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Old May 30th, 2012, 11:43 PM   #1381
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
And they can't do that when the panel and the door is made out of wood or plastic, as opposed to sturdy glass? :')
All you have to do is weld the train driver into a frame made out of steel. No doors. Just to piss those train hatin' terrorists off!
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Old May 31st, 2012, 12:05 AM   #1382
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Originally Posted by KingNick View Post
All you have to do is weld the train driver into a frame made out of steel. No doors. Just to piss those train hatin' terrorists off!
But then you risk those damn terrorist sabotaging the tracks, so we should give the driver some way to avert potential upcoming danger...
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Old May 31st, 2012, 12:50 AM   #1383
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Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post

Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks then having armed men in the wood gunning down passengers as they exit the trains - for instance.
Oh Subby, you so cray...
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Old May 31st, 2012, 01:17 AM   #1384
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C'mon, we're not americans, we don't give a damn about that terrorists bullshit.
We're fine europeans, you must tell us some eco-snob lie to make us take idiotic decisions
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Old May 31st, 2012, 02:15 AM   #1385
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexNL View Post
And they can't do that when the panel and the door is made out of wood or plastic, as opposed to sturdy glass? :')
I'm obviously thinking of kevlar-reinforced separation, like they have in cockpit doors these days.
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Old May 31st, 2012, 07:31 AM   #1386
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I'm obviously thinking of kevlar-reinforced separation, like they have in cockpit doors these days.
There is a big difference between a plane and a train. You can't take a train to Cuba.
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Old May 31st, 2012, 07:37 AM   #1387
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C'mon, we're not americans, we don't give a damn about that terrorists bullshit.
The reason why we don't see more terrorist attacks is not that somehow our anti terrorism measures are effectual. They aren't. Most of them don't even make sense.
The truth is that there are not a lot of terrorists around. Maybe a few 10s or people. And most of them are already on the radar of the worlds intelligence services...

What the TSA does in the US is pure theater, a performance to make us feel safe. It doesn't actually make us safer, costs a lot of money and adds inconvenience to travel. So please don't expand this program to trains too.

One of my best train rides was from Split to Zagreb, where I started to make pictures from behind the glass partition separating the driver's cabin from the passenger area, and promptly got invited in by the driver!
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Old May 31st, 2012, 12:09 PM   #1388
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
Terrorists could gain access to the driver's cabin and take control, if only for a few moments, of a train, like deploying emergency braking in a rural stretch of tracks ...
You are aware that you don't need access to the driver's cabin to force a train to make an emergency stop?
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Old June 2nd, 2012, 11:57 AM   #1389
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Suburbanist has a way of creating his great jokes and all of you keep falling for them like Pavlov's Dog. This one is even too funny for the most paranoid mind, I would think.
Let us get realistic. Recent terrorism on trains -
1. Sapsan derailed by Chechen separatists (Moscow - Petersburg)
2. Bomb detonated on commuter rail (Madrid)
3. Gas attack on metro station (Tokyo)
None of these include the driver seat. Unlike planes or cars, trains are not self-sufficient vehicles. If misused, they can be forced to brake by anyone on board, their electricity can be cut-off from outside, they can be rerouted, etc.
Any security problem for people wanting to engage in wanton mass slaughter is concerned with uncontrolled passenger access; no or not highly secure access to operating grounds. Changing this would be a heavy financial burden on operators (turning all subway stations into mini-airports with x-rays, bodychecks, etc.), would violate what is left of our civil liberties, cause immense congestion at entries and exits.
But maybe this will be the 21st century: total security, control of movement, no crossing the street without having your pupils scanned first....
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Old June 2nd, 2012, 12:10 PM   #1390
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Changing this would be a heavy financial burden on operators (turning all subway stations into mini-airports with x-rays, bodychecks, etc.), would violate what is left of our civil liberties, cause immense congestion at entries and exits.
And therefore useless. Just apply bomb, poison gas, automatic gunfire etc. to the passengers queuing to pass wherever the arms control checkpoint is - the casualties will be the same as if there had been no checkpoint to begin with.
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Old June 2nd, 2012, 03:10 PM   #1391
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Baron Hirsch View Post
1. Sapsan derailed by Chechen separatists (Moscow - Petersburg)
Not Sapsan, but Nevskiy Ekspress.
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Old June 3rd, 2012, 11:42 AM   #1392
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Quote:
Originally Posted by chornedsnorkack View Post
And therefore useless. Just apply bomb, poison gas, automatic gunfire etc. to the passengers queuing to pass wherever the arms control checkpoint is - the casualties will be the same as if there had been no checkpoint to begin with.
Exactly. Iraqi insurgents didn't take long to realise that a checkpoint where dozens of people are waiting to go through is as good a target as any.
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Old June 4th, 2012, 02:52 AM   #1393
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Now some serious railway news:

The construction of the Wendlingen <---> Ulm high-speed railway line has been kicked-off:

Facts

Costs: 2,9 billions €uro
Length: 60 km (30 km of tunnels)
Vmax: 250 km/h
Number of tracks: 2

Wendlingen–Ulm high-speed railway (wikipedia)







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Old June 4th, 2012, 03:05 AM   #1394
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Tunnel ratio 0.5, that almost meets Austrian standards of how a new railway line has to look like.
I see a lot of Verkehrswegebündelung there. Good thing!


BTW: Upgrade München - Salzburg to HSR already!
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Old June 4th, 2012, 04:13 PM   #1395
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if 30 km is in tunnels, can anyone tell me a GOOD reason why it isn't 300+ kph?
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Old June 4th, 2012, 04:37 PM   #1396
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possibly aerodynamic issues? Depending on the tunnel clearance, there may be issues with that, especially at very high speeds. You get a column of air before you, and to make things even worse, a column of less dense air behind you (which sucks you back down the tunnel). Unless you pump out the air, then you can go 500+ :-)
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Old June 4th, 2012, 04:55 PM   #1397
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if 30 km is in tunnels, can anyone tell me a GOOD reason why it isn't 300+ kph?
Because the line is only 60km long?
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Old June 4th, 2012, 05:26 PM   #1398
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Because the line is only 60km long?
yea

and nobody can forsee any lengthening in either direction for any purpose in any timeframe

i mean, at least the alignment...


i totally get that the first couple of decades it makes no sense to operate such a short line at higher speeds, but if they put half the alignment in tunnels then align them so that they are as straight as can be when higher speeds will eventually be needed
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Old June 4th, 2012, 09:22 PM   #1399
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suburbanist View Post
I'm obviously thinking of kevlar-reinforced separation, like they have in cockpit doors these days.
I get the impression that you've seen "Under Seige 2" too many times.
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Old June 4th, 2012, 09:33 PM   #1400
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gramercy View Post
if 30 km is in tunnels, can anyone tell me a GOOD reason why it isn't 300+ kph?
Probably that's why: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/ICx

Germany is not going the 300+ km/h way. More important to them is an integrated timetable.
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