Hong Kong's roads are a free-for-all with Taxis dropping off almost anywhere, street side loading and unloading during rush hours. Given the cramped nature of HK roads why doesn't HK Gov look to introduce 'Red Routes' to optimize some roads for peak travel times?

http://www.tfl.gov.uk/roadusers/finesandregulations/941.aspx

Red routes form a part of London's pro-car policy. They are effectively policies that ensure there is constant flow of traffic on these routes. They are essentially routes that are managed by TfL instead of by boroughs, and they are exactly the same as other routes except that enforcement is more strict.

All roads in HK (except private ones) are managed by TD. Why bother setting up another bureaucratic sub-department that manages one bulk of roads? Surely this would raise managing costs? Surely ensuring a constant flow of cars (instead of buses) are part of a pro-car policy? Surely Hong Kong does better not to have such policies? Surely you haven't thought about that?

The question was more around the enforcing of no drop or stop zones during peak hours on key roads not who arranges them to be swept.

The red-routes are implemented to minimize disturbances on the major trunk roads, so traffic can flow better on the arterials to carry more traffic in and out the London City Centre.

Is HK road really free-for-all for drop-off and pick-up?? Even taxis or red-minibus. You ask a typical car driver would probably get a response it's hard to make drop-off and pick-up easy on the major roadways because of all the restricted zone along the streets. HK doesn't paint the no drop off/pick up and parking area in red, but the typical yellow restricted zone.

Can you park, drop off/pick up on the full length of Hennessey Road, Gloucester Road etc. on HKI?? Nathan Road or Waterloo Rd in Kowloon??

technically yes to some of the above, just suggesting another strategy HK could use to optimise the current road systems, red routes work well and suggesting they would be of no benefit to express routes does not assist in idntifyg roads they could be used on. Say perhaps CheungShaWan road?

In London there's a concept of stopping, waiting, loading and parking, which are all different. With double red lines it only meant do none of the above at any time, which is effectively what Hong Kong's double yellow lines are doing. Besides, taxis in London are allowed to stop at any place to pick up/drop off, except in single or double red lines. In Hong Kong they are not allowed to do that under double yellow lines anyway, so there isn't a need to introduce yet another colour that duplicates the function of what we already have.

These do not seem well regulated with loading and unloading, dropping off, picking up sometime occurring on double yellows. A red line classification could be introduced to assist in congestion management as in several UK cities not just London. They are not for express routes where there is little need (or temptation) to stop but urban thoroughfares, such as Kings road or Hennessey Road or Nathan Road. Driving along one of those this morning there appeared to be a number of vehicles just dropping things off, from newspapers to people to fabric. All these 'drop off' deliveries could of been made outside peak congestion times or just around the corner with minimal effect to the businesses.

These do not seem well regulated with loading and unloading, dropping off, picking up sometime occurring on double yellows. A red line classification could be introduced to assist in congestion management as in several UK cities not just London. They are not for express routes where there is little need (or temptation) to stop but urban thoroughfares, such as Kings road or Hennessey Road or Nathan Road. Driving along one of those this morning there appeared to be a number of vehicles just dropping things off, from newspapers to people to fabric. All these 'drop off' deliveries could of been made outside peak congestion times or just around the corner with minimal effect to the businesses.

Surely you don't know about Red Route loading bays?

And by the way, most Red Routes in London are not busy in terms of their relative business activity. They are just large carriageways that carry lots of cars through, such as Victoria Embankment, Cromwell Road, Park Lane, Holland Park Avenue, Euston Road, etc etc, with not so many shops or pedestrians. This is more or less equivalent to Gloucester Road in Hong Kong. Do you see many people loading stuff on Gloucester Road and blocking traffic? The answer is no, because the numerous restrictions already forbade such activities.

It seems that you like Red Routes to be implemented in other UK cities. You're so pro-car...

These do not seem well regulated with loading and unloading, dropping off, picking up sometime occurring on double yellows. A red line classification could be introduced to assist in congestion management as in several UK cities not just London. They are not for express routes where there is little need (or temptation) to stop but urban thoroughfares, such as Kings road or Hennessey Road or Nathan Road. Driving along one of those this morning there appeared to be a number of vehicles just dropping things off, from newspapers to people to fabric. All these 'drop off' deliveries could of been made outside peak congestion times or just around the corner with minimal effect to the businesses.

Restricted zone in HK means no stopping, loading, pick-up/drop off and parking without a permit or under emergency. It is one rule/one colour for all.
Double yellow line means 24-hour restricted, and single yellow line means periodically restricted as indicated on street signs. The restricted zone sign mounted poles are also painted in different colours to distinct the different restricted time periods. In addition, bus stops are always 24-hour restricted zone even if no lines are painted.
If the driver violates the law, s/he will be ticketed if get caught; or the vehicles can be towed at the owner expense if the vehicle is parked for a long period.

perhaps anti-hawking staff should also police kerbside stopping violations on their patch?

perhaps anti-hawking staff should also police kerbside stopping violations on their patch?

Yeh... and firemen too, right?

Medics in ambulances should be given a right to arrest people :lol:

perhaps anti-hawking staff should also police kerbside stopping violations on their patch?

These red routes or these double red lines only means no stopping, parking, loading, pick-up/drop off if the drivers obey the laws. They mean nothing if the drivers decide to violate the law and take the chance of being prosecuted. If no one enforce the law, and the drivers don't self behave and obey, the red lines still don't mean anything; that's the same as the yellow line.

If the violator is distributing you, you can call the police for help.
In additional to the police, there are also the traffic wardens who regulates and enforce the laws.

obviously it should be traffic wardens but rarely see them working that early, rush hour on main roads does not seem to be their focus of work

To be honest, I don't seem to see anti-hawking staff to be working that early on main roads either...

obviously it should be traffic wardens but rarely see them working that early, rush hour on main roads does not seem to be their focus of work

you don't seem to see them out there, or are they really not out there?
they are two different things.
when they are out there, they would be stationed at more troublesome areas, like the side streets rather than areas you think is a problem, but they actually aren't the most problematic. you don't put resources like this out there just for just showing them.

Perhaps a greater number of tickets can be issued in side streets but the economic impact of miss-use of urban express would probably be more but not measurable. Probably best to have a well publicised 'blitz' of non profit centres every now and then.

Perhaps a greater number of tickets can be issued in side streets but the economic impact of miss-use of urban express would probably be more but not measurable. Probably best to have a well publicised 'blitz' of non profit centres every now and then.

it doesn't matter. for wherever you think this would work, they aren't expressway but local trunk roads. these trunk roads are typically 3 lane in each direction and have frequent bus stops along the way on the left-most lane. the left lane is a defecto travel lane, it is more a drop-off/pick up lane and a turning lane. even if you put private vehicles loading zone in between bus stops, it still would not affect the traffic operation, because only the right two lanes are the true travel lanes.

if you look at where these red-route are in London, they are mostly on narrower arterial where only have 2-lane in each direction. the left lane also serves as bus stops, and loading. which mean it leaves only one travel lane, and a defecto left lane. if the road in HK is only two lane in one direction, it's more likely assigned as either 24 hour and partially restricted zone already.

Some red routes are large arterials but anyway the main points are:

1. Hong Kong does not need red lines that duplicate the function of yellow lines - Red routes forbid stopping, waiting, loading and parking all in one go, which is exactly what yellow lines in Hong Kong do.
2. Hong Kong does enforce stopping restrictions just as London does enforce their red routes.
3. A red route is pro-car in the sense that they promote smooth vehicular (mainly cars in London) traffic and buses are not given top priority on red routes. Hong Kong does not need such pro-car policies.
4. London urban carriageways are generally narrower than Hong Kong's, by the way.

Conclusion: Red Routes are useless in Hong Kong.

[QUOTE=EricIsHim;41456618even if you put private vehicles loading zone in between bus stops, it still would not affect the traffic operation, because only the right two lanes are the true travel lanes. [/QUOTE]

That is the point during rush hour ALL three should be used.

That is the point during rush hour ALL three should be used.

No bus stops?

That is the point during rush hour ALL three should be used.

Even with Red Routes not all lanes are used. As Eric pointed out - buses still have to stop and very few vehicles are able to use the nearside lane!