Birmingham = Cinderella City of the new Millennium?

[SimonTheSoundMan]

Originally Posted by Erebus555

True but a city should first and foremost serve the people that live there, not have to strut around like a peacock all the time. For ages it's been overly image-concious. In the time the council has focussed massively on making every little aspect of the city look all beautiful and whatever, the social care department has fallen apart, education is still struggling to improve and there are still significant socio-economic issues in inner city areas that could have been sorted much earlier on with better, more targeted investment.

They are too dependent on central government, and central government do not care on a local level. We're too big, we should be doing it ourselves. Councils are not willing to commit to work together, and Westminster has our hands tied behind our backs because we are not allowed to make a lot of decisions.

My argument for an elected mayor. We can devolve some of the powers away from Westminster if we have a directly elected mayor. It's early days and its not quite clear what powers we may get. Our population is larger than Scotland, and see what powers they have over their public money. Hopefully for Birmingham we can sort out these issues, and the mayor will have a big enough influence on the region to get other councils to work together.

[Mathieu]

Originally Posted by SuttonBluenose

Interesting to hear an outsider's view of brum. We brummies may not like it, but we (well me certainly) do get the feeling this view is shared by many northerners and southerners.

I think we're on the right path now with very many buildings popping up, and having so much as 11 cranes in the city centre at one time shows this further. Let alone 4 cranes on one site!

It is a bit scattered, but then again Birmingham is a considerably bigger city than Liverpool, Manchester, leeds, sheff.... The city centre stretches what 3 miles? Jewellery Quarter to five ways, Eastside to Ladywood? So the real gems of the city are more likely to be 'sporadic'.

Here's a little list of the true gems of the city, architecturally wise: in my opinion anyway!

Gun Barrel Proof House
Selfridges
Spiceal Street
Colmore Row
1/2 Snowhill
The Cube
The New Library (under construction)
The Old library-sorry I'm a madin lover
Brindley Place --the whole place
The Canals
Victoria Law Courts
The Rotunda
Masshouse-lol joke


There's many other to add to that list there, but it's just a start.


As for stations like Duddeston, well I go through it every day, and what can we actually do with it?

Theres 2 platforms, 4 lines and a disused service yard. It's a dump of an area, I only hope HS2 will make a slight change to it. Then again, I'm not 100% sure HS2 goes through Duddeston. I personally still blame this: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beeching_Axe

What about the two finest buildings in Birmingham The Town Hall and the Council House

[Mathieu]

Originally Posted by Qoasis777

I've deleted some of my comments from yesterday - apologies if I caused any offence I was drunk and angry.

I stand by the sentiment though - your argument is skewed in the negative beyond belief but I dont think I can add anything which has not already been covered by the more reasonable forumers.

We Brummies know what is happening and the level of investment in the city at present - nearly a billion in public sector money on projects such as new st, the runway extension, the library, eastside city park, the metro. There really is nothing of note happening here is there?

I'm proud of Birmingham and what it is achieving - you can look back all you like but that wont change anything. We can only look FORWARD. If you dont like what you see look elsewhere.

I do live in Birmingham, right in the centre and it truly is a remarkable, beautiful city inhabited by honest people without the swagger or arrogance of other major UK cities - thats why I love it, thats why I choose to live here.

You made me angry last night and I shouldn't have risen to it.

Oh and this should really be in the Lunar Society.

You only have to remember what Bill Clinton said "I WAS ASTONISHED WHEN I SAW HOW BEAUTIFUL BIRMINGHAM WAS,THE BUILDINGS, THE ART, THE USE OF WATER. IT IS AN EXTRAORDINARY JEWEL OF A CITY, I WAS BOWLED OVER WHEN I WAS THERE, IT IS QUITE BEAUTIFUL. Bill Clinton

Or


TO ME BIRMINGHAM IS THE GREATEST PLACE IN THE WORLD. Mark-Lewis Francis

[Qoasis777]

Like i've already said - Birmingham doesn't need to brag and boast about how good it is like certain other regional cities. Because it simply is better. When peope come here they leave surprised with their eyes opened, eager to return. Can the same be said of cities which "punch above their weight" in marketing terms? Do people leave these cities with a feeling of dissapointment? Who knows but its possible.

No city can be all things to all people - but Birmingham gives it a damn good go.

I choose to live here because the place is amazing. Perhaps those born here (unlike me) don't appreciate just how good the place is but I certainly do.

There is so much going on now in terms of development (already listed by me and others above so I wont repeat) and so much more to come that I can't help but be excited for the future of this great city. You guys can look back at what you percieve as past failings all you like - I look FORWARD.

[adamdalziel]

Originally Posted by Qoasis777

I do live in Birmingham, right in the centre and it truly is a remarkable, beautiful city inhabited by honest people without the swagger or arrogance of other major UK cities - thats why I love it, thats why I choose to live here.

Yes, my Mrs settled here because she said the people seemed very friendly and straight-forward. I think that's a real asset.

[adamdalziel]

Originally Posted by SimonTheSoundMan

We really need an underground transport system and not bother extending the tram network IMHO. Trams cannot share the roads when the roads are already congested. It take a good hour and a half by bus to go 8 miles from Dudley to Birmingham. You could get the bus to the nearest rail station, but still, Dudley Port is a good 2 miles form Dudley itself, and if you live in Gornal or Sedgley direction you have to travel 3-4 mile to Coseley station (which is a good 30-45 minute bus journey).

It'd cost so much to tunnel underground that I think it'd be wasted effort to try to get funding for this and potentially delay ground level tram projects. Didn't this happen once before? I'm not even sure pushing people underground allowing the car to dominate above is the way forward.

[adamdalziel]

Originally Posted by Qoasis777

Like i've already said - Birmingham doesn't need to brag and boast about how good it is like certain other regional cities. Because it simply is better. When peope come here they leave surprised with their eyes opened, eager to return. Can the same be said of cities which "punch above their weight" in marketing terms? Do people leave these cities with a feeling of dissapointment? Who knows but its possible.

Yes, I do think some cities shout a bit too much about how ace they are which, to me, comes across a bit desperate. Or maybe I wrong, maybe the streets are paved with gold.. but I doubt it.

[SuttonBluenose]

Originally Posted by Mathieu

What about the two finest buildings in Birmingham The Town Hall and the Council House

I did say the list was missing a fair few buildings! Looking for people to add to it!

[Brum X]

Originally Posted by SuttonBluenose

I did say the list was missing a fair few buildings! Looking for people to add to it!

The new GRAND Hotel

[SimonTheSoundMan]

Originally Posted by Qoasis777

Like i've already said - Birmingham doesn't need to brag and boast about how good it is like certain other regional cities. Because it simply is better.

I wouldn't say that. Birmingham already brags about it being "a world class city" and a "landmark", when in fact, it is just an ordinary city in the UK. BCC have a huge PR drive to hide the bad parts. It hasn't got anything really special, and many parts of it are worse than others in the UK.

[Qoasis777]

Originally Posted by SimonTheSoundMan

I wouldn't say that. Birmingham already brags about it being "a world class city" and a "landmark", when in fact, it is just an ordinary city in the UK. BCC have a huge PR drive to hide the bad parts. It hasn't got anything really special, and many parts of it are worse than others in the UK.

Exactly Simon. You wouldn't say that. I would.

That's why this thread is, and has been from the start completely and utterly irrelevant.

[Mathieu]

Originally Posted by SimonTheSoundMan

I wouldn't say that. Birmingham already brags about it being "a world class city" and a "landmark", when in fact, it is just an ordinary city in the UK. BCC have a huge PR drive to hide the bad parts. It hasn't got anything really special, and many parts of it are worse than others in the UK.

Every city always promotes it's best parts. Look I live in Paris which is reckened to be one of the most beautiful cities in the world, but I can tell there are parts of this city that equal the worst slums in the world but they are never referred to by the council or anyone else in the travel industry. Also we have plenty of ugly buildings that should have never got through planning. What is so great about Birmingham is how it has transformed and is still transforming itself in such a short space of time. O.K. theres one a two buildings that could have been better but in the great scheme of things Birmingham will soon be One of the Really Greats of the world. Qoasis is dead right when he says there is far too much negative thinking and nit picking. All you have to do is keep the whole picture in mind. and not worry about grass in parks etc. I tell you what you are very lucky to be having any sort of park in a city centre.

[SimonTheSoundMan]

Originally Posted by Qoasis777

That's why this thread is, and has been from the start completely and utterly irrelevant.

Because someone doesn't express the same opinion as you doesn't make it "utterly irrelevant".

[Qoasis777]

Originally Posted by SimonTheSoundMan

Because someone doesn't express the same opinion as you doesn't make it "utterly irrelevant".

My point is that we all have different opinions and views. The thread is pointless in my view - respect that Simon?

[VerticallyChallenged]

Originally Posted by SimonTheSoundMan

They are too dependent on central government, and central government do not care on a local level. We're too big, we should be doing it ourselves. Councils are not willing to commit to work together, and Westminster has our hands tied behind our backs because we are not allowed to make a lot of decisions.

My argument for an elected mayor. We can devolve some of the powers away from Westminster if we have a directly elected mayor. It's early days and its not quite clear what powers we may get. Our population is larger than Scotland, and see what powers they have over their public money. Hopefully for Birmingham we can sort out these issues, and the mayor will have a big enough influence on the region to get other councils to work together.

That makes a lot of sense.
I think Birmingham has had the absolute dregs as far as MP's are concerned, whenever did you hear a Birmingham MP stand up and defend or promote this city?
Typically, why for instance is the HS2 line terminating at Curzon St?
If the Government can suddenly find an extra Billion pounds to tunnel under some scenic views in the Tory countryside why can't they build a tunnel to terminate HS2 under New Street? A new underground station there might well have been the catalyst for an actual underground system starting with the ICC.
Even Londoners can't understand why they will have to get out and walk when they get off at Birmingham. Why is it always second best for Brum?

And talking about second best, the Birmingham Mail's favourite for Mayor appears to be Gisela Stuart who happens to be my MP.
Her love for Brum is such that she has never lived in the city, she prefers leafy Worcestershire but she does apparently pop in occasionally to hold her surgery, just what we need eh?

[Brum X]

Originally Posted by VerticallyChallenged

That makes a lot of sense.
I think Birmingham has had the absolute dregs as far as MP's are concerned, whenever did you hear a Birmingham MP stand up and defend or promote this city?
Typically, why for instance is the HS2 line terminating at Curzon St?
If the Government can suddenly find an extra Billion pounds to tunnel under some scenic views in the Tory countryside why can't they build a tunnel to terminate HS2 under New Street? A new underground station there might well have been the catalyst for an actual underground system starting with the ICC.
Even Londoners can't understand why they will have to get out and walk when they get off at Birmingham. Why is it always second best for Brum?

And talking about second best, the Birmingham Mail's favourite for Mayor appears to be Gisela Stuart who happens to be my MP.
Her love for Brum is such that she has never lived in the city, she prefers leafy Worcestershire but she does apparently pop in occasionally to hold her surgery, just what we need eh?

Im sorry but the walk from the new Curzon street station is still within 5 mins from the city centre and within 10 minuites from the CBD ???????? How long do it take on the london underground to get to the City or Canary wharf or the West End ??? Hardly something to complain about me thinks.

[daumal]

Originally Posted by Brum X

Im sorry but the walk from the new Curzon street station is still within 5 mins from the city centre and within 10 minuites from the CBD ???????? How long do it take on the london underground to get to the City or Canary wharf or the West End ??? Hardly something to complain about me thinks.

It's a fair point, though. To look at it another way, Boris Johnson is talking about London needing Crossrail 2 to cope with the dispersal at Euston, and the most we've heard for the Birmingham end is a new underground car park.

How long will it take to walk from Curzon Street to the ICC?

[Qoasis777]

Originally Posted by daumal

It's a fair point, though. To look at it another way, Boris Johnson is talking about London needing Crossrail 2 to cope with the dispersal at Euston, and the most we've heard for the Birmingham end is a new underground car park.

How long will it take to walk from Curzon Street to the ICC?

New street is woefully busy as it is. Adding another six platforms won't help that. Cursing st is the right place for it plus its little more than a five minute walk from new st, central shopping area, cbd.

It can't be close to everywhere in Birmingham.

[adamdalziel]

Originally Posted by Mathieu

Qoasis is dead right when he says there is far too much negative thinking and nit picking. All you have to do is keep the whole picture in mind. and not worry about grass in parks etc. I tell you what you are very lucky to be having any sort of park in a city centre.

Yeah, I remember a few years back when I didn't know Brum that well, I'd been backpacking round Europe then came back to Brum for Christmas. I wondered through the xmas markets and found myself at the Floozie looking up the steps to the Town Hall with the words 'Happy Xmas Brum' lit up. I remember thinking 'wow, this place is just as impressive as many of the other cities I've visited over the last few months.'

[adamdalziel]

Originally Posted by VerticallyChallenged

If the Government can suddenly find an extra Billion pounds to tunnel under some scenic views in the Tory countryside why can't they build a tunnel to terminate HS2 under New Street? A new underground station there might well have been the catalyst for an actual underground system starting with the ICC.
Even Londoners can't understand why they will have to get out and walk when they get off at Birmingham. Why is it always second best for Brum?

Because there's London then there's everywhere else. I think it's 2nd best for everywhere that's not London, not just Brum. Not saying it's right btw and hopefully an elected mayor with greater powers and budget would alleviate this somewhat.