Birmingham is in an odd spot. A metro with a stagnat growth rate, in the fastest growing region in the country. A metro who's image seems to be stuck in the past.

Granted Birmingham is the largest city in the least progressive states in the nation, but should and other factors keep this metro from becoming the next hot growth area?.

OKC, Charlotte, Nashville are metros who have turn the corner in term of making things happen. Why cant Birmingham do the same?.

BTW, Im trying my best to get others to see what Birmingham could be, but im just one guy, and maybe im wasting my time and talents that could be used in other places.

well, not knowing too much about the State of Alabama (maybe enough to be dangerous), I would think that Mobile and Huntsville hurt Birmingham. Huntsville is a very well educated city with a lot of high tech jobs. It's proximity to both Atlanta and Nashville help and should keep it growing at a nice pace. Mobile, with its port and redevelopment, is another region in Alabama that seems more progressive and better suited for growth than the Birmingham. Toss in the fact that another city is the state capitol and you have 3 regions within the same state that are direct competition for Birmingham. For a state the size of Alabama, that makes it tough for any one city to pull ahead of the others.

Well, first of all I wouldn't exactly call Alabama the least progressive state in the nation. At least while the world has Mississippi. :D

Here's what I believe Birmingham is going to have to do before it can even think about trying to achieve the levels of other southern cities at or near its size. First of all, it needs transit, and it needs it badly. I have said this before, and I will say it again. Max is not transit, Max is a joke. No modern city can achieve the things it needs without a decent transit infrastructure, and Birmingham is still in the Stone Age where that is concerned.

Next, it needs to work on that crime rate. Birmingham is right up there with the likes of Detroit in crime, and that is nothing to be proud of. In fact, Birmingham is well known nationwide for being a very violent and crime riddled city, because that is exactly what it is. No need in trying to hide it. It's not going to go away. There are parts of Birmingham more dangerous than downtown Baghdad. That's shameful.

Birmingham has too many problems to really mention because it has major problems in just about every category you could name. Until Birmingham works on these problems, updates its aging infrastructure and provides an environment where its residents feel safe going outside after dark, it is going to remain exactly what it is right now. Just a great big ole country town going nowhere. I lived there for over a decade, and with the shape the city is in right now, you couldn't pay me enough to move back there. Gadsden isn't much, but it doesn't pretend to be. At least I can go out without having to worry about having my head blown off because I wandered into the wrong area. Birmingham scares me. It's dirty, smelly, dangerous, and quite frankly, compared to other southern cities its size, boring as hell.

Places like Charlotte, Greenville, Nashville... they have left Birmingham in the dust because they got their shit together and brought themselves into the 21st century. Birmingham has yet to do that, and it shows no signs of trying. So far, Larry Langford has done nothing but prove to be what he really is. A puffed up blowhard so full of himself he couldn't see the asshole of horse if it were standing right in front of him. He's all talk. Always has been. What makes me so damn angry is, Birmingham could be doing the same things as the progressive cities in the south, it just seems hell bent on not improving itself in any way.

My opinion. You asked. :)

lack of city leadership. suburban parasites/white flight nightmare. lack of taxes to pay for transit that was destroyed by short-sighted government policies. lack of taxes to pay for quality education leads to decades of miseducation, raising crime. unlike other southern cities, Birmingham was hit by the collapse of heavy industry. hit hard. a prevelant ass-backwards conservative social culture that doesn't appreciate the fine, historic nature of the city, and votes against progress, causing brain drain. brain drain and collapse of heavy industry; Birmingham's a southern city only really by location and racial demographics. Birmingham is dangerous; i saw a gunpoint mugging 50 feet away, 2 blocks from my apartment, in a nice part of the city. but that was a one time incident. i went out countless times with nothing happening. my point: it's not really that dangerous. anyway, back to what's really wrong...civic pride damaged by 60s racial tensions and white flight and bullshit conservative politics.

Birmingham also gets no love from state leadership; what was it, $250 million in federal funds was set aside for transit if matching funds could be found? the state didn't do crap for it. voted against small tax increases to pay for it.

i liked living in Birmingham. and would do it again.

-

lack of city leadership. suburban parasites/white flight nightmare. lack of taxes to pay for transit that was destroyed by short-sighted government policies. lack of taxes to pay for quality education leads to decades of miseducation, raising crime. unlike other southern cities, Birmingham was hit by the collapse of heavy industry. hit hard. a prevelant ass-backwards conservative social culture that doesn't appreciate the fine, historic nature of the city, and votes against progress, causing brain drain. brain drain and collapse of heavy industry; Birmingham's a southern city only really by location and racial demographics. Birmingham is dangerous; i saw a gunpoint mugging 50 feet away, 2 blocks from my apartment, in a nice part of the city. but that was a one time incident. i went out countless times with nothing happening. my point: it's not really that dangerous. anyway, back to what's really wrong...civic pride damaged by 60s racial tensions and white flight and bullshit conservative politics.

Birmingham also gets no love from state leadership; what was it, $250 million in federal funds was set aside for transit if matching funds could be found? the state didn't do crap for it. voted against small tax increases to pay for it.

i liked living in Birmingham. and would do it again.

-


I agree with much of what you said, and I cannot sit here and blame just Birmingham. It isn't doing enough to help itself, but I can agree that the state seems to want to ignore it sometimes. However, I disagree with you on the crime. It is indeed a very dangerous city. Here is just a quick link I had bookmarked, but when I get home tonight, I will drill down for more info. When I lived there, I saw many incidents of crime with my own eyes. Its national reputation for high crime is unfortunately, true.

http://blog.al.com/spotnews/2007/11/birmingham_alabama_listed_as_n.html

lack of city leadership. suburban parasites/white flight nightmare. lack of taxes to pay for transit that was destroyed by short-sighted government policies. lack of taxes to pay for quality education leads to decades of miseducation, raising crime. unlike other southern cities, Birmingham was hit by the collapse of heavy industry. hit hard. a prevelant ass-backwards conservative social culture that doesn't appreciate the fine, historic nature of the city, and votes against progress, causing brain drain. brain drain and collapse of heavy industry; Birmingham's a southern city only really by location and racial demographics. Birmingham is dangerous; i saw a gunpoint mugging 50 feet away, 2 blocks from my apartment, in a nice part of the city. but that was a one time incident. i went out countless times with nothing happening. my point: it's not really that dangerous. anyway, back to what's really wrong...civic pride damaged by 60s racial tensions and white flight and bullshit conservative politics.

Birmingham also gets no love from state leadership; what was it, $250 million in federal funds was set aside for transit if matching funds could be found? the state didn't do crap for it. voted against small tax increases to pay for it.

i liked living in Birmingham. and would do it again.

-

I agree with you on all points LSyd, but honestly why would you move back if you had the chance?.

Even though I was born and raised here, if and when I leave I probably wont come back. I know thats bad to say about your hometown, but I would be lying if I said otherwise.

Well, first of all I wouldn't exactly call Alabama the least progressive state in the nation. At least while the world has Mississippi. :D

Here's what I believe Birmingham is going to have to do before it can even think about trying to achieve the levels of other southern cities at or near its size. First of all, it needs transit, and it needs it badly. I have said this before, and I will say it again. Max is not transit, Max is a joke. No modern city can achieve the things it needs without a decent transit infrastructure, and Birmingham is still in the Stone Age where that is concerned.

Next, it needs to work on that crime rate. Birmingham is right up there with the likes of Detroit in crime, and that is nothing to be proud of. In fact, Birmingham is well known nationwide for being a very violent and crime riddled city, because that is exactly what it is. No need in trying to hide it. It's not going to go away. There are parts of Birmingham more dangerous than downtown Baghdad. That's shameful.

Birmingham has too many problems to really mention because it has major problems in just about every category you could name. Until Birmingham works on these problems, updates its aging infrastructure and provides an environment where its residents feel safe going outside after dark, it is going to remain exactly what it is right now. Just a great big ole country town going nowhere. I lived there for over a decade, and with the shape the city is in right now, you couldn't pay me enough to move back there. Gadsden isn't much, but it doesn't pretend to be. At least I can go out without having to worry about having my head blown off because I wandered into the wrong area. Birmingham scares me. It's dirty, smelly, dangerous, and quite frankly, compared to other southern cities its size, boring as hell.

Places like Charlotte, Greenville, Nashville... they have left Birmingham in the dust because they got their shit together and brought themselves into the 21st century. Birmingham has yet to do that, and it shows no signs of trying. So far, Larry Langford has done nothing but prove to be what he really is. A puffed up blowhard so full of himself he couldn't see the asshole of horse if it were standing right in front of him. He's all talk. Always has been. What makes me so damn angry is, Birmingham could be doing the same things as the progressive cities in the south, it just seems hell bent on not improving itself in any way.

My opinion. You asked. :)

I did and thanks. But its kind of a stretch to say that some parts of this city is as bad as Baghdad, Iraq.

I agree with you on all points LSyd, but honestly why would you move back if you had the chance?

Read his signature.

well, not knowing too much about the State of Alabama (maybe enough to be dangerous), I would think that Mobile and Huntsville hurt Birmingham. Huntsville is a very well educated city with a lot of high tech jobs. It's proximity to both Atlanta and Nashville help and should keep it growing at a nice pace. Mobile, with its port and redevelopment, is another region in Alabama that seems more progressive and better suited for growth than the Birmingham. Toss in the fact that another city is the state capitol and you have 3 regions within the same state that are direct competition for Birmingham. For a state the size of Alabama, that makes it tough for any one city to pull ahead of the others.

cwilson758 - you should be aware the gross domestic product for Birmingham is greater than Montgomery, Huntsville and Mobile combined and our metropolitan unemployment rate is one of the best in the country.

I lived there for over a decade, and with the shape the city is in right now, you couldn't pay me enough to move back there.

I'm glad you left.

Even though I was born and raised here, if and when I leave I probably wont come back. I know thats bad to say about your hometown, but I would be lying if I said otherwise.

I can't figure you our Stuck in Bama - Are you for or against Birmingham?

Birmingham is a dangerous city - always has been.
I have lived here my entire life and have never had anything remotely criminal happen to me. It's all in the circles you run.

Who contributing to this thread can post something positive about Birmingham? Anybody?
We're too busy tearing it down and wishing we were Nashville, Atlanta or Charlotte.

I dare you to post something positive.

Are you guys aware there has been around a billion private dollars invested in downtown over the last 5-10 years on condo and loft developments? Some estimates say the downtown population is around 9,000

I agree with you on all points LSyd, but honestly why would you move back if you had the chance?.

Even though I was born and raised here, if and when I leave I probably wont come back. I know thats bad to say about your hometown, but I would be lying if I said otherwise.

it's because i'm getting old!!! no really, it seems like a great city for people in the early 30s wanting to settle down and raise a family.

-

Are you guys aware there has been around a billion private dollars invested in downtown over the last 5-10 years on condo and loft developments? Some estimates say the downtown population is around 9,000

Thats not good. :lol:

Who contributing to this thread can post something positive about Birmingham? Anybody?
We're too busy tearing it down and wishing we were Nashville, Atlanta or Charlotte.

I dare you to post something positive.

hmm, something positive about Birmingham. Wow, that's a hard one. OH, I do have one... it has cool old buildings. Damn, that hurt.

hmm, something positive about Birmingham. Wow, that's a hard one. OH, I do have one... it has cool old buildings. Damn, that hurt.

Let me see and where does Evan live.................... hmmmmm the armpit of the state?

BTW, Im trying my best to get others to see what Birmingham could be, but im just one guy, and maybe im wasting my time and talents that could be used in other places.

Dont flatter yourself. It appears to me that you have no talent. Merely bashing a city to the ground does not demonstrate talent. You offer no balance - it's all negative and negativity is easy and requires the LEAST effort. Comming together as a true metroipolitan region, putting differences aside for the common good, focusing on the positives and Offering solutions - now that's TALENT.

Who contributing to this thread can post something positive about Birmingham? Anybody?
We're too busy tearing it down and wishing we were Nashville, Atlanta or Charlotte.

I dare you to post something positive.

Envgraph................thanks for your positive comments. I will have the honor:

Here are a few projects…………………I could think of many more at various stages of development .
1) A new Marriott Renaissance hotel
2) A new $550-million Children’s Hospital (500 new jobs)…… and continued development in the UAB vicinity.
3) A new state of the art woman and infants hospital – project encompassing more than $300-million
4) A new linear park encompassing 14 city blocks
5) A new 1,100 acre urban park atop Red mounting – making Birmingham among the “greenest” cities in the nation
6) A new $70-million entertainment complex that will reflect the history of Birmingham’s past manufacturing heritage
7) A complete redevelopment of twelve city blocks – replacing a low-income housing development with new urbanism condos and apartments that blends with the city’s urban fabric.
8) Many mid-rise condo developments along Highland and loft redevelopments in downtown Birmingham
9) A proposed Platinum LEED certified high-rise (22-stories)
10) ANY yes I will say it…………………………… A new $500-million expansion of Birmingham’s convention complex that can be used to host collegiate bowl games, UAB football and SEC games in addition to more trade show space for huge conventions that are currently too big for Birmingham

And considering that Birmingham is the central city for a large metropolitan region, we could also include all the mid-rise condo, hotel and commercial developments in Homewood and Mt. Brook – both areas are part of Birmingham’s urban grid.

Now Birmingham bashers...............come out of your caves and post your remarks.

Let me see and where does Evan live.................... hmmmmm the armpit of the state?

I never said it wasn't, just that Birmingham was as well. :) Of course Gadsden is a shit hole, but it never tried to pretend it wasn't.

There is an important situation regarding the Birmingham region that everyone needs to be aware of, which may provide some understanding to the region’s situation:

The Birmingham region has never been favored by state government. This goes back many decades. Alabama’s very own George Wallace said that the Interstate network would NEVER be finished while he is Governor. And in fact, that happened. Birmingham was one of the LAST places in Alabama to have the interstate network finished – (Birmingham) the very place that was providing all the matching funds (state taxes) to build Alabama’s interstate network was PUNISHED because of the state’s anti-Birmingham sentiment. The Birmingham region generates an overwhelming majority of Alabama revenues for projects and infrastructure. We get back only a fraction of the money we send to the state. Places like Gadsden should be thanking God for Birmingham existence instead of bashing the place to hell. It would be a logical assumption to say that the taxes generated in Birmingham builds the infrastructure of Gadsden. Our interstate lights have been off for a whole decade – the largest urban center in the state. Over the past few years, there’s been an even bigger anti Birmingham sentiment in Alabama. I suppose this is a matter of convenience, because if everyone is against Birmingham, the state can continue to ignore the place. It comes as no surprise that there are favored cities in this state. Just consider where all the state investment is going. What’s really unfair, the Birmingham region is the state’s bank. Our region provides all the tax money to build the “favored” cities, while the sentiment toward Birmingham is “GO TO HELL YOU SHIT HOLE” but keep the tax money flowing our way. The anti- Birmingham sentiment has become quite fashionable in Alabama. It’s like a “clannish” anti big city attitude. It’s amazing that people buy into this sentiment. Then again, consider the sentiment of Alabamians against the Civil Rights Movement during the 1960s – and Birmingham is majority African American. Sure, Birmingham has had some leadership problems, but this anti-Birmingham sentiment (from people outside Birmingham) only perpetuates the problems Birmingham faces, including crime, crumbling infrastructure and poverty. People need to understand that the problems faced by Birmingham are not only a Birmingham issue. I’m beginning to wonder if these people want Birmingham to just die. Never have I experienced such hatred toward a region.

OK. Feel better?

NO! THIS IS IT PEOPLE! I'M MAD AS HELL! NOW CLAIM YOUR SIDE! YOU'RE EITHER A LOVER OR A HATER? I'M CALLING FOR A CHANGE RIGHT NOW AND AM STARTING WITH A MORE POSITIVE THREAD!


SO HOW ABOUT IT EVAN? ARE YOU A LOVER OR A HATER? DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO ADD?

STUCK IN BAMA? YOU WANT TO CONTRIBUTE YOUR TALENTS TO MAKE BIRMINGHAM BETTER? I DARE YOU TO START NOW!

YOU FOLKS NOT FROM BIRMINGHAM HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD?

SOME OF US LOVE OUR TOWN AND I WILL DEFEND IT UNTIL THIS THREAD IS SHUT DOWN!

Incidentally Evan - I saw your "quickly edited post" this am where you refered to Birmingham as a "shithole". I am insulted and demand an apology on behalf of the 229,000 people in the city and the 1.1 million in Greater Birmingham.

We work entirely to hard for an outsider to insult us and tell us what is wrong with our region.

You're a bit ridiculous.

Incidentally Evan - I saw your "quickly edited post" this am where you refered to Birmingham as a "shithole". I am insulted and demand an apology on behalf of the 229,000 people in the city and the 1.1 million in Greater Birmingham.

We work entirely to hard for an outsider to insult us and tell us what is wrong with our region.


You need to go back and read my posts again. They clearly say Birmingham is a shit hole. :) I edited my post because I was about to blast Vulcan, and realized he is just defending his area like anyone else would, so that is what I edited. Not that it is any of your gawd dayum business.

You're a bit ridiculous.


You're a bit ridiculous! Go back to Hialeah!

You need to go back and read my posts again. They clearly say Birmingham is a shit hole. :) I edited my post because I was about to blast Vulcan, and realized he is just defending his area like anyone else would, so that is what I edited. Not that it is any of your gawd dayum business.


Stop knocking my town. You act as if you have a vested interest! DO YOU?

You think you're so smart anonymously telling everyone what is wrong with Birmingham while carrying the "not a booster" of Birmingham flag.

We don't need that crap.

I can't figure you our Stuck in Bama - Are you for or against Birmingham?

Im still here, that must mean something. To answer your question I see things for what they really are. Im not a over zealous booster or one to paint a dark picture, just an objective opinion.

Who contributing to this thread can post something positive about Birmingham? Anybody?
We're too busy tearing it down and wishing we were Nashville, Atlanta or Charlotte.

I dare you to post something positive.

Sure, for a metro of 1.1 million, we are doing a very good job of keeping this area natural beauty. With the coming addition of Red Mountain Park this should boost our status of one of the greenest metros in the region.

it's because i'm getting old!!! no really, it seems like a great city for people in the early 30s wanting to settle down and raise a family.

-

Thats true, and maybe Birmingham should promote itself as such, but where does that leave the rest of us whom are under 30 and single???.

Let me see and where does Evan live.................... hmmmmm the armpit of the state?

Alot of people in this country thinks the whole state of Alabama is the armpit of the nation, so what's your point??.

Alot of people in this country thinks the whole state of Alabama is the armpit of the nation, so what's your point??.

Complete agreement

Dont flatter yourself. It appears to me that you have no talent. Merely bashing a city to the ground does not demonstrate talent. You offer no balance - it's all negative and negativity is easy and requires the LEAST effort. Comming together as a true metroipolitan region, putting differences aside for the common good, focusing on the positives and Offering solutions - now that's TALENT.

Bashing??, I guess making valid observations is now considered bashing.

I think you should take your cheerleader outfit off for a min and read my OP again.

There is an important situation regarding the Birmingham region that everyone needs to be aware of, which may provide some understanding to the region’s situation:

The Birmingham region has never been favored by state government. This goes back many decades. Alabama’s very own George Wallace said that the Interstate network would NEVER be finished while he is Governor. And in fact, that happened. Birmingham was one of the LAST places in Alabama to have the interstate network finished – (Birmingham) the very place that was providing all the matching funds (state taxes) to build Alabama’s interstate network was PUNISHED because of the state’s anti-Birmingham sentiment. The Birmingham region generates an overwhelming majority of Alabama revenues for projects and infrastructure. We get back only a fraction of the money we send to the state. Places like Gadsden should be thanking God for Birmingham existence instead of bashing the place to hell. It would be a logical assumption to say that the taxes generated in Birmingham builds the infrastructure of Gadsden. Our interstate lights have been off for a whole decade – the largest urban center in the state. Over the past few years, there’s been an even bigger anti Birmingham sentiment in Alabama. I suppose this is a matter of convenience, because if everyone is against Birmingham, the state can continue to ignore the place. It comes as no surprise that there are favored cities in this state. Just consider where all the state investment is going. What’s really unfair, the Birmingham region is the state’s bank. Our region provides all the tax money to build the “favored” cities, while the sentiment toward Birmingham is “GO TO HELL YOU SHIT HOLE” but keep the tax money flowing our way. The anti- Birmingham sentiment has become quite fashionable in Alabama. It’s like a “clannish” anti big city attitude. It’s amazing that people buy into this sentiment. Then again, consider the sentiment of Alabamians against the Civil Rights Movement during the 1960s – and Birmingham is majority African American. Sure, Birmingham has had some leadership problems, but this anti-Birmingham sentiment (from people outside Birmingham) only perpetuates the problems Birmingham faces, including crime, crumbling infrastructure and poverty. People need to understand that the problems faced by Birmingham are not only a Birmingham issue. I’m beginning to wonder if these people want Birmingham to just die. Never have I experienced such hatred toward a region.

Dude, this happens in alot of states. How many people in South Georgia do you think are anti-Atlanta??. Yeah, I agree that the state of Alabama doesnt give a shit about metro Birmingham, but it also seems like metro Birmingham doesnt give a shit about its self either by the so-called leadership that gets elected over and over again.

NO! THIS IS IT PEOPLE! I'M MAD AS HELL! NOW CLAIM YOUR SIDE! YOU'RE EITHER A LOVER OR A HATER? I'M CALLING FOR A CHANGE RIGHT NOW AND AM STARTING WITH A MORE POSITIVE THREAD!


SO HOW ABOUT IT EVAN? ARE YOU A LOVER OR A HATER? DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING CONSTRUCTIVE TO ADD?

STUCK IN BAMA? YOU WANT TO CONTRIBUTE YOUR TALENTS TO MAKE BIRMINGHAM BETTER? I DARE YOU TO START NOW!

YOU FOLKS NOT FROM BIRMINGHAM HAVE ANYTHING TO ADD?

SOME OF US LOVE OUR TOWN AND I WILL DEFEND IT UNTIL THIS THREAD IS SHUT DOWN!

And I dare you to stop making an ass of yourself. There is nothing wrong with defending a place, but to make yourself look like a ranting fool at the same time doesnt help.

Sure, for a metro of 1.1 million, we are doing a very good job of keeping this area natural beauty. With the coming addition of Red Mountain Park this should boost our status of one of the greenest metros in the region.

Have you ever noticed all the litter and trash along the highways and country roads throughout this region and the entire state? I do not think hat's very atractive.

Dude, this happens in alot of states. How many people in South Georgia do you think are anti-Atlanta??. Yeah, I agree that the state of Alabama doesnt give a shit about metro Birmingham, but it also seems like metro Birmingham doesnt give a shit about its self either by the so-called leadership that gets elected over and over again.

It's not going to change. So if this frustrates you, you may as well save yourself a lot of frustration and leave. This is one of the most uneducated states in the nation - often times choosing leaders based on perceived morality (anti-gay and pro gun). This is the way it's been for the state’s history and it's the way it will be for the foreseeable future (our lifetime).

Have you ever noticed all the litter and trash along the highways and country roads throughout this region and the entire state? I do not think hat's very atractive.

I agree, bring back the chain gangs to pick up trash.

It's not going to change. So if this frustrates you, you may as well save yourself a lot of frustration and leave. This is one of the most uneducated states in the nation - often times choosing leaders based on perceived morality (anti-gay and pro gun). This is the way it's been for the state’s history and it's the way it will be for the foreseeable future (our lifetime).

Sad, but true. :ohno:

Sad, but true. :ohno:

I’m always accused of being a cheerleader for Birmingham or Alabama. That’s fine. It’s not that I can’t see the reality, but my nature is to be positive. I’m very aware of all the negatives you try to make people see, but I have made a decision to live here (for now). I accept things I can’t change and try to make the best of reality. If it’s something I can’t change – it’s not worth having a stroke over. Realize these negative situations are here; but accept it and try to make the best of a bad situation – if you choose to stay. I’m confident that the Birmingham region and Alabama can be a better place. It’s really not that different from most other places I’ve visited.

I’m always accused of being a cheerleader for Birmingham or Alabama. That’s fine. It’s not that I can’t see the reality, but my nature is to be positive. I’m very aware of all the negatives you try to make people see, but I have made a decision to live here (for now). I accept things I can’t change and try to make the best of reality. If it’s something I can’t change – it’s not worth having a stroke over. Realize these negative situations are here; but accept it and try to make the best of a bad situation – if you choose to stay. I’m confident that the Birmingham region and Alabama can be a better place. It’s really not that different from most other places I’ve visited.

Im not one to be negative, but I see things for what they are. Im of the opinion of if you shine a light on the negative aspects of something, then maybe a solution can be found to turn a negative into something positive.

Personally im still playing with the idea of should I stay or go, but while im here I might as well do what I can to bring a better image to Birmingham.

I dont like being in a place known for just being a violent, hick town in a hick state.

You can call me a ranting fool if you like. Frankly, I don't care. Threads like this make me furious. We know our weaknesses. Outsiders do not have to make it clear for us.

It's obvious:
The city has a crime problem. Has had it for 50 years. It's not going to stop overnight.

Mass Transit sucks. People like driving their own cars. It's biting us in the ass as we speak.

City schools suck. Overly politicized and losing population.

Meanwhile - our suburbs are thriving.


Are those the answers you're looking for? We've been discussing them for decades.


Stuck in Bama - I don't know you. It seems like you need to make a personal decision of where you want to call home. Be aware that everywhere has problems and double-digit growth does not neccessarily make for a good home.

You're a bit ridiculous! Go back to Hialeah!

Never left. ;)

I'm glad to know where you are.

I'm not a over zealous booster or one to paint a dark picture, just an objective opinion.


I can respect that. There have been some insulting comments made and I am calling it out. I hope you can respect my stance to defend my home.

I'm glad to know where you are.

:shifty:

Birmingham does have some 'shit hole' characteristics. My family evacuated to Birmingham for a few days after Gustav and all they talked about was how dirty the place was, 'nasty little town' was my cousins exact quote. Granted they were staying in a hotel a few miles south of downtown with a bunch of other evacuees, but they are from New Orleans.

As far as being in the middle of one of the fastest growing areas in the country, I guess thats partly true. To the east is booming, but to the west is also stagnant. Outside of the Huntsville area Alabama is a pretty stagnant state then if you look at states to the west you dont see significantly high growth until you get to north western Arkansas (thanks Wal-Mart) or Dallas.

^^
Sounds like a pot and kettle scenario. New Orleans is notoriously known for being a nasty dump…………………And you want to talk about stagnant? Alabama has kicked Louisiana’s ass in economic development. It’s not even a comparison. “Nasty Little Town” give me a break. Our little town is about the size of New Orleans – our metro is much bigger.

This thread has become a bit ridiculous. We in Birmingham are not supposed to defend our city against attacks like this??? I do not care who the freaking mayor is of this city. I’m not going to stand by and allow people to just bash my home just for the hell of it. If the intentions of this thread was start a healthy debate – that one thing; but if it was intended to be used as a platform for the haters – then I strongly disagree. If this were another city or metro being bashed like this, it would be closed. This should not be tolerated.

Youre correct, Birmingham is much bigger than New Orleans in land area. The metros are around the same size even after Katrina.

They freely admit New Orleans is dirty, but it still kicks Birminghams ass and its not even close.

Youre correct, Birmingham is much bigger than New Orleans in land area. The metros are around the same size even after Katrina.

They freely admit New Orleans is dirty, but it still kicks Birminghams ass and its not even close.


That is certainly a matter of opinion and I'm not going to get into NOLA.
I don't bash.

Youre correct, Birmingham is much bigger than New Orleans in land area. The metros are around the same size even after Katrina.

They freely admit New Orleans is dirty, but it still kicks Birminghams ass and its not even close.

I seriously doubt that. New Orleans is in a most unfortunate situation. Actually it’s quite pitiful…..

We could turn this thread around if we wanted?

The title lends itself to being a discussion thread about social happenings in the city and different capital campaigns. We could even discuss our many problems in a more civil manner. (All shithole comments excluded)

Stuck in Bama - All you would have to do is go back and edit your opening post (if you can) and explain the craziness of the first 3(?) pages. Then explain what we want the thread to become - That is if you are interested.

Yeah, we can start by disregarding my negative comment about the Big Easy - truly one of the greatest cities in the world!

I created this thread basically for opinions on whats keeping Birmingham from having the same growth rate as other metros in the Sun-Belt, and what can be done to jump start growth.

I created this thread basically for opinions on whats keeping Birmingham from having the same growth rate as other metros in the Sun-Belt, and what can be done to jump start growth.


And that has led to a straight up shouting match. We know what is wrong.
I'll keep my mouth shut until the bashers return.

And that has led to a straight up shouting match. We know what is wrong.
I'll keep my mouth shut until the bashers return.

Apparently not, because nothing has been done to fix the problems this metro currently has.

The main problem here is that people here tend to hate change, anti-growth, wanting to keep this small, country town mentality, even though 1.1 million people live in this metro.

Why do people here fear a healthy or even a double digit growth rate?.

The people of Atlanta and Charlotte dont seem to have a problem with progress.

Apparently not, because nothing has been done to fix the problems this metro currently has.

The main problem here is that people here tend to hate change, anti-growth, wanting to keep this small, country town mentality, even though 1.1 million people live in this metro.

Why do people here fear a healthy or even a double digit growth rate?.

The people of Atlanta and Charlotte dont seem to have a problem with progress.


I don't fear double digit growth. I'd love to see it.
I'm just not hung up on it and don't believe it necessarily makes for a great city.

It bothers me that Alabama's largest metro has such a negative reputation. As far as Alabama cities go, I prefer Mobile but I like B'ham.

When I'm there, I mostly spend time in Vestavia, Hoover and Mountain Brook, and I never encounter crime. But from reading the news, I know there's plenty of it in the area, like someone said above, it depends on who you associate with and where you go. But when Birmingham continually ranks in the top in crime statistics, it's hard to bring new people in.

One problem I see is telling people outside of Alabama what Birmingham has to offer. I go there occasionally, and couldn't list ten things to see/do there. Since I'm in town mostly to visit family (now that Alabama doesn't play in Legion Field), I don't know what there is for a tourist to do in Birmingham. It's kind of like Augusta outside of Masters' Week - why would anyone come?

It bothers me that Alabama's largest metro has such a negative reputation. As far as Alabama cities go, I prefer Mobile but I like B'ham.

When I'm there, I mostly spend time in Vestavia, Hoover and Mountain Brook, and I never encounter crime. But from reading the news, I know there's plenty of it in the area, like someone said above, it depends on who you associate with and where you go. But when Birmingham continually ranks in the top in crime statistics, it's hard to bring new people in.

One problem I see is telling people outside of Alabama what Birmingham has to offer. I go there occasionally, and couldn't list ten things to see/do there. Since I'm in town mostly to visit family (now that Alabama doesn't play in Legion Field), I don't know what there is for a tourist to do in Birmingham. It's kind of like Augusta outside of Masters' Week - why would anyone come?

I don't believe Birmingham's overall reputation is negative. I know people all over the state that say they love visiting Birmingham for shopping or a day outing. Are you forming your opinion on comments made here or from actual conversation?

Crime is indeed a problem. Hopefully, our new chief (or the mommas and daddies) will be getting in under control soon. Hopefully.

No, we're not a tourist town. There was an article in the Birmingham Business Journal recently analyzing Birmingham's position in this 'slow' economy The lack of tourism was specifically listed as a bonus. Birmingham has done an excellent job over the last 30 years diversifying our economy and should withstand a recession with minimal damage. I'm keeping my fingers crossed.

FYI
We have some great localized destinations next time you are in the area.
Birmingham Zoo
The Birmingham Civil Rights Institute
Barber Motor Sports Museum
Alabama Adventure

It bothers me that Alabama's largest metro has such a negative reputation. As far as Alabama cities go, I prefer Mobile but I like B'ham.

When I'm there, I mostly spend time in Vestavia, Hoover and Mountain Brook, and I never encounter crime. But from reading the news, I know there's plenty of it in the area, like someone said above, it depends on who you associate with and where you go. But when Birmingham continually ranks in the top in crime statistics, it's hard to bring new people in.

One problem I see is telling people outside of Alabama what Birmingham has to offer. I go there occasionally, and couldn't list ten things to see/do there. Since I'm in town mostly to visit family (now that Alabama doesn't play in Legion Field), I don't know what there is for a tourist to do in Birmingham. It's kind of like Augusta outside of Masters' Week - why would anyone come?
Try this site. There's tons of things to do:

http://www.birminghamal.org/

i actually like Birmingham's tourist choices; they're very authentic and real-life. historic and educational. here's some:

- civil rights institute
- sloss furnaces
- vulcan statue
- birmingham zoo
- barber motorsports

and on the cheesier side of things, visionland (or whatever it's called now.)

-

It's Alabama Adventure now, and that little park is slowly improving. The current company that owns it seems to be willing to actually put some money into it.

I'm not saying B'ham has nothing to offer, just that as someone from another city, I don't know what there is. I will check out the site above. I didn't realize Visionland/Alabama Adventure was open, I'm glad to see it is.

I've never been to the zoo, but next time I'm in town I'll go.

The most infamous view of Birmingham:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Mb6RZ1LBPc

I love the Highland Avenue Area / parks

Barber Mortrsports: Largest mortorcycle museum in the world w/ a major addition underway

McWane Center: Largest science museum in a six state region

Birmingham Art Museum: The largest and definitely among the best in the south.

Birmingham Civil Rights Museum: Noted as the best in the world.

Birmingham Zoo: Outstanding

Birmingham Botanical Gardens - can't be matched

Rickwood Caverins: Incredible / huge cave

Oak Mountain: Largest state park in Alabama and a noted mountain biking park in the U.S.

Downtown Homewood: spena a whole day there

Southside/ Lakeview and Downtown Birmingham - visit just for the architecture alone

Alabama Adventure: largest theme park / water park in Alabama

Tannehill State Park: awsome historical museum of Alabama Civil War history

American Village in Shelby County: replicas of famous American historical buildings - a must see

Vulcan Statue and Park: (that's ME!) the largest metal statue in the worls and the second largest (YES I said LARGE baby) in the U.S.

Ruffner Mountain Nature Preserve

Now the newly developed Red Mountain Park

..................... and the new Linear Park being developed in the middle of Downtown.

For the small village experience visit Springville, nice restaurants, stores or Helena - nicer quaint village

tons more stuff to do..................

In what way is the Birmingham Art Museum the largest in the South? Square footage? Not. Permanent exhibits? I don't think so.

What can't the Birmingham Botanical Gardens be matched with? There are many Botanical Gardens in the Southeast that are known to be better...

In what way is the Birmingham Zoo "outstanding"?

In what way is the Birmingham Art Museum the largest in the South? Square footage? Not. Permanent exhibits? I don't think so.

What can't the Birmingham Botanical Gardens be matched with? There are many Botanical Gardens in the Southeast that are known to be better...

In what way is the Birmingham Zoo "outstanding"?



PLEASE CONSIDER THE BIRMINGHAM VS ATLANTA COMPARISONS FOR EACH OF THE TOURIST VENUES LISTED BELOW


1) Birmingham Museum of Art:

http://www.artsbma.org/

WIKOPEDIA

Founded in 1951, the Birmingham Museum of Art today has one of the finest collections in the Southeast, with more than 17,000 paintings, sculptures, prints, drawings, and decorative arts representing a numerous diverse cultures, including Asian, European, American, African, Pre-Columbian, and Native American. Among other highlights, the Museum’s collection of Asian art is considered the finest and most comprehensive in the Southeast, and its Vietnamese ceramics one of the finest in the U.S. The Museum also is home to a remarkable Kress collection of Renaissance and Baroque paintings, sculpture, and decorative arts from the late 13th century to c.1750, and the 18th-century European decorative arts include superior examples of English ceramics and French furniture.

The largest municipally-owned art museum in the Southeast, the recently expanded and renovated Birmingham Museum of Art is owned by the City of Birmingham and encompasses 3.9 acres in the heart of the city’s cultural district. Erected in 1959, the present building was designed by architects Warren, Knight and Davis, and a major renovation and expansion by Edward Larrabee Barnes of New York was completed in 1993. The facility encompasses 180,000 square feet, including an outdoor sculpture garden. The Dwight and Lucille Beeson Wedgwood Collection is the finest outside England, comprising more than 1,400 objects illustrating the entire production of the Wedgwood factory from its early years through the 19th century.

........................and High Museum from WIKEPODIA

The High Museum holds more than 11,000 works of art in its permanent collection. Included in this collection are 19th and 20th century American art; European art; decorative art; African American art; modern and contemporary art; photography and African art. Highlights of the permanent collection include works by Giovanni Battista Tiepolo, Claude Monet, Martin Johnson Heade, Dorothea Lange, Clarence John Laughlin, and Chuck Close


2) Birmingham Botanical Gardens:

http://www.bbgardens.org/

WIKOPEDIA

The Birmingham Botanical Gardens is a 67.5 acre (273,000 m²) botanical garden located inside of Lane Park at the southern foot of Red Mountain in Birmingham, Alabama. It is home to some 3,000 different types of plants in 20 different gardens that includes a Japanese garden. With more than 300,000 annual visitors, the Birmingham Botanical Gardens is Alabama's top free-admittance attraction.

The gardens includes a garden center that has a library, auditorium, Linn-Henley Lecture Hall, Blount Education Center, Gerlach Plant Information Center, Alabama Cooperative Extension System office, Arrington Children’s Plant Adventure Zone, and a restaurant named "Cafe' de France".

AL Tourism Dept.

Birmingham Botanical Gardens is the oldest municipally owned garden in Alabama with 67 acres containing more than 25 display gardens, largest clearspan greenhouse in Southeast.

.......................... and Atlanta Botanical Gardens from WIKOPEDIA

The Atlanta Botanical Garden is a 30 acre (12 hectare) botanical garden located adjacent to Piedmont Park in Midtown Atlanta, Georgia, USA. Incorporated in 1976, the garden's mission is to "develop and maintain plant collections for the purposes of display, education, conservation, research and enjoyment". [1]

3. Birmingham Zoo

http://www.birminghamzoo.com/about.asp


One of the largest zoos in the Southeast, the Birmingham Zoo exhibits mammals, birds, and reptiles in near-natural surroundings within a 100-acre compound. Rare species such as Siberian tigers, white rhinoceroses, gorillas, and polar bears join exhibits of specimens from nations around the globe. The Social Animals Building is the latest example of a leading-edge zoo concept that groups animals in exhibits according to lifestyle characteristics rather than species. In 2005, the zoo will celebrate its 50th year with the addition of a $15 million exhibit devoted to the urban, rural and wild animals and environment of Alabama. Across the street from the zoo are Birmingham's internationally known Botanical Gardens, which offer the visitor both indoor and outdoor plant displays of common and rare plants. Among its more than 67 acres of flowers and plants from all over the world are an authentic Japanese garden and a rose garden featuring more than two thousand blooming plants.

..........................and Atlanta Zoo from WIKOPEDIA
http://74.125.45.104/search?q=cache:WulplGfq2PkJ:en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zoo_Atlanta+zoo+atlanta+wikipedia&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

I will give you that one. Zoo Atlanta is larger and has a bigger collection (not necessarily better); However, Birmingham Zoo is very nice and beautiful - only minutes from downtown.


Now, you answer these questions:

1) Which Southeastern Art Museum is BETTER than Birmingham certainly NOT the High Museum...????????
2) What Botanical Gardens is better - certainly NOT Atlanta Botanical Gardens?????????????????????????
3) Does Atlanta have better museums than Birmingham???????????? Care to look at other Birmingham OUTSTANDING museums?????????????? Care to compare???????????

We all know BIGGER is better...dumbass. You people in Birmingham sure are nasty bitches.

You're the one trying to compare Birmingham to Atlanta...I wasn't going to embarass the city of Birmingham by doing so. That's your business if you want to...after all, Birmingham is the potential Olympic City!:lol:

We all know BIGGER is better...dumbass. You people in Birmingham sure are nasty bitches.

And you're an embarrassment to mother nature. :ohno:

Ummmm....bigger isn't always better. That's pretty subjective. But those were some good stats, contained some information I didn't know. The only thing is that Atlanta has excelled in highlighting its tourist attractions and that's something Birmingham still has to work on, at least from my perspective. Perhaps the dome/BJCC expansion will help to do that.

Excellent post Vulcan!

I've learned something valuable today I would like to share with the more civilized - skyscrapercity.com is more enjoyable when you block ole weime.

Personally I enjoy both museums. BMA and High.

I see this thread is still going strong. I don't know whether that's a good thing or not. I'm late but for my two cents: Birmingham is one of America's great cites. Through laughing? Great! I say this because is was Birmingham that caused America to take a collective look at itself and confront its demons (September 1963). It was Birmingham that helped America become the industrial powerhouse it was during the 20th century. That city has more going for it than people like to give credit for.

So, what's the problem? In a nutshell: leadership. Couple that with a state population that piggybacks on the city's economic success while curiously shunning it at the same time and you find yourself with what we have now.

While Birmingham was being run by Bull Conner and corrupt politicians, Atlanta (our rival at the time) was benefiting from those like Mayor Ivan Allen, William Harstfield, etc. It's a disturbing trend that even continues today (Franklin trumps Langford any day).

The only thing we can do is remain dedicated to Birmingham and her potential. To stay and fight for the things she deserves. To willingly open the door to those outside the state... to those who can appreciate what the city has to offer in hopes that, one day, the voice of a few will eventually become the voice of many.

That said, I'll leave you with this quote:

"Cities are what men make them."

Ummmm....bigger isn't always better. That's pretty subjective. But those were some good stats, contained some information I didn't know. The only thing is that Atlanta has excelled in highlighting its tourist attractions and that's something Birmingham still has to work on, at least from my perspective. Perhaps the dome/BJCC expansion will help to do that.

I agree. Birmingham's central core (where the convention expansion will take shape) has several really nice attractions:

Birmingham Museum of Art / Linn Park
Birmingham Civil Rights Museum / Kelly Ingraham Park
McWane Science Museum
Alabama Sports Hall of Fame
Vulcan Park and Museum
Sloss Furnace National Historic Landmark
Theater District: The Alabama, The Carver and the Lyric Vaudville Theater (redevelopment)
Railroad REservation Park (Linear Park)

I see this thread is still going strong. I don't know whether that's a good thing or not. I'm late but for my two cents: Birmingham is one of America's great cites. Through laughing? Great! I say this because is was Birmingham that caused America to take a collective look at itself and confront its demons (September 1963). It was Birmingham that helped America become the industrial powerhouse it was during the 20th century. That city has more going for it than people like to give credit for.

So, what's the problem? In a nutshell: leadership. Couple that with a state population that piggybacks on the city's economic success while curiously shunning it at the same time and you find yourself with what we have now.

While Birmingham was being run by Bull Conner and corrupt politicians, Atlanta (our rival at the time) was benefiting from those like Mayor Ivan Allen, William Harstfield, etc. It's a disturbing trend that even continues today (Franklin trumps Langford any day).

The only thing we can do is remain dedicated to Birmingham and her potential. To stay and fight for the things she deserves. To willingly open the door to those outside the state... to those who can appreciate what the city has to offer in hopes that, one day, the voice of a few will eventually become the voice of many.

That said, I'll leave you with this quote:

"Cities are what men make them."

That's so very ture. It's hard to beleive that in 1950, Atlanta had only 6,000 more population than Birmingham. Birmingham fought change and Atlanta became the "City too Busy to Hate".

Birmingham did teach the U.S. and the world a great social lesson. That's why the Civil Rights Heritage tour is such a growing part of Birmingham tourism sector. THere's the Civil Rights Museum and all the other Civil Rights landmarks throughout downtown Bham.

Excellent post Vulcan!

I've learned something valuable today I would like to share with the more civilized - skyscrapercity.com is more enjoyable when you block ole weime.

Thanks.
There are many things to learn about the region - no need to believe everything you are told. Sometimes I'm surprised as well.

I see this thread is still going strong. I don't know whether that's a good thing or not. I'm late but for my two cents: Birmingham is one of America's great cites. Through laughing? Great! I say this because is was Birmingham that caused America to take a collective look at itself and confront its demons (September 1963). It was Birmingham that helped America become the industrial powerhouse it was during the 20th century. That city has more going for it than people like to give credit for.

So, what's the problem? In a nutshell: leadership. Couple that with a state population that piggybacks on the city's economic success while curiously shunning it at the same time and you find yourself with what we have now.

While Birmingham was being run by Bull Conner and corrupt politicians, Atlanta (our rival at the time) was benefiting from those like Mayor Ivan Allen, William Harstfield, etc. It's a disturbing trend that even continues today (Franklin trumps Langford any day).

The only thing we can do is remain dedicated to Birmingham and her potential. To stay and fight for the things she deserves. To willingly open the door to those outside the state... to those who can appreciate what the city has to offer in hopes that, one day, the voice of a few will eventually become the voice of many.

That said, I'll leave you with this quote:

"Cities are what men make them."

Now that is a post worth reading and responding to...old crazy is just in and out of these threads running his mouth and causing problems. He was looking for someone to hate on Birmingham, so I gave it to him. I love Birmingham, have been there several times...half of my friends in Atlanta are from Birmingham. Big nasty mouths like envgraph draw hate...that's a fact. Level headed comments like the ones above draw discussion.

Congratulations Birmingham!!!

I hope they get through the nominations process and win it, it would be nice to have the Olympics so close to Atlanta !!! Maybe they could have some events in GA, like maybe at Lake Lanier or something again, who knows.