The Gotthard Base Tunnel - World´s Longest Rail Tunnel (57km)

[Coccodrillo]

Luzern is a terminus station, but there until 2008 IR trains changed loco and restarted in 7 minutes. The problem is mainly that there are 5 lines converging in Luzern that share 3 km of double track with flat junctions (as example a train leaving Luzern for Zürich cross the Basel-Luzern track delaying a train on this line), and this makes difficult or impossible a reduction of the waiting time in Luzern.

In Arth Goldau slow trains wait up to 9 minutes, but fast trains wait only up to 6 minutes. This allows good connection, ie from a Basel-Locarno local to a Zürich-Milano fast train, or viceversa, but also to/from St Gallen. IC trains leave Arth Goldau before IR trains, this avoids conflicts (because the fast train is ahead the slow one). And as IR trains are used mainly for local traffic, it isn't a problem if they are a little bit slower.

[alphorn2]

Originally Posted by Coccodrillo

A possible timetable for 2020.

No need to guess, I have a copy of the actual timetable (with the note "to be adjusted for real journey times through tunnel"). Your version is almost entirely correct, off by one minute or less. No stop in Chiasso, Stop in Como at unknown time, arrival in Milano is 9:49. The journey time from Zurich to Milano is therefore cut from 3:41 to 2:41. That's not hugely impressive compared to some high speed lines, but the project's main purpose is increasing freight capacity so no high speed lines are being built to and from the tunnel.

[Coccodrillo]

Where do you have found your timetable?

The target is to arrive in Zürich and Milano just before minutes 00 or 30. That is, allow the greatest number of connections, not the shortest journey time.

I don't think this timetable is realistic, anyway. Between Milano and Lugano there will not be a new line by 2020, and as today with 1h of scheduled travel time most trains arrive some minutes late, I don't think it is possible to do this trip in 55 minutes instead of 60. Just look at train CIS 12: it is nearly always 5 to 10 minutes late (total travel time between 1h05 and 1h10).

		IC		IR
		arr	dep	arr	dep
Milano Centrale	-	7.10	-	-
Como		?	?	-	-
Chiasso		?	?	-	-
Lugano		8.05	8.08	-	-
Locarno		-	-	-	6.44
Bellinzona	8.19	8.21	7.02	7.04
...
Arth Goldau	9.09	9.13	9.07	9.16
Zug		9.28	9.30	-	-
Zürich		9.52	-	-	-
Luzern		-	-	9.42	9.54
Olten		-	-	10.27	10.32
Basel		-	-	10.55	-

[Luganese1980]

[sebametro]

Originally Posted by Luganese1980

does anyone have a clear picture of the Bodio south portal as i can precisely locate it on google earth

[Coccodrillo]

Google Maps is not up-to-date, anyway:
- Northern portal
- Southern portal

[Luganese1980]

Originally Posted by sebametro

does anyone have a clear picture of the Bodio south portal as i can precisely locate it on google earth

Alptransit.ch

[gramercy]

http://videoportal.sf.tv/video?id=a5...3-caa00609cddc

[Coccodrillo]

Will the capacity south of Chiasso be enough?

No

[hans280]

That's always the problem, isn't it? A massive increase in the capacity in one place almost always (except when the increase is designed to overcome an existing bottleneck...) creates capacity problems further down the line.

Similarly north of the portal. If you ask me, someone in Switzerland are going to bitterly regret not having started on a new base tunnel through the Jura much earlier. (Thank you, Herr Blocher!) Once Gotthard is open there's going to be so much traffic coming through that creaky old railway between Liestal and Egerkingen.

[Coccodrillo]

Exactly.

Anyway the capacity with the two base tunnels will be higher that today and passengers trains will gain one hour.

[hans280]

I don't deny that. But the traffic planners need to be nimble to avoid bottlenecks where two lines (i.e. the old Gotthard route and the new) merge back into one. I guess immediately north of Gotthard the remaining capacity constraint can be resolved through the construction of Zimmerberg 2? At that point the traffic can, I think, be conducted at a steady pace even at peak hours between Zurich and Ticino. My point was that the trains will not be able to continue apace further north on the line Zurich-Olten-Basle. There, the Jura mountains will remain a considerable bottleneck.

I found a presentation where an ingeneering professor gives his assessment of where the future bottlenecks will be. Sorry for not cut-and-pasting the relevant exhibit (I had a technical problem), it is on page 30:
http://litep.epfl.ch/webdav/site/lit...U_Weidmann.pdf

[Coccodrillo]

Les idées et les projets doivent être évalués plus dûrement de la
côte économique, au dépit des aspects politiques.

This says that projects should be more carefully studied on their economical side (cost/benefit analysis, etc).

On the contrary, I think that there are too much discussions, and that these endless discussions canceled some very urgent projects, like the second part of the Zimmerberg Base Tunnel. The existing line has about 150 trains per day on a single track, and the conclusion is simple: build more tracks, or renounce to add more trains.

As of Zürich-Gotthard passenger trains, a solution may be to replace the existing hourly regional train Thalwil-Zug by buses, or to eliminate them at all, and use the freed space for intercity trains until the Zimmerberg 2 tunnels opens in 2120.

Freight trains to the Gotthard go via the Bözberg line instead of via the Zimmerberg line. On the map on page 29 of the same PDF is shown as passing neraby BS-LFG-BG-WO-RK-GD.