Ask the Tubeman

[alserrod]

Thanks to all of you.
I take the words of "intermodal interchange". I think it is the closest to the definitions given in my surroundings.

They are those kind of words not used frequently, not read on newspapers, books or that stuff and not easy to find an accurate translation.

[Tubeman]

Originally Posted by ajw373

Gee wizz some people really want to over complicate things (see answers above). The simple answer to your question is one word. Interchange.

Tell me about it!

'Interchange' is the word used in the UK (although I think 'exchange' is favoured in North America)

'Intermodal' only applies if you mean different forms of transport

[makita09]

Originally Posted by alserrod

Thanks to all of you.
I take the words of "intermodal interchange". I think it is the closest to the definitions given in my surroundings.

"Intermodal" is most commonly used in transport to describe containerised freight traffic. If you use the word to describe passenger traffic it will be misunderstood and confusing. "Interchange" is sufficient for any passenger transport nodes, as it describes modal changes as well as non-modal changes.

[jesinej]

Carissimo, riusciresti a caricare una carta della metropolitana di Londra attuale e inserendo sulla cartina TUTTE LE STAZIONI ABBANDONATE E CHIUSE DAL 1909?

Dear, could you upload a map of the London Underground map on the current and entering ALL STATIONS ABANDONED AND CLOSED FROM 1909?

[sotonsi]

That's quite an ask, especially with TfL copyright meaning that someone can't just add stations to an existing map and publish it here without risking legal problems.

http://www.clarksbury.com/cdl/maps.html has old tube maps scanned.

You'd modify an existing map by the following (not dealing with service changes such as line switches and chords, or rebuildings):

• Jubilee: Green Park to Charing Cross now closed
• East London Line:
  • currently Overground New Cross/New Cross Gate and Whitechapel.
  • Whitechapel - Shoreditch closed
• District:
  • South Acton - Acton Town shuttle.
  • Upminster - various intermediate stations - Southend.
• Piccadilly:
  • Holborn - Aldwych branch.
  • Down Street between Green Park and Piccadilly Circus.
  • York Street between Kings Cross and Caledonian Road.
• Central: Epping - North Weald - Blake Hall - Ongar
• Bakerloo: Harrow & Wealdstone - Headstone Lane - Hatch End - Carpenders Park - Bushey - Watford High Street - Watford Junction
• H&C: Latimer Road - Uxbridge Road - Kensington (Olympia)
• Northern:
  • Moorgate - Old Street - Essex Road - Highbury & Islington - Drayton Park - Finsbury Park - Stroud Green - Crouch End - Highgate - Cranley Gardens - Muswell Hill - Alexandra Palace.
  • Mill Hill East - Mill Hill (The Hale) - Edgware.
  • City Road between Angel and Old Street.
  • South Kentish Town between Camden Town and Kentish Town
• Met:
  • Baker Street - St Johns Wood - Marlborough Road - Swiss Cottage - Finchley Road (stations on Jubilee with same name more than just resitings).
  • Amersham - Great Missenden - Wendover - Stoke Mandeville - Aylesbury - Waddeston Manor - Quainton Road - Granborough Road - Winslow Road - Verney Junction.
  • Quainton Road - Waddeston Road - Wescott - Wooton - Church Siding - Wood Siding - Brill

I may have missed some things out.

[NCT]

Or buy Tubemans' book.

[Tubeman]

Originally Posted by NCT

Or buy Tubemans' book.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/London-Railw...pr_product_top

Although if I'm honest it sounds like Doug Rose's map is more what you're looking for http://www.amazon.co.uk/London-Under...4487109&sr=1-4

[NCT]

Why did I put the apostrophe after the s?

[CharlieP]

Originally Posted by NCT

Why did I put the apostrophe after the s?

Relax, everybody makes mistakes.

[trainrover]

Originally Posted by Tubeman

I think 'exchange' is favoured in North America

Transfer station seems to be current here

[nr23Derek]

Yeah OK I could buy Tubies book - and probably will anyway - but having seen a report (in the Daily Mail so it must be true) about the Aldwych station my curiosity about this station has been rekindled.

First: The long disused platform has tracks laid on the ground - without the usual suicide trench. I'd never thought about that before, but the idea seems to be someone doing a "one under" simply drops below the train. So question is, were these retro fitted and if so when were these added?

Second I've never understood why Aldwych was built. Was it intended to carry the line on to Waterloo? The double tracks seem to indicate bigger things were planned, but the "extension" doesn't simply carry on from Holborn.

Sorry if all this has been covered somewhere in the wad of pages before

Derek

[sotonsi]

Originally Posted by nr23Derek

Second I've never understood why Aldwych was built. Was it intended to carry the line on to Waterloo? The double tracks seem to indicate bigger things were planned, but the "extension" doesn't simply carry on from Holborn.

Yea but no but.

The Piccadilly is a bodge of three lines - the Great Northern and Strand (Aldwych - Finsbury Park and Wood Green), the Brompton and Piccadilly Circus railway (Piccadilly Circus - South Ken and beyond) and the Metropolitan District Deep Level railway (Mansion House - South Ken - Hammersmith). These lines were merged into one route with a stump at Aldwych and some ability to built other sections that were dropped from the Hammersmith - Finsbury Park route.

The Waterloo extension looks to have been first proposed in 1905, when the B&PC route to Shepherds Bush (and Acton) and Hammersmith via High Street Ken, Walham Green, Angel and the Deep Level District at Charing Cross also were proposed. Given the Piccadilly line opened in 1906, Aldwych was simply built as the massive Strand terminus of the GN&S, rather than as a line that was going anywhere. One imagines that the B&PC was planned to be extended beyond Holborn and the connection to the GN&S was only temporary, but it became a huge success and so Aldwych got relegated.

[Manchester77]

Iya
Could you answer the following if its not too much trouble please?...
- When does the new timetable begin for the SSL (with full S7 use on the Hammersmith)

[nr23Derek]

Aldwych:

Originally Posted by sotonsi

Yea but no but.

The thing I find odd though is the line to Aldwych isn't simply a continuation of the line from the north (GN&S line). This map from Urban 75



I would have expected the lines form the north to simply run through to Aldwych, with a branch off west, but no.

Has Holborn been re-modeled at some point or something?

Derek

[London Underground]

That depends on what you mean by remodeled. The stub end platform has been closed and that track has been removed. The platform is now used as a storage room.

[nr23Derek]

Originally Posted by London Underground

That depends on what you mean by remodeled. The stub end platform has been closed and that track has been removed. The platform is now used as a storage room.

No no no!

If Aldwych were simply built as the terminus for the line from the north, the tunnels running south would line up with the tunnels from the north, but they don't.

So the line south must have been built as a separate concept, never intended to have been a part of the main route.

Derek

[London Underground]

Originally Posted by nr23Derek

No no no!

If Aldwych were simply built as the terminus for the line from the north, the tunnels running south would line up with the tunnels from the north, but they don't.

So the line south must have been built as a separate concept, never intended to have been a part of the main route.

Derek

I have no idea what you mean. You asked if Holborn had been remodeled and that's what i replied about.

[Tubeman]

Originally Posted by nr23Derek

First: The long disused platform has tracks laid on the ground - without the usual suicide trench. I'd never thought about that before, but the idea seems to be someone doing a "one under" simply drops below the train. So question is, were these retro fitted and if so when were these added?

Yes, the suicide pits were retro-fitted... There was a spate of suicides due to the Great Depression so they were installed in the early 1930's.

They allow emergency services to crawl under the train to the person to see if they're still alive or not... if they're pronounced dead, the train is simply driven off them, but if they're still alive then decisions need to be made whether to try to treat them initially under the train (if it might injure them more to move the train), or whether it's safe to recharge current and move the train.

I'm guessing that pre-suicide pits there must have been harrowing examples where 'jumpers' were still obviously alive under a train, but then killed when the train was moved to get to them.

The other benefit is that someone accidentally falling onto the track has somewhere to lie without being struck.

[Tubeman]

Originally Posted by Manchester77

Iya
Could you answer the following if its not too much trouble please?...
- When does the new timetable begin for the SSL (with full S7 use on the Hammersmith)

I'll try to find out when I'm next at work... S7 introduction doesn't necessitate a new timetable per se... for the time being it's just a case of C Stocks being sent for scrap and S7 stocks replacing them, there would be no distinct C or S7 working in the timetable.

The S Stock themselves don't deliver any significant timetabling benefits, it's the future SSR-wide resignalling which will do this... and that is many years off.

[Tubeman]

Regarding Holborn...

Here's an alternative diagram:



My understanding is that the station is laid out on 2 levels to facilitate a grade separated junction between the two routes. The northbound Aldwych branch assumedly could have continued to join the northbound main, and the southbound Aldwych branch could have diverged off the SB main instead (whether the relevant tunnels / step plate junctions were built for this I don't know).

The answer to the eventual configuration may lie in platform extensions... the original platforms were 250ft, when they were extended to 350ft I suppose they encroached into space originally occupied by the potential junction locations.

I suspect the answer is in the Capital Transport 'Piccadilly Line - An illustrated history' somewhere, I'll see if it is.