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Old December 22nd, 2009, 04:17 PM   #121
Awayo
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Ha, I'll have to put my post back now! Two of out ten. Two! What kind of menagerie of horrors has people that rate at 2? No one is criticising you for not voting 10. Nowhere has 2 unless you hate all humanity. The KKK probably plenty of decent family men amongst them, bearing in mind their noxious political opinions. They'd not get 2. Probably.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 04:31 PM   #122
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucbiscuit View Post

I like the city, but find most of the people I come across behave not how I would like them to.
so you're either a prostitute or a prison guard
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 04:56 PM   #123
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Originally Posted by yoshef View Post
so you're either a prostitute or a prison guard
no just someone fairly laid back, with courtesy and manners and who shows consideration for others
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 05:10 PM   #124
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Laid back would mean you get along with everyone, which you obviously don't to give an entire city's worth of people 2/10.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 05:38 PM   #125
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Laid back would mean you get along with everyone
not really no, but we're obviously not going to agree, so I'll bow out of the discussion
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 05:44 PM   #126
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Even though it's bollocks I couldn't help myself. Here goes -

The people - 8/10.

Pretty friendly, genuine Cardiffians are quite witty, people tend to crack along together quite well (even with students) and despite opinions to the contrary Welsh people are generally laid back and tolerant (apart from when Wales play England at rugby when for about 4 hours we turn into Serbia circa 1990).

2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 7/10

A difficult one. Quite a lot in the way of museums and good for kids. Lots of pubs but of variable quality, ditto clubs. For theatre, shows, gigs I think it punches above it's weight and the live music scene has improved massively over the last few years.

As for buzz, the buzz you get when you walk through a street genuinely not knowing what will be around the corner, the type of buzz that makes great cities - well this is an ephemeral thing in Cardiff. Sometimes it has it yet at other times it appears very subdued and dare I say it provincial.


3. Places to go/stay - 7/10

This is pretty much dealt with in the category above. Above average I'd say - decent hotels, decent cultural facilities, very good for watching sport, lots of nightlife from the Walkabout cheesiness to po-faced, up your own arse uber cool. We do have the advantage of very accesible countryside, mountains, beaches etc.

4. Skyline -5/10,

The spires on the Milstad are very recognisable and the skyline is not without it's charm especially when viewed from the mountains to the north with the Bristol Channel laid out before it. But no great skyscrapers and not that tall.

5. Streetscape/architecture - 6/10.

Lovely Victorian/Edwardian stuff but bog standard UK provincial city. Great civic centre, fantastic mind blowing castle in the city centre and some very good modern buildings (WMC, Senedd etc) but let down by a lot of mediocre crap. Not bad, just unambitious. Frustratingly Cardiff is about 10 years and about £1bn from having a great modern, urban streetscape.

6. Retail - 8/10

Considering the size of the city it's very good. A lot of decent independent stores, high st chains, super sized malls and cosy arcades. All in a compact area and mostly in attractive buildings.

7. Being well known throughout the world - 6/10

Well known to rugby fans, scholars of European regional governments and those with an in depth knoweldge of the UK. So not very well known then.

8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10

Eh? Not very. What city in the UK outside of London actually matters? What city would be missed if it slipped into the sea overnight apart from by it's citizens. I'd be oblivious if Mcer ceased to exist ditto Leeds etc. Same for Cardiff - it's a nonsense of a category hence the average 5 out of 10.

9. Heritage/History -5/10

Not huge. Not suprising since it's only been a city for 104 years.


10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 6/10

Not much of a claim to fame other than being one of the first multi cultural (perhaps the most successful?) community in the UK. A few famous people but no one that I admire particularly.

A realistic 63 for me.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 05:47 PM   #127
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I wouldn't even give the people of Manchester a 2!? You've obviously had some bad experiences. Or have only met a couple of people in the 4 years you've lived in a city with just under half a million people milling around it.

My guess is that you probably don't know how to deal with people. Psycho-analysis over.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 06:11 PM   #128
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Mancunian version of Sloyne
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 07:03 PM   #129
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Wow, many of you seem to hate your cities.

Anyway, this...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Conor View Post
This is for Dublin:
5. Streetscape/architecture 8/10: Wonderful river front, cool bridges, Georgian architecture, cobbled, tree lined streets, all with modern, tasteful street furniture, iconic modern buildings, designed by world renound architects.
6. Retail 8/10: As far as average high-street, family owned and department stores go, Dublin has everything. What there isn't so much of is the upper class stores that many other leading European cities host. Grafton St would benefit a bit of TLC too.
7. Being well known throughout the world 10/10: Word famous. Don't need to say any more.
8. Importance in ROI/Europe/World 7/10: (Changed UK to ROI) Quite important. Obviously a capital city gives it a higher ranking. Isn't up with Frankfurt, London, Paris etc though.
9. Heritage/History 8/10: Quite a long, confusing colourful history.
10. Claim to fame/Famous people 10/10: Guinness gives it a straight 10!

Total - 80/100
...has to be a joke.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 07:27 PM   #130
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ste View Post
I wouldn't even give the people of Manchester a 2!? You've obviously had some bad experiences. Or have only met a couple of people in the 4 years you've lived in a city with just under half a million people milling around it.

My guess is that you probably don't know how to deal with people. Psycho-analysis over.


me? possibly true, I think I do ok though, I realise other people's point of view or experiences may be different than mine, I will listen to them even if I don't agree with them, I can discuss things in a reasoned manner and not resort to anger or insults, so I think I can deal with people ok

I'm sorry to say the liverpool forumers conduct in this thread has done more to prove my point than I ever could. I don't want to start a vendetta, I live in liverpool and like many aspects of it, some more than others though.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:05 PM   #131
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucbiscuit View Post
me? possibly true, I think I do ok though, I realise other people's point of view or experiences may be different than mine, I will listen to them even if I don't agree with them, I can discuss things in a reasoned manner and not resort to anger or insults, so I think I can deal with people ok

I'm sorry to say the liverpool forumers conduct in this thread has done more to prove my point than I ever could. I don't want to start a vendetta, I live in liverpool and like many aspects of it, some more than others though.

I'm reminded of Nick Griffin, who does the same thing; pretends to be laid back, reasonable and courteous yet his fundamental message is offensive. If you have nothing nice to say, then say nothing. There is nothing more courteous than that. If you don't understand that basic concept, then you have noone but yourself to blame for the way people behave around you and any hostility you receive on this forum.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:08 PM   #132
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yoshef View Post
I'm reminded of Nick Griffin, who does the same thing; pretends to be laid back, reasonable and courteous yet his fundamental message is offensive. If you have nothing nice to say, then say nothing. There is nothing more courteous than that. If you don't understand that basic concept, then you have noone but yourself to blame for the way people behave around you and any hostility you receive on this forum.


ok, thank-you for yet more insults and the lesson in how to behave
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:14 PM   #133
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karldiff View Post
Even though it's bollocks I couldn't help myself. Here goes -

The people - 8/10.

Pretty friendly, genuine Cardiffians are quite witty, people tend to crack along together quite well (even with students) and despite opinions to the contrary Welsh people are generally laid back and tolerant (apart from when Wales play England at rugby when for about 4 hours we turn into Serbia circa 1990).

2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 7/10

A difficult one. Quite a lot in the way of museums and good for kids. Lots of pubs but of variable quality, ditto clubs. For theatre, shows, gigs I think it punches above it's weight and the live music scene has improved massively over the last few years.

As for buzz, the buzz you get when you walk through a street genuinely not knowing what will be around the corner, the type of buzz that makes great cities - well this is an ephemeral thing in Cardiff. Sometimes it has it yet at other times it appears very subdued and dare I say it provincial.


3. Places to go/stay - 7/10

This is pretty much dealt with in the category above. Above average I'd say - decent hotels, decent cultural facilities, very good for watching sport, lots of nightlife from the Walkabout cheesiness to po-faced, up your own arse uber cool. We do have the advantage of very accesible countryside, mountains, beaches etc.

4. Skyline -5/10,

The spires on the Milstad are very recognisable and the skyline is not without it's charm especially when viewed from the mountains to the north with the Bristol Channel laid out before it. But no great skyscrapers and not that tall.

5. Streetscape/architecture - 6/10.

Lovely Victorian/Edwardian stuff but bog standard UK provincial city. Great civic centre, fantastic mind blowing castle in the city centre and some very good modern buildings (WMC, Senedd etc) but let down by a lot of mediocre crap. Not bad, just unambitious. Frustratingly Cardiff is about 10 years and about £1bn from having a great modern, urban streetscape.

6. Retail - 8/10

Considering the size of the city it's very good. A lot of decent independent stores, high st chains, super sized malls and cosy arcades. All in a compact area and mostly in attractive buildings.

7. Being well known throughout the world - 6/10

Well known to rugby fans, scholars of European regional governments and those with an in depth knoweldge of the UK. So not very well known then.

8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10

Eh? Not very. What city in the UK outside of London actually matters? What city would be missed if it slipped into the sea overnight apart from by it's citizens. I'd be oblivious if Mcer ceased to exist ditto Leeds etc. Same for Cardiff - it's a nonsense of a category hence the average 5 out of 10.

9. Heritage/History -5/10

Not huge. Not suprising since it's only been a city for 104 years.


10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 6/10

Not much of a claim to fame other than being one of the first multi cultural (perhaps the most successful?) community in the UK. A few famous people but no one that I admire particularly.

A realistic 63 for me.


Come on Karldiff..

Super Ted is a Kairdiff boy. That alone pushes the last catagory up to 7!
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:40 PM   #134
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i think some of us are harsh on our retail scores. the one thing british cities do reasonably well is city centre shopping. 99% of US cities are crap for this. manchester's city centre offering pisses all over the downtown offerings of famous places like SF or Boston. and many european cities are a bit boring on this front too.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 08:54 PM   #135
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucbiscuit View Post

I'm sorry to say the liverpool forumers conduct in this thread has done more to prove my point...
Interesting. I don't care to speak up for the scousers, but err... where do metrolink, jrb and nathan thingy fit into your analysis?
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 09:02 PM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splendidineogh View Post
Interesting. I don't care to speak up for the scousers, but err... where do metrolink, jrb and nathan thingy fit into your analysis?
I don't fit into anyone's analysis. Not even yours.

BTW. I know something you don't. You would love it. Tuff.

Now jog on.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 09:35 PM   #137
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Splendidineogh View Post
Interesting. I don't care to speak up for the scousers, but err... where do metrolink, jrb and nathan thingy fit into your analysis?

on this thread from what I can see jrb has posted with good-natured stuff, even if he didn't agree with others

I rated Manc 6/10 for people so I'm hardly that keen on Mancs either, I don't know any of the 3 members you mentioned well enough to pass comment really though.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 09:47 PM   #138
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Right, here is my objective analysis based on my wide ranging and in-depth experience of Britain's cities and their people. I'm widely travelled, including across Europe and the world and so I have scored our cities quite harshly keeping my mind on what is abroad. However, I have been very fair in doing so. It is totally over the top for people to just score 8s and 9s willy nilly. It is nothing short of inflationary dumbing down to do this.

Unfortunately, some places that I am very fond of from an architecture point of view end up with lower overall scores owing to fame of its people, or not being well known globally, etc. It is clear that being well known and having famous sons works massively in the favour of one or two cities against the others. But I provide detailed scores below, which explain this, and which I think people would agree are fair.

Here is the summary:

Birmingham - 55.0
Glasgow - 60.5
Leeds - 54.0
Liverpool - 70.5
London - 83.5
Manchester - 61.0
Newcastle - 57.0
Sheffield - 53.0

Birmingham

1. The people - 7/10 (people are basically sound based on my experience.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 6/10 (Great, but very spread out so lacks the cauldron buzz of some other places.)
3. Places to go/stay - 6/10 (Places to stay 7, to see 6)
4. Skyline - 5/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 6/10 (Fine but other places have more heritage and charm.)
6. Retail - 7/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 4/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10 (All the provincial cities get the same for this. They are all weak relative to a highly centralised capital.)
9. Heritage/History - 5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 4/10 (the most unfunny comedians in the world - Lenny Henry and Jasper.)

Glasgow

1. The people - 7/10 (Friendly and helpful. Down to earth.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 6.5/10
3. Places to go/stay - 6/10
4. Skyline - 4/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 8/10
6. Retail - 7/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 4/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 8/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 5/10

Leeds

1. The people - 6.5/10 (Footie fans are still in the dark ages. Friendly, but people lack the friendliness of some other places just a touch.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 6/10
3. Places to go/stay - 5.9/10
4. Skyline - 6/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 5.5/10
6. Retail - 6.9/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 4/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 4.2/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 4/10 (Scary Spice... Jimmy Saville... Now then now then)

Liverpool

1. The people - 7.5/10 (Like anywhere they are a mixed bag, but I have found them to be funny and interesting. Never met a horrible one.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 7/10 (always seems very busy, great night life, lots of art galleries and museums.)
3. Places to go/stay - 7/10 (easily spend a weekend there and not see everything in the centre.)
4. Skyline - 7/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 8/10 (more listed buildings than any where outside London, massive cathedrals, etc.)
6. Retail - 6.5/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 7.5/10 (The Beatles alone get a high score here, as well as footy and emigration, etc.)
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 7.5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 7.5/10

London

1. The people - 4/10 (Not a lot to say. Too international. Lacks special character and distinctiveness.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 9/10
3. Places to go/stay - 9/10
4. Skyline - 8/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 9/10
6. Retail - 9/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 10/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 9/10
9. Heritage/History - 8.5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 8.5/10

Manchester

1. The people - 5/10 (The most horrible people I have ever worked with were from Stockport (x2), Bolton (x1), and North Manchester (x1). Greater Manchester folk seem to go a bit overboard with their manc wannabe-ism. But the normal city mancs I've met in the city centre have generally been nice so I'm sorry to bring them down. Obviously crime is a consideration also.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 7/10
3. Places to go/stay - 6/10
4. Skyline - 6/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 7/10
6. Retail - 7.5/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 6/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 6.5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 5/10

Newcastle

1. The people - 8/10 (People are great. Often a bit barmy, but undoutedly nice.)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 6.5/10
3. Places to go/stay - 6/10
4. Skyline - 5/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 7/10
6. Retail - 6/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 4/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 5.5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 4/10

Sheffield

1. The people - 7/10 (Nice enough)
2. The Atmosphere/Buzz/culture - 6/10 (lacks something)
3. Places to go/stay - 5/10
4. Skyline - 5/10
5. Streetscape/architecture - 5/10
6. Retail - 5.5/10
7. Being well known throughout the world - 5.5/10
8. Importance in UK/Europe/World - 5/10
9. Heritage/History - 5/10
10. Claim to fame/Famous people - 4/10

Last edited by Splendidineogh; December 22nd, 2009 at 10:23 PM.
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Old December 22nd, 2009, 10:11 PM   #139
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tucbiscuit View Post
on this thread from what I can see jrb has posted with good-natured stuff, even if he didn't agree with others
.
I have probably voted more harshly than anybody else on this thread, but even I didn't reach the sordid depths of a 2/10 score. Not even 3/10. So it is understandable that people smell a rat with your score, and you shouldn't be surprised that it makes you seem a little bitter.

Btw, had you voted the mancs a 2/10 jrb would've been all over you like flies on a turd. And I dare say, that analogy is quite apt in this instance.

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Old December 22nd, 2009, 10:18 PM   #140
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I don't post on City Talk much anymore... but when I do, it's usually to laugh at people.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Splendidineogh View Post
Right, here is my objective analysis based on my wide ranging and in-depth experience of Britain's cities and their people. I'm widely travelled, including across Europe and the world.

Birmingham

4. Skyline - 6/10

7. Being well known throughout the world - 3/10

Leeds

4. Skyline - 7/10

7. Being well known throughout the world - 4/10
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