From what I remember, it's the bit where a tram will stop when the driver is changing ends, just after Droylsden. It is therefore a section of bi-directional track so needs to be kept 'off-road'. (Although I think it is also raised all the way down to the junction just before Audenshaw - on the Manchester inbound side.)

I would of thought it would be better to have had the switchover points just before Droylsden stop. This would of eliminated the need for a tram to stop outside of the platforms. I'm sure that TfGM would of looked into it though and there would be good reason not to do this.

I thought it was in reference to the reserved section all the way to the Audenshaw stop, as detailed in these plans http://www.tfgm.com/metrolink/EMLTRO/pdfs/EM3B-RTRA-TRO-Plans.pdf . I think that is to make the journey in the Manchester direction quicker and avoid disruption.

I can't really see what the residents are complaining about. Parking bays will be provided for the terraced houses and the rest have their own driveways. Even if you lived at the very first terraced house and had to go all the way to Lumb Lane to turn round and come back on the other side to park there, it's a total of 0.7 miles. For most of them it wouldn't be anywhere near that far :nuts:

Surely if the track is raised, it's not impossible to have a raised crossing at the same point so that pedestrians and wheelchairs can cross? It's hardly difficult.

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1467156_audenshaw-crossing-protest-raises-the-stakes-in-metrolink-tram-detour-row


Just a bunch of wasp chewers who have nothing better to do then complain about change.:bash::bash:

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1467164_made-in-newton-heath-television-jobs-boost-as-itv-signs-up-to-make-shows-at-sharp-project

This link about the Sharp project says the Central Park extension is due to open in March next year. Apologies if this is old news.

Hi

If I'm right didn't they say they will opened Oldham line allway up to Mumps so do this mean Oldham line will open to Mumps in March then.:banana:

Works to Oldham Mumps now substantially complete. testing will take place in the next few months.
* Due to delays in signalling and junction issues will no longer be a phased opening, line will open all the way to mumps in one go with a Victoria-Mumps service, this will also make training more efficent as the drivers will be trained for the whole of this stretch rather than in stages. Provisional opening schedule may be given to meeting on 16th December and 20th January.

Unless they mean line to Eastlands as it do say the Eastlands ‘sports village’ and the arrival of the Metrolink in March next year will see the area act as a beacon of hope in harsh economic times. so this could mean line to Velopark stop will open in March then, I'm confused.

It was called the B of the Bang, and I loved it! You could see it from the train as you approached Piccadilly from London. Was very sad when they dismantled that!!

Here in Bristol, we'd be lucky to get the F of the Fart, and then just the smell. Boy, am I jealous!

Out of interest, what's the reason for the raised track? To give the tram the priority? Is it just one track or both that will be raised? I can't picture it...

Unless the design has changed during detailed design its the inbound track between approximately North Drive and the crossover so its quite a length. Manchester bound road traffic runs between the kerb and the slightly raised tram line and it is designed to keep road vehicles off the tramway but retain access for emergency vehicles. As I say that was the original intention in 2010.

Unless the design has changed during detailed design its the inbound track between approximately North Drive and the crossover so its quite a length. Manchester bound road traffic runs between the kerb and the slightly raised tram line and it is designed to keep road vehicles off the tramway but retain access for emergency vehicles. As I say that was the original intention in 2010.

I wonder how people who live on dual carriageways manage?

I wonder how people who live on dual carriageways manage?

Interestingly the folks living further along to Ashton who turn off Manchester Road onto Gainsborough Road have exactly that problem when they try to go to Manchester. Manchester Road at the junction with Gainsborough Road is dual carriageway and there are no gaps in the central reserve. I'm not sure what the correct route is but many perform an illegal U turn at the traffic lights by B&Q. U turns are definitely banned at this junction. I think the correct route is to turn right into the Snipe Retail Park and go through the park exiting back onto Manchester Road at the west end of the park..

Interestingly the folks living further along to Ashton who turn off Manchester Road onto Gainsborough Road have exactly that problem when they try to go to Manchester. Manchester Road at the junction with Gainsborough Road is dual carriageway and there are no gaps in the central reserve. I'm not sure what the correct route is but many perform an illegal U turn at the traffic lights by B&Q. U turns are definitely banned at this junction. I think the correct route is to turn right into the Snipe Retail Park and go through the park exiting back onto Manchester Road at the west end of the park..

There used to be a sign indicating the correct route, which is to go left at the lights after the Snipe Retail Park, left again in front of the Travel Lodge, and finally right back on to Manchester Road.

I thought it was in reference to the reserved section all the way to the Audenshaw stop, as detailed in these plans http://www.tfgm.com/metrolink/EMLTRO/pdfs/EM3B-RTRA-TRO-Plans.pdf . I think that is to make the journey in the Manchester direction quicker and avoid disruption.

As an aside, are these sort of detailed plans available for all the extensions?

They are if you request them (with less identification of features), these particular ones though are part of the public consultation on traffic regulation changes.

Hi

I see Etihad Campus (Man City stop) planned is back on the Metrolink website know.

http://www.metrolink.co.uk/pdf/future_metrolink/east-manchester-line/etihad-campus.pdf

Cheers, ro2. They have added the turnstiles and wide staircases in nice colours.

No major breakthroughs to announce for my 1000th post, but here’s a few smidgeons of progress here and there.

Manchester Street roundabout, Oldham :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6710.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6708.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6978.jpg

The 3b turnout at Werneth, seen from Manchester Street near Pass Street :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6990.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6988.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_6983.jpg

A reminder of what it looks like from the bridge above:-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Westwood/101_5986.jpg

At the finback bridge, now that they have removed the high temporary fencing, there is only a low parapet on the ramp. If it remains like that it should give us a good view of the bananas gliding up and down :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Central%20Park/101_6935-1.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Central%20Park/101_6940-1.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Central%20Park/101_6941-1.jpg

Span wires and bracket arms have now appeared in the industrial area between Clayton Hall and Canalside Crossing, behind Ashton New Road. This is the level crossing at Clayton Lane :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7005.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7001.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_6998.jpg

Behind the Grove Inn :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7004.jpg

Croft Street level crossing :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7007.jpg

Looking back to St Cross’ Church at Clayton Hall :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7008.jpg

Approaching Canalside Crossing, Sheikh Mansour’s diggers on the horizon. The canal is just behind the car :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7009.jpg

Passengers will get a fleeting view of the waterway (staff cars were parked on the tramway at the time of these shots):-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7013.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7011.jpg

The line will touch the canal once again a couple of miles East at Droylsden Marina :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_6970.jpg

Droylsden Marina would be a much better name for Cemetery Road stop. The Marina itself is easily accessible from that stop, as will be shown in Train Guard’s magnificent guide book to places of interest along the Metrolink lines.

(Not sure of the title, think it’s due out next year? Hope you didn’t mind me giving you that little puff, TG!!)

:banana:

Nice pics jd, i wonder how they are crossing the road at manchester street roundabout in oldham now as the subway is now filled in, unless they are using the bridge further down manchester street.

Hi

Good Pictures of Oldham line and East manchester line Johnny, only thing that would make Oldham line better is to have trams running up and down that line, Jonesy do u mean the trams or public?.

Hi

Good Pictures of Oldham line and East manchester line Johnny, only thing that would make Oldham line better is to have trams running up and down that line, Jonesy do u mean the trams or public?.

The public, forgot to mention in my last post :bash:, i used to walk under the subway when i lived in the flats next to the roundabout to get to sainsburys(before they moved to clegg street) and the town centre for a few jars of the good stuff:cheers:.

I notice this on TFGM website

Challenges of new tram management system lead to revised Metrolink openings

The 'very challenging' task of introducing a new tram management system on to the Metrolink network has led to revisions to the schedule for new lines opening.

Transport for Greater Manchester's £1.4 billion expansion of the Metrolink network is the largest single investment in public transport outside London.

It will deliver the largest tram network in the country, one three times the size it is now with a line to Rochdale via Central Park and Oldham, a line to Ashton-under-Lyne, a line to East Didsbury and another to Manchester Airport via Wythenshawe, with a second crossing through Manchester city centre.

The new South Manchester Line opened in July this year, and the lines to Central Park and Oldham Mumps are the next sections due to open.

A report considered by the TfGM Committee states that both sections will now open together next year in one phase. They had been due to open in December 2011 and March 2012 respectively.

This has been revised due to the challenges involved with introducing an essential new tram management system and an update will be presented to TfGMC in January.

Ultimately, all the lines will be controlled by the new system, which is a crucial part of the expansion because it will allow more trams to run on the network. It will also give drivers and controllers much more ability to manage individual vehicle schedules and movements.

The benefit to passengers waiting at stops is much more consistency in the running times of their trams as the system is more responsive and flexible, particularly at busy times. It will also provide real-time information on when the next tram is due to arrive at a stop.

The new system is currently being integrated onto sections of the existing lines. This complex operation involves new technology working effectively with the existing outdates system.

Philip Purdy, TfGM's Metrolink Director, said: "The new operating system will provide benefits for existing passengers, not least real-time service information, but it is also a fundamental part of the expansion: ultimately, we simply cannot have one without the other.

"That is because the existing signalling on the Altrincham and Bury lines would not be able to support the number of tram movements that the expanded network will bring on to the network, particularly at a number of pinch-points on the network.

"The first stage of introducing the new system is to integrate the new with the old in a way that has the least impact on existing services.

"We are working closely with the contractor, Thales, on this and the progress made ultimately dictates when lines can open for service.

"We are currently assessing the implications this has for when we can start running to Central Park and Oldham Mumps, which are the next sections in line to open, but we will open them together, rather than in two phases, next year. An update will be presented to TfGMC in January.

"We share the frustrations of people waiting patiently to use the services, especially as construction of the new lines is going well. However, this is about the safe operation of a network that will be three times the size it is now, so we cannot cut any corners - we have to be thorough."

Councillor Andrew Fender, Chair of the TfGM Committee, said: "This is a very complex, technical issue that officers are working closely with the contractor to address.

"I fully appreciate that people want to be able to use their new Metrolink services sooner rather than later, but ultimately this is about ensuring the safe and reliable operation of the expanded network. So it cannot be rushed; we have to get it right."
:banana:

The public, forgot to mention in my last post :bash:, i used to walk under the subway when i lived in the flats next to the roundabout to get to sainsburys(before they moved to clegg street) and the town centre for a few jars of the good stuff:cheers:.

If I right the subway for opposite of road should still be open.

Looking at the map that is the only subway on manchester street and the nearest walkway bridge is on the ashton rd/king street roundabout to get to the town centre or unless you catch the 81 and 83.
http://maps.google.co.uk/maps?q=manchester+street+oldham&ll=53.539403,-2.122332&spn=0.000051,0.032916&oe=UTF-8&hnear=Manchester+St,+Oldham,+United+Kingdom&gl=uk&t=m&z=15&vpsrc=0&layer=c&cbll=53.539403,-2.122332&panoid=0qMk1b1a2YThOHA3s5e_bQ&cbp=12,20.53,,0,9.27

The extensions are delayed once again;
http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1467583_metrolink-tram-extensions-to-oldham-rochdale-and-droylsden-delayed-by-technical-compexities

The extensions are delayed once again;
http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1467583_metrolink-tram-extensions-to-oldham-rochdale-and-droylsden-delayed-by-technical-compexities

And know let wait and see have more rubbish people will put on MEN Comment.:lol:

Droylsden Marina would be a much better name for Cemetery Road stop. The Marina itself is easily accessible from that stop, as will be shown in Train Guard’s magnificent guide book to places of interest along the Metrolink lines. (Not sure of the title, think it’s due out next year? Hope you didn’t mind me giving you that little puff, TG!!) :banana: Thanks very much, Johnny! I'm just sending the drafts to the publisher (Sigma) just now, so I'm hoping that the proofs will be available sometime next Spring. I don't know how long it will take, but hopefully it will be available no later than Summer, 2012. The provisional title is "The Metrolink Companion." I'm hoping to get away with a Victorian style subtitle:- "...being a lineside guide to the tramway network of Greater Manchester, together with descriptions of the places and attractions that it serves. To which is appended a descriptive account of the East Lancashire Railway."

The extensions are delayed once again;
http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1467583_metrolink-tram-extensions-to-oldham-rochdale-and-droylsden-delayed-by-technical-compexities


Oh god... just wait for the comments... everyone on here should reply to the stupid negative comments with some positive ones to counterbalance them!!! I intend to!

And know let wait and see have more rubbish people will put on MEN Comment.:lol:

Oh god... just wait for the comments... everyone on here should reply to the stupid negative comments with some positive ones to counterbalance them!!! I intend to!

Do people not have a right to be annoyed at ANOTHER delay?

Oh god... just wait for the comments... everyone on here should reply to the stupid negative comments with some positive ones to counterbalance them!!! I intend to!

The MEN could at least use an updated photograph, or one relevant to the lines mentioned in the story. The 1003 tram was renovated 6 weeks or so back with the updated livery - an example of the modernisation of the system. The MEN tends to use pictures of the old(er) fleet than the new, and why this particular one in summer (at a guess) in central Manchester????

I wonder if the Oldham & Rochdale line will be open any time of next years or will they opened the line allway up to Shaw or Rochdale by the time Oldham line is opened?.

Do people not have a right to be annoyed at ANOTHER delay?


Of course they do.

However, I am betting that most of the comments will be of the

"See we always knew Metrolink was rubbish",
"More delays when no one wanted the new lines anyway"
"They should get rid of Metrolink altogether"

type that the MEN almost always attracts.

Just think what Oldhamers will say when it in Oldham Chronicle on Monday.

It is a shame that the opening has been deferred, but I don't think many of us on here are surprised. It is clear that things aren't going to plan with TMS (wonder why they got rid of the TOS name :lol:), but better to have a safe system up and running than rush into opening it. Personally I feel that opening through to Oldham makes perfect sense anyway than just going to Central Park.

I bet Thales are under some pressure now - what we don't know is why it is seemingly so difficult to solve the issues with it. The MEN and the others will no doubt make a big thing of it, but ultimately they would be the first to criticise if an unsafe tramway was opened. You can't have it both ways!

They'll close the system for 3 months next year to convert the lot to TMS I reckon.

Although Alti-Navi Road will prove difficult due to network rail.

Which line have got TMS in already and plus they will need to closed the Bury line to connect the wires and missed rail onto Oldham line.

They'll close the system for 3 months next year to convert the lot to TMS I reckon.

Although Alti-Navi Road will prove difficult due to network rail.

I would support that personally, if it helped!

Why doesn't this surprise me? The old heavy rail technology was tried and tested. For a fraction of the cost which has been spent on this Metrostink rubbish we could have had a Oldham-Rochdale loop line that could have lasted many more years and would have provided the service the people wanted.

Hmmm, comments are not too bad so far, that's about the worst...

I would support that personally, if it helped!



The problem would be when they announce after 2 and a half months that it isn't ready to be opened again yet!!!! Same old....

Got a picture in my head of a 323 going thru the streets of manchester if the TMS isnt up and running and metrolink handed over to northern rail and network rail. :nuts::lol:

It be better than old railbuses Class 142 and Class 144 special on Oldham line.

Do people not have a right to be annoyed at ANOTHER delay?

In the debit column--------------------------In the Credit column

Considerable disruption


Frustration is entirely rational especially if you are being inconvenienced by the work

The MEN story is starting to do its rounds on the other forums;

http://northernrailways.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=10425

http://www.railforums.co.uk/showthread.php?t=43722&page=5

Same guy (Rob) posting it on multiple forums.

They'll close the system for 3 months next year to convert the lot to TMS I reckon.



Not a chance! The loss of revenue both immediate and future would just about ensure the end of Metrolink, turning it into one huge white elephant.

Not a chance! The loss of revenue both immediate and future would just about ensure the end of Metrolink, turning it into one huge white elephant.

But whats the solution? If they cant get it to safely integrate with the old system in the meantime, they will have to.

But whats the solution? If they cant get it to safely integrate with the old system in the meantime, they will have to.

Probably needs a fresh pair of eyes to look at it, just as a schematic diagram to begin with. Then a new computer model, then lab test of a scale mock-up, then install it in overnight working. Could it be done?

Is the news that "TMS has not been to blame for any disruption on the spur since May" a sign that the system now works there, or has it just been turned off?

But whats the solution? If they cant get it to safely integrate with the old system in the meantime, they will have to.

Will if they can't get it to safely integrate with the old system what difference will closing it down make, apart from having nothing to test?

Will if they can't get it to safely integrate with the old system what difference will closing it down make, apart from having nothing to test?

The point would be to switch off the old system completely and run TMS throughout the system instead of in bits.

It works ok on the Eccles/MediaCity line.

The point would be to switch off the old system completely and run TMS throughout the system instead of in bits.

It works ok on the Eccles/MediaCity line.

They are being a little economic with the facts to simplify the story. TMS is interfacing with the old system at Pomona and Trafford Bar where the Eccles and South Manchester Line link to the old systems.

TMS is working on the plain line sections of both Eccles and SML and also MCUK with a bit of support. The problems seem to centre on the conflict management functionality needed for junctions, hence the temporary signalling at Trafford Bar, the 'men in a van' team supporting the MCUK junction and the endless testing sessions at the new depot junction with SML. The depot junction is entirely on the new line so it doesn't interface with any old system and yet it doesn't seem to work yet.

I suppose that because up to now the interfaces have been at junctions they can say this is the problem.

I don't believe for one minute they would close the network for a week or two to allow the entire system to be converted to a new control system. There is too much risk attached. Much better to phase it in a little at a time with a fall-back system if it fails. Just imagine what the reaction would be if the whole lot failed a couple of days into running. That's what happened at MCUK in a small way. It was relatively easy to control the fallout from that and the majority of the public weren't really aware.

I don't believe for one minute they would close the network for a week or two to allow the entire system to be converted to a new control system. There is too much risk attached. Much better to phase it in a little at a time with a fall-back system if it fails. Just imagine what the reaction would be if the whole lot failed a couple of days into running. That's what happened at MCUK in a small way. It was relatively easy to control the fallout from that and the majority of the public weren't really aware.

But surely they could incorporate a period of testing including ghost running into the closure?

They can't just keep saying "oh its going to be another 3 months" every 6 months.

But surely they could incorporate a period of testing including ghost running into the closure?

They can't just keep saying "oh its going to be another 3 months" every 6 months.

But close the system down for three months!

As long as most people perceive the system to be working there is no reason why they shouldn't keep saying that it will be another three months.

Close the system down for three months and the passenger figures would return to year zero and probably take at least another two years to recover.

But close the system down for three months!

As long as most people perceive the system to be working there is no reason why they shouldn't keep saying that it will be another three months.

Close the system down for three months and the passenger figures would return to year zero and probably take at least another two years to recover.

I was using 3 months as an example. I don't know how quickly they could convert it all to TMS if they closed the entire network down. It might be 3 hours, 3 days, 3 weeks, 3 months. I don't know.

They have no qualms in using replacement bus services over the summer holidays when the kids are off so it wouldn't surprise me if they resorted to this.

I was using 3 months as an example. I don't know how quickly they could convert it all to TMS if they closed the entire network down. It might be 3 hours, 3 days, 3 weeks, 3 months. I don't know.

They have no qualms in using replacement bus services over the summer holidays when the kids are off so it wouldn't surprise me if they resorted to this.

I doubt if very much of the work is actual need possession and on the ground work, I rather suspect that it's mainly back room brainstorming.

But surely they could incorporate a period of testing including ghost running into the closure?

They can't just keep saying "oh its going to be another 3 months" every 6 months.

The difficulty is that even during testing reversion back to old fashioned signalling once its been removed is a massive job across the network. Doing a small area under a weekend blockade is just about manageable.

Once they get some confidence I reckon they will bring in the depot connection to try it in real life on a fairly risk free basis. That will be followed by a more difficult section for testing only. They will want to build confidence slowly. The remaining junctions/interfaces all have a service risk attached to them. Might be a good idea to find a way of getting to the Sportcity turnback and trash it there away from normal services.

Given the delays and cost involved here I bet this ends up in court between Thales and TfGM. Having worked for an outsourced company that had problems with the delivery of a new system, as soon as it starts to cost a lot of money the legal teams get involved.

I bet Thales are already getting their reasons together as to why they are not responsible.

Just hope TfGM have a water tight contract and they have and are delivering everything that they should be.

And know let wait and see have more rubbish people will put on MEN Comment.:lol:

And who can blame anybody from Oldham. It's 2 years and 2 months since the rail service vanished. Looks at least a year away from the Metrolink arriving.

And who can blame anybody from Oldham. It's 2 years and 2 months since the rail service vanished. Looks at least a year away from the Metrolink arriving.

Yep. I think my prediction that we will see a glut of openings leading up to next xmas may have been a tad optimistic

Thanks very much, Johnny! I'm just sending the drafts to the publisher (Sigma) just now, so I'm hoping that the proofs will be available sometime next Spring. I don't know how long it will take, but hopefully it will be available no later than Summer, 2012. The provisional title is "The Metrolink Companion." I'm hoping to get away with a Victorian style subtitle:- "...being a lineside guide to the tramway network of Greater Manchester, together with descriptions of the places and attractions that it serves. To which is appended a descriptive account of the East Lancashire Railway."

"Dear Santa,

One for next year, if you would be so kind....."

Given the delays and cost involved here I bet this ends up in court between Thales and TfGM. Having worked for an outsourced company that had problems with the delivery of a new system, as soon as it starts to cost a lot of money the legal teams get involved.

I bet Thales are already getting their reasons together as to why they are not responsible.

Just hope TfGM have a water tight contract and they have and are delivering everything that they should be.

And who can blame anybody from Oldham. It's 2 years and 2 months since the rail service vanished. Looks at least a year away from the Metrolink arriving.

The Cambridgeshire Busway, lest we forget, was low tech engineering, came in three years late, and cost nearly thrice the price. Everyone is blaming everyone else, and Cambridge CC has put aside £10 million for legal action against BAM Nutall. That replaced a railway, and to my mind is a good example of why rail works best. Oldham, my hallowed birthplace, shouldn't have as long a wait. TfGM, I reckon, will be better at drawing up contracts. In any case, it must be a major embarrassment for Thales, who will want to sort it out ASAP.

Not necessarily, if the majority of the problems relate to the interface and reliability of the legacy systems and TfGM are responsible for those legacy systems they may entirely blameless.

Given the delays and cost involved here I bet this ends up in court between Thales and TfGM. .

yay - :omg: someone mentioned the 'C' word!!:nuts:
I sincerely and fervently hope not - Courts = Edinburgh! Woops I mentioned it myself, but it's certainly not an expedient way of resolving issues - could knock the whole shooting match back 5-10 years, with all the funding thrown away on zillions for lawyers and no-one else!

Actually, these unforeseen delays are nothing unusual for this type of project, Victoria line, Croydon, Cambridge, Glasgow, StratfordI, it's all happened before. (Sometimes they open early as well).

On this occasion I thought the tfgm press release was quite reasonably & candidly put forward, explaining the specific problems and not trying to fool the public by putting an artificial gloss on it.

Patience, friends, it will happen eventually (even in Edinburgh), just we will all be a little older, that's all!!

:cheers::banana:

I agree it will happen soon enough and other than those in Oldham people are 'missing' something that never existed.

PS down in London today, the place many see as a panacea with regards public transport. The DLR is not operating at all this weekend - 2 Weeks before xmas!

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_6970.jpg

Are those 'ecohouses' in the background? I ask because there is a development in Sheffield which is a very different design, but has the very same colours. They're pretty unusual too - wonder if they got a job lot of paint?

I don't know if they are 'ecohouses' but I doubt it. They were the first phase of what was supposed to be a major redevelopment but it's all ground to a halt and been left a bit of a mess since the recession hit. They could have at least landscaped the area until they start work again, if they ever do (although some new temporary fencing has gone up recently to the right, behind the trees).

Droylsden Marina (http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/s/1025306_100m_marina_transformation)

Are those 'ecohouses' in the background? I ask because there is a development in Sheffield which is a very different design, but has the very same colours. They're pretty unusual too - wonder if they got a job lot of paint?

Looks like someone thought about energy use in the design - small upstairs windows, steep roof rake to stop snow building up. ProWe have a row of houses on a hilltop in Clifton Wood in similar vein (I'll grab a shot one day), and I saw some fishermen's cottages in Bergen with the same colour scheme. They don't look anything like as modern, but are probably as eco as anything the 21st century can come up with.

Are those 'ecohouses' in the background? I ask because there is a development in Sheffield which is a very different design, but has the very same colours. They're pretty unusual too - wonder if they got a job lot of paint?

Not sure if they qualify as 'ecohouses', the builders Watkin Jones, never made a feature of it in their (lacklusture) marketing for the development. Our standards (for insulation, etc.) in the last decade have only just matched what Scandic countries set in the 1950s.

I like painted/coloured render, it adds vibrancy and warmth to the streetscene, think Balamory! My previous (Lovell) home was boring, white render with silver zinc walls, to add colour I did external planting with plenty of different hues.

When they first let the water into Droylsden Marina in 2008 (it took 3 days to fill up) there were hoardings around it showing waterside walkways, gardens, family fun, outdoor cafes etc etc. Then the recession imploded and it all went breast up. However, as TG says, the diggers and JCBGT's have recently appeared again, so perhaps something nice will happen after all.

Hi Martin. Now the Velopark has not only its signage, but its backlit Totem Flag as well! Not the most picturesque of locations in the rain, but here goes anyway :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7033.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7038.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7031.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7034.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7036.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7041.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Velopark/101_7044.jpg

A bit like searching for crumbs nowadays: another miniscule development, (but nevertheless moving things infinitesimally along) - the lights have come on above the ramps at Edge Lane :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Edge%20Lane/101_7026.jpg

Just now it looks quite eerie, Hopper-esque or perhaps like the ghost of Christmassy-yet-to-come?

:banana:

Thanks JdR, cracking photos :) they mustn't be far away from some proper testing to Velopark now...how long prior to opening did the flags go up at Chorlton?

Just think what Oldhamers will say when it in Oldham Chronicle on Monday.

Funny you should say that, just waiting for the comments;
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64393/metrolink-opening-dates-are-off-track

Thanks JdR, cracking photos :) they mustn't be far away from some proper testing to Velopark now...how long prior to opening did the flags go up at Chorlton?

Well, as I remember it was quite a few weeks, but I'm not sure you can gauge the opening dates by that. However, I agree it does underscore the aspiration to open to the sports stadia asap. ahead of Droylsden, as all these 'finishing touches' have now been put in place as far as Velopark. There is no sign, for example of any stop names or running wire arriving in the overhead any further East as yet. (But of course these don't take long to put in place. The track is now complete to Droylsden and I would say about 50% beyond towards Ashton, but the poles currently end at Moss Tavern on the Droylsden/Audenshaw boundary).

Speaking of which, the public meeting at Audenshaw today was surprisingly good-humoured, then I found out why - the idea of a 'raised' trambaan all the way between Droylsden <> Audenshaw has now been scrapped. The alignment will now be the same as on Ashton New Road and Manchester Road Droylsden, i.e. shared with traffic but with certain additionally barred right turns and u turns.

However, there will still have to be the originally planned raised section for the reversal headshunt in the middle of the road just East of Droylsden stop, but this will now only be the length of a double tram :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Ashton/Audenshaw/101_7046.jpg

It looks to me as though it would still be drive overable in an emergency etc.

Some other interesting points to emerge - it is the intention to run double trams through to Ashton on matchdays, as well as the short workings to Velopark. Where this involves a reversal at Droylsden, it would need a 'spare driver' to be standing by on the platform, ready to enter the empty cab on the West facing vehicle and drive it back, with the original driver then in the East facing car as passenger.

The subject of through workings was also touched upon - it was stressed that nothing has been decided in this respect, but current thinking seems to favour Ashton - Eccles. I suggested that Ashton - Bury is also essential to preserve the original link between Picc and Vic, and this was acknowledged.

But of course anything can still happen, and probably will!

Lovely.

:banana:

The subject of through workings was also touched upon - it was stressed that nothing has been decided in this respect, but current thinking seems to favour Ashton - Eccles.

Now that IS interesting!
Who said that and what did they say...?

The gentleman from Metrolink who was presenting the exhibition, didn't get his name but I think he had a vaguely North Eastern accent. Steve Burns of tfgm was also there, and a young lady explaining the diagrams.

Nothing much more to add - I asked 'Where will it go to from here after it reaches Piccadilly', and he said the current thinking was Eccles, but was at pains to stress that nothing has been decided. I then made the point about Picc-Vic which was acknowledged but not confirmed.

Some other interesting points to emerge - it is the intention to run double trams through to Ashton on matchdays, as well as the short workings to Velopark.

Perhaps the doubles to Ashton are for City Fans from Yorkshire and beyond. They could join a Yorkshire bound train at Ashton instead of going into the City Centre.

Doubles on the alty line are rarer than hens teeth when United are at home!! Hope the same applies here!!

The gentleman from Metrolink who was presenting the exhibition, didn't get his name but I think he had a vaguely North Eastern accent. Steve Burns of tfgm was also there, and a young lady explaining the diagrams.

Nothing much more to add - I asked 'Where will it go to from here after it reaches Piccadilly', and he said the current thinking was Eccles, but was at pains to stress that nothing has been decided. I then made the point about Picc-Vic which was acknowledged but not confirmed.

Eccles and mediacityuk can go through to Ashton without any timetable change whatsoever as they are already 6 minutes apart. Also the mediacity service stops about 8pm which is pretty similar to when the Alt/ Bury daytime services finish,so it brings it all in line. If this were to be the case then the Alt/ Bury trams would continue on their usual timetable turning at Piccadilly which retains the link between Victoria and Piccadilly.

The Alt and Bury lines can't carry on to Ashton. The intervals would be uneven. To alter the times to make them even means that they will become uneven on one of the other services to either Alt or Bury. If it was possible to have an even 6 minute service in all directions on all 3 branches (if it were to carry on to Ashton), then it would probably be happening now.

The only other way is for the Bury line and the Eccles or mediacity line to carry on as the Eccles service would only be one minute out, but that could be easily sorted. I doubt if it will be the Altrincham line going through. If I was timetabling it though ,neither the Bury or Alt lines would carry on as there is possibly too much that could go wrong on the Ashton line and that would destroy any attempt at a 6 minute service on those lines where is is important to have a regular service. These things need to be considered when timetabling, but hopefully they will have thought of this.

Funny you should say that, just waiting for the comments;
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64393/metrolink-opening-dates-are-off-track

I had to stop reading those comments halfway through to stop myself personally replying to every single one of them. :bash:


Some other interesting points to emerge - it is the intention to run double trams through to Ashton on matchdays, as well as the short workings to Velopark. Where this involves a reversal at Droylsden, it would need a 'spare driver' to be standing by on the platform, ready to enter the empty cab on the West facing vehicle and drive it back, with the original driver then in the East facing car as passenger.

The subject of through workings was also touched upon - it was stressed that nothing has been decided in this respect, but current thinking seems to favour Ashton - Eccles. I suggested that Ashton - Bury is also essential to preserve the original link between Picc and Vic, and this was acknowledged.:

Why is the two driver situation necessary? To save time? Also, wouldn't it make more sense for the original driver to climb out onto the platform and wait for the next tram to arrive, so they can enter the empty cab of that one? And then the original driver of that tram would then climb onto the platform, and so on.

I really hope it's Eccles and Bury that run to Ashton. I don't think directly connecting Old Trafford with Etihad is a good plan, especially on the rare occurrence of United and City both having a match at home. Also, I quite fancy a direct tram to IKEA every 12 minutes ;)

Eccles and mediacityuk can go through to Ashton without any timetable change whatsoever as they are already 6 minutes apart. Also the mediacity service stops about 8pm which is pretty similar to when the Alt/ Bury daytime services finish,so it brings it all in line. If this were to be the case then the Alt/ Bury trams would continue on their usual timetable turning at Piccadilly which retains the link between Victoria and Piccadilly.

The Alt and Bury lines can't carry on to Ashton. The intervals would be uneven. To alter the times to make them even means that they will become uneven on one of the other services to either Alt or Bury. If it was possible to have an even 6 minute service in all directions on all 3 branches (if it were to carry on to Ashton), then it would probably be happening now.

The only other way is for the Bury line and the Eccles or mediacity line to carry on as the Eccles service would only be one minute out, but that could be easily sorted. I doubt if it will be the Altrincham line going through. If I was timetabling it though ,neither the Bury or Alt lines would carry on as there is possibly too much that could go wrong on the Ashton line and that would destroy any attempt at a 6 minute service on those lines where is is important to have a regular service. These things need to be considered when timetabling, but hopefully they will have thought of this.


I think Eccles and MediaCity will goto Ashton eventually.

It makes sense to keep MediaCity continuing to Piccadilly instead of being a shuttle between MCUK and Cornbrook.

Coverage of the delays on the Oldham-Rochdale line in the Oldham Chronicle. Wonder what are the odds of the whole line opening in one go rather than to Oldham first.

Metrolink opening dates are off track

CHALLENGES of a new tram computer system have led to yet more delays for the opening of Oldham’s Metrolink.

The new Tram Management System (TMS), can electronically map tram positions and automatically control points and signals.

But it caused severe disruption after it underwent trials at Media City last September.

Now the line to Oldham Mumps, which was due to open in March, 2012, will be open even later than planned next year, according to a report considered by Transport for Greater Manchester.

A report to update the situation will be presented to TfGM in January.

Ultimately, all the lines will be controlled by the new system, which will allow more trams to run on the network, as well as giving drivers and controllers the ability to manage vehicle schedules. But transport chiefs some months ago said that the first stage of the Oldham line to Central Park, which had been due in spring, was being put back until winter and the second phase to Oldham Mumps was being delayed from autumn until next spring.

The Central Park stage is not now expected to open until the Oldham Mumps stage opens — and transport officials are assessing whether that will be also be put back.

A two or three month delay may arise on the already-delayed Rochdale extension.

Philip Purdy, TfGM’s Metrolink director, said: “The new operating system is a fundamental part of the expansion: ultimately, we simply cannot have one without the other.

“The first stage of introducing the new system is to integrate the new with the old in a way that has the least impact on existing services.

“We are currently assessing the implications this has for when we can start running to Central Park and Oldham Mumps, which are the next sections in line to open, but we will open them together.

“We share the frustrations of people waiting patiently to use the services, especially as construction of the new lines is going well.

“However, this is about the safe operation of a network that will be three times the size it is now, so we cannot cut any corners.”

http://oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64393/metrolink-opening-dates-are-off-track

Why is the two driver situation necessary? To save time? Also, wouldn't it make more sense for the original driver to climb out onto the platform and wait for the next tram to arrive, so they can enter the empty cab of that one? And then the original driver of that tram would then climb onto the platform, and so on.


Isn't it because it's a double tram so the driver can't change ends without getting out - so it has to be done at the platform. In which case, my question is how would they reverse a double tram behind Piccadilly?

Isn't it because it's a double tram so the driver can't change ends without getting out - so it has to be done at the platform. In which case, my question is how would they reverse a double tram behind Piccadilly?

I guess behind Picc, they could install one of those gantry things for the driver to walk along? More tricky in Droylsden as it's in the road!

It's called "stepping back" on the London tubes. One driver waits on the platform and as the train stops in the platform he enters the cab at the rear of the train, the original driver steps out and the second driver then takes the train away. The original driver then walks to the departure end of the platform in time for the next train to arrive, which he then drives away. And so on.

In Droylsden (or even Piccadilly) the new driver could wait on the platform, getting into the rear cab as the tram arrives. The original driver takes the tram into the turnback siding where he stops and hands over control for the reverse journey to the new driver in the rear cab. The original driver then gets out as the tram passes back through Droylsden stop and does his "stepping back" on the platform. Simple.

"yet more delays" I'm not sure that statement is completely correct. Other than the TMS issue that's only just been made public it will affect these lines, what other issue is there?

Why dont metrolink just fit the trams with ATS for now until they get the TMS sorted or dont TFGM/GMPTE like parting with money.

For what purpose? We have enough trams for the current operations and no junction exists to the Oldham line.

Also, they almost certainly don't like parting with money given how limited it is.

Some financial discipline is required or we've have spent all the money before 2cc was built.

Why dont metrolink just fit the trams with ATS for now until they get the TMS sorted or dont TFGM/GMPTE like parting with money.

It's more along the lines of the fact that they don't have any money to part with in the first place.

Eccles and mediacityuk can go through to Ashton without any timetable change whatsoever as they are already 6 minutes apart. Also the mediacity service stops about 8pm which is pretty similar to when the Alt/ Bury daytime services finish,so it brings it all in line. If this were to be the case then the Alt/ Bury trams would continue on their usual timetable turning at Piccadilly which retains the link between Victoria and Piccadilly.

The Alt and Bury lines can't carry on to Ashton. The intervals would be uneven. To alter the times to make them even means that they will become uneven on one of the other services to either Alt or Bury. If it was possible to have an even 6 minute service in all directions on all 3 branches (if it were to carry on to Ashton), then it would probably be happening now.

The only other way is for the Bury line and the Eccles or mediacity line to carry on as the Eccles service would only be one minute out, but that could be easily sorted. I doubt if it will be the Altrincham line going through. If I was timetabling it though ,neither the Bury or Alt lines would carry on as there is possibly too much that could go wrong on the Ashton line and that would destroy any attempt at a 6 minute service on those lines where is is important to have a regular service. These things need to be considered when timetabling, but hopefully they will have thought of this.

Interesting points Motor. I guess that in the 'off-peak', i.e. in the evening etc. there are three lines all presenting a 12 minute headway to Piccadilly, any of which could be the one that runs through to Ashton which will also be 12m at that time.

The 6 minute headways in the peak could also be supplied alternately by Eccles and MC, but this makes a big assumption that MC will continue to Piccadilly as it does now, and this is not apparently on the cards according to tfgm, due to the 30 tph capacity along Mosley Street. It's only available at present as East Didsbury is down to 5 tph instead of 10.

But help me please Motor with what is the "too much that could go wrong on the Ashton line"? (I don't like starting from an assumption that the whole thing is bound to be a catastrophe 12 months before it even gets off the drawing board!!!) By that time, my sincere and fervent hope is that TMS will be operating satisfactorily, so that approaching LRVs can call all the traffic lights in their favour, and there should be no more reason for unforeseen delays on Ashton than on any other line. Only a third of it is on-street and there are not many junctions.

Moreover my impression, admittedly not from regular peak time usage, is that the calling of traffic lights both along the Eccles line and in the city centre, is now much more predictable than it used to be in the early days.

One more question re "those lines where it is important to have a regular service" I am just wondering why Bury and Alti are thought to be more deserving of reliability than other lines? And does it not matter if the Ashton line is just as wantonly destructive to the headways on Eccles or MC?

Very interesting questions for debate, but let's hope at the end of the day the whole thing dovetails like clockwork and tickety-boo!

:banana:

Shock Horror

Droylsden "raised" line to be dropped

Link here to MEN

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/transport/public_transport/s/1467732_delight-as-road-protesters-win-u-turn-over-metrolink-track-in-droylsden

Cheers
Chris W

I hope none of those protesters ever complain about the trams getting snarled up in rush hour traffic...

I hope none of those protesters ever complain about the trams getting snarled up in rush hour traffic...

They'll do it from day one.

They'll do it from day one.

I await the complaints of the trams holding up traffic...saying this however, I bet they will be regular users of the system...

Shock Horror

Droylsden "raised" line to be dropped

Link here to MEN

http://menmedia.co.uk/manchestereveningnews/news/transport/public_transport/s/1467732_delight-as-road-protesters-win-u-turn-over-metrolink-track-in-droylsden

Cheers
Chris W

TfGM's take on the story:

Changes to tram lane proposals in Audenshaw

Key changes have been made to the design of a dedicated tram lane in Audenshaw.

Work is well underway on the new Metrolink line from Droylsden to Ashton-under-Lyne, which is due to open in 2014.

Proposals for the line included the creation of a dedicated, raised tram lane along a section of Droylsden Road and a range of associated changes to the highway.

Since March, Transport for Greater Manchester has engaged extensively with the community over the proposals, via letters, home and workplace visits, and information events. As a result, elements of the scheme have now been revised.

The tram lane will not be raised - it will be at the same level as the highway. In addition, there will be no restrictions on right turns from North Drive and Moss Street, or to and from Kingsley Grove, and, other than at road junctions, 'No Loading' restrictions will only apply at peak times.

Other features include the creation of a waiting/loading bay for the shops at Kershaw Lane, a residents' parking scheme on Droylsden Road, and parking for shops at Assheton Avenue.

Martin Lax, Metrolink's Strategic Development Manager, said: "We've taken into consideration all of the issues that have been raised by residents, as well as those raised during detailed discussions with Tameside Council.

"The revisions, made as a direct result of the consultation process, will be considered at the Speaker's Panel on 21 December. We believe they strike the right balance between the requirements of the new Metrolink line and the needs of residents along the route.

"I'd like to thank everyone who took the time to meet with us and work with us as we developed and finalised the designs."

http://www.tfgm.com/tfgm_news.cfm?news_id=9008266?submenuheader=3

"yet more delays" I'm not sure that statement is completely correct. Other than the TMS issue that's only just been made public it will affect these lines, what other issue is there?

To be fair the whole Metrolink system was meant to be completed in its entirity by the year 2000, if not the mid-1990s... http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141

To be fair the whole Metrolink system was meant to be completed in its entirity by the year 2000, if not the mid-1990s... http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141

I'm not sure there ever was an official opening date in 2007 never mind 1996.

Construction and techincal issues, official opening dates. I don't think that reporter has a leg to stand on.

Think the trams would look ace in orange white and brown.

To be fair the whole Metrolink system was meant to be completed in its entirity by the year 2000, if not the mid-1990s... http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/ http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141/http://www.flickr.com/photos/jza84/6391918141

"The whole network may take 5 years or more to build"

parrpp! :D

TMS may take 5 years or more to install at the Firswood junction"



That's more like it.

I can forsee within a week or so of the East Manchester Line opening that one of these residents will reverse out of their driveway without looking, right into an oncoming LRV.

Cue protests about "Why wasn't a safe reservation built to protect us?"

I can forsee within a week or so of the East Manchester Line opening that one of these residents will reverse out of their driveway without looking, right into an oncoming LRV.

Cue protests about "Why wasn't a safe reservation built to protect us?"

Or be broad sided whilst waiting to do a now legal right turn!

It's funny, a five inch high kerb is no obstruction when they want to drive on the pavement!

Think the trams would look ace in orange white and brown.

not sure about the brown, but the orange yes indeedy

I just had a look at that fabulous 1980's scan and couple of things come to mind

The whole thing back then nothing more than a rework of the existing suburban rail network EXCEPT for the City Centre bit and reinstatement of the South Manchester Line to East Didsbury; and the City Centre sections primary raison-d'etre was to plug the Piccadilly/Victoria gap (PiccVic Tunnel Replacement)

Now we all love the Metrolink... but, why the hell didn't we just leave the commuter lines in place and buy some new two coach trains to increase the frequency/capacity on those commuter lines; plus run a shuttle (of some kind) between between Piccadilly and Victoria - the end point as far as passenger capacity/frequency would have been roughly the same and for an amount of money an order of magnitude less than has been spent and is going to be spent?

not sure about the brown, but the orange yes indeedy

I just had a look at that fabulous 1980's scan and couple of things come to mind

The whole thing back then nothing more than a rework of the existing suburban rail network EXCEPT for the City Centre bit and reinstatement of the South Manchester Line to East Didsbury; and the City Centre sections primary raison-d'etre was to plug the Piccadilly/Victoria gap (PiccVic Tunnel Replacement)

Now we all love the Metrolink... but, why the hell didn't we just leave the commuter lines in place and buy some new two coach trains to increase the frequency/capacity on those commuter lines; plus run a shuttle (of some kind) between between Piccadilly and Victoria - the end point as far as passenger capacity/frequency would have been roughly the same and for an amount of money an order of magnitude less than has been spent and is going to be spent?

Because you lose the door-to-door service that a light rail service can provide to a city. Street running through residential areas picks up the hop-on-hop-off traffic that urban rail doesn't.

Interesting points Motor. I guess that in the 'off-peak', i.e. in the evening etc. there are three lines all presenting a 12 minute headway to Piccadilly, any of which could be the one that runs through to Ashton which will also be 12m at that time.

The 6 minute headways in the peak could also be supplied alternately by Eccles and MC, but this makes a big assumption that MC will continue to Piccadilly as it does now, and this is not apparently on the cards according to tfgm, due to the 30 tph capacity along Mosley Street. It's only available at present as East Didsbury is down to 5 tph instead of 10.

But help me please Motor with what is the "too much that could go wrong on the Ashton line"? (I don't like starting from an assumption that the whole thing is bound to be a catastrophe 12 months before it even gets off the drawing board!!!) By that time, my sincere and fervent hope is that TMS will be operating satisfactorily, so that approaching LRVs can call all the traffic lights in their favour, and there should be no more reason for unforeseen delays on Ashton than on any other line. Only a third of it is on-street and there are not many junctions.

Moreover my impression, admittedly not from regular peak time usage, is that the calling of traffic lights both along the Eccles line and in the city centre, is now much more predictable than it used to be in the early days.

One more question re "those lines where it is important to have a regular service" I am just wondering why Bury and Alti are thought to be more deserving of reliability than other lines? And does it not matter if the Ashton line is just as wantonly destructive to the headways on Eccles or MC?

Very interesting questions for debate, but let's hope at the end of the day the whole thing dovetails like clockwork and tickety-boo!

:banana:

:lol::lol:Catastrophe is not quite what I was thinking.

Having lines coming in from all over is asking for it though. Whether it works or not then maybe anyone who uses them can say more but only the other day I saw 4 services going to Altrincham down Mosley Street all maybe a couple of minutes apart, 2 from Piccadilly and 2 from Market Street. I sat and watched this happen.So how do they sort all that out with 4 all reaching Altrincham behind each other I wonder?

Having segregated running and street running joined together on one line is asking for it to go wrong. Apart from signals or possibly power probs,nothing should go wrong on segregated sections but on the street. ..... Well? All it takes is a car parked wrongly to hold the service up a few minutes then you have the start of what i was saying above, ; uneven gaps.

It's easier to control one line end to end. It may look pretty on a map though to have many different services but the reality may be completely the opposite. Buses have stopped this joining together 2 services to make combined higher frequencies ie 86/47, 14/15. 256/257. It doesn't work. Also the passengers decided on the 46/47/86 with their feet. They didn't like split services having to wait longer at different places.There was an 86 from Piccadilly every 10 minutes and a 47 from Cross Street every 10 minutes timed to be every 5 minutes from Princess Street to Chorlton. Piccadilly was where they went so more and more 86s were put on and the 47 eventually became the ghost bus with all different routings to pep it up and all failed, the last one to turn it into a Magic bus. But the passengers all wanted to go to Piccadilly, so that tells me they don't like split services.

As I've said before and Freel said so the other week about ALT Bury being only one line. I agree completely, then its easier to control , although on the downside the link Piccadilly to Victoria would be lost. If there was a way to overcome this then it's a thought. 3 distinct lines. Alt/Bury. Eccles,MC/Ashton. East Didsbury/Rochdale.

Now here's a thought. If they had made a junction outside Victoria station that went up towards Shudehill from Exchange Square think of the possibilites there!

Hi

Good pictures at velopark stop Johnny:cheers:, I notice this in Oldham Chronicle tonight paper.

Frustration over new Metrolink delay

FRUSTRATION is mounting over news of a second delay in bringing Metrolink to Oldham.

Transport for Greater Manchester (TfGM) admits it doesn’t know when Oldham Mumps will open — but admits it will be later than the planned date of March, 2012, and will open at the same time as Central Park.

The new opening date will not be announced until January, when an updated report is due.

Councillor Jim McMahon, Oldham Council leader, said he was very frustrated by the potential delay to the line. He has voiced his concerns with TfGM officials.

He said: “This news doesn’t affect the 3B line — the town centre extension — which remains our key focus. The works ongoing in the area right now are all related to this scheme so, even if Metrolink 3A had been on time, major infrastructure works would still be under way right now. The town-centre line is due to arrive in 2014. That timescale remains completely unaffected by this potential delay and preparing for the arrival of that line remains our priority.

“We are using our time to lobby TfGM to ensure that 3B is delivered on time and that the finish on this project — especially at key gateway sites at Mumps and King Street — is of a high quality.”

Lib-Dem leader Councillor Howard Sykes demanded that questions be asked of Metrolink bosses.

“I think some questions need to be asked because this is not good enough — this is the second time the Metrolink has been delayed,” he said. “Every time it causes more disruption and added cost — not to mention the domino effect for elsewhere.”

Also SF07 I notice u said yesterday this Wonder what are the odds of the whole line opening in one go rather than to Oldham first. I wonder if Metrolink people think is better idea to opened the line to Shaw, as people in Rochdale or who live near Rochdale have still got train network, surely they could wait for a bit for line to Rochdale opened and have trams running to Shaw & Crompton surely that better idea.:banana:

Funny you should say that, just waiting for the comments;
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64393/metrolink-opening-dates-are-off-track

I love the one calling for the private sector to be called in to sort out the computer system! Irony of a quality I never thought I would see in Oldham. Maybe we could get the private sector to sort out the banks too?

I love the one calling for the private sector to be called in to sort out the computer system! Irony of a quality I never thought I would see in Oldham. Maybe we could get the private sector to sort out the banks too?

Another good one.....


This is not the forum for sensible and considered comments like yours. In future can you please be more inflammatory.

While the Metrolink may be a good thing for Oldham, it is currently under construction so we don't yet know.

We therefore need to put our default setting to "we fear change" and rant about how it will definitely spell DOOM for Oldham and - I imagine - will almost certainly render anyone who uses it infertile, or cause a nasty rash at the very least.

:lol::lol:

I think it would certainly be better to open to Shaw, ro2, if at all possible, but could it be ready in a reasonable time? I guess, like many other aspects, we simply don't know!

Anyway, I thought I would bob down to MediaCity to see if I could get a shot of the tram terminus without the red & white bollards on the waterside, now they have put in the more elegant fencing – (a shot I have been awaiting for about four years!) But unfortunately they haven’t cleared the bloody things away properly as yet! (BTW the vertical posts, just visible as part of the lower railings, are actually lights, which look quite well in the gloaming, but not worth snapping until they get rid of the crap behind them!):-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_7076.jpg

(Sorry not to say hello properly Lynyrd - I was dashing to the other side of the dock before the trambanana departed!) I did manage to get a partially clear shot which is perhaps not so bad :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_7073.jpg

There's something I always like about trams next to water - perhaps it's an atavistic memory of childhood holidays at Blackpool. Ah well, we'll get there in the end, but in the meantime another shed load of carbuncle is this particular pile of crap which is the first thing to greet everyone arriving on the tram, as the gateway to Media City. Who gave planning permission for that, in such a sensitive and iconic location? Please get rid of it and build something nicer! :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_7078.jpg

Latest news by New Islington tramstop, the first piece of whatever edifice will grace the South Eastern corner of Great Ancoats Street & Pollard Street, was being raised or lowered into place today. I think this latent building has its own thread :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7059.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7058.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7060.jpg

Nothing to do with Metrolink and ergo completely off thread sorry, but further down Gt Ancoats I noticed this quirky little piece of modernity making an appearance as a new in-fill between buildings of various vintages :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7065.jpg

I think the construction on the far left also has its own thread :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7062.jpg

Another somewhat quirky expression? :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Central/Piccadilly/101_7080.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Central/Piccadilly/101_7079.jpg

I wonder what arrangements are planned to improve passenger flows in this area, when it becomes the Droylsden/Etihad platform?

:banana:

Because you lose the door-to-door service that a light rail service can provide to a city. Street running through residential areas picks up the hop-on-hop-off traffic that urban rail doesn't.

Agreed in principle, but.... there was NO street running apart from in the City Centre back then. The Eccles line was nowhere to be seen and the Ashton Line would never have been built because of the Glossop/Hadfield line being converted

I think the construction on the far left also has its own thread :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/New%20Islington/101_7062.jpg

See here....
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=308256

On the subject of the forthcoming Mersey Valley Viaduct...

Just received a email from Future Metrolink saying that the viaduct will rise ABOVE the current footpaths along the river, rather than sink the paths or have level crossings.

Kinda what I thought they'd do, means the thing should be quite a height!

Aye, which is kind of what I was saying some time ago.

It is going to overshadow Jackson's Boat considerably given how low down that it.

Aye, which is kind of what I was saying some time ago.


Aye but always nice to have official confirmation!

Looking forward to seeing some renders

Looking forward to seeing some renders


Me an' all.

The email also said the plans are still not public but "they will be made public as soon as they are", (will be made public as soon as they are public? I assume she means released!)

but in the meantime another shed load of carbuncle is this particular pile of crap which is the first thing to greet everyone arriving on the tram, as the gateway to Media City. Who gave planning permission for that, in such a sensitive and iconic location? Please get rid of it and build something nicer! :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_7078.jpg



That would be the pie factory sound stages. It was originally an actual pie factory well before mediacity was thought up. Now it is currently very busy with filming and companies occupying the offices, the real backbone to MediaCity.

They have tried to smarten it up somewhat by painting it and doing limited landscaping. However unless they do something similar to the greenhouse and put a trellis around it I can't see what else can be done. It won't be going anywhere for the time being due to it's usefulness

..

That would be the pie factory sound stages. It was originally an actual pie factory well before mediacity was thought up. Now it is currently very busy with filming and companies occupying the offices, the real backbone to MediaCity.

They have tried to smarten it up somewhat by painting it and doing limited landscaping. However unless they do something similar to the greenhouse and put a trellis around it I can't see what else can be done. It won't be going anywhere for the time being due to it's usefulness

Funnily enough I have got used to it, wasn`t sure as first but now I think its got some character, I suppose it looks a little like the back lot of a film studios. ( well-ish)

Please get rid of it and build something nicer! :-
http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_7078.jpg


You should try approaching Media City by road along the new link road from Eccles. Lovely view of the sewage works on the way :lol:

Just passing Trafford Bar, couple of Thales vans parked up, look to be working on the SML inbound junction.

Just passing Trafford Bar, couple of Thales vans parked up, look to be working on the SML inbound junction.


I noticed them there about half 8 this morning, they seemed have a lot of the orange cable trunking with them.

Ok the Pie Factory can stay skit & heart, as long as they put their bins behind the back. (Don’t think I will ever be able to go over and hug that blue corrugated asbestos, though!!)

Actually I rather like the view from Eccles – I had it as my screen saver for a while – it reminds me of the approach to the Emerald City in the Wizard of Oz . . . no?

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Eccles/MediaCityUK/101_2790.jpg

# Hi Catsy – I am hoping we don’t need to worry too much about the new Mersey bridge spoiling the view of Jackson’s Boat, as it is not particularly adjacent, but a few hundred yards further along the river :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Wythenshawe/Sale%20Water%20Park/100_4706.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Wythenshawe/Sale%20Water%20Park/100_4705.jpg

My friend is standing at the location of the Metrolink bridge, marked out by the blue stake, and Jackson’s Boat is left of the existing footbridge in the background :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Wythenshawe/Sale%20Water%20Park/101_0995.jpg

When it says above the footpath, I am wondering if it means the upper or the lower footpath . . . (btw how did you know that before?).

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Wythenshawe/Sale%20Water%20Park/101_0999.jpg

In any event, a bridge for a light rail line on its own I think can be a fairly minimal structure like a pier, and hopefully shouldn’t be too dominant.

The existing footbridge is a similar structure and does actually loom down over the location of Jackson’s Boat itself, but it is quite an attractive metal construction which I would say enhances what is a nodal point on the river walk :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Wythenshawe/Sale%20Water%20Park/100_4707.jpg

Lovely, and about to get even better, no? . . .

:banana:

More concerns from Oldham Council about the delays of the Oldham-Rochdale line.

Fears raised over Metrolink delays

Oldham Council meeting
GRAVE cross party concerns were raised over the possible delays facing Metrolink rolling into the borough.

The leader of Oldham’s Lib-Dems, Councillor Howard Sykes, hit out at the potential delay due to technical faults with the new Tram Management System.

He said: “We could have a fully functioning tram line but with no trams on it.

“With trams coming to Shaw at least six months late than people were originally told, we’re going to lose people originally in favour of the scheme.”

But Councillor Dave Hibbert said achieving a safe, effective and efficient system was more important than rushing Metrolink’s arrival.

He said: “We’re frustrated, disappointed and embarrassed by what has happened, but do you want to rush to get it on time or do you want to achieve health and safety?

“Priority seems to be to get it in as quickly as possible but we clearly want a system that is safe, god forbid there would be an accident. What would the reaction be then?”

http://oldham-chronicle.co.uk/uploads/f2/news/img/20111215_121227.jpg

Just to let you all know that some more testing should be taking place next week on the Oldham line. One of the people assessing me today for a LRV job has been rostered in for it, so I heard it from him.

Anyone who was interested in how I did today.... I passed the psychometric tests but did a poor interview, so won't know 'til next week if I passed. Even if I don't, I can happily say I've now driven a tram :D :banana:

Just to let you all know that some more testing should be taking place next week on the Oldham line. One of the people assessing me today for a LRV job has been rostered in for it, so I heard it from him.

Anyone who was interested in how I did today.... I passed the psychometric tests but did a poor interview, so won't know 'til next week if I passed. Even if I don't, I can happily say I've now driven a tram :D :banana:

Hi

Thanks for info for Oldham line rob001uk, they should be running on the only engine this time and try and get some pictures again maybe at South Chadderton too.:banana: also I hope u get that jobs rob001uk and u never know but u can be first tram drive to drive a tram on first passengers tram when a new line openeds.:banana:

Congrats Rob on passing the tests! Fingers crossed for the interview! :-)




When it says above the footpath, I am wondering if it means the upper or the lower footpath . . . (btw how did you know that before?).



I would assume the upper paths as the lower ones sometimes get submerged in high waters don't they..? Ah well time will tell.

The nice new high kerbs are now finished on the Mauldeth Rd West bridge in Chorlton, they've also re-done the pointy stones along the tops (no idea of their proper name!)

Still utility work going on on the site of Barlow Moor Rd stop, no photos as frankly it's not very interesting to see! :)

Congrats Rob on passing the tests! Fingers crossed for the interview! :-)
I would assume the upper paths as the lower ones sometimes get submerged in high waters don't they..? Ah well time will tell.


Ditto from me Rob.

Looking at it I'm sure you're right martin. It seems that the ground falls away a bit towards the camera from Hardy Farm in the background, so it might not need too much of a rise for the alignment to achieve the necessary height.

Parapets? (I always get them mixed up with abutments!)

:cheers:

Ditto from me Rob.
Parapets? (I always get them mixed up with abutments!)

:cheers:

I think he means the coping and caps which go on top of the parapet wall.

Just to let you all know that some more testing should be taking place next week on the Oldham line. One of the people assessing me today for a LRV job has been rostered in for it, so I heard it from him.

Anyone who was interested in how I did today.... I passed the psychometric tests but did a poor interview, so won't know 'til next week if I passed. Even if I don't, I can happily say I've now driven a tram :D :banana:

And well done from me too!

Anybody hazard a guess at the type and purpose of said testing?

Could it be the one where they run two trams side by side to test clearances? Or have they already done that on the ORL?

Could it be the one where they run two trams side by side to test clearances? Or have they already done that on the ORL?

I don't think they've done it as far as Mumps have they?

I don't think they've done it as far as Mumps have they?

I remember a while ago people posting about the gauge tests as far as Central Park, but doubt its been done as far as Mumps, unless they got hold of 2 of the sentinel engines, and they dragged two trams down there.

I remember a while ago people posting about the gauge tests as far as Central Park, but doubt its been done as far as Mumps, unless they got hold of 2 of the sentinel engines, and they dragged two trams down there.

Couldn't they drag one with the sentinel and the other with 1027?

Probably easier to wait until the OHLE is live though.

Think there's a spelling error here. Think it should say 'completed to to the highest standard'.

Metrolink work will be done ‘to highest standard’

COUNCIL chiefs have pledged to ensure that preparatory works for the arrival of Metrolink are competed to the highest standard.

Oldham Council says that as contractors work to divert utilities, it is vital that, when they have finished, roads and footpaths are reinstated using the appropriate materials, and that they are not a danger to motorists or pedestrians.

To ensure it happens, council inspectors will carry out regular sample inspections and have legal powers to get the work re-done if it does not meet the required standard.

Councillor Jean Stretton, cabinet member for neighbourhoods, said: “Oldham Council staff carry out regular inspections on a minimum of 10 per cent of all the utility works being carried out at any one time.

“Staff ensure that all work currently under way is being carried out safely. During the six months following completion, it will be re-inspected and it will also be re-inspected if any complaints are received.

“For example, recent work carried out on behalf of BT on Manchester Road and King Street in Oldham town centre was assessed as not being up to the required standard.

“Once this was identified a legal defect notice was served requiring the contractors to put it right to the satisfaction of inspectors and at the contractor’s expense. This has now been completed.

“Oldham Council deals with more than 8,000 requests from utilities to work on roads and footpaths annually and we are committed to ensuring that when they have finished it is put back to an acceptable standard and at no cost to residents.”

Residents aware of any work being carried out on the highway that they feel is not safe, or is not of a good standard, are asked to report it on 0161-770 6644.

http://oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64627/metrolink-work-will-be-done-to-highest-standard

Could it be the one where they run two trams side by side to test clearances? Or have they already done that on the ORL?

Hi

They have did this but only as far as Central Park so the probably doing that next week then, if I right it will be first time tram had go as far as Mumps as last time the do testing the unlet went as far as old Werneth Station.:banana:

Couldn't they drag one with the sentinel and the other with 1027?

Probably easier to wait until the OHLE is live though.

The Oldham line is live as far as Mumps so they should be running on the own power this time.

Oldham Rochdale line, electrification of overhead power lines

As you may be aware, work is underway to build your new Metrolink extension. I am writing to inform you of the electrification of the overhead power lines between Central Park in Manchester and the Oldham Mumps (temporary) stop which will include all the intermediate areas around the new Metrolink stops at Newton Heath and Moston, Failsworth, Hollinwood, South Chadderton and Freehold.

In the next few days we will be switching on the electricity supply to the overhead lines which will power this section of the new extension. Once switched on, the overhead lines that run above the tramway will continuously carry electricity at a high voltage of 750 volts. The overhead lines should be considered live as of Wednesday 16 November 2011.

Sunday and overnight working in Shaw

Oldham and Rochdale Metrolink extension. Sunday working, Beal Lane to Milnrow Road Bridge (Shaw) and overnight working Beal Lane to Bridge Street/Railway View footbridge

Work will be taking place on Sunday 18th December 2011 between 8am and 5pm . This is to continue the ongoing ballast and track works for the new line which will involve the use of excavators, rollers and other plant vehicles operating on the Metrolink construction site between Beal Lane and Milnrow Road Bridge in Shaw.

In addition, there will be overnight working between Beal Lane and Bridge Street/Railway View footbridge. This night work will take place between 6pm and 4.30am from Monday 19th December to Wednesday 21st December 2011 . During the works rail materials will be distributed along this section of the line.

All out of hours works and method of working has been discussed and agreed in advance with the local authority.



http://www.metrolink.co.uk/constructionworks/index.asp?id=501

Think there's a spelling error here. Think it should say 'completed to to the highest standard'.



Not bad for the Chron, though.

Oldham Council seem a bit pissy about Metrolink. Some places in GM would kill for trams!

Not bad for the Chron, though.

That's true :)

Oldham Council seem a bit pissy about Metrolink. Some places in GM would kill for trams!

I think the problem is that Oldham Council had been hoping that trams would be running now (original opening was Autumn 2011 - the sign is still up on Clegg Street saying Metrolink arrives in 2011), then it was put back to March and now the talk is that it will be Summer 2012 (we'll find out when in January), which will make it nearly 3 years since the train line was closed down. It's probably a case of frustration of the delays combined with the roadworks in the town centre and Mumps.

I do believe that Oldham Council want the Metrolink to come. Get the feeling that they're hoping that the Metrolink will help attract people/businesses to the town. The only problem is that Oldham Council seem to be waiting for the trams to arrive first before attracting businesses rather than getting the businesses in by the time trams do arrive in the town.

That's true :)



I think the problem is that Oldham Council had been hoping that trams would be running now (original opening was Autumn 2011 - the sign is still up on Clegg Street saying Metrolink arrives in 2011), then it was put back to March and now the talk is that it will be Summer 2012 (we'll find out when in January), which will make it nearly 3 years since the train line was closed down. It's probably a case of frustration of the delays combined with the roadworks in the town centre and Mumps.

I do believe that Oldham Council want the Metrolink to come. Get the feeling that they're hoping that the Metrolink will help attract people/businesses to the town. The only problem is that Oldham Council seem to be waiting for the trams to arrive first before attracting businesses rather than getting the businesses in by the time trams do arrive in the town.

Frustration is always frustrating, I agree. Your point about Oldham BC not trying to attract businesses, though, is the chicken versus egg argument. In the days when we were told in Bristol that we were going to have a tram system - ha! - part of the justification was that new businesses would be attracted because of it. In fact, the original proposal had the system being paid for in part by the rise in property values along the route. This probably explains why it never happened, but also explains why Oldham is not already a vibrant hub of industrial excellence waiting for a tram. Not much point boasting about something that isn't up and running yet.

Im sure a tram has been up the Oldham line under its own power a few weeks ago. I could hear something coming up the line from Newton Heath but by the time i opened the bathroom window it had passed. Im certain it was a tram as the only sound i could hear when the window was open was the vibration from the rails. It wasn`t the Sentinal or the Track Tamper as i can hear the engines from these and it was going too quick to be one of these 2!!

I do believe that Oldham Council want the Metrolink to come. Get the feeling that they're hoping that the Metrolink will help attract people/businesses to the town. The only problem is that Oldham Council seem to be waiting for the trams to arrive first before attracting businesses rather than getting the businesses in by the time trams do arrive in the town.

Yeah, to be honest, they need to pull their fingers out about attracting investors to the area. After all, Oldham isn't the only town to get Metrolink this time round! If, say, Tameside attracted more businesses there, it would be off their own back.

It's not like "Build the Tram, and they shall come", more like people will be more likely to live in those areas, and *may* shop in Oldham, but if they don't invest in the town centre soon, people will happily stay on that tram right into Manchester or Rochdale (assuming they do some investment too).

Remember, this is the town that hung on to the claim of it being the home of the tubular bandage! It doesn't strike me as the most forward-thinking council in Greater Manchester!

Im sure a tram has been up the Oldham line under its own power a few weeks ago. I could hear something coming up the line from Newton Heath but by the time i opened the bathroom window it had passed. Im certain it was a tram as the only sound i could hear when the window was open was the vibration from the rails. It wasn`t the Sentinal or the Track Tamper as i can hear the engines from these and it was going too quick to be one of these 2!!

Hi

Did this happen around end of November, if so then it can been a good train as the where dropping stones down between South Chadderton to Werneth but if it where a tram then this is good news.

Being nice and wintery (and cold and slippery as we found out) we ventured out to get some new Waterpark/ Mersey/ Hardy Farm photos:

Remains of something (Sale Old Hall?) at Water Park stop
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/5018d832.jpg
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/982e5529.jpg


Water Park stop
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/b6a29734.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/0319d73e.jpg

Preparations for the new junction:
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/3c1dad8a.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/5682a035.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/78afade8.jpg

No park n ride activity yet
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/5b6d1316.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/6d958a26.jpg

Towards the Mersey
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/e986933a.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/3843ef58.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/2534f16a.jpg

Back towards the M60
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/14c1967c.jpg

The bridge site
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/ef93a8b6.jpg

From the bridge site towards the M60. A ramp now leads to the top of the embankment. Construction vehicle access?
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/f5617aa0.jpg

From the Mersey towards Chorlton
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/02630b96.jpg

Hardy Farm compound
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/91136bbb.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/b7732593.jpg

Love this sign!
http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/610ae669.jpg

More photos in the new year when hopefully there is more progress to document.

Good shots Marni. Gonna have to have a gander down that way at some point, maybe when the weather gets better!

Just come back from Hamburg. Theres a good transport system Manchester can hope to emulate one day!

Anyways a quick couple of shots from me of the Ashton line. Travel Lodge will provide an exellent tram spotting location one day :nuts::lol:

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/Geeves8612/P1010228.jpg

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/Geeves8612/P1010227.jpg

Towards Ashton

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/Geeves8612/P1010226.jpg

and Manchester.

Marni, smashing pictures but can you delete one post please?

Travel Lodge will provide an exellent tram spotting location one day :nuts::lol:


I worked out you were there!

Seems an expensive location for tram spotting. :lol:

Was expecting tony robinson to pop up in them pics marni1971,:lol:

http://i13.photobucket.com/albums/a260/Geeves8612/P1010226.jpg

What are the structures between the rails on the inbound track?

The uncovered remains of the building in the marni pictures appear to be formally excavated. I hope they are not directly on the alignment.

Well according to my contact at Metrolink subject to the weather testing is supposedly supposed to start tomorow on Oldham Loop Line as far as Oldham Mumps.

It might start tomorow or it could be cancelled at short notice and it does depend on the weather, apparantly Metrolinks idea is still to get the Oldham Line up and running before any other hence how quick track is going down at the moment between the other side of Mumps-Rochdale

Well according to my contact at Metrolink subject to the weather testing is supposedly supposed to start tomorow on Oldham Loop Line as far as Oldham Mumps.

It might start tomorow or it could be cancelled at short notice and it does depend on the weather, apparantly Metrolinks idea is still to get the Oldham Line up and running before any other hence how quick track is going down at the moment between the other side of Mumps-Rochdale

Exciting stuff. I'm sure there'll be people from this forum scattered all along that line for the first glimpse :banana:

Exciting stuff. I'm sure there'll be people from this forum scattered all along that line for the first glimpse :banana:

In this weather:bash:
I think I'll wait for the piccies:banana:

[QUOTE=marni1971;86764544]Being nice and wintery (and cold and slippery as we found out) we ventured out to get some new Waterpark/ Mersey/ Hardy Farm photos: Remains of something (Sale Old Hall?) at Water Park stop




From Sale Community Web

"The Old Hall, on the south side of Rifle Rd, that was demolished in 1920 was the final building in a sequence probably dating back to the Middle Ages. In 1840 Mrs Mary Worthington rebuilt the hall which was then 200 years old. The datestone of the 1920 building was removed and fixed to the lodge inside Worthington Park. It's inscription shows two dates JM1600 and MW1840, the former denoting James Massey. James, son of Richard, only succeeded to the estate on the death of his father in 1603 so the dates do not quite match if they denote building date. However, the hall was probably built around that date as the 1801 estate map shows a typical E shaped Jacobean building. This hall would have most likely replaced an earlier, timbered building, which may or may not have been on the same site.
....................................................................................................

When James Massey died in 1649 the estate passed to his oldest son, Richard. Richard later (1684) settled the hall and demesne lands on his daughter, Katherine, who married Robert Malyn. Richard's younger brother, William, married Ursula Domville and he built a house in 1688 in Fairy Lane known as Sale New Hall. This was demolished in 1953. Robert and Katherine's son, Massey Malyn, was rector of the parish from 1717to his death in 1729. The male line of the Masseys died out before the end of the 17th century. The principal later landowners of the Massey estate were the Earl of Stamford and Warrington, the Leghs and Egertons and Charles White."

Train Guard

Well according to my contact at Metrolink subject to the weather testing is supposedly supposed to start tomorow on Oldham Loop Line as far as Oldham Mumps.

It might start tomorow or it could be cancelled at short notice and it does depend on the weather, apparantly Metrolinks idea is still to get the Oldham Line up and running before any other hence how quick track is going down at the moment between the other side of Mumps-Rochdale

That side is only said to be 6 months behind schedule, so surprised at the rush really!

Well according to my contact at Metrolink subject to the weather testing is supposedly supposed to start tomorow on Oldham Loop Line as far as Oldham Mumps.

It might start tomorow or it could be cancelled at short notice and it does depend on the weather, apparantly Metrolinks idea is still to get the Oldham Line up and running before any other hence how quick track is going down at the moment between the other side of Mumps-Rochdale

Hi

Well I haven't see anything that but I did hear something this Morning around 9 to 10am and I sure it was on Metrolink line hopely that was't it but if anything come up I'll try and take some photo and maybe video.:banana:

Great pictures against the weather, marni – thanks for the background info TG – hope the archaeological find won’t cause a problem. And for Tony’s pix –(was it a mucky hotel weekend? - still I guess there’s not much else to do on that side of Ashton Moss at present!!)

Exciting stuff. I'm sure there'll be people from this forum scattered all along that line for the first glimpse :banana:

Well yes, some of us were out and about on the Oldham line in the last couple of days, and no, there wasn’t much happening, and yes, it was snowy then ice then very very wet!! Here are the pix to prove it and not much else! :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Burry/Queens%20Road/101_7104.jpg

Quite nice tarmacscaping above Monsall station though :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Monsall/101_7096.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Monsall/101_7097.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Monsall/101_7094.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Central%20Park/101_7093.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Central%20Park/101_7089.jpg

One sign of activity today was at Ashton terminus where the rails were being laid in the rain :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Ashton/101_7115.jpg

Not to worry – the best is yet to come!!

:banana:

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Burry/Queens%20Road/101_7104.jpg
Quite nice tarmacscaping above Monsall station
:banana:
Cheers for the pics as usual Johnny!

Ohhhh you slipped that word 'station' out again... :lol: I guess it comes naturally for that line since they were stations not all that long ago.

Any idea where those crossover pieces are for in that 1st pic???

Do you know something, I hadn't even noticed those, it being a quick snap taken from a tram window on the Bury line!! Quite a conundrum actually - perhaps they're for an additional turnback somewhere up the Oldham line? - I bet one of the insiders will know . . .

(ps I tend to use 'station' and 'tramstop' interchangeably according to the context - I'm inclined to see it as part of the organic nature of language, and perhaps underscored in this case by Metrolink's ambiguous high platforms! pps be careful, Kriis, we might get done for raising this particular dialogue again!!) :storm:

pps be careful, Kriis, we might get done for raising this particular dialogue again!!) :storm:

Haha, quick let's mention capacitors, transistors and logic gate schematics to cover it up! :lol::lol::lol:

Hopefully, before too long, we could see further extensions (pretty much the same as promised in the TiF bid) to Oldham Town Centre, the Airport & East Didsbury, as per AGMA's wish list today. http://0x43.org/bN

Hopefully, before too long, we could see further extensions (pretty much the same as promised in the TiF bid) to Oldham Town Centre, the Airport & East Didsbury, as per AGMA's wish list today.

PLEASE STOP PUTTING LINKS TO UNRELATED SITES

They are already underway, funded and approved, is this a current doc because work has been underway for a while.

On the topic of the Airport line, work has begun on the site of Benchill stop, full of MPT staff everywhere!

PLEASE STOP PUTTING LINKS TO UNRELATED SITES

They are already underway, funded and approved, is this a current doc because work has been underway for a while.

On the topic of the Airport line, work has begun on the site of Benchill stop, full of MPT staff everywhere!

It is an automated spammer that you are giving more airtime to.

Haha, quick let's mention capacitors, transistors and logic gate schematics to cover it up! :lol::lol::lol:

You could always reverse the polarity of the neutron field. (see how many get that one) lol

Well yes, some of us were out and about on the Oldham line in the last couple of days, and no, there wasn’t much happening, and yes, it was snowy then ice then very very wet!! Here are the pix to prove it and not much else! :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Monsall/101_7097.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Monsall/101_7094.jpg



I just passed Mosall station on the way to work after a few days off,
I noticed that they are putting up the yellow entrance arches at last!
There's half-built one on your photos.

Does this mean that things are finally starting to move?

Does this mean that things are really starting to move?

No.

Could those pieces of track on Irk Viaduct be the missing pieces needed to connect the line to the Bury line when they eventually get around ot connecting them up?

Great pictures against the weather, marni – thanks for the background info TG – hope the archaeological find won’t cause a problem.

Regarding the uncovered foundations at the water park roundabout, I did some research and it does indeed appear to be part of Sale Hall. Here's a composite of the latest Google Earth image with a pre M63 map superimposed:


http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/1ecc285b.jpg


And for reference, a wider composite image:

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/c0da01de.jpg

Hi

Good pictures of Monsall and Central Park Johnny:cheers:, them two pics at Monsall stop and other one near tram depot, the only thing that missed out of them is a tram running up and down but sadly that could be other six months to know.

One last thing on the Oldham line is it not possibly to opened the line to Shaw and Crompton but having it as 12 mins service off peak and have trams running to Mumps even 6 mins and have tram running to Shaw even 12 mins peak times, could that be possibly thing as at Shaw they are gonna have terminating.

http://www.metrolink.co.uk/pdf/future_metrolink/oldham-rochdale-line/shaw-and-crompton.pdf

You could always reverse the polarity of the neutron field. (see how many get that one) lol

Elementary my dear Doctor; Just bang 3 billion electron volts through the Flux Capacitor and into the Klystron Generator. When you've got 1.21 gigwatts on the gauge it's time for a liquid lunch, but mind the particle accelerator and the pair of rubber bands.

Zero-value prizes are available for identifying all references.

Time circuits on. Flux Capacitor... fluxxing. Engine running. All right!

Just thinking...

Once testing of the Oldham line is complete would it be viable to run a service from say... Central Park to Mumps and bus link to town? At least it would see the infrastructure being used!

Might be viable from a technical perspective but no way will they run a half assed service like that, would be bad pr, even compared to the late opening. Plus they'd have to connect up the junction to get trams on and off the line.

I guess it wouldn't look too good. You can get trams onto the via line the empty stock connector out of the depot.

Lol imagine the Oldhamers' reaction... "tramline's finally open, but you have to get a connecting bus from Monsall to Victoria!"

Lol imagine the Oldhamers' reaction... "tramline's finally open, but you have to get a connecting bus from Monsall to Victoria!"

Wouldn't blame them in the slightest!

Time circuits on. Flux Capacitor... fluxxing. Engine running. All right!

Just thinking...

Once testing of the Oldham line is complete would it be viable to run a service from say... Central Park to Mumps and bus link to town? At least it would see the infrastructure being used!

That not a bad idea have trams running from Monsall to Mumps but they oldhamers will moan about it saying that I bet when the finally due open Oldham line the oldhamers will possibly keep moaning about something like tram broke down or signalling problem:lol:.

Wouldn't blame them in the slightest!

Who would?

Please tell me this woman as been on the waccy-tobaccy or is it just nonsense?
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64762/metrolink-shaker

Heavy works do cause earth tremors, when they were driving the massive piles for the dam couple of hundred metres from my house there was perceptable ground shaking for months.

Please tell me this woman as been on the waccy-tobaccy or is it just nonsense?
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64762/metrolink-shaker

My house shaked when trains used to run past my house even when the building the new Freehold stop my house shaked my I didn't care, surely her house should shaked when trains what past her house then?.

Please tell me this woman as been on the waccy-tobaccy or is it just nonsense?
http://www.oldham-chronicle.co.uk/news-features/8/news-headlines/64762/metrolink-shaker

I think she's been on the crack.

Is there actually any good news about the Metrolink? Does anyone have anything good to say about it? I notice our elected representatives are keeping a very low profile other than the odd moan about it.

Only this week the Altrincham Chorlton & Eccles lines were closed after vandalism, so far as I see the scheme is a disaster, it will continue to be when it is running, and no one seems to want to take responsibility - what a surprise!
By Flake @ 20/12/2011 17:03:46

I read that as if 'Flake' is blaming Metrolink for someone trespassing and vandalising essential equipment... It seems some people do have goldfish brains.

One point I would say is, if Metrolink weren't currently converting the Oldham Loop line now, in5 years time people in Oldham would be slagging off the train system saying they wish they could have some shiny new yellow trams running on the lines, instead of the old, out-dated, noisy, dirty, heavy bangers that they would still have. :bash:

Seems noone can ever do anything right these days. :nuts:

I read that as if 'Flake' is blaming Metrolink for someone trespassing and vandalising essential equipment... It seems some people do have goldfish brains.

One point I would say is, if Metrolink weren't currently converting the Oldham Loop line now, in5 years time people in Oldham would be slagging off the train system saying they wish they could have some shiny new yellow trams running on the lines, instead of the old, out-dated, noisy, dirty, heavy bangers that they would still have. :bash:

Seems noone can ever do anything right these days. :nuts:

It's classic backwards-looking Oldham. It has been documented in numberous reports such as the Cantle Report (after the riots) and the One Oldham rebranding report that there is a stubborn vocal minority in the borough that drags Oldham down through its resistance to any change. It even affects grass-roots democracy where the politcal leadership is frightened of making any bold decisions (or any decisions in general perhaps) for fear of being voted out in such a marginal Labour/Lib Dem district.

I used to frequent the "ex-Soviet"-like Oldham Loop Line. It was cold, damp, bumpy, unreliable in the Autumn, inconveinent for anywhere other than Manchester city centre, and embarrassing if you wanted to bring company home. It gave out all the wrong signals about Oldham's aspirations and ambition, and its important position within the City Region. I admired it slightly, but for all the wrong reasons though - because it was often free (because the operation was so poorly managed), which is no way to run a modern 21st century rail network; no wonder rail tickets are going up by 5.9% in January.

Metrolink will be good for Oldham and continue to be good for Greater Manchester.

No.

There has been talk of testing on the Oldham line this week, StevePerkins, but one thing and one thing only will enable further progress, namely successful introduction of the 'Tram Management System' (signalling, operational control and info dissemination etc) which they still cannot get to work properly despite over 12 months of trying. Even Media City & St Werburgh's haven't opened correctly under TMS as planned.

It seems fairly clear now that all the projected future opening dates are therefore purely aspirational - they don't really seem to know what's wrong with the TMS, and are probably basically hoping that perseverance will pay off within the relevant timescales. So the 'eureka' moment that has to come sooner or later is proving elusive, no-one really knows, and until the problem is identified, never mind the solution, it is likely to remain so!

But when it does, it will surely be a wowser!!

I doubt it will be a Eureka moment.

I bet they slowly work through the problems and fiz literally thousands of 'snags' that are causing the currently problems.

the worry is that we may end up in an Edinburgh-Tram-Fiasco style stand off between various parties BEFORE we ever get to that Eureka moment - a stand off driven by estimate money/timescales being touted to get there.... :-(

I'm no expert but if TMS has worked in other cities then surely TfGM could get someone from those city(s) local authorities to try and fix the problem? Or have they already done this to no avail?

Elementary my dear Doctor; Just bang 3 billion electron volts through the Flux Capacitor and into the Klystron Generator. When you've got 1.21 gigwatts on the gauge it's time for a liquid lunch, but mind the particle accelerator and the pair of rubber bands.

Zero-value prizes are available for identifying all references.

Back To The Future??

I'm no expert but if TMS has worked in other cities then surely TfGM could get someone from those city(s) local authorities to try and fix the problem? Or have they already done this to no avail?

Other cities don't have the exact same system combination that we have, it looks to be very specific issues rather than general, I'm sure they'll already be doing everything they can to fix this!

I would live to know what options are currently under investigation as a method of delivering a solution to this problem. Remember the Jubilee line and the signalling issues with the hard deadline of 31st December 1999 to be ready.

I'm no expert but if TMS has worked in other cities then surely TfGM could get someone from those city(s) local authorities to try and fix the problem? Or have they already done this to no avail?

I am sure I read somewhere that the only environment this system has worked in previously is where there is a single line from (double track) from A to B. Nothing like the multi-line complexity of the Metrolink network.

Also - I believe that it has always been deployed onto new tramways. and this is the first time it is being implemented on/interfaced with an existing system.

But I could be wrong - no doubt someone will tell me if I am :-)

Not quite correct.

Forms of TMS are used all over the world on all systems.

The system that uses the same technologies as we are using in Manchester to deliver TMS is Bergen in Norway which is a simple new network.

However, it will have multiple junctions and complexities if nothing else off and on the network.

Given time each of the issues that are causing the problems will be worked through, I really do doubt there will be a Eureka moment, rather the number and possible impact of remaining snags will be so low that someone can make a go decision to proceed with a cut over. I seriously doubt that Thales will ever be in a position whereby they can say with 100% certainty that all is perfect - in fact no one will ever give a 100% guarentee on any IT system.

Once the system is 99.9% (or whatever) reliable someone will say that is enough, time to go live.

Hi

Can anyone who work on Metrolink system can confirm that testing on Oldham line have tuck place, as I sure someone on here said that the where gonna be testing Oldham line on Monday but I never saw a tram going up, and today I notice near old Werneth station the where digger on the track doing something, so the couldn't had tram up on the line today.

Just a quick one from me.

Managed to spot 3047 passing through Victoria this morning at 04:43 closely followed by double set 04 + 22 at 04:46. All of them heading towards Queens Road :)

Back To The Future??

Nope. There's a clue in that answer. Who'd have guessed?

Just a quick one from me.

Managed to spot 3047 passing through Victoria this morning at 04:43 closely followed by double set 04 + 22 at 04:46. All of them heading towards Queens Road :)

what 3004+3022 couple together :banana: or 1004+1022 couple together?

I am sure I read somewhere that the only environment this system has worked in previously is where there is a single line from (double track) from A to B. Nothing like the multi-line complexity of the Metrolink network.

Also - I believe that it has always been deployed onto new tramways. and this is the first time it is being implemented on/interfaced with an existing system.

But I could be wrong - no doubt someone will tell me if I am :-)

As I (and others) have said before TMS is not a product in its own right. TMS stands for Tram Management System, all tramways have some form of TMS ranging from the very basic to very complex. Like all control systems they evolve over a long period and gain additional functions and facilities. Metrolink currently has a Tram management System consisting of a 1998 control network system combined with 1980s block signalling.

The new system will be comprised of a number of subsystems to provide the overall network control. The exact combination has probably not yet been implemented elsewhere. The use of TMS beyond Trafford Bar on SML and beyond Pomona on Eccles makes me doubt that it is the interfacing with the old kit that is the problem. There are 2 interfaces with block signalling working now.

I doubt that the issue will descend into an Edinburgh fiasco as no doubt the contract clearly calls for a TMS that works. In Edinburgh the problems were more over the issue of who should pay for what, particularly the utility diversions.

My concern is Thales have 'won' a contact to which they had to deliver against.

However, if that contract suggested an environment that was, our could be argued is, incorrect, then Thales will ensure any blame for late delivery is due to the wrong specs in the original contract and not their fuck up.

as nice as this interlude over TMS issues is, we don't know the full details so it seems rather futile for us to argue over it!

In other news, I spied the start of rail being put down at the end of the Didsbury Village stop!

Very exciting!!! Might check that out tomorrow unless it's raining! :-)

My concern is Thales have 'won' a contact to which they had to deliver against.

However, if that contract suggested an environment that was, our could be argued is, incorrect, then Thales will ensure any blame for late delivery is due to the wrong specs in the original contract and not their fuck up.

You are right of course that if the contract implied that the existing infrastructure was different to what actually existed Thales may have a just claim.
However given that they can't seem to get the new system to work at the Old Trafford Depot entrance from SML it makes me think that there is something more fundamental as that area is new MPT constructed infrastructure.

I wonder whether we will ever find out of whether once the problems are resolved the cause will be lost in the mists of time.

as nice as this interlude over TMS issues is, we don't know the full details so it seems rather futile for us to argue over it!

In other news, I spied the start of rail being put down at the end of the Didsbury Village stop!

Given that TMS is such a big issue at the moment I personally think it merits discussion here. I may be corrected by others of course.

Good to hear that they have started to lay some track at Didsbury Village.

Hi

Can anyone who work on Metrolink system can confirm that testing on Oldham line have tuck place, as I sure someone on here said that the where gonna be testing Oldham line on Monday but I never saw a tram going up, and today I notice near old Werneth station the where digger on the track doing something, so the couldn't had tram up on the line today.

I had cause to be around Thorpes Bridge this morning so took a look over the bridge there to see if there were signs of any activity. The rails certainly don't look as though anything other than the odd road railer have been through recently.

You are right of course that if the contract implied that the existing infrastructure was different to what actually existed Thales may have a just claim.
However given that they can't seem to get the new system to work at the Old Trafford Depot entrance from SML it makes me think that there is something more fundamental as that area is new MPT constructed infrastructure.

I wonder whether we will ever find out of whether once the problems are resolved the cause will be lost in the mists of time.

I suspect given that Thales are presumably throwing significant investment at TMS they will deem the fix as intellectual capital they own and certainly would not want competitors to know the solution given Thales large investment.

I have mentioned this before but given the obvious problems here TfGM are now pretty stuck with Thales if they ever want TMS extending to new lines. Imagine the risk for a new company coming in to extend TMS when they know Thales had such problems.

I suspect given that Thales are presumably throwing significant investment at TMS they will deem the fix as intellectual capital they own and certainly would not want competitors to know the solution given Thales large investment.

I have mentioned this before but given the obvious problems here TfGM are now pretty stuck with Thales if they ever want TMS extending to new lines. Imagine the risk for a new company coming in to extend TMS when they know Thales had such problems.

Obsolescence is a big problem these days. bearing in mind that Metrolink is just 20 years old it is now on it's third 'TMS' system. The original GEC system was binned in 1998/9 during the Eccles project as it was no longer supported. Phase 3 is seeing the Adtranz (Bombardier) system replaced just over 10 years later even though the contract for it required it to be able to deal with the 'Big Bang'. Each time a new supplier comes on board so may be Thales won't supply the kit for any Phase 4 project.

Elementary my dear Doctor Sherlock Holmes; Just bang 3 billion electron volts Otto von Schirach - Maxipad Detention through the Flux Capacitor Back to the Future and into the Klystron Generator Return to the forbidden planet. When you've got 1.21 gigwatts Back to the future on the gauge it's time for a liquid lunch, but mind the particle accelerator and the pair of rubber bands. Bowerick Wowbagger - Life, the universe and Everything

Zero-value prizes are available for identifying all references.

References in Green, Answers in Red

Have I missed anything?

Mersey Valley crossing update

Just through my letterbox:

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/34f129c7.jpg

http://i1185.photobucket.com/albums/z349/Uploads1971/4b4b8a24.jpg

I had cause to be around Thorpes Bridge this morning so took a look over the bridge there to see if there were signs of any activity. The rails certainly don't look as though anything other than the odd road railer have been through recently.

Hi

I never through they did the testing on Oldham line this week, surely it be beg of Jan when the do it know, will the need to have signal in for a tram to come up on Oldham line used it own power?.

References in Green, Answers in Red

Have I missed anything?

"3 billion electron volts" was intended to be from Forbidden Planet (film, with Leslie Neilsen) a quote (http://www.bruceandbrandon.info/warren/films/forquotes.html) from the description of the super-duper forcefield (halfway down page in link).

However, major bonus points for Wowbagger in the immortality quote!

References in Green, Answers in Red

Have I missed anything?

Nearly but not quite right afraid.

TMS is sorted and all extensions will open next week. This is all they have to do.... twiddle a few knobs.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yLD03bU5R5M&feature=related

Hi

I never through they did the testing on Oldham line this week, surely it be beg of Jan when the do it know, will the need to have signal in for a tram to come up on Oldham line used it own power?.

Was the quote taken from a letter to residents? I don't recall seeing the source.
Edit, I see it was from an inside source via M60Lad. Things obviously changed perhaps due to the weather earlier in the week.

However to answer your specific question, no they won't need signalling to allow a test tram to run as it will be undertaken either within an engineers possession of the line or on what is a construction site. They will need human intervention to get trams out of Queens Road Depot via Smedley Junction and also to turn back art Oldham I would guess. I would not expect them to use the Bury Line Junction just yet as that would need changes to the Bury Line signalling.

Presumably Thales have not even started on TMS for the single track section near Dean Lane as we were informed the depot would be done first and that is clearly not ready.

That single track section would be quite complex I guess, akin to MediaCity. I really don't see how TfGM can be optimistic for anything positive with regards trams to Oldham anytime remotely soon.

Mersey Valley crossing update

Just through my letterbox:

Interesting year for us all next year :)

Was the quote taken from a letter to residents? I don't recall seeing the source.
Edit, I see it was from an inside source via M60Lad. Things obviously changed perhaps due to the weather earlier in the week.

However to answer your specific question, no they won't need signalling to allow a test tram to run as it will be undertaken either within an engineers possession of the line or on what is a construction site. They will need human intervention to get trams out of Queens Road Depot via Smedley Junction and also to turn back art Oldham I would guess. I would not expect them to use the Bury Line Junction just yet as that would need changes to the Bury Line signalling.

Right thanks for Freel07, I through they didn't need Signal to be in but I was't sure.

Presumably Thales have not even started on TMS for the single track section near Dean Lane as we were informed the depot would be done first and that is clearly not ready.

That single track section would be quite complex I guess, akin to MediaCity. I really don't see how TfGM can be optimistic for anything positive with regards trams to Oldham anytime remotely soon.

Is not possibly to have old Signal in on Oldham line and line to Velopark like the did with Chorlton line then if they can the could open them lines soon then.

how many extra trams will the need for Oldham line if Chorlton line will go to Oldham? and how many extra trams will the need if the opened the line to Velopark and have Eccles line going they? how many will that need.

I think you've partly answered your own question. There is not enough trams compatible with the old style signalling which they need to use the existing bits of the network. Even if TMS works on the new bits (unlikely) those trams won't get across the city centre, stopping them at central park and new islington, not a good idea...... There is barely enough trams now to work the lines currently open.

I think you've partly answered your own question. There is not enough trams compatible with the old style signalling which they need to use the existing bits of the network. Even if TMS works on the new bits (unlikely) those trams won't get across the city centre, stopping them at central park and new islington, not a good idea...... There is barely enough trams now to work the lines currently open.

Couldn't they used M5000 trams (3018 to 3028) to do that?.

No because a) TMS doesn't work yet b) those trams aren't equipped to run on non TMS lines. It's either spend lots of ££££ equipping that lot of M5000 and the new lines with the old style signalling equipment for (hopefully) the short term or wait 'til TMS is working... even if they got TMS working on the new lines and could get those trams out of the depot, running a short service stopping outside the city centre will be a bit crap if you ask me!

Is not possibly to have old Signal in on Oldham line and line to Velopark like the did with Chorlton line then if they can the could open them lines soon then.

how many extra trams will the need for Oldham line if Chorlton line will go to Oldham? and how many extra trams will the need if the opened the line to Velopark and have Eccles line going they? how many will that need.

For South Manchester they only used the old style signalling for the junction at Trafford Bar, the section down to St Werburghs Road uses a minimal TMS based system to track the trams and provide the turnback crossover which is a set of spring points anyway.

To open to Oldham they would need to use the old style signalling at the junction on the Bury Line and then use the basic TMS right through to Oldham. This junction is more difficult to signal than Trafford Bar as it is not grade seperated and therefore has far worse conflicts and being high up on a viaduct the consequences of an accident are far worse. See this report of an accident at this site: http://www.railwaysarchive.co.uk/documents/MoT_Irk1953.pdf

To get to Velopark requires TMS to be able to control the Piccadilly/Sheffield Street area to allow the Eccles/MediaCity UK or the Bury Altrincham via Piccadilly services to turn back there.

As for the extra trams needed I am not sure of numbers but at present there are certainly nowhere near enough dual equipped trams to provide that level of service. 3018 to 3028 aren't equipped with the old style equipment. I would guess that it would take at least another 12 trams to operate both these extension lines.

No because a) TMS doesn't work yet b) those trams aren't equipped to run on non TMS lines. It's either spend lots of ££££ equipping that lot of M5000 and the new lines with the old style signalling equipment for (hopefully) the short term or wait 'til TMS is working... even if they got TMS working on the new lines and could get those trams out of the depot, running a short service stopping outside the city centre will be a bit crap if you ask me!

The idea of running to Velopark does have merits as it would enable service proving of some TMS functions at less risk than on a longer route. Agreed the need to equip enough trams with both signalling systems would require a big investment in both time and money. It's a delicate balance.

I was told by a driver recently that tms works fine at controlling signals. Fine at controlling poinys, but instantly crashes if you ask it to do both at the same time

Not seen any trams at Oldham Mumps but have noticed that the layout for the tracks in the middle of the old roundabout has now started to appear this week. Does look like they'll have to change the layout of the traffic lights again when trams eventually run through to Shaw and Rochdale along the temporary line as the Oldham Way traffic lights would have to be moved back to accommodate the tracks to run across the road.

I was told by a driver recently that tms works fine at controlling signals. Fine at controlling poinys, but instantly crashes if you ask it to do both at the same time

Very worrying if so. In a year or so I would hope a stable IT system could be delivered.one capable of dealing with errors and not crashing repeatedly.

I was told by a driver recently that tms works fine at controlling signals. Fine at controlling poinys, but instantly crashes if you ask it to do both at the same time

Interesting comment there. It certainly works controlling the signals between Pomona and Eccles. The only points it actually 'controls' at the moment are those at Broadway/Harbour City and MediaCityUK and not all of those are actually controlled as some are sprung. Harbour City crossover is sprung and I think the points on the outbound line at Broadway from MediaCityUK are also sprung. However we all know what troubles there have been with this area.

I can't actually think of anywhere that there are points on their own controlled by TMS with no signals. The turnbacks at Eccles and St Werburghs Road are both sprung points with no control so it's no wonder they work.

A photo taken at Thorpes Bridge yesterday morning. As I said not much sign of any rail vehicle movements over the track recently.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000602a.jpg

Some progress photos around Ashton taken yesterday afternoon as the MPT guys were wrapping up for Christmas.

Ashton Terminus with the platform base and track laid and concreted on the left hand side. Rail is also laid on the right hand side.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000612a.jpg

Ashton West Stop. Again platform bases cast and also to be seen are the grooved to flatbottom transition rails ready to install.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000620a.jpg

The road crossing at Ashton Moss Stop is now complete with the road reopened.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000641a.jpg

Ashton Moss Stop has its platform now
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000642a.jpg
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000647a.jpg

The detail of the finished track construction.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000648a.jpg

The track laid between Moss Way and Ashton Moss Stop. Something that has intrigued me about this stretch is the way the track climbs and then drops away again and also that the outbound track is higher than the inbound. Presumably there must be something under the track here that has required the elevation for a short distance.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000681a.jpg
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000652a.jpg

A closer shot of the panels that will be between the rails adjacent to the Travelodge, they have reinforcement which has been added to the main slab. Something to do with the noise and vibration reduction perhaps?
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000660a.jpg

The grooved rail is in behind the Snipe now and also alongside the concrete block wall on Manchester Road.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000667a.jpg
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000672a.jpg

Finally the road crossing of the eastbound carriageway just east of the Audenshaw gyratory system is now in.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000673a.jpg

Interesting comment there. It certainly works controlling the signals between Pomona and Eccles. The only points it actually 'controls' at the moment are those at Broadway/Harbour City and MediaCityUK and not all of those are actually controlled as some are sprung. Harbour City crossover is sprung and I think the points on the outbound line at Broadway from MediaCityUK are also sprung. However we all know what troubles there have been with this area.

I can't actually think of anywhere that there are points on their own controlled by TMS with no signals. The turnbacks at Eccles and St Werburghs Road are both sprung points with no control so it's no wonder they work.

A total wild guess, but possibly the problems being described relate to the SML / depot junction and testing on that section of track and this is what they cannot get working on the TMS only parts that they are stuggling with?

A total wild guess, but possibly the problems being described relate to the SML / depot junction and testing on that section of track and this is what they cannot get working on the TMS only parts that they are stuggling with?

Quite probably yes, I didn't think of that.

Yeh I think that comment referred to the depot to sml testing, they can get the points working without the signalling, or the signalling without the points (presumably with them being thrown by hand) but not both at the same time

The track laid between Moss Way and Ashton Moss Stop. Something that has intrigued me about this stretch is the way the track climbs and then drops away again and also that the outbound track is higher than the inbound. Presumably there must be something under the track here that has required the elevation for a short distance.
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000681a.jpg
http://i985.photobucket.com/albums/ae333/freel07/Metrolink/P1000652a.jpg


I know theres high pressure gas pipe running somewhere through Ashton. Its not on any maps due to its sensitivity and being a possible target for terrorists. Great if your digging a hole and no one tells you. Someone I work with nearly had his jcb driver put his bucket into the thing and take out half of East Manchester. Some random bloke turns up out of the blue saying stop all work, world war three starts.

Which sounds like a software problem that could be worked on in a lab as you would imagine they can replicate the signals and points being activated in the right sequence.

It is very odd that if what we are presuming is true that what sounds like a relatively simple software logic cannot be easily resolved.

I know theres high pressure gas pipe running somewhere through Ashton. Its not on any maps due to its sensitivity and being a possible target for terrorists. Great if your digging a hole and no one tells you. Someone I work with nearly had his jcb driver put his bucket into the thing and take out half of East Manchester. Some random bloke turns up out of the blue saying stop all work, world war three starts.

May be that's what it is then although that would only account for the elevation not the difference between inbound and outbound levels. Also seems strange that Lord Sheldon Way doesn't follow the same level changes and that the garden centre is built right over it as well as the tramway track slab is designed to span 3 to 4 metres unsupported and so the trams would hardly be likely to place much direct load on anything underneath. At first I wondered whether it was a mining issue left over from Ashton Moss pit where B&Q is but again neither the road nor the buildings are affected.

May be that's what it is then although that would only account for the elevation not the difference between inbound and outbound levels. Also seems strange that Lord Sheldon Way doesn't follow the same level changes and that the garden centre is built right over it as well as the tramway track slab is designed to span 3 to 4 metres unsupported and so the trams would hardly be likely to place much direct load on anything underneath. At first I wondered whether it was a mining issue left over from Ashton Moss pit where B&Q is but again neither the road nor the buildings are affected.

Mine shafts are certainly fun. Not all of them are registered with the Coal Authority and most people only find out if they are registered a later date or if your house starts moving. Find out you've got a mine shaft under your building and its worth about £0. Theres a place in South Wales where they built aload of 1940s housing over a large mine shaft, one afternoon two semis turn into a large hole. I believe the whole estate is now condemned.

Cheers for those informative pix of Ashton Moss Freel.

My Eureka moment will be when the next bit of extension opens - I have already run the bathwater 3 times but it keeps going cold!

ro2 I have been up and down the Oldham line a few times this week but not much happening after all.

Hollinwood is all quiet :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7139.jpg

Except for a load of lights burning juice in the middle of the day :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7137.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7140.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7143.jpg

The only thing of note was the engineering wagon at Dean Lane :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Newton%20Heath%20Moston/101_7142.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Newton%20Heath%20Moston/101_7145.jpg

So we continue to wait ro2 - the construction industry tends to take a couple of weeks off at this time, so here's looking forward to at least 12 bananas bananing in 2012 and all the best to everyone!!

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

Hi

Good pictures of East Manchester line Freel07:cheers:, is that some track down at Ashton bus station if so I wondering if line to Ashton be opening before Winter 2013/14 but this is Metrolink we taking about:lol:, also good pictures on Oldham line Johnny:cheers:, Hollinwood stop just look like Freehold stop but without lights been on and yellow paint, I think the will start testing the Oldham line before Jan 20th as they got meeting about Oldham & Rochdale line on 20th Jan taking about when it might opened and it will give them idea when the might open it after testing done. I through that 151 bus service got withdrawn and replace by 188 service but it look like it didn't. :banana:

Merry Christmas to everyone on this forums and thank you for taking all pictures from all New Metrolink line and let hope they will be some new lines opening in 2012 and hopely TMS will be fine. :cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers::cheers:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

Cheers for those informative pix of Ashton Moss Freel.

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7143.jpg

The only thing of note was the engineering wagon at Dean Lane :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Newton%20Heath%20Moston/101_7142.jpg


So we continue to wait ro2 - the construction industry tends to take a couple of weeks off at this time, so here's looking forward to at least 12 bananas bananing in 2012 and all the best to everyone!!

:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

Cheers Johnny.
When was the photo of that Bluebird bus taken was it yesterday as it was just in the same position when I was down there yesterday morning.

Interesting to see that there is a group of Network Rail guys working round that prefabricated turnout on their side of the blue fence. I guess that may well be installed over the Christmas shutdown as part of the changes brought about by the conversion to Metrolink. it looks as though its part of the double to single line connection on the refuse depot line perhaps.

Anyway all the best to the gang of regulars and here's hoping for a busy 2012.

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Hollinwood/101_7143.jpg



Doesn't that just look so right?

Apologies for possible mawkishness (just been here http://www.barleymowbonsall.co.uk/, so pretty relaxed at the moment) but thanks and best wishes to all contributers to this thread that never fails to brighten my day, every day.

Here's to lots of :banana: action in 2012!

Neil

Doesn't that just look so right?
Neil

Er.. no, sorry, never did. At least not to many of us who remember the old MCT(D), Salford, Stockport, Ashton, SHMD etc. liveries!

Er.. no, sorry, never did. At least not to many of us who remember the old MCT(D), Salford, Stockport, Ashton, SHMD etc. liveries!

First did them heritage liveries on the F reg olympians before they got rid when they was at wigan depot. Shame stagecoach or first haven`t done a GM Buses heritage livery.

Stagecoach Manchester have a training bus in old North Western RCC colours http://www.flickr.com/photos/salford_ian/4469507457/

Well as equalspark mentioned a couple of pages back, there are indeed rails down on the Didsbury line :banana::banana:

Firstly a couple of station shots along the route where things have changed slightly since I last saw them:

Burton Road stop is taking shape and is fortunate enough to get a brick clad lift shaft:

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/01.jpg

So does West Didsbury (not that much changed here, I just like the station's location!)

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/02.jpg

I think its wide entrance will look nice with a big yellow arch over it :)

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/03.jpg

The Didsbury tunnel looks all set to receive rails and/or OLE...

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/04.jpg

...but it's when you look the other way from School Lane that you see this:

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/05.jpg

Woohooo! :banana:

From Parrs Wood Rd looking back to Didsbury Village...

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/05b.jpg

...and towards Kingsway and East Didsbury:

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/06.jpg

Close up of the crossover before E. Didsbury stop:

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/07.jpg

And looking back from Kingsway bridge:

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/08.jpg

Bit of track at E. Didsbury stop isn't connected up yet...

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/09.jpg

...because they have done this - I assume this is so they can transport materials down the line that have been brought in by road?

http://i853.photobucket.com/albums/ab93/martin2345uk/Didsbury%2024122011/10.jpg

All in all they are cracking on with this bit, I've said it before and I'll say it again, feels strange that it won't be open for at least another year and a half! :bash:

Merry Christmas everyone!

Hi

Good pictures of South Manchester line Martin:cheers:, is bit weird that they got two crossover track in same place?:banana:

Hi

Good pictures of South Manchester line Martin:cheers:, is bit weird that they got two crossover track in same place?:banana:

It would be needed so they can access and leave from either side of the island platform.
http://farm8.staticflickr.com/7143/6564377845_c50e76210e_z.jpg
:banana::banana:

Think we had a discussion about why a scissors crossover like at Bury and Picc undercover wasn't used instead. Think we had the outcome it would probably cheaper for this, and also simpler for the TMS, since it probably has three sprung points and one controlled. I guess it means (if it did get desperate) East Didsbury could operate without TMS for a less than full service by not using the right hand track at the platform. [i.e. the left hand diagram]

Well done Martin - great Christmas eve update.

I'm soooo frickin excited!! Rails at East Didsbury - wooop! Whilst the TMS problem is a right pain (esp for the Oldhamites), work continues on the SML & the Airport line at a great pace & still gives us reasons to be cheerful. Also, when the EML & O&R lines do end up opening, the others will follow in quick succession. Bang, bang, bang!

I'd like to take this opportunity to thank each & everyone of you, for making this one of the friendliest forums on SkyscraperCity & a very merry Christmas to you all & your loved ones. Have a great holiday.

Best, SiM

So good to see all this progress! Anyhow some 'historic' documents for the Christmas season!

http://www.flickr.com/photos/36844288@N00/6566207613/in/photostream

http://www.flickr.com/photos/36844288@N00/6566194403/in/photostream

Loving those, Central, and welcome! (It feels like time we should be having another newsletter?)

Very exciting developments at East Didsbury also, martin - they're all gonna be ready at once!! That's a very strange looking additional feeder track, I think you're right about its purpose. The double crossover is presumably also to allow for a 6 minute service Kriis. And originally, of course, it was only going to be a single line between Olive Shapley and East Didsbury - they bought the extra land later, to facilitate through working to Stockport . . . . . .

Anyway, it's all quiet over here on the Eastern front, but all the track is now laid, finished and ready from Piccadilly to Droylsden. Here’s a few Xmas holiday pix :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7218.jpg

Rails and poles among the setts once again :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Clayton%20Hall/101_7217.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Edge%20Lane/101_7287.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Edge%20Lane/101_7292.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Edge%20Lane/101_7293.jpg

I am surprised that the railway inspectorate have allowed the rails to go so close to people’s garden gates, here approaching Cemetery Road tramstop. The purpose is to create a pocket for right turning vehicles in front of the Jolly Carter, the cream building middle distance on the right. But I am sure it doesn’t need to be so lengthy - there are never more than a couple of cars waiting there :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7284.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7278.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7275.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7270.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7232.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7240.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7243.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7246.jpg

The red ohle poles have now reached the canal bridge, just short of Droylsden terminus :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7233.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7239.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/Cemetery%20Road/101_7248.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7264.jpg

The infamous turnback trambaan, raised with a lighter coloured surface :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7260.jpg

I didn't realise the clock chimes the quarter-hours, but unlike Mcr Town Hall it's very, very faint – you can only just about hear it when standing alongside :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7254.jpg

But banana time marches on!!

:banana::banana::banana:

A 12 minute direct service is running between Altrincham and Bury. (Piccadilly Station is closed)

Extra units will be used to accommodate passengers travelling to and from the football match at Old Trafford.

A 12 minute service is operating on the Eccles line with all trams calling at MediaCityUK and terminating at Piccadilly.

I'd quite like to know how Piccadilly can be closed but still accommodate Eccles trams :D

I'd quite like to know how Piccadilly can be closed but still accommodate Eccles trams :D

Piccadilly Station/Piccadilly Gardens?

Nice pics their JDR , only thing i can say is BRING ON THE BANANAS:banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana::banana:

I'd quite like to know how Piccadilly can be closed but still accommodate Eccles trams :D

I believe they ran to Piccadilly but pax were ushered away from the main station.

I believe they ran to Piccadilly but pax were ushered away from the main station.

It's understandable that they would still run to Piccadilly, a lot of passengers use that stop for nearby workplaces and homes etc.

It's understandable that they would still run to Piccadilly, a lot of passengers use that stop for nearby workplaces and homes etc.

Indeed. I think the fire doors at the top of the escalators were closed, still leaving the Metrolink Mezzanine level open to go to the departure platform.

Hi

Good pictures of East Manchester line Johnny:cheers:, that good news about they got track down from Piccadilly to Droylsden, maybe they will have trams testing line to Droylsden in couple of months or will the need the overhead wires to be live allway up to Droylsden for that to happen?.

Well I guess they can test clearances, etc by towing a car with the engineering vehicle ro2, but they have to run a full 'ghost' timetable for several days before opening, maybe more given the greater amount of interface with road vehicles on East Manchester.

However, because of the issues with TMS, Droylsden is currently set for 'Autumn 2012', which could be nearly 12 months yet. All being well, the way things are going, Ashton could follow in not much more than 12 months after that!

Whilst I'm on, here’s a few more updates of the current state of play from the North and East, during the construction winterval . . .

Rochdale Railway Station tramstop now has platforms :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Rochdale/RRS/101_7300.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Rochdale/RRS/101_7295.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Rochdale/RRS/101_7307.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Rochdale/RRS/101_7310.jpg

Can’t wait to see 'The Banana Ascending' (Isn't that by Delius?) :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Rochdale/RRS/101_7304.jpg

Oldham Mumps roundabout is no more :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps/101_7332.jpg

Not much progress between Bell Street & Brook Street, however :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps/101_7330.jpg

Onwards and upwards towards Derker (is that a smidgeon of rail in the disance?):-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps/101_7341.jpg

And back down again towards Mumps Temporary :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps/101_7343.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps/101_7340.jpg

At the risk of repeating a very corny line, It’s a Long, Long Way to Temporary :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps%20Temporary/101_7324.jpg

But now at least it has shelters and tarmac. The shelters look flimsy and temporary also, but at least they have side panels, and for this reason alone will do a much better job than most of the new permanent ones all over Metrolink (viz Cornbrook, Deansgate-C, Ladywell etc etc) :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps%20Temporary/101_7315.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps%20Temporary/101_7318.jpg

In the centre of this next shot I think is a shade of the old Mumps station – until very recently there was a massive pile of sleepers etc. here :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/Mumps%20Temporary/101_7322.jpg

Over at King Street tramstop, once the 1960’s brutalism of the Co-op Funeral Parlour has gone, that end of Union Street should have a much finer view of St Patrick’s Church behind it :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/King%20Street/101_7359.jpg

A new feeder road, on the left of this shot, has been created as a (temporary?) replacement for the junction of John Street and Foundry Street, under which Metrolink must now pass in a cutting :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/King%20Street/101_7357.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/King%20Street/101_7353.jpg

I think the retaining wall beneath this new build (the replacement funeral parlour?) will probably form the Northern abutment of the cutting, as the alignment descends through the earth away from the camera :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Oldham/King%20Street/101_7352.jpg

Over at Ashton West to-day :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Ashton/Ashton%20West/101_7363.jpg

Ashton Moss roundabout :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Ashton/Ashton%20Moss/101_7365.jpg

And finally another view of the Droylsden Terminal Trambaan :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7368.jpg

:banana:

And a couple more shots of the Droylsden Terminal Trambaan :-

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7369.jpg

http://i742.photobucket.com/albums/xx61/Johnny_de_Rivative/Droylsden/101_7368.jpg

:banana:

i hope they tidy up that road and pavement surface.. looks a bit of a mess after all the utility works :bash:

Work in progress, Kriis, work in progress! Tameside are bragging that all their street running section will have brand new pavements, and I must say if it turns out like Edge Lane and Villemomble are shaping up, it will be fabulata!! . . .