Miami Economic Development = Engines that drive the community

[theEmbarcadero]

Originally Posted by spellbound

I'd prefer no conflict, but the chances of the Super Bowl moving their date to accomodate the Boat Show would be zero. We have to be realistic about that. It's the biggest sporting event (by far) in the country and THEY decide when it's played---not the other way around.

I still maintain both could be done. A Super Bowl is not a Miami-only event and hasn't been for nearly three decades. I think there's ample hotel space in Dade and Broward to do it, even if there might be some logistical issues remaining.

From what I'm reading, though, San Francisco is pretty likely to get that game regardless since they'll have a brand new stadium to offer and the NFL LOVES that stuff.

Good comments from everyone here....and I see your point, casa, I really do. And calleOcho, you are spot on...and I would like to add a little to yours and spells' comments.

1. spell, you are correct in stating that the NFL is not going to change its SB date for anyone...EXCEPT itself, of course. They have been pushing it back on the calender for several decades. It used to be played in the middle of January, and now it is in Februay....and it gets later every year! My point is....the conflict of dates with the Miami Boat Show now, does not mean that will always be the case. The NFL is pushing for an 18 game season at some point in the future (and probably expanded playoffs) which would push the SB to the END of February....potentially.

2. calleOCHO hit the nail on the head....the Miami Boat Show is an annual event that has been around a lot longer than the SB. It is something that can be counted on.....EVERY year! Whereas the NFL makes its SB jump through a million hoops to even bid on the big game.

I wrote a post here a few years ago where I predicted that Miami was nearing the end of its run as a regular SB site....and would soon fall out of the SB rotation. I mentioned the monster new venues in Glendale and Arlington, not to mention the popularity of New Orleans and the NFLs commitment to that city. Throw in the Georgia Dome, new SF stadium, new LA stadium, new NY stadium and there is always Tampa..and several northen cities to be placated..

Add to this, an aging Joe Robbie Stadium (don't bother trying to correct me on this, fellas) and it puts Miami near the back of the line for future Super Bowls.

Am I advocating a one billion dollar, waterfront, new stadium downtown...??

Yes...

But that is not my point. My point is that The Miami Boat Show has to come first...!!!!!

[dave8721]

They can't change the weekend of the boat show on a couple of years notice?

[casamagda]

Originally Posted by spellbound

I still maintain both could be done.

That is fine. But if your opinion is that both could be done effectively, then you are in direct conflict with the Greater Miami Convention and Visitors Bureau among others.

You can drive a car with your feet, but it doesn't make it a good idea.

[Aceventura]

Yabba Dabba Doo!

[spellbound]

Originally Posted by casamagda

That is fine. But if your opinion is that both could be done effectively, then you are in direct conflict with the Greater Miami Convention and Visitors Bureau among others.

Oh my God, no! Not direct conflict with the Chamber of Commerce "and others!" I couldn't live with that.

Anyway, in all seriousness given that a Super Bowl is a regional affair, I'm not convinced it couldn't be done even if I already said there might be some logistical issues, which I guess you missed (you might have been reading between your toes).

The entire thing is probably moot, anyway, with San Francisco likely to win that Super Bowl bid.

[CalleOchoGringo]

Originally Posted by theEmbarcadero

Am I advocating a one billion dollar, waterfront, new stadium downtown...??

Yes...

But that is not my point. My point is that The Miami Boat Show has to come first...!!!!!

May I be the first in line to advocate that no tax payer money be used to pay for this?

Marlins stadium cost enough as it is and trying to save up for the Colossus of Savalas just puts us over the edge!

[casamagda]

Originally Posted by spellbound

Oh my God, no! Not direct conflict with the Chamber of Commerce "and others!" I couldn't live with that.
Anyway, in all seriousness given that a Super Bowl is a regional affair, I'm not convinced it couldn't be done even if I already said there might be some logistical issues, which I guess you missed (you might have been reading between your toes).

There are very thoughtful and thourough people at the Greater Miami Convention and Visitors Bureau (I didn't write GMCC) that plan and think about these very things for a living. They have been doing it for years, and these people know what they are talking about. You are welcome to post in the SSC that you are not convinced and hedge anyway you like.

However, your opinion does not change the fact that having a SB at the same time as the Boat Show is not feasible, nor desireable.

You are a smart enough guy, I'm convinced that a 5 minute chat with someone who knows what they are talking about would have you convinced.

[spellbound]

Originally Posted by casamagda

However, your opinion does not change the fact that having a SB at the same time as the Boat Show is not feasible, nor desireable.

You are a smart enough guy, I'm convinced that a 5 minute chat with someone who knows what they are talking about would have you convinced.

There is no unanimity that a Super Bowl at that time is not feasible or desirable, therefore that is ALSO an opinion and not a 'fact.'

Rodney Barreto and Nikki Grossman (who have both been at this a long, long time) are both on record as saying it can be done. As a matter of fact, the last Super Bowl in South Florida was played as the Boat Show was already being set up.

Again, the Super Bowl is not a Miami-only event. It is a regional one. I happen to think there is ample hotel space in the Dade/Broward market (I'm not even including PBC) to get it done, even if there may be some logistical issues--as I've said repeatedly.

Maybe it would be too much, I'm open to that, but neither of us is in position to say that with certainty and the Greater Miami Convention and Visitors Bureau is not the sole voice in a position of authority on this. Why should they be viewed as such?

[QuantumX]

Originally Posted by Aceventura

Yabba Dabba Doo!

You nearly killed me with the visual I got of Fred Flintstone driving!

[dave8721]

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/12/1...bowl-boat.html

Pressure on for a Super Bowl Boat Show

Miami-Dade’s mayor signals his support for holding both big events on the same weekend, while the county’s tourism director does not.

BY DOUGLAS HANKS
DHANKS@MIAMIHERALD.COM

Miami-Dade’s tourism bureau faces more pressure to endorse holding the 2016 Super Bowl during the Miami International Boat Show and drop objections that there aren’t enough hotel rooms in the Miami area to handle both events.

On Tuesday the mayor of Miami-Dade County, which helps fund the bureau, all but endorsed holding both events on the same weekend if the National Football League opts to move the championship game to President’s Day Weekend, the Boat Show’s home for decades.

“We can hold two parties at once,’’ Mayor Carlos Gimenez said during a County Commission discussion on pursuing the Super Bowl.

The Miami Dolphins and the team’s backers on the South Florida Super Bowl organizing committee contend downtown Miami is capable of holding Super Bowl during Boat Show, which is primarily based at the Miami Beach Convention Center. On Tuesday, the committee picked a downtown Miami hotel to announce new celebrity spokesmen for the region’s Super Bowl bid: Dolphin greats Bob Griese, Dan Marino and Jason Taylor.

“I think every Super Bowl, personally, should be in South Florida,’’ Marino said from the stage at the Intercontinental Miami hotel on downtown’s waterfront. “I’ve been telling people that for years.”

South Florida is competing against San Francisco for 2016, and the loser will take on Houston for the 2017 Super Bowl. Though South Florida has already hosted a record 10 Super Bowls, the latest campaign for the big game has brought new tensions.

For the first time, Broward and Miami-Dade were required to make separate presentations to the Super Bowl group, which intends to pick one “urban core” to be the hub for pre-game activities. Meanwhile, team executives are still mulling another push for tax dollars to renovate Sun Life Stadium, improvements NFL executives have said would help South Florida’s Super Bowl bid.

Broward’s tourism director, Nicki Grossman, drove from Fort Lauderdale to Miami for the Super Bowl committee’s first public event for the 2016 bid. The presentation included unveiling the group’s new logo featuring palm trees and the Roman numerals of the Super Bowls held in the Dolphins’ home stadium since 1968.

In past years, the Host Committee has held bid events at Sun Life Stadium. Rodney Barreto, a partner in one of Miami-Dade’s top lobby firms and long-time chair of the Super Bowl committee, said picking the Intercontinental for the unveiling wasn’t a sign that Miami leads Fort Lauderdale in the competition. “We have not made a decision,” he said. “We feel this is neutral territory.”

William Talbert, president of the Greater Miami Convention and Visitors Bureau, attended the event but declined to talk to The Miami Herald about the Boat Show issue afterward. But in comments to television reporters Tuesday, he seemed to back off a statement last month that “it’s not physically possible in Miami to host Super Bowl during the President’s Day weekend.” Talbert told WSVN at the Intercontinental: “To the extent that we can secure sufficient hotel rooms, it works.”

With NFL owners pushing the players’ union for an extended season, the league has begun asking cities to prepare for a Super Bowl held later than usual. In 2010 and 2011, the NFL requested that cities bid on three potential weekends for future Super Bowls, including President’s Day. But given the Boat Show conflict, South Florida declined and instead offered Super Bowl proposals for the other two weekends. South Florida lost out both times.

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/12/1...#storylink=cpy

[skyscraperhighrise]

Like I Say it again, we need both events.

[CalleOchoGringo]

...

[theEmbarcadero]

Originally Posted by skyscraperhighrise

Like I Say it again, we need both events.

what he said

[theEmbarcadero]

Originally Posted by dave8721

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/12/1...bowl-boat.html



Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/12/1...#storylink=cpy

Thanks dave for posting this link....

I don't think it is off-topic, or the wrong thread to say what I am about to say next.

I don't see how you can have this debate/quandary over the SB/MBS conflict without mentioning that Genting's project would solve a lot of these issues???

Massive amount of new hotel rooms.....massive convention center floor space....casino for the high rollers and WHAM! Problem solved.

It seems like many naysayers want it both ways....they argue against Genting, saying that there are too many hotel rooms now....but when it comes time for hosting 2 world class events---they argue that Miami doesn't have ENOUGH!!!

Step up to the big leagues Miami.....commit to Genting....commit to 2 world class events happening at the same time...!!!!!!!!!

Who are you, Miami? Enid or MIAMI?????????

[Aceventura]

Also Art Basel is getting big enough to easily use the Miami Beach Convention Center, the original Genting proposed convention center, and maybe even another large venue if one is built at Miami World Center. Plus those extra rooms would be filled by people here for conventions the rest of the year, conventions that are currently in other cities because Miami lacks the facilities. But no hotel rooms, no casino, no privately funded convention market dominating exposition center.

[spellbound]

Yeah, the convention center aspect was always the biggest factor for me--for reasons both financial and because it would be great (and desperately needed) for Miami. As Ace said, we've fallen out of the big leagues in that regard and that just isn't acceptable.

Genting has apparently dropped it from the current plans, though, and without passage of a full gaming license it's hard to imagine them reviving it.

I'd take ANYTHING, though, including a dramatically expanded/modernized Miami Beach facility. We just need it SOMEWHERE!

[desertpunk]

Just 850 developer units remain unsold in downtown Miami: report

[1772]

I'm pro-convention centers and all, but this is a pretty interesting read;

http://www.theatlanticcities.com/pol...-centers/2210/

[CalleOchoGringo]

They make a compelling case. And the argument rings true historically. The cycle goes that there's usually a glut of something built (or made, if a product). And even before it can be absorbed into the market you have a drop in demand which screws everyone (but screws the latest to build it the most).

With the recent bifurcation of society, the marketable-skilled tech-savvy and the rest who wait in long term (un or under)employment purgatory or are paid meagerly. You will see a drop in demand of many things if you haven't already. This will likely continue for years regardless if the economy recovers.

It's very likely that building a convention center right now is a bad long-term deal, due to the recent glut in the past few years. Furthermore if the end-game for building them is "bringing in the people" then it begs the question: is there a more financially efficient and effective way to do that? I would think that making urban-cores of cities more livable and walkable might do far more to bring in those who will fill the stores with customer and lift the economy, not to mention pay property taxes for the long term.

[1772]

Then again, the convention center business isn't going to die; it's just that there will be a few winners and more loosers.
Back in it's heyday, any small town could have a convention center and have it work well, but nowadays, only the strong survive.

And despite all our faults, Miami is one of the countrys hottest destinations, sp a big convention center in downtown would attract the big players.
I mean, who the hell wouldn't want to come here? Especially in these months of the year.
It's just that we have to keep an eye out for the competition.