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Liverpool in the media

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3M views 22K replies 464 participants last post by  Howie_P 
#1 ·
This thread is for representations of Liverpool in the media and any issues raised by how the city is represented.

As I write, there is a piece on Radio 4's Today programme about the UNESCO visit to Liverpool, and the danger of the city losing its WHS if it goes ahead with the museum.

The key narrative appears to be: Can the city remain faithful to its past whilst growing?

I have to say that it is an informed, balanced piece.

It ended with a statement to the effect that if UNESCO doesn't accept the arguments by LCC, EH, CABE, Liverpool might have to contemplate pulling out of the WHS club.

What do you think?
 
#5,742 · (Edited)
http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01pkmmh/Flog_It!_Series_11_Cheshire/

Flog It! comes from the stunning gardens at Tatton Park in Cheshire, and also from Liverpool's historic docks.

Meanwhile, Paul takes a closer look at the lost treasures of Liverpool - some of its historic buildings which may no longer exist, but have left a lasting imprint on the city.

^^^^^^
Including Liverpool Castle, Customs House, Sailors Home and Overhead Railway.
 
#5,745 ·
Interesting this. Of all the songs that appeared on the Christmas TOTP yesterday only the Justice Collective's 'He's not heavy' was not identified by the name of the band nor that of the song. Before it came on, it was introduced with "here's your Christmas number one". And at the end: "well that was your Christmas number one", after which the programme ended. Good old BBC.
 
#5,746 ·
Interesting this. Of all the songs that appeared on the Christmas TOTP yesterday only the Justice Collective's 'He's not heavy' was not identified by the name of the band nor that of the song. Before it came on, it was introduced with "here's your Christmas number one". And at the end: "well that was your Christmas number one", after which the programme ended. Good old BBC.
Well yes, it was prerecorded a week last Thursday before they could know who was number 1. If James Arthur had been number 1 then his live performance would have been slotted into the bit where the Justice Collective was with the same generic links.
 
#5,748 ·
I understood the lack of a specific mention to be down to the reason mentioned by gottago. That said, by the day of recording it was pretty obvious that the battle for Christmas Number One was a two-horse race. Surely it wouldn't have taken that long to record two versions, one for each single (perhaps even still doing a third generic one like the one they used just in case an unexpected outsider grabbed the top spot at the last minute)? It they were going to edit the James Arthur single into a different part of the show had he won, they could easily have edited in whichever of the Christmas Number One intros they needed too.

I also don't understand why they edited He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother short. Surely the one song that should get a full play is the Christmas Number One? Still I suppose at least in their edit, they left in the word Justice lit in candles, and the names of the 96. To edit those out would have been absolutely unforgivable.
 
#5,749 ·
Sounds dodge to me.
...why?
Surely it wouldn't have taken that long to record two versions, one for each single (perhaps even still doing a third generic one like the one they used just in case an unexpected outsider grabbed the top spot at the last minute)?
They didn't do that because there was no point. It would have taken more time to film and edit, this year's TOTP was done on an absolute shoe-string budget. The majority of people who would have noticed the generic link would have been the idiots desperately trying to accuse the BBC of anti-Liverpool rhetoric.
I also don't understand why they edited He Ain't Heavy, He's My Brother short. Surely the one song that should get a full play is the Christmas Number One? Still I suppose at least in their edit, they left in the word Justice lit in candles, and the names of the 96. To edit those out would have been absolutely unforgivable.
Simply because the videos are less enjoyable to watch than live performances. They used to do this during the regular TOTP series (and CD:UK) as well when they couldn't get the number 1 in the studio. A live performance will ultimately be unique whereas a video is something that you are likely to see multiple times on different channels and online. Nothing anti-Liverpool about it, just typical of any music chart show, though the TOTP Xmas special is just about the only music chart show around these days.
 
#5,751 ·
This is Peter Hooton's facebook status update which says the end was edited.

"In case you missed it Xmas Day TOTP's- pity they edited the end but we weren't popular winnerswith music indusrty types as 'indie' releases aren't supposed to do this but 'the people' made sure we did! Thanks to everyone who got behind it!"
 
#5,752 ·
I didn't think for a moment there was any anti-Liverpool sentiment behind, I just found it strange to edit down the Christmas Number One, the most important song in the programme.
Gotta (who by-the-by is being a berk) has provided a mechanical explanation for why the song was not identified at all. And that may be true. However, given the importance of the song and what it stands for, if they had the will or inclination to correct the problem of this, the most meaningful Christmas number one for a generation (on the Christmas No. 1 show!) they easily could have. But they didn't and it's interesting that they didn't. You will never know but I wonder if for example another "support our cannon fodder war criminal mercenaries" track had come out they wouldn't have bothered attempting to tell people what it was. I'll bet they would have. They'd have daren't not to have. Media bias is subtle and often unconscious but of course it exists.
 
#5,753 ·
Gotta (who by-the-by is being a berk)
Only because you were.

has provided a mechanical explanation for why the song was not identified at all. And that may be true.
I can confirm that that is true.

However, given the importance of the song and what it stands for, if they had the will or inclination to correct the problem of this, the most meaningful Christmas number one for a generation (on the Christmas No. 1 show!) they easily could have.
I'm sorry, and this obviously isn't going to be popular at all on this forum, but that is entirely subjective. Just as the Justice Collective meant so much to a lot of people this year, the Military Wives being number 1 last year will have meant so much to a lot of people.

In fact I've just watched back the portion of TOTP that Justice featured in and I was expecting it to last around two minutes or so as would be normal, but no, it lasts 3 and a half minutes. That is extraordinarily, perhaps uniquely, long for a music video on Top of the Pops. Quickly looking at last year's TOTP special on the BBC's internal player the Military Wives got a total of 2 minutes and 40(ish) seconds.

They'd have daren't not to have. Media bias is subtle and often unconscious but of course it exists.
It's comical that you take this all from an innocent link to camera that lasted a few seconds and was quite obviously made with the intention of being usable no matter what was number one given that they, at that point, did not know who the number one would be. "Media bias" in a fucking light music programme? Get real.

Some people on this forum would be staggered by the amount of people who come from Liverpool and work behind the scenes at the BBC. Several of my colleagues are from Liverpool, another's from the Wirral and one's from Southport. I know at least four other people in the department who've been to uni in Liverpool, one of whom stayed in the city for 10 years afterwards and travels from London to Liverpool each weekend. The head of daytime (who announced his departure last week to become director of Sky1) is a Scouser. One of the heads of BBC Entertainment in Salford is from Heswall and still lives there. All my other colleagues represent the rest of the UK (and indeed further afield) very well - television most definitely is not an industry made up of Londoners. No one there hates Liverpool. Contrary to popular belief on this forum that is not actually the mentality of the British people. No one makes programmes in the hope that they can diminish the reputation of Liverpool.

Mistakes are always going to be made somewhere; someone researching a fact incorrectly and getting it wrong, not casting enough participants from an area as they should have; but this astonishingly minor moment on a music programme viewed by less than four million people was absolutely not in any way biased against Liverpool or the Justice Collective.
 
#5,755 ·
Some people on this forum would be staggered by the amount of people who come from Liverpool and work behind the scenes at the BBC. Several of my colleagues are from Liverpool, another's from the Wirral and one's from Southport. I know at least four other people in the department who've been to uni in Liverpool, one of whom stayed in the city for 10 years afterwards and travels from London to Liverpool each weekend. The head of daytime (who announced his departure last week to become director of Sky1) is a Scouser. One of the heads of BBC Entertainment in Salford is from Heswall and still lives there. All my other colleagues represent the rest of the UK (and indeed further afield) very well - television most definitely is not an industry made up of Londoners. No one there hates Liverpool. Contrary to popular belief on this forum that is not actually the mentality of the British people. No one makes programmes in the hope that they can diminish the reputation of Liverpool.
You misunderstand the nature of bias. People from Liverpool are often unable to be loyal to their city in the way people from other cities (such as Manchester) are - part of their professionalism has to be about rising above parochialism and local loyalty, indeed sometimes tolerating anti-Liverpool prejudice despite inwardly finding it distasteful. It's how people get on.

The claim that "no-one hates Liverpool" is fanciful: I know a number of professional Mancunians who certainly have a tribal and parochial contempt for Liverpool (in a way that one never encounters in reverse from professional Liverpudlians). They do discriminate when they can. Why do you think Liverpool has been systematically rubbished by the BBC (from Manchester) for decades? Because a handful of scousers have been unable to overturn deeply ingrained parochial paranoia from a neighbouring town?
 
#5,758 ·
Seriously now, BBC Liverpool point man Roger Phillips tried the argument that in effect talented Liverpudlians had to travel to Salford and London to have a media career as a response to local criticism of Liverpool's poor service from the BBC in the past. [Remember, we're paying for this crap.] But it is just an terrible one (and counter-productive to the BBC if you think it through). "Liverpool gets shit coverage from BBC Manchester". "But lots of Scousers work there". Yes, and?
 
#5,759 ·
Seriously now, BBC Liverpool point man Roger Phillips tried the argument that in effect talented Liverpudlians had to travel to Salford and London to have a media career as a response to local criticism of Liverpool's poor service from the BBC in the past. [Remember, we're paying for this crap.] But it is just an terrible one (and counter-productive to the BBC if you think it through). "Liverpool gets shit coverage from BBC Manchester". "But lots of Scousers work there". Yes, and?
People from literally every corner of the UK have to travel to Glasgow, Salford and London to have a television career, not just Liverpool. That is simply the nature of the industry, it can't be done across the UK in small pockets because it is an industry that requires a strong degree of centrality in terms of production services, studio space, development and ultimately people. The majority of people working in television are working freelance on very short-term contracts that only last as long as the programme is in production. That means they're moving from one company to the next as soon as their contract ends, they can't afford to go moving across the country especially at a junior level, so they're more than likely going to stay in the same city where they know all the production companies are based and where they have contacts.

I'm not a regular viewer of local news (although I started my career in it) but whenever I've tuned in there have been plenty of occasions where Liverpool stories, many of them positive, have featured at the top of the bulletin. Older relatives of mine have commented about things they've seen on both programmes in the past so I can only assume they find that they both suit their interests. I think the BBC and ITV both do a good job with the large regions and tight budgets they have. There are many, many parts of the UK that have to suffer from living in far larger regions than we do which means that whole areas can go without being reported on for days. The North West was one of only three regions that ITV didn't enlarge in 2009 and one of only a handful that is completely live.

There'll be an announcement at some point in the New Year of a new series of a popular show that will be filmed in Liverpool thanks to its production moving to Salford.
 
#5,760 ·
There are many, many parts of the UK that have to suffer from living in far larger regions than we do which means that whole areas can go without being reported on for days. The North West was one of only three regions that ITV didn't enlarge in 2009 and one of only a handful that is completely live.
They might as well merge it to cover all the North; the "North West" is a quite artificial concept and, as a project, has been used to damage Liverpool as a city. Hopefully city tv will begin to provide a bit of real regional coverage for Liverpool.
 
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