Bulgaria in the New York Times

[3tmk]

ouch
first page news, a very big article that just throws punch after punch on the worst of the worst

I wonder if the mutri even care about the nyt though :lol:

It is a long article, so I'll just post some excerpts
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/16/world/europe/16bulgaria.html?scp=2&sq=bulgaria&st=cse

“Other countries have the mafia,” said Atanas Atanasov, a member of Parliament and a former counterintelligence chief who is a magnet for leaked documents exposing corruption. “In Bulgaria, the mafia has the country.”

By almost any measure, Bulgaria is the most corrupt country in the 27-member European Union. Since it joined last year, it has emerged as a cautionary tale for Western nations confronting the stark reality and heavy costs of drawing fragile post-Communist nations into their orbit, away from Russia’s influence.
The European Union, eager to improve the lives of the 7.5 million Bulgarians, has promised 11 billion euros, or nearly $15 billion, in aid.

Far from halting crime and violence, the money effectively spread the corruption. Once Bulgaria’s shady businessmen realized how much European Union money was at stake, said many of Sofia’s advocates for reform, they moved from buying off politicians to being directly involved in politics themselves.

And so European officials froze almost $670 million in financing this summer and may halt the flow of billions more, alarmed at freewheeling white-collar criminals with links to the very highest reaches of power.
essman and three bodyguards.

The toll now tops more than 125 contract killings since 1993, according to a list compiled by the United States Embassy in Sofia, which does not include at least four people killed this year, including the head of an energy company. Most of the killings are unsolved.
Kremikovtzi, an insolvent Communist-era steel plant and one of Bulgaria’s largest companies, has become a test case. Foreign creditors — many of them American hedge funds — are pursuing a $474 million claim against Kremikovtzi, whose former chief executive is under investigation by the Bulgarian authorities for fraud and embezzlement.

“When your law enforcement system isn’t cleaning up the corruption in the legal system, who do we go to?” asked Justin Holland, an adviser to the Kremikovtzi investors committee, “Literally, we cannot go to anybody in Bulgaria.”

Among Western nations, impatience is growing, particularly at the lack of trials of high-level government officials accused of corruption. As Frans Timmermans, the Dutch minister for European affairs, argued, “What we need to see is real people put before real judges, convicted and put in jail.”

[Turnovec]

The same is in The International Herald Tribune ...

http://iht.com/articles/2008/10/15/europe/bulgaria.php?page=2

I am expecting tonight the president Parvanov and the PM Stanishev to announce on a press conference that this is just one additional part in the international dirty campaign against Bulgaria :lol:

[JuMPer]

:lol:

[Tego]

It's official now, my national self esteem dropped below zero. Say again, when are the next elections?

[zzibit]

3tmk why would you post this here?

[ВМРО]

It's official now, my national self esteem dropped below zero. Say again, when are the next elections?

Nothing is going to happen/change after the next elections, although I really hope that the tripartite coalition will become a tripartite opposition(hopefully NDSV will be out of the parliament).
http://aresearch.org/userfiles/image/dnevnik_09091.gif
http://aresearch.org/userfiles/image/dnevnik_09092.gif

[radi6404]

Gerp will win, tha´ts ovious unfortunately the elections are still very far away.

[bgrs]

Haaah, BSP and DPS are only 20.9% of the population?!? I thought there are more pensioners and chalga lovers over here!!!

[ВМРО]

Haaah, BSP and DPS are only 20.9% of the population?!? I thought there are more pensioners and chalga lovers over here!!!

20.9% of the population, 33,92% real votes, 41.38% of the deputy's seats without including the "hidden vote" for DPS.

[Cyberflow]

Haaah, BSP and DPS are only 20.9% of the population?!? I thought there are more pensioners and chalga lovers over here!!!
What's in common between chalga and DPS? I don't know a single turk who listens to this plagiatic crap. They have their own music. Chalga is the mentality of the bulgarian majority, ain't that right, now? Mostly of those who have more importan't business than voting.

[Turnovec]

^^ Yeah and the USA are still full of rednecks still chewing tobacco ... but ...

[Ivanski]

What difference does it make anyway? Who cares about that newspaper and regular American reader.. 3/4 of the people who read the article probably thought of Bolivia or Hungary anyway :lol: .. I mean i heard somewhere that a women from the States actually believed that Russia attacked the state of Georgia :rofl:

[zzibit]

damn it, these pricks put it on the front page
http://www.nytimes.com/pages/world/index.html

[3tmk]

3tmk why would you post this here?

what do you mean? I thought of putting it in the OT thread, but since I was pretty surprised this morning when I saw it on the first page, I thought it deserves its own thread.
Because of all the negative articles they've made about us, this one really hit hard

[just4ivaylo]

“Other countries have the mafia,” said Atanas Atanasov, a member of Parliament and a former counterintelligence chief who is a magnet for leaked documents exposing corruption. “In Bulgaria, the mafia has the country.”

It was because of that quote that it made the first page. :lol:

[Делян]

They should not use the word mafia, instead they should use the word communists.....

[zzibit]

what do you mean? I thought of putting it in the OT thread, but since I was pretty surprised this morning when I saw it on the first page, I thought it deserves its own thread.
Because of all the negative articles they've made about us, this one really hit hard

making it stand out in a thread of its doesn't really help Bulgaria's image on SSC. Yes, all of know that this is happening and it's nothing new. But is this the message that we should be sending the world "Welcome to mafialand"? By emphasizing our weaknesses we are shooting ourselves in the foot even more.

[insertnickhere]

elections wont fix squat.

execute the judiciary and oversight bodies, mayors, commissioners, advisors, police supervisors (no exact translation really...), company registers and all rules concerning taxation and incorporation should also be cleaned along with voting and immigration reform.

THEN

elect whoever you want in parliament. It wouldnt matter! Just like it does not matter who is elected now. Dont you bloody see it? bloody hell ive funded half the people in my area over the years, and none of it has trickled up to petkov or purvanov or videnov or who was that other idiot.. kostov. Their trustees only operate within the local realm. Unless you change it, its pointless. Their companies are not affected by who the president is! They are affected by the board and the mayor. They are the ones who authorize land transactions, bids, contracts, oversee the police etc. Clueless, the lot of you!

On the other hand i am amazed how touchy people are. What the f are you hiding? I think people need to know exactly how things are because right now it is not slander but rather reflecting reality. Are you even remotely aware of the number of people who bought into all the hippy crap only to be royally screwed by rampant crime and aimless cops? Then left and never returned. Because if you think the damage these people will do from word of mouth is less than what some pos article on the frontpage of a commie (oh yes nyt is communist, read up) paper would do, you are so far up naive land it is appaling.

Perhaps dirty laundry needs to be aired, only then it can be contained. It will never be fixed. Italy will never be fixed, we will never be fixed. All you can hope to do is create a balance where you can have certain measures against lawless screwing and just legalize it. Say if you get screwed, you can seek retribution, not get your domicile vandalized (you know what i am talking about right). Sorta like in other countries....

[3tmk]

making it stand out in a thread of its doesn't really help Bulgaria's image on SSC. Yes, all of know that this is happening and it's nothing new. But is this the message that we should be sending the world "Welcome to mafialand"? By emphasizing our weaknesses we are shooting ourselves in the foot even more.

I have a feeling that were it not me or us, some crazy guy would have started the thread.
Besides, I prefer having us discuss these topics as being conscious of the problems, instead of what some of our neighbors do, try to use the forums as propaganda machines to make others think that everything is rosy in their country.

[insertnickhere]

But we make everything to be a graveyard even if its rosy...... grass is greener... well 2 doors down.

I hear people having a sinister laugh about the current credit situation gleeming with joy how all those who pulled credit will suffocate. They dont realize that those people did more in the past 5 years than the naysayers did in a lifetime of nickle and diming it

but hey, we love it when it sucks for others. its sorta the customary way

[Dulgeroff]

Why are you guys so saddened by this news?

We should all be proud that our Mafia is gaining international recognition for its competitive standing in the capitalist black market money-hungry dog-eat-dog globalizing world where sex, guns and green(US currency and Marry-J) is a one way ticket to manmade heaven as sponsored by Luxembourg's banks, stimulated by America's Wallstreet and fashioned by a thick-neck named Dimitar the Doctor. Pretty soon there will even be Hollywood movies dedicated to our mafiosos. I can't think of better advertising for our little nation.

Haven't you heard that the next Batman movie is called: Dark Knight Vs the Dark Bulgar

Hey, if our criminal masterminds control our county whilst they have found their competitive advantage in various international profit driven activities, then it is only logical to conclude that our country is as a result also competitive. As BB once said, "our criminals make the best counterfit Euros cause we're not a stupid nation." :)

[Turnovec]

Аз вече почвам да си мисля, че това сме си ние и толкова си можем като народ. От Бай Иван от село Калиманци до Бай Гоце президента на републиката ...

В една друга тема се разизкваше заселването на британци по нашите земи ... Е и аз имам какво да кажа по темата. Имам едни комшии в селото ми до Велико Търново - на около 40 години, мъж и жена. Свестни хора - не са дошли само да пият и да мързелуват като някои други свои сънародници, а се опитват да се нагодят към всички сфери на живота в България. За 2 години имат завиден напредък в усвояването на нашия език, мъжа си направи цех за правене на колбаси ... жената се занимава с шиене. Изобщо не стоят на едно място - създават работа за други българи - полезни са на себе си и обществото. И тези хора миналото лято 2(ДВА) пъти им обираха къщата ... в българско село ... с население от българи ... Вторият път докато те и техни приятели от ЮК си бяха у дома! Техните приятели имаха намерение да си купят също имот в България и да инвестират в някакво малко производство... след тая случка познайте какво стана с тези им техни намерения...

А най-фрапиращата случка за която знам е от друго село - в Стражишка община. Пак семейство англичани си купуват имот. Почти две години мъжа идва и се занимава с ремонти , обзавеждане и т.н. Понеже има хубава работа и не може все още да я изостави съвсем(пак семейство на средна възраст, а не пенсионери) в края на лятото оставя къщата на грижите на местно семейство, срещу заплащане - местно семейство българи, а не цигани или турци ... След това въпросното семейство цяла зима организира разпродажба на обзавеждането на къщата, техниката вътре, инструменти и какво ли не. Съселяните, пак Българи си купуват на преференциални цени и никой ни дума не обелва нито се опитва да сезира някой, че се върши нещо нередно с чужда собственост... Накрая семейството англичани си идват обратно на пролет и заварват празна и опустошена къща ... а семейството дето са наели да се грижи за нея се оказват емигрирали в чужбина. И още по-лошото е, че никой от съселяните купили си на ниски цени от техните неща не се намира да дойде и да ги върне обратно или да се почувства неудобно поне да се извини ...

Ей това е ... в Българско село , с население от българи , а не цигани или турци.

Сега само сменете мащаба - представете си, че това става не само в едно село ами в цяла държава и то не само с чужденци ами всеки го прави със всеки и със всичко и ще получите много точна представа за България и нейния народ....

Изобщо да се чудиш какво се е случило с възрожденските ни идеали ... с достойните хора от това време, как за 50-60 години успя толкова много да се изроди това общество и народ... Колко точно са хората в тая държава извън обществената шизофрения, които смятат себе си за нормални българи и европейци, не купуват кафенце за 20 лева на пътния полицай, не си хвърлят боклука през прозореца, не ходят на врачки, не харесват Бойко Борисов и не тъгуват за времето на Тодор Живков, защото саламът бил евтин.... и т.н. :ohno:

[insertnickhere]

been there paid for it turnovec. few times over.



it is sad when it seemingly happens to people who it should not happen to, but such is the opportunist. Discrepancy of wealth means you need to be mindful of your surroundings. you cannot just make a house amidst a bunch of people who have way less than you. Nowhere in the world is this really possible any more.

[bgrs]

Хаха има интернет-петиция за връчване на орден "Стара планина" на братята Галеви :)

http://www.bgpetition.com/orden-galevi/index.html

[Turnovec]

Хаха има интернет-петиция за връчване на орден "Стара планина" на братята Галеви :)

http://www.bgpetition.com/orden-galevi/index.html

^^ Yep! They have been searching for them with the special forces yesterday in order to give them the medals :lol:

It is more than obvious now that the current rulers of Buglaria are living in some kind of a parralel virtual reality that has nothing to do with the real one ...

[bgrs]

BSPlandia :)

[insertnickhere]

more like the crap from ndsv hit the fan.....

[Turnovec]

more like the crap from ndsv hit the fan.....

^^ No , no .... NO! :)

Galevi Brothers , Batkov ... Lyudmil Stoykov etc. etc. ... are all pure R.E.D. Line-a :)

[bgrs]

NDSV are loyal coallition partners! How dare you blame it on them! :)

[ВМРО]

The transition towards free market and capitalism seems to be everything but successful, though the transition towards innovative feudal system conducted by Dogan is giving positive results.



Петричкият Альо броил по 20 лева на калпак за ДПС вот (http://www.dnes.bg/article.php?id=59107)

По 20 лева за глас в полза на ДПС е плащал ромският бос Альоша Ангелов, стана ясно по време на заседанието на съда в Петрич.

От прокуратурата стана ясно още, че в тетрадките, открити в дома на Альо дни преди извънредния вот за общински съветници в Петрич, Альо вписвал трите имена, ЕГН, сумата, която е платил на лицето, и в коя секционна комисия гласува.

От разпитаните "по списък" 25 лица се разбра, че Альо плащал за гласове за ДПС.

Въпреки това Ангелов бе пуснат на свобода срещу 1000 лева гаранция.

В същото време известният в Петричко като "човека митница" Марио Минев остава под домашен арест, решиха магистратите в южния град.

Минев бе задържан във вторник след нанесения жесток побой над лидера на "Атака" в региона Огнян Тетимов.

Минев пристигна от болницата в съдебната зала вчера около 18,30 часа. Както се потвърди и от съдебномедицинската експертиза - той страда от сърдечно заболяване и не може да лежи в килията.


Драшков спрял "Лиана"-та срещу ДПС (http://www.dnes.bg/article.php?id=59038)


Отстраненият от поста зам.-председател на ДАНС Иван Драшков вероятно е прикрил спецразработка срещу ДПС, обяви председателят на ПГ на СДС Йордан Бакалов.

"На мен ми прави впечатление активната защита на Ахмед Доган спрямо Драшков. Тя е свързана с това и той тепърва ще започне да се пазари за определени позиции", заяви пред bTV синият депутат.

"Имаше разработка срещу ДПС преди време, която впоследствие беше прикрита. Такава активна позиция аз досега от Доган не съм виждал", заключи.

Преди време в медийното пространство се пусна слухът за разработката "Лиана", която е свързана с черни каси на ДПС, в които били събирани парите от рушвети от дървената мафия в страната.

"Лиана" е тръгнала от делото "Сови", при което били установени митнически нарушения - прикриване на ДДС и занижаване на цените на вносни стоки.

Опозицията твърди, че данните са изпратени в прокуратурата, която образувала досъдебно производство срещу двама души, но делата били спрени поради липса на доказателства.

[vycanismajoris]

And speaking about politics:


In Poland for example the biggest one is the german minority. Reaserches show that there are about 1 000 000 germans living in Poland (Silesia, Pomorze, Mazury regions). This miniority has got the right for 2 representatives in polish parliment, no matter how many votes they are able to collect.

I wonder how can Poland do that, and we can't. Seems like in Bulgaria there is no will for such an initiative.

[insertnickhere]

well... ww2.... poland... germany.... thats how

meanwhile our history has been wiped out so we can all sing some virtual fire chant and stab each other in the dark side of the fire

[bgrs]

Nah we tried that in 1945, it lead to a disaster.

[Drunken_Disorder]

I am from Canada and I have lived in Australia for a few years I have been to your country and I have to say Bulgaria is a lovely country, the people are very nice I had a great time. You guys deserve better than this and I support you! Bless you all:)

[Cosmin]

^^Yada yada yada Rich.:lol:

[Singidunum]

I expected to read something about tourism, seaside and mountain resorts but it seems the NYT has a grudge against Bulgaria to put this on first page. On the other hand mafia president REALLY needs to go. It's not NYT or 3tmk who are creating a bad image but a "thick neck" president.

[insertnickhere]

I think what happened is they are mad we no longer play lapdog to the IMF and WB and that ticked them off so they ran the article out of spite

but like i said, nyt is communist left wing pinko liberal paper as it is.. most people disregard it and they have been discredited many times in the past

On the other hand, i cannot say they wrong per say. Like i said earlier, you cannot just downplay certain things because eventually people will come to face with them.

The president was much more independent in the past.. recently something is going on though. People suiciding left and right, others disappearing, others giving bjs to other politicians.... unusual.

Either a clense or the last stick with which to beat any opposition away. Time will tell.

[Cosmin]

People suiciding left and right, others disappearing, others giving bjs to other politicians.... unusual.
What.the.fuck?:crazy:

[insertnickhere]

You must have missed on the news.... 2 people dead, 1 a fairly well ranked politician, 3rd person mia, stanishev praising one of his coalition partners like a god, the other calling him his majesty, said partner then changing the name of the party.....

not bad for 30 hours

[Cosmin]

Ours are just as fucked up, but generally we have less (no) dead people it seems (pussies!). Are the two dead guys politicians?

[JuMPer]

^^ no just 1...killed by his own party. anyhow, this is a weird case cuz its a well established rule that u dont kill politicians. though i dont know about RO media but BG media only knows how to write about who killed who or gossip crap and it seems to most bulgarians that murders are a lot while in fact they are on a low level compared to the west. and thats what i call media terrorism.

[Turnovec]

Cosmin, did Gigi Becali received some medal of honour from your President ?
I am asking because one of the interesting news these days here is that Parvanov gave a medal "Stara Planina" to the president of FC Levski :lol: A famous thick head, apperantly from the ex secret police etc.... who also managed to ruinFC Levski.

[Cosmin]

JuMPer, our media is also full of murders, rapes and all sorts of fatal car crashes. Nothing too high level though; just some guy that killed his mother/neighbour/wife/family with an axe or some father abusing his daughter and I see that lately it's hip to torture animals, especially horses. Our news journals are full of this crap but then again, I generally don't watch TV for news, let alone Romanian channels, for a few years now. Long live RSS!:lol:

Turnovec, not AFAIK, no.:lol: He does claim to be "the light warrior" though and compares himself to Stephen The Great, so I guess he doesn't need a real medal from the president as he already has lots of imaginary ones.:nuts:

[insertnickhere]

Ours are just as fucked up, but generally we have less (no) dead people it seems (pussies!). Are the two dead guys politicians?

1, the other a criminal doctor (some stupid commie term i cant quite translate.. forensic investigator of sorts) who worked on some high profile cases it seems

and the 3rd a former customs agent, charged in a number of things. just vanished. along with most of the football club owners as of late.......

.
and i disagree. we are more fucked up. relinquish the title! :lol:

[[s2jc]hyp]

how is it possible to have 15% BSP supporters and 5% for DPS?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!?!? This means 15% of the population in mutras and their children and 5% in turkish and gypsy swarms! it doesn't look like that at first though. I'd think those guys show up in the streets only on election day...

[insertnickhere]

DPS is actually quite standard. they get another 2-3% from turks and misc cigani who are never around for these surveys

15% for bsp is also quite standard. the hike around last election was due to the withdrawal from ndsv and disgust with sds (all of them) rather than an actual electorate.

[[s2jc]hyp]

^^ the retired who are still living in 'cold war' time. only 30% are sane young ppl who refuse to vote :(

[insertnickhere]

40% and going up....

honestly ive no clue who to vote for so i will probably skip next elections and just drink beer, in spite of their ban

[blago84]

"a criminal doctor" - I think that "forensic medic" is the right term for this :)

About voting - I think that everyone should vote - If you don't know who is worthy for your vote - the select those who mustn't be allowed to power at any cost and then make a random choice of who's left. That's what I do when I'm not sure who is worthy for my vote. Because otherwise I'm just leaving my future in the hands of the red grannies and the gypsy-turks

[Cosmin]

"a criminal doctor" - I think that "forensic medic" is the right term for this :)
Forensic investigator or criminalist (more narrow definition) is probably the correct term in English.

A "criminal doctor" would be a deranged medic that goes around killing people.:lol:

[blago84]

According to Wikipedia "forensic pathologist" is the correct term :)

"Criminal doctor" sounds really crazy (But I like it :nuts: )

[Делян]

in other news, this time from Washington Times (http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2008/oct/18/poland-excluded-from-visa-waiver-list/)....

At a Rose Garden ceremony, Mr. Bush announced rescinding visa requirements for six other former communist countries — Estonia, Latvia, Lithuania, Hungary, the Czech Republic and Slovakia - as well as South Korea, effective in about a month.

------

Mr. Bush expressed support for the bids of Bulgaria, Cyprus, Greece, Malta, Poland and Romania to join the visa-waiver list.

[JuMPer]

ok why did they close the skybar thread while this one is the same shit...rigged polls and propaganda articles, lovely >(

[Ventilator_BGD]

very expected.

[bgrs]

Expected what?

[Ivanski]

Trolls like him :lol: