NEW YORK | Midtown Towers | 427m x 2 | 1401ft | Pro

LLoydGeorge · June 15th, 2007, 05:53 AM

Developers To Detail $14B Plans Around Penn Station
By ELIOT BROWN
Special to the Sun
June 14, 2007

A plan for building a set of towering skyscrapers, two grandlyscaled train halls, and a new Madison Square Garden around the existing Pennsylvania Station are rapidly advancing, and the state hopes to begin the public review process for the project, known as Moynihan Station, in the next few weeks.

The developers' revised designs, which are said to include a pair of towers taller than the Empire State Building to be built on the current site of Madison Square Garden, could swiftly transform Midtown South into a thriving epicenter of commercial activity centered around one of the largest transit hubs in the country.

The proposals, which could cost more than $14 billion including the private development, are being shown to elected officials and community groups by a joint development team, Vornado Realty

Trust and the Related Companies.

A spokesman for New York's Empire State Development Corporation said the state has yet to complete negotiations about the complex development rights and possible public subsidies for the renovation of Penn Station. Developers say they hope to start construction in 2008 after the sometimes lengthy process of public approval is completed.

The project takes its name from the late Senator Moynihan, who favored the concept of transforming part of the Corinthiancolumned Farley Post Office building, which sits across Eighth Avenue from Madison Square Garden, into a train station reminiscent of the original Penn Station. It has been under consideration for at least 15 years and faced numerous financial and political obstacles.

While the developers had publicly discussed their vision for the comprehensive plan about a year ago, the concept is now refined, more specific, and closer to reality, people familiar with the plans said, and come after a spider web of discussions among the numerous stakeholders that has gone on for months.

People familiar with the designs say they call for a complex containing 5.5 million square feet built on what is now Madison Square Garden. Primarily office buildings, it includes two towers whose spires will be taller than 1,400 feet. Another tower, to be built along Seventh Avenue near One Penn Plaza, would utilize 2 million square feet of developable air rights transferred from the Farley Post Office site.

Under the plans, the existing Pennsylvania Station would be reconfigured to allow natural light into the train hall, which is now buried under low ceilings.

"The whole place will be flooded with daylight," the president of the developers' Moynihan Station Venture team, Vishaan Chakrabarti, said. He called it "a dramatically nicer space that, again, is larger than the main room at Grand Central."

Given its scale, the project could be extraordinarily lucrative for the developers. Vornado has a significant number of other holdings in the area that would presumably skyrocket in value. The magnitude of the project also makes it risky, the developers say, especially since the most lucrative part of the complex — the private towers in the place on the current Garden site — could not be completed until near the end of the project, which could take up to 10 years.

"If you think about it, the place where we make any money is the towers that get built last — it's an extraordinary risk," Mr. Chakrabarti said.

Historic preservation groups, including the Municipal Art Society and the Landmarks Conservancy, have expressed concerns that the main hall in the Farley building would effectively be turned into an entrance for a new sports arena; they took issue with the possibility of using the post office's original sales windows as ticket booths for events.

The developers say the rebuilt Madison Square Garden acts as a critical component for that space.

"It certainly moves the center of gravity of Midtown to the south and the west, and it effectively expands the Midtown central business district with a significant new anchor," the chief executive officer of the Partnership for New York City, Kathryn Wylde, said.

Adrian Smith fan · June 15th, 2007, 06:24 AM

cant wait for a pic

Online · June 15th, 2007, 06:28 AM

14 billion

Rizzato · June 15th, 2007, 06:45 AM

wow. thats agressive, 2 1400 footers?
lets see if this gets done.

LLoydGeorge · June 15th, 2007, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rizzato

wow. thats agressive, 2 1400 footers?
lets see if this gets done.

NY desperately needs office space. In addition, a third tower of 2m+ s.f. is reported for that site and Vornado plans a fourth tower of 2.5m s.f. across the street on the Hotel Penn site. That's four buildings in the 1,000 foot + range on one block!

cbotnyse · June 15th, 2007, 02:07 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Online

14 billion

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rizzato

wow. thats agressive, 2 1400 footers?
lets see if this gets done.

my thoughts exactly.

LLoydGeorge · June 15th, 2007, 04:17 PM

Supposedly Norman Foster is the lead architect.

LLoydGeorge · June 15th, 2007, 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbotnyse

my thoughts exactly.

NY is the most unique real estate market in the US. The city can fill 6 m sf of space with ease.

Even forgetting the commercial market, consider the NY residential market. While the rest of the country is suffering, NY's market is red hot. Trump can't sell out his Chicago tower at $800/ s.f., and yet comparable space in the TWT, 15 CPW and the Plaza is selling out rapidly in NY at $6,000/ s.f.

great184 · June 15th, 2007, 06:51 AM

This is slightly higher than ESB and in the same locality?

deez · June 15th, 2007, 07:08 AM

oh great. here we go again with the height tease. 'it includes two towers whose spires will be taller than 1,400 feet.' i hope i'm wrong, but i can easily see ~1000 foot towers (not that impressive) with 400 foot antennas (slightly exaggerating, but look at FT's 400 footer!). i guess i fall into the category where the 'tip don't count'....now...roof height at 1400, then i'll raise my eyebrows.

we'll see!

Online · June 15th, 2007, 07:11 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by deez

oh great. here we go again with the height tease. 'it includes two towers whose spires will be taller than 1,400 feet.' i hope i'm wrong, but i can easily see ~1000 foot towers (not that impressive) with 400 foot antennas (slightly exaggerating, but look at FT's 400 footer!). i guess i fall into the category where the 'tip don't count'....now...roof height at 1400, then i'll raise my eyebrows.

we'll see!

Welcome

Jai · June 15th, 2007, 07:22 AM

Awesome!!

Hanshin-Tigress · June 15th, 2007, 08:02 AM

lol two towers that are 700 feet with 700 feet spires could you imagine if that were the case??
Anyways i hope they are 1300 at roof and just 100 foot spire.

_00_deathscar · June 15th, 2007, 08:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Maki-chan

lol two towers that are 700 feet with 700 feet spires could you imagine if that were the case??
Anyways i hope they are 1300 at roof and just 100 foot spire.

Spires add nothing other than aesthetic value, and I imagine they're not too desirable to the property developers who wish to maximise profits...

Audiomuse · June 15th, 2007, 08:32 AM

Wow, taller than the ESP??

That sounds amazing. They would be the second largest buildings in NYC right? After the Freedom Tower at 1776 feet...?

Citystyle · June 15th, 2007, 08:39 AM

Well they wont be near the size of the old WTC however they will be a great addition to the skyline, pending design. This should be good.

Muse · June 15th, 2007, 12:04 PM

Nice.

So in metric, 427m each.

Thanks LLoydGeorge.

Astralis · June 15th, 2007, 12:08 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Muse

Nice.

So in metric, 427m each.

Thanks LLoydGeorge.

Wow

Great hight

!

chicagogeorge · June 15th, 2007, 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Citystyle

Well they wont be near the size of the old WTC however they will be a great addition to the skyline, pending design. This should be good.

The old Twin Towers were shorter than 1400ft. The proposed towers will be only about 50ft shorter than the Sears Tower

***wjfox*** · June 15th, 2007, 12:18 PM

Incredible if true... this would transform New York's skyline (and that's saying something!).

June 15th, 2007, 05:53 AM	#1
LLoydGeorge BANNED Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,035 Likes (Received): 0	NEW YORK \| Midtown Towers \| 427m x 2 \| 1401ft \| Pro Developers To Detail $14B Plans Around Penn Station By ELIOT BROWN Special to the Sun June 14, 2007 A plan for building a set of towering skyscrapers, two grandlyscaled train halls, and a new Madison Square Garden around the existing Pennsylvania Station are rapidly advancing, and the state hopes to begin the public review process for the project, known as Moynihan Station, in the next few weeks. The developers' revised designs, which are said to include a pair of towers taller than the Empire State Building to be built on the current site of Madison Square Garden, could swiftly transform Midtown South into a thriving epicenter of commercial activity centered around one of the largest transit hubs in the country. The proposals, which could cost more than $14 billion including the private development, are being shown to elected officials and community groups by a joint development team, Vornado Realty Trust and the Related Companies. A spokesman for New York's Empire State Development Corporation said the state has yet to complete negotiations about the complex development rights and possible public subsidies for the renovation of Penn Station. Developers say they hope to start construction in 2008 after the sometimes lengthy process of public approval is completed. The project takes its name from the late Senator Moynihan, who favored the concept of transforming part of the Corinthiancolumned Farley Post Office building, which sits across Eighth Avenue from Madison Square Garden, into a train station reminiscent of the original Penn Station. It has been under consideration for at least 15 years and faced numerous financial and political obstacles. While the developers had publicly discussed their vision for the comprehensive plan about a year ago, the concept is now refined, more specific, and closer to reality, people familiar with the plans said, and come after a spider web of discussions among the numerous stakeholders that has gone on for months. People familiar with the designs say they call for a complex containing 5.5 million square feet built on what is now Madison Square Garden. Primarily office buildings, it includes two towers whose spires will be taller than 1,400 feet. Another tower, to be built along Seventh Avenue near One Penn Plaza, would utilize 2 million square feet of developable air rights transferred from the Farley Post Office site. Under the plans, the existing Pennsylvania Station would be reconfigured to allow natural light into the train hall, which is now buried under low ceilings. "The whole place will be flooded with daylight," the president of the developers' Moynihan Station Venture team, Vishaan Chakrabarti, said. He called it "a dramatically nicer space that, again, is larger than the main room at Grand Central." Given its scale, the project could be extraordinarily lucrative for the developers. Vornado has a significant number of other holdings in the area that would presumably skyrocket in value. The magnitude of the project also makes it risky, the developers say, especially since the most lucrative part of the complex — the private towers in the place on the current Garden site — could not be completed until near the end of the project, which could take up to 10 years. "If you think about it, the place where we make any money is the towers that get built last — it's an extraordinary risk," Mr. Chakrabarti said. Historic preservation groups, including the Municipal Art Society and the Landmarks Conservancy, have expressed concerns that the main hall in the Farley building would effectively be turned into an entrance for a new sports arena; they took issue with the possibility of using the post office's original sales windows as ticket booths for events. The developers say the rebuilt Madison Square Garden acts as a critical component for that space. "It certainly moves the center of gravity of Midtown to the south and the west, and it effectively expands the Midtown central business district with a significant new anchor," the chief executive officer of the Partnership for New York City, Kathryn Wylde, said.

June 15th, 2007, 06:28 AM	#3
Online Californias rest in peace Join Date: May 2007 Location: TJ/SD Posts: 3,657 Likes (Received): 35	14 billion __________________ lllllllll México >Tijuana en Imagenes< >Mi Flickr<

June 15th, 2007, 06:51 AM	#9
great184 visionary Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Miami-Manila-Bohol Posts: 1,589 Likes (Received): 40	This is slightly higher than ESB and in the same locality? __________________ Arguably, one of the best 3d cities in SSC - South Sea Central http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1536278

June 15th, 2007, 08:32 AM	#15
Audiomuse Civilization Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Austin, TX, USA Posts: 2,730 Likes (Received): 4	Wow, taller than the ESP?? That sounds amazing. They would be the second largest buildings in NYC right? After the Freedom Tower at 1776 feet...? __________________ The beating of a million drums... The fire of a million guns... The mother of a million sons... CIVILIZATION.

June 15th, 2007, 08:39 AM	#16
Citystyle Watch my Chops Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Perth, Posts: 5,251 Likes (Received): 42	Well they wont be near the size of the old WTC however they will be a great addition to the skyline, pending design. This should be good. __________________ Sec. 31 But how far has he given it us? To enjoy. As much as anyone can make use of to any advantage of life before it spoils, whatever is beyond this, is more than his share, and belongs to others. Nothing was made by God for man to spoil or destroy. And thus considering the plenty of natural provisions there was a long time in the world, and the few spenders, and to how small a part provision the industry of one man could extend itself, and ingross itself to the prejudice of others. - John Locke

June 15th, 2007, 06:24 AM	#2
Adrian Smith fan BANNED Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Chicago Posts: 514 Likes (Received): 0	cant wait for a pic

June 15th, 2007, 06:45 AM	#4
Rizzato Blue Collar Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Boston Posts: 903 Likes (Received): 5	wow. thats agressive, 2 1400 footers? lets see if this gets done.

June 15th, 2007, 04:17 PM	#7
LLoydGeorge BANNED Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,035 Likes (Received): 0	Supposedly Norman Foster is the lead architect.

June 15th, 2007, 07:08 AM	#10
deez Registered User Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 72 Likes (Received): 0	oh great. here we go again with the height tease. 'it includes two towers whose spires will be taller than 1,400 feet.' i hope i'm wrong, but i can easily see ~1000 foot towers (not that impressive) with 400 foot antennas (slightly exaggerating, but look at FT's 400 footer!). i guess i fall into the category where the 'tip don't count'....now...roof height at 1400, then i'll raise my eyebrows. we'll see!

June 15th, 2007, 07:22 AM	#12
Jai ॐ शान्तिः शान्तिः शान्तिः Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Haleiwa, Oahu, HI :. Waianae, Oahu, HI :. DETROIT, MI Posts: 3,855 Likes (Received): 11	Awesome!!

June 15th, 2007, 08:02 AM	#13
Hanshin-Tigress BANNED Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: 和歌山市(Wakayama);Orlando Posts: 1,751 Likes (Received): 0	lol two towers that are 700 feet with 700 feet spires could you imagine if that were the case?? Anyways i hope they are 1300 at roof and just 100 foot spire.

June 15th, 2007, 12:04 PM	#17
Muse Supernature Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: Sydney Posts: 8,630 Likes (Received): 7	Nice. So in metric, 427m each. Thanks LLoydGeorge.

June 15th, 2007, 12:18 PM	#20
*wjfox* Moderator Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: L O N D O N Posts: 36,197 Likes (Received): 931	Incredible if true... this would transform New York's skyline (and that's saying something!). __________________ FutureTimeline.net - a timeline of future history

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