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Old June 11th, 2007, 02:46 PM   #1
gakei
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TIANJIN | Rail Tram







http://www.gakei.com/tsn/tsnt.htm
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Old June 11th, 2007, 03:51 PM   #2
Mr.JACOB
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Nice but i heard that the one rail trams are realy shity. There is such a tram in nancy france. My friend who lives there sad that they have to be very slow other vise they jump out of the track
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Old June 13th, 2007, 05:11 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.JACOB View Post
Nice but i heard that the one rail trams are realy shity. There is such a tram in nancy france. My friend who lives there sad that they have to be very slow other vise they jump out of the track
Nancy has Bombardier's Guided LIght Transport system:



There were several derailments when the system in Nancy first started operation. The system seems to be more reliable now though there are segments along which the speed is severely restricted. A similar system in Caen has not expereinced these problems.

Tianjin has the Translohr system, which uses a different configuraiton for the guide rail:



Other Translohr lines are being built Clermont-Ferrand in France and Padua, L'Aquila, and Mestre-Venise in Italy. The first systems are just opening and there are reports of teething problems.

The major advantages claimed for both the Bombardier and Translohr systems are that they are cheaper to build and can climb steeper grades than traditional trams.

For more information, see the following links:

Bombardier Guided Light Transport
http://www.bombardier.com/index.jsp?.../1_2_2_2_1.jsp
http://world.nycsubway.org/eu/fr/nancycaen.html
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bombard..._Light_Transit

Translohr
http://www.lohr.fr/transport-public_gb.htm
http://www.mitsui-tr.co.jp/english/goods/translohr.htm
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Translohr
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Old June 13th, 2007, 07:28 AM   #4
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F°°°ing Translohr, we're having lots of problems with it here in Padua, and also many other dumb towns have chosen it instead of a damn traditional tramway system.

Many accidents, we're still running with restricted service and we can count a really bad crash. A piece of stone has dazzled the stupid monorail, the last car has derailed and it has crashed against a traffic light pole.
A man seriously injured... and many thanks to the pole, without it the TL would have jumped upon the pedestrian walk, crushing them against the wall.

It needs a lot of manteinance and cleaning on the line, not just to work well, but to not derail!


Those idiotic politicians who chose this crap instead of a damn standard tramway should pay on their own to replace it with a decent and safe system... this thing should be banned from this Earth
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Old June 13th, 2007, 06:43 PM   #5
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LOL blame the tyre companies. They're the ones who advocate GLT
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Old June 13th, 2007, 07:16 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilhem275 View Post
F°°°ing Translohr, we're having lots of problems with it here in Padua, and also many other dumb towns have chosen it instead of a damn traditional tramway system.
[..]
Those idiotic politicians who chose this crap instead of a damn standard tramway should pay on their own to replace it with a decent and safe system... this thing should be banned from this Earth

Here in Paris they are supposed to use those "tram" for the future extensions. They plan to build at least 3 new routes (Epinay-Villetaneuse, Chatillon-Vélizy and Boulogne-Meudon). I hope the problems there are in Padua, Nancy and Caen will help us to not make this stupid choice.
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Old June 13th, 2007, 09:38 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Augusto View Post
Here in Paris they are supposed to use those "tram" for the future extensions. They plan to build at least 3 new routes (Epinay-Villetaneuse, Chatillon-Vélizy and Boulogne-Meudon). I hope the problems there are in Padua, Nancy and Caen will help us to not make this stupid choice.
Whats the point in them anyway? The tram takes up as much space as the tracks would so it can't be a problem with space... Is it cost? Surely a rail would be a very cheap part of a tramway system compared to pantographs trains etc.
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Old June 13th, 2007, 10:10 PM   #8
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I still dont get what the advantage of the system compared to a conventional tram should be?
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Old June 14th, 2007, 06:51 AM   #9
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it's cheaper and... well it's cheaper.

but what I dont understand is, what the heck is the point of this? We use trams because their trucks can carry more people than the suspension on a bus would. The guide rail system runs like a bus, only that it's restricted to where it can go. So there is no increase in capacity when compared to a double articulated bus, but there is a huge decrease in flexibility.

I don't understand why they couldn't have went for BRT instead.
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Old June 14th, 2007, 08:41 AM   #10
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those trams are "tripple articulated" if necessare. Thats impossilbe with busses.
One more advanteage of conventional tram is, that they have steel wheels and steel tracks, so they have a better riding comfort and less maintenance costs than rubber tire on concrete, like the one above...
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Old June 14th, 2007, 02:31 PM   #11
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it's cheaper and... well it's cheaper.
It's supposed to be cheaper because you don't have to dig as deeper than for a classic tram to move the underground networks like power cables, phone lines, water pipes,.. But if you add the maintenance cost for concrete and tires, the cost for using plenty of buses all the times the system is out of order, I'm not sure it's cheaper anymore.

Quote:
I don't understand why they couldn't have went for BRT instead.
BRT can't be as narrow as a tram (rubber tires or not). Instead I would say I don't understand why they couldn't have went for a bus with a virtual rail (just a line painted on the ground) and a camera like the one in Rouen and Las Vegas. They seem to be quite reliable. I can't remember the name nor if it's made by Alstom or Bombardier.
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Old June 14th, 2007, 06:54 PM   #12
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Milwaukee was going to build one of these systems but the plan fell through becuse it cost almost as much as light rail and was considered unreliable.
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Old January 13th, 2010, 04:14 PM   #13
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This is a very good thread, thanks –

I Live in Kolkata (old name was Calcutta), and my city is running electric tram since 1902, which is Asia’s oldest operating electric tram, & metro since 1984, which is India’s first metro.

Tianjin (old name was Tienstin) has some similarities with Kolkata. Both cities has tram & metro. The main difference is that Kolkata is running electric tram continuously, struggling with periodical threats of closure, but Tianjin was closed its electric tram in 1972.

Thanks to transport authority. They at last returned tram in Tianjin in 2007, after long 35 years. The new rubber tired tram is no-doubt a proud of Asia. Long live Tianjin Tram.

Mainly for these reasons, I’m very much interested about Tianjin’s tram & metro. So I’ve some suggestions/requests/questions. Please answer me one by one -

1) This thread does not have any information about previously closed trams before 1972. Please add some information about the previous system, English links, photos etc.
2) Please publish a full prominent map of pre 1972 Tianjin tram at their full fledge indicating details about every closed routes.
3) Is there any remaining present of the previous tram system in Tianjin, which was closed in 1972?
4) Please include here a complete map of Tianjin’s present tramway network, with interchanges for subway.
5) Can anybody write which year previous system’s tram routes were opened & closed? Write routes year by year.
5) Is there any route planned? If yes, please write details.
6) Are there any common alignments between past & present tram network? If yes, write details.
7) Is there any official/unofficial English website of Tianjin’s present & past tram system?
8) When the construction of subway started, were the tram tracks (closed in 1972) discovered under the asphalt in the time of digging?


Please reply me as soon as possible.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 01:43 PM   #14
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Recently, I found a very good link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TEDA_Mo...ided_Rail_Tram

I'm repeating my questions & requests to my Chinese tram friends -
1) This thread does not have any information about previously closed trams before 1972. Please add some information about the previous system, English links, photos etc.
2) Please publish a full prominent map of pre 1972 Tianjin tram at their full fledge indicating details about every closed routes.
3) Is there any remaining present of the previous tram system in Tianjin, which was closed in 1972?
4) Please include here a complete map of Tianjin’s present tramway network, with interchanges for subway.
5) Can anybody write which year previous system’s tram routes were opened & closed? Write routes year by year.
5) Is there any route planned? If yes, please write details.
6) Are there any common alignments between past & present tram network? If yes, write details.
7) Is there any official/unofficial English website of Tianjin’s present & past tram system?
8) When the construction of subway started, were the tram tracks (closed in 1972) discovered under the asphalt in the time of digging?

Shanghai has opened 2nd Chinese (& Asian) rubber tired tramway system on 1st January 2010.
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Old January 17th, 2010, 05:05 PM   #15
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Try this:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trams_in_Tianjin
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Old January 18th, 2010, 03:39 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashis Mitra View Post
Recently, I found a very good link - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TEDA_Mo...ided_Rail_Tram

I'm repeating my questions & requests to my Chinese tram friends -
1) This thread does not have any information about previously closed trams before 1972. Please add some information about the previous system, English links, photos etc.
2) Please publish a full prominent map of pre 1972 Tianjin tram at their full fledge indicating details about every closed routes.
3) Is there any remaining present of the previous tram system in Tianjin, which was closed in 1972?
4) Please include here a complete map of Tianjin’s present tramway network, with interchanges for subway.
5) Can anybody write which year previous system’s tram routes were opened & closed? Write routes year by year.
5) Is there any route planned? If yes, please write details.
6) Are there any common alignments between past & present tram network? If yes, write details.
7) Is there any official/unofficial English website of Tianjin’s present & past tram system?
8) When the construction of subway started, were the tram tracks (closed in 1972) discovered under the asphalt in the time of digging?

Shanghai has opened 2nd Chinese (& Asian) rubber tired tramway system on 1st January 2010.
3) no
6) no
8) no
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Old January 19th, 2010, 12:58 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Celebriton View Post
Friend, this link was created by me. I Need more info which this link isn't presenting.

Help ME.
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Old January 19th, 2010, 02:42 PM   #18
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It sounds as if you've already gathered all the information about Tianjin's trams that is readily available in English. If historical maps and detailed accounts of individual lines, etc, were out there on the web, someone would have posted them here.

If you want to dig deeper, you'll need to contact Chinese tram enthusiasts, ask politely for their help, and be prepared for the possibility that you won't be able to find out everything you want to know. Your questions amount to a demand for a complete history of the Tianjin tramway, something that may not exist even in Chinese. Primary evidence (maps, photographs, documents, etc.) may no longer exist at all, or might be locked away in closed archives. (BarbaricManchurian or other Chinese members will have a better idea of how difficult historical research is in China.)
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Old January 19th, 2010, 03:26 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Augusto View Post
It's supposed to be cheaper because you don't have to dig as deeper than for a classic tram to move the underground networks like power cables, phone lines, water pipes,.. But if you add the maintenance cost for concrete and tires, the cost for using plenty of buses all the times the system is out of order, I'm not sure it's cheaper anymore.
Underground networks have to be moved also with the Translohr system. It is not mandatory, nor it is with trams, but if you don't do it, you have to close the line during works on these networks.

Translohr system is as expensive as tramways but can be built only by one productor unlike tramways. It's like Windows versus Linux.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Augusto View Post
BRT can't be as narrow as a tram (rubber tires or not). Instead I would say I don't understand why they couldn't have went for a bus with a virtual rail (just a line painted on the ground) and a camera like the one in Rouen and Las Vegas. They seem to be quite reliable. I can't remember the name nor if it's made by Alstom or Bombardier.
Rouen and Las Vegas buses are built by Irisbus (born after the fusion of part of Iveco and Renault), the optical guiding system has been developed by Siemens but can be mounted on all types of buses.
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Old January 19th, 2010, 10:45 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ashis Mitra View Post
Friend, this link was created by me. I Need more info which this link isn't presenting.

Help ME.
TEDA tram has an interchange with BMT line 9 and there are no other trams planned. Honestly, even I, someone who has lived in Tianjin for a long part of my life, have heard very little of the tram system, it seems like you will not get much more info unless if you learn Chinese and consult the right sources, as despite my Chinese fluency, I have heard very little about the tram from listening on the street and in the Tianjin Museum, you'll have to find some highly specialized people to learn more, which may or may not exist.
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