They're being "evicted"....

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100301/LOCAL18/3010324/City-evicts-those-living-beneath-rail-overpass

Well, at least we know what the Ivy Tech "multimodal transit center" is going to look like now.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100301/NEWS04/3010377/Ivy-Tech-gets-rolling-on-new-parking-library

Well, at least we know what the Ivy Tech "multimodal transit center" is going to look like now.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100301/NEWS04/3010377/Ivy-Tech-gets-rolling-on-new-parking-library

woo hoo! concrete parking garage-chic!

woo hoo! concrete parking garage-chic!

I love the canopy with the big hole in it.

A Massachusetts Avenue project announced two years ago is zeroing in on financing but will face some opposition over the amount of parking the plan calls for when it seeks city approval next month.

Trail Side on Mass Ave would include 69 one-bedroom apartments and about 23,000 square feet of ground-level retail space in a four-story building. The project is proposed for a site at 875 Massachusetts Ave. now occupied by a building owned by the Center Township Trustee.

Trail Side, designed by the local architectural firm A2SO4, would feature units of between 600 and 700 square feet. They would rent to tenants with incomes that range between 30 percent and 60 percent of the median income. Rents would range from $325 to around $700.

Tom Battista, a long-time property owner in the 800 block of Massachusetts Avenue, objects to the project because he said it doesn’t include enough parking to satisfy demand.

“I think it would economically jeopardize the other businesses in the area for lack of parking,” said Battista, whose commercial building across the street houses R Bistro restaurant and a number of other merchants.

Battista said more than 40 people work in the businesses that occupy the 9,300 square feet of retail space in his building. Those employees and customers of the businesses only have access to angled parking spaces on Massachusetts Ave.

Trail Side, theoretically, would attract even more employees and customers to its considerably larger retail space. Add in the 69 apartments and parking plans for the project are inadequate, said Battista, who said he will oppose Trail Side unless it significantly increases the number of parking spaces in the plan. --From IBJ (http://www.ibj.com/rew-lead-story-template/PARAMS/article/18416)

Okay...let me wrap my head around this. A building owner who has NO parking on his site currently relies on the PUBLIC parking along Mass Ave for his tenants, their employees, and customers. This same building owner apparently has the "I got here first" argument going: his development can use the public parking, but the new development by Riley can't.

So another neighboring property owner is objecting to the low-to-moderate income development plans of Riley on the convenient (and this time, very weak) grounds that there isn't enough parking. Sound familiar?

Do business owners not see the benefit of having RESIDENTS directly across the street? Ask the owners who have plenty of patrons down Mass Ave where there is residential all over how they feel about the lack of parking?

So another neighboring property owner is objecting to the low-to-moderate income development plans of Riley on the convenient (and this time, very weak) grounds that there isn't enough parking. Sound familiar?

My brain is hurting. Make it stop.

This hurts because I know Tom and consider him a pretty good guy most of the time. He and my wife are pretty good friends from her days of working down on the avenue. He must see the value in this place going forward...

This hurts because I know Tom and consider him a pretty good guy most of the time. He and my wife are pretty good friends from her days of working down on the avenue. He must see the value in this place going forward...

I don't think it's really about parking or customers.

R Bistro and Best Chocolate in Town probably aren't going to make regular customers of folks whose salaries are 30-60% of AMI. So I think their landlord is fairly safe in imagining that the development wouldn't provide a lot of business to his tenants.

But the development might be a place where some of the employees would want to live.

When upper-middle-class building and business owners start realizing that the very real people who work in their places are low-to-moderate income (and not the dreaded "those people"), then maybe they can accept the need for developments like this in their neighborhoods and wish the developers well.

I agree with what yo uare saying cdc. These are the tough decisions that as a city need to be overcome to move forward.

Isn't Tom Battista on the board of Riley CDC?

Isn't Tom Battista on the board of Riley CDC?

He's one of the 25 directors listed on the website (http://www.rileyarea.org/boardmembers.htm). However, the webpage doesn't give a date, so it's difficult to tell if the list is current. In small cdc's, updating the webpage is often a low priority...:)

Sounds like a great location for someone to do a parking garage development with ground floor commercial space. Go ahead and build the density and the private sector will realize the business opportunity of building vertical parking in the area that can be leased to multiple surrounding projects.

Sounds like a great location for someone to do a parking garage development with ground floor commercial space. Go ahead and build the density and the private sector will realize the business opportunity of building vertical parking in the area that can be leased to multiple surrounding projects.


That's just crazy talk

That's just crazy talk

:lol:

If TIFs didn't have such a bad reputation in Indy, that would be the perfect financing mechanism for a parking garage project near Mass Ave.

In reality, I think everyone on the east end of Mass Ave is kind of waiting on the old Coca-Cola plant situation to be resolved.

What IS the coca-cola plant situation? I dont know what the story is on the place except that it takes up a lot of space that shouldnt be used for bus parking

What IS the coca-cola plant situation? I dont know what the story is on the place except that it takes up a lot of space that shouldnt be used for bus parking

Conceptually, I think IPS would get out of there, but they don't have the cash to build their own new facility. (That is true of two other near-downtown historic properties of theirs: their maintenance function is along the Monon south of 16th and it includes an historically significant dairy site, and their warehouse is on Washington just west of Oriental in a former industrial site.)

There are legal requirements around the disposition of school property, and I don't know if it would be possible for them to do a "swap" with a developer who could build them a new bus depot elsewhere. Even then...a new bus depot wouldn't be cheap, so a developer's basis in the property would be pretty high. Entitlements and planning on that site would take a long time because of the historic significance of the building. And the real estate market would have to be a whole lot better to absorb the amount of relatively high-cost residential or commercial space that could be developed there.

That's a long way of saying that it's just stuck where it is for now and it's going to take a focused effort to move things forward. One might expect the Cultural Trail to provide extra impetus, but that hasn't worked for Market Square yet.

Graffiti writer Choke arrested:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100303/NEWS02/100303026/-1/frontpagecities22/%E2%80%9CChoke%E2%80%9D-graffiti-artist-arrested-in-Indy

Graffiti writer Choke arrested:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100303/NEWS02/100303026/-1/frontpagecities22/%E2%80%9CChoke%E2%80%9D-graffiti-artist-arrested-in-Indy

Dude's got some balls.

Dude's got some balls.

Dude's a dumbass for missing a court date last week. Dude's got serious legal issues now.

That's just crazy talk

I know, living on the edge.:nuts:

Dow Agro to add 550 jobs in Indy. :-)

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100304/NEWS/100304021/Dow-Agro-to-add-550-jobs-in-Indianapolis

^^

And IBJ's take:

http://www.ibj.com/dow-agrosciences-reveals-340-million-expansion/PARAMS/article/18479

“I think it would economically jeopardize the other businesses in the area for lack of parking,” said Battista, whose commercial building across the street houses R Bistro restaurant and a number of other merchants.


When R Bistro first opened, they put signs in front of the street parking spaces in front of the restaurant, asking people to save the spaces for their customers! For that reason I have never been and will never go there.

When R Bistro first opened, they put signs in front of the street parking spaces in front of the restaurant, asking people to save the spaces for their customers! For that reason I have never been and will never go there.
I'm sorry, but that is truly sad. R Bistro is one of the finest restaurants Indianapolis has to offer. They don't do this anymore (the parking signs) so I'd let it go and give 'em a chance.

flavius, you could have parked somewhere and walked there just to make a point. I agree with Chris, the food and experience there is pretty nice.

But the development might be a place where some of the employees would want to live.

When upper-middle-class building and business owners start realizing that the very real people who work in their places are low-to-moderate income (and not the dreaded "those people"), then maybe they can accept the need for developments like this in their neighborhoods and wish the developers well.

I want you to be right about this.

But are hospitality employees (such as the servers at R Bistro) necessarily 30-60% AMI in the nation's most affordable large city? If this were a place like Boston, I'd have no doubt you're right.

But Indy? I worked in the hospitality industry briefly several years ago on the south side, and I'd venture to say that no one I worked with qualified for affordable housing. They often talk about the tips they'd make (they'd make far more than me b/c they were better servers than I was) and I could assure you that they wouldn't qualify if they averaged those wages for a 35+ hour job each week.

In states like New Jersey, public sector employees with college degrees qualify for affordable housing because everywhere is expensive. Obviously Indiana's housing market is nowhere close to this.

Have things changed in the past few years for Indy, or would AMI for downtown apply differently than they would on the south side?

I want you to be right about this.

But are hospitality employees (such as the servers at R Bistro) necessarily 30-60% AMI in the nation's most affordable large city? If this were a place like Boston, I'd have no doubt you're right.

But Indy? I worked in the hospitality industry briefly several years ago on the south side, and I'd venture to say that no one I worked with qualified for affordable housing. They often talk about the tips they'd make (they'd make far more than me b/c they were better servers than I was) and I could assure you that they wouldn't qualify if they averaged those wages for a 35+ hour job each week.

In states like New Jersey, public sector employees with college degrees qualify for affordable housing because everywhere is expensive. Obviously Indiana's housing market is nowhere close to this.

Have things changed in the past few years for Indy, or would AMI for downtown apply differently than they would on the south side?
I'm not sure where you find a full chart of these numbers, but based on a query I made a while back, the one data point I can provide for Marion County is 60% of AMI for a family of 3 is $36,700. 60% of AMI for one person would be quite a bit lower. Based on R Bistro's price point (and the tips that generates) I'm pretty sure you're right that none of their servers would qualify as low income.

I'm not sure where you find a full chart of these numbers, but based on a query I made a while back, the one data point I can provide for Marion County is 60% of AMI for a family of 3 is $36,700. 60% of AMI for one person would be quite a bit lower. Based on R Bistro's price point (and the tips that generates) I'm pretty sure you're right that none of their servers would qualify as low income.

AMI only deals with income, not housing expenditure, so housing affordability isn't a factor. The AMI numbers are buried somewhere in the HUD website; for simplicity, here they are.

%AMI = 1 person...2 people

30% = 14,300...16,350 )
60% = 28,620...32,700 ) 30-60% is target range for Trailside

80% = 38,150...43,600 (max for affordable housing)

100% = 47,700...54,500

28,620/year is about $550/week, which is over $15/hour for 35 hours a week. 38,150 is $733/week, or about $21/hour for 35 hours. Two people could be one wage-earner and one student, or a single working parent with a minor child.

Dow Agro to add 550 jobs in Indy. :-)

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100304/NEWS/100304021/Dow-Agro-to-add-550-jobs-in-Indianapolis

w00t!

But Indy? I worked in the hospitality industry briefly several years ago on the south side, and I'd venture to say that no one I worked with qualified for affordable housing. They often talk about the tips they'd make (they'd make far more than me b/c they were better servers than I was) and I could assure you that they wouldn't qualify if they averaged those wages for a 35+ hour job each week

All of my server / bartender friends make great money. I wish I had the patience for the general public.

when I was in school, I worked at Palomino about 20-25 hours a week. I brought home around $500-600 per week. That's a pretty good job and offered me the opportunity to live in a relatively nice apartment (with a roommate) and to travel quite a bit. I would say that most professional service industry folks that rely on tips downtown do as well as I did.

More info about the Dow Agro jobs:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100305/BUSINESS/3050336/-1/ARCHIVE/Dow-AgroSciences-to-invest-340M-add-nearly-600-jobs-in-next-5-years

I was just listening to Mayor Ballard's monthly interview with Abdul. They briefly discussed TIFs/abatements.

Some passing comments from Ballard caught my ear:

"We're better stewards of that abatement dollar than in the past... We're getting more jobs. When we got in there, we said it was for jobs... abatements, if we're going to do abatements, you'd better be bringing jobs to us, that's it. There's possibly one exception that we do this to create some sort of a development downtown in a particular area. That might be an exception, we'll see, we're not there yet."

Any thoughts on what he's talking about?

Market Square Arena comes to mind, The Transit Center, maybe Barton Tower area? Any other ideas?

Why have planners and such slept for so long on the downtown transit center idea? Its been on the table for quite some time.

Just looking at the recent swirl around indyconnect one gets the sense that it could probably be re-examined. Indygo had a whole study on their page locating in post office area on south street, but why hasnt anything happened?

I havent been around long enough to know why, which is why I ask.

I went by the Ball State downtown location the other day, and I noticed they were cooking up (http://www.nd20.org/2010/03/east-washington-street-2-0/) some cool ideas for East Washington Street.

FYI: Wanted to let you know that I'm giving the keynote address at the IndyPartnership annual meeting. Be sure to send any suggested content my way!

http://www.indypartnership.com/annualmeeting2010.aspx

My theme is going to be reasons why Indianapolis is the best!

Why have planners and such slept for so long on the downtown transit center idea? Its been on the table for quite some time.

Just looking at the recent swirl around indyconnect one gets the sense that it could probably be re-examined. Indygo had a whole study on their page locating in post office area on south street, but why hasnt anything happened?

I havent been around long enough to know why, which is why I ask.

Typically, I think it helps to have significant transit in order to have a successful transit center. Perhaps if IndyConnect actually results in a funded plan to improve transit, then the transit center idea would get some more traction. I would suggest that you need 4 or more transit centers downtown to put most major destinations within a short walk.

I went by the Ball State downtown location the other day, and I noticed they were cooking up (http://www.nd20.org/2010/03/east-washington-street-2-0/) some cool ideas for East Washington Street.

Didnt want you to go un-noticed here Kevin. That was a really good link. Provided some reading enjoyment. Neat ideas presented

Thought that this was an interesting blurb. I cannot seem to find anything else about it on the web except on the site I have linked.

http://kylebell.com/2010/02/15/south-bend-mayor-announces-plan-for-streetcars-google-high-speed-internet/

South Bend Mayor is looking to put a streetcar system in

More good business news for Indy:

Scale Computing lands $9M from Silicon Valley venture firm

http://www.ibj.com/scale-computing-lands-9m-from-bigtime-venture-firm/PARAMS/article/18558

Owner of 45 Degrees Sushi is opening a Yogurt and Coffee shop next door in the 757 building.

http://www.urbantimesonline.com/?p=1248

Owner of 45 Degrees Sushi is opening a Yogurt and Coffee shop next door in the 757 building.

http://www.urbantimesonline.com/?p=1248

I really wanted the Beilouny at Chatham Point to fill in that section of Mass Ave with good retail but so far it hasn't done much for the area... a mediocre "sushi" bar/disco club.... I hope they are better at yogurt and coffee than they are at sushi! A frequent stop store will be great for that part of Mass. I can't wait.

From IBJ:

The local housing agency will learn later this month if the state will authorize the placement of additional credits that could raise another $60 million. That money would fund renovations, replacements or additions to four other properties, including Lugar Tower, at 901 Fort Wayne Ave, and the Caravelle Commons complex near 16th Street and College Avenue. Caravelle’s 65 units would be demolished and replaced with 155 units of new construction.

---

This needs to happen in the worst way. I have said this privately to many people: the solution to failed housing projects, especially Caravelle, is the bulldozer. I hope the state authorizes the tax credits.

I assume that the money for Lugar Tower would help fund the redevelopment of the space around it in addition to renovations. Although even there, I now lean more toward "The Urbanophile Solution": replace the "tower in a park" with a cluster of mid-rise buildings that play better with the neighbors than the massive Brutalist tower. Or perhaps there could be two-to-four story additions to the tower that address East and Fort Wayne.

I assume that the money for Lugar Tower would help fund the redevelopment of the space around it in addition to renovations. Although even there, I now lean more toward "The Urbanophile Solution": replace the "tower in a park" with a cluster of mid-rise buildings that play better with the neighbors than the massive Brutalist tower. Or perhaps there could be two-to-four story additions to the tower that address East and Fort Wayne.

The space across the street on Fort Wayne Avenue (directly west of the Lugar Tower) is, IIRC, an additional excellent opportunity for redevelopment.

Although even there, I now lean more toward "The Urbanophile Solution"...

The Urbanophile Solution, is that anything like The Manhattan Project (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manhattan_Project)? ;-)

Since we're on the topic of Lugar Towers, everyone be on the lookout for extra special good news whenever the Barton Tower rehab moves forward. Can't say anything else, sorry!

From IBJ:

The local housing agency will learn later this month if the state will authorize the placement of additional credits that could raise another $60 million. That money would fund renovations, replacements or additions to four other properties, including Lugar Tower, at 901 Fort Wayne Ave, and the Caravelle Commons complex near 16th Street and College Avenue. Caravelle’s 65 units would be demolished and replaced with 155 units of new construction.

---

This needs to happen in the worst way. I have said this privately to many people: the solution to failed housing projects, especially Caravelle, is the bulldozer. I hope the state authorizes the tax credits.

I assume that the money for Lugar Tower would help fund the redevelopment of the space around it in addition to renovations. Although even there, I now lean more toward "The Urbanophile Solution": replace the "tower in a park" with a cluster of mid-rise buildings that play better with the neighbors than the massive Brutalist tower. Or perhaps there could be two-to-four story additions to the tower that address East and Fort Wayne.
Didn't F&C also win rights to develop the East St. frontage by Lugar Tower when they got the Barton Tower land, or am I remembering incorrectly?

The Urbanophile Solution, is that anything like The Manhattan Project? ;-)

Nuke the towers? Nah. We need to keep a little bad Brutalist stuff around as a reminder, and that quarter of downtown is replete with examples: the little law office tucked in the shadow of 3Mass (NW corner of NY and Ala); The Educational Services Center on Delaware; Lugar, Barton, and the Barton Annex; and the big hunk itself, the Minton-Capehart Building.

A new overlay historic district: The Brutalist Quarter. :lol:

I will be honest. If I never see another Brutalist tower again, that would not bother me. If they all were demolished in Indy, I would not be bothered. I do not care if it is of time and so on... Too much went down for these things, and if nothing went down for them, then as far as I am concerned a bunch of nothing rose up in the sky! I want Indy to have beautiful buildings, and beautiful places to go to.
Now bring on the Roller Derby!

I hope the Barton Tower land does not get developed. It is nice to have a little bit of green space in this area. Without it, you wouldn't know what the 'center' of the Mass Ave area is.

I don't like the tower any more than most people, but I am actually a huge fan of the Barton Annex (the short building next to it). It is an extremely well-designed building and a good example of how livable you can make a housing development without spending a lot.

I hope the Barton Tower land does not get developed. It is nice to have a little bit of green space in this area. Without it, you wouldn't know what the 'center' of the Mass Ave area is.

I don't like the tower any more than most people, but I am actually a huge fan of the Barton Annex (the short building next to it). It is an extremely well-designed building and a good example of how livable you can make a housing development without spending a lot.

And why, pray tell, is knowing the location of Mass Ave's center important? :-)

It's much more important to the success of the entire area that that parcel be developed. We've beaten this topic to death in the past, but that "park" is a dead spot and is keeping the north end from reaching its full potential. Literally no one uses it save for a couple of Barton residents sitting on a bench next to it. It's holding back an entire night life, arts, and shopping district from becoming a truly thriving urban corridor.

Also, I'm probably in the minority, but I happen to like Barton Tower. Its awkward top-heavy geometry is stimulating and assertive. It has a sense of energy and simple deliberate style that's lacking in 99% of the buildings in Indy. I'm not saying I'd want a whole city to look like it, but I find it compelling and am glad it's here.

A new overlay historic district: The Brutalist Quarter. :lol:

I like!

Im not a huge fan of the tower either but I spend a lot of time in this area so its always engaging and the more I am around it the less of a negative affect it has on me.

But as for the green space, I get the feeling the people living there dont take advantage of it. Ive helped my wife with some photo shoots in the same green space and feel like it is hardly ever taken full advantage of.

Citizens Energy to take over city's water, sewer utilities

http://www.ibj.com/citizens-energy-to-take-over-city-water-sewer-utilities/PARAMS/article/18593

http://www.indianabarrister.com/archives/2010/03/ballards_billion_dollar_deal.html

IBJ says the deal will generate 425 million for infrastructure improvements and Abdul is reporting that Citizens will give the city 426 million in cash.

Sounds good to me, but this is definitely outside of my area of expertise.

Same here. Im trying to figure out if this is a good move or a bad move... Cash is good, but the long term payout....

Citizens has been around a while so you hope they would manage this in good spirit.

EDIT: I also thought it would be interesting to post this little tidbit. When my wife and I went to the Indyconnect unveiling, we got to talk to Mayor Ballard for about 10 minutes. My wife made me walk over and talk to him. LOL He praised us for being young people interested in mass transit improvement but the other off the cuff remark that he made that is interesting in regards to this water deal. He said something along the lines of, "... and if we get this water and sewer deal done, this transit plan could happen easier (or sooner or something like that)." Dont quote me on that, but it was interesting to see him drawing the parallel.

So the city sells a utility to itself and gets $425M out of the deal? Looks like a capitalized tax/rate increase to me (i.e, equivalent to just issuing bonds).

Citizens Energy to take over city's water, sewer utilities

http://www.ibj.com/citizens-energy-to-take-over-city-water-sewer-utilities/PARAMS/article/18593

http://www.indianabarrister.com/archives/2010/03/ballards_billion_dollar_deal.html

IBJ says the deal will generate 425 million for infrastructure improvements and Abdul is reporting that Citizens will give the city 426 million in cash.

Sounds good to me, but this is definitely outside of my area of expertise.

Best part of the deal is that Citizens would also take on the existing bond debt from the City's purchase of the Water Company from NIPSCO earlier in the decade.

Second best part of the deal: Citizens will be able to coordinate all underground infrastructure improvements, so that a street isn't repaved, then torn up for a gas main a year later, then for a water main the next year, and for sewer improvements a year after that.

They will have to change their name again, though. "Citizens Utilities" anyone?

So the city sells a utility to itself and gets $425M out of the deal? Looks like a capitalized tax/rate increase to me (i.e, equivalent to just issuing bonds).

Sells it to a public charitable trust. Trust issues tax-exempt bonds. Trust has back office and operational synergies through combining meter-reading, billing, maintenance, and capex budgets.

Rate increases were already programmed for water and sewer. For the water utility, it's to pay for lots of deferred capital replacement. For the sewer utility, it's to pay for the deep tunnel and other EPA consent decree items.

Some guy wrote a guest post on The Urbanophile about "city water" (http://www.urbanophile.com/?s=chris+barnett), which included some specific comments on rates and deferring capital expenses to keep rates artificially low. :)

Same here. Im trying to figure out if this is a good move or a bad move... Cash is good, but the long term payout....

Citizens has been around a while so you hope they would manage this in good spirit.

EDIT: I also thought it would be interesting to post this little tidbit. When my wife and I went to the Indyconnect unveiling, we got to talk to Mayor Ballard for about 10 minutes. My wife made me walk over and talk to him. LOL He praised us for being young people interested in mass transit improvement but the other off the cuff remark that he made that is interesting in regards to this water deal. He said something along the lines of, "... and if we get this water and sewer deal done, this transit plan could happen easier (or sooner or something like that)." Dont quote me on that, but it was interesting to see him drawing the parallel.

I think Ballard knows that he needs to pull-off a big project for his re-election. Right now he has NOTHING to point to that shows he has improved Indy. Peterson laid the ground work for a lot of what has occured under Ballard's watch and the dems will certainly have a VERY formidible opponent. He knows he got in on anti-tax...a tax he campaigned to rescend and if I am correct, I am still paying. SO, pulling off funding for the oft and long talked about mass transit plan would be a major feather in his cap. I hope he can do it.

cdc, I think the burden is on the city to detail where $425M in present value of "efficiencies" are going to come from. Otherwise it's a tax increase. That doesn't mean it is a bad idea. But the idea that you can generate massive amounts of free money by selling an asset to yourself seems dubious to me.

Also, I would think this would be an opportune time for greater oversight by elected officials of Citizens Gas.

cdc, I think the burden is on the city to detail where $425M in present value of "efficiencies" are going to come from. Otherwise it's a tax increase. That doesn't mean it is a bad idea. But the idea that you can generate massive amounts of free money by selling an asset to yourself seems dubious to me.

Also, I would think this would be an opportune time for greater oversight by elected officials of Citizens Gas.

From the Citizens website:

Citizens Energy Group Governance

Citizens Energy Group is governed by a 5-member, non-partisan Board of Trustees and a 7-member, non-partisan Board of Directors as established in Indiana Code 8-1-11.1-1. According to the statute, the trustees’ exclusive function is to make nominations for vacancies to both boards and “nominees shall be appointed by the mayor of the consolidated city (Indianapolis) within ten (10) days after receiving such nominations.” The Board of Directors has primary oversight for the current management and long-term direction of the company.

The Citizens Energy Group Board of Directors and Board of Trustees are fully accountable to state and local elected officials, regulators, and of course customers. Made up of 12 accomplished citizens of Marion County, Citizens’ Boards include retired and current leaders of corporations, such as Eli Lilly and Company, and major non-profit organizations, like Goodwill Industries, Board members receive modest compensation for their service. Further accountability is ensured because Citizens is regulated by the Indiana Utility Regulatory Commission and other agencies including the Indiana Department of Environmental Management and U.S. EPA.

Aaron, our current (political) mayor-and-council-appointed boards have done a much worse job of managing the water and sewer utilities than the Citizens boards have done in managing the gas company. So I am not too sure that political appointments on the Citizens boards are appropriate. MAYBE an ex-officio seat for the mayor or his designee. But certainly not full appointive power over a majority of the board.

And I'll repeat clearly: we are not paying enough for water in Indy. A full-cost fair rate is NOT a "tax increase" because water is not a "free good" like other municipal services. It's a fair exchange based on usage. My guess is that the "expected" rate increases drive the NPV of the deal.

Cory, I have to take some issue with your overly partisan comments. Ballard is slowly accomplishing fire consolidation, and he managed to get control of IMPD back from the Sheriff (where it never should have been anyway, an agreement that Bart made). Bart's administration mismanaged the Water Company bond issues by using the auction-rate bonds that required the emergency rate increase last year. I believe in laying credit and blame where it's due in a non-partisan manner. I didn't vote for Ballard, but if he gets this done and funds public transit expansion/improvement, he can have my vote next time.

"... and if we get this water and sewer deal done, this transit plan could happen easier (or sooner or something like that)."

Thanks a lot! Now you got me all hot'n'bothered. :-)

If they had an unexpected influx of cash, you would think it would get something off the ground a lot faster. Just have to cover an operating budget next...

Carmel has officially put the brakes on Phase 2 of the City Center.

Indystar article (http://www.indystar.com/article/20100308/LOCAL0101/3080320/Carmel-scales-back-its-building-boom)

I think the CCC should have to approve rate increases, bond issues, budgets, etc. for Citizens.

I think the CCB should have to approve rate increases, bond issues, budgets, etc. for Citizens.

IMO, IURC and the companion Utility Consumer Counselor adequately oversee public utility rates in Indiana. Local political control of rates is a bad thing, as we've seen with Indianapolis Water since the city takeover. Economic development, operations and finance types have the expertise and should be the ones looking at and justifying rates, not city-county councilors or the Mayor's staff or appointed board members.

I'll get scalped for writing this, but why not just let the market and bond-rating agencies decide when Citizens has issued enough bonded indebtedness? It's a time-honored tradition (and perfectly legal) in Indiana to off-load bonded capital indebtedness to special-purpose municipal corporations as long as there's a demonstrable revenue stream to guarantee the payments. But a bond issue won't fly if it's poorly covered or poorly rated.

If they had an unexpected influx of cash, you would think it would get something off the ground a lot faster. Just have to cover an operating budget next...

Sales tax increment. Unfortunately, they'll call it the "local option sales tax".

LOST is an unfortunate acronym for anything related to transportation. :lol:

We've already seen what happens with unaccountable boards with the various township fiascoes and the library debacle. I don't think the CCC ought to be setting rates, but there's no reason why, as the library budget now is, the Citizens finances shouldn't be subject to CCC approval.

I think as a matter of governance principle that general purpose elected officials that the public at large knows and holds accountable for the state of the city should have the final say on major matters. If they screw it up, so be it. At least they are accountable to the voters.

We've already seen what happens with unaccountable boards with the various township fiascoes and the library debacle. I don't think the CCC ought to be setting rates, but there's no reason why, as the library budget now is, the Citizens finances shouldn't be subject to CCC approval.

I think as a matter of governance principle that general purpose elected officials that the public at large knows and holds accountable for the state of the city should have the final say on major matters. If they screw it up, so be it. At least they are accountable to the voters.

I generally agree.

However, we don't cry out for CCC or mayoral oversight of IPL...and have never had it. There's a fundamental difference here: water and gas and electric are fungible goods, not public goods. The one "utility" that hasn't generally held to that concept is sewage, but the days of minimal treatment and river dumping are over. Sewage (as opposed to stormwater) metering and management needs to be every bit as sophisticated as other utilities'.

Police, fire, streets, sidewalks, schools...all the free public goods should be subject to oversight by elected officials. Libraries, stadiums, and public building authorities, too.

But not what we unfortunately call "public utilities". Those are well-regulated business entities (regardless of their ownership). There is too much pressure from elected officials to "keep rates down" artificially when they are in control of the utilities. Maintenance and capital replacements suffer in such an environment.

I dont blame anyone for wanting to keep prices down. Even in the face of increasing costs. Just break it down to your basic household needs and everything is more expensive. Food. Heating bills. Insurance. Everyone wants a bigger slice of your paycheck whether you are rich or poor. And where is all the money going?

At the simplest level I believe its fair to ask how much you are willing to pay out for basic everyday needs versus how much you keep and put in your wallet.

insideindianabusiness.com interviews Mayor Ballard about the Citizens Energy proposal:

(FYI, they have an awkward video setup. It launches a stand alone quicktime video.)

http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/video-player.asp?ID=11194&CategoryID=190

^^

They also interview Carey Lykins, President and CEO of Citizens Energy

http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/video-player.asp?ID=11195&CategoryID=190

I dont blame anyone for wanting to keep prices down. Even in the face of increasing costs. Just break it down to your basic household needs and everything is more expensive. Food. Heating bills. Insurance. Everyone wants a bigger slice of your paycheck whether you are rich or poor. And where is all the money going?

At the simplest level I believe its fair to ask how much you are willing to pay out for basic everyday needs versus how much you keep and put in your wallet.

Bears repeating here (from The Urbanophile (http://www.urbanophile.com/?s=chris+barnett)):

Electricity, natural gas, food, and transportation are all equally necessary for me to live and work in the city, and I probably spend close to $14 per DAY (before ever eating out) on those other basic necessities; their price assures that I don’t waste them. To the do-gooder argument of water as a necessity of life: if I am too poor to afford necessities, there are social-service providers or government welfare to help me; as an affluent and largely urban society, we don’t buy the rationale that food should be nearly free for everyone because it is a necessity of life. Water should be treated likewise. Further, the low price of water and water infrastructure almost assures that it is taken for granted and that significant amounts are wasted. Even the unit of measure sends the message “you aren’t using that much water.” But 100 cubic feet is 750 gallons, enough safe drinking water for four people for a full year or enough to flush a low-flow toilet 400-500 times.

Ive read that selection and agree. I wasnt disputing it. I was hoping to make the point that it feels like the amount of money spent out on these things keeps getting larger as time goes on to the point that we are paying a larger percentage out of our income compared to what we used to.

To that end, I cant blame someone for trying to hold the floodgate back. Right or wrong, it's tough to blame someone for that.

Totally off topic but anyone else taken note of the number of major accidents on the area freeways lately?

Old National Bank has struck a deal with Live Nation for naming rights to the Murat Centre.

Details of the deal were not available Monday morning, as officials with Live Nation and the Evansville-based bank could not be reached for comment. Live Nation was planning a press conference for Tuesday morning.

The voice-mail system at the century-old Murat, however, already greets callers with this message: "You have reached the Old National Center, a Live Nation venue."

The deal is significant both for Live Nation and Old National. Naming-rights deals dried up with the recession, said William Chipps, senior editor of IEG Sponsorship Report in Chicago. Considering the age of the venue and the economy, he guessed Old National would pay a six-figure annual fee in the low to middle range.

"I would be surprised if it's in the million dollars," he said.

Live Nation runs the Murat Centre under a 50-year lease deal with the city of Indianapolis. The company also runs the Verizon Wireless Amphitheatre in Noblesville.

Live Nation has name sponsors on almost all of its venues, Chipps said.

The deal is probably more significant for Old National, which has been trying to gain market share in Indianapolis since acquring 65 former Charter One bank branches a year ago. Most of those are in grocery stores and strip centers in and around Indianapolis.

Chipps said the sponsorship will likely pay off for Old National in media exposure, but the general public may take years to stop using the Murat's original name.

"That's not necessarily what a sponsor wants," he said.

http://www.ibj.com/old-national-bank-puts-name-on-murat-centre/PARAMS/article/18694

http://www.ibj.com/old-national-bank-puts-name-on-murat-centre/PARAMS/article/18694

How long do you suppose it will take for the name change to catch on broadly?

For the Hamilton County venue, many folks still call it "Deer Creek".

To that end, i still know a lot of people who still call the old RCA dome, the Hoosier Dome.

Interesting -- all the awnings were changed around the Murat a couple weeks ago to say Old National Center. I thought I just missed the announcement that naming rights had been sold. Apparently they just didn't announce anything until all the changes had already been put in place.

And yeah, it'll always be the Murat to me.

To that end, i still know a lot of people who still call the old RCA dome, the Hoosier Dome.

:lol: Almost added that to my post too.

In passing homage to Prince, I often called it "The Dome Formerly Known As Hoosier".

How long do you suppose it will take for the name change to catch on broadly?

For the Hamilton County venue, many folks still call it "Deer Creek".

How lucrative can it be to sponsor a theatre that holds 2,500 people? I can see why Conseco and Lucas Oil want to put their names on large sports stadiums that have very decent TV exposure but a theater centre? Maybe they got it for a cheap price (thats my guess) but if that's the case why sell off a century old venue's naming rights that has developed a brand of its own under its current name?

I think this is just an example of how ridiculous naming rights have become. Its come to the point where we'll sell off anything for the all mighty dollar and tradition gets kicked out the window.

Bosart, I think you nailed it. I've got no problem with selling naming rights, but some of the low prices for which major civic assets have gotten names attached to them seems wrong to me. If you can't get real value out of them, then you shouldn't sign the deal.

I think its not so much the 2500 people or so that fit into the theater for each sold-out show but the commercials on all of the radio stations and in the Star, NUVO newsweekly, MetroMix and other papers. Every time shows are advertised, the name of the venue is listed or announced. Tens of thousands (maybe a hundred thousand or two) of people every week will see or hear the ads mentioning Old National Center. I don't like changing names of venues to the name of the highest bidder either -- but, I don't think there is much we can do.

I've got no problem with the rename at all. If it helps them stay in business, so be it. Like I said on IBJ, if they repainted the mural with a big Old National Logo, or wrapped the tower with a neon sign, then I'd be a bit miffed.

Saw this little rendering in the channel 13 story for the new fountain in Fountain Square.

They interviewed Craig Von Deylen of PVA about their new IMOCA building and also talked to him about the Murphy building. Anyway, as you can see from the rendering, it looks like they've got plans to put in more storefronts. For those not familiar with the building, none of those windows or awnings on the right facade are there right now.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2749/4438311276_6b9c34a97f_o.png

Not really digging the blue, btw.

I've got no problem with the rename at all. If it helps them stay in business, so be it. Like I said on IBJ, if they repainted the mural with a big Old National Logo, or wrapped the tower with a neon sign, then I'd be a bit miffed.
i'm not trying to paint livenation as evil. To the contrary I believe that the murat is in a much better place than it would have been without the investment and the lease deal that they received. I do take issue with this decision because they sold the naming rights for pennies most likely (relatively speaking). When it comes to the financial performance of this venue I don't think that these funds would sway livenations business decisions regarding the venue because the naming rights are likely only to be a marginal amount. In the meantime the brand that this venue has developed over the past century is left with a sizeable dent.

My point is that I believe brands that have been around for decades or more should not be sold off for pennies simply because they can. I believe they're worth more than that.

i'm not trying to paint livenation as evil. To the contrary I believe that the murat is in a much better place than it would have been without the investment and the lease deal that they received. I do take issue with this decision because they sold the naming rights for pennies most likely (relatively speaking). When it comes to the financial performance of this venue I don't think that these funds would sway livenations business decisions regarding the venue because the naming rights are likely only to be a marginal amount. In the meantime the brand that this venue has developed over the past century is left with a sizeable dent.

My point is that I believe brands that have been around for decades or more should not be sold off for pennies simply because they can. I believe they're worth more than that.

The risk to the buyer (and Livenation) is this: five or six months from now, I'll hear an ad for a show at "Old National Center" and wonder when they put a theater in the bank building downtown...because that's the building already branded "Old National".

^^ BTW, I bank with Old National. Love 'em.

http://www.ibj.com/bakehouse-drives-growth-for-scholars-inn/PARAMS/article/18635

I meant to post this last week but forgot.

Anyone seen the new bridge construction on 465 on the north east side? They are actually putting some style into the new bridge supports. Not just surface finish resulting from plywood forms, but actual style. Not exactly like the west side, but at least they are trying to make it a little more visually appealing

Heard a little blurb on the radio last night, they were interviewing the president of Old National or someone of that stature. He said only the building is being renamed Old National Center. The theater itself will remain The Murat Theater. He said they think it has a lot of brand recognition they wouldn't want to tarnish that. Not exactly sure how that will pan out in advertising or whether his saying that actually affects/means anything. Could be just a PR thing.

Has anyone ever rode the state fair train? Where does it let people off at the fairgrounds? Does it let off north of Fall Creek Pkwy or does it cross the road, Fall Creek itself and stop closer to 38th street?

Just wondering if that bridge that crosses Fall Creek is even in service today.....

Has anyone ever rode the state fair train? Where does it let people off at the fairgrounds? Does it let off north of Fall Creek Pkwy or does it cross the road, Fall Creek itself and stop closer to 38th street?

Just wondering if that bridge that crosses Fall Creek is even in service today.....

The stop is at 39th St., and pedestrians cross that old bridge (or used to). The bridge got a TE grant for rehab within the last couple of years; good thing. The pedestrian pathway was lined with the concrete highway barriers to keep people away from the crumbling edges...and that was back in the 90s when my kids were little.

Alright that makes sense. I should have been more clear in wondering about the state of the RAIL bridge that crosses fall creek. Apparently it's still structurally sound if they take the fair train over it.

The pedestrian bridge actually looks like it is in good shape.

Heard a little blurb on the radio last night, they were interviewing the president of Old National or someone of that stature. He said only the building is being renamed Old National Center. The theater itself will remain The Murat Theater. He said they think it has a lot of brand recognition they wouldn't want to tarnish that. Not exactly sure how that will pan out in advertising or whether his saying that actually affects/means anything. Could be just a PR thing.

Old National Center at Murat Theater? We shall see, I am still awaiting Wrigley Field's namesake.
Uhg!!

Actually -- I think it would be The Murat Theater at the Old National Center. (Or the Egyptian Room at the Old National Center.)

Actually -- I think it would be The Murat Theater at the Old National Center. (Or the Egyptian Room at the Old National Center.)

Or "The Egyptian Room of the Murat Theater at the Old National Center".

Or just "The Murat". :)

Recycling program showing some progress
http://www.indystar.com/article/20100318/LOCAL18/3180432/Curbside-recycling-expansion-planned

Ivy Tech's site plan for the Old St. Vincent site:

http://www.shielsexton.tv/IvyTech/ (http://http://www.shielsexton.tv/IvyTech/)

Can't find an elevation or rendering.

Saw this little rendering in the channel 13 story for the new fountain in Fountain Square.

They interviewed Craig Von Deylen of PVA about their new IMOCA building and also talked to him about the Murphy building. Anyway, as you can see from the rendering, it looks like they've got plans to put in more storefronts. For those not familiar with the building, none of those windows or awnings on the right facade are there right now.

http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2749/4438311276_6b9c34a97f_o.png

Not really digging the blue, btw.

Interesting concept. But would adding more storefronts on the side render the grass in front of it useless?

If I remember this space correctly, that piece of grass is pretty big. And completely unused right now.

There's more than enough room there for a two- or three-story apartment building (built off a single-loaded corridor that hugs the side of the Murphy Building) and still have room for storefronts on the first floor.

Actually -- I think it would be The Murat Theater at the Old National Center. (Or the Egyptian Room at the Old National Center.)

Yeah, whichever way any of it goes, it all is corporatified... Need to go lie down.

Yeah, whichever way any of it goes, it all is corporatified... Need to go lie down.

News today:

(from Inside Indiana Business) (http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?ID=40720)

"The new name for a central Indiana entertainment venue may soon be facing a legal challenge. Live Nation announced earlier this week that the Murat Centre has been renamed Old National Centre. However, our partners at Network Indiana/WIBC report the group that owns the building says Live Nation did not have the authority to make the change. The Murat Temple Association says it is looking into what its legal options are to challenge the renaming."

More from Inside Indiana Business (http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?id=40721&ts=true)

"The Indianapolis Airport Authority is expected to award a consulting contract to Landrum & Brown Inc. this morning for a major land use study encompassing all of its properties, including reliever airports. But much of the focus will be on future uses for the former Indianapolis International Airport, which some envision as the hub of a major urban development known as an "Aerotropolis." Memphis and Detroit are among several U.S. cities also pursuing the concept, which can combine commercial, retail, residential and logistics development."

So the airport authority just spent 50 years buying out residential neighborhoods around the airport, partly for noise reasons. Now they're going to try to sell the idea of living underneath the nightly parade of FedEx planes on High School Road?

Also in the story, this is a $2 million "feasibility study", with an undetermined "fee" to the UNC professor who devised the "Aerotropolis" concept. Aaron, have you hung out your "transportation consultant" shingle yet? Apparently there's big money in that field. :nuts:

Last development tidbit from Inside Indiana Business (http://www.insideindianabusiness.com/newsitem.asp?ID=40719):

"The 2012 Indianapolis Super Bowl Host Committee next week will be among six groups announcing a new investment in a local neighborhood. The funding is expected to assist in the funding of affordable-housing and commercial development in the targeted area. Indianapolis Mayor Greg Ballard and officials from State Farm Insurance Company and the John H. Boner Community Center will also participate."

There's more than enough room there for a two- or three-story apartment building (built off a single-loaded corridor that hugs the side of the Murphy Building) and still have room for storefronts on the first floor.

I'd prefer that kind of approach too. Or at least some sort of additional gallery space. I'd always envisioned some sort of glass gallery cap to that end of the building.

My friend at SEND did tell me there are plans for some sort of restaurant patio thing where the grass is now.

So the airport authority just spent 50 years buying out residential neighborhoods around the airport, partly for noise reasons. Now they're going to try to sell the idea of living underneath the nightly parade of FedEx planes on High School Road?

Also in the story, this is a $2 million "feasibility study", with an undetermined "fee" to the UNC professor who devised the "Aerotropolis" concept.

I still don't fully get this "Aerotropolis" concept. It seems like it's just a fancy new name for something that has been going on for a long time.

I wouldn't read too much into the residential aspect of it. The Airport Authority just finished executing the next master plan. They do have an old terminal to figure out what to do with. It seems proper to me that they do a new master planning study, and with a big area to cover the amounts don't seem out of line. I'd rate the airport as one of the better run service agencies locally, one that has had a long term and forward looking mindset. Nothing particularly raises any red flags here.


Aaron, have you hung out your "transportation consultant" shingle yet? Apparently there's big money in that field. :nuts:

Hah! My only relationship with the airport authority is having them quote me at events they don't invite me to.

I can say this, after I finish up two slow burn volunteer projects I initiated some time ago, anything I might do in the future related to Indianapolis has to be on a purely commercial basis. I can promise you that.

Guys, I want to highlight a blog you all need to check out and add to your reader. It's called "Urban Out" by Greg Meckstroth:

http://urban-out.com/

As the name implies, it's written by a 20-something gay guy pretty recently out of college who works and lives in downtown Indy. Like most Indy blogs, he's not solely focused on Indy but writes about other cities too. It's also not just a gay blog either but covers lots of urbanism issues. He's an Ohio State grad and Cincy partisan, but don't hold that against him! I think he's pretty fair on most issues. Check it out.

They've started construction on the small apartment building going in on the SE corner of St. Clair and Capitol. Foundation has been poured and the building materials (cement blocks) are stacked up on site. Not a big deal project --- but its another nice little infill housing spot that is much better than the parking lot that currently exists there. Can't wait until they take down the ugly white construction wall along the canal by the Cosmopolitan. It'll look so good when it will all be open to the canal -- but with that white wall there -- you just can't see how nice it will look along there.

Oh yeah -- one other thing. Last Friday they had all of the barricades down that had been blocking access to most of the stairways and bridges along the canal down by the Ohio Street basin (near the State Office Complex). The deteriorating cement has been replaced with wonderful black/gray/white peppered granite steps and granite pedestals supporting some of the railing on the bridges. Looks fantastic. Now it looks like it will hold up for another century. Very nice!!

woooHooooooo Yea BUTLER SWEET SIXTEEN!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Keep on Rollin' Doggies!!!!

Way to go Butler!

Formspring.me moving to San Francisco:

http://www.readwriteweb.com/start/2010/03/formspringme-another-startup-packing-its-bags-for-silicon-valley.php

Hey, gonna break things up abit. Need to know the best restaurant to take a first date in Broad Ripple, Thanks.

Hey, gonna break things up abit. Need to know the best restaurant to take a first date in Broad Ripple, Thanks.

H2O Sushi. Executive Chef John Adams is great! The service staff is also impressive!

Recess. Just opened, incredible, Executive Chef Greg Hardesty, Sioux Chef Abbi Merriss... a great team! Quite expensive, but worth every penny!

Another zoning issue rears its head in Indianapolis...

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100322/LOCAL18/3220335/Zoning-holds-up-Eastside-business-expansion

Guys, I want to highlight a blog you all need to check out and add to your reader. It's called "Urban Out" by Greg Meckstroth:

http://urban-out.com/

As the name implies, it's written by a 20-something gay guy pretty recently out of college who works and lives in downtown Indy. Like most Indy blogs, he's not solely focused on Indy but writes about other cities too. It's also not just a gay blog either but covers lots of urbanism issues. He's an Ohio State grad and Cincy partisan, but don't hold that against him! I think he's pretty fair on most issues. Check it out.

I know Greg. Very nice guy that totally gets it.

I read through his page this weekend and put a link to it on mine. Very good reading. I love the carless story. Went perfect with a story I wrote recently.

Good to see a nice, consistent influx of cash coming our way for a long time.

From IBJ...

City, NCAA forge 30-year event pact (http://www.ibj.com/city-ncaa-forge-30year-event-pact/PARAMS/article/18793)

I still don't fully get this "Aerotropolis" concept. It seems like it's just a fancy new name for something that has been going on for a long time.

Good, I'm not alone. It sounds suspiciously like another professor's attempt to build a brand around his writing. (See: Richard Florida)

I can't remember who mentioned the I-465 NE bridges, but I went out today and took a look.

This is nothing but a mold they applied when pouring the concrete. The abutments use non-decorative facings on the retaining walls. The horizontal clearance is the absolute minimum they need. It's not done yet, but based on what I saw I'd have to rate it "absolute shit" grade. It's clear they did this design instead of something like the W or NW designs because it is dirt cheap. They are basically putting nothing into the design of this but some plywood forms.

I know from whom this design philosophy emanates, but I'll remain silent on that for now.

Good, I'm not alone. It sounds suspiciously like another professor's attempt to build a brand around his writing. (See: Richard Florida)

Hey, if he's getting some consulting gigs out of it, it must be working!

I saw it a little closer today myself driving on Keystone. I saw the big "tool" they are using to cast it. While I did not get to see it closely either time (was driving) I was pointing out that they were doing SOMETHING.

H2O Sushi. Executive Chef John Adams is great! The service staff is also impressive!

Recess. Just opened, incredible, Executive Chef Greg Hardesty, Sioux Chef Abbi Merriss... a great team! Quite expensive, but worth every penny!

Thanks Eddie, I appreciate that alot!:)

Dropping $100 on a first date.. yikes.

I made it over the old 'hood today and finally got to see the Fountain Square fountain. I'd give it a rating of "Ok". Could have been worse but also clearly could have been much better.

I made it over the old 'hood today and finally got to see the Fountain Square fountain. I'd give it a rating of "Ok". Could have been worse but also clearly could have been much better.

I think it will be much better when the plaza and other fountain go in on that parking lot and when the Cultural Trail is finished. I feel like it will all tie in really well together.

I made it over the old 'hood today and finally got to see the Fountain Square fountain. I'd give it a rating of "Ok". Could have been worse but also clearly could have been much better.

The White Rabbit Cabaret (http://www.whiterabbitcabaret.com/) just opened across the street from Radio Radio. Andy a Deborah, the owners, just had a feature in Nuvo. The build out is simple and well done. No smoking!! No food yet, but its a work in progress. They have been having Cabaret style shows on fridays. I think that first friday (april 2nd) they are having a grand opening event. It is definitely worth checking out!

http://www.whiterabbitcabaret.com/

Dropping $100 on a first date.. yikes.

Not sure what I will be dropping. Hopefully we can find some more entertainment after that for several hours. So, anything in that area should be cool. Thanks:fiddle:

Well --- the US Census bureau's 2009 Metropolitan area population estimates are out. I'm having trouble opening them so far --- but here is where they should be:

http://www.census.gov/popest/metro/metro.html

Maybe you'll have more luck opening the tables. My computer was running really slowly for some reason and I couldn't open the file.

Census data released today.

The Good: Indpls still #1 in Midwest big city in population growth and net domestic migration. Marion County 7,000 growth - pretty strong. Madison County also continued growing.

The Bad: Continued erosion in demographics. Last three years have gone from 1.5% to 1.4% to 1.3%. Columbus, Ohio increase growth to 1.2% last year and came within a few hundred of overtaking Indy in numeric growth. Next year Columbus will take over the #1 spot most likely.

Total population: 1,743,658

OK - now I've gotten it open. Indy grew by about 23,000 in the past year --- about the same as the previous year - but down from the 26,000 two years ago. This compares with 22,000 for Columbus, OH; 21,500 for Kansas City; 13,000 for Cincinnati; Negative 3,000 for Cleveland; Negative 20,000 for Detroit; 65,000 for Chicago; 9,000 for Louisville; 9,000 for Milwaukee; 32,000 for Minneapolis / St. Paul and 10,000 for St. Louis. Just taking a quick look at these numbers and calculating in my head -- it looks like Indy has the highest one year growth percentage ('08 - '09) of these large Midwest Metros (plus Louisville).

On other interesting stat. Looking at total net domestic inmigration (absolute, not percentage), Indianapolis ranked #18 in the nation in total number of net people moving in. That's not bad.

Indy is doing well. Here's a story from the Star:

BLOOMINGTON -- Hamilton and Hendricks counties remain Indiana's top hotbeds for newcomers, but the recession cooled the growth.

The number of moving trucks bringing new residents into those suburban Indianapolis counties in 2009 was "well below their annual averages" during this decade, the Indiana University's Indiana Business Research Center said after a review of census data and other statistics.




Hamilton County, a U.S. success story as the 21st-fastest growing county from 2000 to 2009, added 8,350 residents in 2009 -- compared to an average annual increase of 10,700 between 2000 and 2008. Hendricks grew by an average of 4,060 people annually over this same period but slipped to 2,780 newcomers in 2009.

Meanwhile, Marion County, grew to 890,000 after adding 7,770 in 2009, compared to an average annual growth of just 2,770 previously from 2000 to 2008. Marion County was the 56th-largest county in the nation in 2009, adding 30,420 residents since 2000.

From 2000 to 2009, Hamilton County gained 53 percent; Hendricks, 35 percent; Johnson and Hancock, 23 percent each; and Boone, 22 percent.

Matt Kinghorn, an economic research analyst in the Indiana Business Research Center, said the source of these shifting trends is a recent slowdown in migration that has been experienced in Indiana and nationally.

"In central Indiana, many of the suburban counties have seen a decline in migration in 2009 while Marion County registered its first annual net in-migration of residents in this decade as fewer residents moved to surrounding counties," Kinghorn said in a statement.

The Indiana Business Research Center is housed within IU's Kelley School of Business.

That is interesting to see the jump in population growth for Marion County -- at the same time as the decline in the rate of growth for the outlying counties in the region. I wonder what made this sudden jump occur for Marion County -- increasing by 7,700 in one year - up from average increases of around 2,700 during the previous years in the decade? Changes in demographics -- ie more parents with kids that have grown out of their high school years and now the parents want to "downsize" back into a more urban neighborhood? More recognition of the attractions in the central city -- maybe all the news about the Cultural Trail and all of the connected attractions is beginning to pay off? People tired of a 25 mile commute - wanting to get closer to a job in the central city? I don't know exactly - but it sure seems like this was the year that things really started to shift. We'll see if it is a long term trend or just a blip. My guess is it is the start of an ongoing trend.

I suspect is economic. You can't move to Hamilton County if you can't sell your house in Marion County. If you are out of a job, you need to stay in low cost housing like Marion County. I'd be interested in seeing where this lands when the economy turns north again. But regardless, I'd say Marion County's population growth is good news. I'd love to see an upside surprise there from the Census because of all the immigration too.

Nice write up about your appearance at the Indy Partnership meeting Aaron

http://www.ibj.com/urban-expert-lauds-indianapolis-for-progress/PARAMS/article/18864

Thanks! I plan to blog the section of it on human capital Sunday.

Nice write up about your appearance at the Indy Partnership meeting Aaron

http://www.ibj.com/urban-expert-lauds-indianapolis-for-progress/PARAMS/article/18864

Now you're an "urban expert". I am not sure if that is a step up from "urban affairs blogger".

ps. Do you have comments disabled on your Longworth post? I wanted to point out that (1) contrary to his assertion, Indianapolis WAS a manufacturing city and is making the transition away from it better than other cities, and (2) many of the problems he cites (municipal finance, preserving diversity, and affordable housing) have been dealt with in Indy and that the city might be an example to the rest of the Midwest.

I came back from the dead just to post this.. Awesome. Congrats.

http://www.ibj.com/urban-expert-lauds-indianapolis-for-progress/PARAMS/article/18864

Urban expert lauds Indianapolis for progress

If Indianapolis’ business leaders needed a pep talk to shake them from their recessionary funks, they got it Tuesday from an urban affairs expert who says the city is faring better than several others.

Aaron Renn, an Indiana native who writes the popular Urbanophile blog from his home in Chicago, spoke at the Indy Partnership’s annual meeting at the Indianapolis Museum of Art.

Supporters of the regional economic development organization undoubtedly felt better about their situations after listening to Renn, who grew up in tiny Laconia along the Ohio River.

“Indianapolis is just starting to come into its own as a major American city,” he said. “This city’s best days are ahead of it.”

By comparison, Indianapolis’ Midwestern counterparts mostly are regressing, and Renn brought the statistics to prove his point.

The former partner of the Accenture consultancy said Indianapolis enjoyed population growth of 65,000 residents over the past decade, tops among 11 Midwestern cities. And many of those cities even experienced population declines, he said.

Indianapolis also ranked first in total job growth. From 2001 to 2009, the city experienced net job growth of 17,000, a particularly striking statistic considering the 10 other cities all experienced job losses, Renn said.

Now, he said, it’s time for Indianapolis to start competing against national darlings such as Austin, Texas; Charlotte, N.C.; Nashville, Tenn.; and Portland, Ore.

Indianapolis already stacks up well against Portland, he said. Although the Hoosier capital lags in population growth, it has higher job growth and lower unemployment than its Oregonian rival.

“If you want to sip lattes by the light-rail system, go to Portland,” Renn said in a light-hearted jab. “But if you want a job, come to Indianapolis.”

A light-rail system in Indianapolis, however, was lauded as a potential “game-changer” by Mark Miles, CEO of the Central Indiana Corporate Partnership. He provided a brief overview of the plans at the Indy Partnership’s meeting.

A light-rail system, the midfield terminal at Indianapolis International Airport and the Indianapolis Cultural Trail are examples of what the city needs to help lure more young professionals to the city.

That can be a challenge, Renn acknowledged, because Indianapolis is “flatter than a pancake” and lacks the attractive scenery that mountains and oceans can provide to metropolitan areas.

Partnership CEO Ron Gifford concluded by using a basketball analogy in reference to the NCAA men’s Final Four basketball championship that will be in Indianapolis April 3-5.

Twenty-five years ago, when Gifford moved to the city from San Francisco, Indianapolis might have strived to be the “Cinderella” of the tournament.

But now, Gifford said, “we should be in the Final Four for everything we do.”

I actually RSVP'd to attend, but didnt even get to leave work until 5:30 so missed it unfortunately.

I came back from the dead just to post this.. Awesome. Congrats.

http://www.ibj.com/urban-expert-lauds-indianapolis-for-progress/PARAMS/article/18864
Holy crap, it's been almost 2 years since we heard from you moochie!

Got any more East Washington projects to tease us with? :)

Thanks, moochie! And great to have you back among the living. You should stick around.

cdc, Comments aren't disabled on the Longworth post. Everything looks fine to me. I will say that guest posts tend to generate very few comments, so I'm not surprised no one has said anything. I think they are afraid or something as a general rule on guest posts.

Holy crap, it's been almost 2 years since we heard from you moochie!

Got any more East Washington projects to tease us with? :)

Only bad ones I'm afraid. 146 E Washington: dead as a doornail. Penn Centre: barely alive.. partners still optimistic. I can't talk about these things like I used to though.

Thanks, moochie! And great to have you back among the living. You should stick around.

cdc, Comments aren't disabled on the Longworth post. Everything looks fine to me. I will say that guest posts tend to generate very few comments, so I'm not surprised no one has said anything. I think they are afraid or something as a general rule on guest posts.

Hmm. I tried to post. Maybe you've got ME on "comment moderation". :lol:

More good news showing Indy's increasing diversity:

Saraga International grocery to open on the South Side
http://www.indianaeconomicdigest.net/main.asp?SectionID=31&SubSectionID=135&ArticleID=53345&TM=57708.62

From IndyStar:

FISHERS -- Tonight, Fishers' Advisory Plan Commission will review a development plan for a large automobile mall along Ind. 37.

The $19 million auto mall would be developed by Butler Automotive Group on a stretch of property along the west side of Ind. 37 between 131st and 141st streets. It could be home to up to five major auto dealerships and create about 230 jobs, according to Town Council documents.

Wow. A hotbed of economic development. :lol:

From IndyStar:

FISHERS -- Tonight, Fishers' Advisory Plan Commission will review a development plan for a large automobile mall along Ind. 37.

The $19 million auto mall would be developed by Butler Automotive Group on a stretch of property along the west side of Ind. 37 between 131st and 141st streets. It could be home to up to five major auto dealerships and create about 230 jobs, according to Town Council documents.

Wow. A hotbed of economic development. :lol:

This sounds terrible.

I agree. Don't they have enough dealerships on 96th street? Good grief...

The even more disturbing part in the story in the star today:

The town wants to create a tax-increment financing district to help cover $5.4 million in infrastructure improvements for the area, according to commission documents. Butler could cover some of those expenses directly.

Tax-increment financing money also could be used to pay $858,000 the town needs to acquire A&R Storage, which is in the path of a road Fishers plans to build from Ind. 37 into the auto mall.

The TIF district would stretch from just south of 126th Street to 141st Street.


wow....
http://www.indystar.com/article/20100325/BUSINESS/3250338/Panel-gives-auto-mall-in-Fishers-green-light

Keystone is in serious need of an overhaul...it's a depressing place, especially south of 56th Street. When I lived at 52nd and Crittenden for a few years, I hated to trudge out in to the ugliness of Keystone Avenue. I'd also be all for somehow recreating the Lafayette Square ethnic restaurant zone...it would certainly be cheaper than making it look nice. (yes, I know, this is just my stomach talking...apologies).

This is why I stress time and time again that ANY LIGHT RAIL or improved mass transit needs to go up Keystone.

I agree. Don't they have enough dealerships on 96th street? Good grief...

One need only look at the former "miracle miles" of car dealerships around Indy to understand what this magic new place will look like in 20-30 years, and where the jobs will come from and go over time. Probably 96th will look like that in 10-20 years, even if it is partly in Carmel, as the apartments through there age and move downscale.

When I moved to Indy as a young man, Keystone Avenue between 49th and 56th had Chrysler, Pontiac, AMC/Jeep, Olds, and Cadillac dealerships. Those sites today aren't what they used to be. Likewise Shadeland from Washington to I-70. Likewise, W. 38th from Lafayette Rd. out to I-465 had a number of new-car dealerships, and another stretch was located north and west of the mall. Those dealerships are gone or struggling, too. South US31 near I-465 has also lost several dealers.

As the dealership business has consolidated, the old franchise locations have been left behind, marching ever outward to the new suburban boulevards.

This isn't "economic development". It's sprawl and cannibalism.

I live in walking distance of that stretch of keystone so I see it literally, on a daily basis. It sucks.

I live in walking distance of that stretch of keystone so I see it literally, on a daily basis. It sucks.

Keystone is in serious need of an overhaul...it's a depressing place, especially south of 56th Street. When I lived at 52nd and Crittenden for a few years, I hated to trudge out in to the ugliness of Keystone Avenue. I'd also be all for somehow recreating the Lafayette Square ethnic restaurant zone...it would certainly be cheaper than making it look nice. (yes, I know, this is just my stomach talking...apologies).

What, you mean that McDonalds on the corner didnt do it for ya? ;-) At least you could walk to the "Deli" ;)

It's too bad that utility relocatoin is so expensive because all the tall power lines running down that stretch stick out SO badly. It makes me feel depressed on a cloudy day look south from say, 56th street through the auto mall area and see all the dirty sidewalks, and tall power poles sticking out from the middle of them. So ugly...

Guess it's time for the clones to start heading further north again.

Police investigating rash of robberies at Castleton Square mall
http://www.fox59.com/news/wxin-castleton-robberies-032310,0,742772.story

A couple of months ago, the Red Eye Cafe closed. In its space (S. Meridian at Louisiana Street - by Union Station) the owner of the adjacent nightclub "Blu" is fixing it up to make it an expanded part of his nightclub. (I saw them working on it last night.) He is also fixing up the space to the immediate west of the old Red Eye space - along Louisiana Street - to make this part of the complex as well. It should be a really big place and will have some great street frontage areas (along S. Meridian and Louisiana St.) filled with bar, night-club and restaurant uses. As that will be right next to Cadillac Ranch - there will be two mega nightclub complexes right next to each other - each of them about 20,000 sq. feet or so.

Its kind of amazing the amount of bar / nightclub space within a block or two of that area -that is pretty much the hub of the Wholesale District: Jillians, Howl at the Moon, Kilroy's, Six, Blu, Cadillac Ranch, Ike & Jonesy's, Hooters, Scotty's, Hard Rock, Claddagh, Crackers, the Pub, Coach's, Ugly Monkey, Slippery Noodle, Wild Beaver, Subterra Lounge -- and then there are all of the restaurants / bars along Illinois Street.... Should be fun next week with 80,000+ fans in town for the Final Four filling up all of these spots.

A couple of months ago, the Red Eye Cafe closed. In its space (S. Meridian at Louisiana Street - by Union Station) the owner of the adjacent nightclub "Blu" is fixing it up to make it an expanded part of his nightclub. (I saw them working on it last night.) He is also fixing up the space to the immediate west of the old Red Eye space - along Louisiana Street - to make this part of the complex as well. It should be a really big place and will have some great street frontage areas (along S. Meridian and Louisiana St.) filled with bar, night-club and restaurant uses. As that will be right next to Cadillac Ranch - there will be two mega nightclub complexes right next to each other - each of them about 20,000 sq. feet or so.

Its kind of amazing the amount of bar / nightclub space within a block or two of that area -that is pretty much the hub of the Wholesale District: Jillians, Howl at the Moon, Kilroy's, Six, Blu, Cadillac Ranch, Ike & Jonesy's, Hooters, Scotty's, Hard Rock, Claddagh, Crackers, the Pub, Coach's, Ugly Monkey, Slippery Noodle, Wild Beaver, Subterra Lounge -- and then there are all of the restaurants / bars along Illinois Street.... Should be fun next week with 80,000+ fans in town for the Final Four filling up all of these spots.

BROAD RIPPLE - THE SEQUEL!

I remember when South Meridian was a thriving bar district the last time around. All of the establishments that used to be there except the Slippery Noodle closed. Don't forget that in Cleveland the Flats now looks like a "Scooby Doo ghost town". These types of generic bar districts in redevelopment areas have a tendency to be ephemeral.

I've heard that for the Super Bowl -- the plans are to close Illinois and Meridian Streets to auto traffic (I think basically between South St. and Washington St.) - and have that whole area pretty much a huge pedestrian zone. Any one involved in any of the Super Bowl planning meetings able to confirm (or deny) that idea? or provide any other news pertaining to the plans?

I've heard that for the Super Bowl -- the plans are to close Illinois and Meridian Streets to auto traffic (I think basically between South St. and Washington St.) - and have that whole area pretty much a huge pedestrian zone. Any one involved in any of the Super Bowl planning meetings able to confirm (or deny) that idea? or provide any other news pertaining to the plans?



I've heard word about georgia getting a makeover and will ped only

Re Arenn's note above ^^ : Well --- a good chunk of the bars in that area have been there for a good ten or so years now (some more) --- (Ike & Jonesy's, Tiki Bob's, Have a nice day Cafe, Jillians's, Hooters, Claddagh, Howl at the Moon, Hard Rock, etc. I can't think of too many spots that have closed and remained "vacant" - although there have been a few places that have seen several name changes over the years: (Kilroy's current location; Cadillac Ranch location ...)

I know Cincinnati had an issue with Main Street being the popular place for quite a while -- then that started to die out a few years ago. I think Indy benefits quite a bit from the proximity of the Convention Center to this area -- not to mention the proximity of Lucas Oil Stadium and Conseco Fieldhouse. With the amount of activities going on around the Wholesale District -- it doesn't seem like the area is likely to go bottom up in the near future. Fifteen to twenty-five years ago -- the area did have its definite ups and downs (I remember "Sha Booms" and "Locomotions" from the mid 80's Union Station era, if that tells you anything.) But since Circle Centre opened in '95, in general I would say there has simply been steady growth in the restaurants, nightclubs, bars, etc. in the Wholesale District. With the doubling in size of the Convention Center in nine months, I don't see things slowing down at all -- but possibly we could see even a little more growth.

With all that said, however --- I do understand that the "popular" areas can change kind of quickly sometimes -- and all it takes sometimes is some ignorant crazy person getting out of hand and doing something stupid related to gunfire / knives, etc. causing a major media-attracting tragedy - and all of a sudden it becomes a place where no one wants to go. The track record of the wholesale district however - with pretty strong security and in the middle of a pretty healthy area - should help prevent that from happening however, I believe.

To Benjaminoo: That definitely makes sense to close Georgia to autos also - if Illinois and Meridian are already pedestrian only. That will make that whole area pretty interesting -- a little like Bourbon Street up north.

My View: Despite poor economy, Downtown thrives

The Indianapolis Downtown and I share a lengthy history. I'm a lifelong Hoosier. Ten years ago, I purchased a contract furniture and service business, then relocated it from the Northwestside suburbs to Downtown. Seven years ago, I wrote in these pages about why I moved RJE Business Interiors: the central location that cuts delivery costs and travel time for my employees and me; the nearness to restaurants, shopping and the energy of Downtown that helps us attract and retain the brightest employees; the proximity to customers and service organizations that allows us to grow our own revenue while boosting our community.

Thanks to a strong vision by civic leaders, public and private sector investment and a fierce community pride, our Downtown has been transformed into the lifeblood of our region.
Advertisement

Through the last decade, we've witnessed expansions in all sectors -- from Clarian's People Mover to Indiana University-Purdue University Indianpolis' remarkable transformation; from diverse new hotels to the Cultural Trail and Central Library; from Lucas Oil Stadium to the small, locally owned businesses peppering the Massachusetts Avenue Cultural District.

From RJE's windows on Ohio Street, we watched an explosion of growth, starting with the removal of the Market Street ramp to provide a stronger connection from the Eastside to the rest of Downtown. Angie's List thrives around the corner, while Indianapolis' first office building designed to be platinum-level LEED-certified, the Nature Conservancy of Indiana, goes up across the street. Harrison College started out in a historic church. Now it's a state-of-the-art institution educating workers for the next 100 years.

RJE itself grew to $29 million in annual revenue, powered by 50 professionals glad to be Downtown. In fact, business Downtown proved so successful that we recently expanded to another downtown setting to serve the greater Cincinnati area.

Despite what's happening in the rest of the world, Indianapolis' Downtown hasn't just survived, it's triumphed. According to Indianapolis Downtown Inc., since 2003, 177 projects have been completed in Downtown with an investment of approximately $3.8 billion. Every day, 127,000 office workers bring energy to Downtown. For 20,000 people, it's not enough to just come during the day; they chose to make their homes in the center of our city.

This April, I'll move into the role of IDI chairman. Building on the legacy of leaders that include Mayors William Hudnut, Steve Goldsmith, Bart Peterson and Greg Ballard, IDI shares a commitment to raising Downtown to the next level. Just think about the Indiana Convention Center expansion, the 2012 Super Bowl and the towering Marriott Place complex.

Yes, we still have challenges to tackle. But as we break through the economic doom and gloom, let's not forget what's right in front of us: a vibrant, thriving Downtown to enjoy today. We're all part of something special. I'm glad I moved RJE here. And I look forward to what we can add in the coming months and years to keep our Downtown among the gems of the region.

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100325/OPINION01/3250319/1002/OPINION/My-View-Despite-poor-economy-Downtown-thrives

:)

South US31 near I-465 has also lost several dealers.

South US 31 at I-465 looks terrible these days--just as vacant as everywhere else you mentioned. Further north, closer to Troy Avenue, the parcels are smaller and filled with mom-and-pop used car lots, a surefire indication of depressed land values--and also a great opportunity for redevelopment in an area more receptive to urban form than US 31 and Hanna (where the big-name car dealerships stood).

I don't know Keystone and 56th as well as the rest of you, but has there been anything percolating in terms of redevelopment of those vacant dealerships?

These types of generic bar districts in redevelopment areas have a tendency to be ephemeral.

On the theme of ephemerality...does anyone remember when South Meridian hosted a Tibetan Restaurant (Snow Lion) and a Thai place? Something tells me they might have survived longer if they had opened today.

Nightclubs in particular rarely last more than 5 or 6 years.

Chain bars are willing to shell out more money for the premier locations, but they will be the first to gun it, if district's popularity starts to wane.

The Wholesale District seems a bit more sustainable because it has diversified its options and generally boasts a reasonably strong residential population. If it consisted almost exclusively of national bar/restaurant chains like Jillian's or Alcatraz (as it did six or seven years ago), I'd be very cynical. The fact that regional, traditionally more risk-averse entrepreneurs like Scotty's, Ambrosia, and Kilroy's have opened new branches there demonstrates a greater confidence in the area than one might get if it solely consisted of chains that are willing to shell out the big bucks for a five-year lease, with not a care in the world about whether or not they'll renew. The local presence also understandably makes it more attractive to locals, or to people who are seeking something other than the national chain presence (which has been a major, deserved point of criticism of Indy from out-of-towners for many years).

I don't know much about Cleveland's Flats beyond what Aaron had described (love the "Scooby Doo ghost town" reference). From what I've read, at least part of it sounds like it could have been a duplicate of Louisville's Fourth Street Live, which is likely to fade in five years or so if it doesn't reinvent itself. Though metro Cleveland's abysmal economy surely doesn't help any new venture there.

Final verdict: If an entertainment district/mall/car dealership cluster does not depend remotely on the urban design, massing and scale of the neighborhood and could exist just about anywhere else and thrive (as is the case with Louisville's 4th Street), then it probably will pull itself up by the roots every decade and relocate to the newest hotspot.

I think the Wholesale District is pretty strong today. I'm just saying this isn't the first time there was a wave of semi-generic bars on South Meridian. The version I am recalling is from the early 90's pre-Circle Centre.

So I wonder who this Denny Sponsel is that wrote the "positive" blurb about downtown Indy. He says he's going to be the new Chairman of IDI. Tamara Zahn is the President of IDI. I wonder what the "Chairman" does.

Congrats Butler!!!! Knocking off Syracuse. Nice job ---- and its on to the Elite 8!!!

So I wonder who this Denny Sponsel is that wrote the "positive" blurb about downtown Indy. He says he's going to be the new Chairman of IDI. Tamara Zahn is the President of IDI. I wonder what the "Chairman" does.

Tamara Zahn is the head employee of IDI and she reports to the Board. As Chairperson, Mr. Sponsel oversees the Board, which makes him and his fellow Board members, Ms. Zahn's bosses.

South US 31 at I-465 looks terrible these days--just as vacant as everywhere else you mentioned. Further north, closer to Troy Avenue, the parcels are smaller and filled with mom-and-pop used car lots, a surefire indication of depressed land values--and also a great opportunity for redevelopment in an area more receptive to urban form than US 31 and Hanna (where the big-name car dealerships stood).

I don't know Keystone and 56th as well as the rest of you, but has there been anything percolating in terms of redevelopment of those vacant dealerships?

This is hard to "say" with a straight face: the old Bud Wolf at 54th has been reborn as another Oak Motors Second Chance Superstore.

The old Pontiac dealership at 52nd has been Walgreen's for 15 years or so. The old AMC-Jeep dealer at 54th was redeveloped into a Rally's/strip mall configuration 4 or 5 years ago (their former backlot across Tacoma was turned into mini-barn storage in the 90s). The former O'Brien Chrysler is being remodeled, and I suspect it will be yet another used-car dealer as they have applied for zoning approval of a big ol' video signboard. A former car lot south of O'Brien's Goodyear Tire shop was converted to storage barns 5-8 years ago. Much further north, the former Eric Dickerson Buick (north of 71st, across from Walmart) is vacant and for sale. It seems to be prime for some kind of retail big box (Home Depot?), as the surrounding area has pretty good demographics (Ravenswood notwithstanding). The old Alderman Ford at 55th is now a Butler dealership, probably the only healthy new-car dealer remaining.

I can't imagine Lockhart Caddy will stay too much longer, but they can't really go straight north since Tutwiler is already there. Maybe they'll refit the Hummer dealership on SR37 since they already own it.

I remember when South Meridian was a thriving bar district the last time around. All of the establishments that used to be there except the Slippery Noodle closed. Don't forget that in Cleveland the Flats now looks like a "Scooby Doo ghost town". These types of generic bar districts in redevelopment areas have a tendency to be ephemeral.

Cue "people come on down to South Meridian Street....it's the perfect place if you're a d-bag"

Some interesting real estate news
http://www.ibj.com/lugar-tower-project-delayed-by-lack-of-tax-credits/PARAMS/article/18935

Some interesting real estate news
http://www.ibj.com/lugar-tower-project-delayed-by-lack-of-tax-credits/PARAMS/article/18935

Highlight of the story:

"The news wasn’t all bad for IHA. Three of its other projects will move forward, including a $32.2 million redevelopment of the Caravelle Commons Apartments at 16th Street and College Avenue The 65-unit complex will be demolished to make way for 155 new units, a community center, computer lab and recreational facilities.

The authority bought the complex in March 2009 from the Near North Development Corp., which took over the failed co-op in 2003. Near North stepped in to refinance, renovate and stabilize the property with an eye toward eventually selling it to a more appropriate owner.

A new Caravelle Commons, along with plans for a new Kroger supermarket at 16th and Central Avenue to replace an old and cramped existing store, could represent a turning point for the blighted stretch of 16th Street.

The $3.3 million in credits that will be doled out annually over the next 10 years for Caravelle Commons is the largest amount IHCDA has ever awarded, Sipe said."

This is incredibly good news. It is exactly what is needed for that "development", which is an ugly urban-renewal version of a 70's suburban townhouse-apartment development where the streets were dead-ended and the buildings were arranged around dead-end internal parking lots with backs turned toward the street.

Are there any renderings of what they want to do yet? The article from last year said they would have an update later, but I cannot find anything. They said all the right things in the article, I hope it doesnt turn out like 25th & central did. At least there is money to back this project

Speaking of IDI...or the IC&VA, I have decided to kinda make a career shift this year. I am off the the MBA program at U of I for marketing and hope to work for either of these places once I complete my degree.


I had no idea Red Eye Cafe closed.

OH...not really "development," but according to the size of condoms that Hoosiers buy, Indiana is the 4th "largest" State while Indy ranks 13th in the top 20 cities ;)

http://secure.condomania.com/Rankings/

I knew I was helping the "curve" go up (all pun intended), but I didn't realize I was helping that much :)

har har har

;)

When I lived at 17th and Central, a police officer lived there that was instrumental in getting 17th St. blockaded at the southern edge of MLK Park. Apparently there was a rash of drive-by shootings on 17th and their solution was to simply close the street to cars. If they're going to clean up the area and redevelop Caravelle Commons, I hope they reopen 17th St. in the process.

When I lived at 17th and Central, a police officer lived there that was instrumental in getting 17th St. blockaded at the southern edge of MLK Park. Apparently there was a rash of drive-by shootings on 17th and their solution was to simply close the street to cars. If they're going to clean up the area and redevelop Caravelle Commons, I hope they reopen 17th St. in the process.

They should restore the street grid as much as possible by reopening 17th, Park, and Broadway...but it would be necessary to relocate a wing of the health center to do Broadway. Which would be fine, as it's an ugly 70's urban renewal era suburban looking piece of you-know-what.

That whole area south of MLK Park is an example of how NOT to do urban redevelopment, right down to the suburban-looking church with a parking lot, lawn and iron fence at the corner of College.

I knew I was helping the "curve" go up

:banana:

:banana:

Aw, come on, guys. This ain't a locker room, and that's not the kind of "development" I want to read about here. :)

Cue "people come on down to South Meridian Street....it's the perfect place if you're a d-bag"

That's what I'm sayin'...

Thanks for supporting downtown Indianapolis guys^^ Obviously you guys are super cool and must only hang out at the Dorman Pub with all of the other uber cool folks in Indianapolis - and wouldn't dare hang out at any of the Wholesale District areas where some of the common folk tend to be seen. Sorry to insult your sense of coolness on this web site by saying positive things about the wholesale district scene. Hopefully your skillful attempts at dissing the long time future prospects of the Wholesale District will assure any potential readers that you are still cool and haven't actually lowered yourself to the level of the everyday Indy common person.

Basically - I was just saying previously that its fantastic that downtown Indianapolis has a great hub of downtown bars, restaurants, nightclubs, etc. that are all doing well. Its good too that we are promoting the other good nightlife areas of downtown with their bars, stores, restaurants, night clubs etc. through the Cultural Districts promotions. We need to have a lot of places for visitors to go when huge events like the Final Four and the Super Bowl and the Performance Sports Convention and the CEDIA convention, etc. are in town. We've got a lot of places for folks to hang out when they are downtown -- and that's a good thing. Having lots of places where people -- particularly people from outside of the State - can spend their money downtown is a good thing.

I know I went overboard above - but still --- it doesn't do any good for you guys to go on a development board and start making insulting comments about places in downtown Indy. The way I took your comments was that you were saying anyone that hangs out at bars / restaurants in the Wholesale District -- is a d-----bag. Really nice.

And ---- Fantastic job BUTLER! Amazing run is still going strong - coming home to play in the Final Four. For a while I was just posting my congrats because I was happy they were winning -- even though I realized it wasn't really "development" news. Now -- the situation is shifting. This is such a unique and good story - a little school with about 4500 students has made it to the Huge Final Four -- with all of the "Hoosiers" and Hinkle Fieldhouse tie-ins. It will be bringing mega media coverage to Indianapolis and Butler University. And it is positive coverage. A bunch of good kids being talked about. The weather is supposed to be fantastic during the upcoming week -- so CBS news live coverage on the Butler campus, downtown, around LOS, over at WRSP, etc. will look real nice. National attention is a very good thing - and a particularly positive story getting national attention is even better. Its going to be a good week. Good luck Bulldogs -- keep up the great work.

Thanks for supporting downtown Indianapolis guys^^ Obviously you guys are super cool and must only hang out at the Dorman Pub with all of the other uber cool folks in Indianapolis - and wouldn't dare hang out at any of the Wholesale District areas where some of the common folk tend to be seen. Sorry to insult your sense of coolness on this web site by saying positive things about the wholesale district scene. Hopefully your skillful attempts at dissing the long time future prospects of the Wholesale District will assure any potential readers that you are still cool and haven't actually lowered yourself to the level of the everyday Indy common person.

Basically - I was just saying previously that its fantastic that downtown Indianapolis has a great hub of downtown bars, restaurants, nightclubs, etc. that are all doing well. Its good too that we are promoting the other good nightlife areas of downtown with their bars, stores, restaurants, night clubs etc. through the Cultural Districts promotions. We need to have a lot of places for visitors to go when huge events like the Final Four and the Super Bowl and the Performance Sports Convention and the CEDIA convention, etc. are in town. We've got a lot of places for folks to hang out when they are downtown -- and that's a good thing. Having lots of places where people -- particularly people from outside of the State - can spend their money downtown is a good thing.

I know I went overboard above - but still --- it doesn't do any good for you guys to go on a development board and start making insulting comments about places in downtown Indy. The way I took your comments was that you were saying anyone that hangs out at bars / restaurants in the Wholesale District -- is a d-----bag. Really nice.

We were referring to our love of the Cleveland tourism video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysmLA5TqbIY). Didn't mean to get anyone's dander up.

I don't hate South Meridian Street. It's just not my cup of tea (or pint of beer).

Well OK --- I was wondering if there was some type of hidden message in the cue the music quote. Thanks for explaining. I'm not saying I go out much anyway -- but I just didn't think it was good to insult people that go to S. Meridian St. Anyway ---- Next......

Yes, we're just alluding to a humorous video someone made about a similar area in Cleveland:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ysmLA5TqbIY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oZzgAjjuqZM

Sorry for the general photo bomb... I had jury duty today, so I went to the observation deck and snapped some shots.

http://lh4.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7DgeQyiUoI/AAAAAAAAEe4/UNBr2kIu7zE/s640/photo%205.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7DeqbVvhFI/AAAAAAAAEd8/gPRy7c9CQCA/s640/photo%202.jpg

http://lh5.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7Df1_qpc1I/AAAAAAAAEeY/04V1MAXarPQ/s640/photo%203.jpg

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7Df2Fr9EQI/AAAAAAAAEec/UaR0SzK9KEM/s640/photo%204.jpg

http://lh6.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7Dgd24SUdI/AAAAAAAAEew/OS0QwCsn220/s640/photo%203.jpg

http://lh3.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7DhKbgpcSI/AAAAAAAAEfA/hsc3mVyShbE/s640/photo.jpg

34 North is comming along. The brick work is nicer than I expected. Definitely a good addition to that stretch of Meridian. Heading north it really fills in that row of buildings and feels like a developing denser neighborhood... There is still a lot to be desired on an individual level for it to become a cohesive community though. Some day it will get there.
http://lh6.ggpht.com/_weBy68KZy-I/S7DeqFp1MEI/AAAAAAAAEd4/jTNiZpe1PjI/s640/photo.jpg

I was hoping that you would have presented us with some news that the City County building would be Refaced. UGH! Hey, on a brighter subject, that whole Butler thing is astonishing.

Just to go on record: I think the City County building looks pretty good. You can't get much more classic 1960 than that building. I like the metal and glass pattern on the main tower. The limestone trim on lower portions of the tower and its side structures is pretty nice also. Overall, I'm fine with it. People bash it a lot - but I think it a pretty decent building. It adds a nice chunk of tower on the east side of downtown. Once we finally get something to go in on the MSA blocks - and the block one street further to the east --it'll be a key part of the rise of towers connecting the near east side residential neighborhoods with the heart of downtown Indy.

Just to go on record: I think the City County building looks pretty good. You can't get much more classic 1960 than that building. I like the metal and glass pattern on the main tower. The limestone trim on lower portions of the tower and its side structures is pretty nice also. Overall, I'm fine with it. People bash it a lot - but I think it a pretty decent building. It adds a nice chunk of tower on the east side of downtown. Once we finally get something to go in on the MSA blocks - and the block one street further to the east --it'll be a key part of the rise of towers connecting the near east side residential neighborhoods with the heart of downtown Indy.

I totally agree.. one indiana square had a very similar modernism architecture style but it looks very different now with the new facade. The City-County building is really the only good example of this 1960's style in our skyline..hope it remains that way for decades to come.

I have a few questions about the observation deck at the city-county building. Is it open to the public? Does it cost anything? What are the hours that it is open?

I think there are some ok elements to the CCB, particularly at ground level. However, it kills that entire block. At the end of the day, it's yet another entire city block taken up with one building, and not even a particularly big one.

Garfield, you work for the city IIRC, so you know the conditions inside the building. The CCB likely needs major interior overhauls. I'm hopeful at some point we can implode it and redevelop that site with high intensity, urban mixed use to complement the MSA site and bridge the gap between the Wholesale District and Mass Ave.

In my view the best modernist building is the Minton-Capehart Federal Building, which is a superior version of Boston City Hall. Barton Tower isn't bad either.

I totally agree.. one indiana square had a very similar modernism architecture style but it looks very different now with the new facade. The City-County building is really the only good example of this 1960's style in our skyline..hope it remains that way for decades to come.

To each his own, but as I have commented in the past about the building (and I know others disagree), I think it is nothing more than a dull little box. Also, I still love (and love repeating) Ada Louise Huxtable's famous quote: "It's consummate dullness is almost a negative achievement." The wings are about the only thing that add a bit of grandeur (if I can even use that word with respect to this building) to the structure.

I appreciate exceptional examples of Modernism--the Seagram Building, the UN Secretariat Building, the Crown-Zellerbach Building, and certain comparatively lesser-known structures such as the IBM Building in Seattle . But, the City-County Building is just a derivative structure which creates a visually dead corridor on the space it occupies.

When I become dictator, I will order it demolished. Though, to be honest, it's not high on my list of structures which will get the death sentence--but it is on there.

lol @ kangaroo

Im torn. With respect to the yesterday of our downtown, it has its place. Like Aaron said though, the interior is not in that great of shape. Ive seen photos from some fellow contacts and I could be wrong, but it looks as old inside, as outside, I suspect.

It wouldnt hurt my feelings if it was knocked down to be replaced by something nicer, but it also wouldnt hurt my feelings if development sprung up around it either to help lessen the pain

Just to go on record: I think the City County building looks pretty good. You can't get much more classic 1960 than that building. I like the metal and glass pattern on the main tower. The limestone trim on lower portions of the tower and its side structures is pretty nice also. Overall, I'm fine with it. People bash it a lot - but I think it a pretty decent building. It adds a nice chunk of tower on the east side of downtown. Once we finally get something to go in on the MSA blocks - and the block one street further to the east --it'll be a key part of the rise of towers connecting the near east side residential neighborhoods with the heart of downtown Indy.

I'm right there too. I also hate that the lobby/entry under the Public Assembly Room has been so cut up by security features. It used to be a really nice space, warmed tremendously by the wood screen on the back wall of the elevator core on the first and second floors. It was a very Wrightian feature: compression through the entry then expansion (though modest) into the open stairwell.

Don't forget that cube and the entry interest it creates on the Market Street side.

The pictures of the Regions Bank building made me snicker and wonder when they're ever going to finish the new facade. I know it's done, but it just doesn't look like a full wrap.

Aaron and kangaroo, one thing the CCB is: very busy with pedestrian traffic in and out. Because most visitors cannot use the onsite parking, it's one of the busiest pedestrian settings in Downtown. It is unlike all the dead skyscraper bases elsewhere in town in that regard. Plus it really addresses three streets with a presence; the best presence is on Market. Contrast that with AUL, which is on an island where any entrance is a long walk from any pedestrian crossing or nearby bus stop or parking lot. CCB is barely 100 feet from City Market.

Editorial note: Minton-Capehart Building is not "modernist". It's "brutalist". The concrete is the dead giveaway. :)

IMO, the first "modern" high-rise building in town to be demolished should be the residential tower near 40th & Meridian (Tarkington Tower). WAY worse than CCB, kangaroo...totally without distinction or redeeming features, and a blight on its neighborhood.

CCB is barely 100 feet from City Market.

I rest my case.

Editorial note: Minton-Capehart Building is not "modernist". It's "brutalist". The concrete is the dead giveaway. :)

Most people would consider brutalism a type of modernism, given that it originated in the work of Corbu himself.

I'd like to see all of the Courts and Police / Sheriff offices moved out of the CCB and into a new, well designed, approximately 8 - 12 story Courts and Public Safety building - south of the CCB on the south side of Washington Street. By moving all of these public safety and Court rooms out - the majority of the security barricades in the CCB might be able to be removed or at least downsized considerably. The new Public Safety / Courts buildilng would also have a jail component that would link with the existing jail on the southern half of the block where it would be built. With a well designed building balancing the CCB across Washington Street - it would likely make the plaza between the two a more appropriate looking public place.

Sure the layout inside the CCB in the offices isn't as efficient as it possibly could be. I do like the Terrazo floors on every floor in the elevator lobbies. I also like the tall granite rectangular "pillars" that create the entryway as you are going from the plaza area into the inner courtyard in front of the entry doors on the south side of the building. As CDC guy said, it is amazing how busy the building is with pedestrian traffic! At peak times the revolving door entrance on Market Street seems to hardly stop going around - and there are numerous "peak" times during the day.

I'll repeat again Aaron's master plan to win the war:

- Build the Washington St. light rail line to the west side.
- Build a new jail and criminal courts complex on a reclaimed brownfield on the mid-west side, using the light rail line as anchor.
- Renovate the old City Hall into a new City Hall with executive offices for the mayor and key staff.
- Build high intensity mixed use on the MSA site, including an office component with the city taking 400-600,000 sq. ft of it.
- Implode the CCB and replace with high intensity mixed use.
- Demolish the Marion County Jail and replace with mixed use.
- Demolish or renovate Marion County Jail II and Liberty Hall into private sector, mixed use.
- Potentially build a combination state appellate/county non-criminal courts building elsewhere in the CCB.

Lest anyone complain that you have to have the jail downtown, Chicago doesn't. It's jail and main criminal courts building is in Little Village at 26th and California, a thriving Latino neighborhood where the court traffic actually provides neighborhood retail benefits. An Indy light rail line would provide even better transit service to the new west side jail than Chicago has.

This puts enormous prime downtown land back on the tax rolls and removes several huge barriers to further downtown development, paving the way for both linking the Wholesale District with Mass Ave and expanding the Wholesale District redevelopment zone east along Washington.

Shots of Indianapolis Skyline to Depress Nation During Final Four Broadcast
http://www.theonion.com/articles/shots-of-indianapolis-skyline-to-depress-nation-du,17163/

Before anyone blows a gasket, it's the Onion, a satire newspaper that is hilarious. I think we need to be able to laugh at ourselves from time to time.

Hopefully with the Final Four Indy might make the SSC banner this weekend. I have never actually seen Indy on the banner.

Shots of Indianapolis Skyline to Depress Nation During Final Four Broadcast
http://www.theonion.com/articles/shots-of-indianapolis-skyline-to-depress-nation-du,17163/

Before anyone blows a gasket, it's the Onion, a satire newspaper that is hilarious. I think we need to be able to laugh at ourselves from time to time.
That's hilarious. And they used a picture of Indy so old that it still has Market Square Arena in it!

I'd like to see all of the Courts and Police / Sheriff offices moved out of the CCB and into a new, well designed, approximately 8 - 12 story Courts and Public Safety building - south of the CCB on the south side of Washington Street. By moving all of these public safety and Court rooms out - the majority of the security barricades in the CCB might be able to be removed or at least downsized considerably. The new Public Safety / Courts buildilng would also have a jail component that would link with the existing jail on the southern half of the block where it would be built. With a well designed building balancing the CCB across Washington Street - it would likely make the plaza between the two a more appropriate looking public place.

Sure the layout inside the CCB in the offices isn't as efficient as it possibly could be. I do like the Terrazo floors on every floor in the elevator lobbies. I also like the tall granite rectangular "pillars" that create the entryway as you are going from the plaza area into the inner courtyard in front of the entry doors on the south side of the building. As CDC guy said, it is amazing how busy the building is with pedestrian traffic! At peak times the revolving door entrance on Market Street seems to hardly stop going around - and there are numerous "peak" times during the day.

If IMPD and the courts were to leave the CCB, the east and west wings of the building could go away. This could allow for possible reclaimation of Market Street. Much of the interior of the building is downright nasty, and could definitely use an overhaul.

Hearing on Trail Side (http://www.urbantimesonline.com/?p=1283) coming April 7th.

Thanks for the link Kevin! I bet that is going to be a contentious meeting. I hope that for the sake of the city, this development can move forward.

I have a few questions about the observation deck at the city-county building. Is it open to the public? Does it cost anything? What are the hours that it is open?

I think it is open during the regular business hours of the City-County Building. It is free and open to the public. You take the freight elevator to the 26th floor and transfer to another elevator that takes you up to the 28th. The operator of the second elevator told me that it is open on christmas and thanksgiving at night so that you can see the nighttime skyline. (I am not sure if he meant christmas/thanksgiving eve or day...)

P.S.- You do still have to go through metal detectors to access the observation deck. A little annoying...

I'm all for ensuring the viability of the East End shops, but I'm getting really sick of them talking about the PUBLIC parking spaces around them as if they own them. In essence they're making their complete and utter lack of parking the problem of everyone around them. If all those parking space tweaks on the streets around Mass Ave don't tip the scales, that's a travesty. Trail Side needs to happen yesterday.

I'm all for ensuring the viability of the East End shops, but I'm getting really sick of them talking about the PUBLIC parking spaces around them as if they own them. In essence they're making their complete and utter lack of parking the problem of everyone around them. If all those parking space tweaks on the streets around Mass Ave don't tip the scales, that's a travesty. Trail Side needs to happen yesterday.

In the UT article, the owner says: “People won’t park three blocks away to buy chocolate or go to R Bistro,” he said. That may be true of the East End, but raise your hand if you have parked three blocks away to walk to the Rathskeller or the Chatham Tap or Agio's. Right now, the east end of Mass Avenue, despite some nice shops and restaurants, is desolate and unattractive in appearance, and the intersection of Mass Ave and College isn't very pedestrian-friendly. The current Cultural Trail construction is addressing the latter, and the Trailside would help with the former. And they are complaining about both projects.

Hearing on Trail Side (http://www.urbantimesonline.com/?p=1283) coming April 7th.

This needs to be something we voice our opinion about, people. I will make an effort to be there to support the project.

In the UT article, the owner says: “People won’t park three blocks away to buy chocolate or go to R Bistro,” he said. That may be true of the East End, but raise your hand if you have parked three blocks away to walk to the Rathskeller or the Chatham Tap or Agio's. Right now, the east end of Mass Avenue, despite some nice shops and restaurants, is desolate and unattractive in appearance, and the intersection of Mass Ave and College isn't very pedestrian-friendly. The current Cultural Trail construction is addressing the latter, and the Trailside would help with the former. And they are complaining about both projects.

It's ridiculous. This is a dream come true for the area and they're potentially mucking it all up.

If they want to be in a strip mall with a giant parking lot, they need to move to one.

All they want is the project to be done right. It isn't too much to ask. Trail Side doesn't even have a commitment or anything in writing with the township trustee (which might not even be around if we change the township system) for their current "shared" parking idea. The East End shop owners and stake holders just want smart development. The area will get developed no matter what. They are just pushing to get the best development that they can. If you had a development going in your back yard wouldn't you work to get it done in the best way for your community? I know that everyone is arguing that anything will be better than nothing... but development that has parking is much better than development with out parking AND better than nothing. I hope that everyone will come to an agreeable solution. The East End stake holders want development.




BTW** No one is complaining about the trail. The construction is slow which can be frustrating for a business owner, but no one is against the trail. Actually the East End fought to get the trail to go down Mass Ave. The rest of Mass Ave opposed it, thats why it turns down college and doesn't go all the way down Mass Ave like originally conceived.

I'm all for ensuring the viability of the East End shops, but I'm getting really sick of them talking about the PUBLIC parking spaces around them as if they own them. In essence they're making their complete and utter lack of parking the problem of everyone around them. If all those parking space tweaks on the streets around Mass Ave don't tip the scales, that's a travesty. Trail Side needs to happen yesterday.

Grr. There is plenty of damn parking everywhere in Indianapolis, except maybe at Ivy Tech and IUPUI and Methodist, which is why all are planning and building garages.

When I want to buy from Best Chocolate in Town, I'll walk a block or two if I can't park close. I promise. Their closest (geographic, not necessarily quality) competition is Godiva at Circle Center...and how far do I have to walk from my car there?

All they want is the project to be done right. It isn't too much to ask. Trail Side doesn't even have a commitment or anything in writing with the township trustee (which might not even be around if we change the township system) for their current "shared" parking idea. The East End shop owners and stake holders just want smart development. The area will get developed no matter what. They are just pushing to get the best development that they can. If you had a development going in your back yard wouldn't you work to get it done in the best way for your community? I know that everyone is arguing that anything will be better than nothing... but development that has parking is much better than development with out parking AND better than nothing. I hope that everyone will come to an agreeable solution. The East End stake holders want development.

Then maybe the East Enders should rent the parking lot on College for their 40 or so employees, so that there are spaces available for their customers. Scholars Inn leased off-site parking instead of bitching about the Cultural Trail and Davlan and Mill No. 9 and Real Silk and 707...

"Existing city standards require 165 off-site parking spaces for the mixed-use building. The developers have 136 parking spaces – a 19 percent shortfall."

They're short by 29 spaces. I would argue that that's not even an issue, but just for good measure, they've addressed that shortfall by adding 299 (10 TIMES what they're short) public spaces to the surrounding area.

How is this project not being done right Eddie? Everyone is bending over backwards to support the East End shops.

In my view the best modernist building is the Minton-Capehart Federal Building, which is a superior version of Boston City Hall. Barton Tower isn't bad either.

Is this an early April Fool, or your honest-to-gosh opinion? Those are two of my least favorite Indianapolis buildings, and very least favorite Boston building.

I think it is open during the regular business hours of the City-County Building. It is free and open to the public. You take the freight elevator to the 26th floor and transfer to another elevator that takes you up to the 28th. The operator of the second elevator told me that it is open on christmas and thanksgiving at night so that you can see the nighttime skyline. (I am not sure if he meant christmas/thanksgiving eve or day...)

P.S.- You do still have to go through metal detectors to access the observation deck. A little annoying...
Are the faded photos and 1980s-era posters still up there?

To me the Minton-Capehart building falls into the "so bad it's good" category. Though I despise the location.

Trailside's gotta get approved. Very important.

"Existing city standards require 165 off-site parking spaces for the mixed-use building. The developers have 136 parking spaces – a 19 percent shortfall."

They're short by 29 spaces. I would argue that that's not even an issue, but just for good measure, they've addressed that shortfall by adding 299 (10 TIMES what they're short) public spaces to the surrounding area.

How is this project not being done right Eddie? Everyone is bending over backwards to support the East End shops.

The problem arises from the time shared spaces that don't have any sort of commitment from the trustees. I am sorry but a business relies on contracts. Show the stakeholders binding agreements...

Listen, I'm not against the development, but I can see why the stakeholders are working to get their voices heard. They want development and they want to have some say in how their neighborhood grows. Its simple. I am not trying to pick a fight, everyone just needs to lighten up. It is a process and it will end with a new development.

The problem arises from the time shared spaces that don't have any sort of commitment from the trustees. I am sorry but a business relies on contracts. Show the stakeholders binding agreements...
I'm not sure that lack of a contract is the issue. What do the East End shops care whether the residents are moving their cars? That would be an issue to Center Township Trustee's office, not the shops.

The issue, according to Tom Battista, the owner of the East End shops, is that the contract (when one eventually exists) will result in Trail Side residents moving their cars from the shared lot to the metered parking spaces. Think about that....these are low income residents and they're going to spend 75 cents an hour to park somewhere? That doesn't make any sense.

What's really going to happen is:

(a) They're not going to have a car in the first place (the article mentions that only half of the residents at the Davlan, a similar low-income project on Mass Ave, have cars).
(b) They're going to take their car and go to work.
(c) They're going to move their car where they don't have to spend 75 cents an hour to park.

Just to go on record: I think the City County building looks pretty good. You can't get much more classic 1960 than that building. I like the metal and glass pattern on the main tower. The limestone trim on lower portions of the tower and its side structures is pretty nice also. Overall, I'm fine with it. People bash it a lot - but I think it a pretty decent building. It adds a nice chunk of tower on the east side of downtown. Once we finally get something to go in on the MSA blocks - and the block one street further to the east --it'll be a key part of the rise of towers connecting the near east side residential neighborhoods with the heart of downtown Indy.

I am on record for disliking the tower. I do not mind 1960's classic architecture, but this is something I don't care for. The roof elements as well. Sorry, but alot went down for that thing if I am not mistaken, and I hope something good happens one day, a reskin, or an implode.

Shots of Indianapolis Skyline to Depress Nation During Final Four Broadcast
http://www.theonion.com/articles/shots-of-indianapolis-skyline-to-depress-nation-du,17163/

Before anyone blows a gasket, it's the Onion, a satire newspaper that is hilarious. I think we need to be able to laugh at ourselves from time to time.

Did they 'shop out One Indiana Square or is that an extremely fortuitous angle?

Cf. (http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1339/774859349_443e63ab8a.jpg?v=0)

I'm not sure that lack of a contract is the issue. What do the East End shops care whether the residents are moving their cars? That would be an issue to Center Township Trustee's office, not the shops.

The issue, according to Tom Battista, the owner of the East End shops, is that the contract (when one eventually exists) will result in Trail Side residents moving their cars from the shared lot to the metered parking spaces. Think about that....these are low income residents and they're going to spend 75 cents an hour to park somewhere? That doesn't make any sense.

What's really going to happen is:

(a) They're not going to have a car in the first place (the article mentions that only half of the residents at the Davlan, a similar low-income project on Mass Ave, have cars).
(b) They're going to take their car and go to work.
(c) They're going to move their car where they don't have to spend 75 cents an hour to park.


The point is that the parking plan is thin at best, and the stakeholders in the area have every right to try to push to get as much as they can. And it is not just Mr. Battista, it is every business east of college on Mass ave. (The Art Bank, Mayflower, Indyfringe, Stage rentals, Evolve, Kuaba, Best Chocolate, R-Bistro, Mass Ave Wine Shop... etc.) It is not just a few people on the east end, it is the entire east end. They have every right to work through the proper channels to get the best possible development in their neighborhood. They are doing everything the right way and are just working to make their community better. When people stop caring and stop being involved thats when you get strip malls and bad development. Fighting for the best development they can get is a good thing in my book.


EDIT: Trail side is the one asking to change the rules in the first place. If they want to do the development they need to deal with the concerns of the community. They are asking for concessions to the rules, the stakeholders around the East End are just negotiating the best deal they can.

Shots of Indianapolis Skyline to Depress Nation During Final Four Broadcast
http://www.theonion.com/articles/shots-of-indianapolis-skyline-to-depress-nation-du,17163/

Before anyone blows a gasket, it's the Onion, a satire newspaper that is hilarious. I think we need to be able to laugh at ourselves from time to time.

I love the CCB in the picture! Beautiful.

I'm late to the conversation, but I adore the City-County Building. The entry lobby is so cool, and the remnants of original interior materials are modern yet properly stately.

I think it's preferable for government buildings to be somewhat restrained and serious. They serve a hugely grave function, after all. A courthouse located in a shopping mall - which is what I read, Aaron, when you say "mixed use" - would be completely inappropriate.

Also, I live in the CCB architect's house that he designed for himself, and though it's been quite mucked up by previous owners, it is restrained to the point of being boring - with the exception of some zooty Mod wallpaper hidden in the bathroom closet! Those Modernist architects all loved their martinis, to be sure. ;-)

And, The Onion article cracks me up.

Where did I say I wanted a court house in a shopping mall? I want a criminal courts complex on the west side and a possible standalone appellate court/civil court downtown. The mixed use complex would house city offices of the type that are frequently in rented office buildings. The old "City Hall" would be a true "City Hall" again.

I happen to think that things are going to happen for Indianapolis....

Not if Trailside isn't approved! :)

Not if Trailside isn't approved! :)


They wont kill trailside, they will just negotiate the best deal they can. I have no doubt that it will get developed. I want to see it happen, I can just understand where they are coming from.

Did they 'shop out One Indiana Square or is that an extremely fortuitous angle?

Cf. (http://farm2.static.flickr.com/1339/774859349_443e63ab8a.jpg?v=0)

I think the vantage point in the Onion shot was in the East/College area now occupied by the Indiana Farm Bureau and Anthem. Possibly from the grassy knoll on Lord Street east of East. That angle would completely hide One Indiana/Regions behind the CCB.

Trail side is the one asking to change the rules in the first place. If they want to do the development they need to deal with the concerns of the community. They are asking for concessions to the rules, the stakeholders around the East End are just negotiating the best deal they can.

The Trailside developers are only asking to play by the same relaxed rules as everyone else in the neighborhood. (Batista's building has ZERO parking, a violation of the commercial zoning ordinance that is only possible because he's grandfathered in.)

Don't Plan On It
Centralized city planning is not the answer to the problems facing America's cities.
By Witold Rybczynski (http://www.slate.com/id/2249253/)

Excerpt:

"The important lesson is not that city planning is unimportant but, rather, that urban development should not be implemented by the public sector alone and that in a democracy, a vision of the future city will best emerge from the marketplace. (That it may turn out to be a messy vision, lacking a grand aesthetic, Jane Jacobs long ago acknowledged.)...

"Talk of economic stimulus packages raises the temptation to undertake large publicly planned projects again. This temptation should be resisted. The lessons of the last 50 years should not be forgotten. To rephrase that great city planner, Daniel H. Burnham, make no big plans, only many small ones."

I think the vantage point in the Onion shot was in the East/College area now occupied by the Indiana Farm Bureau and Anthem. Possibly from the grassy knoll on Lord Street east of East. That angle would completely hide One Indiana/Regions behind the CCB.

My guess would be just on the west side of East St. Maybe from the parking lot of the White Castle when it was still there. That concrete retaining wall for the railroad tracks that's in the foreground is now on the north edge of the Anthem/Wellpoint parking lot.

I love the CCB in the picture! Beautiful.

Whoa, I completely forgot about that large transmission tower that used to be on the Barnes and Thornburg building...Interesting.

Whoa, I completely forgot about that large transmission tower that used to be on the Barnes and Thornburg building...Interesting.

I was completely keeping that thing out of my mind and only picturing the Barnes alone. Hey, I love Indy, but I really can do without some buildings and some decisions that have been made over the last 45 years or so. I do however like the Barnes and Thornburg, but the transmission tower did nothing for me.

Ray Lahood in Indy tomorrow
http://www.indystar.com/article/20100401/NEWS05/4010470/U.S.-official-to-tour-Amtrak-repair-shops

http://www.ibj.com/fishers-approves-auto-mall/PARAMS/article/19025

Well, Fishers approved the automall. I only worry that this will have implications on 96th street. Not that I am a fan of the 96th street stretch of dealerships, but in 10 years, will we be saying the same things about that stretch, that we have recently been discussing about N Keystone Ave in Indy?

Am I really the only person on here who likes this plan? There is a lot of talk about wanting density...well, here is your density (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=2879412&id=54966649964&fbid=185551649964). Sure the architecture is a little fakey, but you can't hold out for everything to be perfect.

Well, Fishers approved the automall. I only worry that this will have implications on 96th street. Not that I am a fan of the 96th street stretch of dealerships, but in 10 years, will we be saying the same things about that stretch, that we have recently been discussing about N Keystone Ave in Indy?

Yes, we will. 96th & Keystone was already getting shaggy 5 years ago. Home Place/South Carmel too.

Am I really the only person on here who likes this plan? There is a lot of talk about wanting density...well, here is your density (http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?pid=2879412&id=54966649964&fbid=185551649964). Sure the architecture is a little fakey, but you can't hold out for everything to be perfect.

Looks like a movie-backlot version of Gotham City.

Density is good in Indy ONLY to the extent that work and home and leisure are close or commutable by transit, reducing one's carbon footprint This sort of density is really appropriate near major employment clusters, like Downtown/Lilly, IUPUI/Wishard/Clarian, or even the Way-north Meridian office-park cluster from 86th to 126th.

If you live in that tangle in the middle of Carmel, where will you work and how will you get there? If the answer is 15 miles away, by car, then the density is not really a contributor to greening the metro area.

Looks like a movie-backlot version of Gotham City.

Density is good in Indy ONLY to the extent that work and home and leisure are close or commutable by transit, reducing one's carbon footprint This sort of density is really appropriate near major employment clusters, like Downtown/Lilly, IUPUI/Wishard/Clarian, or even the Way-north Meridian office-park cluster from 86th to 126th.

If you live in that tangle in the middle of Carmel, where will you work and how will you get there? If the answer is 15 miles away, by car, then the density is not really a contributor to greening the metro area.

At their closest points, this development is two miles from the North Meridian office park.

Anyway, it is enough for home and leisure to be close (or for work and home to be close). I live 20 miles from where I work, but in a dense area. If I take the kids to the park, or go out for a cup of coffee, or even most of the times that I go out for dinner, I walk. One day, so will the people who live here (if the original plan is ever completed).

As far as transit goes, you are all the more likely to have public transit once the transit knows where it is supposed to take you.

Looks like a movie-backlot version of Gotham City.

Density is good in Indy ONLY to the extent that work and home and leisure are close or commutable by transit, reducing one's carbon footprint This sort of density is really appropriate near major employment clusters, like Downtown/Lilly, IUPUI/Wishard/Clarian, or even the Way-north Meridian office-park cluster from 86th to 126th.

If you live in that tangle in the middle of Carmel, where will you work and how will you get there? If the answer is 15 miles away, by car, then the density is not really a contributor to greening the metro area.

The City Center project is a mixed-use project with office space, residential space, and restaurant and entertainment space. So, one assumes at least some people will both live AND work in the development, and be able to walk to work. Also, some people will just work in the development, but they will patronize the restaurants and other businesses without having to drive to get a cup of coffee or grab lunch. Additionally, many people will work nearby and it will only be a short commute to City Center to patronize one of the restaurants. Quite frankly, even downtown Indianapolis has lousy public transit service, and the vast majority of people who work downtown drive to work--and many drive quite a distance to get there. So, if the argument is that Indianapolis needs better public transit, I agree, but I think that is a related, yet separate issue.

While the architecture of City Center may be historical pastiche, I fail to see why the density or walkability of the development is a problem. Would low-rise strip-malls or asphalt-surrounded two-story office buildings be a better solution for that area? No, it would not be. Suburban development will continue, whether one likes that development occurs out there or not. It's better that the development that does get built is dense and walkable, rather than spread out and car-focused. Even if the development is not currently serviced by public transit, if more dense nodes like this are constructed, as opposed to spread out development, then it makes it easier to build public transit connections at a later date.

The City Center project is a mixed-use project with office space, residential space, and restaurant and entertainment space. So, one assumes at least some people will both live AND work in the development, and be able to walk to work. Also, some people will just work in the development, but they will patronize the restaurants and other businesses without having to drive to get a cup of coffee or grab lunch. Additionally, many people will work nearby and it will only be a short commute to City Center to patronize one of the restaurants. Quite frankly, even downtown Indianapolis has lousy public transit service, and the vast majority of people who work downtown drive to work--and many drive quite a distance to get there. So, if the argument is that Indianapolis needs better public transit, I agree, but I think that is a related, yet separate issue.

While the architecture of City Center may be historical pastiche, I fail to see why the density or walkability of the development is a problem. Would low-rise strip-malls or asphalt-surrounded two-story office buildings be a better solution for that area? No, it would not be. Suburban development will continue, whether one likes that development occurs out there or not. It's better that the development that does get built is dense and walkable, rather than spread out and car-focused. Even if the development is not currently serviced by public transit, if more dense nodes like this are constructed, as opposed to spread out development, then it makes it easier to build public transit connections at a later date.

I don't disagree with most of your analysis. But I wasn't commenting on the density or walkability, only the development's location. I think you've glossed over the overarching need in an era of energy and water limits for ANY new development or redevelopment to be adequately served with necessities.

That means jobs, groceries, medical services, daycare, schools. For density to make its desired impact (i.e. to reduce single-occupant vehicle-miles, increase water and power conservation, reduce embedded carbon footprint in structure and infrastructure, etc.), development plans need to incorporate those needs specifically, not tangentially or accidentally. And I'm not talking about coffee shops and chi-chi restaurants and high-end delis. Those are luxuries, not necessities.

Merely saying that a district is planned as "mixed use" doesn't make it happen. Are there enough people, close enough together, to support a corner grocery or pharmacy? Will a doctor or dentist have enough patients to pay the rent and earn a living? Will enough kids live there to make daycare costs reasonable? Can kids walk to school? Or will all those "retail" spaces just end up as real-estate and lawyers' offices, or worse, H&R Block dead-spaces?

I am equally critical of any plan for massive urban revitalization that doesn't include those features: why would anyone buy a renovated house on the Near Eastside if they have to drive all over town to support their basic life needs?

I'll restate my main point more sharply: a little bit of manufactured density in the wrong place is pointless. Walking to Starbucks instead of driving through, then driving 15 or 20 miles alone in your car to and from work 5 or 6 times a week isn't the change we need to promote, IMO.

Moving closer to work (if commuting by car) and living in a functioning economic neighborhood is the ticket. That's why commercial redevelopment and public safety in the urban core are so vital. When people know the necessities of life are close at hand and safety is assured, they will consider more-dense living arrangements. Witness the near downtown neighborhoods north from Ohio to 16th, Meridian to College. Relatively dense, walkable, and livable...because they're served by grocery stores, hardware store, dry cleaners, clothing shops, shoe stores, schools, etc. Not because they're some model of designed-in "mixed-use" density.

Nice article on Sun King Brewing:

http://www.indystar.com/article/20100402/BUSINESS/4020384/-1/ARCHIVE/Sun-King-Brewing-is-pouring-it-on

I particularly think it's cool that their parents stopped driving around the country in an RV in order to help come run the brewery!

I need to pick up some cans.

Hey all,

I'm fishing for information here, so I hope I'm not posting in the wrong place. Feel free to guide me along and any information you can provide is great.

I live in a rundown neighborhood near 10th and Tuxedo, close to Brookside Park. A few of my neighbors and I are really interested in cleaning up the stretch of Tuxedo between 10th and Brookside. I'm a realistic person, and I understand that 4 or 5 blocks is a huge undertaking that would take many years, but we feel that we have to start somewhere. We are focusing on one block in particular to start, but if we have some success we'd be really interested in moving on to the next couple of blocks.

We've gotten connected with some folks who have planted many community gardens within Indy and are currently building our own. we have formed a group to continually clean up the block from trash, weeds, etc.

That being said, there's only so much a grassroots effort can do without proper knowledge and backing of the city. There are things lacking like proper curbs, sidewalks, and streetlights that would make an immediate impact on the quality of life and perception of the block.

Do any of you know the best way to petition for those types of improvements? Have any of you started your own initiatives like this? Do the Indy Superbowl 2012 projects reach this far? (Their website didn't really give much info)

Any advice or tips I get is much appreciated. Thanks so much!

Hey all,

I'm fishing for information here, so I hope I'm not posting in the wrong place. Feel free to guide me along and any information you can provide is great.
...
Any advice or tips I get is much appreciated. Thanks so much!

Start with NESCO (the Near East Side Community Organization), which is an umbrella neighborhood organization that covers I-65 to Emerson, Washington to Mass Ave./21st St. and includes your area. Their offices are in the Boner Center at 10th & Jefferson. Website is http://www.nescocommunity.org/

They can direct you to the people who are the leaders of the Brookside area's neighborhood association.

We've gotten connected with some folks who have planted many community gardens within Indy and are currently building our own.

Tyler and Laura?

Start with NESCO (the Near East Side Community Organization), which is an umbrella neighborhood organization that covers I-65 to Emerson, Washington to Mass Ave./21st St. and includes your area. Their offices are in the Boner Center at 10th & Jefferson. Website is http://www.nescocommunity.org/

They can direct you to the people who are the leaders of the Brookside area's neighborhood association.

Thanks for the info. I did some digging and found out that the HoTIF area where they will be pouring new curbs and sidewalks won't be extending farther northeast than 10th and Rural. That's a bit disappointing, as I had heard otherwise.

I will get in touch with the Brookside neighborhood association and the NESCO organization (obviously I'm new to the area, I didn't know about these two orgs) to see what they have to offer.

Anyone who has experience in neighborhood revitalization, please continue to chime in. :)

Tyler and Laura?


I don't know Tyler or Laura--I've been working with a woman named Linda. Perhaps if you know them you could put me in touch with them?

I don't know Tyler or Laura--I've been working with a woman named Linda. Perhaps if you know them you could put me in touch with them?


BigCityFarms (http://www.bigcityfarmsindy.com/?page_id=24)

tyler@bigcityfarmsindy.com

Thanks for the info. I did some digging and found out that the HoTIF area where they will be pouring new curbs and sidewalks won't be extending farther northeast than 10th and Rural. That's a bit disappointing, as I had heard otherwise.

I will get in touch with the Brookside neighborhood association and the NESCO organization (obviously I'm new to the area, I didn't know about these two orgs) to see what they have to offer.

Anyone who has experience in neighborhood revitalization, please continue to chime in. :)

Contact Keep Indianapolis Beautiful at (317) 264-7555. They help revitalize public spaces in neighborhoods throughout the city.

I don't disagree with most of your analysis. But I wasn't commenting on the density or walkability, only the development's location. I think you've glossed over the overarching need in an era of energy and water limits for ANY new development or redevelopment to be adequately served with necessities.

That means jobs, groceries, medical services, daycare, schools. For density to make its desired impact (i.e. to reduce single-occupant vehicle-miles, increase water and power conservation, reduce embedded carbon footprint in structure and infrastructure, etc.), development plans need to incorporate those needs specifically, not tangentially or accidentally. And I'm not talking about coffee shops and chi-chi restaurants and high-end delis. Those are luxuries, not necessities.

Merely saying that a district is planned as "mixed use" doesn't make it happen. Are there enough people, close enough together, to support a corner grocery or pharmacy? Will a doctor or dentist have enough patients to pay the rent and earn a living? Will enough kids live there to make daycare costs reasonable? Can kids walk to school? Or will all those "retail" spaces just end up as real-estate and lawyers' offices, or worse, H&R Block dead-spaces?

I am equally critical of any plan for massive urban revitalization that doesn't include those features: why would anyone buy a renovated house on the Near Eastside if they have to drive all over town to support their basic life needs?

I'll restate my main point more sharply: a little bit of manufactured density in the wrong place is pointless. Walking to Starbucks instead of driving through, then driving 15 or 20 miles alone in your car to and from work 5 or 6 times a week isn't the change we need to promote, IMO.

Moving closer to work (if commuting by car) and living in a functioning economic neighborhood is the ticket. That's why commercial redevelopment and public safety in the urban core are so vital. When people know the necessities of life are close at hand and safety is assured, they will consider more-dense living arrangements. Witness the near downtown neighborhoods north from Ohio to 16th, Meridian to College. Relatively dense, walkable, and livable...because they're served by grocery stores, hardware store, dry cleaners, clothing shops, shoe stores, schools, etc. Not because they're some model of designed-in "mixed-use" density.

Cdc, I don't generally disagree with with your response. However, I restate my point that development will continue in the suburbs, despite the fact that you or I may think the greener alternative is to redevelop the inner-city. Therefore, I would rather see dense, mixed-use suburban development that will encourage some walking over driving and which is more easily linked up to mass transit, as opposed to endless sprawl which ensures ALL errands and other outings will be via car and which is nearly impossible to serve with mass transit connections.

Moreover, until we as a society commit ourselves to improving inner-city public schools, addressing crime and poverty in the inner-city, and investing in our aging inner-city infrastructure, the demand for inner-city living will always be limited to a relatively narrow segment of the population. Generally, the fairly wealthy, the fairly poor, and perhaps the young "up-and-coming" dwell in the inner-city, but most middle-class families live in the suburbs and continue to drive suburban development.

I hope someone is going to take advantage of the nice weather and influx of basketball fans and get some great photos of an all too rare sight in Indy...activity in the streets!