Where do you think will be the next Central Business District?

[junsanchez]

There's a heated discussion going on in another forum about this topic.

Without batting an eyelash, I'd say it's Santa Rosa, Laguna.

I will cite my reasons later on but i want to know your insights first.

Thank you so much



jun

[lochinvar]

Quezon City's East and North Triangle. They have the space and it's in Metromanila.

[j.r.]

there's already a thread for this, right?

[LhexiMont]

Really where is it . Any link?

[TheRick]

There's a heated discussion going on in another forum about this topic.

Without batting an eyelash, I'd say it's Santa Rosa, Laguna.

I will cite my reasons later on but i want to know your insights first.

Thank you so much



jun


When you say Santa Rosa, Laguna are you thinking the current development in Santa Rosa or with the addition of Eton City and Nuvali?

[in_a_rush]

Quezon City's East and North Triangle. They have the space and it's in Metromanila.

i agree. lalo na kapag natayo ang Grand Central Terminal at ang MRT7 in addition to LRT and MRT. Trinoma and SM north is there pa. It will be one of the best CBD in Asia!

[junsanchez]

there's already a thread for this, right?

Oops! If there is already one, may I request the mod to have this thread fused with the original thread?

Thanks

When you say Santa Rosa, Laguna are you thinking the current development in Santa Rosa or with the addition of Eton City and Nuvali?

Yes, mainly those two and the other developments that are currently going on there.

Kindly check this out:

Best real estate in the Philippines, which will be the next Makati CBD? (http://pinoydreamhousetoday.com/best-real-estate-in-the-philippines-part-1/)

Ayala Land's Nuvali will occupy a total land area of more than 1,700 hectares, 8 times the size of their Makati CBD. It's so vast that it will encompass two cities (Sta. Rosa and Calamba) and one municipality, Cabuyao.

ALI's president himself, Jaime Ayala, said that whatever accomplishments they achieved in Makati, Ayala Alabang, Global City and more will be nothing compared to their vision for Sta. Rosa. And the good thing about Ayala Land is they always deliver on their promises.

FYI, in Ayala Alabang, lots there sold for P350 per square meter in the 80's when it was first launched. Value has appreciated by more than 80 times since. Can you imagine that?

Eton City is another vast project of almost 1,000 hectares.

This is the first time in Philippine history that projects of such scale and grandeur are being undertaken, and all these are happening in Sta. Rosa and its adjoining vicinities.

The University of Santo Tomas will soon construct a teaching hospital in a 44 hectare property in Sta. Rosa; it's 5 times the size of its 21 acre campus in Espana. Aside from medical science courses, it is envisioned to be a center for IT learning.

UST's campus will be so vast that residential and commercial developments will be built inside (for doctors, faculties, families of students?). If I am not mistaken, the property was bought by UST from the Quiros family of Sta. Rosa and the residential project within will be a joint-venture among UST, the Quiros family and the owners of Brittany Corp. It appears that UST has diversified into real estate. I may be wrong, though.

Add to that the rehabilitation of PNR's railway system that will be "double-tracked" from, at least, Caloocan to Calamba, Laguna.

And there are so many more.

Kindly watch the videos in the link I provided to see how close to reality Sta. Rosa will become the next Makati CBD

Thanks

[j.r.]

err... i may be wrong... maybe i'm thinking of another forum... :)

[hecky12]

siguro sa visayas region..

[plmetzen]

Well I know this place is not as big as the proposed CBD in Santa Rosa...but face the facts guys, before all that happens, Filinvest Corporate City will be the real CBD in the next five to ten years because of the proximity between Makati and its entry way to CALABARZON. Santa Rosa is envisioned to be its own city, not a CBD, and sustainable in its own right to be better and not at par with Makati. How crazy it would be for us now to think that Makati will be considered old haha, I just hope it doesn't end up like the way one thinks of the reputation of Malate as an area.

But again before that happens, FCC will be the gateway for it. Here's why: FCC has a direct access from the very end point of the skyway from Makati and a roundabout directly from the South Super Highway. Santa Rosa still has to develop the same level of investment from this crucial highway just to access its areas - at the moment the entry way from the South Luzon Expressway is really tiny compared to FCC. Also, FCC has already underground utilities and it has the main bus and commuting station in the south: South Station, and its only 30% completed from its masterplanned design.

Oh well that's my share :):banana:

Plmetzen

[LhexiMont]

Definitely its FCC as it really accessible via national roads/multi level expressways. The recent rehabilitation of the Alabang Viaduct , the ongoing road expansion of Alabang Zapote road on Muntinlupa city's portion , the current expansion and extension of SLEX the ongoing construction of Skyway stage 2 and the PNR- SouthRail modernization and its proximity to very busy convergence point from all important areas in Metro Manila , Calabarzon and even Bicol, which is Alabang , is definitely a plus factor . It also has a well conceptualized zoning , good infrastructures , road layout that is expansive and greeneries that 's truly beautiful . In a few years time FCC will truly blossomed into a fine business district.

[narthuril]

^^ convergence...

QC CBD

LRT1
LRT2
MRT3
MRT7
MRT9
NLEX
EDSA
Q. Ave

[TeslaCoil]

cebu and cdo should be next. enough of luzon.

[d00dz]

cebu and cdo should be next. enough of luzon.

As much as I'd like for that to happen to Visayas and Mindanao (I'm from Mindanao myself), I just don't see that happening on the same scale as in Luzon.

Most of these CBD developments are highly dependent on private developers and historically speaking, the crux of their efforts are in Luzon (Ayala has a business park in Cebu but its nowhere near the size and success of Fort Bonifacio and Makati).

[Arvor]

http://www.buzzen.com/files/pictures/img_169513_0_46.jpg

Well this is probably not where the next cbd will be but i think that it's where one ought to be but mixed with something different an "olympic city + village" , given the requirement for new athletic infrastructure .

The idea essentially is to reclaim the land on the shores of manila bay next to the mouth of the Pasig river ( place called santa ana ) where they could add river ferry and future PNR stations .

The proposed C6 highway would cut the area in two the olympic or sports city would be located by the lake , where they should build every sporting venue imaginable , from a 100.000 seater world class mega stadium to say inviting wimbledon to set up a large tennis complex , artificial ski slopes & skating , water activities rowing , wind surfing etc along the lake and river , and other venues infrastructures ( athletic university ) and stadiums ( football , baseball , basketball you get the picture ) should be located there , marked by the red X's .

The white X cross is a new housing area i think that they should acquire it ouright and turn it into an athlete sport village , catering to Filipino athletes and from around the world or for housing athletes in say an olympic or other major sporting event .

On the other side of the C6 could conveniently be placed hotels , office buildings and commercial centers indicated by white boxes .

The whole area can then be linked to the Fort Bonifacio cbd , c5 and of course linked to the rest of the city via the c6 river / lake ferry PNR and so on .

This would further increase foreign investments and devlop a proper sports industry from sport related manufacturing to media and events revenue , contributing to an increase in tourism for sporting related events including as ive pointed out foreign athletes .

And perhaps allow the country to host the "Olympics" in the future .

Not to mention that Manila's lake shore seem to have been totally neglected and turned into a forgotten dirty kitchen when it probably could be some of the most stunning and valuable parts of the city , just imagine a new bay boulevard where Manila can witness sunrise in the morning and sunset on it's Manila bay counterpart .

http://www.buzzen.com/files/pictures/img_169513_0_45.jpg

The area opposite on the pasig river bank could probably be transformed into a major PNR cargo terminal and logistics hub coupled to a Laguna lake cargo port terminal which could connect various towns on the lake by container river / lake barges all the way to Manila Bay and it's ports .

On the lake shore of the sports complex they could also perhaps add a Laguna lake ferry terminal where passenger lake ferries can link every town along the lake with the capital spurring further economic development , it would then just be a question of linking the c6 with a lake circumferential highway and rail way line , finally building a couple of marina's and resorts for tourism and recreational water activities , eventually this could also probably help decongest Metro Manila by making it feasible to live in brand new lakeshore towns as people can then reach the city via rail , highway or ferry , obviously the fishing pens would have to go and all that .

It would probably cost billions to develop the laguna bay region but it would also provide a big boost to gdp .

Anyway lol just my two cents which ended up turning into a greater metro manila development fantasy ... .

[Bosnyboy]

For me its downtown manila. They could revive the old and original financial business district in binondo but expanded all the way to the aduana area. I know this could happen if only we have local leaders with a vision. Just imagine hi rise buildings and a commercial strip by the pasig river just like in singapore and nearby the historic intramuros and the lively night shopping area of divisoria.

[Arvor]

Just imagine hi rise buildings and a commercial strip by the pasig river just like in singapore and nearby the historic intramuros and the lively night shopping area of divisoria.

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/mar2009/6/9/singapore-193124982.jpg

Yeah exactly that view of Singapore looks nice :)


But they will have to fix up the port area's if they do something like that , i think they should build a passenger ferry terminal and turn south port into a ferry / cruise terminal only .

http://ikaunangpahina.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/old-manila.jpg

http://img228.imageshack.us/i/intramuros3bx6.jpg/#q=old%20intramuros

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum.posts&forum=75&thread=1389180&page=1
great pics of old manila

On the south bank of the Pasig river i agree that they should continue to restore the intramuros and pull down architechturally incompatible buildings and turn it into a mainly pedestrian area with classical and old style buildings , turning it into a cultural city a place for nightlife , very high end chique and trendy international haute cuisine and cafés top designer clothing boutiques side by side with shops selling traditional Filipino handicrafts , clothing , foodstuffs or other products , a nice touch would be to only have horse drawn carriage traffic and reinstating the old tram line limited inside the city walls .

They should also unclutter the immediate area around intramuros and strictly impose height restrictions and plant more trees , this way you can have a contrast between the new highrises on the north bank and a pictoresque classical southbank , eventually they should also perhaps remodel the entire area around malacanang palace adding a large park and some large boulevards in front of it heading towards the port and the new highrise area .

Malacanang palace is probably one of the few official head of state residences anywhere in the world which is located near slums and other rather ugly and run down neighbourhoods .

[LhexiMont]

Another potential business district for me in Muntinlupa city would be the 400++ hectares of the New Bilibid Prison reservation ( signed by PGMA to be transferred elsewhere) , its proximity to the newest high end villages in Daang Hari such as Portofino , Versailles, Southvale etc. and the planned link road ( C6 component ) that will connect SLEX to Daang Hari will coast along the huge govt. property . Also with still large tracts of lands in the Susana Heights area and the vicinity of Bacoor for development and its nearness to the commercial center area of Portofino , this has real potentials too once the supporting infrastructures are built . The rolling terrain of the area is such an ideal site for a business district coupled with a huge central park for the southern Metro Manilans imho.

[koreanboy]

^^ convergence...

QC CBD

LRT1
LRT2
MRT3
MRT7
MRT9
NLEX
EDSA
Q. Ave

agree ako sa sa QC ang d next n d best CBD in MM SOON.from north to south,and from west to east.^^^^^^

[lochinvar]

"The idea essentially is to reclaim the land on the shores of manila bay next to the mouth of the Pasig river ( place called santa ana ) where they could add river ferry and future PNR stations."

This area has a container terminal and Farola on the north side. The south side has Baseco. I'm pretty sure people in these places will complain with your plan.

[antediluvianist]

Fort Bonifacio still has space to fill up - Global city is just less than one-third of Ft. Bonifacio.

There is also Ft. Boni North, like where Megaworld just won the bid for 8.3 Hectares, and there's plenty more left there; and plenty of land also in Boni South, where at the moment the JUSMAG area is the subject of bids (Boni South extends all the way to the SLEX.)

So, plenty more developments - both commercial and residential - still to come in Ft. Boni. Ft. Boni is the place.

[junsanchez]

First, I congratulate this forum for having very intelligent members who reply based not only on their own personal opinion but also back them up with facts.

I will enjoy it here, you guys are very intelligent and great to interact with. :master:

Well I know this place is not as big as the proposed CBD in Santa Rosa...but face the facts guys, before all that happens, Filinvest Corporate City will be the real CBD in the next five to ten years because of the proximity between Makati and its entry way to CALABARZON. Santa Rosa is envisioned to be its own city, not a CBD, and sustainable in its own right to be better and not at par with Makati. How crazy it would be for us now to think that Makati will be considered old haha, I just hope it doesn't end up like the way one thinks of the reputation of Malate as an area.
Plmetzen

I agree, FCC was was masterfully planned and it was way ahead of its competition in the mid 90's to becoming the next CBD. Unfortunately the 1997 Asian financial crisis hit everyone and its development was protracted.

Fortunately for us, the Philippine government, particularly the Monetary Board put in place several fiscal policies and programs that have protected us so far; precisely the reason why we are not as badly hit by the global economic slowdown that's hitting hard other countries that are much wealthier than our country.

Because of the other factors working in favor FCC, it will rapidly develop even ahead of Sta. Rosa. But saturation point will eventually be reached precisely because of the reason you cited - its relative size.

Great observation , Bro.


Definitely its FCC as it really accessible via national roads/multi level expressways. The recent rehabilitation of the Alabang Viaduct , the ongoing road expansion of Alabang Zapote road on Muntinlupa city's portion , the current expansion and extension of SLEX the ongoing construction of Skyway stage 2 and the PNR- SouthRail modernization and its proximity to very busy convergence point from all important areas in Metro Manila , Calabarzon and even Bicol, which is Alabang , is definitely a plus factor . It also has a well conceptualized zoning , good infrastructures , road layout that is expansive and greeneries that 's truly beautiful . In a few years time FCC will truly blossomed into a fine business district.

I agree. Add to that the proposed construction of C-6 along, mostly the coastline of Laguna Lake. It is meant to hasten traffic from NCR and connect it to the South particularly Muntilupa. How far this C-6 will go (whether it will go beyond Muntinlupa further down south, I have no idea.)

Great observation, Bro.

http://www.buzzen.com/files/pictures/img_169513_0_46.jpg

Well this is probably not where the next cbd will be but i think that it's where one ought to be but mixed with something different an "olympic city + village" , given the requirement for new athletic infrastructure .

The idea essentially is to reclaim the land on the shores of manila bay next to the mouth of the Pasig river ( place called santa ana ) where they could add river ferry and future PNR stations .

The proposed C6 highway would cut the area in two the olympic or sports city would be located by the lake , where they should build every sporting venue imaginable , from a 100.000 seater world class mega stadium to say inviting wimbledon to set up a large tennis complex , artificial ski slopes & skating , water activities rowing , wind surfing etc along the lake and river , and other venues infrastructures ( athletic university ) and stadiums ( football , baseball , basketball you get the picture ) should be located there , marked by the red X's .

The white X cross is a new housing area i think that they should acquire it ouright and turn it into an athlete sport village , catering to Filipino athletes and from around the world or for housing athletes in say an olympic or other major sporting event .

On the other side of the C6 could conveniently be placed hotels , office buildings and commercial centers indicated by white boxes .

The whole area can then be linked to the Fort Bonifacio cbd , c5 and of course linked to the rest of the city via the c6 river / lake ferry PNR and so on .

This would further increase foreign investments and devlop a proper sports industry from sport related manufacturing to media and events revenue , contributing to an increase in tourism for sporting related events including as ive pointed out foreign athletes .

And perhaps allow the country to host the "Olympics" in the future .

Not to mention that Manila's lake shore seem to have been totally neglected and turned into a forgotten dirty kitchen when it probably could be some of the most stunning and valuable parts of the city , just imagine a new bay boulevard where Manila can witness sunrise in the morning and sunset on it's Manila bay counterpart .

http://www.buzzen.com/files/pictures/img_169513_0_45.jpg

The area opposite on the pasig river bank could probably be transformed into a major PNR cargo terminal and logistics hub coupled to a Laguna lake cargo port terminal which could connect various towns on the lake by container river / lake barges all the way to Manila Bay and it's ports .

On the lake shore of the sports complex they could also perhaps add a Laguna lake ferry terminal where passenger lake ferries can link every town along the lake with the capital spurring further economic development , it would then just be a question of linking the c6 with a lake circumferential highway and rail way line , finally building a couple of marina's and resorts for tourism and recreational water activities , eventually this could also probably help decongest Metro Manila by making it feasible to live in brand new lakeshore towns as people can then reach the city via rail , highway or ferry , obviously the fishing pens would have to go and all that .

It would probably cost billions to develop the laguna bay region but it would also provide a big boost to gdp .

Anyway lol just my two cents which ended up turning into a greater metro manila development fantasy ... .

Great concept Bro. Are you an urban planner? You seem to speak the language. And great presentation.

Not too many Filipinos realize this, but I believe our country is one of the most strategically located and best laid out in the world. There are so many property development options in this country and all (if planned and constructed carefully, will surely flourish. Kanya-kanya lang ng panahon.

I also believe that most of these projects don't have to compete with one another; in fact they complement one another.

Look at FCC and Sta. Rosa for example:

Whatever development happens in FCC, Sta. Rosa will eventually benefit from it. Whenever new office buildings, and therefore, businesses go up in FCC, there's a good chance that workers there will now find Sta. Rosa an ideal place to live in, dahil medyo mahal na mga lote at bahay sa Alabang area, sa Sta. Rosa, hindi pa. (baka lang)

Even big-time developers realize this, that's why they do not put all their apples in one basket.

Take the Gotianun's of Filinvest, for example. They didn't bet all their marbles in FCC; they have large investments in Laguna. If I'm not mistaken,they have at least one industrial park in Laguna. And this one I'm sure of, the Gotianuns have a residential project in Laguna Brentville International (http://www.1philippinerealestate.com/brentville-international-laguna-210/) and it's in Sta. Rosa, I believe.

About what you said: It would probably cost billions to develop the laguna bay region but it would also provide a big boost to gdp .

I agree 100%, the Laguna Lake coastline is magnificent. The Ayala's and Mr. Lucio Tan are spending billions to make and maintain man-made lakes in their respective projects in Sta. Rosa. And their projects are magnificent. But if you ask me, the most beautiful piece of real estate in Sta. Rosa are in Bgy Aplaya and Caingin (Please Google Earth them). My ex-wife hails from the latter and they have for their backyard Laguna Lake; the sight is just awesome.

The problem is the people don't seem to realize the kind of real estate they have. Both barangays are in utter squalor and disarray. Sobrang nakakahinayang.

http://images.mirror.co.uk/upl/m4/mar2009/6/9/singapore-193124982.jpg

Yeah exactly that view of Singapore looks nice :)

http://ikaunangpahina.files.wordpress.com/2009/06/old-manila.jpg

http://img228.imageshack.us/i/intramuros3bx6.jpg/#q=old%20intramuros

http://www.mixedmartialarts.com/mma.cfm?go=forum.posts&forum=75&thread=1389180&page=1
great pics of old manila

On the south bank of the Pasig river i agree that they should continue to restore the intramuros and pull down architechturally incompatible buildings and turn it into a mainly pedestrian area with classical and old style buildings , turning it into a cultural city a place for nightlife , very high end chique and trendy international haute cuisine and cafés top designer clothing boutiques side by side with shops selling traditional Filipino handicrafts , clothing , foodstuffs or other products , a nice touch would be to only have horse drawn carriage traffic and reinstating the old tram line limited inside the city walls .

They should also unclutter the immediate area around intramuros and strictly impose height restrictions and plant more trees , this way you can have a contrast between the new highrises on the north bank and a pictoresque classical southbank , eventually they should also perhaps remodel the entire area around malacanang palace adding a large park and some large boulevards in front of it heading towards the port and the new highrise area .

Malacanang palace is probably one of the few official head of state residences anywhere in the world which is located near slums and other rather ugly and run down neighbourhoods .

Again, another very insightful observation and suggestions. It's true that Manila has become ugly and congested, in fact Forbes.com ranks it as the most congested city in the world (http://www.forbes.com/2006/12/20/worlds-most-congested-cities-biz-energy-cx_rm_1221congested_slide_2.html?thisSpeed=30000)

At hindi naman dahil pumangit na ang isang lugar ay hindi na maibabalik sa dating kaayusan. Your suggestions are great and the people running Manila owe to hear those advise.

By the way, who made that rendering of the cityscape with buildings that look like Singapore; that's awesome. Is there a software (freeware, I hope) that I can use to make one like that?

Thanks a lot, Bro.

Again, the issue of what the next Makati CBD is? is at best a matter of opinion. Walang tama o maling sagot. It will depend on how these big-time developers will play their cards and how they will market their projects. Pero lahat yan pwedeng maging CBD.

I appreciate all your very insightful comments, opinions and suggestions; they have made me more knowledgeable now than before I read them.

But I will leave you a video. I have watched and listened to this video maybe a hundred times. And this is why I'm still adamant as to my opinion of what the next CBD is.

BTW, I'am not a real estate agent or broker, I'm not selling this property. I'm a property consultant specializing in economic and marketing research.

Please watch this video intently and listen to every word.

The Next Makati CBD (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rzv2I3ig5Hk&feature=player_embedded)

Ang gagaling nyo, guys. I look forward to more of this kind of enlightening discussions.

Thanks


jun

[Arvor]

This area has a container terminal and Farola on the north side. The south side has Baseco. I'm pretty sure people in these places will complain with your plan.

Im sure they would but for the greater good of the country sometimes hard decisions must be made , however i believe that there should be just compensation for private property and for landless squatters relocation to proper and adequate social housing .

[Arvor]

Hello

Are you an urban planner?

I guess like most kids you either dream of becoming a pilot or an architect , unfortunetely im neither im just a guy with an interest in architecture and or urban planning , i otherwise work for an airline .

My ideas on urban planning i guess is partly influenced by living in Europe which one can't argue has a very efficient and integrated infrastructure ( road , rail , maritime/riverine , air ) , while having some of the most livable cities with quite aesthetically pleasing architecture .

In particular cities over here usually have ring highways which being a regular user does make me see the utility of having something similar around Manila .

Looking at Laguna bay on google earth from an altitude one would immediately see what looks like a neglected pearl on Manila's doorstep , just screaming with potential for urban development being located right smack in the middle of a greater Manila metropolis .

I think that the way Metro Manila is defined or Mega Manila must change and see it as a larger integrated region with Angeles city as it's northern outskirts , Subic to the west and as far south as Batangas and Lucena city as it's southern gate , while the Quezon , Infanta port city concept on the east coast of Luzon being it's eastern perimiter .

This region requires an advanced integrated transport infrastructure to allow urban development to kick into a higher gear , essentially basing it on the way Tokyo and it's surrounding towns and cities have developed togheter and overtime turning into a mega metropolis with a gdp the size of a small developed country all on it's own .

I particularly like the Infanta idea because it could probably capture alot of container traffic especially from south east asia towards the America's , the south Pacific and vice versa , imagine container ships from the America's and Australia/NZ unloading containers in Infanta and for those containers to be transported by rail , air and or river/lake barges to Manila bay and it's ports on their way to the rest of Asia , essentially turning Infanta and Manila into a regional logistics hub , with similar ports perhaps on the north coast of Luzon which they are also planning we could capture traffic from China and elsewhere turning Luzon into one of the premier logistics hubs in Asia and even the world .

Alot of these idea's already exist as official policies in some form or the other and plans to develop them as can be attested to by the many threads on this forum , it's just unfortunate that the country lacks sufficient capital or finances to fund it all at the same time , but if they can keep up the development pace there is no doubt that in time the Phillipines could truelly become one of the larger and top economies of Asia .

By the way, who made that rendering of the cityscape with buildings that look like Singapore; that's awesome. Is there a software (freeware, I hope) that I can use to make one like that?

Well actually that was just a famous view of Singapore which i took from the net and posted on here , the other images with the maps were simply from google earth which i modified with a basic photoshop program , otherwise there are quite a few architect programs out there like 3d architect for beginers and others that increase in complexity for real pro's , otherwise there are also alot of animation programs out there like maya , milkshape 3d or others and some probably are freeware .

At hindi naman dahil pumangit na ang isang lugar ay hindi na maibabalik sa dating kaayusan.

I totally agree and despite calling parts of Manila ugly and or congested it's only because i actually see alot of potential for it as im sure alot of skyscrapercity members do :) , and like you ive also been pleasantly surprised to read alot of good idea's and projects on this site from fellow members .

---

Btw the old Santa Ana racetrack is being closed down and moving the track to cavite with plans to turn the old grounds into a new development a new mall .

http://gogirlcafe.jennyo.net/?p=493=1 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/index.html?curid=20414031: here's a few interesting articles on it .

[LhexiMont]

First, I congratulate this forum for having very intelligent members who reply based not only on their own personal opinion but also back them up with facts.

I will enjoy it here, you guys are very intelligent and great to interact with. :master:



I agree, FCC was was masterfully planned and it was way ahead of its competition in the mid 90's to becoming the next CBD. Unfortunately the 1997 Asian financial crisis hit everyone and its development was protracted.

Fortunately for us, the Philippine government, particularly the Monetary Board put in place several fiscal policies and programs that have protected us so far; precisely the reason why we are not as badly hit by the global economic slowdown that's hitting hard other countries that are much wealthier than our country.

Because of the other factors working in favor FCC, it will rapidly develop even ahead of Sta. Rosa. But saturation point will eventually be reached precisely because of the reason you cited - its relative size.

Great observation , Bro.




I agree. Add to that the proposed construction of C-6 along, mostly the coastline of Laguna Lake. It is meant to hasten traffic from NCR and connect it to the South particularly Muntinlupa. How far this C-6 will go (whether it will go beyond Muntinlupa further down south, I have no idea.)

Great observation, Bro.





jun

Really ?? FCC was way ahead before.. I hope that developments in FCC will pick up once again since its the one and only of quite a huge development in the southern Metro Manila comparable in size to Makati and BGC which together with Ortigas is relatively still very close to each other as compared to FCC which is all by its lonesome but have smaller business districts ( Madrigal B.P. and the upcoming Lakefront Central ) near it . In case FCC gets really filled up , there's still the much bigger NBP Reservation which has a wonderful topography as well.

[d00dz]

Really ?? FCC was way ahead before.. I hope that developments in FCC will pick up once again since its the one and only of quite a huge development in the southern Metro Manila comparable in size to Makati and BGC which together with Ortigas is relatively still very close to each other as compared to FCC which is all by its lonesome but have smaller business districts ( Madrigal B.P. and the upcoming Lakefront Central ) near it . In case FCC gets really filled up , there's still the much bigger NBP Reservation which has a wonderful topography as well.

Is the developer putting a lot of effort into FCC? I actually forgot about it until reading about it in this forum so I have the impression that the developer has put the project on a low priority. Its not even heavily marketed anymore.

[[kq90]]

Is the developer putting a lot of effort into FCC? I actually forgot about it until reading about it in this forum so I have the impression that the developer has put the project on a low priority. Its not even heavily marketed anymore.

FCC is doing very well considering that it is far from other developed areas like Makati and Ortigas. It is the first city-project master-planned by Filinvest - the only other development of the same scale that Filinvest has is their development in Cebu. There are a lot of developments in FCC. The only reason as to why it does not look as developed as other developments is because of its sheer scale. Ongoing and upcoming projects like ENTRATA, Acacia Grove Hotel, Bellevue 2, Vector One and Two, Lavie Flats, and soon to be launched projects like The Levels and Studio City prove that the development has not been abandoned.

Beside Filinvest is Madrigal Business Park, which is a business park development by the Ayalas. It is home to some noteworthy developments of its own. Although MBP (Madrigal Business Park) is not as developed as other Ayala developments, it is still very much more developed than many other master-planned business centers.

Besides offices, hotels, and condominiums, FCC and MBP are home to the south's finest shopping and dining areas. The area is home to Alabang Town Center, Westgate, Festival Supermall, South Station, and soon, Entrata (which houses two floors of retail establishments). The area is also rich in supermarkets with South Supermarket, S&R, Makati Supermarket, Puregold, Shopwise, and SM SaveMore.

I can hardly see how FCC is in low priority. It may not be the most rapid development around, but it is very much still alive as a development.

[lochinvar]

"Im sure they would but for the greater good of the country sometimes hard decisions must be made...."

Let me reiterate, in your map you stressed the development of the east side (the source of the Pasig) but you mentioned the west side (the mouth of the Pasig).

"The idea essentially is to reclaim the land on the shores of manila bay next to the mouth of the Pasig river ( place called santa ana ) where they could add river ferry and future PNR stations."

Now which one is it really?

[Arvor]

Now which one is it really?

Alright by "Manila bay" to be clear i meant Manila's other bay the Laguna bay , which is indicated on the map ive posted .

[LhexiMont]

;43812270']FCC is doing very well considering that it is far from other developed areas like Makati and Ortigas. It is the first city-project master-planned by Filinvest - the only other development of the same scale that Filinvest has is their development in Cebu. There are a lot of developments in FCC. The only reason as to why it does not look as developed as other developments is because of its sheer scale. Ongoing and upcoming projects like ENTRATA, Acacia Grove Hotel, Bellevue 2, Vector One and Two, Lavie Flats, and soon to be launched projects like The Levels and Studio City prove that the development has not been abandoned.

Beside Filinvest is Madrigal Business Park, which is a business park development by the Ayalas. It is home to some noteworthy developments of its own. Although MBP (Madrigal Business Park) is not as developed as their other developments, it is still very much more developed than many other master-planned business centers.

Besides offices, hotels, and condominiums, FCC and MBP are home to the south's finest shopping and dining areas. The area is home to Alabang Town Center, Westgate, Festival Supermall, South Station, and soon, Entrata (which houses two floors of retail establishments). The area is also rich in supermarkets with South Supermarket, S&R, Makati Supermarket, Puregold, Shopwise, and SM SaveMore.

I can hardly see how FCC is in low priority. It may not be the most rapid development around, but it is very much still alive as a development. Very well explained , in defense of the seemingly lack of developments in FCC, I am quite interested what is Vector 1& 2 project an office or residential? Entrata looks promising and I really think it will boosts the business district since its the first mixed- use center in the area in a very prominent location. Hopefully with the completion of stage 2 of Skyway, FCC will also complete the widening of its segment in Alabang Zapote road to its fullest with an underpass at Northgate area , I also wish for the full opening of their Filinvest Avenue from the SLEX tollgate until the AZ road complete with lightposts and spacious sidewalks complementf by its bountiful greeneries. This should be their premiere road ( as in Ayala Avenue to Makati )that needs to be revved up to perk up FCC in my opinion as its also the longest boulevard in their road network.

[Arvor]

FCC will also complete the widening of its segment in Alabang Zapote road to its fullest with an underpass at Northgate area

Are there any plans to widen the whole road ? .

[LhexiMont]

Vector 1 and 2 is the former I-hub 3&4 from what I read in the net also, a twin office building in Northgate , its on its finishing touches on its exteriors right now

[LhexiMont]

Are there any plans to widen the whole road ? .

That I don't know but in the Muntinlupa segment from Ayala Alabang /FCC/ South Station tollgate it will be at least 6 lanes while it will remain at 4 lanes within the Las Pinas segment. Its difficult to widen the road in LP area coz both sides of the road is built up with commercial structures and its the only major road in the LP area that's why traffic is horrendous there .

[lochinvar]

"its the only major road in the LP area that's why traffic is horrendous there."

Add to that the water problem. :ohno:

[j.r.]

"its the only major road in the LP area that's why traffic is horrendous there."

Add to that the water problem. :ohno:

^^^^water problem? you mean, madaling bumaha? :ohno:

[Arvor]

Its difficult to widen the road in LP area coz both sides of the road is built up with commercial structures and its the only major road in the LP area that's why traffic is horrendous there .

Yeah indeed , well i havn't been back in a few years but our family has some places in Pilar and BF homes and as far as i could remember even in the early 80's traffic was already heavy , so i was kindof hoping theyve finally also developed plans for that road or some way to decongest that area , but ohwell maybe someday :cheers: .

http://www.buzzen.com/files/pictures/img_169513_0_51.jpg

I would'v liked to have seen ( in red ) some kind of new highway or at least a large boulevard from the SM on the Alabang Zapote rd to connect with the Aguinaldo hgwy somewhere south in Dasmarinas , and to the north toward the airport cutting through BF homes and Paranaque connecting to the SLEX and C5 .

Thing is at the moment there are really only two ways of heading north into Manila SLEX or via Manila bay from that area , there is a lack of major roads north in between so that traffic is forced on to these few horizontal rds between SLEX and Roxas blvd Manila bay , i also hope that the c6 someday becomes a real bypass highway and encompass not just MM but the entire lake in part parallel to SLEX , it would just do a world of good for the whole city/region .

[junsanchez]

;43812270']FCC is doing very well considering that it is far from other developed areas like Makati and Ortigas. It is the first city-project master-planned by Filinvest - the only other development of the same scale that Filinvest has is their development in Cebu. There are a lot of developments in FCC. The only reason as to why it does not look as developed as other developments is because of its sheer scale. Ongoing and upcoming projects like ENTRATA, Acacia Grove Hotel, Bellevue 2, Vector One and Two, Lavie Flats, and soon to be launched projects like The Levels and Studio City prove that the development has not been abandoned.

Beside Filinvest is Madrigal Business Park, which is a business park development by the Ayalas. It is home to some noteworthy developments of its own. Although MBP (Madrigal Business Park) is not as developed as other Ayala developments, it is still very much more developed than many other master-planned business centers.

Besides offices, hotels, and condominiums, FCC and MBP are home to the south's finest shopping and dining areas. The area is home to Alabang Town Center, Westgate, Festival Supermall, South Station, and soon, Entrata (which houses two floors of retail establishments). The area is also rich in supermarkets with South Supermarket, S&R, Makati Supermarket, Puregold, Shopwise, and SM SaveMore.

I can hardly see how FCC is in low priority. It may not be the most rapid development around, but it is very much still alive as a development.

Ayun, ganda nang sagot ni Bro kq90.

If I may add, Wilcon Depot built its biggest branch in FCC. It did so because they see that FCC has so many kick-ass developments in the pipeline, many of which I only learned now from Bro kq90.

One good thing about Filinvest, according to the grapevine, is that it's owners, the Gotianuns, are known in the industry for being straight players, well-respected and they always deliver what they promise, sometimes more. In real estate, character and integrity of the developer comes over and above the size of his wallet.

Another thing, in the few years that I have been observing real estate and construction in the Philippines, I have seen that construction starts, and therefore, real estate, always swell after a general election. I reckon because of the massive expenditures during the campaign period and on election day itself in the entire country. It's like the general election has become a means to pump-prime the economy.

For example, remember the presidential race between GMA and FPJ in 2004? Based (http://pinoydreamhousetoday.com/PDF/STUDY%20ON%20THE%20PHILIPPINE%20CONSTRUCTION%20INDUSTRY.pdf) on NSO's figures, construction starts in 2005 suddenly increased by a massive 23%. That, I think, wasn't normal considering that it already increased by 4.8% in 2003 and then 9.9% in 2004. The same thing happened after the 1998 general election when Erap won (I don't have the exact figure, though).

In spite of the many naysayers, I strongly believe that the local real estate industry is about to experience a Renaissance. Ngayon pa lang medyo malakas na, especially the single-detached and apartment units (which means, there's steady demand for them from renters). And there's a general election next year. Townhouses are also fairing well. It's condominiums that are kinda suffering because of glut.

So if I were you, if you have the resources or, at least a workable financial plan to buy a property (at least a land), I suggest you start planning now while they are still priced relatively low. Enter the market as early as you can and don't wait for the next general election to pass. By then, I'm certain prices of properties will already be prohibitive for many of us.

[junsanchez]

That I don't know but in the Muntinlupa segment from Ayala Alabang /FCC/ South Station tollgate it will be at least 6 lanes while it will remain at 4 lanes within the Las Pinas segment. Its difficult to widen the road in LP area coz both sides of the road is built up with commercial structures and its the only major road in the LP area that's why traffic is horrendous there .

I agree, it's very unlikely that that road can still be widened. Technically it can be done like what they did with Sucat Road several years ago. But to do it today in Alabang-Zapote road is not feasible; so many big commercial establishments will be hit.

Maybe, the solution to ease traffic there is to come up with an innovative transport infrastructure system and an effective traffic management system. Whatever they do, traffic on that road should be solved, period. It's a major bottleneck that hinders full development of Las Pinas, in general, and FCC, MBP, in particular.

[junsanchez]

Let me reiterate, in your map you stressed the development of the east side (the source of the Pasig) but you mentioned the west side (the mouth of the Pasig).

"The idea essentially is to reclaim the land on the shores of manila bay next to the mouth of the Pasig river ( place called santa ana ) where they could add river ferry and future PNR stations."

Now which one is it really?

I don't know about the ferry, but PNR (http://www.pnr.gov.ph/) will never put a railway there; click the Project tab in their website.

BTW, the guy who made that statement was not stating a fact. His hobby is urban planning and he was just explaining to us his concept of how Metro Manila and the outlying vicinities should be designed or planned. And his ideas are mostly great.

Thanks

[3cr]

Hands down Fort Bonifacio is the next important CBD on the rise. The Fort Bonifacio/BGC boom continues despite of the global slowdown which is a good sign and it definitely looks like it's really just a matter of time now for its CBD to come to fruition. And at the rate it's going, Fort Bonifacio/BGC will definitely surpass Ortigas/Mandaluyong for the no.#2 spot in the coming years especially once the unified stock exchange moves in the neighborhood. The article said possibly as soon as 3 years time! Amazing! Perhaps even snatch the no.#1 spot from Makati after that! And actually this is not impossible but quite realistic considering the total Fort Bonifacio campus up for development is bigger than that of Makati's total area!


Bonifacio Global City expects to equal Makati space by 2012
http://www.bworldonline.com/BW092109/content.php?id=046


THE BONIFACIO Global City expects to become as big as Makati in terms of floor area in three years, the developer of the former military reservation in Taguig said, pointing to the mushrooming of condominiums, corporate headquarters, and retail businesses.

This would be a huge change from what used to be viewed as just an alternate route to the Makati central business district (CBD).

In a statement, the Fort Bonifacio Development Corp. (FBDC) said it expects Bonifacio Global City’s gross floor area to hit 2.6 million square meters (sq. m.) by 2012 or more than twice the figure today. Citing various studies, FBDC said it expects the supply of residential units to reach 8,442 units — at par with Makati’s and surpassing Ortigas’ 7,000 units.

Property analysts have projected Bonifacio Global City to come out of depressed prices first. Rates in Fort Bonifacio fell by a fifth to P550 per sq. m. in the second quarter.

This was slower compared to the 42% drop in the price of prime offices in the Makati district to P700 per sq. m. from April to June. Property experts expect land prices at Fort Bonifacio to go up in the future as it dethrones Ortigas Center in Pasig as an alternative CBD three to five years from now.

"The vision is to create an ideal and balanced lifestyle with sufficient time for work and recreation. By creating an environment that fosters such a balance, we hope to attract locators who will contribute further to this goal," Noel Kintanar, FBDC head of commercial operations, said.

FBDC is a joint venture between Ayala Land, Inc. and Campos-led Evergreen Holdings, Inc., as well as the government’s Bases Conversion and Development Authority. Ayala Land and Evergreen bought the controlling stake in the property firm from Metro Pacific Investments Corp. in 2003.

With the opening of the Bonifacio High Street commercial center, FBDC said the development is spreading northward through the "City Center North" area, which has 14 commercial lots that are around 2,000 sq.m. each.

Aside from City Center North, other developments include a science museum — The Mind Museum — which is expected to draw 250,000 visitors annually upon completion in 2011.

"This will be in addition to plans to expand and upgrade the transport system and other systems, infrastructure, and amenities that will ensure a city that works," FBDC said.

Fort Bonifacio dates back to the American colonial period, when the US government acquired land in Taguig for military purposes. After Philippine independence, the area, known then as Fort William McKinley, was renamed Fort Bonifacio and became the home of the Philippine Army and later, the Philippine Marines.

When Fort Bonifacio land was privatized in 1995 and placed under the administration of the Bases Conversion and Development Authority, the whole area was restored to Taguig.

High-end residential condominiums include Essensa, Serendra, Pacific Plaza and Regent Parkway, Forbeswood Heights, and Kensington. Office buildings include Net Square, Bonifacio Technology Center, the HSBC Building, Hanjin Philippines, and the Singapore Chancery.

More projects are set to rise on the area, which include the six-star, 60-storey Shangri-La at the Fort which would have 500 hotel rooms and 234 apartments. It is scheduled to open in 2012.

The Philippine Stock Exchange is planning to build a unified headquarters at Fort Bonifacio, leaving its offices in Makati and Ortigas.

The 14-storey St. Luke’s Medical Center, which will have 600 beds and an 11-storey medical arts building with 366 doctors’ offices, will open this year.

Fort Bonifacio will also become the site of the country’s tallest building, the 66-storey skyscraper Federal Land Tower costing P20 billion. — Kristine Jane R. Liu

[bustero]

Probably best to define "next cbd"

If it is meant to be the premier cbd (e.g. from manila to makati) then perhaps the fort and only the fort has a shot, even Ortigas has no chance and I'm not even sure the Fort will surpass Makati, even in the long run as the country's premier central business district.
On the other hand for a mega city like Manila, it's only right that there are cbd clusters preferably linked with mass transport.
The fort, Alabang, Bay Area , North triangle and perhaps even down south will probably develop well.

Modern Urban Planning leans toward denser clusters with more pedestrian commutes as much as possible resulting in Smaller environmental footprints. Having multi clusters make sense. That way we don't have urban sprawl.

[antediluvianist]

The next CBD? Underwater.

[mochini]

Di ba puro condo jan sa BGC? Pano maging next Makati? Baka next Salcedo Village?

[august88boy]

Di ba puro condo jan sa BGC? Pano maging next Makati? Baka next Salcedo Village?

yup, daming condo.
even the proposed north bonifacio area will be 90% residential.

but i think the number of commercial/office bildings in BGC now is half that of residential. not bad.

[Aziza1121]

Di ba puro condo jan sa BGC? Pano maging next Makati? Baka next Salcedo Village?

Not only residential condos...We have various international schools, a couple of Diplomatic Embassy, banks, an Ayala mall, restos, shops, grocery, a world-class hospital, HQs of international companies, etc...

[antediluvianist]

"Not only residential condos...We have various international schools, a couple of Diplomatic Embassy, banks, an Ayala mall, restos, shops, grocery, a world-class hospital, HQs of international companies, etc... "

Absolutely. Plus the Mind Museum, being put up by the same company that put up Singapore's excellent science museum, and other things not enumerated above, such as a 6-star hotel and a 5-star hotel and an Arts Center. Plenty of things in BGC aside from residential condos; many of these non-condos are not up yet , but are in construction or planned. BGC has years of further development coming.

[WANCH]

Even if new CBDs are popping out. Makati will still be the main one in Metro Manila for a long time. There are still room for developments there the fact that some old buildings are being torn down and new ones sprouting.

As for other CBDs, they are mostly building condos. Office buildings are less and are built shorter compared to their residential counterparts especially at The Fort. Also, the majority of the offices in The Fort are BPO based. Makati on the other hand is multi sectored.

[antediluvianist]

"As for other CBDs, they are mostly building condos. Office buildings are less and are built shorter compared to their residential counterparts especially at The Fort. Also, the majority of the offices in The Fort are BPO based. Makati on the other hand is multi sectored. "


Again, it should be borne in mind that less than 15% of Ft. Boni is up at this time.

Of course many of the stores will not go up until more of the residential buildings are already up; otherwise who will buy anything in the stores.

One example of not seeing the offices coming up : wait for the big Embassy of China compound, and the Embassy of Singapore compound.

Others, just off the top of my head : the PSE and Shangrila and Hyatt. The DBP. The expanded SnR. The really big Metrobank Headquarters complex, which in fact will be the tallest building in the Philippines. There are so many commercial buildings going up and no, most of them are not BPOs.

What you see at The Fort is just the START of The Fort. Can't form conclusions on the relatively few buildings out there now.

[herbs]

There's a heated discussion going on in another forum about this topic.

Without batting an eyelash, I'd say it's Santa Rosa, Laguna.

I will cite my reasons later on but i want to know your insights first.

Thank you so much



jun


Di kaya delikado para sa mga eroplanong nagti-take of at nagla-landing sa NAIA kung magkakaroon man ng matataas na building sa Santa Rosa, Laguna?

[alabster]

If the geological considerations are under control, I would think that the Manila Bay Area, with Alphaland, Pagcor City, Genting and Megaworld, SMX, MOA, Federal Land, Anchorland etc. has a good chance of being the next CBD should they pattern it after the Singapore model, that of having a freeport/trading area.

The Manila Bay area is also more dynamic than Makati and Fort in terms of locators (Casinos, Hotels, SMX, a proposed time share yacht club, cruise lines, etc). The next step for the area is to have it masterplanned like BGC so there will be zoning, PEZA incentives, restrictions, parks, and a sound vehicle and pedestrian network to control traffic and encourage tourists and locals to visit the areas.

Multinationals will consider this as an office site if all the developers plan their moves as a team so that they can market the entire area instead of selling their own kingdoms and projects by cluster.


:)

[todjikid]

^^ convergence...

QC CBD

LRT1
LRT2
MRT3
MRT7
MRT9
NLEX
EDSA
Q. Ave

and SLEX through C5!

and LUCIO
and AYALA

and the top UNIVERSITIES (academe-industry partnership.)


kaya lang...


daming informal settlers!
sobrang corrupt ng city hall.

[Henz]

Even if new CBDs are popping out. Makati will still be the main one in Metro Manila for a long time. There are still room for developments there the fact that some old buildings are being torn down and new ones sprouting.

As for other CBDs, they are mostly building condos. Office buildings are less and are built shorter compared to their residential counterparts especially at The Fort. Also, the majority of the offices in The Fort are BPO based. Makati on the other hand is multi sectored.

i agree.. Makati will still be the CBD for still a long long time....


In Vismin.. the South Road Properties ( SRP) in Cebu will be the next CBD.
With Filinvest developing a 60 hectare area and SM building the smaller version of MOA in its 30 hectare property there, we can see that in the next 10 years of the realization as the undsiputed CBD within Vismin.

[darknyt1]

Its probably the Fort. Construction of buildings is tremendous even though it is more residential. More offices will be constructed as office boom commence. In reality, it would take long years before it would surpass Makati.

[Henz]

i agree.. Makati will still be the CBD for still a long long time....


In Vismin.. the South Road Properties ( SRP) in Cebu will be the next CBD.
With Filinvest developing a 60 hectare area and SM building the smaller version of MOA in its 30 hectare property there, we can see that in the next 10 years of the realization as the undsiputed CBD within Vismin.


Here is what will the Cebu SRP will look like.. after a few years...

http://i62.photobucket.com/albums/h102/cebupics3/SRP/SRPdevtplan.jpg

[Henz]

A perspective of SM Commercial Complex at the SRP in the next five years...
The perspective was released just today......

http://img94.imageshack.us/img94/7104/smsrp.jpg

SM alone planned to built the largest Mall in Vismin in SRP, a convention center (SMX).. a hotel, school ( National University) a Hospital and several residential condominiums to be handled by the SM Residences...

Filinvest Land, Inc. will also unveil its plans for its 60 ha. property in the SRP in a few days...

This is also to mention the plan of a Korean investor who plans to put up the Phillipines tallest hotel at 50 storey, a convention and Casino on the place...

[Henz]

A clearer view of SM property in the future CBD of Vismin...

http://img80.imageshack.us/img80/7104/smsrp.jpg