Differences between English people and Welsh people

[large]

Originally Posted by JamesWales

I don't think that's a fair reflection at all. Euro 96, England went mental. Flags everywhere, lots of patriotism etc. Correspondingly, this obviously didn't happen in Wales, and inevitably, some Welsh people would have displayed German flags for a laugh, to wind people up, or because they genuinely didn't want England to win.

It's the European Championships now, and I can tell you that in my office, only one person has said they actively wanted England to lose last night. I watched the game with people from the Valleys, all supporting England.

Many don't support England, but many more do, albeit with minimal enthusiasm.

I do get a bit annoyed by this myth that the Welsh are opposed to the English. There is actually very little evidence whatsoever to support it. It's about respect. Few English people are knowledgeable about Wales, and this frustrates Welsh people, some of whom may respond with something that could be taken as anti-English.

btw; There are a lot of German students in Cardiff too, so it would have been acceptable for them to fly flags, whereas correspondingly this would have been far less acceptable in England at the time..wasn't a Russian stabbed in England after the game because people thought he was German?

Maybe things have changed. It didn't bother me...in fact I thought it was amusing, until the Germans broke our hearts. Either way, it didn't stop me liking the welsh people, who are British, but in a very welsh way

[JamesWales]

Originally Posted by large

Maybe things have changed. It didn't bother me...in fact I thought it was amusing, until the Germans broke our hearts. Either way, it didn't stop me liking the welsh people, who are British, but in a very welsh way

That's cool. my point really is that 'The Welsh' (or more correctly 'people living in Wales' Cardiff is at least 10% English born) don't collectively think anything.

There is a huge diversity of opinions in Wales, like anywhere else..Indeed our views on the United Kingdom are probably more evenly varied than the other nations

[Mwara]

In reply to this question. People in wales speak welsh only in many parts of wales. I grew up in a middle class welsh home. Welsh children are brought up differently to english children. Culture and education are first and foremost. My grandparents where singers my aunties and uncles and parents where singers. A welsh child automatically has singing and piano lessons they compete at eisteddfodau from a young age to sing recite etc. Hollywood wouldnt exist without the welsh and many famous welsh men have contributed to architecture politics medicine etc in the usa. Abraham Lincoln family hail from north wales.

[Awayo]

whereas english children are raised to torture small animals and eat their own poo. josef stalin's family were from doncaster.

[Karldiff]

Originally Posted by Awayo

whereas english children are raised to torture small animals and eat their own poo. josef stalin's family were from doncaster.

I've heard that. Can't the government do something about it? Bloody ConDems....

[Lostboy]

Originally Posted by Mwara

In reply to this question. People in wales speak welsh only in many parts of wales. I grew up in a middle class welsh home. Welsh children are brought up differently to english children. Culture and education are first and foremost. My grandparents where singers my aunties and uncles and parents where singers. A welsh child automatically has singing and piano lessons they compete at eisteddfodau from a young age to sing recite etc. Hollywood wouldnt exist without the welsh and many famous welsh men have contributed to architecture politics medicine etc in the usa. Abraham Lincoln family hail from north wales.

Your last bit is hardly profound.

All countries have emigres who have contributed to American architecture, politics and medicine in the US, that Welsh or partially Welsh descended people have done so is hardly surprising and less so when you consider they are from the traditionally dominant white European culture that did so well in America (although in thr future as an adopted Mexican I am sure this will change shortly).

Lincoln was an American of mixed descent (there's still speculation he's part African American) but immediate ancestors wete established Americans. Regardless his achievements were American and done as an American, not a Welshman or any European.

[jdjones]

Also, if I can put my two pence in, So what if Lincoln's family originated from North Wales, they don't live there now and he never did, you could say he became who he was BECAUSE they left Wales. Also look at the top 10 Surnames of African Americans, 5 of which are Welsh, freed slaves often took their former owner's surname, so there was a lot of Welsh decent slave owners.

[Dreamer]

Originally Posted by liamcymro

If you do ever come here to North West Wales - Welsh is much more popular with around 62% + of the population speaking Welsh, as I do! But Cardiff, I just love Cardiff - a fantastic city, nice cosmopolitan place to live - Looking forward to be at the University there next year studing Welsh!

No offence but why study Welsh? Wouldn't it be better to study a useful language like Chinese? I think there's a big difference between north and south, mainly accent and what people do. We have Snowdonia and most people here shop in England or to go out or to watch a film or eat as Chester and Liverpool are so close and Manchester too.

[Awayo]

Originally Posted by Dreamer

No offence but why study Welsh?

Because it is beautiful, 1,500 years old at least and with a literature to prove it and, for the Cymraeg, of themselves: their families, ancestors, land and history.

Not everything that many might choose to spend time and effort upon will be chosen as it might make it more likely to land a particular job in an office. However considering Wales' legally-enforced bilingual officialdom and the devolved adminstration in Cardiff needing thousands of Welsh-speaking recruits each year, studying Welsh will help in that as well.

[Mwmbwls]

Originally Posted by Awayo

Because it is beautiful, 1,500 years old at least and with a literature to prove it and, for the Cymraeg, of themselves: their families, ancestors, land and history.

Not everything that many might choose to spend time and effort upon will be chosen as it might make it more likely to land a particular job in an office. However considering Wales' legally-enforced bilingual officialdom and the devolved adminstration in Cardiff needing thousands of Welsh-speaking recruits each year, studying Welsh will help in that as well.

Right answer but wrong reason. Yes Welsh is beautiful but you cannot eat history. The key benefit of speaking Welsh occurs when the Welsh become polyglot. Speaking only English holds back the United Kingdom in the World. The Irish have long realised that being multi lingual was a critical factor in exploiting their membership of the EU.

[Dreamer]

Originally Posted by Awayo

Because it is beautiful, 1,500 years old at least and with a literature to prove it and, for the Cymraeg, of themselves: their families, ancestors, land and history.

Not everything that many might choose to spend time and effort upon will be chosen as it might make it more likely to land a particular job in an office. However considering Wales' legally-enforced bilingual officialdom and the devolved adminstration in Cardiff needing thousands of Welsh-speaking recruits each year, studying Welsh will help in that as well.

I see your point, the issue with any legally enforcement of welsh is the cost and the fact that the government needs to focus on import issues with the lack of investment in Wales and the north south divide in the country. Never mind the additional costs in providing extra paperwork for a language most people dont speak. North Wales losses out to South Wales every time and the complete lack of working together with England and English councils to improve transport, rail or any kind if realistic and successful investment or regeneration. Anyone who knows the north Wales cost will know rundown it is and it could easily be turned around.

[Dreamer]

Originally Posted by Mwmbwls

Right answer but wrong reason. Yes Welsh is beautiful but you cannot eat history. The key benefit of speaking Welsh occurs when the Welsh become polyglot. Speaking only English holds back the United Kingdom in the World. The Irish have long realised that being multi lingual was a critical factor in exploiting their membership of the EU.

True but wouldn't it make more sense to use/learn a language that would bring n significant jobs and wealth like mandarin or Japanese or other German?

[Lostboy]

Originally Posted by Dreamer

True but wouldn't it make more sense to use/learn a language that would bring n significant jobs and wealth like mandarin or Japanese or other German?

If language was entirely about economic factors, then everyone would speak English and nothing else (change to Mandarin in twenty years) or Europe would have collectively spoke French in the eighteenth or Spanish in the sixteenth century and forgot other languages. Language is the absolute centre of identity (not just national, but religious, political or class identity).

Chinese is more important globally but less important in Wales, move to North Wales its the most logical language to learn until the populace of North Wales, collectively abajdons it for Chinese and Arabic, and as an Indo European language can be learned by an English speaker far faster than Mandarin. Besides learning a language is not zero sum, there is an economy of scale, once the first foreign language is acquired the second quickly comes.

[Dreamer]

Originally Posted by Lostboy

If language was entirely about economic factors, then everyone would speak English and nothing else (change to Mandarin in twenty years) or Europe would have collectively spoke French in the eighteenth or Spanish in the sixteenth century and forgot other languages. Language is the absolute centre of identity (not just national, but religious, political or class identity).

Chinese is more important globally but less important in Wales, move to North Wales its the most logical language to learn until the populace of North Wales, collectively abajdons it for Chinese and Arabic, and as an Indo European language can be learned by an English speaker far faster than Mandarin. Besides learning a language is not zero sum, there is an economy of scale, once the first foreign language is acquired the second quickly comes.

A second language is totally about economic factors theses days, we didn't have a global economy in the 18th or 19th centuries so it wasnt important. We are broke and need to be as flexible as possible and need people in North Wales to be in work, and they want to work. Give the people a new skill like mandarin etc and we can attract investment to make Flintshire and Denbighshire better places to live.

The Welsh language is hugely important from a cultural point of view and does feature in some people's lives in everything they do or just by the road signs they see. However we need to ensure people do not become sidetracked and keep focused on job creation and investment.

South Wales gets new roads and rail links, we in North Wales get heavy congestion on the A55 and one main rail line that's not electrified. The question should be about the differences in Wales firstly. People say the UK in London-centric, we are Cardiff centric in a negative way.

[Lostboy]

Originally Posted by Dreamer

A second language is totally about economic factors theses days, we didn't have a global economy in the 18th or 19th centuries so it wasnt important. We are broke and need to be as flexible as possible and need people in North Wales to be in work, and they want to work. Give the people a new skill like mandarin etc and we can attract investment to make Flintshire and Denbighshire better places to live.

The Welsh language is hugely important from a cultural point of view and does feature in some people's lives in everything they do or just by the road signs they see. However we need to ensure people do not become sidetracked and keep focused on job creation and investment.

South Wales gets new roads and rail links, we in North Wales get heavy congestion on the A55 and one main rail line that's not electrified. The question should be about the differences in Wales firstly. People say the UK in London-centric, we are Cardiff centric in a negative way.

If North Walians were fluent in Spanish, Mandarin and Arabic, funds eould be concentrated in South Wales, the reason 60 percent of Wales, lives in a small corner consisting of Cardiff, Newport, Swansea and the valleys, why with this should funding not be South East Wales centric.

[Dreamer]

Originally Posted by Lostboy

If North Walians were fluent in Spanish, Mandarin and Arabic, funds eould be concentrated in South Wales, the reason 60 percent of Wales, lives in a small corner consisting of Cardiff, Newport, Swansea and the valleys, why with this should funding not be South East Wales centric.

Not if it means the rest of the country gets nothing. The A55 for example has needed to be widened for years as its the only main big road that goes all the way to Holyhead. In the summer it's even worse, this constant delays which put people off visiting, investing and doing business here is holding back millions of pounds of investment.

[Mwmbwls]

[QUOTE Besides learning a language is not zero sum, there is an economy of scale, once the first foreign language is acquired the second quickly comes.[/QUOTE]

The point I should have made but didn't - Well said.

[Kenneth austen]

Originally Posted by Dreamer

True but wouldn't it make more sense to use/learn a language that would bring n significant jobs and wealth like mandarin or Japanese or other German?

The art of communication is a common language and we have it. Its English,spoken in most parts of the world. Rare to hear Welsh spoken now in South Wales. Eastern European is the language I hear mainly, it's everywhere. I understand one large factory near Merthyr requires Understanding of the polish language, no hope for the locals. Glad I am retired.

[Pennypacker]

I didn't know that 'Eastern European' was a language...

[Kenneth austen]

I was referring to many languages now heard from Eastern Europe. There are many, All welcome, but causing many social problems due to language problems within schools, something the government over looked.