Malaysia-Singapore

There is a bullet train project at 300 km/h (186 mph) to link Kuala Lumpur and Singapore, proposed by the current Malaysian operator KLIA Express YTL Corporation, which links Kuala Lumpur with the KLIA. Travel time would be 90 minutes, compared with 4 hours of highway drive, 7 hours currently by standard rail, 2 hours of flight including commuting to and from airport, check in and boarding. Plans for the project were shelved due to high government cost. The project also faces opposition from rail operator rivals such as Keretapi Tanah Melayu.

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Govt Drops Plan For High Speed Bullet Train Project, Says EPU Chief
Published: 2008/04/22

PUTRAJAYA, April 22 (Bernama) -- The cost factor was the main reason the government decided not to go ahead with the high-speed bullet train link between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore proposed by YTL Corp Bhd.

"The letters on the decision were sent to parties such as YTL and the relevant agencies in early April," said Economic Planning Unit (EPU) director-general, Datuk Seri Dr Sulaiman Mahbob, told Bernama here Tuesday.

He said the government would have to bear a significant cost based on the financial model that was submitted by YTL.

"Based on the financial model submitted by YTL, the government has decided not to go ahead with the bullet train (project)," he said, without elaborating on the amount the government has to bear.

YTL has proposed the RM8 billion project which would take 90 minutes to travel between the two capitals from about seven-and-a-half hours now.

It was earlier reported that the government has allowed YTL to do a feasibility study and it (YTL) came back to say the project was feasible.

The plan for a high-speed train between the two cities, spanning about 300km, was proposed in late 1990s, but garnered strong interest last year after the government invited companies to come up with ideas for privately-funded projects.

-- BERNAMA

Kereta api laju KL-Singapura batal
Oleh Abdul Halim Yusoff
BeritaHarian

KUALA LUMPUR: Kerajaan memutuskan untuk tidak meneruskan cadangan projek pembangunan sistem kereta api laju yang menghubungkan Kuala Lumpur-Singapura kerana projek itu memerlukan kos yang terlalu tinggi.

Ketua Pengarah Unit Perancang Ekonomi (EPU) di Jabatan Perdana Menteri, Datuk Seri Sulaiman Mahbob, berkata kerajaan memutuskan untuk tidak menyokong pelaksanaan projek itu selepas meneliti cadangan yang dikemukakan mengenainya.

"Kerajaan tidak akan meneruskan projek kereta api laju itu kerana berdasarkan model kewangan dibentangkan syarikat konsesi, kita perlu menanggung beban kos kewangan yang besar," katanya ketika dihubungi Berita Harian, di sini semalam.

Bagaimanapun, beliau enggan mengulas jumlah kos yang perlu ditanggung kerajaan bagi projek itu yang dikatakan mampu menjimatkan tempoh perjalanan kereta api dari Kuala Lumpur ke Singapura kepada 90 minit, berbanding lebih enam jam ketika ini.

Sulaiman berkata, pihaknya juga sudah memaklumkan keputusan kerajaan itu kepada kementerian, jabatan dan syarikat berkaitan tetapi enggan mengulas lanjut.

Projek kereta api laju yang dianggar memerlukan pelaburan berjumlah kira-kira RM8 bilion itu dicadangkan syarikat prasarana dan pembinaan YTL Corporation Bhd (YTL Corp).

YTL Hopes For Bullet Train Project To Materialise
June 30, 2009 23:00 PM

KUALA LUMPUR, June 30 (Bernama) -- Conglomerate YTL Corporation Bhd hopes that the government will pursue the proposed RM8 billion bullet train project between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore given its potential economic spin-offs.

Managing director Tan Sri Francis Yeoh Sock Ping said he wanted to see the project taking shape even if YTL is not involved.

"As a Malaysian citizen, I would like to see this project between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore done even if YTL does not build it," Yeoh said at a media briefing at the Invest Malaysia conference here Tuesday.

"It does not matter if the government can build it and anybody can bid for it, but I think this is a project that must be done," he said.

The project proposal came from YTL but it was cancelled due to significant costs to be borne by the government.

It is expected to cut travel time between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore to 90 minutes.

"It is a relevant project. There is a lot of economic value to the high-speed train," Yeoh said.

He said that high-speed trains in other countries like Taiwan (between Taipei and Kaohsiung) and Britain have been successful in connecting people and helping to generate business activities.

"Japan also, how would that country be powerful as an industrial force if not because of the communication. They connected the people in such a powerful way, the high-speed trains," Yeoh said.

"So, I hope this kind of project can materialise soon," he said.

Yeoh said YTL would continue to support the government, adding that the announcement of the liberalisation of foreign ownership will help to boost economic growth.

-- BERNAMA

YTL: KL-S'pore bullet train project economically viable
By Azlan Abu Bakar
Published: 2009/07/01

http://www.btimes.com.my/articles/waytil/pix_topright

DIVERSIFIED group YTL Corp Bhd (4677) said it still believes the high-speed bullet train linking Kuala Lumpur to neighbouring Singapore is an economically viable project and hopes the government will reconsider its implementation.

Its managing director Tan Sri Francis Yeoh said the project is important to further build and strengthen the country's economy. It can also help attract foreign investors to the country.

"We hope the government will continue with the high-speed bullet train project for the sake of the country and the economy," he told a media briefing on the sidelines of Invest Malaysia 2009 in Kuala Lumpur yesterday.

"Indeed, we don't mind if we are not involved in the project as long as the government or other companies are interested in realising the project," he added.
The plan for a high-speed train between the two cities, spanning about 300km, was proposed in the late 1990s.

The project was shelved in 2008 by the government due to the high cost of building it. This was based on the financial model that was submitted by YTL.

The proposed RM8 billion bullet train project is said to be able to cut travelling time between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore to 90 minutes compared with existing trains which takes about seven hours.

Yeoh said he is optimistic that the present government would reconsider the project's implementation and put it on the urgent list.

"China, Japan, the UK, Europe and Taiwan are among the places that have successfully implemented a high-speed train system. Malaysia should have it too in efforts to become a developed country," he said.

bukan dah ada thread ke untuk ni??? anyway dis is totally good 4 us specially 4 Iskandar JB

thread belum ni sudah kunci!..

High-speed train offer from Siemens
STORIES BY CHAN CHING THUT
Monday April 23, 2007

http://www.ytlcommunity.com/common/showimage.asp?imgid=70138

The Velaro i the culmination of Siemens' efforts to achieve
an average speed of 350kph for high-speed rail transport

YTL Corp Bhd managing director Tan Sri Francis Yeoh raised the buzz on high-speed rail service when he proposed the service to link Kuala Lumpur and Singapore last July.

Until now, no decision has been made as the Malaysian government is still studying the proposal.

However, Siemens is ready to share its expertise in high-speed rail technology if the project gets the approval.

Siemens Malaysia Sdn Bhd transportation systems head Tim Hunter said the company was likely to work with YTL Corp if the latter was awarded the project.

http://thestar.com.my/archives/2007/4/23/business/b_p16velaroE.jpg

The Velaro E has a top speed of 350km an hour

YTL Corp had conducted a study, which found the project feasible.

“The Government is identifying the political, economic and environmental impact and all issues relating to the existing transportation network,” he told Malaysian reporters during an international media tour of the new Velaro E in Madrid, Spain, recently.

The Velaro E is the latest in the high-speed trains platform developed by Siemens.

Hunter said there was no deadline on when the Government would conclude the study but he anticipated “soon”.

http://thestar.com.my/archives/2007/4/23/business/b_P16interior.jpg

The interior of the Club Class

“The topography of Peninsular Malaysia is appropriate for high-speed rail.

“As for challenges, it will be to cross the straits into Singapore and integration with existing rail system,” he said, adding that the route could possibly begin at KL Sentral station, linking the KL International Airport (KLIA), Johor Baru and end at Singapore's Changi Airport.

“That will make more sense because inter-modal exchanges are important. It has to be linked to existing transport modes.

“The service may probably link Malacca and Putrajaya, although nothing is confirmed yet,” he said.

The distance between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore City is 325km. If the Velaro E is used, which has a top speed of 350km/h; travel time will be reduced to 90 minutes.

http://thestar.com.my/archives/2007/4/23/business/b_p16cockpit.jpg

The cockpit

Hunter said the train's proposed seating capacity was between 400 and 500 people on a single trip.

YTL Corp has previously drawn the expertise of Siemens to develop the Express Rail Link, which connects KL Sentral and KLIA.

Siemens has also managed the Ipoh-Rawang double-tracking electrification project, hence, it feels it could offer its latest technology should the high-speed rail project receive the green light.

Besides Siemens, other players that provide high-speed rail technology include France's Alstom, Kawasaki Heavy Industries and Hitachi from Japan and Spain's Construccionesy Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles S. A.

Although Hunter did not reveal the project's actual cost, he said it would run into billions of ringgit as factors such as land acquisition, route, civil engineering and system costs, speed and density had to be considered.

According to published reports, the high-speed rail was expected to cost RM8bil.

“Land acquisition cost will be significant. Funding will be another main challenge and it is unsure at the moment who will bear the cost.

“Private finance initiative is one of the options. The project could be completed between two and five years, but that will depend on the engineering issues that may crop up,” he explained.

Hunter said an agreement between Malaysia and Singapore was highly important before the project could even proceed.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Renfe_clase_103.JPG/800px-Renfe_clase_103.JPG

Siemens Velaro E at Innotrans 2006 in Berlin

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/29/Velaro_RUS_Innotrans_2008.JPG/800px-Velaro_RUS_Innotrans_2008.JPG

Velaro RUS high speed trains by Russian Railways

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/ba/CRH3.JPG/800px-CRH3.JPG

Velaro CRH3 for the Beijing-Tianjin high-speed rail line

YTL Proposal : AseanStar

http://img26.picoodle.com/img/img26/9/8/27/f_09m_9512af1.jpg

http://www.malaysia-maps.com/images/map-malaysia-main-states.gif

^^
rasenye ni plus highway bukan jajaran keretapi..

ya...Itu tunjuk peta semenanjung saja not concern with the HST route map!BTW walau bagaimana nak jadi tentang projek ni...keep update lah!

I think the project still not feasible because:

1. The gov wants to protect national airlines industry
2. MYR 8 Bil is such a huge investment, with the current economic condition the gov would not be able to accommodate anymore hugh account deficit.
3. The double electrified rail project from Gemas to JB will be initiated soon.
4. Talk about the ticket pricing, malaysians prefer economical solutions for traveling means naik bas lagi murah kot.

Maybe in about 10 years from now, there would be a call from gov to revive this project when airline industry has proven to be competitive, KTM project been fully optimized and ppl start having more money in their pocket.

This is purely from my own opinion.

Fast track the S’pore bullet train project
Friday July 3, 2009

IT is reported that the YTL Corp still believes, as it has done since the late 1990s, that the high-speed bullet train linking Kuala Lumpur with Singapore is still a viable project.

Covering a distance of about 300km and costing about RM8bil, it will cut travel time from the present seven hours to about 90 minutes.

YTL considers its implementation important to further build and strengthen the country’s economy as it can also help attract foreign investors to the country.

Many developed countries such as China, Japan, the UK and those in Europe have successfully implemented the high-speed train system and Malaysia should have it due to its viability.

In another report, Datuk Ahmad Zaid of Johor has proposed the double-tracking KTM railway system to include the 197km stretch between Johor Baru and Gemas. It will cost RM7.5bil, which will include the building of overhead bridges.

This extension of the current Gemas-Seremban is being considered by the relevant authorities.

The YTL proposal is a privately funded project where the company is willing to take full financial risks due to its confidence in the viability of the project. The JB-Gemas project is to be financed by taxpayers and it could substantially reduce the travel problems of the Johor people.

However, in the absence of details, it is impossible to ascertain whether the JB-Gemas length of 197km costing RM7.5bil (RM37mil per km) is fair and reasonable compared with the KL-Singapore journey of 300km that is estimated to cost RM8bil (RM27mil per km).

What is certain is that both projects are viable and will complement each other as one is an express service while the other will mainly be a commuter service for those living along the route.

Both can be a stimulus for developing those undeveloped areas and generate commercial/industrial/housing opportunities. Employment opportunities will be created that will benefit the locals and state and federal revenues.

It may be noted that the first double-tracking project (Rawang-Seremban and Sentul-Port Kelang) was constructed in the mid-1980s covering 181km. The cost was less than RM3mil per km without any overhead bridges and functional station buildings.

The 180km Ipoh-Rawang link was estimated to cost RM40mil per km. The 1990 YTL proposals of the KL-Singapore link was estimated to cost RM5bil or RM17mil per km. Thus, delay has only raised the cost and hampered the development of surrounding areas and economic progress.

Now is the right time as the projects will definitely stimulate the economy and further the efforts of the Government. Delay can prove to be financially not beneficial.

However, the government-funded project should be based on competitive tenders and not negotiation. This will promote transparency and accountability while minimising opportunities for corruption and fraud.

GURSHARAN SINGH,

Kuala Lumpur.

> http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2009/7/3/focus/4236128&sec=focus

TRANSPORT LINKS: A good time for that rail project
By GURSHARAN SINGH, Kuala Lumpur 2009/07/03

IT was reported that YTL Corp still believes that a high-speed bullet train linking Kuala Lumpur to Singapore -- over a distance of 300km and costing RM8 billion -- is an economically viable project as it will cut travel time from the present seven hours to about 90 minutes ("YTL: KL-S'pore bullet train project economically viable" -- NST, July 1). Another report on the same day highlighted the proposed double tracking of the KTMB railway system from Johor Baru to Gemas (197km) at an estimated cost of RM7.5 billion. This is an extension of the Gemas-Seremban and Ipoh-Padang Besar double-tracking projects.

The KL-Singapore bullet train will be a privately-funded project where the private sector appears to be willing to take financial risks because of its confidence in the viability of the project. The Johor Baru-Gemas project is to be financed by taxpayers as it could substantially reduce the travel problems of Johor people.

However, in the absence of details, it is not possible to ascertain whether the Johor Baru-Gemas link of 197km costing RM7.5 billion (or RM37 million per km) is fair and reasonable compared with the KL-Singapore bullet train link estimated to cost RM8 billion (or RM27 million per km).

But what is certain is that both projects are viable and will complement each other, as one is an express service whereas the other will mainly be a commuter service for those living along the track.

Each project can be a stimulus for the development of undeveloped areas and generate other commercial and employment opportunities that will benefit the locals, as well as state and federal revenues.

It may be noted that the first double-tracking project (Ra- wang-Seremban and Sentul-Port Klang), constructed in the mid-1980s and covering a 181km, cost less than RM3 million per km without any overhead bridges and functional station buildings.

The 180km Ipoh-Rawang link has been estimated to cost RM40 million per km.

When YTL first proposed the KL-Singapore bullet train project a few years ago, it was estimated to cost RM5 billion (or RM17 million per km. Thus the delay has not only raised the cost of the projects but also delayed the development of the surrounding areas.

Now is the right time to go ahead with the project as it will definitely stimulate the economy. The delay could prove to be financially not beneficial.

A word of caution, though: the government-funded project should be based on competitive tenders and not negotiated. This will promote transparency and accountability while minimising the opportunities for corruption and fraud.

> http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Friday/Letters/2597891/Article/pppull_index_html

Francis Yeoh not done hunting for bargains
July 03 2009

KUALA LUMPUR, June 3 — During the height of the equity markets, Francis Yeoh sat restlessly on the sidelines watching rivals bid up prices. When Singapore's Temasek decided to unload three of its power-generating firms last year, Yeoh, whose YTL Corp is one of Southeast Asia's biggest power companies, made offers he thought were fair. But he initially lost out, first in March 2008 to China Huaneng Group and then four months later to Japan's Marubeni.

It was a tough time for Yeoh. "You don't know what kind of pressure I had before," says the 55-year-old scion, as he sits in his penthouse office overlooking YTL's Ritz-Carlton in Kuala Lumpur. His father, billionaire Yeoh Tiong Lay, founded YTL as a construction firm in 1955, but Francis took over daily operations two decades ago, transforming it into a US$3.4 billion (market cap) multinational conglomerate. "When I had US$3.8 billion in cash, a lot of people, especially fund managers and analysts, criticised me," says Yeoh, "They said: 'We can't recommend your stock because you have so much cash and you don't know what to do with it.'"

But Yeoh, who is known for his flamboyant lifestyle, including his two helicopters, a private island and famous friends such as the late Luciano Pavarotti, is prudent in business. "I could not buy assets that were two or three times the market value," he says, despite the fact that hedge funds and private equity players were paying those prices.

Yeoh must have been one of the few businesspeople in the world who was relieved when the markets collapsed. He could finally go shopping: In October YTL paid US$180 million in cash to buy control of Macquarie Prime Real Estate Investment Trust and its holding company, paying 49 per cent of net asset value. Renamed Starhill Global REIT, it includes two shopping malls on Singapore's busy Orchard Road, Wisma Atria and Ngee Ann City.

Then in late November Temasek shelved the auction of PowerSeraya, Singapore's second-largest power generator, because of unfavourable market conditions. Days later it privately called Yeoh to negotiate. Within a week subsidiary YTL Power agreed to pay US$2.4 billion in stock and debt, or 10 times Ebidta. When the sale was finalised in March, Yeoh, who converted to Christianity at age 16 and is deeply and overtly religious, issued a press release thanking "our Lord Jesus for blessing us with stewardship of this important asset."

Divine intervention not withstanding, the latest purchase strengthens YTL's standing as a leading power supplier. "This puts us in a very strategic position to win more power assets globally, especially with our large cash reserves," says Yeoh, who favours utilities because of the typically long-term concessions and steady profits. The conglomerate now gets 60 per cent of its US$2 billion sales from such assets.

The deals also illustrate Yeoh's tendency to preserve cash during boom times so he can spend during downturns. "YTL thrives in times when acquisition opportunities are aplenty at reasonable valuations," says Bernard Ching, associate director of ECM Libra Research. "We expect YTL to pounce on a few assets before this recession is over." One thing you won't probably see is a sale: an eager buyer at the right prices, YTL is a reluctant seller in any market.

Investors seem pleased. Net profit more than doubled in the third quarter ending March 31, following the consolidation of the results from the two acquisitions. The stock is down 7 per cent for the year — outperforming the Kuala Lumpur Composite Index, down 21 per cent — but it is up 27 per cent since September. Francis' father, who controls 53 per cent of YTL's shares, is again Malaysia's seventh richest, worth US$1.8 billion, despite dropping US$300 million in the past year.

Yeoh’s conservative approach is born of his family's early history. A dirt-poor Chinese immigrant, his father started a construction business at the age of 30, eventually building army barracks and other government quarters. But business almost collapsed during the 1970s oil crisis. Relatives and employees pawned jewellery to help keep the firm going.

Still, his father, who never went to college, collected enough money to send Francis, the oldest of his seven children, to study engineering at Kingston University in the UK. His hope was that his son, then 16, would come back and reinvigorate the business.

Yeoh returned four years later, in 1978, to work for the company. He was eventually joined by all six siblings, who now help run various businesses. Within a decade he was named managing director. One of his earliest ventures was developing a site on Pangkor island. Today its lavish Pangkor Laut Resort, which Yeoh's late wife helped design, is one of several luxurious resorts in the group's portfolio.

But Yeoh didn't get an engineering degree to only develop vacation spots, and he eventually moved the company into more technically complex sectors. YTL now employs 3,000 engineers, who help build factories, power plants, hotels, even a rail link, at competitive prices.

Yeoh's big break came in 1992, sparked by a Malaysia-wide blackout. Fed up, the government awarded YTL the first licence to operate a private power plant, breaking the monopoly held by the national utility. But foreign investors hesitated to fund the project and wanted risk premiums. So Yeoh arranged for the first-ever 15-year bond issued in ringgit, sharply reducing its foreign-currency exposure. He later persuaded the Kuala Lumpur Stock Exchange to allow its subsidiary, YTL Power, to go public as an infrastructure project company, fast-tracking the offering by five years, well before the project was complete.

These moves proved fortuitous during the 1997 Asia crisis when the ringgit's value plunged by more than a third against the dollar. During that time YTL was able to pay down some debts, get more favourable rates and pick up bargains including prime properties in Kuala Lumpur. It paid US$130 million in 1999 to buy two shopping malls, Starhill and Lot 10, and the JW Marriott from struggling outfit Taiping Consolidated. The Starhill mall, now called Starhill Gallery, co-sponsored a luxury watch gala with Forbes last December. (The Forbes family played no role in initiating or compiling this story.) In 2000 YTL Power bought a 33.5 per cent stake in ElectraNet, which operates the power transmission grid for the state of South Australia under a 200-year concession.

When Enron collapsed and sold off its assets, including Wessex Water plant in the UK, YTL surprised rivals by beating out a consortium led by Royal Bank of Scotland for the plant in 2002. The US$1.3 billion deal brought Yeoh international exposure and controversy. After the deal was done, Wessex's chief executive was arrested for alleged improper payments from YTL; he was eventually cleared of any wrongdoing. No one from YTL was ever charged. The business, says Yeoh, is now worth US$3.5 billion.

Yeoh has had setbacks. For years he tried to get approval from the Malaysian government to build a fast train connecting Singapore and Malaysia, but the project was shelved in April 2008, apparently stalled by politics. Now Yeoh seems to be trying again, with Siemens Malaysia as a partner. He won't say much. "The more I talk about it, the more the project will never come alive," he worries. Still he argues that people didn't believe in his high-speed rail between Kuala Lumpur International Airport and the city centre, which carries 4.5 million people a year. "I pray that this project will come in my lifetime. Even if it is not done by me, I want to see it happen between the two countries."

YTL also had the misfortune of partnering with now defunct Lehman Brothers to develop a resort in Thailand's Koh Samui. But it was a small deal, and YTL is negotiating to acquire the whole lot.

With YTL still sitting on US$2.8 billion in cash, more deals are likely. Yeoh says he is looking into a water business in China and plans to spend up to US$700 million to build Malaysia's first 4g network. EMC Libra analyst Ching thinks the UK is a "good hunting ground" for the conglomerate, in view of the weaker pound.

No doubt Yeoh will try not to overpay. Says he: "I just can't play that game." — Forbes

> http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/index.php/malaysia/28403-francis-yeoh-not-done-hunting-for-bargains

Serve other areas, YTL
By : T.E.T., Batu Caves




WITH the revival of talk about a high-speed rail link between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore, I hope YTL Corporation Berhad can consider serving areas that are different from those KTM Komuter serves.

From Kuala Lumpur International Airport (KLIA), the high-speed rail can proceed to Port Dickson, Malacca, Muar and Batu Pahat before reaching Johor Baru and Singapore.

Although this alignment may cost more in land acquisition than running it along the North-South Expressway, it serves better to tap into markets currently not directly served by the railway.

The aforementioned towns are all future growth centres and the possibility of a higher ridership means the investment can be recouped much earlier.

By routing the train through the main population centres, we can more effectively move people from where they are to where they want to go.

PUBLIC TRANSPORT: Think about 'flying on land'
NST Online » Letters 2009/07/08
By : MOHD PETER DAVIS, Bandar Baru Bangi
Source: http://www.nst.com.my/Current_News/NST/Wednesday/Letters/2601681/Article/index_html

I AGREE with Gursharan Singh's article ("A good time for that rail project" -- NST, July 3) that now is the best time to upgrade Malaysia's railway system.
In 1957, the Kuala Lumpur-Singapore express train service took seven hours 35 minutes; today it takes seven hours. The journey by car or express bus can be completed in four hours without traffic jams.

However, traffic jams are a way of life in the Klang Valley and other major urban areas. It is twice as fast for my daughter and her fellow students to walk the few kilometres from their apartments to their colleges in Subang Jaya, but this is not so easily done without a dedicated pedestrian path.

My independent research reveals a road death rate per million population that is three to four times higher in Malaysia than in Australia, Japan or Britain. The heavy reliance on motorcycles in Malaysia must be the main reason for this. Worldwide, motorcycles are inherently unsafe, with a death toll of 117 per billion kilometres travelled compared with 12 for cars and only one for planes and trains. Roads worldwide have been transformed into death-traps. With 30 million road deaths in the 20th century, the transition to fast and safe public transport, affordable for the entire population, is long, long overdue.

The short distances between urban centres in peninsular Malaysia makes high speed intercity trains a far better choice than planes, especially with airports a long way away from city centres.

Scientists and engineers internationally have done their job. Suitable public transport technology is available and lacks only the political will to implement.

Japan's bullet trains travelling at 210kph have been operating successfully and profitably for 45 years. This is the fast rail system proposed for the Kuala Lumpur-Singapore route by the YTL group. However, the much better Maglev technology, capable of 480kph has been sitting on the shelf for decades. Only China has taken the plunge with this German technology. For the past five years commercial Maglev trains have been amazing travellers with the four-minute trip from Shanghai airport to the city centre. China is extending the Maglev line to Hagzhou City, which by next year is scheduled to cut the 175km journey to 30 minutes. Japan has announced it will replace its bullet trains with Maglev trains travelling more than twice the speed.

Clearly, Malaysia should not be the last country to use the 1960s bullet-train technology, but should instead leapfrog to a Maglev railway network covering the whole peninsula.

I think the Maglev system most suitable for Malaysia is the American Maglev 2000. The modular concrete Maglev track, elevated above existing railway lines and alongside highways, can move both the intercity Maglev passenger trains at 480kph and the larger Maglev container trains at 300kph. This gets several cars and trucks off the roads. (Maglev photos and diagrams can be viewed on my website, www.mohdpeterdavis.com)

Travel time for passengers from Kuala Lumpur to Seremban will be reduced to 12 minutes, 60 minutes to JB or Butterworth, KL to Kuantan will take 40 minutes, Kuala Terengganu 70 minutes and Kota Baru 100 minutes. Suburban feeder Maglev trains will quickly get people close to their workplace.

This will be a grand project, but it is no more difficult or expensive than building highways. Given cheap electricity that only nuclear power plants can supply, the low operating costs will make travelling by Maglev "flying on land" affordable for all Malaysians, children included.

A Malaysian Maglev railway network, achievable within 10 years, must therefore be seen as an essential component, along with nuclear energy, of a high-tech Vision 2020.

Are you joking!!! :lol:
The Maglev 2000
http://www.maglev2000.com/

http://www.maglev2000.com/assets/lib_vehicle.jpg

People like this scare me.

http://transitmy.org/2009/07/09/commentary-kl-singapore-high-speed-rail/

Letters coming soon as well.

Cheers, m

Warning signals for Taiwan’s bullet train

By Robin Kwong in Taipei

Published: July 18 2009 01:42 | Last updated: July 18 2009 01:42

The opening of Taiwan’s high-speed rail system two years ago was a transformative moment for Thomas Tsai, president of the Chinese Taipei Olympic Committee.

Mr Tsai, who often had to travel the length of Taiwan to the southern city of Kaohsiung where the national teams’ training grounds are located, recalled having to check in at the domestic airport in Taipei at least once a week to make the trip.

“Now, I just take the high-speed rail and I arrive in less than two hours,” says Mr Tsai.

The bullet train, which opened two years ago, not only linked Taiwan’s more cosmopolitan north with its industrial south. It was also one of the world’s grandest experiments in tapping private funding for an infrastructure project.

High-speed rail was Taiwan’s first non-government funded infrastructure project and its T$489bn ($14.8bn) construction cost made it the world’s biggest build-operate-transfer project.

But with the privately owned High Speed Rail Company facing debt trouble after accumulating T$67.5bn in losses, there is mounting concern that the experiment in public-private partnership is proving a failure and taxpayers will in the end still have to bear the cost of building and running one of the world’s most advanced train systems.

The bullet train’s financial failure would also be a stark warning to other countries planning their own high-speed rail system, such as Vietnam and Malaysia.

Taiwan’s government last week pledged to support the High Speed Rail Company in securing refinancing at lower interest rates for some of its T$390bn debt.

While officials have not indicated any plans for further involvement in the publicly listed operator, bankers familiar with the situation and observers say that more government support is almost inevitable.

“If the high-speed rail cannot get refinancing, then it becomes just a matter of the government paying the cost later rather than earlier,” Liang Kuo-yuan, the president of the Polaris Research Institute, said.

Wu Fu-hsiang, former director of the High Speed Rail bureau, who oversaw the project through the 16 years it took to conceive, design and build, said that the original plan estimated the break-even point to be T$3bn in monthly sales. “But it made only T$2.5bn in its best month,” he said.

A large part of the problem is not enough passengers. The bullet trains are less than half full on average despite having lured away many would-be air travellers, such as the Olympic committee’s Mr Tsai.

The number of passengers flying the Taipei-Kaohsiung route fell from 2.6m in 2006, the year before High Speed Rail opened, to 341,972 last year, but the number of High Speed Rail passengers has stagnated at below 2.8m per month after impressive growth in the first year.

Mr Wu, now a professor at Chung Hua University , said that planners did not anticipate the exodus of Taiwanese businessmen who left to seek their fortunes in mainland China. “They would have taken the high-speed rail [had they been in Taiwan],” he said.

The original plan also called for a flourishing of new towns in the area surrounding the out-of-town stations, which would allow the High Speed Rail Company to profit from developing the 32 hectares of land it was granted near five stations. That has not been the case.

Half-constructed luxury apartments and empty lots litter the area around Hsinchu station outside Taipei.

Yao Schueh-chieh, a real estate agent there, said that only half of the units in the area have been sold despite the location’s being near the heart of Taiwan’s high-technology export industries. “Business is not very good,” he said.

Despite its recent troubles, Mr Wu is convinced that using the build-operate-transfer model – a first for Taiwan at the time – was the correct decision.

Given the government's lack of efficiency, he said, “if this was a purely public project even by today we still wouldn’t have the first train service ready”.

KL-S'pore high-speed rail will generate economic benefits
Monday July 20, 2009
Hock's Viewpoint - By Choong Khuat Hock

A KL-Singapore high-speed rail would generate more economic benefits than the double-tracking railway from Ipoh to Thailand

WITH negative export growth and private consumption, fiscal stimulus is playing a more important role. In Japan, building bridges to nowhere has not generated long-term economic benefits but has instead burdened future generations.

In Malaysia, building a double-tracking railway from Ipoh to the Thai border for RM12bil can never generate as much economic benefits as a high-speed rail (HSR) from Kuala Lumpur to Singapore for around the same price tag. (Please vote or express your views on the blog
http://klsingaporehsr.blogspot.com/)

Malaysia appears to be far behind in HSR development. China has completed six high-speed rail projects with design speeds of up to 250km/h and in July 2008, it completed the 108km Beijing to Tianjin HSR with a design speed of 350km/h.

This would be equivalent to travelling from KL to the Malacca border in 30 minutes. The 1,302km Beijing to Shanghai HSR will be ready next year.

China’s HSR network of 6,000km by 2013 will exceed Japan’s current HSR network of 2,459km. France, with an HSR network of 1,700km, has the most extensive HSR network among European countries followed by Britain (1,400km), Germany (1,290km) and Spain (1,272km).

Even the United States is jumping on the HSR bandwagon with Obama unveiling plans for 10 potential high-speed intercity corridors.

Other Asian countries that have successfully built HSR include South Korea and Taiwan. Interestingly, the 335.5km Taiwan HSR from Taipei to Kaohsiung (taking 90 minutes) is approximately similar in distance from KL to Singapore. I was able to buy tickets and board the train 10 mins before departure.

The train ride was very smooth and the speedometer on the train showed train speeds of close to 300km/h. As in Taiwan, the HSR in Malaysia could have direct services from KL to Singapore and also services that cover KL International Airport (KLIA), Malacca and Johor. Malacca’s tourist potential will be enhanced while Iskandar Malaysia’s viability will be improved.

The positive economic impact from the HSR from KL to Singapore would be tremendous. It would anchor KLIA-LCCT-Changi as the top airline hub in South-East Asia where foreign and domestic passengers will have a choice of full service or budget airlines.

The HSR may attract additional visitors to the KL-Singapore hub due to the clustering effect. Furthermore, it would boost the number of Singaporean and foreign visitors (from Singapore) visiting Johor, Malacca and Kuala Lumpur.

Airline frequency between KL and Singapore may decline but airlines could generate additional traffic from the cementing of KL-Singapore as the premier transportation hub of the region. Property prices in Kuala Lumpur should also benefit from greater demand from Singaporeans and foreigners who are attracted by the improved accessibility of KL.

With better accessibility, foreign companies may be attracted to place their operations in KL or Iskandar where operating costs are lower. The better accessibility would also make it easier to attract talent to work in KL or Iskandar.

The high-speed Eurostar train link from London to Paris in just 2.5 hours has helped narrow the discount of Parisian property prices to London property prices.

The differential between KL and Singapore property prices remains large with high-end condos in Malaysia going for around RM1,000 per sq ft while high-end Singapore condos are at least five times more expensive at over S$2,000 per sq ft.

Based on an estimated built-up area of 1.8 billion sq ft in the Klang Valley, property values could be boosted by a massive RM180bil if property values rise by RM100 per sq ft and the gain could rise to RM360bil if property prices appreciate by RM200 per sq ft. The positive wealth effect is an important ingredient for better consumer confidence.

Asian giants like China and India are increasingly dominating the economic field, hence, there is a greater urgency for Malaysia and Singapore to work together to carve out a niche (while it still exists) as the indisputable destination for investments, tourism, services and selected manufacturing in the Asean region.

Since the energy consumption per person using a train is less than those for cars and planes, the HSR will lead to lower carbon dioxide production, which contributes towards global warming. The KL-Singapore HSR will reduce the number of cars and planes plying between KL and Singapore and reduce road accidents.

Should the Malaysia and Singapore governments decide to carry on with the HSR, it is important for the project to be implemented by a group that can build the HSR within the stipulated cost and as quickly as possible.

We cannot afford another Port Klang Free Zone where massive cost overruns and accusations of misdemeanors in a privatised project have burdened taxpayers without any tangible economic benefits.

The Taiwan HSL was plagued with delays and severe cost overruns. The final cost at a staggering US$15bil (RM55bil) equates to a cost of US$45mil per km compared to US$27mil per km in South Korea and only US$12mil for the express rail link to KLIA which was built by a YTL-led consortium.

As a Malaysian consumer, I am very keen on being given the choice to travel on HSR to Singapore even if it costs more than the bus fare. As a taxpayer, I am keen on taxpayers’ money being spent on infrastructure projects that generate economic returns.

Economically-viable private sector-funded investments should be encouraged at a time when government finances are tight. As a property owner in KL, I am keen to see better property prices and KL becoming a vibrant international city with excellent connectivity. What do you think?

● Choong Khuat Hock is head of research at Kumpulan Sentiasa Cemerlang Sdn Bhd. Readers’ feedback is welcome. Please email to starbiz@thestar.com.my

it is economic feasable once completed (i expect it will be finish in 2020 if the project groundbreaks in 2010), but become the major competitor against the malaysia airlines, firefly, air asia, and express bus companies because HSR is much more convenient compared with air travel and express bus service in terms of:

1. transit location:
HSR station in KL may be setted in KL Sentral, within the downtown core of Kuala Lumpur, HSR station in Singapore may be setted be around in Marina Bay, still within the downtown core of Singapore. Compared with air travel, take firefly planes from KL to Singapore, planes will be landed in subang airport, which is currently lacking public transport facility, and if, even there is a station called Sri Subang built on it, it still takes about 30 - 45 minutes to travel from KL downtown to Subang Airport, same case in Singapore, from Singapore downtown to Changi Airport.

Still express bus service transit location is much more strategic compared with HSR, in Puduraya currently, in the heart of downtown. Maybe it will not as convenient as HSR once the express bus hub for southern route moved to Bandar Tasik Selatan.

2. fare cost:
It is still cheaper compared to malaysia airlines, but i'm not sure will it become cheaper than air tickets of firefly and air asia.

It won't be as cheap as express bus, but i'm sure, the tickets you buy from HSR ticket booth is sure genuine. Puduraya got quite lot of fake ticket dealers and security matters in Puduraya is still much more worse than KL Sentral.

3. serving areas:
It doesn't only serve KL and Singapore, but also maybe:
Seremban
Malacca (station set in Tampin, interchange with local train service between Melaka Sentral and Seremban or Tampin)
Johor Bahru

serving this three areas benefit lots of KL-ites, Serembanese, Malaccans and JB-ites. the express bus service between these cities are frequent and in high capacity, with daily traffic more than 1000.

during holidays, many singaporeans travel to malacca, what i'm concern is not is YTL will gain profit from HSR or not, is malacca able to handle such people inflow to malacca downtown and heritage site. once the HSR is ready, malacca must have extensive intergrated public transport network, convenient for both tourist and local commuters.

so, i think, EPU drops this project with these reasons:
1. HSR will become a major competitor against air travel between these cities, since the most profitable line of malaysia airlines is the KL - Singapore route.
2. HSR will become a major competitor against express bus between these cities, this will harm the profit of Transnasional, or Nice, or what else... and those companies may have some relations with the officials.

and still when you all are still worry it may be a competitor against KTMB, i would say no. because both company operate rail for different propose. YTL's HSR is for only passenger, KTMB operates for both freight and passenger. KTMB may compromise with YTL, which YTL operates limited express service, and KTMB operates the local and local express service, it just like Shinkansen and Local lines in Japan, both operates together, both are profitable, just from different senses.

last time i heard there is a HSR project from KL to Kuantan. got people propose it to extend to Kuala Terengganu. it is totally not feasable, a double track electrified meter gauge KTMB rail is far more enough, instead.

See the above article on taiwan's hsr.

If they went into massive debt because of cost overruns, what would happen in Malaysia?

Not to mention that you have to deal with 6 different governments for the KL-Singapore HSR.

KL is a federal territory then you have Selangor (opposition state), Negri Sembilan, Malacca, Johor and then Singapore.

Where would the customs be? Do you think Singapore is going to accept more Malaysian Customs officers in Singapore? Will KL accept any Singapore customs officers anywhere in Malaysia?

The idea is a wonderful one. The engineering is relatively easy. The problem is the politics ... political will and political skills.

Cheers, m

yes, there is much advantage in having a HSR BUT if you read the article above about the financial problems of the Taiwan HSR it tells us to be fully aware that the govt (ie taxpayers) may have to bail out the HSR if it can't meet its projected sales and break even forecast. Actually the HSR between London and Europe thru the channel tunnel hasn't been making money since it was built decades ago.
As taxpayers is a bailout justified to save the HSR if it doesn't make a profit and is it fair to other mode of transport operators that taxpayers money is used.
Of course if it is fully a private venture than its a different case.

Singapore in 90 minutes by rail – positive for the economy and property prices
Tuesday, July 14, 2009

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_RyRATjZtUzY/SlwuTKRpp7I/AAAAAAAAABU/f5WB_thtlyU/s400/High+Speed+Rail+Shinkansen_S500_kyoutei.jpg

[Imagine at the causeway between JB-Woodland]

The possible policy responses to current economic downturn in Malaysia are actually quite limited. Private consumption has turned negative and is unlikely to recover as consumer confidence is weak and the consumer debt to GDP ratio of over 60% in Malaysia is already high by Asian standards. Export growth is likely to remain weak (exports down 30% y-o-y in May 2009) as long as highly leveraged US consumers continue to deleverage which could last over a decade if the Japanese experience is repeated. The only real solution is fiscal spending and private investment; on this front, we have to choose projects wisely especially as our budget deficit to GDP to also among the highest in Asia.

Japan undertook a series of unsuccessful fiscal stimulus to boost its economy which raised government debt to GDP from 60% in 1990 to 180% in 2008. In Japan, building bridges to nowhere has not generated long-term economic benefits but has instead burdened future generations. In Malaysia, building a double tracking railway from Ipoh to the Thai border for RM12bn can never generate as much economic benefits as a high speed rail (HSR) from KL to Singapore for around the same price tag.

Malaysia appears to be far behind in HSR development. China has completed six high speed rail projects with design speeds of up to 250km/h and in July 2008, it completed the 108km Beijing to Tianjin HSR with a design speed of 350km/h. This would be equivalent to travelling from KL to the Malacca border in 30 minutes. The 1302km Beijing to Shanghai HSR will be ready next year and will reduce travelling time by rail from 10 hours to 5 hours. In total China is planning 25 HSR lines between now and 2013!

China’s HSR network of 6,000km by 2013 will exceed Japan’s current HSR network of 2459km. Japan, famous for its Shinkansen bullet trains, was the first country to introduce HSR in 1964 starting with speeds of 210km/h for service between Tokyo and Osaka. The French TGV (Train à Grande Vitess) is the fastest conventional train in the world with an experimental speed of 574.8km/h while the Japanese JR-Maglev, which floats on magnetic fields, achieved 581km/h. France, with an HSR network of 1700km, has the most extensive HSR network among European countries followed by the UK (1400km), Germany (1290km) and Spain (1272km). Even the US is jumping on the HSR bandwagon with Obama unveiling plans for 10 potential high speed intercity corridors.

Other Asian countries that have successfully built HSR include South Korea and Taiwan. Interestingly, the 335.5km Taiwan HSR from Taipei to Kaohsiung is approximately similar in distance from KL to Singapore. I personally had the pleasure of riding the train recently. It was possible to buy tickets and board the train 10 minutes before departure. The train ride was very smooth and the speedometer on the train showed train speeds of close to 300km/h. The train reached Kaohsiung in the south of Taiwan from Taipei in the north in just 90 minutes after a stop in the central city of Taichung. As in Taiwan, the HSR in Malaysia could have direct services from KL to Singapore and also services that cover KLIA, Malacca and Johor. Malacca’s tourist potential will be enhanced while Iskandar’s viability will be improved by fast and efficient connectivity which will alleviate a shortage of manpower there.

The positive economic impact from the HSR from KL to Singapore would be tremendous. It would anchor KLIA-LCCT-Changi as the top airline hub in SE Asia where foreign and domestic passengers will have a choice of full service or budget airlines. Unlike Taiwan, which only have slightly more than 4m visitors a year, Malaysia and Singapore together have over 30m visitors a year. Therefore, the HSR may attract additional visitors to the KL-Singapore hub due to the clustering effect. Furthermore, it would boost the number of Singaporean and foreign visitors (from Singapore) visiting Johor, Malacca and Kuala Lumpur. Airline frequency between KL and Singapore may decline but airlines could generate additional traffic from the cementing of KL-Singapore as the premier transportation hub of the region.

Property prices in Kuala Lumpur should also benefit from greater demand from Singaporeans and foreigners who are attracted by the improved accessibility of KL. This would help generate demand for the large supply of condominiums in KL. With better accessibility, foreign companies may be attracted to place their operations in KL or Iskandar where operating costs are lower. The better accessibility would also make it easier to attract talent to work in KL or Iskandar. For example, the Taiwan HSR has allowed white collar workers easy access to Hsin Chu (Taiwan’s Silicon Valley) from all major cities in Taipei. Increased tourist arrivals and business activities will also boost the sagging rental market arising from lower occupancy rates. Singapore will also benefit from greater accessibility for its integrated resorts and higher tourist arrivals, both from Malaysia and overseas.

The high-speed Eurostar train link from London to Paris in just 2.5 hours has helped narrow the discount of Parisian property prices to London property prices. The ease of getting to Paris from London has encouraged the British to consider second homes in Paris and have even encouraged some British workers to consider Paris as a permanent base. Likewise, the KL-Singapore HSR could boost KL property prices and promote greater economic integration between Malaysia and Singapore as a catalyst for ASEAN integration. The differential between KL and Singapore property prices remains large with high-end condos in Malaysia going for around RM1,000 psf while high-end Singapore condos are at least 5 times more expensive at over S$2,000 psf.

Based on an estimated built up area of 1.8bn sq ft in the Klang Valley, property values could be boosted by a massive RM180bn if property values rise by RM100psf and the gain could rise to RM360bn if property prices appreciate by RM200psf. This excludes the potential gains for Johor and Malacca property. Prices of property in Taiwan and HK have risen due to Chinese demand and the yields of high end residential and commercial property in Taipei is only slightly over 2% (compared to rental yields of 6-7% in Malaysia) due to good demand and low interest rates. Greater demand for properties arising from the KL-Singapore HSR and lower Malaysian interest rates would help improve property prices in the Klang Valley. The positive wealth effect is an important ingredient for better consumer confidence, especially so as residential property accounts for around 80% of property stock in the Klang Valley. Of course, besides the HSR, other factors like better connectivity within Klang Valley, an investment friendly climate and a stable and safe environment are also important factors.

As Malaysia and Singapore squabble over long standing issues, Asian giants like China and India are increasing dominating the economic field. Hence, there is a greater urgency for Malaysia and Singapore to work together to carve out a niche (while it still exists) as the indisputable destination for investments, tourism, services and selected manufacturing in the ASEAN region. Hopefully the pain of deep recessions will numb the pride of both countries and enable closer economic integration that will benefit the people of both countries and promote better understanding.

Since the energy consumption per person using a train is less than those for cars and planes, the HSR will lead to lower carbon dioxide production, which contributes towards global warming. For example, the Taiwan HSR is estimated to produce a quarter of carbon dioxide emissions per individual compared to that for a regular four-wheeled vehicle. The KL-Singapore HSR will reduce the number of cars and planes plying between KL and Singapore. Greater use of trains will also reduce road accidents and improve productive time as passengers can comfortably carry on work their work or reading on a train.

Should the Malaysia and Singapore governments decide to carry on with the HSR, it is important for the project to be implemented by a group that can build the HSR within the stipulated cost and as quickly as possible. We cannot afford another Port Klang Free Zone (PKFZ) where massive cost overruns and accusations of misdemeanors in a privatized project have burdened taxpayers without any tangible economic benefits. The Taiwan HSL was plagued with delays and severe cost overruns. The final cost at a staggering US$15bn (RM55bn) equates to a cost of US$45m per km compared to US$27m per km in Korea and only US$12m for the Express rail link (ERL) to KLIA which was built by a YTL-led consortium. The YTL Group, backed by its ERL experience and strong financial resources, remains keen on the KL-Singapore HSR project. YTL Group is also believed to have a good relationship with the Singapore government as evidenced by its investments in Singapore property and power plants.

As a Malaysian consumer, I am very keen on being given the choice to travel on HSR to Singapore even if it costs more than a bus fare. As a taxpayer, I am keen on taxpayers money being spent on infrastructure projects that generate economic returns. It is no rocket science to know that a mainly private funded KL-Singapore HSR will generate more economic benefit than a government funded RM12bn double tracking railway from Ipoh to the Thai border. Economically viable private sector funded investments should be encouraged at a time when government finances are tight. As a property owner KL, I am keen to see better property prices and KL becoming a vibrant international city with excellent connectivity. What do you think? Please vote or express your views on the blog by clicking on comments below.

More comments > http://klsingaporehsr.blogspot.com/2009/07/singapore-in-90-minutes-by-rail_13.html

Just imagine... Kuching-KL Highspeed rail... hahaha...

yes, there is much advantage in having a HSR BUT if you read the article above about the financial problems of the Taiwan HSR it tells us to be fully aware that the govt (ie taxpayers) may have to bail out the HSR if it can't meet its projected sales and break even forecast. Actually the HSR between London and Europe thru the channel tunnel hasn't been making money since it was built decades ago.
As taxpayers is a bailout justified to save the HSR if it doesn't make a profit and is it fair to other mode of transport operators that taxpayers money is used.
Of course if it is fully a private venture than its a different case.

Yes, the Eurostars hasn't been making money. But it has helped many companies to generated billions of profits by linking Britain with Europe. Businessmen could have a day business trip between London and paris. important business documents can be couries within a single day. There are many more benefits!

In Europe and China, rail services (including high speed) are subsidized in one way or another. It is part of the basic public transport infrastructure that fund & maintained by public money. Most cities would be poorer without a good rail services. Tax generated from business in these cities could be used for subsidizing this infrastructure.

I am fine with a High speed train. Its just that there will be people that are just waiting to sound off when as expected the taxpayer will have to subsidize this train. What more if its built and owned by a private company.

I estimate the price of a one way ticket would probably be in the region of what a premier airline charges or more.. RM300-400 or there about.
Probably not for the general travelling public, more for businesspeople and well off folks.

Just imagine... Kuching-KL Highspeed rail... hahaha...

we need very long tunnel/bridge linking together...From now on, Malaysian access easy to the city better by airplane...since our services are better so far among the region! :cheers:

BTW we need a train linking which include: Kuching - Sarikei - Sibu - Mukah - Bintulu - Miri - Bandar Seri Begawan - Limbang - Kota Kinabalu would be high benefits in the future! :cheers:

I am all for publicly-owned railway infrastructure, so tickets could be subsidized accordance with annual budget from government(taxpayers). Or alternatively taxpayers build the railway infrasturcture and network, they could later licence the service to a few private companies to run. So these companies don't have to bear the cost of public infrascture, they could also lose their license under the taxpayers' wish.

of course, my argument is putting all rail infrastucture as a basic necessity for the public ..like police stations, fire brigade, hospitals, post office, street ligh,pedestrian pathway..etc

Don't you think the cost of travel will be crazy ? How much you pay for 58-km ride from KL Sentral to KLIA ? 35 Ringgit

So imagine how much it will cost to travel 350 km from KL to Singapore, provided the same quality of train ....

I think people will definitely choose to fly, since the cheapest fare to fly KUL-SIN by Air Asia is just 30-40 RM.. ( excluding airport-downtown rides)

Taiwan and Japan still do not have "real" low-cost carriers plying their domestic lines, but Malaysia and Singapore are readily connected by cheap airlines, hmm

Don't you think the cost of travel will be crazy ? How much you pay for 58-km ride from KL Sentral to KLIA ? 35 Ringgit

So imagine how much it will cost to travel 350 km from KL to Singapore, provided the same quality of train ....

I think people will definitely choose to fly, since the cheapest fare to fly KUL-SIN by Air Asia is just 30-40 RM.. ( excluding airport-downtown rides)

Taiwan and Japan still do not have "real" low-cost carriers plying their domestic lines, but Malaysia and Singapore are readily connected by cheap airlines, hmm

KLIA-express train could be cheaper if the services and infrastucture wholly owned by taxpayers. People choose to fly because the KLIA was build by taxpayers money, if it was privately fund i bet not many people could afford to pay the airport tax, and certainly not many airlines could afford to land.
The high-speed train service could be resonable cheap if it run by taxpayers' money. it doesn't has to be profitable. It's like public healthcare or education..as long as annually pour in the taxpayers money to sustain it. Same as the future metro system in KL, penang, and JB. .

But taxpayers in Trengganu, Penang, Sabah, Sarawak etc may object (very likely in the present political climate) to the funding and subsidizing of a service that they will probably never use.
Before this is built, the economic and social benefits and its multiplier effects must be debated to show how this will benefit the country as a whole and justify Federal subsidies.

I agree that public transport should be a part of public services provided by the govt. Rail services like KTM should be supported and run by the govt as it services provide many with a rapid and cheap means of travel and commuting reaching many areas in Peninsular Malaysia. I also support extension of its lines to other areas not served at this time.

In my opinion, double tracking and electrification of metre gauge KTM line should be done first.....before we proceed to build 300 km/h standard gauge high speed railway...

I think fast trains on narrow gauge will better serve as preview for things to come on railway services before we really need to build HSR...

Yes, the Eurostars hasn't been making money. But it has helped many companies to generated billions of profits by linking Britain with Europe. Businessmen could have a day business trip between London and paris. important business documents can be couries within a single day. There are many more benefits!

In Europe and China, rail services (including high speed) are subsidized in one way or another. It is part of the basic public transport infrastructure that fund & maintained by public money. Most cities would be poorer without a good rail services. Tax generated from business in these cities could be used for subsidizing this infrastructure.which is exactly the issue that has to be questioned. Why should we subsidize a high speed rail service to help companies become rich...when at the same time, we refuse to subsidize public transport in our main cities that would help people by giving them transport choices and maybe a little bit more money at the end of the month.

My vote is for subsidizing public transport ... let the HSR pay for itself if it can.

Oh, and this is also important - if the government wants an HSR, then do an international request for proposals and an open tender. Let the best companies of the world for consortiums with local companies to make it happen. No way we should give YTL the "inside track" (pun intended).

Cheers, m

In my opinion, double tracking and electrification of metre gauge KTM line should be done first.....before we proceed to build 300 km/h standard gauge high speed railway...

I think fast trains on narrow gauge will better serve as preview for things to come on railway services before we really need to build HSR...A very good point. Think how the double tracking has improved the KL-Ipoh service - many more trains and many more passengers and many more services. They even introduced a bike shuttle.

The problem is that KTMB is not promoting themselves. Where are the performance stats for the KL-Ipoh train service? They need to show the world they are getting better and better.

Now, another thing to consider...Soon the double tracking will be past Penang and they can start running more shuttle trains from KL-Penang. If they have enough trains they can introduce a rudimentary "Komuter Utara" service to Butterworth.

Finally....Fast Train service is coming soon; it will be operating by the end of the year. If they can make FTS work on the KL-Ipoh and KL-Penang corridors, and double track the whole country and triple-track and electrify the "Komuter" lines in the North (Penang), and South (JB)....

then we look at HSR.

Cheers, m

A very good point. Think how the double tracking has improved the KL-Ipoh service - many more trains and many more passengers and many more services. They even introduced a bike shuttle.

The problem is that KTMB is not promoting themselves. Where are the performance stats for the KL-Ipoh train service? They need to show the world they are getting better and better.


The introduction of diesel KL-Ipoh train service has shown one thing...

People will take train if it is reasonably fast and cost effective...

Load on KL-Ipoh train service is good, in my experience

In the future, the goverment shouldn't give any taxpayer fund HSR asset to private company like they did it to renong's Putra-lrt. Malaysian future HSR technology shouldn't relied on single country or company. Putra-line was a mistake, not many train manufacturers could or want to reproduce the train for the putra system, or it just simply too expensive. They should have more bargaining/switchover power in the future to source hight-speed trains from low-cost/mass-produce/ready-made manufacturing countries like china or india or even latin america after the standard gauge.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?p=40102440#post40102440

The introduction of diesel KL-Ipoh train service has shown one thing...

People will take train if it is reasonably fast and cost effective...

Load on KL-Ipoh train service is good, in my experience
that reminds me, ive got to get KTMB to share the intercity on-time performance stats.

Cheers, m

I think they should build this hsr line by now but must be outside than KTM line and can be connected to KTM line via regional line. They can built by stages maybe from KLIA to PD first and then extend Batu Pahat lastly to Nusajaya (3rd Phase)..In future it will connect to Singapore at Jurong

This is my proposed line and I call it west coast or coastal hsr line..

KL-KLIA-Port Dickson(In future it will Connected to Seremban via Seremban-PD KTM Komuter line)-Kota Melaka(Connected to Jasin via Jasin-Kota Melaka KTM Komuter Line)-Muar-Batu Pahat-Pontian-Nusajaya(In future it will connected to Senai via Senai-Gelang Patah KTM Komuter Line and JB via JB LRT system)-Jurong,Singapore

I think kalau sungguh bina they must pass through JB Sentral 2 (future@senai) & 1 (completed@CIQ) then Malaysia-Singapore would get the new bridge for HST at the current causeway (the current causeway would also demolish to the bridge (although not such a crook one) for cars )
Iskandar Malaysia Masterplan

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/3747/sjer7gu7.jpg

or... what about if would get the new Channel Tunnel like Engaland-France..kalau bukan kat kawasan the current causeway bagaimana kat Nusajaya - Jurong!!!

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/4/4f/Course_Channeltunnel_en.svg/250px-Course_Channeltunnel_en.svg.png

I think better Nusajaya-Jurong because JB is too congested and at least we can connect Putrajaya-Nusajaya. Nusajaya is new area and quite far from JB, and it is good area to develop.

About LRT System shown on figure Nazrey's posting above^^, I would like to suggest they can built five origin LRT station where all transit buses need to stop here without having travel to JB and Larkin. For express buses they can use Larkin as main stop as usual. JB city centre is restricted area for transit buses except for bus that have to crossing causeway.

The origin station is
1. Nusajaya - For West Region (All transit bus from Pontian, Gelang Patah, Skudai, Tmn Tunku Aminah, Mutiara Rini and Tmn Bukit Indah etc)
2. Bandar Tebrau - For East Region (All transit bus from Ulu Tiram, Kota Tinggi,Tmn Daya, Tmn Austin, Bandar Tun Hussien Onn etc)
3.Permas Jaya - For South-East Region (All transit bus from Pasir Gudang, Plentong, Johor Jaya and Bandar Seri Alam etc)
4. Larkin - For Central Region (Bandar Baru Uda,Danga Bay, Tampoi, Kempas etc)~Larkin also for express bus and transit bus to Singapore
5. JB Sentral 2 - For North Region (All transit bus from Senai, Senai Airport, Kulai, Saleng, etc.)

:cheers:

Last throes of JB landmark
Tuesday April 8, 2008
TheStar

http://thestar.com.my/archives/2008/4/8/southneast/se_08landmark.jpg

Last stand: The flats will be demolished on April 15 to make way for the
proposed Mass Rapid Transit project linking Johor Baru to Singapore.

BUKIT Cagar flats in Johor Baru, which is among the city's landmarks, will be torn down in less than a week.

Abandoned and dilapidated, it is now a place for scavengers and stray animals.

This 17-storey structure, which is visible from across the causeway, will give way to the proposed Mass Rapid Transit project.

It was built in the 70s by the state to provide cheap housing for more than 2,000 households.

These households have been relocated to Taman Sri Stulang in Bakar Batu, approximately 3km away.

While the former residents are enjoying their new homes, trader Azmi Abdullah, 48, is still running a eatery near the flats with his wife Fadzillah Abdul Majid, 43.

The couple have been living here for a decade and are waiting to move to their new business premises.

Azmi said that food operators in Bukit Cagar were upset as they were yet to have proper sites to do business.

Today, instead of flat dwellers, scrap metal hunters frequent his stall for a meal or two.

Without water and electricity, Azmi has to close his shop earlier than before.

Idris Abdul, 60, who has been running a wiring service shop three doors away from Azmi's eatery, was uncertain about his future.

“How do they expect me to keep my things in such a small place, and this is my livelihood,” he lamented.

Another former resident, Sulaiman Samad, 34, who was at Azmi’s shop, said he preferred his new home compared to his Bukit Cagar flat which was very cramped.

However, the legal clerk at a firm in City Square Tower said that not everything was rosy at the new place because structural defects had started to show.

“The flats also leak, especially during rains, and water comes in through the windows as we are not allowed to install awnings by the developer,” said Sulaiman.

Those who were relocated should be allowed to purchase their homes instead of renting them, he added.

“I hope that Mentri Besar Datuk Abdul Ghani Othman and Johor Baru MP Datuk Shahrir Samad can do something to improve the living standards of those starting a new life at Bakar Batu,” he said.

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_2aw-0BMjjpg/SE6et8f0WQI/AAAAAAAAA50/5b_medg1cYM/s640/04062008(001)bt%20cagar.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_2aw-0BMjjpg/SE6flyKhNAI/AAAAAAAAA60/DsKIrryJeFM/s640/04062008(008)bt%20cagar.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_2aw-0BMjjpg/SE6fB4vhXlI/AAAAAAAAA6c/j3c7I2ZQDKM/s640/04062008(006)bt%20cagar.jpg

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_2aw-0BMjjpg/SE6fv2XgE_I/AAAAAAAAA7M/yZMuaXggUuY/s640/04062008(011)bt%20cagar.jpg

we need very long tunnel/bridge linking together...From now on, Malaysian access easy to the city better by airplane...since our services are better so far among the region! :cheers:

BTW we need a train linking which include: Kuching - Sarikei - Sibu - Mukah - Bintulu - Miri - Bandar Seri Begawan - Limbang - Kota Kinabalu would be high benefits in the future! :cheers:I think there is an early plan for a Trans-Borneo railway already.

This may be one of the pieces of the SCORE project.

Cheers, m

I think kalau sungguh bina they must pass through JB Sentral 2 (future@senai) & 1 (completed@CIQ) then Malaysia-Singapore would get the new bridge for HST at the current causeway (the current causeway would also demolish to the bridge (although not such a crook one) for cars )
Iskandar Malaysia Masterplan

http://img299.imageshack.us/img299/3747/sjer7gu7.jpgany closeup images of the plan? Or links to the Iskandar transport plan? Id love to see more.

Cheers, m

any closeup images of the plan? Or links to the Iskandar transport plan? Id love to see more.

Cheers, m

This is the interactive map link

http://www.iskandarmalaysia.com.my/pop-devmap3.html

Correct me if I'm wrong, linking JB & Singapore via MRT means Causeway is there to stay... forever?

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_2aw-0BMjjpg/SE6fv2XgE_I/AAAAAAAAA7M/yZMuaXggUuY/s640/04062008(011)bt%20cagar.jpg[/QUOTE]

wow! how did they get the excavators up there?

helicopter?

But why didn't they just bomb it? controlled demolition??

This is the interactive map link

http://www.iskandarmalaysia.com.my/pop-devmap3.htmlthank you!

Cheers, m

This is the interactive map link

http://www.iskandarmalaysia.com.my/pop-devmap3.html

WoW!!!! Many thanks TWK90! Really open eyes!! :cheers:

Is there a market for KL-S'pore speed rail link?
Moaz Yusuf Ahmad Jul 10, 09
MalaysiaKini

When I returned to Malaysia at the beginning of this month and updated myself on local news, I could not help but notice the return of the YTL proposal for a High-Speed Rail link between KL and Singapore.

Apparently YTL CEO Francis Yeoh is not going to take the rejection of his proposal lying down. Perhaps he hopes that, with a new prime minister and a new set of ears, his proposal might be accepted this time. Whatever his reasons, I do admire him for his persistence and determination.

It certainly seems that many among the public are strongly in favour of the KL-Singapore High Speed Rail project. After all, high speed certainly sounds good, and the government has seemingly unlimited amounts of money that it could give to Francis Yeoh to spend on this vital railway project. High-Speed Rail is good for the environment, having a private company initiate the project is good for the economy, and of course everyone loves technology.

So why do I feel that the YTL proposal is just inappropriate right now?

Francis Yeoh has a strong ambition for growth and his company does have some experience with the KLIA express rail link, (which offers the KLIA Ekspres and KLIA Transit service). But is the company capable of building such a massive engineering project, dealing politically with two different national governments (Malaysia and Singapore) and the governments of five different states (KL, Selangor, Negri Sembilan, Malacca and Johor) - all with their own special needs?

When the project is built, will YTL be capable of managing the High Speed Rail service to the expectations of passengers?

We must also consider the competition. The recent entry of AirAsia and Jetstar into the KLIA-Singapore route has already created challenges for the MAS-SIA Shuttle.

Then we must consider the upcoming entry of Firefly into the mix, with service on the Subang-Singapore route coming before the end of this year. Bus service (especially express bus) between KL and Singapore is a growing market.

Putting all of this together, one wonders if there really is a market for high speed rail between KL and Singapore?

Finally, we must put this proposal in its proper context. Existing public transport (bus, taxi, KTM, LRT) in Malaysia is largely in a terrible state.

Having a high tech line sounds great but will the KL-Singapore HSR (as well as KL-Ipoh, Malacca Aerorail, Penang LRT/Aerobus, more LRT in KL, Johor Baru Maglev train, etc.) improve the overall state of public transport.

The sad truth is that they will not. And that is exactly why the government, Francis Yeoh and others should not let themselves get carried away by technology. We do not deserve a high speed rail if we cannot even get the buses and taxis to operate properly.

If Francis Yeoh really wants to improve public transport in Malaysia, he should have YTL take over a few taxi or bus companies and make them work properly, and also look at extending the KLIA Transit service to more communities (Seremban or Rawang, perhaps?).

And I am sure that Prasarana would appreciate it if YTL would invest in expanding the KL Monorail service.

Once YTL has succeeded in those areas, then we can talk about High Speed Rail.

(The letter is written on behalf of TRANSIT - The Association for the Improvement of Mass Transit)

Yeoh: KL-S’pore high-speed train essential
by Jose Barrock Wednesday, 01 July 2009 11:17
The Edge Financial Daily
http://www.theedgemalaysia.com/business-news/17625-yeoh-kl-spore-high-speed-train-essential.html

KUALA LUMPUR: YTL Corp Bhd managing director Tan Sri Francis Yeoh Sok Ping said the high-speed train service between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore proposed by his company was essential, even if YTL were not involved in the project.

“I would like to see the high-speed train (service) take off even if YTL (Corp) is not involved in it,” Yeoh told reporters at Invest Malaysia yesterday.

Yeoh’s YTL had mooted the CONSTRUCTION [] of the RM10 billion high-speed train link a few years ago, but the plans were scuttled due to the damp economic environment.

Asked if YTL would consolidate the property assets held by its unit YTL Land Bhd and various holdings in Singapore, Yeoh said: “YTL would do the right thing at the right time.” He noted that the YTL group had land assets with a gross development value of about RM25 billion.

Yeoh also welcomed the government’s initiative to liberalise the Foreign Investment Committee regulations on land ownership as it would be difficult to realise land values otherwise.

http://www.picamatic.com/show/2009/10/11/07/49/5490661_103x132.JPG

I recommend that Johor begin with a komuter system of Pasir Gudang, Kulai, JB and PTP before embarking on LRT or even monorail. Take it one step at a time. JB Sentral still not completed also with this upcoming electrification from Gemas - JB still in the dark.

Before to build Gemas-JB as their plan, they need to build project of Electrification from Seremban-Gemas (94.14 km) first!

http://www.picamatic.com/show/2009/10/03/07/18/5334281_320x281.JPG

http://www.malaxi.com/maps/railway_links.jpg

From the info board, expected completion is Jan 2012

http://i264.photobucket.com/albums/ii161/helmessy/DSC09620-1.jpg?t=1223186079

Latest news on electrification from Gemas - JB!
RM5b rail project on drawing board
By Sharen KaurPublished: 2009/05/12

Global Rail Sdn Bhd and its partner from China are working on a RM5 billion project to lay 250km of parallel railway lines in southern Peninsular Malaysia.

The proposal for the double-track lines, connecting Gemas and Johor Baru, will be submitted to the Ministry of Finance and Transport Ministry by early June, Global Rail managing director Fan Boon Heng told Business Times.

Its partner is China Infraglobe Consortium, a state agency under the Central Committee in Beijing.

The rail project will be a Private Finance Initiative, where the developers will arrange funding, and it will also include a plan by China Infraglobe to invest in mineral processing and metal production in Johor.

Global Rail is part of an international team of specialists undertaking a detailed development and investment study for China Infraglobe.

The Chinese company wants to set up an industrial complex in Johor to process the mineral and for downstream metal production with the required logistics infrastructure.

The proposed investment by China Infraglobe is related to the processing of minerals sourced in Peninsular Malaysia with electrified rapid rail freight, connecting the southern ports to the complex, Fan said.

"A proposal on the plan by China Infraglobe will also be submitted to the Chinese government early next month for approval," Fan told Business Times in an interview.

China Infraglobe is the implementation arm of the Byzantium China International Investment Consortium, both of which are extra-jurisdictional agencies under the Central Committee in Beijing.

"Our aim is to provide a solution to link up to Iskandar Malaysia, which is fast developing. There is a single track up to Johor currently but that needs to be upgraded. Furthermore, the government has indicated the continuation of the double tracks from Gemas to Johor," Fan said.

The Gemas-Johor Baru double-tracking project will benefit Keretapi Tanah Melayu Bhd as it will be able to extend its commuter services to Johor, instead of making its last stop in Seremban.

India's national railway firm, Ircon International Ltd, is already working on a RM3.45 billion contract to build 100km of electrified double-tracks from Seremban to Gemas.

Ircon's design-and-build contract is fully funded by the government and will be implemented in four years.

^^From now, double tracking in IDR is MUST. It surely will boost IDR and will attract investors...

the HSR route will possibly to be like this:
Penang-Ipoh-KL-Seremban-Kluang-JB-Singapore
Kangar will also be possible when the town is more developed.

What is the avg speed of this train in the first place?If its anything beyond 250km/h
i rather it have limited stops butterworth and KL will do.

I think better 300km/h

300 kmph and limited stop...

I think that is for ASEAN HSR lol.
From Kunming to Singapore via Chiang Mai and Bangkok.

And from JB to Singapore, the HSR will go underground, from suburb of Johor Bahru, have a underground stop around JB Sentral, then underground untill Marina Bay MRT station. Immigration and Checkpoint of Singapore and Malaysia will be done in Marina Bay Station, Singapore.

The Route will be:
(Bangkok)<- If SRT is intrested...
Butterworth - Ipoh - KL Sentral - Seremban - Ayer Keroh (intergrate with Melaka Aerorail, Malacca is popular destination of Singaporeans) - JB Sentral - Singapore (Marina Bay)

If SRT is intrested...
Chiang Mai - Nakhon Lampang - Den Chai - Phitsanulok - Nakhon Sawan - Thonburi - Bangkok - Nakhon Pathom - Phetchaburi - Chumphon - Surat Thani - Thung Song - Nakhon Si Thammarat - Hat Yai - Padang Besar (clearance and immigration station) - Butterworth

300 kmph and limited stop...

I think that is for ASEAN HSR lol.
From Kunming to Singapore via Chiang Mai and Bangkok.

And from JB to Singapore, the HSR will go underground, from suburb of Johor Bahru, have a underground stop around JB Sentral, then underground untill Marina Bay MRT station. Immigration and Checkpoint of Singapore and Malaysia will be done in Marina Bay Station, Singapore.

Good to see our HSR going underground in JB and Singapore.

But i'm interested more in maglev technology because it can achieve more than 500km/h and have low noise level due to less friction. At such speed, you can commute JB-KL in just half-an-hour which by meaning, you can live in JB and working in KL. Still, ticket price would be a big issue here.

In Japan, total cost for build 286km maglev track is about 5.10 trillion Yen which equal to RM740billion. The primary reason for the project's huge expense is that it is planned to run in a tunnel for more than 60% of the entire line, and 40 m underground (deep underground) for a total of 100 km in the Tokyo, Nagoya and Osaka areas.

JR Maglev MLX-01 which achieved 581km/h in 2003
http://www.rtri.or.jp/rd/maglev/jpeg/magcg_m.jpg

:cheers:

erm, JB ppl prefer to work in SG than KL ...
If the HSR is build underground in SG, then a shuttle service special for JB-SG must be introduced to commute the JB workers to SG.
But looks like JB Sentral has reached its maximum capacity.

i don't think JB Sentral at the max capacity given that it's yet open to public for intercity/shuttle train. JB ppl still use the old station (or i've lost track of any activities in JB?)

if u're talking about the single track laying in the southern region up to singapore has reached it's capacity, maybe it makes sense.... i'm not sure but i think it's not crowded at all. express sinaran pagi, ekspress sinaran ptang, ekspress rakyat, senandung malam, wau... what else? eastern and oriental, plus shuttle train to singapore (actually it also use the express train such as the senandung malam)....

I make my conclusion based on the traffic flow on the causeway, and the counter full of ppl!

causeway is for sure congested,jammed and everything. but on the other hand, the train service is not that packed yet. plus all the massive no of ppl commute from MY-SG and vice versa by personal vehicle or public bus use the Bangunan Sultan Iskandar (the CIQ building), not the JB sentral...

Build the third bridge lol.

The second link in tanjung kupang so far away from JB city center. then build the third bridge to link Permas Jaya and Senoko intersect JB Coastal Expressway and Woodlands Avenue West.

Or maybe fourth, fifth, or six...

If Malaysia and Singapore have treaty like Schengen Agreement between EU countries, things may be much easier.

A third bridge to be built at east. then forth...

we also can recommend trains that is flexible like Uk's to run on the existing track with high speed without building a new track. It can cut cost of construction and people can afford it from the beginning. It will also be very stable, not like the bumpy train in our country......

This will go on if the chinese pump money into it!It will part of the trans asia line from china all the way south to singapore.

hope we will have our own train technology so that we dont always gantung to other country...

:shifty:erm, JB ppl prefer to work in SG than KL ...
If the HSR is build underground in SG, then a shuttle service special for JB-SG must be introduced to commute the JB workers to SG.
But looks like JB Sentral has reached its maximum capacity.

The govt should do something I guess... Is it too much to ask for train services such as mrt or lrt between sg n jb??? :shifty::shifty::shifty::shifty:

Yes I think but if we don't ask too much for mrt, then it is too much for the causeway.

I think a believable solution for the cross-border MRT/LRT situation is to have a station at both sides of the customs area and a pedestrian bridge (indoor travellator along the causeway with duty free shops maybe :P:nuts:)

This is already implemented in the Lok Ma Chau border crossing between Hong Kong and Shenzhen (China) where stations from Shenzhen Metro and the HK East Rail MTR are linked by a pedestrian bridge. Custom clearance are at both sides of the river. The picture is taken from HK looking towards Shenzhen.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/f/fa/Lokmachau_huanggang_crossing.jpg

I 10000000% agree with u,Only if only on the johor side can get their act together.I am sure the singaporeans are more than happy with the idea.

I 10000000% agree with u,Only if only on the johor side can get their act together.I am sure the singaporeans are more than happy with the idea.I would prefer the bridge, like the design shown.

If both sides could agree they could build the water pipes and a pedestrian walkway into the bridge.

Cheers, m

I saw it before and it is quite amazing

But Johor Strait is wider that the cost may be high and the government may reject it .
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/1503/aaaaaare.jpg
Quite long.....
The bridge cannot build parallel to the causeway because the causeway need to be upgraded. So, leave some space for them...

But Johor Strait is wider that the cost may be high and the government may reject it .
http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/1503/aaaaaare.jpg
Quite long.....
The bridge cannot build parallel to the causeway because the causeway need to be upgraded. So, leave some space for them...

If they could build the pedestrian bridge, they would already have built a new road and rail bridge to replace the causeway long time already :bash:

The causeway can't be upgraded because of the SG government got some opinions.
I think there will be no quarrel about the pedestrian bridge because it doesn't really consist of economy matters.....

The causeway can't be upgraded because of the SG government got some opinions.
I think there will be no quarrel about the pedestrian bridge because it doesn't really consist of economy matters.....Singapore depends on food deliveries and water supplied from Malaysia and that comes through the Causeway.

The construction of the bridge would require a replacement of the water pipes and Singapore is worried that one of their '4 taps' would be turned off - maybe permanently.

But in 2050 Singapore will not be buying water from Malaysia and they will have no problem with replacing the causeway.

Cheers, m

I thought Sg has the neWater project?

the water agreement will only expire in 2061..in the meantime they still wants to get water supply from malaysia till they can solely relied on neWater and salt water desalination

99 years....

the water agreement will only expire in 2061..in the meantime they still wants to get water supply from malaysia till they can solely relied on neWater and salt water desalination

Hi, I'm from Singapore. I have to say Singapore have been buying water from Indonesia for quite some time. They are planning to build 2 more reservoirs, so now, Singapore has about 15 reservoirs with 2 along the way.

Anyway, with regards to the causeway, well, I definitely would not mind a new causeway. A high speed rail would definitely be better thouugh seriously, Singapore is just too small to have HSR going through it. The things Singapore want in exchange for the causeway is just ridiculous. Oh well, politics is just one thing I will never really understand when it comes to Singapore Malaysia relations.:)

ha ha,

It's the kind of thing that neighbors scratched each other's faces about and don't want to realize that their children are all playing happy happy together.

I thought Sg has the neWater project?neWater is one of the '4 taps'

The others are desalinisation, rainwater in reservoirs & the bulk water from Malaysia via the causeway.

(and, I guess, water shipments from Indonesia)

Cheers, m

The construction of the bridge would require a replacement of the water pipes and Singapore is worried that one of their '4 taps' would be turned off - maybe permanently.


it's not about the water supply that worries singapore as it is in the agreement.

but the thing which is not in the agreement...

the movement of freighters between Tanjung Pelepas Port in the west and Pasir Gudang Port in the east...it may hurt their port a lot. they don't want a 'Suez Canal' there...

Johor strait is just like the Victorian harbor. It is more suitable than the Singapore strait on the south. I think the SG government is happy when our country didn't develop.......
And HSR may tie up their country...(I can't explain the meaning)

Has anyone think about KL-Bangkok HSR link?

Has anyone think about KL-Bangkok HSR link?

yes... but you know lah Southern Thai problems and most parts of it economically not very developed....

Has anyone think about KL-Bangkok HSR link?

a romantic, luxury yet cheaper version of E&O Express is better...:okay:

Johor strait is just like the Victorian harbor. It is more suitable than the Singapore strait on the south. I think the SG government is happy when our country didn't develop.......
And HSR may tie up their country...(I can't explain the meaning)Im not going to disagree flatout that Singapore might be worried about competition from the neighbouring ports...but I think it is only a remote possibility.

Port of Singapore is the most efficient port in the world with the largest container volume & throughput for many years.

The only port that is close to being comptitive to Singapore is Hong Kong.

I dont see Pasir Gudang and PTP as being serious competition for Singapore...

In fact, if Singapore, Pasir Gudang & PTP could work out a good transshipment agreement they could probably find increased efficiencies from economics of scale and together dominate shipping throughout southeast Asia in particular & East Asia in general.

Cheers, m

Klang may competitive to SG if the islands around Klang is developed...
But I don't hope it will come...

how we define 'competitive' anyway? by the volume? or by how busy it is?

Klang may competitive to SG if the islands around Klang is developed...
But I don't hope it will come...

nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!

i was dreaming that they could develop the islands into rotterdam like and me living in one of it:lol::lol::lol:

i even scath future klang cbd at the river mouth, at the current south port terminal and bounded by pulau indah, pulau selat klang and northport that look like marina bay, even make a marina barrage for flood protection purpose and a megacasino..:)

how we define 'competitive' anyway? by the volume? or by how busy it is?

SPA is top3 bussiest port in the world with 1st class efficiencies, PTP just plain cheap.we can make it more cheaper and handle more volume by simlpy building it bigger.. they cannot,they can only be efficient,but efficiencies alone will not be enough as they wll reach the point of increased marginal cost... they run out of land, and new land need to be imported by barrage from vietnam...not cheap not easy..and they have 2 neigbour waiting to potong their line whenver the time comes..

Heya

Actually even with building more reservoirs ,will still need a fall back route.

Reservoirs are just basically rain water collectors.
What if we get a drought? Or the amount of rain is not enough?

Desalination plant can only provide so much.
So in the long run SG will still require water imports and i beleive that after that contract expire,Malaysia will place will a high value on the water.

Which will be detrimental towards SG.
People always plan but we can never be cautious enough.

SPA is top3 bussiest port in the world with 1st class efficiencies, PTP just plain cheap.we can make it more cheaper and handle more volume by simlpy building it bigger.. they cannot,they can only be efficient,but efficiencies alone will not be enough as they wll reach the point of increased marginal cost... they run out of land, and new land need to be imported by barrage from vietnam...not cheap not easy..and they have 2 neigbour waiting to potong their line whenver the time comes..

Heya

Actually in time,PSA will be closed down due to the cost and land issue.

But i believe mainly as more and more ships no longer needs to be transshipped.
As China opened up and more items removed from the prohibition list,there will be no requirement to enter SG water to renamed and rebranded.

Same case for Vietnam/Myanmar,or other countries branded in US naughty list.

Most of the incoming goods are not meant for internal consumtion,and as such if PSA goes down,it wont affect SG that much in the long term.

But personally i would say ,i really want it to be closed,VIVO City upper decks are virtually unusable when it is windy,you can smell the iron in the air.

Oh my sinuses.

Heya

Actually even with building more reservoirs ,will still need a fall back route.

Reservoirs are just basically rain water collectors.
What if we get a drought? Or the amount of rain is not enough?

Desalination plant can only provide so much.
So in the long run SG will still require water imports and i beleive that after that contract expire,Malaysia will place will a high value on the water.

Which will be detrimental towards SG.
People always plan but we can never be cautious enough.

Err, they are now buying water from Indonesia. Also, they are NOT closing PSA. They are only going to close the Tanjong Pagar berth and move it to Tuas. PSA is the organisation in charge of all the ports in Singapore.

Anyway, back to topic, The HSR would would be a great choice. However, i think a good idea is to make the part between Singapore and Malaysia to be underground or in this case underwater. Right now, the infrastructure can only permit a slightly faster train but not the HSR desired. It would take time but I am sure it would happen one way or another. For immigration for HSR, i guess the best way is to clear at the start point and end point of the trip.:)

nooooooooooooo!!!!!!!!!!!!

i was dreaming that they could develop the islands into rotterdam like and me living in one of it:lol::lol::lol:

i even scath future klang cbd at the river mouth, at the current south port terminal and bounded by pulau indah, pulau selat klang and northport that look like marina bay, even make a marina barrage for flood protection purpose and a megacasino..:)

My meaning is not to be developed to industrial site...
WE can develop the islands but leave Pulau Ketam alone...

I think neighbour Indonesia will be best friend to Singapore compared to Malaysia.

Right now, Indonesia sells water, sand, foods stuffs including meat (particularly pork) for Singapore consumption. So you see Malaysia has been losing out in this neighbour-neighbour trade (besides manufactured goods).

I also believe HSR will greatly benefit both countries, with Malaysia more to gain due to majority of the length will be in our part with condition our planners know well to maximise its connectivity with towns. Singapore on the other hand will gain alot from tourism and other service oriented economic activities.

The right time to build HSR is actually now when the cost is still affordable. Our two country relations have been on the positive side too (given Genting's casino).

I would think the best idea is:
KL Sentral - Melaka - Nusajaya - Marina Bay (Singapore)

I think the tracks should be laid closer to the XXXXSouth China SeaXXX [it should have been Straits of Malacca] coast compared to the existing KTM tracks. I think we can utilise the 2nd Bridge (just like Causeway having KTM) to cross over to Singapore. Then most part should be underground in Singapore.

Perhaps continuing northwards to Penang Sentral bypassing Lumut/Sitiawan would be great!!

^^
their best friend had stop selling them sand
now they get it from vietnam

i dont see why its cant be build at grade in singapore, since the lots of 2/3lane highway took more space than the train tracks..

and you do mean the straits of malacca right? not south china sea..

I think neighbour Indonesia will be best friend to Singapore compared to Malaysia.

Right now, Indonesia sells water, sand, foods stuffs including meat (particularly pork) for Singapore consumption. So you see Malaysia has been losing out in this neighbour-neighbour trade (besides manufactured goods).

I also believe HSR will greatly benefit both countries, with Malaysia more to gain due to majority of the length will be in our part with condition our planners know well to maximise its connectivity with towns. Singapore on the other hand will gain alot from tourism and other service oriented economic activities.

The right time to build HSR is actually now when the cost is still affordable. Our two country relations have been on the positive side too (given Genting's casino).

I would think the best idea is:
KL Sentral - Melaka - Nusajaya - Marina Bay (Singapore)

I think the tracks should be laid closer to the South China Sea coast compared to the existing KTM tracks. I think we can utilise the 2nd Bridge (just like Causeway having KTM) to cross over to Singapore. Then most part should be underground in Singapore.

Perhaps continuing northwards to Penang Sentral bypassing Lumut/Sitiawan would be great!!Interesting enough, Malays in Singapore are increasingly influenced by Indonesian ... er... theology is the wrong word...maybe 'attitudes' is better?

Er...patchay do you mean that the tracks should be laid closer to the straits of Malacca (rather than the South China Sea Coast)

Else how to have the KL-Malacca-Nusajaya-Marina Bay alignment?

Cheers, m

built close to the straits? Then how to solve when it touches Melaka?

EDT started around late 1980's, in Klang Valley, then to Rawang-Ipoh, Ipoh-Padang Besar, Seremban-Gemas and finally Gemas-Johor Bahru...

If Gemas-JB double tracking completed in this decade (2010-2019), that takes around 3x years for the whole west coast stretch from Padang Besar to Johor Bahru, to be completed.

Still, it is worth it, better intercity services, introducing commuter services around metropolitan areas and better freight services.

All of these can be achieved via EDT, and we can set our sights on high speed rail on west coast, hehe...

Provided if it is convenient and fast, people may take high speed train between KL and Singapore or to cities/towns between these two cities. Travelling to LCCT by bus already takes around 1 hour. Then check-in also takes time, boarding and take off also takes longer than a train to depart from station. If Malacca is one of the stops for the high speed rail line, more people from KL and Singapore can flock to Malacca. Trains can be more frequent on a day than airplane, that provides flexibility for travellers.

even though our EDT is only narrow gauge and max speed can only theoretically go at max 160km/h..

u should get to singapore from kl (provided non stop, and i heard the plan called gemas-tg pagar not gemas - JB EDT studies) in around 2 1/2 hours right?

considering flight took 1 hr bus ride, i hour to check in, then the flight, then the check out then the MRT rides, it should avarage about the same..

should KTM extend to marina bay, or should MRT come to our shore, or should we have both


built close to the straits? Then how to solve when it touches Melaka?

like duke and klana jaya line
we just do what we always do..build along the national grid...

I think the tracks should be laid closer to the South China Sea coast compared to the existing KTM tracks. I think we can uti....



I laughed at myself for that error.... yes it's STRAITS OF MALACCA

I think there's lotsa land around Melaka, i meant outskirts of Melaka. It does'nt need to bypass Jonker Street :)


I choose Marina Bay
- for the line to extend further into Singapore (giving Singapore more economic justification if they would want to participate with Malaysia to build HSR) ; and

- c'mon it's one-foot out to one of the world's financial hub. It has new land there, great connectivity = MRT, upcoming regional business/leisure hub Marina Bay and The Sands.


I hope the Msian govt seriously consider the HSR project right now since economy is already recovering. HSR will give a huge boost to our GDP.

4.5% is how much $?

Err, they are now buying water from Indonesia. Also, they are NOT closing PSA. They are only going to close the Tanjong Pagar berth and move it to Tuas. PSA is the organisation in charge of all the ports in Singapore.

Anyway, back to topic, The HSR would would be a great choice. However, i think a good idea is to make the part between Singapore and Malaysia to be underground or in this case underwater. Right now, the infrastructure can only permit a slightly faster train but not the HSR desired. It would take time but I am sure it would happen one way or another. For immigration for HSR, i guess the best way is to clear at the start point and end point of the trip.:)

Heya

Yes they are buying water now,but i sincerely hope the plans do not include stopping the purchase in the future.

Singapore is an isolated coutnry in many facets.And water is most important.

For the PSA issue,i sincerely hope they will close all port in SG in the future,the land is sorely needed for further development.

And since we will proceed to become a United Asian soon,SG can forgo these ports and use it for other purposes.

Cargos for SG can use ports in Malaysia and Indonesia then trafficked into SG.

I dunno where the platfrom of the HSR at KL sentral is located. Elevated or at ground?
I can see holes on KL Sentral which one of these is occupied by KJ line.

can do it like taiwan HSR, urban tracks are going underground.

HSR is not feasable in this 10 years. transit cost is very high, even can higher than MAS flights. As in Japan, Shinkansen fares are more expensive than flights. HSR is use money to buy time, not much Malaysian able to afford.

add seremban station. for me, profit in first priority. HSR between KL and Seremban with high speed and low cost (RM 20 something) able meet the high demand of express commuter service between KL and Seremban, a competition between SKS bus, KTM komuter, and the HSR.

Limited Express:
KL Sentral - Melaka - Johor Bahru Sentral - Marina Bay

KL-Seremban Express:
KL Sentral - Putrajaya Sentral(only 10% or 20% of train stops here) - Seremban
(only economy class available, no luggage space)

Local:
KL Sentral - BTS -Putrajaya Sentral - Salak Tinggi - Seremban - Melaka - (1 or 2 stations in Northern and Central Johor) - Johor Bahru Sentral - Marina Bay
(only economy class available, no luggage space)

Airport Express:
KL Sentral - BTS - (enters KLIA branch line) - KLIA - LCCT - (exits KLIA branch line) - Seremban

travel cost per passenger decreases when the demand is increases.
and we need at least two railway operators in west malaysia and east malaysia have its own railway operator to reduce the corruption, make competition between those companies to pay more effort on providing better service to get more customers. maybe HSR and meter gauge railway needed to operated seperately by two different companies.

The government may announce another 'once'. >>>>"we can only build ... once the population of .... reaches ...."

^^ it's reasonable.

if we can't meet such demand, who will cover the deficit of HSR?

For Taiwan HSR passenger catchment:
Taipei-Keelung 6.75mil
Kaohsiung 2.78mil
Taichung-Changhua 2.16mil
Taoyuan-Jhongli 1.81mil
Hsinchu 0.67mil
Chiayi 0.37mil
Total: 14.54mil

For KL-SG HSR passenger catchment
Klang Valley-Seremban 7 mil
Malacca 0.6mil
Johor Bahru Metropolitan Area 1.8mil
Total (within Malaysia): 9.4mil
Singapore 5mil
Grand Total: 14.4mil

but crossing two countries is different thing. In Taiwan, it is connecting three major metropolitan area (Taipei, Taichung, Kaohsiung) within a country, which is same economy system, customs system, currency system which makes more buisiness passengers between these three cities, but what about KL and Singapore? passenger flow between this two cities cannot be compared with Seoul-Busan, Taipei-Kaohsiung, Tokyo-Nagoya-Osaka.

and another thing is, HSR is use money to buy time. those take HSR from one place to one place is because of it is urgent, or no more available services in the short time. in case of malaysia, low cost airline sure beat HSR, for now.

So actually just upgrade the railways and provide more fast and comfortable train. Upgrade all train station and no need HSR again.

Interesting news:)

China's Railway Calls for High-Speed Diplomacy

http://abcnews.go.com/Travel/europe-asia-days-proposed-high-speed-rail-network/story?id=10048404&page=1

extend the KLIA express from Salak Tinggi to Seremban is ok, KLIA express tracks is capable for HSR development, make KL-Seremban as the first phase of HSR because commuter flow between KL and Seremban is increasing. and make competition between HSR and KTM and express buses. service quality can improved by competition between operators.

Seremban's role becoming more and more like a satelite city of kuala lumpur...

Now we should plan to build KL-Penang or KL-Seremban 1st. Then when the population increased, the line may be extended to north or south.

go and see the Singaporean thread about this, they wish to have HSR very much.

go and see the Singaporean thread about this, they wish to have HSR very much.how much are they willing to pay?

m has also heard that China is planning on investment in railways in SE Asia and Central Asia, to build stronger economic links.

Cheers, m

go and see the Singaporean thread about this, they wish to have HSR very much.

can post link?

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=370319&page=27

Fix the local public transport first, if we want to make rail travel a viable alternative to Malaysians.

If access to local railway station from surrounding areas within the town/city is convenient, people will be more inclined to take rail.

Fix the local public transport first, if we want to make rail travel a viable alternative to Malaysians.

If access to local railway station from surrounding areas within the town/city is convenient, people will be more inclined to take rail.There are some serious gaps & weakness within the metro & commuter rail system in the Klang Valley which makes it unpopular ... but overall, it does meet the needs of a large number of residents.

The main weaknesses are, to my mind:

1.Poor investment in KTM Komuter service - all trains should be 6 carriage and properly maintained

2.Not enough coverage by KTM Komuter - the Subang area should be covered by KTM Komuter. The Batu Caves extension is wonderful but it can go farther - and I would prefer an Outer Ring Rail over an outer ring road any day.

3. That whole concept of "LRT" which has really distorted our thinking. We end up with trains that are too small for our needs but cost too much money to build.

What is the point of buying a train design that can only carry 1/2 the passengers of a metro but costs 2/3 the price?

4. Feeder buses & buses in general are really screwed up thanks to the government's 'competitive, entrepreneurial' approach to public transport

5. Bus lanes needed to be designed effectively (see the recent letters in the Star regarding the bus lanes on Jalan Syed Putra, or TRANSIT's post "Do bus lanes worsen congestion?")

I could go on but those are the obvious weaknesses that need to be resolved ... and if they could be then we would see a marked improvement in public transport.

Cheers, m

Actually the problem can be solved easily if there are no special law in our country. The underground can be occupied fully and a more comfortable and faster Metro can be built. Or we recommend underground busway (not a really good idea)?

the reason why underground investment in malaysia is unsustainable, is because the underground( all the way to the mental) is owned by the 'above' land owner, that why tunnel in malaysia, will still have to follow river,highway and so on,..which defeat the purpose of the underground system anyway which is to go from A to B in a straits line...

might as well build cheaper above ground system..

This is also a major problem when building the SMART tunnel. The management may pay a large amount of cash to the Royal Selangor Club. This may be the the excuse that the government didn't start projects as usual. IT is very hard to count the actual value of the land .

I heard Thailand is gonna build its HSR? Issit the same as ours? When is our turn?

There are some serious gaps & weakness within the metro & commuter rail system in the Klang Valley which makes it unpopular ... but overall, it does meet the needs of a large number of residents.

The main weaknesses are, to my mind:

1.Poor investment in KTM Komuter service - all trains should be 6 carriage and properly maintained

2.Not enough coverage by KTM Komuter - the Subang area should be covered by KTM Komuter. The Batu Caves extension is wonderful but it can go farther - and I would prefer an Outer Ring Rail over an outer ring road any day.

3. That whole concept of "LRT" which has really distorted our thinking. We end up with trains that are too small for our needs but cost too much money to build.

What is the point of buying a train design that can only carry 1/2 the passengers of a metro but costs 2/3 the price?

I could go on but those are the obvious weaknesses that need to be resolved ... and if they could be then we would see a marked improvement in public transport.

Cheers, m

point 2, ORL should be operated by RapidKL not KTMB.
point 3, change the LRT into MRT (i mean upgrade from 3 coaches to 8 coaches), it may reduce the life span of the infrastructure, but "nasi sudah jadi bubur", unless rebuild the whole LRT system.
-> every new lines to be build in KL, must be MRT not LRT.

other points, totally agree with you.

HSR is a dream only. Singaporeans can't realize the Malaysian's problem, even the legal system also a problem.

I can see some comments on the thread of pics of metro lines in SEA. Many ppl said about our LRT is : "IS this really LRT??????"

I can see some comments on the thread of pics of metro lines in SEA. Many ppl said about our LRT is : "IS this really LRT??????"

By capacity, our Kelana Jaya line is not really LRT, it is a medium capacity system or probably you can call it as "light metro".

The infrastructure of Kelana Jaya line is more to metro than "LRT", tunnels....underground stations, elevated tracks...

If the outer ring rail total distance is more than 50 or 60 km....i think it is better to see KTM running the line :D

I think the 'LRT' mistake in our country is going to happen in Jakarta like the 'MRT or Subway'.
Back to topic.( nothing say about it now).

point 2, ORL should be operated by RapidKL not KTMB.
point 3, change the LRT into MRT (i mean upgrade from 3 coaches to 8 coaches), it may reduce the life span of the infrastructure, but "nasi sudah jadi bubur", unless rebuild the whole LRT system.
-> every new lines to be build in KL, must be MRT not LRT.

other points, totally agree with you.

HSR is a dream only. Singaporeans can't realize the Malaysian's problem, even the legal system also a problem.Why should RapidKL run the outer ring line? Let RapidKL handle the KL - Kepong - Petaling Jaya - Seri Petaling loop line assuming it is ever built.

KTMB should handle the outer ring line which should be built as much at ground level as possible to keep costs low.

As for upgrading from 3 coaches to 8 coaches, sorry Im not sure what you meant there.

KTM Komuter operates 3 coach trains but is moving to 6 coach trains with the future purchases of trains from ROTEM.

RapidKL's Kelana Jaya line is operating 2 coaches but will move to a mix of 2 & 4 coaches, by 2012. Ive proposed that they eventually move to fully 4-coach operations by 2014 by purchasing 18 additional trains so they would have a total of 282 carriages (53 x 4 carriage trains + 34 x 2 carriage trains coupled into 4-carriage consists + 1 spare 2 carriage train).

If RapidKL can expand the train stations (platform and concourse) they can move to 8-carriage trains in the future. The main challenge will be expansion of the underground stations but it would be possible.

Ampang line runs 6-coach trains and could expand to 8-coach trains in the future with expansion of the station concourse and platforms. Of course this would be much easier than the Kelana Jaya line expansion since it would not require as much infrastructure and many of the stations are at grade.

As for future lines, the labeling of 'LRT' and 'MRT' serves to cause confusion. Our "LRT" is actually consists of short "MRT" trains that use shorter, narrower carriages.

Shorter, narrower carriages allow for tighter turns and smaller tunnels which saves a great deal on infrstructure costs - so it is very likely that any future 'MRT' we see could just be an 8-carriage version of an 'LRT' train.

Cheers, m

Costs and political sensitivities hit hopes of a pan-Asia rail link
Toh Han Shih in Beijing
South China Morning Post/ Mar 22, 2010

Prospective Malaysian and Thai partners in a Chinese-built high-speed rail network linking the mainland with Southeast Asia say prohibitive costs and political sensitivities could delay the plan for a decade.

"High-speed trains may happen in Malaysia in 10 to 15 years, but not in two to three years. The main problem is high-speed rail is too expensive as new rail lines need to be laid," said Afzar Zakariya, a senior manager at Keretapi Tanah Melayu (KTM), the Malaysian state railway.

Zakariya was speaking on the sidelines of the China Modern Rail Summit in Beijing last week.

At an earlier railway conference in Beijing, a senior Thai railway official said that Chinese companies had been trying to persuade the Thai government to adopt high-speed railways supplied by China, but he was advising against the plan.

High-speed rail links were too expensive for Thailand, given the state of its economy, the official said, adding that political sensitivities over the location of rail links from southern China through Southeast Asian nations such as Myanmar and Vietnam, would require careful negotiation.

Another KTM official, Ismail Said, said mainland firms may be invited to join upgrading projects on existing lines and train stations in Malaysia, but not high-speed systems.

China has proposed a high-speed link from Kunming, in Yunnan province, to Singapore via Thailand and Malaysia, and is involved in technical negotiations on this issue, it has been reported.

State-owned firms such as China Railway Group (SEHK: 0390) and CNR Tangshan Railway Vehicle were in negotiations with parties in Malaysia over various railway projects, including a high-speed network, CNR sales chief Wang Dianwu said

But Wang declined to comment on a Malaysian newspaper report that CNR was in talks to build a rail link between Georgetown on Penang island with Butterworth.

In November last year, around the time of President Hu Jintao's visit to Malaysia, the Malaysian government announced it would award a US$2.1 billion railway project in southern Malaysia to a Chinese consortium including China Railway Engineering Corporation, the state-owned parent of China Railway Group, a Hong Kong and Shanghai-listed railway construction firm.

But China Railway Group now appears to be facing possible delays in its planned Malaysian projects.

On March 9, when former Malaysian finance minister Daim Zainuddin met the group's president Li Changjin in Beijing, Li expressed to Daim his hope that both sides would implement their joint project as soon as possible, according to China Railway's website.

Daim replied that while the Malaysian government had signed a letter of intent on the project late last year, much work remained to be done by both sides.

With progress on the high-speed land network evidently stalled over price and political sensitivities, attention has returned to the idea of a 200km undersea high-speed rail link between Fujian province and Taiwan, which was first mooted earlier this month.

Zheng Jian, the chief planner at China's Ministry of Railways, confirmed that an undersea high-speed rail tunnel between Fujian and Taiwan was part of the government's long-term plans, and said authorities were conducting feasibility studies.

But the Mainland Affairs Council, Taiwan's top China policy co-ordinating body responded coolly to the comments, dismissing the idea as a unilateral proposal from Beijing and saying it was improper for the two sides to talk about such a huge project given the political situation across the Taiwan Strait.

However, speaking in Beijing last week, Sung Hung-kang, the chief of the train operation and maintenance section of the Taiwan Railways Administration, said the feasibility of the idea should be considered.

"Now there is no war between China and Taiwan. Relations between Taiwan and China are improving. As cross-straits ties get better, a high-speed rail link can be considered," said Sung.

Last year, the Taiwan government scrapped a law forbidding the sourcing of railway equipment from the mainland. Also last year, a Taiwanese railway delegation visited mainland railway officials in Shanghai to discuss cross-strait partnerships in rail technology and Taiwanese purchase of mainland-made railway components, said Sung.

The Taiwan Railways Administration is conducting a tender for 296 electric train cars, and mainland companies were welcome to bid for it, he said.

Within ASEAN framework, what are your views, Malaysian friends?

China has three proposed line:
1) To europe
2) To Japan or Taiwan
MOST Important to us:
3) To Singapore

We will be Tied up I think base on some ppl opinions about China's High-speed railway diplomacy.

I heard Thailand is gonna build its HSR? Issit the same as ours? When is our turn?

As a Thai citizen, this is still not so sure concept yet ... even the cabinte has apporved in principle that the follwing 4 High speed lines have to be realized with the maximum time at 5 hours
http://www.nationmultimedia.com/home/2010/02/25/business/images/30123380-01.jpg
1. BKK (Makkasan Central) - Rayong - Chanthaburi
2. BKK (Bang Sue Central) - Hua Hin - Chumporn Surat Thani - Hat Yai
3. BKK (Bang Sue Central) - Nakhon Sawan - Chiang Mai
4. BKK (Bang Sue Central) - Nakhon Ratchasima - Nong Khai

Putrajaya mulls multi-billion rail deals
June 08, 2010
http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/putrajaya-mulls-multi-billion-rail-deals/

KUALA LUMPUR, June 8 — The Najib administration is considering proposals costing nearly RM50 billion on two rail projects to improve public transportation in the Klang Valley and for a high-speed rail link to Singapore, say government officials familiar with the deals.

On the table is a proposal from a MMC Corporation Bhd and Gamuda Bhd joint venture to construct a new mass rapid transit (MRT) system with a price tag of at least RM35 billion.

The other proposal for a high-speed rail link connecting KL and Singapore is from a Barisan Nasional (BN) component party to form a special purpose vehicle with capital from some of its other partners in the ruling coalition.

The Malaysian Insider understands that Prime Minister Datuk Seri Najib Razak is "positive" on the proposals.

"But no final decision has been made yet," a source said.

The KL-Singapore link proposal could cost between RM8 billion and RM10 billion, similar to a 2006 bid by YTL Corporation Berhad which owns a 50 per cent stake of the Express Rail Link between KL Sentral and KL International Airport.

But the lion's share would be for the MRT project which could take up to ten years to complete. It remains unclear if the new MRT line would replace or be in addition to the proposed Kota Damansara-Cheras line.

It is understood that MMC-Gamuda had made an unsolicited offer to build and design the MRT system. The Edge Daily yesterday reported both firms are bidding separately but government officials say both made a joint bid.

As a result the government is considering the use of a "Swiss Challenge" philosophy to tender the project out with MMC-Gamuda maintaining an advantage in being awarded the contract.

A Swiss Challenge is a form of public procurement in usually less-developed countries whereby public authorities receiving an unsolicited bid for a project invites third parties to match or exceed it.

The public authority would also usually give the original proponent an advantage in a competitive bidding process.

Using this principle, competitive bids would have to substantially lower or more cost effective to defeat any proposal from MMC-Gamuda.

A source familiar with the MMC-Gamuda proposal told The Malaysian Insider that MMC-Gamuda appeared to have gained an unusual advantage with its unsolicited bid because of the Swiss Challenge philosophy.

This was because the joint venture would only be involved in the "design-build" phase as contractors and would undertake almost no risk. Syarikat Prasarana Negara Berhad, the national infrastructure company, would ultimately own and operate the MRT line.

The huge price tag of "at least RM35 billion" for the MRT system could also rise further because it is understood that a major portion of the system would be underground.

Some underground sections of the new line being proposed would be constructed near or parallel to the existing underground sections of the Kelana Jaya Light Rail Transit (LRT) line.

But the new line would be underneath the LRT subway, escalating cost further.

The Malaysian Insider also understands that a BN component party that put forward its proposal to Najib to revive the KL-Singapore high-speed project had received favourable response.

Under the proposal, the BN party's investment arm would set up a new joint venture with capital contributions from a number of other BN parties to undertake the construction of the bullet-train type service.

YTL Corporation had been an original proponent of a bullet-train service which it said it would build for RM8 billion. It had then proposed cutting down travelling time to 90 minutes between KL and the island state.

But the YTL proposal, mooted soon after it had completed the KLIA Express Rail Link (ERL), had been put off by the government in 2008 due to the high costs involved.

It is understood that the new proposal by the BN component party is being looked at positively because of improved bilateral ties with Singapore and the possibility of a third bridge being built across the Causeway.

Oh ya here we go again!!!

Penang to Singapore HSR
Yes please!

KL mulls Penang-Singapore high speed rail link
September 21, 2010

KUALA LUMPUR, Sept 21 — Putrajaya is planning a high-speed rail (HSR) system linking Penang, Kuala Lumpur and Singapore under the Najib administration’s ambitious Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) unveiled today.

A feasibility study will be conducted on the HSR system by January 2011.

“We are looking at speeds of about 280km per hour,” said Ahmad Suhaimi, the deputy lab leader for Greater KL at the ETP open house here today.

He added that there will be public consultation and the results will be shared with the public.

According to information provided by the lab, the door to door journey from KL to Singapore will take about 2.4 hours as opposed to 3 hours by air.

An intercity service to Seremban, Ipoh, Ayer Keroh, Muar and Batu Pahat has also been proposed.

^^ Please may that finally happen!

Oh ya here we go again!!!

c'mon dude. it's multi billion dollar worth of investment/project. of course, there'll be a lot of discussion. just hope for the best. don't be such a negative person...:dj:

Latest news from http://www.themalaysianinsider.com/malaysia/article/kl-mulls-penang-singapore-high-speed-rail-link// >
Penang to Singapore HSR
Yes please!

KL mulls Penang-Singapore high speed rail link
September 21, 2010

KUALA LUMPUR, Sept 21 — Putrajaya is planning a high-speed rail (HSR) system linking Penang, Kuala Lumpur and Singapore under the Najib administration’s ambitious Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) unveiled today.

A feasibility study will be conducted on the HSR system by January 2011.

“We are looking at speeds of about 280km per hour,” said Ahmad Suhaimi, the deputy lab leader for Greater KL at the ETP open house here today.

He added that there will be public consultation and the results will be shared with the public.

According to information provided by the lab, the door to door journey from KL to Singapore will take about 2.4 hours as opposed to 3 hours by air.

An intercity service to Seremban, Ipoh, Ayer Keroh, Muar and Batu Pahat has also been proposed.

Penang-Singapore..berapa kilometre agak jauhnya!

http://www.malaysia-maps.com/images/map-malaysia-main-states.gif

Oh no here we go again!!!!:lol:

KL-Butterworth.. 369km
http://www.malaysiasite.nl/distance.htm


KUALA LUMPUR, Malaysia (AP) -- Malaysian conglomerate YTL Corp. has proposed building a high-speed bullet train link between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore to cover the 325-kilometer (200-mile) journey, a top executive said Wednesday.
..

369+325 = 694km+ hmmm Harga pembinaan must be charge...

RM118bil worth of ETP projects to take off this year:cheers:

Various projects are in the pipeline, including making Malaysia the number one regional hub for oil field services and a global biodiversity hub, more conducive shopping for tourists and revitalising the capital market.

There are also plans to build 141km of new rail lines and a high-speed rail system to connect Kuala Lumpur and Singapore, and revitalise the Klang river into a heritage and commercial district.:cheers:

Idris said there would be a level-playing field for the private sector, with the Government acting as an enabler and catalyst.

The ETP is expected to create 3.3 million jobs over the next 10 years, more than 60% of which would be in the medium-income or high-income salary brackets.

more: thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/9/21/nation/20100921141416&sec=nation

Photos from me.

Taken in ETP open day, PWTC.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC07014-1.jpg
http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC07015-1.jpg

Edited : Photos now with watermark.

Alamak...berita datang macam ributan !!
RM118bil worth of ETP projects to take off this year:cheers:

Various projects are in the pipeline, including making Malaysia the number one regional hub for oil field services and a global biodiversity hub, more conducive shopping for tourists and revitalising the capital market.

There are also plans to build 141km of new rail lines and a high-speed rail system to connect Kuala Lumpur and Singapore, and revitalise the Klang river into a heritage and commercial district.:cheers:

Idris said there would be a level-playing field for the private sector, with the Government acting as an enabler and catalyst.

The ETP is expected to create 3.3 million jobs over the next 10 years, more than 60% of which would be in the medium-income or high-income salary brackets.

more: thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/9/21/nation/20100921141416&sec=nation

malaysiainsider report Penang-Singapore (phase II)
The Star report KL-singapore (phase I)

cheers em

I went to the open day, and this is what i got :D

2 hours, KL to Singapore.

Baguslah mereka connect KLIA belum sampai KL City Centre!

It is Penang to Singapore.

However, KL to Singapore will be given priority.

KL studies high-speed Singapore rail link
Published: 2010/09/21
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/20100921103029/Article/index_html

Malaysia’s government is studying the viability of a high-speed rail system to connect greater Kuala Lumpur to Singapore with a traveling time of two hours, according to an exhibition in the capital.

The study will be led by the Land Public Transport Commission and the Economic Planning Unit, which will present the results to Malaysia’s cabinet in early January, the display shows.

The Cabinet will consider a study on a mass rail project for Kuala Lumpur by the end of this year, according to the exhibition.

The scheme could cost a total RM45 billion, comprising RM36 billion of infrastructure and RM9 billion of operating assets including trains, the display shows. -- Bloomberg

10 EPPs Identified To Deliver On Greater KL
By Zuriati Zulmi September 21, 2010 20:06 PM
http://www.bernama.com.my/bernama/v5/newsindex.php?id=529281

KUALA LUMPUR, Sept 21 (Bernama) -- Building an integrated urban mass rapid transit system linking Singapore via a high-speed rail system and wooing 100 of the world's most dynamic firms are among projects identified to deliver on the Greater Kuala Lumpur under the National Key Economic Area (NKEA).

Revitalising the Klang River into a heritage and commercial district is also among the 10 entry point projects (EPPs) along four dimensions identified to deliver on the Greater Kuala Lumpur under the NKEA.

Growth in Greater KL economic activities will increase total employment from 2.5 million in 2010 to 4.2 million by 2020.

These details were disclosed by members of the laboratory set up by the Performance Management and Delivery Unit (PEMANDU) in the Prime Minister's Department led by Ahmad Suhaili Idrus at the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) Open Day here Tuesday.

The Greater Kuala Lumpur NKEA's vision is to be a city that simultaneously achieves a top-20 ranking in city economic growth while being among the global top-20 most liveable cities by 2020.

Four dimensions to deliver the Greater Kuala Lumpur aspirations are Greater KL as a magnet, Greater KL connect, Greater KL new places and Greater KL enhanced services.

Greater KL EPPs will require a cumulative funding of RM172 billion from 2010 to 2020, 34 per cent of which is expected to come from the public sector.

The other EPPs are greening Greater Kl to ensure residents enjoy sufficient green space, creating a comprehensive pedestrian network, creating iconic places and attractions, developing an efficient solid waste management ecosystem and sewerage-non river.

Greater KL, already on the global map as one of the iconic cities of Southeast Asia, will boast as the world-renowned landmarks such as the Petronas Twin Towers, a unique blend of diverse cultures and heritage, an extensive road network and high quality basic services such as water and electricity.

However, it now faces fierce competition from neighbouring cities in attracting talents and multinational corporations.

Its liveability lags behind many other Asian cities, public transport remains inadequate and many natural assets remain untapped.

The NKEA laboratories involved more than 500 participants from over 200 private sector companies, government ministries, agencies, regulatory bodies and non-governmental organisations.

-- BERNAMA

Here, the last three photos which i took from the open day.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC06792-1.jpg

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC06793-1.jpg

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC06794-1.jpg

Too optimistic planning..this HSR will be private funded and government will be only the PEMANDU and a planner (SPAD)..
so no issues of lack of fund and budget deficits whatsoever.
I only wonder how it will benefits Malaysians neither Singaporeans since it will be business oriented (ticket price will be like a bomb) :cheers:

From Malaysian point of view, the proposal by the government seems great.

I hope this is not the joke/crap of the decade by the government. Most of things they propose in the past take years or even decades to come into action. At the most of the times, the government tends "to drizzle by giving loud thunderstorm" to the people.


From Asian side of view, this is a part of Asian integrated HSRs as claimed by China. China is building HSRs aggressively in over her country. By 2014, the time required to travel from Hong Kong to Beijing is only 8 hours while the distance is around 2200km. China has already started building HSRs in Myanmar and has the intention to link it to Thailand, Malaysia and Singapore.


High speed rail indeed can boost economic activities and development. I am not too sure why the maximum speed by Malaysian HSRs is only 280km/h instead of 350km/h. The speed difference actually has significant impact on the traveling time.

Perhaps they should build Maglev which can have 550km/h like Japanese Shinkansen. Which I think it is impossible for Malaysia to build it.

It should be faster than 2 hours, then only people will consider to pay much more due to the significant reduction of travel time.

It should be faster than 2 hours, then only people will consider to pay much more due to the significant reduction of travel time.

Agree, since we are doing that from scratch, not from existing rail track, we might as well aim for faster HSR, just like Taiwan's HSR, cutting traveling time from Taipei to Kaohsiung to 90 minutes from about 5 hours of driving time. If we are doing it, we should aim for 2.5 hour max. from Butterworth to Singapore. We can have limited stop line which charges higher fare and regular line which stops at every major city.

KL-S'pore high-speed rail link project may come back
By RISEN JAYASEELAN Wednesday September 22, 2010
http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/9/22/business/7079354&sec=business

Projects to kick-start nation’s high income quest

PETALING JAYA: Among the larger projects that could come about as a result of the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) are the building of the mass rapid transit (MRT) system and the once-shelved high-speed rail between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore.

The ETP has also laid down plans to make Malaysia the number one Asian hub for oil field services, cleaning up and beautifying the capital city’s rivers, building a 7km shopping strip with covered walkways and identifying sites for the country’s first nuclear power plant.

These are some of the 131 “entry point projects” spanning 11 national key economic areas (NKEAs), ranging from electronics to agriculture, that would generate big results fast, the Performance Management and Delivery Unit (Pemandu) said.

It added that the investments would be led by the private sector and the Government would play a facilitative role in ensuring that these projects get off the ground.

The oil, gas and energy NKEA alone is expected to raise its contribution to the total gross national income (GNI) to RM241bil by 2020 from RM110bil in 2009. (alhamdulillah akan berjaya!!!)

This will require about RM218bil in funding, most of which would come from the private sector.

Part of the plans for this sector is to consolidate all domestic fabricators to increase their likelihood of winning major contracts.

It is understood that this will entail a merger of existing oil and gas fabricators owned by companies such as Kencana Petroleum Bhd, Malaysia Marine & Heavy Engineering Sdn Bhd, Ramunia Holdings Bhd, Sime Engineering Bhd, Boustead Heavy Industries Corp Bhd, Oilcorp Bhd and Brooke Dockyard and Engineering Works Corp.

However, an analyst notes that it is not going to be easy to merge all these companies, considering their diverse shareholder base. A source familiar with the plans said Malaysian Investment Development Authority (Mida) would play a key role in overseeing this merger.

Another proposal for the oil and gas sector is to build a regional oil storage centre which hopefully will eventually be a hub.

In his opening remarks to a packed hall at the Putra World Trade Centre yesterday, Pemandu CEO Datuk Seri Idris Jala singled out the planned RM5bil deepwater oil storage project in south Johor by Dialog Group Bhd as an example of the kind of private sector investments that would boost the country’s growth.

The independent deepwater storage terminal for oil products in Pengerang, south-east Johor, is undertaken by Dialog and its partner, Vopak, via a 51:49 joint venture. The joint-venture company, Dialog Vopak JV, owns 90% of the project, with the Johor government holding the balance 10% stake.

Met on the sidelines of the ETP open day yesterday, Dialog managing director Ngau Boon Keat said his company hoped to receive all the necessary approvals, which include those from the Environment Department, for this project by year-end.

The energy sector would also see investments for the deployment of nuclear energy for power generation and building up the country’s solar power capacity.

According to Pemandu, the MRT project will be the largest infrastructure project in Malaysia – spread across 141km of three new corridors and integrated with existing rail systems such as the KTM Komuter, monorail and light rail transit.

The MRT project is also supposed to generate jobs for 130,000 people. While no figure had been revealed for the total project cost, it will be 66% privately funded, according to Pemandu.

It had earlier been reported that the MRT project would cost RM36bil, leaving some to question if the private sector can foot such a bill.

YTL climbs on HwangDBS, CIMB reports
Published: 2010/09/22

Malaysia’s biggest builder YTL Corporation Bhd , rose the most since November 2008 after CIMB Investment Bank Bhd and HwangDBS Vickers Research Sdn Bhd said the company may gain from proposals to build a high-speed rail network linking Kuala Lumpur and Singapore.

Shares of YTL gained 5.3 per cent to RM7.99 at 12.02 pm local time in Kuala Lumpur trading. - Bloomberg

eh tolong la, jgn mempermainkan rakyat, ok?
How will the government fund the mega projects?
Even if YTL gonna take this up, what will be the price of the tickets?
Sudah lupa experience of the KLIA express?

It's good to see policy near next election time..
projek HSR dulu tu pasal condition yg banyak masaalah untuk membinanya...(sampai kena batalkan)
tpi policy dari najib era dia lain..tgk seterusnya lagi...

Seven projects under ETP to triple nation’s income
Wednesday September 22, 2010
http://thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/9/22/nation/7080193&sec=nation

KUALA LUMPUR: Malaysia’s economy is set to surge forward, propelled by seven projects worth almost RM115bil scheduled to start by year-end.

Minister in the Prime Minister’s Department Datuk Seri Idris Jala said the projects would be a joint venture between the private sector and the Government under the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) aimed at creating 3.3 million jobs by 2020.

The seven were part of 131 projects worth some RM670bil to be spearheaded by the private sector, said Jala at the one-day ETP open day programme at Putra World Trade Centre.

Other developments:

> Among the projects are the creation of Greater Kuala Lumpur, a high-speed rail link between Kuala Lumpur and Singapore, and revitalising Klang River;

> CEOs call for Government’s role in business to be reduced and for freer competition;

> The ETP open day event received an overwhelming response, with some 4,000 people crowding the venue; and

> Tourism industry aims to raise GNI to RM104bil by 2020

KL Sentral --> KLIA ( 58km ) already 35 Ringgit

jadi... KL Sentral --> Singapura ( 320 km ) berapa ringgit ni ???

But if this HSR project is economically beneficial & being a major driver of transformation of cities & towns in between KL & SG then why not kan ?

We cannot compare airport express rail and high speed rail ticket cost.

They might have different costing system, who knows?

I would like to know in terms of RM per km.

Airport rail link maximun speed is just 160km/hr (it's not high speed but just express rail link) ...
High speed rail kena ada berkelajuan dari 200+km/hr!
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/High-speed_rail

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/2/2f/Alstom_AGV_Cerhenice_img_0365.jpg/800px-Alstom_AGV_Cerhenice_img_0365.jpg
(Alstom-France)
Bayangkan itu di Malaysia...

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/ce/ICE3_Dernbachertunnel.jpg/800px-ICE3_Dernbachertunnel.jpg
(Siemens ICE-German)
Dulu keretapi berkelajuan tinggi jenis ni dari German dah proposed untuk Malaysia!

KL-Singapore proposed speed at 280km per hour!!!

Penang to Singapore HSR
Yes please!

KL mulls Penang-Singapore high speed rail link
September 21, 2010

KUALA LUMPUR, Sept 21 — Putrajaya is planning a high-speed rail (HSR) system linking Penang, Kuala Lumpur and Singapore under the Najib administration’s ambitious Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) unveiled today.

A feasibility study will be conducted on the HSR system by January 2011.

“We are looking at speeds of about 280km per hour,” said Ahmad Suhaimi, the deputy lab leader for Greater KL at the ETP open house here today.

He added that there will be public consultation and the results will be shared with the public.

According to information provided by the lab, the door to door journey from KL to Singapore will take about 2.4 hours as opposed to 3 hours by air.

An intercity service to Seremban, Ipoh, Ayer Keroh, Muar and Batu Pahat has also been proposed.

skrg detail of project ada:
- proposed speed 280km/hr
- 2 hours from KL-Singapore
- Alignment

Photos from me.
Taken in ETP open day, PWTC.

http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC07015-1.jpg

Edited : Photos now with watermark.
COMING SOON JANUARY 2011!


http://i161.photobucket.com/albums/t224/Nissan_FUGA/Public%20transport/DSC07014-1.jpg

^^^Did someone mixed up infos up there... as more i read as more confused i am...
i dont think the 141km rail line is for HSR.. i think it is for the proposed MRT.. same goes to the RM45 bil of money.. i also think it is for the MRT project instead of the HSR..

141km=36bil, so 1km=.2 bil.. is that the right way to count?? i thought things like whether the track is on grass, elevated or underground is taken into account as there have diff cost per km.. lastly.. i think this tread is for HSR not MRT.. sorry if i off topic!

^^

141 km is for the mass rapid transit and as we know, high speed rail is not the same as mass rapid transit line.

I wont be surprised if the ticket price for the high speed train between KL and Singapore will probably be around RM250 one way, as the cost to build the line will be expensive.

This trainride is meant for business travelers and those who can afford it, so YTL or whoever builds the line cant be forced to offer low ticket prices (and lose money) so that everyone can ride them.

Before there were low cost airlines like AirAsia, only those who can afford will be able to fly on MAS. Nobody complained about their ticket prices then because it was understood that only those who can afford can fly MAS.

Same thing here.

Why not they just extend the ERL line to Seremban and Malacca for the first phase. Use the same train as ERL and no need to buy new one...I think Malacca really need for a direct connection with KLIA and if there an ERL, surely it will boost either tourism in Malacca or passenger arrival in KLIA .

Soon after they got enough money, they can buy the 300km/h train, extend the line to JB from Malacca and upgrade the signaling. As simple as that. :cheers:

^^

One potential challenge is that high speed trains are normally wider than our Siemens Desiro used by ERL.

ERL train width is 2,840 mm.

Siemens Velaro E (used in Spain) or ICE 3 (Germany) width is about 2,950 mm.

Another thing is if we look at China, their high speed rail models has body width of more than 3,000 mm.

We cannot compare airport express rail and high speed rail ticket cost.

They might have different costing system, who knows?

I would like to know in terms of RM per km.

YEAH..I STRONGLY AGREE WITH YOU!
geez malaysian,
the ticket might be costly,but i believe a lot more cheaper than taking a flight.(standard flight ticket sing-mal).
it is an option,for those who don't want to get in flight, they can take a high speed train.
those who think taking train is expensive,take a flight or bus then.

YEAH..I STRONGLY AGREE WITH YOU!
geez malaysian,
the ticket might be costly,but i believe a lot more cheaper than taking a flight.(standard flight ticket sing-mal).
it is an option,for those who don't want to get in flight, they can take a high speed train.
those who think taking train is expensive,take a flight or bus then.

Can we all imagine the amount of tourists drawn to Singapore that will take the opportunity to travel to Melaka, KL and Penang using the fast speed train service? Not to mention those in the major towns in Johor such as Muar and Batu Pahat who can easily go to KLIA instead of Changi? We must have this track built. I will be a regular customer!

I read the article from LGE, he said that the HSR will not extend to Penang. Just KL-SG!

ambitious.... but doubtful.... whether how close is it to reality.... private or govt... or semi with govt subsd... how affordable is it to the public...

but yea of coz im in it as well... if really connects the 3 hotspot PG-KL-Spore , then it's awesome... if only kl and s'pore a bit boring.... shud be north to south like PLUS.... hehe

I think the government wanted Singaporeans to come KL spend money. Penang no money, so no need connect......:ohno:

orang singapore ramai di penang.... must connect penang-sngapore

i think for the beginning,it better to start up with KL-Sing first.

if the outcome is lucrative, then they have to think for a KL-penang tract.

in fact,to build it all at once might be very expensive.
IMO,it should be done in several phases.

I hope no more politics problem to be involved in the project.

Let's us compare the High Speed Rails of some Asian nations.

Country : Taiwan
Depart-Arrive : Taipei - Zuoying
Local Ticket Fare : NT 1490
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 147.00
Distance Travelled : 335.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.44


Country : Korea
Depart-Arrive : Seoul - Busan
Local Ticket Fare : 45,000 won
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 120.50
Distance Travelled : 408.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 10 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.29


Country : China
Depart-Arrive : Wuhan - Guangzhou
Local Ticket Fare : 490 Yuan
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 226.10
Distance Travelled : 968 km
Time Taken : 3 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.23


Country : Japan
Depart-Arrive : Tokyo - Osaka
Local Ticket Fare : 13,750 Yen
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 504.10
Distance Travelled : 552.6 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 25 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.91


So, the question, are we willing to pay KL-Singapore HSR at Japanese price? With a total distance of 320km, RM 291.20. But, we have to recall that the costs of living in Malaysia and in Japan are different. In fact, I would not be surprised if Malaysian Government set at the price higher than RM 100 per one way.

I realized that Japan already built its HSR on 1964. What an amazing nation. I think Malaysia seriously must wake up and build her own HSR as soon as possible for economic purpose. Link up all the major cities in Penisular.

^^

In my opinion, RM 100 to RM 130 might be fair enough.

Suppose today, 27th September.

If i got a notice to attend business meeting on the 29th...a similar air ticket cost (not promotional price), one way will easily cost more than RM 1xx, depending on flight departure time.

However, airport is far away from the city. Add taxi or bus, it will be more than the air ticket price for sure.

If it is possible to surf internet on board the train, plus shorter door-to-door service and also higher frequency on any given day, bullet train is an ideal option.

I'll be really happy if the HSR really does stop at BP! :)

Siemens eyes MRT, high-speed rail jobs
From Adeline Paul Raj Published: 2010/09/27
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/zimin-2/Article/index_html

http://www.btimes.com.my/articles/zimin-2/pix_topright

The high-speed rail project from KL to Singapore has always been a priority for the company in looking at the Malaysian market, says its head of mobility division at Siemens Malaysia

BERLIN: Siemens, a global expert in rail technology, is keen to take part in Malaysia's proposed high-speed rail project linking Kuala Lumpur and Singapore and RM36 billion mass rapid transit (MRT) system for Greater Kuala Lumpur.

The two projects are being considered by the government as part of a larger plan to transform the country into a developed nation by 2020.

They are among 131 projects proposed under the government's 10-year Economic Transformation Programme.

"The high-speed rail project from KL to Singapore is something that has always been a priority for us in looking at the Malaysian market. It is clear that if this project develops further, we would be very interested to take part in it," said Axel Muench, head of the mobility division at Siemens Malaysia Sdn Bhd.

As a turnkey supplier, Siemens - which has done high-speed rail projects for countries like Spain, Russia and China - typically provides the rolling stock and signalling and electrification systems.

"That's the kind of package we would be going for here as well," Muench told Business Times on the sidelines of Innotrans 2010, the world's largest rail exhibition, held every two years in the German capital.

The four-day event, which attracted about 1,900 exhibitors from around the world and some 90,000 visitors, ended last Friday.

The event saw Siemens introducing the Velaro D, its new high-speed train for Germany's railway operator Deutsche Bahn.

The group is keen to use the Velaro for Malaysia's high-speed rail project.

The typical speed for such projects these days is about 350km an hour, Muench said.

Competition to secure the job will be stiff, with a handful of other global suppliers such as France's Alstom also likely to be keen. Adding to the rivalry will be Chinese suppliers.

"My view is that the price of all the suppliers will be very similar. I think with this one (project), it will come down to a trusting relationship between consortium partners ... and the emotional aspect," he said.

According to Muench, the YTL group is still one of the major promoters of the project.

"And then there are two Chinese consortiums, as I understand, that are declaring their interest," he said.

Conglomerate YTL had proposed the project a few years ago, but it failed to take off.

As for the MRT project, Muench believes the long-talked-about line linking Damansara and Cheras will form a vital part.

According to reports, the MRT will consist of three lines running a total of 150km and covering an area within a 20km radius of central Kuala Lumpur.

Its estimated RM36 billion cost excludes land acquisition and rolling stock.

Suppliers for this project, unlike the high-speed rail, will likely be picked based on "hard-core price-based competition", Muench said.

"Being focused on providing quality transportation solutions, we're hoping we can contribute to both projects," he added.

Siemens eyes MRT, high-speed rail jobs
From Adeline Paul Raj Published: 2010/09/27
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/zimin-2/Article/index_html

As a turnkey supplier, Siemens - which has done high-speed rail projects for countries like Spain, Russia and China - typically provides the rolling stock and signalling and electrification systems.


Velaro E for Spain (Barcelona–Madrid) - 2001

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/1/10/Renfe_clase_103.JPG/800px-Renfe_clase_103.JPG

Velaro CRH3 for China (Beijing-Tianjin) - 2005

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/b/ba/CRH3.JPG/800px-CRH3.JPG

Velaro RUS EVS (Sapsan) for Russia (Moscow-Saint Petersburg) - 2006

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/1/13/Siemens_Velaro_RUS.jpg

ICE5 (Velaro D) NEW! during Innotrans 2010 Berlin, Germany!
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4087/5025472699_fd5e178970_b.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/janberlin/5025472699/
http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4111/5024519732_a4b0ee7d78_b.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/39974957@N08/5024519732/
produk baru dari Siemens :cheers:

Let's us compare the High Speed Rails of some Asian nations.

So, the question, are we willing to pay KL-Singapore HSR at Japanese price? With a total distance of 320km, RM 291.20. But, we have to recall that the costs of living in Malaysia and in Japan are different. In fact, I would not be surprised if Malaysian Government set at the price higher than RM 100 per one way.

I realized that Japan already built its HSR on 1964. What an amazing nation. I think Malaysia seriously must wake up and build her own HSR as soon as possible for economic purpose. Link up all the major cities in Penisular.

kl-singapore is one of the busiest air routes in the world (450 flights a week/ 320k seat / month). and that with be average price of rm 250 - 300 per return trip. hsr can replace the air route at just 10 trips a day...

if it takes 2-3 hours to go from downtown to downtown with the cost of 200-300 ringgit, many more customers will opt of rail instead of air...

hell, people now taking 5 hour luxury bus trips at cost of rm100 per seat, i am think half of the passenger willing to pay twice of that if it will take them half the time to get to singapore...

building a kl-singapore hsr is a no brainer, the challenges are:-
1) funding
2) land acquisition (taking 2nd link/causeway/new route?)
3) how to clear customs/immigration at boarder
4) what kind of consortium it will be made to build/operate the hsr (government, semi-government, private?)

cant wait 4 dis

in term of design.. i really love the Siemens model that is been used in German and the new one...

Alstom is a big NO NO!!

And i realise that most european countries HSR are shorter than the one in Asian countries.. I wonder how many coaches(is it the right word?) do KL-SG train will have??

in term of design.. i really love the Siemens model that is been used in German and the new one...

Alstom is a big NO NO!!

And i realise that most european countries HSR are shorter than the one in Asian countries.. I wonder how many coaches(is it the right word?) do KL-SG train will have??

Nothing has been mentioned about coaches etc.

I guess we have to wait for the completion of the study.

Let's us compare the High Speed Rails of some Asian nations.

Country : Taiwan
Depart-Arrive : Taipei - Zuoying
Local Ticket Fare : NT 1490
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 147.00
Distance Travelled : 335.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.44


Country : Korea
Depart-Arrive : Seoul - Busan
Local Ticket Fare : 45,000 won
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 120.50
Distance Travelled : 408.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 10 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.29


Country : China
Depart-Arrive : Wuhan - Guangzhou
Local Ticket Fare : 490 Yuan
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 226.10
Distance Travelled : 968 km
Time Taken : 3 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.23


Country : Japan
Depart-Arrive : Tokyo - Osaka
Local Ticket Fare : 13,750 Yen
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 504.10
Distance Travelled : 552.6 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 25 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.91


So, the question, are we willing to pay KL-Singapore HSR at Japanese price? With a total distance of 320km, RM 291.20. But, we have to recall that the costs of living in Malaysia and in Japan are different. In fact, I would not be surprised if Malaysian Government set at the price higher than RM 100 per one way.

I realized that Japan already built its HSR on 1964. What an amazing nation. I think Malaysia seriously must wake up and build her own HSR as soon as possible for economic purpose. Link up all the major cities in Penisular.nice use of data in the above - but may I suggest that you also include some info on when the line returned to profitability.

After all, one of the main issues behind our failure to invest in mass-transit in a proper and timely fashion is the annoying propensity of our mass-transit builders to go belly-up - as in, bankrupt, forcing the government to take over the projects.

Frankly, if the government had planned properly and not had to take over PUTRA (followed by STAR, IntraKOTA, and KL Monorail) then we probably would have seen more consistent investment in mass-transit over the past decade.

Cheers, m

if it takes 2-3 hours to go from downtown to downtown with the cost of 200-300 ringgit, many more customers will opt of rail instead of air...

hell, people now taking 5 hour luxury bus trips at cost of rm100 per seat, i am think half of the passenger willing to pay twice of that if it will take them half the time to get to singapore...More likely that half of the passengers who board their buses at KL Sentral (Airebus etc), Kuala Lumpur station (Nice++) and KLCC (Airbus) will switch to the high-speed rail link...those who board their buses outside of the city (Bandar Utama, Sunway, Mont Kiara, Menara Axis-PJ) will have to debate whether the extra time required to get to KL Sentral will be worth it.

Cheers, m

building a kl-singapore hsr is a no brainer, the challenges are:-
1) funding
2) land acquisition (taking 2nd link/causeway/new route?)
3) how to clear customs/immigration at boarder
4) what kind of consortium it will be made to build/operate the hsr (government, semi-government, private?)

1. Khazanah Nasional Berhad + Temasek
2. KTMB Land all the way to Tanjung Pakar - except the section which require the new land acquisition
3. International station at JB Sentral
4. Just the same as 1.

Airport rail link maximun speed is just 160km/hr (it's not high speed but just express rail link) ...
High speed rail kena ada berkelajuan dari 200+km/hr! KL-Singapore proposed speed at 280km per hour!!!

Track Rehab the Ariport Link line to be at 300 kph + expanding the width to accept the width of rollign stocks at 3.000 meter

'ETP brings cheer to construction sector'
Published: 2010/09/27
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/20100927173803/Article/index_html

The unveiling of the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) has brought cheer to the construction industry,says ECM Libra Investment Research.

In a research note today, ECM Libra said apart from the expected mass rapid transit (MRT) project, another mega rail project, the high-speed rail to Singapore, was back on track.

"The project, purportedly worth an estimated RM8 billion to RM11 billion,was shelved a few years ago due to concerns of high cost," it said.

ECM Libra said under the ETP, a myriad of major property development projects planned within Greater KL would also support the construction industry over the next decade.

It said the government was mulling an undersea tunnel between Malaysia and Singapore for the 1.5km rapid transit system connecting the countries, which was reportedly agreed at a meeting in May.

"Both countries are to work together on the cost considerations, and will form a committee to oversee the project, expected to be completed by 2018," it said.

However, it said, apart from the MRT for which the feasibility study was to be concluded by early next month, many of these projects were still at their initial stages. - Bernama

Let's us compare the High Speed Rails of some Asian nations.

Country : Taiwan
Depart-Arrive : Taipei - Zuoying
Local Ticket Fare : NT 1490
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 147.00
Distance Travelled : 335.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.44


Country : Korea
Depart-Arrive : Seoul - Busan
Local Ticket Fare : 45,000 won
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 120.50
Distance Travelled : 408.5 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 10 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.29


Country : China
Depart-Arrive : Wuhan - Guangzhou
Local Ticket Fare : 490 Yuan
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 226.10
Distance Travelled : 968 km
Time Taken : 3 hours
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.23


Country : Japan
Depart-Arrive : Tokyo - Osaka
Local Ticket Fare : 13,750 Yen
Ringgit Equivalent : RM 504.10
Distance Travelled : 552.6 km
Time Taken : 2 hours 25 minutes
Ringgit per Kilometre : 0.91


So, the question, are we willing to pay KL-Singapore HSR at Japanese price? With a total distance of 320km, RM 291.20. But, we have to recall that the costs of living in Malaysia and in Japan are different. In fact, I would not be surprised if Malaysian Government set at the price higher than RM 100 per one way.

I realized that Japan already built its HSR on 1964. What an amazing nation. I think Malaysia seriously must wake up and build her own HSR as soon as possible for economic purpose. Link up all the major cities in Penisular.

thank for the list:cheers:

one question though, why do you thimk that we gonna get the japanese prices??

i'll be ok if it follow the taiwanese prices, as we the distances covered as well as the population are about the same, however if can get those chinese or korean than that will be better (but i highly doubt so)

^^

I doubt we can reach the pricing as in China.

They benefit from economics of scale, as they deploy high speed rail lines in large number.

Also, funding for the high speed rail in China comes from the Chinese government instead of private sector.

^^
then taiwanese it is:)

but maybe we could reduce it further by not using their european train..

lets buy china made one:cheer:

if it takes 2-3 hours to go from downtown to downtown with the cost of 200-300 ringgit, many more customers will opt of rail instead of air...

hell, people now taking 5 hour luxury bus trips at cost of rm100 per seat, i am think half of the passenger willing to pay twice of that if it will take them half the time to get to singapore...

Besides the businessmen, we also got to think of the average tourists la...

For malaysians, our income is 5x less than Sporeans, do u think setting this type of pricing will induce msians to take the HSR? Sporeans probably, but will Msians?

1. Khazanah Nasional Berhad + Temasek
`

You forget EPF with RM400 billion war chest. RM30 billion won't exactly be spare change but better public funding than in private hands IMO!!

Besides the businessmen, we also got to think of the average tourists la...

For malaysians, our income is 5x less than Sporeans, do u think setting this type of pricing will induce msians to take the HSR? Sporeans probably, but will Msians?

However, if one books air ticket during last minute, the price can be between RM 1xx and RM 3xx depending on which airline, that is for one way.

That means, if the HSR is priced between RM 1xx and 2xx, it may still give tough fight against airlines.

Another thing is that frequency of HSR is much higher than airlines.

alah you guys..
price for me is doesn't matter.
time is more precious than money.

by the way i like the new siemens high speed train.380kmph
make it 400kmph dude!
the faster,the better.

3) how to clear customs/immigration at boarder


i think we can use the same principle as we did at the airport.., with custom/immigration counter before check in the train. To have a stop in JB will only cause inconvenience to the users and will cost lot of time.

" Besides the businessmen, we also got to think of the average tourists la...
For malaysians, our income is 5x less than Sporeans, do u think setting this type of pricing will induce msians to take the HSR? Sporeans probably, but will Msians? "

Cmon..., if you can afford to go to SG i dont think there will be a prob for the pricing. The HSR price is nothing compared to their Hotel room rates. :nuts::nuts:

^^

There is one example of international high speed rail service, it is the Eurostar between UK and France.

Maybe Malaysia can learn from them, in terms of arrangements in immigration.

^^

There is one example of international high speed rail service, it is the Eurostar between UK and France.

Maybe Malaysia can learn from them, in terms of arrangements in immigration.

There is minimal immigration and custom checks at the train station before boarding the train at the London end and none at the arriving end in Paris.
But then these are EU countries were there is no customs and very minimal immigration checks between member countries and that only for non EU passport holders. The departure immigration check at London was by French authorities, don't remember if there was UK immigration check.

There is minimal immigration and custom checks at the train station before boarding the train at the London end and none at the arriving end in Paris.
But then these are EU countries were there is no customs and very minimal immigration checks between member countries and that only for non EU passport holders. The departure immigration check at London was by French authorities, don't remember if there was UK immigration check.

uk immigration check is done while on board heading toward london.

i'm just wondering how they want to do it here. singapore immigration/customs check at terminal or border? malaysia immigration check on board while heading back and customs at kl sentral?

2011 Budget to be exciting, says OCBC
Published: 2010/10/12
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/20101012120356/Article/index_html

The 2011 budget promises to be an exciting one, given that, it is the first under the 10th Malaysia Plan(10MP), says OCBC Bank economist Gundy Cahyadi.

He also said that the limelight now seems set to fall on how the authorities are going to start off the New Economic Model (NEM).

In a statement today, Gundy said the economic recovery seen in 2010 has paved the way for further fiscal consolidation by the government, in line with its target to lower the budget deficit to 2.8 per cent of gross domestic product (GDP) by 2015.

"We expect Malaysia to continue seeing its fiscal expenditure ratio staying among the highest in the region, at least in the next couple of years. This is particularly since, the government is likely to frontload, most of its infrastructure expenditure allocated for the 10MP.

"Nonetheless, some sort of fiscal consolidation is likely to be seen, partly as a result of the anticipated increase in oil and gas revenue for the government.

"After hitting seven per cent of GDP in 2009, we expect the fiscal deficit to fall to about 5-5.2 per cent of GDP in 2011, based on our forecast for a 5.4 per cent expansion in headline growth for next year," he added.

According to Gundy, he expects the budget to include special grants and incentives for targeted high-end manufacturing activity, including the green energy sector, and for efforts to boost human capital/technical know-how by way of training or higher education.

"This would spur on economic activity in the high-end manufacturing sector and other sunrise industries. "Meanwhile, the planned fiscal expenditure on the Greater KL MRT and the high-speed rail system is expected to reach about RM50 billion over the next 10 years.

"We expect the government to start rolling out its dough, starting in 2011, although it remains to be seen how much of it will be tabled in the 2010 budget proposal," he explained.

Meanwhile, he said, an implementation of the goods and services tax (GST) system would help to boost the government’s revenue base, but noted that, talks of this has cooled down in recent months.

"We see only a small chance that the GST will be introduced for 2011, as earlier planned," the economist added. Gundy also said it is unlikely that the Economic Transformation Projects (ETP) will be able to bring in a significant increase in returns, especially at their initial stage, since the government seems to also want to focus on bigger-scale projects in 2011.

"We believe that the increase in revenue would come mainly from higher tax receipts, especially petroleum tax receipts," he highlighted.

Additionally, he also expects a higher excise tax to be imposed on cigarettes and tobacco products, although the additional revenue from this front is unlikely to be significant.

On subsidies, Gundy is of the view that the government is not expected to expressly announce any significant removal of subsidies in the Budget 2011 plan, especially with lingering doubts about the sustainability of this year’s economic recovery. -- Bernama

I think the 3 giant cities in SEA should link by HSR,

lets dream the HSR connect Bangkok-Kuala Lumpur-Singapore

in 2011 budget,did najib address about this?

Nope

http://biz.thestar.com.my/archives/2010/9/25/business/b_22greaterKL.jpg

10 EPPs Identified To Deliver On Greater KL
By Zuriati Zulmi September 21, 2010 20:06 PM
http://www.bernama.com.my/bernama/v5/newsindex.php?id=529281

KUALA LUMPUR, Sept 21 (Bernama) -- Building an integrated urban mass rapid transit system linking Singapore via a high-speed rail system and wooing 100 of the world's most dynamic firms are among projects identified to deliver on the Greater Kuala Lumpur under the National Key Economic Area (NKEA).

Revitalising the Klang River into a heritage and commercial district is also among the 10 entry point projects (EPPs) along four dimensions identified to deliver on the Greater Kuala Lumpur under the NKEA.

Growth in Greater KL economic activities will increase total employment from 2.5 million in 2010 to 4.2 million by 2020.

These details were disclosed by members of the laboratory set up by the Performance Management and Delivery Unit (PEMANDU) in the Prime Minister's Department led by Ahmad Suhaili Idrus at the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) Open Day here Tuesday.

The Greater Kuala Lumpur NKEA's vision is to be a city that simultaneously achieves a top-20 ranking in city economic growth while being among the global top-20 most liveable cities by 2020.

Four dimensions to deliver the Greater Kuala Lumpur aspirations are Greater KL as a magnet, Greater KL connect, Greater KL new places and Greater KL enhanced services.

Greater KL EPPs will require a cumulative funding of RM172 billion from 2010 to 2020, 34 per cent of which is expected to come from the public sector.

The other EPPs are greening Greater Kl to ensure residents enjoy sufficient green space, creating a comprehensive pedestrian network, creating iconic places and attractions, developing an efficient solid waste management ecosystem and sewerage-non river.

Greater KL, already on the global map as one of the iconic cities of Southeast Asia, will boast as the world-renowned landmarks such as the Petronas Twin Towers, a unique blend of diverse cultures and heritage, an extensive road network and high quality basic services such as water and electricity.

However, it now faces fierce competition from neighbouring cities in attracting talents and multinational corporations.

Its liveability lags behind many other Asian cities, public transport remains inadequate and many natural assets remain untapped.

The NKEA laboratories involved more than 500 participants from over 200 private sector companies, government ministries, agencies, regulatory bodies and non-governmental organisations.

-- BERNAMA

Budget 2011 to give incentives for private sector participation
By YVONNE TAN and LEONG HUNG YEE Thursday September 30, 2010
http://biz.thestar.com.my/news/story.asp?file=/2010/9/30/business/7130018&sec=business

Commercial viability and profitability critical to success of entry point projects (EPPs)

PETALING JAYA: It’s almost certain that the private sector will be fed with incentives to be spurred to invest in entry point projects (EPPs) under the Government’s Economic Transformation Programme (ETP).

RAM Holdings Bhd group chief economist Dr Yeah Kim Leng said besides the usual fiscal and financial incentives such as tax holidays and double tax deduction, innovative schemes tied to government procurement and export facilitation as well as pre-packaged incentives for specialised skills training and other project-specific requirements could also be considered.

“The ETP provides an excellent opportunity for policymakers to design ‘out-of-the-box’ fiscal and financial incentives to spur value-adding, industrial upgrading, skills transfer-cum-technology deepening as well as business innovation, research and development and entrepreneurship activities,” he said.

A source close to the Government said he believed the Government may give incentives in the form of tax incentives and soft loans to attract the private sector to take up EPPs in order to start the ball rolling under the ETP.

The Government is expected to announce the incentives in Budget 2011 on Oct 15. The Government has identified some 131 EPPs and 60 business opportunities, which is expected to generate 3.3 million jobs in return.

It was announced recently that 92% of the investment for the EPPs is to come from the private sector, with the Government only contributing some 8%.

In other words, the ETP assumes that the private sector will invest some US$410bil (RM1.27 trillion) in EPPs from now till 2020.

Among the high-priority EPPs are the KL Mass Rapid Transit system, investment by electronic and engineering firms in the upstream semiconductor industry in Penang and the development of a “Malaysia Truly Asia” tourist centre in KL.

Key EPPs include the LNG regasification plant in Malacca, the high-speed rail link with Singapore, covered walkways connecting shopping centres in KL, the listing of more government-linked companies (GLCs) and the reduction of government stakes in existing GLCs.

“The critical success factor to ensure take-up of the identified EPPs is commercial viability and profitability for investors.

“However, there is a need to ensure that ‘profits are not privatised and risks socialised’, hence the need for incentives and other forms of government support that ensure sustainability and long term participation of genuine project promoters and investors,” Yeah said.

http://img690.imageshack.us/img690/9711/dsc07014p.jpg

Budget 2011 tu budget kerajaan ...

KL-S’pore high-speed link proposal to be made soon
By RISEN JAYASEELAN
risen@thestar.com.my


PETALING JAYA: A proposal for a high-speed train from Kuala Lumpur to Singapore using the magnetic levitation (maglev) technology will soon be submitted to the Government, industry sources said.

The sources also said the Government would soon appoint an international consulting firm to study the various proposals for the high-speed rail link to Singapore.

The maglev is the train system that links Shanghai’s Pudong airport with its financial district and was the first installation of its kind in the world.

The journey of 30km takes about seven minutes. The maglev train in Shanghai can reach speeds of up to 350km per hour in two minutes, although new generation trains being developed on this technology can go even faster, it is understood.

The maglev proposal will be competing with that of the conventional high-speed rail network, an idea first mooted by the YTL Group. Its technology partner then was said to be Germany’s Siemens, a global expert in high-speed rail technology.

The YTL proposal however did not get the green light, due in part to the high costs involved. But the concept of a high-speed rail link from KL to Singapore recently surfaced again. It was cited as a proposed “high impact” project in the Economic Transformation Programme (ETP) that was unveiled last month.

While there is no indication on costs involved, maglev’s proponents argue that it is a more suitable technology as it requires less maintenance, is safer and faster. The maglev system uses more electronics and essentially involves “non-contact electromagnetic levitation”. It has been operational for the last eight years in Shanghai and carried more than 20 million passengers without any accident.

“The technology is mature and commercially tested. Malaysia is in the market for alternative railway technology and could be the catalyst for maglev on the global map,” said a party familiar with the proposal.

According to maglev’s proponents, the technology has yet to take off in a big way in Europe where there is a wide rail network of conventional train systems.

“The huge existing track network of those countries, and parties that represent those vested interests, continue to support the 150-year-old wheel-steel technology,” said a source, adding that the conventional train technology had its limitations.

“The enormous weight of conventional trains is borne by its wheels.

“This requires precise routine maintenance, which is costly and requires tremendous skill and labour, which is not necessary in maglev trains, which are highly automated and do not even use wheels,” the source added.

Would love to see maglev trains running in Malaysia:D

Kenapa berita pasal HSR di Malaysia not mention to HSR for Singapore-Kunming project atau future connection to the mainland China langsung...projek HSR di Thailand terus ke Laos akan connect to China..source dari berikutnya always talk dia akan connect hinga sampai Singapore which that means ia akan lalu Malaysia ?!

Kalau nak ambik maglev teknologi maknanya ia tak de mengena ngn future connection to the mainland China atau pun mereka nak buat HSR line yg lain pulak ??!

http://b.imagehost.org/0395/bullet20to20singapore.jpg

Ok, I would be totally happy with conventional HSR. But if THIS happens, not only travels, but commute between the 2 cities (and anywhere in between) can be possible without effort

HSR is going to span from KL to Singapore, I think there will be one stop in Johor Bahru before head to Singapore. So, the immigration check of both countries can be done in Johor Bahru instead of Malaysian one in JB, while Singaporean in Woodlands, this make 1 stop for immigration instead of 2 stops.

HSR connecting 2 cities can't make much profit since this 2 cities total population is only about 13 million and most of them are in middle-low income, can't afford HSR which travel cost is high. So, 3 more stops between could boost the income.

I think the 3 more stops should be, Seremban, Ayer Keroh, Johor Bahru. There are quite numbers of Singaporeans choose Malacca as tourist destination because it is close to Singapore, so the demand will stand high during holiday seasons. While if the KL-Seremban travel cost is only 12-15 ringgit, it will be a strong competitor with SKS bus and KTM Komuter. And this do increase the influence of KL and make Seremban the next satelite city of KL. While now, more or less it is already a satelite city of KL.

For me, I personally don't support for Maglev because of high operational cost, and such technology is not stable yet. We should let those rich and advanced countries as guinea-pig instead of us being a guinea-pig for them.

HSR is going to span from KL to Singapore, I think there will be one stop in Johor Bahru before head to Singapore. So, the immigration check of both countries can be done in Johor Bahru instead of Malaysian one in JB, while Singaporean in Woodlands, this make 1 stop for immigration instead of 2 stops.

I believe the customs for both countries should be done in the terminus in Singapore (somewhere in CBD would be best).

Why? Because there would be no further stops in Singapore, the next one would already be abroad in Malaysia. So a one-stop immigration for both countries in the same place would be the most practical and comfortable.

I can't wait to hear an announcement like: "Next station, Marina Bay Interchange. Passengers who are continuing their journey on the Circle Line, Thomson Line and the KL Maglev, please alight" :lol:

I think the best for Maglev HSR is point-to-point like your aircraft.

To keep the cost low and efficiency, dont stop here n there.

The immigration should be KL Sentral and you come out at Marina Bay (plenty of land there to build new station). Vice versa.

In terms of business, the best route would be connecting the heart of city for both countries like this: KLCC - Raffles Place...


12.00PM at KLCC, you'll hear

"Next station, Raffles Place. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Singapore, please align"

2.30PM at Raffles Place, you'll hear

"Next station, KLCC. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Kuala Lumpur, please align"


The economic potential is tremendous....................

^^

Information on the HSR is now available on Pemandu website. It is interesting.

I am sure it will improve, and strengthen Klang Valley's (KL) competitiveness.

patchay, Raffles Place is too densely build up at this moment. Marina Bay is more likely as its yet sparsely developed and IMO, areas ranging from Bugis to Tanjong Pagar would also work out.

In KL, I suppose KL Sentral would be good enough due to its nodal character. Would be pretty easy to transfer to KTM and LRT, I'm not too sure about the MRT proposal.

Beside, to improve catchment, the line would need to have at least few stops. I suppose the realistic option is KL -> Seramban -> Melaka -> JB (OR Nusajaya) -> Sg. Obviously, there would be 2 or more classes of trains, likewise in Shinkansen network. One would go straight between the terminals and another type would stop at all stations. :yes:

I think the best for Maglev HSR is point-to-point like your aircraft.

To keep the cost low and efficiency, dont stop here n there.

The immigration should be KL Sentral and you come out at Marina Bay (plenty of land there to build new station). Vice versa.

In terms of business, the best route would be connecting the heart of city for both countries like this: KLCC - Raffles Place...


12.00PM at KLCC, you'll hear

"Next station, Raffles Place. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Singapore, please align"

2.30PM at Raffles Place, you'll hear

"Next station, KLCC. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Kuala Lumpur, please align"


The economic potential is tremendous....................

:cheers:Yupps right on the money thats the whole idea in first place!Potentially in the future bangkok,saigon onwards to china:cheers:

^^

Information on the HSR is now available on Pemandu website. It is interesting.

I am sure it will improve, and strengthen Klang Valley's (KL) competitiveness.

REALLY INTERESTING!!! (page 17+) :cheers:
http://www.pemandu.gov.my/pdf/chapter5.pdf
More infos : http://www.pemandu.gov.my/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=699&Itemid=133&lang=en
If cabinet decision on HSR system in 2011 is OK...construction of HSR system likely to begin in 2012 and will operation in 2017!! (subject to decision to proceed) !!!

NOTE: The project is estimated to cost RM16.5 billion.

I think the best for Maglev HSR is point-to-point like your aircraft.

To keep the cost low and efficiency, dont stop here n there.

The immigration should be KL Sentral and you come out at Marina Bay (plenty of land there to build new station). Vice versa.

In terms of business, the best route would be connecting the heart of city for both countries like this: KLCC - Raffles Place...


12.00PM at KLCC, you'll hear

"Next station, Raffles Place. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Singapore, please align"

2.30PM at Raffles Place, you'll hear

"Next station, KLCC. Passengers who are continuing their journey in Kuala Lumpur, please align"


The economic potential is tremendous....................

wa....like3333!!!

i think china made meglev is gonna cost as much as those conventional european high speed train..

lets buy that...1st international customer maa, china most likely included tons of free goodies..discount,soft loan and all...:)

if and HSR is point-to-point connecting 2 cities, the main problem is how many passengers able to be allocated? Demand of high speed commuting between KL to Singapore is not enough to sustain the HSR, if it is enough, then have service that have direct service from KL to Singapore, but with trains stop in stations between, increase profitablity. And what I suggest is the place that have high population and tourist spots.

Example:
TAIWAN HSR
The HSR between Taipei to Kaohsiung (Zuoying) consists 8 stations, in Taipei (km 5.9) Banchiao (13.1), Taoyuan (42.3), Hsinchu (72.2), Taichung (165.7), Chiayi (251.6), Tainan (313.9), Zuoying (345.2). With new stations proposed: Miaoli (104.9), Changhua (193.9), Yunlin (218.5).

TOKAIDO SHINKANSEN
The Tokaido Shinkansen between Tokyo and Shin-Osaka consists 17 stations, in Tokyo (km 0.0), Shinagawa (6.8), Shin-Yokohama (25.5), Odawara (76.7), Atami (95.4), Mishima (111.3), Shin-Fuji (135.0), Shizuoka (167.4), Kakegawa (211.3), Hammamatsu (238.9), Toyohashi (274.2), Mikawa-Anjou (312.8), Nagoya (342.0), Gifu-Hashima (367.1), Maibara (408.2), Kyoto (513.6), Osaka (552.6).

This line with Kodama service stops in all stations (2 trains per day)
Nozomi stops only 6 stations (9 trains per day, 3 trains to Hakata, Kitakyushu via thru service in Sanyo Shinkansen and Kyushu Shinkansen; 1 to Hiroshima via thru service in Sanyo Shinkansen)
Hikari stops only 8 stations, 2 or 3 stations stops occasionally (2 trains per day, 1 train to Okayama via thru service in Sanyo Shinkansen).

I think MHSR should build stations (approx. mileage) in Seremban (65), Ayer Keroh (125), Johor Bahru (375), Singapore [Marina Bay] (400). Johor Bahru station is connected by JB Metro, Ayer Keroh is connected by Melaka Monorail. This do boosts tourism in Melaka. We should have some trains stop all stations, some trains dedicated for KL-Singapore point to point.

The reason of I would like JB as immigration center is historical concern: in 1990 POA, immigration facility in Singapore have to move to Woodlands because of illegal immigrant concern of Singaporean government. The fact is, Singaporeans are very "kiasi" (afraid to die). Unless the kiasi Singaporean government would let the KL-Singapore HSR to have immigration facility in Singapore, which I think is the best location, if not, we have no option but one-stop immigration facility in JB instead of 2 that Malaysian in JB, Singaporean in Woodlands. Or the HSR just stop in JB and it is connected to Singapore by their MRT. I think both Malaysian and Singaporean immigration facility should be together in 1 station. Another solution is Malaysia and Singapore reach customs union that passport is not required in commuting and border control is removed.

^^ if they are kiasi,they will likely wanted a joint immigration facility INSIDE singapore, like the MRT JB extension...with the track are build underground,if its above ground, they will likely not agreed to it, or bobwired it 2-3 lapis...


its not just med size town le, small town can get a station as well, kluang,tangkak,tampin,labis,yong peng,ayer itam.

.they can even have,point to point,express,transit and kommuter type of services..

if and HSR is point-to-point connecting 2 cities, the main problem is how many passengers able to be allocated? Demand of high speed commuting between KL to Singapore is not enough to sustain the HSR, if it is enough, then have service that have direct service from KL to Singapore, but with trains stop in stations between, increase profitablity. And what I suggest is the place that have high population and tourist spots.


For sure, they will have different services with different stopping pattern.

For example, Tokaido/Sanyo has Kodama (slowest and stops at every stations), Hikari (intermediate) and Nozomi (the fastest and stops at only major stations).

Lets see...

My opinion is that...

For KL-Singapore direct service, they can have separate platform in KL, and have immigration counters in KL and SG for that service.

Limiting it to JB, and having to take MRT to Singapore (as you say) defeats the point of this project, because taking MRT from JB to centre of Singapore will take quite a while. The benefit of taking HSR, first and foremost is connecting of one city centre to another city centre.

Kereta api laju KL-Singapura dikaji
Oleh WAN NAJIB WAN DAUD
http://www.utusan.com.my/utusan/info.asp?y=2010&dt=1026&pub=Utusan_Malaysia&sec=Ekonomi&pg=ek_01.htm

KUALA LUMPUR 25 Okt. – Projek perkhidmatan kereta api laju antara Kuala Lumpur dan Singapura yang merupakan sebahagian daripada Program Transformasi Ekonomi (ETP) melalui Inisiatif Pembiayaan Swasta (PFI) masih dalam peringkat kajian sebelum ia dibawa ke Majlis Ekonomi Negara.

Menteri di Jabatan Perdana Menteri, Datuk Seri Idris Jala berkata, ia kemudiannya akan diputusan oleh Kabinet.

“Kita menjangkakan keputusan sama ada ia sesuai atau tidak dibina bergantung kepada keputusan Kabinet yang mana ia mungkin diputuskan selepas bulan Februari atau Mac,” katanya.

Beliau berkata demikian kepada pemberita selepas majlis pelancaran buku ETP yang disempurnakankan oleh Perdana Menteri, Datuk Seri Najib Tun Razak di sini hari ini.

Selain itu, menurut Idris, keputusan untuk kereta api diteruskan sehingga ke Singapura atau berhenti di Johor Bahru juga akan diputuskan oleh jemaah menteri kelak.

Mengulas lanjut katanya, dalam menuju ke arah negara maju menjelang tahun 2020, kerajaan telah mencadangkan projek bernilai RM1.2 trilion bagi dibangunkan dalam tempoh 10 tahun akan datang.

Beliau berkata, pembabitan kerajaan hanya lapan peratus daripada pelaburan yang diperlukan itu dan kerajaan perlu menyediakan insentif pelaburan.

“Selebihnya swasta akan memainkan peranan di dalam pelaburan tersebut,” katanya.

Idris berkata, berdasarkan pemantauan kerajaan, hampir 45 peratus daripada jumlah pelaburan sebanyak AS$97 bilion (RM300.7 bilion) yang mewakili 53 Projek Penempatan Pekerjaan (EPP).

Antara EPP yang telah pun bermula ujarnya ialah pelaburan permulaan berjumlah RM214 juta daripada RM1.9 bilion oleh LFoundry untuk membina kemudahan fabrikasi wafer di Taman Teknologi Kulim, Kedah.

Then i hope najib can negotiate well with Singaporean side. I think KL-Singapore should have 1 immigration checkpoint only, in Singapore.

And I hope the fares are not exceeding RM 149 for KL-Singapore route. Taipei-Zuoying (Kaohsiung) length is 342km, which its travelling cost is 1490NTD for Economy Class, 2440 for Business Class.

Then i hope najib can negotiate well with Singaporean side. I think KL-Singapore should have 1 immigration checkpoint only, in Singapore.

And I hope the fares are not exceeding RM 149 for KL-Singapore route. Taipei-Zuoying (Kaohsiung) length is 342km, which its travelling cost is 1490NTD for Economy Class, 2440 for Business Class.

I think RM 100 to RM 200 should be okay.

Think of the benefits such as more frequent than airlines, faster and of course, depart/arrive in city centre.

Most importantly, having wireless internet access is very crucial to attract people to take HSR.

@project aliciel,

I think there are little worries about the demand. There are countless flights, car rides and bus services between the 2 cities and they are sustainable financially. Also, thanks to faster and hassle free access using the HSR, more demand would be actually generated. Not only locals in both cities would likely travel more, also tourists would possibly link Singapore and Kuala Lumpur into one trip, what was previously way more troublesome. Intermediate cities would experience organic growth due to easy access.

Regarding the customs, Singapore government was worried about the illegal entry through the KTM previously, but lets be realistic. KTM tracks are uncontrolled and only allowing slow speeds (and the trains slow down even more before Bukit Timah station and Tanjong Pagar Terminal). It was possible for someone to simply jump off the train before/after custom check. A tunnel with CCTVs would make it impossible, so I'm pretty sure single checkpoint would be feasible :yes:

I am as excited as the early bird... haha.... kuku... kuku.... BOLEH :)

already make comparison with shanghai maglev:LENGTH:30km ,FARE SINGLE TRIP:RM23.++.

so,distance KL-SPORE is roughly 300km ---->fare more/less would be RM230

conclusion:i would rather use LCC

The high speed train will make most of its revenue from business travellers. Not from leisure travellers like you and me.

Do U think Datok Tony will NOT object to this project? What about Proton Saga? If this project materialized, it will create a stiff competition to the budget airline and cars

Do U think Datok Tony will NOT object to this project? What about Proton Saga? If this project materialized, it will create a stiff competition to the budget airline and cars

The government already initiated double tracking project to the north, hence i don't think it is an issue.

Do U think Datok Tony will NOT object to this project? What about Proton Saga? If this project materialized, it will create a stiff competition to the budget airline and cars

What kind of comment is this?

Then we can always argue, why didn't Malaysia Airlines (owned by the Govt) object to the idea of having Air Asia flying out of its base? Isn't that a stiff competition to the national carrier?

And why now Datok Tony will object to the idea of having a competitor to his business when he in the first place did that to other?

@project aliciel,

I think there are little worries about the demand. There are countless flights, car rides and bus services between the 2 cities and they are sustainable financially. Also, thanks to faster and hassle free access using the HSR, more demand would be actually generated. Not only locals in both cities would likely travel more, also tourists would possibly link Singapore and Kuala Lumpur into one trip, what was previously way more troublesome. Intermediate cities would experience organic growth due to easy access.



So I think, these stations should be included in this line:
KL Sentral
Seremban
Ayer Keroh (Malacca)
Johor Bahru
Singapore (Marina Bay)

KL-Singapore direct train service (like Nozomi of Shinkansen), 70% of the trains. [Limited Express]
KL-Singapore all station stopped (like Kodama of Shinkansen), 30% of the trains. [Express]

If the line extend longer to Butterworth, it should add one more type service which stop only major towns (like Hikari of Shinkansen). The rapid transit line connecting Ayer Keroh to Malacca city center should be ready before Ayer Keroh station in use.

What kind of comment is this?

Then we can always argue, why didn't Malaysia Airlines (owned by the Govt) object to the idea of having Air Asia flying out of its base? Isn't that a stiff competition to the national carrier?

And why now Datok Tony will object to the idea of having a competitor to his business when he in the first place did that to other?

At the end of the day, the government implements double tracking up to north (including Penang) which is one of the largest urban area in Malaysia.

According to the display on ETP during the open day, they noted that it had opposition from airlines in 2007. However, the current scenario is different due to open skies policy.

if and HSR is point-to-point connecting 2 cities, the main problem is how many passengers able to be allocated? Demand of high speed commuting between KL to Singapore is not enough to sustain the HSR, if it is enough, then have service that have direct service from KL to Singapore, but with trains stop in stations between, increase profitablity.

@project aliciel,
I think there are little worries about the demand. There are countless flights, car rides and bus services between the 2 cities and they are sustainable financially. Also, thanks to faster and hassle free access using the HSR, more demand would be actually generated. Not only locals in both cities would likely travel more, also tourists would possibly link Singapore and Kuala Lumpur into one trip, what was previously way more troublesome.

The high speed train will make most of its revenue from business travellers. Not from leisure travellers like you and me.


The main purpose of this HSR is to connect KL and create economic impact for both countries.

There is a VERY HUGE demand for travelling to Singapore. In wonder, flights between Changi and KL is one of the busiest in Asia. Do you know how many Malaysians work, study, live and do business in Singapore? My neighbours have all their kids studying in Singapore high school. Do you know how many ordinary Singaporeans want to come to KL?

If there's HSR direct to KL City, guess I would probably be travelling to Singapore and vice versa every week! My sister and her kids would be to visit me in KL every week too. The problem now is most time can't get affordable price to Singapore on short notice. And the LCCT is freaking far. And busses way too long and wasting time.

My 2 cents



Do U think Datok Tony will NOT object to this project? What about Proton Saga? If this project materialized, it will create a stiff competition to the budget airline and cars

We need entrepreneurs like Dato Tony to run our privatised transportation services such as KTM, LRT, MRT, express buses, etc.....

The main purpose of this HSR is to connect KL and create economic impact for both countries.

There is a VERY HUGE demand for travelling to Singapore. In wonder, flights between Changi and KL is one of the busiest in Asia. Do you know how many Malaysians work, study, live and do business in Singapore? My neighbours have all their kids studying in Singapore high school. Do you know how many ordinary Singaporeans want to come to KL?



According to the ETP roadmap, 9.2 million trips were made between Klang Valley and Singapore every year. That figure of course do not include trips between other Malaysia town/cities such as Seremban, Melaka and Johor Bahru (well, people of JB most likely take HSR to KL).

I believe with the HSR, the figure will see further rise, as HSR capacity opens up new possibilities.

The only thing is, they need to have proper supporting public transport around HSR stations to maximise the potential.

More people will fly via KLIA, especially those living in Malaysian towns and cities, as HSR has a station in KLIA. Airlines can take this opportunity to join in HSR as well.

Bros, relaks.

What ever the talk is about, tak mungkin the high speed rail, shinkansen ke, maglev ke, be built. COme on, can't u guys see that this is an election gimmick? There are thousands of places that the money can be invested more wisely, do u think some leisurely trips between Spore and KL can sustain the project?

^^^ i dont find anything wrong with being optimist and hoping something that might not be true.. let just put the political agenda aside as talk more about the topic been posted... i dont say that u r wrong but u know from 'forum'ing u can learn lots of thing.. why not we just continue with the dicussion...

my 1 cent

i am really looking forward for this project...-fingercross-

-deleted-

Bros, relaks.

What ever the talk is about, tak mungkin the high speed rail, shinkansen ke, maglev ke, be built. COme on, can't u guys see that this is an election gimmick? There are thousands of places that the money can be invested more wisely, do u think some leisurely trips between Spore and KL can sustain the project?

no wonder lah,i thought kl-sg flight were full of bussinesman,ruper rupernya just klites going to sg casin,while singaporean go to genting:lol:

..even KL-sg journey,which is one of asia busies can't even support a HSR line..that why country like korea,japan,china,taiwan are without HSR:nuts:..coz no people maa:)..

care to give any example of the thousand of places where money could be spend that give better yield than this one:lol:

On the fast track
By Sharen Kaur Published: 2010/10/28
http://www.btimes.com.my/Current_News/BTIMES/articles/TRAIN27f/Article/index_html

http://www.btimes.com.my/articles/TRAIN27f/pix_topright

Several companies made presentations to the National Key Economic Area (NKEA) lab about three months ago on the Kuala Lumpur-Singapore high-speed train project, industry sources say.

Among them were YTL Corp Bhd and Hartasuma Sdn Bhd (4677), which was said to be partnering a Chinese state-owned firm.

Hartasuma, a Class "A" Bumiputera contractor, is a member of Ara Group, founded by Datuk Aisamar Kadil Mydin Syed Marikiah and Tan Sri Ravindran Menon, director and executive director of Subang SkyPark Sdn Bhd respectively.

Its track record includes repair and overhaul of passenger coaches for KTM Bhd and civil works (Kuala Kubu Baru-Tanjung Malim Halt) for the Rawang-Ipoh electrified double tracks.

Business Times understands that some of the companies have proposed to undertake the high-speed rail project for between RM8 billion and RM14 billion.
A government source said the project could be worth RM10 billion to RM12 billion and that it would take five to eight years to complete as it will cover 300km.

The source said that cost would depend on the type of technology deployed, whether it is magnetic levitation (maglev) or conventional, and how the tracks are aligned.

Maglev will cost more than conventional, but requires less maintenance, is safer and faster. The system also uses more electronics and essentially involves "non-contact electromagnetic levitation".

"If the alignment is built along the coastal road, then it would involve a lot of land acquisition and this would add to the cost," he said.

The source added that the project would depend on a study by the Treasury, the Performance and Delivery Unit (Pemandu) and other government agencies.

It is believed that Pemandu, which is leading the NKEA lab, has invited officials from the Ministry of Transport, the Land Public Transport Commission (Spad) and City Hall to attend briefings held separately by the companies.

The high-speed train project was mooted by YTL in 2006. It had proposed to undertake the project for RM9 billion, partnering Germany's Siemens, a global expert in high-speed rail technology.

The YTL proposal, however, was shot down because of the high cost involved.

Malaysia is mulling over a high-speed rail linking Kuala Lumpur and Singapore that will cut travel time between the two cities to 90 minutes.

Plans would require the approval of Singapore, which has expressed its interest in the project. However, the government has not given a firm approval, the source said.

---------
Berita ni tak de apa yg baru..ia hanya cerita pasal dulu2 saja...

I think Malaysia with a few of population and divided between peninsular and east malaysia,the HSR service covered only KL-Spore definitely it is hard to support a High Speed railway to profit.

Approx. 350Km Taiwan High Speed Rail,serviced over 10 million people, recorded with hugh loss so far n how we can claim this will returned good benefit to this nation n the people.

To those liberals who is blind nationalistic that really want this project,i want to ask question,who do u think will pay all this loss if one day our HSR is losing money?our kids?the taxpayers?

i think i need to start a Facebook group that againts this soon-making-loss-HSR KL Spore..

To those liberals who is blind nationalistic that really want this project,i want to ask question,who do u think will pay all this loss if one day our HSR is losing money?our kids?the taxpayers?

i think i need to start a Facebook group that againts this soon-making-loss-HSR KL Spore..

To apply the same logic - Malaysia Airlines was a losing money entity. Does it mean that we don't need to have a national carrier? The airlines itself might be a losing entity. But the spill over effect to local economy that it brought is tremendous.

You have to factor all those in. Don't close your mind and focus on one subject only. Leaders have to look in broader perspective.

Do U think Datok Tony will NOT object to this project? What about Proton Saga? If this project materialized, it will create a stiff competition to the budget airline and cars

I dun think Dato Tony will object this project :)
But will take it as a challenge... He will not surrender so easily, he probably will have another new and better idea to attract more customers :)