GERMANY | Railways

[K_]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

As for translucent glasses peeking into the cabin, I'm glad they are getting rid of that security failure.

Why is that a security failure? For DB it used to be even a source of extra income...

[aleander]

He is afraid of terrorists breaking in and steering trains into skyscrapers.

[Suburbanist]

I read that they are going to cancel the Nurberg-Praha train service as of Dec. 2012. It was apparently killed by bus competition (the market is heavily concentrated in both cities and the trains stops too much, thus slower).

They'd route services currently running on that route to Münche Hbf.


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Originally Posted by K_

Why is that a security failure? For DB it used to be even a source of extra income...

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks then having armed men in the wood gunning down passengers as they exit the trains - for instance.

[aleander]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks then having armed men in the wood gunning down passengers as they exit the trains - for instance.

Y'know, if they can pull that off, they could just mine the tracks. And before you think that fencing the tracks off is enough, there's RPGs, molotov cocktails and remote-detonation IEDs. Because Germany is like Afghanistan, man.

[AlexNL]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks then having armed men in the wood gunning down passengers as they exit the trains - for instance.

And they can't do that when the panel and the door is made out of wood or plastic, as opposed to sturdy glass? :')

[KingNick]

Originally Posted by AlexNL

And they can't do that when the panel and the door is made out of wood or plastic, as opposed to sturdy glass? :')

All you have to do is weld the train driver into a frame made out of steel. No doors. Just to piss those train hatin' terrorists off!

[AlexNL]

Originally Posted by KingNick

All you have to do is weld the train driver into a frame made out of steel. No doors. Just to piss those train hatin' terrorists off!

But then you risk those damn terrorist sabotaging the tracks, so we should give the driver some way to avert potential upcoming danger...

[Sopomon]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks then having armed men in the wood gunning down passengers as they exit the trains - for instance.

Oh Subby, you so cray...

[Wilhem275]

C'mon, we're not americans, we don't give a damn about that terrorists bullshit.
We're fine europeans, you must tell us some eco-snob lie to make us take idiotic decisions

[Suburbanist]

Originally Posted by AlexNL

And they can't do that when the panel and the door is made out of wood or plastic, as opposed to sturdy glass? :')

I'm obviously thinking of kevlar-reinforced separation, like they have in cockpit doors these days.

[K_]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

I'm obviously thinking of kevlar-reinforced separation, like they have in cockpit doors these days.

There is a big difference between a plane and a train. You can't take a train to Cuba.

[K_]

Originally Posted by Wilhem275

C'mon, we're not americans, we don't give a damn about that terrorists bullshit.

The reason why we don't see more terrorist attacks is not that somehow our anti terrorism measures are effectual. They aren't. Most of them don't even make sense.
The truth is that there are not a lot of terrorists around. Maybe a few 10s or people. And most of them are already on the radar of the worlds intelligence services...

What the TSA does in the US is pure theater, a performance to make us feel safe. It doesn't actually make us safer, costs a lot of money and adds inconvenience to travel. So please don't expand this program to trains too.

One of my best train rides was from Split to Zagreb, where I started to make pictures from behind the glass partition separating the driver's cabin from the passenger area, and promptly got invited in by the driver!

[K_]

Originally Posted by Suburbanist

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks ...

You are aware that you don't need access to the driver's cabin to force a train to make an emergency stop?

[Baron Hirsch]

Suburbanist has a way of creating his great jokes and all of you keep falling for them like Pavlov's Dog. This one is even too funny for the most paranoid mind, I would think.
Let us get realistic. Recent terrorism on trains -
1. Sapsan derailed by Chechen separatists (Moscow - Petersburg)
2. Bomb detonated on commuter rail (Madrid)
3. Gas attack on metro station (Tokyo)
None of these include the driver seat. Unlike planes or cars, trains are not self-sufficient vehicles. If misused, they can be forced to brake by anyone on board, their electricity can be cut-off from outside, they can be rerouted, etc.
Any security problem for people wanting to engage in wanton mass slaughter is concerned with uncontrolled passenger access; no or not highly secure access to operating grounds. Changing this would be a heavy financial burden on operators (turning all subway stations into mini-airports with x-rays, bodychecks, etc.), would violate what is left of our civil liberties, cause immense congestion at entries and exits.
But maybe this will be the 21st century: total security, control of movement, no crossing the street without having your pupils scanned first....

[chornedsnorkack]

Originally Posted by Baron Hirsch

Changing this would be a heavy financial burden on operators (turning all subway stations into mini-airports with x-rays, bodychecks, etc.), would violate what is left of our civil liberties, cause immense congestion at entries and exits.

And therefore useless. Just apply bomb, poison gas, automatic gunfire etc. to the passengers queuing to pass wherever the arms control checkpoint is - the casualties will be the same as if there had been no checkpoint to begin with.

[XAN_]

Originally Posted by Baron Hirsch

1. Sapsan derailed by Chechen separatists (Moscow - Petersburg)

Not Sapsan, but Nevskiy Ekspress.

[Gag Halfrunt]

Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack

And therefore useless. Just apply bomb, poison gas, automatic gunfire etc. to the passengers queuing to pass wherever the arms control checkpoint is - the casualties will be the same as if there had been no checkpoint to begin with.

Exactly. Iraqi insurgents didn't take long to realise that a checkpoint where dozens of people are waiting to go through is as good a target as any.

[Deadeye Reloaded]

Now some serious railway news:

The construction of the Wendlingen <---> Ulm high-speed railway line has been kicked-off:

Facts

Costs: 2,9 billions €uro
Length: 60 km (30 km of tunnels)
Vmax: 250 km/h
Number of tracks: 2

Wendlingen–Ulm high-speed railway (wikipedia)

[KingNick]

Tunnel ratio 0.5, that almost meets Austrian standards of how a new railway line has to look like.
I see a lot of Verkehrswegebündelung there. Good thing!


BTW: Upgrade München - Salzburg to HSR already!

[gramercy]

if 30 km is in tunnels, can anyone tell me a GOOD reason why it isn't 300+ kph?