ROTTERDAM - Nieuwe-Kuip (63,000)

[maartenpieter]

It will be 80000+ probably without track, but maybe like Stade de France.

[maartenpieter]

...

[Mr. Fitz]

Originally Posted by EPA001

I hope so too. But 75.000 seats would already be fantastic.

Btw, you can scrap the beautiful Signal Iduna Park while it can only reach this capacity as stated in your list with terreaces where fans stand on the large Südtribüne (25.000) and for a small part on the Nordtribüne. The UEFA rules (in accordance to the FIFA rules as well) still require all seater stadiums to host the CL Final and the UEFA-league Final.

Too bad also Bayern München build their Allianz Arena too small. The Olympiastadion in Berlin is just a little bit too small, but during the last DFB-Pokal Finale I saw an extra stand "in the hole" which the second tier of the Olympiastadion has. Maybe that will be enough for the UEFA to award the CL-final alos to a German venue. In such a large country with a thribing and healthy Bundesliga every once in a while a CL final should be played imho.

And I think you can add Croke Park in Ireland to the list. It has 82.300 seats and since a couple of years the Gaelic Athletics Association allows other sports to be played in the stadium, including football. It would be the number 3 stadium on your list.

San Siro has lost seats lately due to renovations and to installling proper seats instead of the small pads you had to sit on before. I think it will still have a capacity of around 75.000 if all seats are installed and the renovations are done, unless they will build more business facilities which eat away normal capacity quite rapidly. So unless that happens, it would still qualify. I am not sure about the capacity of Stadio Olympico in Rome, that could possibly also be a CL venue?

This period is over now, we've got a national stadium for football and rugby built so Croke Park should be left out.

[Mr.Underground]

Do we consider it canceled after 2nd december?

[Sjoerd]

the chance that this stadium will come, is as big as the chance that feyenoord will win the eredivisie this year

[KiwiRob]

Originally Posted by EPA001

And I think you can add Croke Park in Ireland to the list. It has 82.300 seats and since a couple of years the Gaelic Athletics Association allows other sports to be played in the stadium, including football. It would be the number 3 stadium on your list.

If you ad Croke Park then why not Twickenham, it seats 82,000, making it the second biggest in the UK. Plus if the 2018 Cup had gone to England Twickers was in the running to be used as a venue (a dark day for Rugby, allowing poofter girlie football to be played on the hallowed turf).

[skaP187]

Originally Posted by Mr.Underground

Do we consider it canceled after 2nd december?

Originally Posted by Sjoerd

the chance that this stadium will come, is as big as the chance that feyenoord will win the eredivisie this year

WC or not, Feyenoord needs a new stadium. If there is anything which speeks for the club in these dark days then it is the huge potential of this club.

[Axelferis]

don't you think 60-65k is more realistic for this population?

85K is a little bit too big imo! Eredivisie is a good championship but sunday to have 85k is not realistic.

[Quintana]

Apparently renovating De Kuip has become an option now as well (and we were led to believe that it was simply too old and in too dire state to make this a viable option). Proposed capacity of the new stadium had already been downgraded to 68,000.

[www.sercan.de]

So we have to options now?

A) Upgrade old stadium (make it more modern and adding new tier?)
2) New stadium (68,000)


?

[EPA001]

Sorry about the late response Sercan. .

Renovation is called for by some local politicians who have no idea about what is technically feasable and what is allowed on a shielded monument which the current stadium is.

To renovate it completely would be very, very expensive and labour intensive. But the monumental rules shield the stadium from major design changes. A third tier is no option (and technically not possible) and no renovation can increase the total capacity and (more important) really expand the lucrative business facilities. Also without a retractable roof these is no change to win back the events (mostly concerts) which have gone to Amsterdam and Arnhem.

The new stadium could be relocated adjacent to the current one instead of opposite to the current stadium on the river banks. That could save a lot of money because no companies need to be bought out and the stadium foundations are way cheaper to build on land then partially in water. That could save the club and the city combined € 200 million, so that is an option woth to think about.

Especially since that location (which was my favorite to begin with) is directly at the railroad tracks and at the already present train station "Stadion Feyenoord". Of course the could move the station 300 meters and modernize it which would be an easy thing. Also an additional tram line could be routed to the front of the stadium as an additional line to the current one which now serves the current stadium.

In a couple of months decisions are expected, but no decision will go to a full renovation. . Because that is too expensive without the possibility to get a decent return on investment. And in 20 or 25 years time you would need a new stadium after all.

But the initial capacity is now set at 68.000 seats (with an option of 11.000 of them to fold them away to create terraces) which would bring the capacity to 73.500 maximum. Also the stadium will be designed and built with the possiblity to expand it. Which means probably enough clearance between the third tier and the roof.

@Sercan: can you please change the capacity in the topic to 68.000? Thanks.

[Annibale]

Originally Posted by EPA001

Wow! A Schouwburgplein 2.0...

[EPA001]

Originally Posted by EPA001

@Sercan: can you please change the capacity in the topic to 68.000? Thanks.

You can change that now to 63,000 according to the latest plans I have heard of. But they might select an option which is very popular in Germany. That is to make a part of the seats easily convertable into standing terraces. That might increase capacity by possbly 5,000 or so. Depending on the Dutch FA allowing this in a stadium.

Furthermore the chances are increasing that they will build the new stadium in phases on the present grounds. This saves about € 200 million in ground acquisition costs and it also a lot cheaper to build on land than building the stadium partly in the river.

But with the current economic crisis no time-line is certain anymore. Decisions by the city have been postponed till late-Spring or early-Summer 2012. In the mean time the club, the stadium and the parties involved in the project are looking for alternative financing possibilities if the city does not to pay its part of the development costs (even if that money would be a loan which will be payed back).

Here history repeats itself since the present stadium was built in the crisis years 1935-1936. And the city did not pay anything and the opening had to be delayed till March 27th 1937 since the city failed to finish the roads and the tram lines in time for the stadium to be opened.

After that the city has profited massively from this stadium which will be in use for 75 years coming March, though it is actually 1 year older. So it is quite sad that again the city wants to be on the front row without paying for that position.

[skaP187]

It´s not wurth changing anything as nothing is sure.
Nobody has clear what they want or what it will look like, all speculation.

[EPA001]

Well, the numbers are from the most recent detailled busines case (level 3 out of a total of 4 business cases to be made. The higher the number, the more detailled the business case becomes) so that makes them imho reliable enough to change the (targeted) capacity.

Of course nobody knows what it will look like since there is no architect yet selected as the parameters are still (slightly) flexible. After the fixation (& formal approval) of Business Case level 4, and the decision to be made by the City of Rotterdam, the architect selection process can started. That means that even then you are still far away from knowing how the stadium eventually will look like.

@Sercan: thanks for the change in the title of this thread.

[OnceBittenTwiceShy]

Allegedly, this ‘development’ has entered yet another speculative stage now that, reportedly, the waterfront stadium design’ has been banned from the drawing tables.


Source: Dutch TV Rijnmond Rotterdam, brought to you by Google Translate and slightly modified:

Two large construction companies are working separately on plans for a new De Kuip. The desire of the municipality of Rotterdam and Feyenoord to build a new stadium is thus revived.

There are two construction companies in the race to partner with other parties to create a new stadium for up to 65,000 visitors. The first builders are a consortium of BAM, Siemens and Eneco. They want to thoroughly renovate the existing stadium. During construction, which will take about 4 years, the stadium can be used.

The other major party contractor Volker Wessels are working on a new stadium on the sports fields adjacent De Kuip. Their plans provide retaining the old stadium for other sports, but the financing is not yet complete.

Please note the artist impression depicts De Kuip in its authentic roofless state:

[Maastricht]

When can we expect the First designs?

[Modis]

When will this project be aproved,is there any information about this project.Or this is just a piece of computer work that was once on the move,but not anymore.?

[carnifex2005]

Originally Posted by Quintana

Apparently renovating De Kuip has become an option now as well (and we were led to believe that it was simply too old and in too dire state to make this a viable option). Proposed capacity of the new stadium had already been downgraded to 68,000.

And well it should be downgraded. It would be idiotic for a team that averages about 40k per game the last 10 seasons to try to fill up anything more than a 60k stadium. It makes absolutely no economic sense.

[flierfy]

Originally Posted by carnifex2005

And well it should be downgraded. It would be idiotic for a team that averages about 40k per game the last 10 seasons to try to fill up anything more than a 60k stadium. It makes absolutely no economic sense.

It's not just Feijenoord who fills this ground. Cup finals and internationals are played there as well. So a 70'000 seater is certainly not unreasonable.