimits on plots that have little to do with the track-area, such as Krystallklar or Clarion Hotel.

True - this is truly depressing. Looking at the volume study of the Brevsenter plot, it does not at all look like the focal point I was hoping it would become. :ohno:

So - do you think they will redesign the Krystallklar plans, or start all over again with the new limitations?

I think ROM/KlpE will keep their current proposals off 116 and 95 meters (+ 3 lower towers.) for political process. Remember that there is very often a conflict between PBEs recommendations and City councils ruling. As you may remember, Clarion has submitted their 60 meter proposal way after they knew PBE recommended 42 meters for that plot :)

Its not the ground itselfs (was a bit dim there), but the fact that there will be running train in tunnels under the lock makes it limited how much this pilars can hold since they need to be placed between the jungle of tracks.

Have you ever been to Manhattan? They certainly made it work there, and I don't think any city has a more jungly underground that New York. I've heard the geology argument before though, but I have no idea if it's true or not. Are there any geologists here?

^^

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the New York subway mainly run under the streets and avenues, not the buildings?

^^

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the New York subway mainly run under the streets and avenues, not the buildings?

this is the impression that ive gotten the times ive been there..

while walking in the streets you always hear the subway right beneath the ground.

It's doable, it's just more expensive.... That is why the Proposed Hotel is split into 2 towers. Simply to make way for an easier build if this would be chosen as a subway corridor.

^^

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the New York subway mainly run under the streets and avenues, not the buildings?

I think so too, but with a few exceptions.

^^

Correct me if I'm wrong but doesn't the New York subway mainly run under the streets and avenues, not the buildings?

I don't know if we're talking about the Krystallklar site in particular or downtown Oslo in general, but in the latter case underground tunnels are no excuse for not building tall buildings.

It's about the room over the tracks of Oslo S where there has been serious questions asked about the possibility of building anything at all, but it seems to be getting some clear answers and they are positive. Krystallklar is only halted by the bus-terminal location. There is certainly not the ground that is preventing Oslo from getting Skyscrapers or highrises in general, that is just politics.

A bit old, but there are some cool new renders in there aswell as some shots of the model:
http://www1.nrk.no/nett-tv/indeks/214043

This poster was located at Roms stand today, with Klpe towers at a great height, estimates? 140 m? :)
http://i584.photobucket.com/albums/ss282/Ingenioren3/aug10/DSC00706.jpg

(Yeah i know we've seen it before.)

Every time I see a new post on a cool project I get fears its bad news. Not so this time around. *phew* :)

PS I fucking hate having <page back> keys next to the arrow keyes.

Oslo Congress centre

Venstre, the marginal but strategicly placed political party is poking around the city council with a proposal that Oslo needs a new large congress-centre simular to those our Scandinavian sister-cities have managed to build. Rom naturally has the solution in this project and hopes for a speedy process, with a clear political majority in support of the plan (H & Frp is pretty much given.) one can hope it will not stay in the "Pro" section for the next 10 years.
http://ne.no/34853

In relation Oslo S is clearly the "new" cbd of Oslo with easily rentable space even during tough times, the area is now full and quickly running out of squaremeters to fill it's demand, strangely enough there doesn't seem to be anyone knowing or daring to guess how long the projects will be stalled due to indecission from the city and infrastructure departments:
http://ne.no/34842/Fullt%20rundt%20Oslo%20S

^^Read the story about increased interest for Kvadraturen too. Downtown may get a boost, as we see in Stockholm. Maybe we can convince the politicians to allow more floors in old quarters, increasing the density of Kvadraturen, and a pocibility for a subway line in the north-south direction:)

And Tampere is building this above their train-tracks >> Urbika (http://urbika.com/projects/view/4114-tampere-central-deck).

http://i56.************/kcibtt.jpg

holy crap, thats awesome.. congratulations to tampere!

Masturbation time!

http://i54.************/2jfj30n.jpg

http://i56.************/jqs09w.jpg

http://i55.************/2z6tstu.jpg

http://i51.************/2jaykjr.jpg

http://i56.************/29idq9.jpg

http://i53.************/315eq1f.jpg

http://i56.************/1442ywg.jpg

Praise Luxigon (http://luxigon.fr/) and Space Group (http://www.spacegroup.no/)! :master:

http://i54.************/10z0h0l.jpg

huh?


Nevermind, nothing loaded at first. but yes... this IS fap worthy...

amazing!! im whipping out mine as well.. :lol:

but really, with projects like these the city centre of oslo is turning into urban eye candy! it will definitely be the most modern scandinavian capital by far within a decades time :)

that night photo is just incredible..

Masturbation time!

http://i54.************/2jfj30n.jpg


I don't know how long I have waited for a highrise at Gunerius parking. This render adds more hope to that :cheers:!

And what kind of park do we see at the waterside of Børsen? Some strange colours..

looks like a minigolf-course :D

Masturbation time!

If they had added Krystallklar to the night photo, it would be a complete orgasm.

And i almost forgot, a video of Oslo S.

16842410

^^It's the same video that's looping on the screens on the actual station. Now, if they'd only start constructing!:D

to be honest, i think they should keep the tracks, it makes an an awesome contrast between the tracks, and having skyscrapers around as you enter the city. :cheers:

to be honest, i think they should keep the tracks, it makes an an awesome contrast between the tracks, and having skyscrapers around as you enter the city. :cheers:The tracks are horrible. :nuts: Using them as a passenger every day, it's actually one of the things I hate the most about Oslo, visually.

This new development will be stunning if completed, however all these lovely new buildings and the atmosphere that they are intended to create will be completely fucked it if the authorities continue to allow the prostitutes, beggars, druggies and drug dealers to infest the area, this is Oslo's front door, most people arriving in the city end up around this area either by train from Gardermoen or other cities in Norway or via the ferry's, this is the part of town where Olso is supposed to make a lasting impression, at the moment it's not a very good one, especially since you have to see it all over again when you leave.

^^
I do agree, but I think they will eventually solve at least most of this problem, if not for other reasons, then because they have just made this area one of the most heavily invested-in city areas of all of Norway.

Btw, compared to when I was a kid, you see considerably less druggies/heavy drinkers walking around in more or less all other parts of town than Jernbanetorget and Oslo S. It's just a meeting place for them, at that spot in Jernbanetorget. From my impression, it looks like quite a lot of druggies have either went into rehab and is now trying to live normally, or they've died. I think there's less "street druggies" now than in the 90s really. At least VISIBLE ones.

Of course there has been some considerable recruitment of new ones, though. For one thing, it's a very noticeable increase in immigrant druggies (and not least dealers).

But I still feel the problem is a bit better compared to a couple years ago (and about 16-17 years ago), in all areas EXCEPT Oslo S/Jernbanetorget. It's just that they gather together at that square, making the impression stronger.

to be honest, i think they should keep the tracks, it makes an an awesome contrast between the tracks, and having skyscrapers around as you enter the city. :cheers:

i agree, but the potential area for development covering the tracks is huge.

but, yes, lots of shiny new buildings making a great corridor into the city.

http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv353/Ingenioren2/190510/Omrdeprogram.jpg

Was thinking about this Krystallen building, at first when Spacegroups concept was chosen it was tought to be to tall for such a location, but looking at the "Områdeprogram" it clearly allows for 42m here. Now i would like to see Krystallen resurrected with it's intended height (Or atleast 42m) once a new planitiativ is published. What do you think? :)

^^It may be some sort of compromise too. Krystallen as in Space Group's drawings, uses a lot of Jernbanetorget, while in the områdeprogram, they've excluded Jernbanetorget to it's current boundries.

The triangle of buildings which will be Plaza - Posthuset - Krystallklar, combined with Fjordporten next to the triangle, will be a beatiful formation of buildings that really is going to define Oslo's skyline. Way to go :) How sure are we this will actually be 95m though?

We're not sure at all. PBE recommends lowering it to 70m+42m... :bash: But for now only Venstre has (not surpricingly) expressed their negative position on the current highrise proposals.

Figures...

Venstre is such a bunch of dishonest rats. "miljøparti" my ass! The country's biggest hub for public transportation is not a place for density. Nowhere else, for that matter, can be higher than four (4!!!) floors. So, clearly, if we can't build up, we must build out, right? Right?!? But wait:
"Venstre vil:
- sikre at markagrensa ligger fast.
- verne grøntarealer, inkludert hele Husebyskogen ved Makrellbekken-Huseby, og sørge for bedre forbindelser mellom de grønne områdene.
- etablere et helhetlig verneområde (bynasjonoalpark) med Maridalen, Akerselva miljøpark, Bygdøy, Hovedøya, Ekebergskrenten og Østensjøvannet." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2100)

So, we can't build up and we can't build out. All in the name of the environment, of course. So where can we build? Can we at least replace single homes with four *sssss* story blocks? Let's see:
"Venstre vil:
- ta vare på småhusområdene." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2101)
Yeah, didn't think so. But all is not lost: "Nye boligstrøk må først og fremst etableres på tidligere nærings- og industriområder." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2101)
AHA! So that's where it's going to go down. And how much are we speaking of here, exactly? Enough for 200000 new people projected to come here over the next 20 years? And the local green areas they no doubt want to include in their low-rise heaven? After they have, as they promise, established "et helhetlig verneområde (bynasjonoalpark) med Akerselva"? I guess that means Grorud is the only place any meaningful development can happen. And how many units, exactly, will be developed? According to our considerably more density-minded byråd, 37000 (http://mobil.nrk.no/m/artikkel.jsp?art_id=17354424).

That means 5-6 people per apartment. And if that doesn't work out? Not Venstres problem, I'll tell you that.

Venstre is such a bunch of dishonest rats. "miljøparti" my ass! The country's biggest hub for public transportation is not a place for density. Nowhere else, for that matter, can be higher than four (4!!!) floors. So, clearly, if we can't build up, we must build out, right? Right?!? But wait:
"Venstre vil:
- sikre at markagrensa ligger fast.
- verne grøntarealer, inkludert hele Husebyskogen ved Makrellbekken-Huseby, og sørge for bedre forbindelser mellom de grønne områdene.
- etablere et helhetlig verneområde (bynasjonoalpark) med Maridalen, Akerselva miljøpark, Bygdøy, Hovedøya, Ekebergskrenten og Østensjøvannet." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2100)

So, we can't build up and we can't build out. All in the name of the environment, of course. So where can we build? Can we at least replace single homes with four *sssss* story blocks? Let's see:
"Venstre vil:
- ta vare på småhusområdene." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2101)
Yeah, didn't think so. But all is not lost: "Nye boligstrøk må først og fremst etableres på tidligere nærings- og industriområder." (http://www.venstre.no/oslo/artikkel/2101)
AHA! So that's where it's going to go down. And how much are we speaking of here, exactly? Enough for 200000 new people projected to come here over the next 20 years? And the local green areas they no doubt want to include in their low-rise heaven? After they have, as they promise, established "et helhetlig verneområde (bynasjonoalpark) med Akerselva"? I guess that means Grorud is the only place any meaningful development can happen. And how many units, exactly, will be developed? According to our considerably more density-minded byråd, 37000 (http://mobil.nrk.no/m/artikkel.jsp?art_id=17354424).

That means 5-6 people per apartment. And if that doesn't work out? Not Venstres problem, I'll tell you that.

I wouldn't worry about it, they're such a small party anyways.

Besides, that link you posted is like 4 years old.

As the owner of an apartment in the city centre in Oslo, I should be happy for Venstre's NIMBYism. Their policy is the recipe for sky-rocketing prices. Nevertheless, I'm only disappointed. They ideology in terms of urban development seems to be "no to everything!" :ohno:

Byutvikling til folket (http://www.aftenposten.no/kul_und/article4031501.ece)
Våren 2012 skal et topp moderne informasjons-senter for byutvikling åpne i den gamle Østbanehallen på Oslo S.
http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af172/mjoks007/OsloS.jpg

In the spirit of the Oslo of yore-thread, it would've been so great if they while building the new hotell and this project, that they also put the 1854 station in it's orignal state. It used to be such a nice brick building, and now it looks like a factory.

^^ That's actually not a bad idea at all. Maybe we should suggest it to ROM eiendom (they are developmenters behind the project, right?). This would perhaps also stop the arguments about the highrises from Oslo Byes Vel that are bond to come.

Not much point doing anything at the end gavels, but at least they could rebuild the tower. Why tear down that at all? NSB started the "cheap down"-model already in the 1880ies?

http://i326.photobucket.com/albums/k439/marshol/OsloS1854.jpg?t=1255907602

It would be possible to rebuilt half of the gavels too, but I agree with you that the tower is most important part. If you look at the render provided above you will even see that the building actually got lower part of the tower intact (it's pulled out from the rest of facade etc), it's only the tower-part that is missing.

Byutvikling til folket (http://www.aftenposten.no/kul_und/article4031501.ece)

http://i1005.photobucket.com/albums/af172/mjoks007/OsloS.jpg

New design on the highrise, or just a better render? Anyway, it looks good. Reminds me of one of my favorite scrapers, The New York Times building.

The one by Rezo Piano or the old one standing at Times Square? I think the new one was a major disappointment.

The one by Rezo Piano or the old one standing at Times Square? I think the new one was a major disappointment.

I was thinking about the new one. Me like :)

Well, I guess we have different opinions then. I like the old one standing at Times Square, only a shame it's now covered with concrete plates and plasma screen above them again.
http://citynoise.org/upload/37327.jpg

But is the shape of the highrises in this project final or are they just there to show the height?

Altough i agree with you that this is a great facade, that's not what's shown in the render at all:

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2587/4107633680_96a996383f_z.jpg

Altough i agree with you that this is a great facade, that's not what's shown in the render at all:


The facade was not my point, but rather the total impression. They are both slim, metallic, kind of gothic modern and delicate.

^^Personally I hope they just copy the height. But is the ramp-shape final?

Well, I guess we have different opinions then. I like the old one standing at Times Square, only a shame it's now covered with concrete plates and plasma screen above them again.

But is the shape of the highrises in this project final or are they just there to show the height?

Interesting - what exactly does this building look like now? I've spent tons of time in Times Square and can't remember having seen that building.

It's the building that named the square and the most famous there. It was turned into an advertisement tower because the landlord couldn't afford to renovate it.

Here it is today:
http://www.usatravel.hu/fckep/Image/New%20York/Times_Square2_NYC.jpg

Ah, wow. Had no idea such a characteristic building was hidden behind all those advertisement boards. It's quite a shame, but at the same time.. What would times square be between all those blinking lights.

Well, I guess we have different opinions then. I like the old one standing at Times Square, only a shame it's now covered with concrete plates and plasma screen above them again.

It's this one, right? http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/One_Times_Square

Can't see a hint of the old facade. They could just as well demolished the whole building :ohno:.

But they replaced the terracotta with concrete plates (have happened a lot in NY) before they put the plasma screens on, and if you scroll down this page you will see how the current facade looks like without screens om them:
http://www.shorpy.com/node/8856

The picture I posted it's how it orginally looked like.

^^Well, that's a quite interesting facade too.

About Fjordporten, I find it highly unlikely to be realized without some sort of U-shape, even though it's been altered quite a bit since the first designs. Another boxy brown-cheese is the last thing we need next to Pgb.

I don't think we can only choose between boxes and half pipes, but if that's the choice then I personally prefer a proper designed box. Maybe I'm just being conservative ...

I don't think we can only choose between boxes and half pipes,

Experience says otherwise...

There are way to many boxes, long live this curved design :) Now if only the facade would turn into something great, Karl Johan deserves it.

Oslo´s City Council (Byrådet) supports the Fjordporten Conference Hotel

Oslo´s City Council (Byrådet) has sent out an enthusiastic press release in response to the Fjordporten development - SG´s proposal to build a
large conference hotel on top of today's Airport Express terminal at Oslo S. The Fjordporten Conference Hotel is integrated in a long-term
development of the entire New Oslo Station.

http://oslopuls.aftenposten.no/byliv/article545850.ece
http://spacegroup.no/daily_life

http://spacegroup.no/uploads/images/1700017/1305889608/Oslo_S_FjordPorten.jpg

There are way to many boxes, long live this curved design :)

Boxy skylines are way better than "curvy", organic and generally unboxy skylines imho. Just take a look at this, one of the worlds greatest ones:

http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4009/4471727919_ed98147b54_b.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/kymberlyanne/4471727919/sizes/l/in/photostream/

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3127/3128487543_ee2d3760dc_b.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/40142450@N00/3128487543/sizes/l/in/photostream/

Almost pure boxy awesomeness.

Oslo´s City Council (Byrådet) supports the Fjordporten Conference Hotel

Oslo´s City Council (Byrådet) has sent out an enthusiastic press release in response to the Fjordporten development - SG´s proposal to build a
large conference hotel on top of today's Airport Express terminal at Oslo S. The Fjordporten Conference Hotel is integrated in a long-term
development of the entire New Oslo Station.

http://oslopuls.aftenposten.no/byliv/article545850.ece
http://spacegroup.no/daily_life

http://spacegroup.no/uploads/images/1700017/1305889608/Oslo_S_FjordPorten.jpg

Digging through some old stuff?:D But, yeah, this thread needed an update, even if I think the city councils respons (this is from the områdeprogram-decission) was known through other threads..

Digging through some old stuff?:D But, yeah, this thread needed an update, even if I think the city councils respons (this is from the områdeprogram-decission) was known through other threads..

If they agree on these two taller buildings on the station + when the Fjordcity is ready... Oslo will have an very nice skyline in the future. Im personally support more skyscrapers in Oslo city centre. Not to much, but maybe 10 - 15 buildings (incl. Radisson & PostG.Bygget). This will give the city a real metropolis look.

Hmmm. This project seems delayed. Jernbaneverket has changed their minds, and won't allow any planing work to continue until they've decided on the final solutions for a new Oslo-tunnel. The final NTP 2014-2023 vote is expected to take place spring of 2013, and until then planing work will have to take a break, then start over.

Isn't bureaucracy fun?:D


Showdown among govt agencies:

Jernbaneverket's statement from mid-August: http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=3237258
Plan- og bygningsetaten asks, "what the hell is going on?": http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=3245326
ROM eiendom answers, they've "got no clue": http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/showfile.asp?fileid=3251898

For someone who reads a lot of dry paperwork, I get tons of fun out of this!:lol:

Isn't bureaucracy fun?:D



Bureaucracy is like excrements: It's ugly, it stinks, and nobody likes it, but alas, it's part of life! :(

Imo, the problem with this project and the plans for a new bus terminal is that it is not put into a context with development of the whole area with train tracks. What we really need is a masterplan for the area, all the way to Gamlebyen. In other words, I want to see a plan with more highrises :D

Imo, the problem with this project and the plans for a new bus terminal is that it is not put into a context with development of the whole area with train tracks. What we really need is a masterplan for the area, all the way to Gamlebyen. In other words, I want to see a plan with more highrises :D

That was what the områdeprogram was for, but it didn't work after it's intentions at all. Jernbaneverket obviously wasn't involved enough in the process, which lead to both of these delayed and flawed suggestions (nye Oslo S, Biskop Gunnerus gate 14 b).

The need for a new central station is quite urgent, for both practical and aesthetic purposes, so any delay is unfortunate – but of course not surprising. I think the design from Space Group is really good and will be a huge improvement for the whole area, but I guess the failure to find a good solution for the bus terminal plays a big part in delaying some of the connected projects. It is obviously hard to find the perfect placement of the terminal because it involves so many different aspects for consideration; traffic flow, access – and the pedestrian environment in the street it is connected to. But it seems to me that the cooperation and communication between the different involved parties has been insufficient. But is it impossible to keep the current bus terminal and extend it underground – either at the brevsenter-plot or at the planned new Statoil Fuel and Retail HQ? Surely they could implement an underground bus parking and access in exchange for, let’s say, a taller main tower? I have no idea if it is practically possible, and if it were I presume it has been considered.

I agree with muster, though, they should complete a master plan that involves the future of the train tracks and the potential plans for the future from the different transportation agencies and other involved parties, but I’m afraid this will drag out because of the complexities of the placement and that we are stuck with the current situation well into the next decade.

ROM Eiendom has made an answer to Jernbaneverket, a pretty convincing case for why this project can move ahead with some different alternatives for a second Oslotunnel:

http://web102881.pbe.oslo.kommune.no/saksinnsyn/casedet.asp?mode=all&caseno=200902746

Yes, it'd be saying that for a few days... We'll see what JBV responds (IF they respond), but anyways November 1st is getting closer, so it may or may not matter.
My personal bias is of course that ROM eiendom as a company is a stupid compromise between Jernbaneverket's ownership over the infrastructure, and the need to secure NSB's income through other sources than just running trains. This case is, even though legally a no-brainer, another sad example on how bad government agencies with overlapping responseabilities can work together. I DON'T think ROM should've been in the NTP 2014-23 group, but it's obvious they have interests there. But Jernbaneverket can't wrap they're head around anything other than making way for the trains, so eitherway it's a lose-lose.

(This area is actually legally part of the Krystallklar-project, but I'll put it here eitherway...)

Snøhetta has drawn a new plan for the central track-area of Oslo S as an alternative to PBE/KLPe's project to move the bus terminal here. The plan includes new entrances to Oslo S from north, south and east, and a new pathway over each track. The pathway will more effectivly lead passengers from the stations to the trains, instead of the passanger tunnels we have today.

In an article in the newest edition of Jernbanemagasinet, they discuss ROM eiendoms Oslo S-project, the future Oslo-tunnel, and the work that is being done leading up to NTP 2014-2023.

Link (page 10): http://www.jernbaneverket.no/PageFiles/15905/Jernbanemagasinet_0711_web2.pdf

Renders:
http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/snohetta_oslo_s_aerial_kredittering_wwwvismo_dk_.jpg

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/snohetta_oslo_s_platform_kredittering_vismodk_.jpg
Illustrations belong to Snøhetta/Vismo

^^ It seems to me that jernbaneverket is desperately negative to any idea or solution that they didn't come up with themselves.

So they really can`t find another way to develop this prime land next to our new CBD? The only thing logical would be to put the rails underground and do something extraordinary with this land.

It's not that big, only ~200 x 200 meters. If they manage to develope the rest of the train area east of Nylandsveien, I'm more than happy. I don't think I know of any big cities that have built densely on such large rail-areas. You can build on a concrete base of two - four tracks, but 19 tracks, that's a nut!

Also, is that Akerselva I see below the bridge?:D

So they really can`t find another way to develop this prime land next to our new CBD? The only thing logical would be to put the rails underground and do something extraordinary with this land.

Agree. I can never support anything less than Barcode buildings in the area :ohno:

It's not that big, only ~200 x 200 meters. If they manage to develope the rest of the train area east of Nylandsveien, I'm more than happy. I don't think I know of any big cities that have built densely on such large rail-areas. You can build on a concrete base of two - four tracks, but 19 tracks, that's a nut!

I`ve got some good examples from new york:

"Railroads were the first companies to realize the potential of making money from their air rights. A good example of this is Grand Central Terminal in New York City, where William J. Wilgus, chief engineer of the New York Central and Hudson River Railroad, devised a plan to earn profit from air rights. At first, the railroad simply constructed a platform above the rail yards to allow for the development of buildings overhead. By 1954, the railroad began to realize it could sell more air rights and Grand Central Terminal was proposed to be replaced by a 50-story tower. This is how the MetLife Building came to be built next to the station, after public protest regarding the demolition of Grand Central Terminal.

Building on platforms over railroad tracks is still potentially very profitable, especially in New York City. Recently the Metropolitan Transportation Authority attempted to sell air rights to the New York Jets so that they could build the West Side Stadium over the West Side Yard near Penn Station as part of the Hudson Yards Redevelopment Project. The MTA has even proposed building a platform themselves to encourage development. In Brooklyn, the Barclays Center is proposed to be constructed over the Atlantic Yards." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_rights

Hudson Yards Redevelopment Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hudson_Yards_Redevelopment_Project)

Atlantic Yards (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atlantic_Yards)

http://www.startsandfits.com/?p=255

I really don't mind having the rail road out in the open for a while. If we build over it now it will only results in fat boxes due to the knee-jerk reactions against anything tall. It's better to build taller around first and then come up with a great and tall suggestion for this site when highrises have become more common here.

I really don't mind having the rail road out in the open for a while. If we build over it now it will only results in fat boxes due to the knee-jerk reactions against anything tall. It's better to build taller around first and then come up with a great and tall suggestion for this site when highrises have become more common here.

They will build someting over tracks in a few years. The problem is, if they build something like the Snøhetta proposal, you will never see highrises in that area in you're lifetime.

^^That`s also my opinion. I`d rather wait 10 years for some good development here, than having this built and wait 50-60 years for highrises.

^^The current alignment is ~25 years old. Why would we have to wait more than double that if we got a (fairly simple) improvement now?

^^Because we all know how the Norwegian bureaucracy works..

Looking at the MetLife building that is mentioned, I must say it looks abysmal. That whole area looks dark and unattractive. I don't think the tracks at Oslo S should be filled with high rises. A dense area also needs open places and this spot serves that need fine. The proposed bus central is the right thing to put here.

Image from Wikipedia (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Walter_Gropius_photo_MetLife_Building_fassade_New_York_USA_2005-10-03.jpg):
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/b6/Walter_Gropius_photo_MetLife_Building_fassade_New_York_USA_2005-10-03.jpg/450px-Walter_Gropius_photo_MetLife_Building_fassade_New_York_USA_2005-10-03.jpg

^^ Looks better than Regjeringsbygget! Except the top of it, there Reg.byg. *almost* looks better. :)

But I see what you mean with "dark and unattractive" around it.

The proposed bus central is the right thing to put here.



No. The right thing is to make some streetlife, some highrises and maybe a park or a market for people to meet. A bus terminal should never occupy a hugh area like that in the heart of Oslo. It has to be underground.

No. The right thing is to make some streetlife, some highrises and maybe a park or a market for people to meet. A bus terminal should never occupy a hugh area like that in the heart of Oslo. It has to be underground.

There are not enough people in Oslo to sustain markets, cafes and retaurants everywhere. I would rather have the public use the facilities along the harbour and the existing inner city hot spots than creating yet a new area for this. This area is already a public transportation hub and adding the bus station on top only extends and improves this service.

There are not enough people in Oslo to sustain markets, cafes and retaurants everywhere. I would rather have the public use the facilities along the harbour and the existing inner city hot spots than creating yet a new area for this. This area is already a public transportation hub and adding the bus station on top only extends and improves this service.

Lol, everywhere? We are talking about the heart of the city. Oslo is growing with 15 000 people every year and have a small city core for it's size. Of course there are enough people in Oslo to support a normal city structure with shops and cafes in the middle of Oslo city center. I don't understand you're post at all. How can anyone prefer a bus terminal like that. Maybe we should demolish Karl Johan and build a bus terminal there also. After all, we know the city is not big enough to support shops and cafes in the city center. Why have a city center at all. Let's make it all a suburb with a big bus terminal in the center :nuts:

From what I have heard one of the main reason why the platform area of Oslo S will not be a total rebuild is that they then have to follow the EU regulations. In a case of a new build Oslo S will loose 2 platforms due to rules about space between rails. It's more likely that they will upgrade existing platforms (rise them) and make new access points.

Lol, everywhere? We are talking about the heart of the city. Oslo is growing with 15 000 people every year and have a small city core for it's size. Of course there are enough people in Oslo to support a normal city structure with shops and cafes in the middle of Oslo city center. I don't understand you're post at all. How can anyone prefer a bus terminal like that. Maybe we should demolish Karl Johan and build a bus terminal there also. After all, we know the city is not big enough to support shops and cafes in the city center. Why have a city center at all. Let's make it all a suburb with a big bus terminal in the center :nuts:

If you say so...

I would prefer the urban, public oriented services to be developed along the harbour, kvadraturen and the existing inner city. When these areas are "done" (never, I know...) Groruddalen/north east part of Oslo needs to get their share of urbanism.

^^Groruddalen IS getting urbanized, but why not both? There's nothing wrong in trying to get different parts of the city work nicely for people, and offering something different. Not all areas are like Karl Johan, not all like Aker Brygge, and not all like Grünerløkka.

If you say so...

I would prefer the urban, public oriented services to be developed along the harbour, kvadraturen and the existing inner city. When these areas are "done" (never, I know...) Groruddalen/north east part of Oslo needs to get their share of urbanism.

I couldn't disagree more with you. Kvadraturen is not a "dead" part of the city because of Barcode. There are other reasons for that.

Oslo is growing fast and needs a bigger inner city. The only logical thing is to build as dense as possible at the most central place in Norway. This is the best for environment, the economy and city life of Grønland and Bjørvika which needs to be connected with a proper urban development, not barriers like a bus terminal that just as well could be underground somewhere else.

I couldn't disagree more with you. Kvadraturen is not a "dead" part of the city because of Barcode. There are other reasons for that.

Oslo is growing fast and needs a bigger inner city. The only logical thing is to build as dense as possible at the most central place in Norway. This is the best for environment, the economy and city life of Grønland and Bjørvika which needs to be connected with a proper urban development, not barriers like a bus terminal that just as well could be underground somewhere else.

Why are you saying that I think Kvadraturen is dead? I'm not certainly not writing that. The word Barcode is not used at all...

As to the bus terminal, what we know is that an expansion is needed and that it needs to be located near the current location. It is not realistic to expect this to be under ground, but some building above it could be a possibility.

We could see commuter buses terminate Skøyen, Bryn and Ryen in the future, and the long distance bus terminal could still be located in Schweigaards without expansion.

We could see commuter buses terminate at Skøyen Lysaker, Bryn Helsfyr and Ryen in the future, and the long distance bus terminal could still be located in Schweigaards without expansion.

I would rather see that, than a huge busterminal above ground in the track area or anywhere else. There's not room for all the busses they want in Oslo Vaterland/Grønland. And I edited your post:)

We could see commuter buses terminate Skøyen, Bryn and Ryen in the future, and the long distance bus terminal could still be located in Schweigaards without expansion.That would just be horrible.. When people commute to Oslo they want to go downtown, not having to change buses or mode of transport way outside the city core.

That would just be horrible.. When people commute to Oslo they want to go downtown, not having to change buses or mode of transport way outside the city core.

The thought is that everyone aren't going to "downtown"/Bussterminalen anyways. In stead, it would be just as effective to enter the metro-network at a city-border transfer point, than to run all the way to downtown with an overground transport form. For instance, Helsfyr works as this today, and entry point to the metro-grid from north-east. Most people has to change somewhere eitherway.

The thought is that everyone aren't going to "downtown"/Bussterminalen anyways. In stead, it would be just as effective to enter the metro-network at a city-border transfer point, than to run all the way to downtown with an overground transport form. For instance, Helsfyr works as this today, and entry point to the metro-grid from north-east. Most people has to change somewhere eitherway.Yeah, I understood the thought. But not having a bus central in central Oslo would be a huge failure and just wouldn't make any sense. So if you wanted to travel from say Lørenskog to Oslo sentrum you'd have to get out and switch to a T-bane at Helsfyr? What a nice downgradement of public transportation. :nuts:
Besides I'm sure 90% do take the bus all the way to sentrum, I've been on my fair share of 401 buses (tho I'd usually take the train)

Yeah, I understood the thought. But not having a bus central in central Oslo would be a huge failure and just wouldn't make any sense. So if you wanted to travel from say Lørenskog to Oslo sentrum you'd have to get out and switch to a T-bane at Helsfyr? What a nice downgradement of public transportation. :nuts:
Besides I'm sure 90% do take the bus all the way to sentrum, I've been on my fair share of 401 buses (tho I'd usually take the train)

Feeder buses to rail transport is a pretty common phenomenon around the world. In Budapest for example, the big suburban bus terminals are at the end stations of the metro. Several areas in Oslo use this arrangement as well. Asker, Sandvika and Lillestrom for example, all have fairly big bus terminals where people change between suburban buses and trains. Bekkestua is an important interchange spot between local buses and the metro.

It makes sense to consolidate traffic underground rather than have it congest streets. Short distance city buses or tramways would take care of local traffic. It's not really feasible in Oslo though until we get the new tunnel, otherwise the capacity would be completely busted. If Oslo is to continue growing, I think it's insustainable to consolidate both bus and train terminals in the centre. We should make a choice. Most likely the centre should be for rail transport, while buses should be kept in the suburbs as much as possible.

In Turkey for example, a country that relies heavily on buses for regional trasport as opposed to trains, major bus terminals are located quite a distance outside the city centre, and are almost a bit like airports. From the bus terminals you have metro links which carry people into the city centre.

I support the idea of having busterminals located on the outskirt. If anything we could for example run buses from north to Helsfyr, and let them continue to Skøyen every second time, only having a short stop downtown. The only reason for the need of a bigger terminal downtown is because the buses have a 10 min - 1 hr standby time before they continue, which requires alot of space.

We could see commuter buses terminate Skøyen, Bryn and Ryen in the future, and the long distance bus terminal could still be located in Schweigaards without expansion.

Do you know if that is a solution they consider? I would support that if it’s a feasible solution for the travelers – a place like Helsfyr, as I see is getting proposed as one of the possible new end stations in this discussion, is still pretty close to the city center, and it would help a lot on the congestion downtown and ridding Oslo of the headache it is to find the space for an extension downtown.

As for the article in Jernbanemagasinet; first of all it’s pretty bad if the current Oslo S plan is as problematic to construct as Jernbaneverket presents – but anyways I find the Snøhetta proposal quite good. It’s a fairly easy upgrade that can be constructed in addition to the existing building mass, and it would solve parts of the problem with the current situation by easing the pressure on the current main building and letting the flow of people come from more directions. As far as I can judge there wont be a big problem if they decide to combine a project like this with the Space Group project in the future, so if something like this could be done pretty fast to combat the evolving problem while the bigger project is in development I would be all for it (I know it’s unrealistic to expect something to happen pretty fast in Oslo, though). As for the developments of highrises over the rails I would guess this is more feasible east of Nylandsbroen, and it will in any case not happen for a lot of years.

For better understanding the nature of these new plattforms:

http://www.jernbaneverket.no/Documents/1%20Mapper%20for%20bildekarusell/2011/Jernbanemagasinet/Slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles/slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles%203.jpg

http://www.jernbaneverket.no/Documents/1%20Mapper%20for%20bildekarusell/2011/Jernbanemagasinet/Slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles/slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles%204.jpg

http://www.jernbaneverket.no/no/Nyheter/Nyhetsarkiv/2011/-Slik-kan-Oslo-S-utvikles/

Looks good!

For better understanding the nature of these new plattforms:

http://www.jernbaneverket.no/Documents/1%20Mapper%20for%20bildekarusell/2011/Jernbanemagasinet/Slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles/slik%20kan%20oslo%20s%20utvikles%203.jpg

It'll be hard to dig a new walking pathway beneath the tracks without closing Oslo S, I would think. Perhaps they have a special technique...? Not that it wouldn't be a good idea, though.

Looks like I was right about the Akerselva opening as well...?

Won't they use the exising one (the one smelling of piss all the time)? Maybe it's possible to dig closing only two tracks at a time..

Digging on Oslo S would be a nightmare. With all signal and highvoltage cables in the ground. This winter or next summer there will be build two new highvoltage houses on Oslo S and power into the station re-routed.

Won't they use the exising one (the one smelling of piss all the time)? Maybe it's possible to dig closing only two tracks at a time..

I would think they'll keep the old one, but that's not what the render shows. Maybe they're planing to removing the old one due to the miss-match with Stasjonsalmenningen, and it's obvious problems with foundations.


Digging on Oslo S would be a nightmare. With all signal and highvoltage cables in the ground. This winter or next summer there will be build two new highvoltage houses on Oslo S and power into the station re-routed.

As far as I've understood, a big part of the Oslo-project is to move cables etc. above ground to make it more accesible for maintainance work and debugging. They've already done this in the tunnels. I wouldn't completely rule out that this work in the longer run could make it possible (or even neccessary) to dig a new tunnel close to Nylandsbrua. Eitherway, therecant be that many cables there, with Akerselva less than a meter from the tracks.

Posting a picture of the new, beige Central Station, then:

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/20111021_001.jpg

Looks nice!

I like this colour better than the yellow. More continental.

Classy.

From what I have heard one of the main reason why the platform area of Oslo S will not be a total rebuild is that they then have to follow the EU regulations. In a case of a new build Oslo S will loose 2 platforms due to rules about space between rails. It's more likely that they will upgrade existing platforms (rise them) and make new access points.
If that really is the case, I think it's time to break out my trusted, old friend again: :crazy:

Another render I found on Snøhettas website of the proposal for new platform structures on Oslo S;

http://www.gassarmatur.no/oslos.jpg

Går mot Oslo S-planer (http://ne.no/38355)
Jernbaneverket godtar ikke Rom Eiendoms planer for Oslo S.

Basically they're negative towards pretty much every point of the plan.

Isn't it a little late for that?

My idea, and proposal for a new bus station: We have to admit that Hotel Opera and the other ugly box was a BIG mistake. I suggest we demolish those buildings and puts the new bus-station there. On top of it we build highrises of course.

This will solve the bus station problem. We can continue with Barcode and highrises all along DEF, and the rail tracks can be used for better things in the future. :)

Since everything still are in the blue, here is an alternative approach on how to develop Oslo S.

http://lintris.no/oslos/

^^ No offense meant if is you that have made it, but I don't like it. One of the problems with the current station is how much of the square it uses without giving anything back. What I like about the official proposal is how small the new stations foot print is meaning it will disturb as little as possible of the surrounding streetscape. Your suggestions however is quite different there. I don't think this area need a big groundscraper to be honest.

Since everything still are in the blue, here is an alternative approach on how to develop Oslo S.

http://lintris.no/oslos/

Very creative! But saftety wise this might be a bad idea. One strategically placed bomb and the whose structure might come crashing down.

seeing as this is not an official project, shouldn't it be in this thread.....

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1446495

Edit: Ooops, wrong thread....

Går mot Oslo S-planer (http://ne.no/38355)
I'm a little puzzeled over how the highrises are supposed to create an insurmountable problem for traffic flow. Is it really that hard to channel the flow around a few coloumns? It's not as if the current layout is ideal. I can sort of understand their worry with the large top-mounted bus terminal, but I'm sure we can get around that somehow.

Without knowing exactly how they intend to build those high-rises, a load-bearing structure a'la the Eiffel Tower should allow for plenty of room underneath. Bundling columns where needed is a pretty standard procedure and has been for a long time.

Very creative! But saftety wise this might be a bad idea. One strategically placed bomb and the whose structure might come crashing down.
True, but that's a matter of design. If I was designing those arches, I'd quietly add some extra reinforcement and blast absorbing materials around the where a vehicle can get close to it. You could potentially fill a bus with explosives and try to knock it down, but it's quite easy to make sure you'd need a lot more than the 1000 kg Breivik used on H-blokka (which still wasn't enough to compromise integrity). If you could fill an entire bus with explosives, we'd be in trouble on a lot of sites already to be honest.

My gut feeling is that, say, a train-born container filled with explosives would kill almost everyone in the station long before it topples the arch.

The Oslo S area is one of the worst examples of cityplanning (or lack of) that i have seen. The flow of people around this place is very poor. I often find myself walking through the station because it is the only shortcut from the south side of the station to anywhere north of this. I have often thought that it would be a good idea - however very difficult to achieve - if we would build a new Oslo S expansion under the current station. This could be done together with the new crosslink tunnel. 10 platforms under todays platforms. This could also free up space and demolish platforms 1-4, to build new open pedestrian roads around this very closed off downtown area. REMOVE the concrete monster on top of the current station.

http://i1188.photobucket.com/albums/z402/sagittariius/oslos1-.png
(the green is the underground station..)

What do you think? Wet dream 4 sure :-P but is this at all plausible?


H

^^
I think that would be very hard to achieve. You'd have to dig really deep to get the tracks under the river, and in the mean time the flow of traffic suffers. I think most parties involved will agree that the only way you could justify such an expense is if you somehow had high usage above ground to compensate. Your street would probably be easier realized by just building a bridge and connecting it to Nylandsveien. Not that I think that justifies the expense either.

Imho the best and most realistic option to "retake" this urban space is to either build a lid above and keep the tracks at their current height or move the whole station underground - neither of which will be cheap - and have high density development atop it pay the bill. If/when that is done, I'm sure a street will be part of it, but it's possible it will pass where the old one ran, that is besides Østbanehallen.

When a hub is as big as Oslo S, there ain't no free lunch.

The Oslo S area is one of the worst examples of cityplanning (or lack of) that i have seen. The flow of people around this place is very poor. I often find myself walking through the station because it is the only shortcut from the south side of the station to anywhere north of this. I have often thought that it would be a good idea - however very difficult to achieve - if we would build a new Oslo S expansion under the current station. This could be done together with the new crosslink tunnel. 10 platforms under todays platforms. This could also free up space and demolish platforms 1-4, to build new open pedestrian roads around this very closed off downtown area. REMOVE the concrete monster on top of the current station.
What do you think? Wet dream 4 sure :-P but is this at all plausible?


H

A good model for a more vertical station is Antwerp (http://www.google.no/search?q=antwerp+centraal+station&hl=no&prmd=imvns&source=lnms&tbm=isch&ei=ycbKTuOFMob-4QTtu4Fr&sa=X&oi=mode_link&ct=mode&cd=2&ved=0CBsQ_AUoAQ&biw=1920&bih=986), the original station building is all one sees at ground level, it's bigger than Oslo S but follows a similar elongated shape...and then it just goes down and down....


it helps that it is one of the finest railway stations you'll ever see... :(

http://www.rcts.org.uk/about/news/images/Antwerpen%20Centraal%2002Jun09%20Steve%20Ollive.jpg

Have there been any proposals/ ideas of rearranging Oslo S completely, and put all tracks ( spor) underground? By doing so, a huge area will be opened ( where todays tracks (spor) are), which could fit plenty of appartments, offices and so on...!

^^Yes. Take a look at this PDF (http://www.ostsam.no/Docs/00000E25/Omr%E5deprogram%20Oslo%20S_PBE%202010.pdf)

And welcome to the forum.

Thanks! :)

Looks interesting, but how realistic are the plans?

Building over the tracks requires that a new Oslo-tunnel getting built first, so it wont happen anything in many years. Atleast they have started on the assessment work for a new tunnel. (http://www.jernbaneverket.no/no/Nyheter/Nyhetsarkiv/2011/Jernbaneverket-utreder-ny-tunnel-under-Oslo/)

http://www.diiz.no/images/stills/OsloS_Konferanse_SpaceGroup_Diiz_4_s.jpg

3d visualization of a concept for new conference centre in Oslo, situated on top of the proposed new bus terminal and connected to the proposed new hotel. Design by Spacegroup. The project is part of the recreation of the central railway station Oslo S to be built by 2020. More info can be found here:
http://www.romeiendom.no/Vare-eiendommer/Nye-Oslo-S


The highrise looks absolutely hideous here. :ohno: What an eyesore.

The "conferance building" looks the most terrible. A desperate attempt to fix the increadibly bad idea too put a bus terminal on top of Oslo S' platforms.

Put the god damn thing under Operallmenningen/Christian Fredriks plass, or terminate the green Ruter busses outside downtown. Those are the only viable alternatives.
If we put a bus terminal on top of Oslo S, we have officially destroyed all possibilities for city development in this area for at least 50 years.

The "conferance building" looks the most terrible.

At least it don't look like a half melted halfpipe clad with nasty glass. :down:

At least it don't look like a half melted halfpipe clad with nasty glass. :down:
Oh come now, it's not that bad. I might agree I prefer it in some of the older renders and the lower (vertical) part beneath the tallest end might need some more work, but I still say go for it. :)

If the bus terminal ends up "indoor" as the render suggests i can live with that...

Oh come now, it's not that bad.

No, it's awful. :ohno:

No, it's awful. :ohno:

Støtter. They also NEED to demolish that NSB building for the good of man kind and our beloved city..

Støtter. They also NEED to demolish that NSB building for the good of man kind and our beloved city..


ABSOLUTELY !

The best thing would be demolish the old hideous thing, move the tower closer to Postgiro and build taller and less melted, and restore the old brick station! Then we could have gotten a very nice station.

and restore the old brick station!

They are currently renovating it, but I don't think we're going to see it rebuilt with spires.

About The NSB office-building, it's also very recently renovated, and is more essential in Norwegian railways than ever, as now also the traffic control of all Østlandet is done there at a brand new facility.

http://www.jernbaneverket.no/PageFiles/1158/Togleder-oslo-s_1416889a.jpg?epslanguage=no

^^ But if you built taller then could also fit in some apartments/more offices/brothel to finance the movement of that control center ... We need to get rid of the thing that current box somehow!

Ehm... You sure "brothel" means what you think it does?

:lol:

Ehm... You sure "brothel" means what you think it does?

Yes, and I think it's a very profitable business. :)

Posting a picture of the new, beige Central Station, then:

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o309/IceCheese/20111021_001.jpg

I just noticed the facade towards Jernbanegata (the 1854-station) has turned red. I'm surprised, cause I thought it has always been brick-colored. But I guess the antiquarians nust've agreed to the change, so...

ROM eiendom works for 2022 as the finish date for the new Oslo central station, according to this article: http://oslopuls.aftenposten.no/byliv/article712807.ece

Just ten years left, now!:nuts:

Crazy long time. At least passenger traffic won't increase too much before the Intercity triangle and the centre tunnel is complete.

Just in time for the potential olympics. (or just not in time)

^^ don't think its that bad doing it the other way around really.

Oslo S will go before anything happends to the plots on the tracks, maybe it will look like this 5 years later?
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y136/cityw/Photoshop/Fjordporten3a.jpg

I wish!

Vil det skje noe utvikling med Oslo S iløpet av 2013? Blir f.eks brevsentralen revet i år?

Østbanehallen starts in the fall of 2013. Demo of brevsenter is clearly not happening untill the plot comes out of planning-limbo.

Østbanehallen starts in the fall of 2013. Demo of brevsenter is clearly not happening untill the plot comes out of planning-limbo.

Så mange år bare med snakk hit og dit... Byråkratiet er helt ute av kontroll, helt vannvittig hårreisende er det! Det byene her i landet trenger nå er en diktator av en byplanlegger som overstyrer alle arrogante byråkrater sånn at prosjekter endelig kan igangsettes. Stor befolkningsvekst og slow motion handling mixer dårlig.

De statlige etatene i form av Jernbaneverket og Satans vegvesen er ikke stort bedre. I snitt mangler det tanker om hvordan planlegging skal organiseres, og at det må være statens (ig kommunens) oppgave å ha avklart fremtidige behov før man starter behandling av nye reguleringssaker (kommuneplanen?), aller helst før sakene blir aktuelle. Burde være en selvfølge med hundreårsplaner for vei og jernbane.

Tilfellet Oslo sentralstasjon er en tragedie. Det dukker stadig opp nye ting man skal ha med i planene, samtidig som at avgjørelser slyves frem i tid.

Byråkratiet er helt ute av kontroll, helt vannvittig hårreisende er det! .

Det er en veldig grei måte å skaffe jobber på da ... For en kort stund.

Det er en veldig grei måte å skaffe jobber på da ... For en kort stund.
Har du blitt byråkrat? :D

Vet noen når de skal begynne rivningen av trafikkanten og trappene opp til inngangen.

Si 5 år om vi er heldige.

Vet noen når de skal begynne rivningen av trafikkanten og trappene opp til inngangen.

Hei Petter. Velkommen til forumet.

Jeg håper faktisk de ombestemmer seg angående inngangen fra jernbanetorget. I motsetning til noen synes jeg det er finere sånn som det er nå.