Brutal New York - 1965/95

[desertpunk]

Originally Posted by T. Funster

I'm not sure if this is the right place for this, but I'm doing a reseach on The Bowery (and surroundings) in the 1970's and early 1980's (more specifically, from 1970 to 1984), and I'm finding it very difficult to find not only good pictures of it, but also information. Famous bars and nightclubs of that place during that time, famous prostitution points, and this kind of thing. Anything would be helpful, really.

I actually wanted to create a thread specifically about this, but I'm not able to do it just yet, so I'd be incredibly grateful if someone had at least something here.

Thank you.

Here's some stuff:

http://forumnyc.com/topic/30429-new-...os-from-1970s/

http://www.google.com/url?q=http://w...LghP98usZ49S1Q

http://www.google.com/url?q=http://w...1NHDxPFmHIMrWQ

[desertpunk]

1980s

image hosted on flickr

NY in the 80s 173 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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Hell Gate Bridge 20 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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NY in the 80s 166 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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Abandoned Building 25 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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NY Subway 57 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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NY in the 80s 117 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

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Coney Island - ruins in the 1980s 2 by stevensiegel260, on Flickr

[ducus]

Seems to you that NYC has changed in comparation with those times, that isn't anymore so miserable and ghetto-ed?
That "big picture", atmosphere, couldn't dissapear over time, so there's nothing new compared with today. The ghetto and the misery exists even today, so what really changed?

[Uaarkson]

What are you talking about? NYC's ghettos have shrunk to a tiny fraction of what they were in this time period. The city is far safer, cleaner and more well-kept than it was even 15 years ago.

[LegitimateAnswer]

Originally Posted by ducus

Seems to you that NYC has changed in comparation with those times, that isn't anymore so miserable and ghetto-ed?
That "big picture", atmosphere, couldn't dissapear over time, so there's nothing new compared with today. The ghetto and the misery exists even today, so what really changed?

I went to the city this winter for the first time, and my dad did 10 years ago. Before i went for a visit there he told me i would see many impoverished places and constantly reminded me to stay out of some places (harlem etc). But when i actually went there (stayed in the bronx, pelham pkwy) i was shocked by how clean and safe the city was. I went to harlem 3 times at this pizzeria and the same thing. Cleanliness, safety and overall a good picture of a buzzing harmonious city. I was absolutely impressed!

Comparing the city with the pictures above leaves me in wonder whether they are photoshoped lol. NYC is 100x times better than i expected and 1000x better than the pictures above!

[desertpunk]

1978

image hosted on flickr

http://www.flickr.com/photos/photographers-gallery/

[desertpunk]

Brooklyn 1975

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Boro Park, Brooklyn 1975 70s "Go Cart" under EL on New Utrecht Ave - full slide by Whiskeygonebad, on Flickr

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Boro Park Brooklyn 1975 13th Ave - 04 by Whiskeygonebad, on Flickr

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Boro Park Brooklyn 1975 13th Ave - 06 by Whiskeygonebad, on Flickr

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Boro Park Brooklyn 55th St Station Intersection 1976 Kodachrome by Whiskeygonebad, on Flickr

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326 by tonymarciante, on Flickr

[Dralcoffin]

I would go so far as to say New York in the past thirty years has seen the greatest urban turnaround of our lifetimes. The only sort of transformation that surpasses it in my view is the post-war resurgences of Tokyo, Seoul, Berlin, etc.

[JoakoLC]

Amazing pics everyone, congrats.

[superbigshow1997]

those pics make me want to scream.. its sad.

[Uaarkson]

Google streetview yourself around the Bronx, you'll feel a lot better. NYC has experienced redemption ten-fold since the end of this period.

[Majkyboy]

This is maybe the first thread on SSC or on whole internet what made me almost cry and it gaves me the main reason why I want to visit NY...Mr.Photograph you have my respect and my admiration...Cheers from Slovakia...

[Uaarkson]

Here's some music for the thread.

[swivel]

amazing to see how this thread has lived on. miss you guys.

[VelesHomais]

Originally Posted by ducus

Seems to you that NYC has changed in comparation with those times, that isn't anymore so miserable and ghetto-ed?
That "big picture", atmosphere, couldn't dissapear over time, so there's nothing new compared with today. The ghetto and the misery exists even today, so what really changed?

Nonsense. As a New Yorker I don't even recognize my city in these pictures from the 70s and 80s.

[JoakoLC]

Well, there's something wrong whit you then. Ghettos still exist around nyc.

[acc521]

As a tourist, I spent time in Bed Stuy last year and felt safe enough, tell me I could have done that in the 80s!

To suggest nothing has changed is crazy.

[yankeesfan1000]

Originally Posted by JoakoLC

Well, there's something wrong whit you then. Ghettos still exist around nyc.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that they don't, it's the scale and size of them that's changed. Going from 2245 murders in 1990, to 500 last year is very indicative of the transformation NY has undergone. The NY of the 1970s or 1980s or even 1990 might as well be a completely different city.

I'm only 24, but the amount of gentrification that has occurred since I was a kid is incredible, let alone since the 70s.

[nipz]

epic tread, such beautiful city in such deep criminal decay!!!

[skyduster]

Originally Posted by Uaarkson

Standard of living in the US varies wildly. Cities have a much lower HDI than suburban and rural environments. Middle and Upper class Americans live just as well as any other top tier country, but inner city ghettos drag the number down a bit.

Yeah, wrong.

Rural areas tend to have lower HDI than cities/suburbs.

This map pretty much illustrates that, using the same scale used by the UN (0-1.000). Generally, the more urbanized a state (or demographically dominated by its big city/cities), the higher its HDI. The more rural the state, the lower the HDI. There are some exceptions like Vermont and Iowa.

source

Here's another indicator of HDI across the United States: take a look at measureofamerica.org/maps

Click on "start exploring". The default map shows you HDI per state. In the top left, you can change it, and check HDI per each of the ten largest metropolitan areas. You can compare those scores with the states (the scale used is different than the one used by the UN).

The Chicago metropolitan area has a higher HDI than the state of Illinois as a whole, and it has a higher HDI than 40 states. The other ten states are mostly urbanized states like New York and Colorado (states whose populations are mostly concentrated in the state's largest metropolitan area.) The Chicago metropolitan area surpasses all the rural states (states with no big city)...a clear indicator that rural areas have low HDI.

The New York City metropolitan area would rank second in HDI if it were a state, surpassed only by Connecticut. This means that Metro NYC also surpasses its respective states, NJ and NY.

The Washington DC metropolitan area has a higher HDI than all the states.

In fact, here's how the ten largest metropolitan areas* compare to the states:
*It looks like they didn't consider San Francisco-San Jose a single metropolitan area, so it's excluded from the list, which bumped up Miami into the list.

Washington DC metropolitan area (DC/MD/VA) 6.94
Boston metropolitan area 6.55
Connecticut 6.3
New York City metropolitan area (NY/NJ) 6.26
Massachusetts state 6.24
District of Columbia (entirely urban) 6.21
New Jersey state 6.16
Maryland state 5.96
New York state 5.77
Minnesota 5.74
New Hampshire 5.73
Hawaii 5.73
Philadelphia metropolitan area (PA/NJ) 5.70
Colorado 5.65
Chicago metropolitan area (IL/IN) 5.61
Los Angeles metropolitan area 5.60
Rhode Island 5.56
California state 5.56
Atlanta metropolitan area 5.53 (tie)
Virginia state 5.53 (tie)
Washington state 5.53 (tie)
Miami-Ft Lauderdale metropolitan area 5.46
Illinois state 5.39
Delaware 5.33
Alaska 5.27
Vermont 5.27
Wisconsin 5.23
Pennsylvania state 5.12
Dallas-Ft Worth metropolitan area 5.11 (tie)
Arizona 5.11 (tie)
Utah 5.08
Florida state 5.07
Iowa 5.06
Kansas 5.06
Nebraska 5.05
Oregon 5.03
Houston metropolitan area 5.02
Michigan 4.99
North Dakota 4.92
Maine 4.89
Ohio 4.87
Georgia state 4.86
South Dakota 4.82
Wyoming 4.80
Nevada 4.78
Indiana state 4.74
Missouri 4.68
Texas state 4.67
Idaho 4.65
North Carolina 4.64
New Mexico 4.56
Montana 4.49
South Carolina 4.36
Tennessee 4.33
Kentucky 4.23
Oklahoma 4.15
Alabama 4.09
Louisiana 4.07
Mississippi 3.93
Arkansas 3.87
West Virginia 3.85

For 3 states (California, Louisiana, and Mississippi), you can even check out detailed information by county and even town (for some counties). Click on California (state profiles -> California closeup), and note that the entire rural San Joaquin Valley has low HDI, along with other rural areas (like Imperial County and some of those backwoods far-northern counties). The San Francisco Bay, Los Angeles, and Sacramento metropolitan aras are overwhelmingly high or medium HDI. The very few areas in Metro Los Angeles that have low HDI (comparable to rural areas), are the poor areas of South-Central and East L.A. The San Francisco metropolitan area only has one very small low-HDI area.

There's a loooooooot of poverty in rural areas which tend to receive more from federal and state than they pay in taxes. Whereas major metropolitan areas pay more than they receive.

As for city-vs-suburb, it's a false comparison.

There's both high-HDI and low-HDI areas in city centres, and there's both high-HDI and low-HDI in suburbs. And there's medium-HDI in both as well. This can be proven, again, by looking at the California closeup in the website I mentioned above.

The poor "inner city" is becoming a thing of the past, except perhaps in Detroit (whose metro you live in). Detroit seems to be stuck in the 1970s/80s, where you still have vast urban blight surrounding the downtown, and everyone from lower-middle-class and upwards, lives in the suburbs.

In NYC, and other cities including Chicago and Boston, the concept of a "poor inner city" no longer exists; former "inner city" areas have become completely gentrified, while the poor have been pushed further out, and even into the suburbs. In Washington, central areas are a mix of rich, poor, middle class...there is no central-peripheral pattern. In Los Angeles, the "poor inner city" never really existed; L.A.'s city centre is difficult to define, and most of its most notorious poorest areas (Watts, Compton, East L.A.) are actually peripheral, not central by any means. By the early 1990s, the term "inner city" became synonymous with urban blight. But by 2010-2012, that term has become a huge misnomer...which is why it's rarely ever used anymore.

And regardless of the socioeconomic variations within cities and metros...rural areas still come out at the bottom.

Thanks for a good laugh, though.