Remembering HISTORIC NEWCASTLE - Old Photos, Maps, even Stories . . .

[DXNewcastle]

All the green houses are labelled почма ( as I wrote in post #2830 ! )

There's 2 more on the Coast Road which I didn't include in my original list. Those 2 might have been commercial properties and the one at its junction with Benton Road may have been a post office at some point and the one on the corner of Elmfield Pk. and Ashburton Rd. has been, despite my denial that the others have ever been a P.O..

[Percy Trimmer]

Originally Posted by WilfBurnsFan

The one in Jesmond is marked 'posta'. Could they all be sub post offices?

Originally Posted by DXNewcastle

All the green houses are labelled почма ( as I wrote in post #2830 ! )

I can't see the strategic value of sub post-offices. I wonder if the "postas" are actually junctions of some kind in the [Post Office] Telephone system. There might not be anything visible at street level other than a green box or a telegraph pole.

[WilfBurnsFan]

But Ivan's just ripping off OS and local maps. It's not as if the KGB got that bloke from Whitley Bay walking the streets and secretly jotting down the location of junction boxes.

[newcastlepubs]

Here's the key from the author. This will form part of a book being published in Sept if anyone wants the details.

Green 91, 92, 93 - barracks; 96, 97, 99, 100, 101, 103 - post office
Black 38 - metalworking factory; 114 - industrial plant; 169 - centre
for scientific research.

For more information about the Newcastle sheet - and 31 other British
sheets - see the forthcoming book due out in September (as attached).

Best wishes
John

I ve asked re the pink.

This might in part be Ivan nicking the OS map [with some wrong heights chucked in], however someone has spent a tremendous amount of time and effort with I assume some feet on the ground doing this. BTW on the subject of Soviet spooks, it's not that widely known but Abel, exchanged for Gary Powers, was actually born in Elswick

[Percy Trimmer]

Originally Posted by newcastlepubs

BTW on the subject of Soviet spooks, it's not that widely known but Abel, exchanged for Gary Powers, was actually born in Elswick

Willie Fisher. Something about him here.

[Ken O'Heed]

Further to post #2814 there is to be no separate Local Histoery Month leaflet for Gateshead

The events are included within the booklet for May - August 2012 with front cover




PIcked my copy up at St Mary's Centre but assume are available at Gateshead Civic Centre, Libraries and the like

KEN

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by DXNewcastle

All the green houses are labelled почма ( as I wrote in post #2830 ! )

There's 2 more on the Coast Road which I didn't include in my original list. Those 2 might have been commercial properties and the one at its junction with Benton Road may have been a post office at some point and the one on the corner of Elmfield Pk. and Ashburton Rd. has been, despite my denial that the others have ever been a P.O..

Here's the update on colours:

The objects depicted are listed in the index as:
(purple)
3 - labour exchange and banks
(black)
28 - rope factory
79 - cable factory
81 - Forth Bank works - production unknown
144 - port warehouses
149 - station (goods)
156 - station (passenger and goods) Manors
157 - station (passenger) Central
175, 180 - power station

Green indicates an object of military significance, purple administrative and black industrial.

Sorry the image on the website is a bit blurred at the southern edge. There's a better quality image of more of the city centre and Gateshead in the book.

[Percy Trimmer]

I can understand why barracks are of military significance, but not sub-post offices.

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

I can understand why barracks are of military significance, but not sub-post offices.

I am guessing but [and this comes from direct experience of the USSR, albeit a bit after 1977]. Telephones and communication were VERY rare when I was there before it fell apart. Sub Post offices might have been seen as communication points. If your mindset is that people are unlikely to have phones at home [and that was certainly the case in the 70s] then your first point of call for 'fixed line' might well have been post offices.

[Percy Trimmer]

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

I can't see the strategic value of sub post-offices. I wonder if the "postas" are actually junctions of some kind in the [Post Office] Telephone system. There might not be anything visible at street level other than a green box or a telegraph pole.

Originally Posted by newcastlepubs

I am guessing but [and this comes from direct experience of the USSR, albeit a bit after 1977]. Telephones and communication were VERY rare when I was there before it fell apart. Sub Post offices might have been seen as communication points. If your mindset is that people are unlikely to have phones at home [and that was certainly the case in the 70s] then your first point of call for 'fixed line' might well have been post offices.

I don't remember British sub-post offices providing public telephones, but I suppose they were set up to deal with telegrams. Have we confirmed all of those postas were post offices? What about the double Elswick Road one?

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

I don't remember British sub-post offices providing public telephones, but I suppose they were set up to deal with telegrams. Have we confirmed all of those postas were post offices? What about the double Elswick Road one?

I ll try and have a dig about - and though GB post offices didn't have public phones Soviet POs did.

Follow up on number 3..

The word adjacent to the '3' is биржа meaning 'exchange'
(in non-italics биржа)

[DXNewcastle]

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

Have we confirmed all of those postas were post offices? What about the double Elswick Road one?

The one marked in Jesmond was most emphatically NOT ever a post office. It was, in the 1970's a slightly bohemian household, and in the 1920's was the home of H.M. Inspector of Mines for the North of England.
Over the road (and a few doors up) lived Yevgeny Zamyatin between around 1916-18, Russian ship builder (Chief Surveyor of Icebreakers) and novellist (and harsh critic of British society, who drove a car, liked to visit castles and experienced WWI bombing raids on Newcastle).
But never a Post Office. There was one on nearby Acorn Road.

Conversely, there were many Post Offices around the City which are not marked. Nor are there any such premises marked on the corresponding maps of the other cities I've been looking at.

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by DXNewcastle

The one marked in Jesmond was most emphatically NOT ever a post office. It was, in the 1970's a slightly bohemian household, and in the 1920's was the home of H.M. Inspector of Mines for the North of England.
Over the road (and a few doors up) lived Yevgeny Zamyatin between around 1916-18, Russian ship builder (Chief Surveyor of Icebreakers) and novellist (and harsh critic of British society, who drove a car, liked to visit castles and experienced WWI bombing raids on Newcastle).
But never a Post Office. There was one on nearby Acorn Road.

Conversely, there were many Post Offices around the City which are not marked. Nor are there any such premises marked on the corresponding maps of the other cities I've been looking at.

A reply on the pink building:

> Ah ha. Would that be a telephone exchange [in which case they might have wires crossed] or could it be a transport exchange ?

No, item 3 is listed in the index as 'labour exchange'

I ll cc your mssg to the author.

[Percy Trimmer]

Originally Posted by DXNewcastle

The one marked in Jesmond was most emphatically NOT ever a post office.

But before we get too conspiratorial is/was there a PO telephone junction box or even an important telegraph pole in the vicinity? Something that might make an easy sabotage target and therefore be of "military significance"?

[DXNewcastle]

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

. . . . is/was there a PO telephone junction box or even an important telegraph pole in the vicinity?

There were and still are poles in these back lanes at a density of about 1 pole for every 8 properties (4 on each side of the lanes). There was a junction box cabinet at the end of the back lane, which would have corresponded to the adjoining propert on Acorn Road.

Originally Posted by Percy Trimmer

Something that might make an easy sabotage target and therefore be of "military significance"?

Neither of these observations distinguish that site from hundreds of similar roads of terraced houses, no military significance in terms of structure.

By contrast, none of the early telephone exchanges appear to be identified.

I spoke with the householder of the Jesmond property at почма 99 at the weekend who was as sure as I that it had not been anything other than a residence. That leaves me with the possibilities that the mark is simply an error or that the significance was in the occupants of the residence, rather than its structural features.

[newcastlepubs]

Originally Posted by DXNewcastle

There were and still are poles in these back lanes at a density of about 1 pole for every 8 properties (4 on each side of the lanes). There was a junction box cabinet at the end of the back lane, which would have corresponded to the adjoining propert on Acorn Road.Neither of these observations distinguish that site from hundreds of similar roads of terraced houses, no military significance in terms of structure.

By contrast, none of the early telephone exchanges appear to be identified.

I spoke with the householder of the Jesmond property at почма 99 at the weekend who was as sure as I that it had not been anything other than a residence. That leaves me with the possibilities that the mark is simply an error or that the significance was in the occupants of the residence, rather than its structural features.

It seems to me that these maps can have had two purposes:

• Military planning and action - that they show Ivan where to go, strategic targets, etc etc.
• Clandestine operations

On the face of things I agree with DX - that either the map has lots of errors, or that at least some the makings show something which is not an obvious target ie the occupant is 'of interest' [either helpful or someone to lock up - Germany produced extensive intern lists in WW2].

Where I am having difficulty is that both GRU and KGB, and their predecessors [and this is much more likely to be a GRU than KGB map] were notoriously secretive of what one might call 'assets' [ie supporters]. The act of printing a map such as this, would if these were assets, have exposed them to a huge risk of exposure.

DX, I was going to work in the Lit and Phil today but can easily go to the central library; do you have the address for почма 99, PM me if you prefer. I ll have a scout and see if there is anything of potential interest there in the early/mid 70s.

Final, probably daft idea, these weren t the locations of post/phone boxes were they ? Rather clutching at straws.

[Ken O'Heed]

Below are scanned copies of pages from the May - August 2012 "Gateshead Live booklet" (hosted on Photobucket)






















KEN

[Newcastle Historian]

Notebook tells a tale of life on the banks of Tyneside
by Michael Brown, Evening Chronicle, April 27th 2012


Peggy Dixon, 100, pictured with nursing staff Wendy Fowler, left, and Dawn Regan on her right

WHEN PEGGY Dixon was born, the Titanic was yet to set sail and World War One was but a distant fear, but 100 years later, while many a centenarian has long since seen their memories fade, the discovery of her diaries offers a fascinating insight into life on the south bank of the Tyne.

Susan Jones, chief executive of Craigielea Nursing Home and Lodge, on Durham Road in Low Fell, where Peggy lives, said she had been pulling together information about the former charity worker when she came across the “book” she had written about her own life. “One of our residents, Peggy Dixon, celebrated her 100th birthday and while I was getting information together I came across a handwritten notebook which Peggy had kept from when she came to live at Craigielea in 1992 and where she had made regular entries right up until 2005.

“Since then her family has continued to add to the life history which Peggy had written, which makes it an amazing history of the last century in Gateshead. Peggy has lived a remarkably long life, dedicated to the service of local people, despite her own health problems. She truly is an inspiration,” she said.

Peggy’s "book" has now been typed up by her daughter-in-law Marian and runs to 77 pages, with photographs from across the last 100 years.


Read More - http://www.chroniclelive.co.uk/north...#ixzz1tEyFh8fp

[Steve Ellwood]

Originally Posted by Adrian_Swall

A very wet day here on Tyneside so a trip to the Shipley was in order....

There is 'Portrait' exhibition on currently as well as a South African 'beading' exhibition.

One portrait painting which caught my eye.

Judy Dowling - 'Keeper of the Town Hutch'

No, nothing to do with rabbits but she was the guardian of Newcastle's records and archives.

Sounds like she had an interesting life!

Take a look at her portrait with this link... http://www.twmuseums.org.uk/artonlin...id=TWCMS:G4790

Newcastle Town Hutch - courtesy of the Newcastle Libraries Archive Collection @ http://www.flickr.com/photos/newcast...es/4076562304/

image hosted on flickr

[Steve Ellwood]

Originally Posted by WilfBurnsFan

Is that in the old Town Hall?

I'm sure museum curators would be delighted to see it practically jammed up against that radiator.

I presume it is better looked after in the Discovery Museum!

More than likely - wonder if that is Jackie Broons bell (Blaydon Races fame)?

Here is the Town Hutch back in 2002 whilst on display at the Discovery Museum: