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Supertalls Discussions of projects under construction between 300-599m/1,000-1,999ft tall.
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Old December 15th, 2017, 11:50 AM   #3741
NYC87
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Originally Posted by Eric Offereins View Post
Ideally you would like to have more windows on both sides, but I assume there are only a few because of structural strength of the tower.
It's c. 60 feet wide and 1428 feet tall. That'll be the world record width-to-height ratio for any skyscraper. Heck, if it was a 500 foot skyscraper it'd be only 22 feet thick. It also probably has to be designed to withstand the worst earthquake physically possible (magnitude 5.something at least) and the worst hurricane possible far into the global warming future (low end Category 4 at least) and maybe even both at the same time. The technology to make make concrete strong enough that it can have this many windows might even be only a few years old (it'll also have a 800-ton tuned mass damper which is needed to prevent seasickness in high wind (and snapping like a twig in a Cat 4?)) I wonder if Hurricane Andrew or Irma would break it (skyscrapers are usually hard to break completely but that's because there's much less for the hurricane or tornado to push against after the glass walls break). I've heard it takes very roughly 200 mph to warp/bend a steel skyscraper frame so if a strong enough hurricane blew against the concrete sides would those tiny windows be enough to save it? And Eighth Avenue is only a bit further away than the height of the tower (probably the least improbable direction for it to fall)
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Old December 15th, 2017, 11:55 AM   #3742
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I think KZ meant the glazing panels (Glass) serves no purpose. KZ, often insulated glazing is used instead of other materials to give a nice appearance. I think the architect did a good job of including *just enough* 'real' window openings through the shear walls (and changing their alignment vertically) to fool us into thinking they're all used as 'windows'. At night a random smattering of light will be cast through these, creating the illusion that there's less concrete. Although now WE know, so WE won't be fooled :P
Are you sure the windows don't have to be that way because the building's asymmetrical? Does anyone know?
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Old December 15th, 2017, 01:34 PM   #3743
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NYC87 View Post
...The technology to make make concrete strong enough that it can have this many windows might even be only a few years old..
Does anyone have stats of the concrete strength/durability used in this project?.. Say in comparison for example to the concrete used in the Hoover Dam in the 30's ? How many times stronger/more durable?.. It would be very interesting to know.
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Old December 15th, 2017, 06:27 PM   #3744
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyMEng View Post
I think KZ meant the glazing panels (Glass) serves no purpose. KZ, often insulated glazing is used instead of other materials to give a nice appearance. I think the architect did a good job of including *just enough* 'real' window openings through the shear walls (and changing their alignment vertically) to fool us into thinking they're all used as 'windows'. At night a random smattering of light will be cast through these, creating the illusion that there's less concrete. Although now WE know, so WE won't be fooled :P
The façade has LED lighting built into it and it will be all lit up from the outside so nobody will notice whether there's any light in the windows or not. They may also put LEDs behind the glass to give the illusion of lit windows, like they've done in some other buildings recently.
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Old December 15th, 2017, 06:38 PM   #3745
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Those windows that everyone is talking about are going to make this building look very stylish and elegant even if nobody can see through them. If they were to only put windows on those dinky holes where windows could actually be seen through by a viewer in the building and then cover that concrete with another material besides glass it would look like the tallest high security prison in the world. They've made the best they could out of a difficult situation in terms of designing this side of the building and I think they've done an incredibly good job of it!
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Old December 16th, 2017, 12:07 AM   #3746
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Originally Posted by uakoops View Post
The façade has LED lighting built into it and it will be all lit up from the outside so nobody will notice whether there's any light in the windows or not. They may also put LEDs behind the glass to give the illusion of lit windows, like they've done in some other buildings recently.
For extra realism they could hire a high schooler for little to nothing to write a program that simulates lights turning on and off at statistically plausible times, copy the holiday light probability of the real windows and make it seem like each fake window's a different apartment in true New York fashion (since keeping track of what each real window is doing in real time and estimating what the fake windows would be showing even with automatic heuristics (based on where the room walls and apartment walls are) would be too nosy (despite being visible to millions with a telescope). Not to mention that the closer it is to the opposite of "1 apt/real window, trying to make it look like 1 apt/any kind of window" the harder it is to make the fake windows look real)
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Old December 16th, 2017, 12:35 AM   #3747
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Those windows that everyone is talking about are going to make this building look very stylish and elegant even if nobody can see through them. If they were to only put windows on those dinky holes where windows could actually be seen through by a viewer in the building and then cover that concrete with another material besides glass it would look like the tallest high security prison in the world. They've made the best they could out of a difficult situation in terms of designing this side of the building and I think they've done an incredibly good job of it!
Some people think 432 Park Avenue looks like a vertical prison or bunker but I think they waited for concrete strength to advance just enough for it to not look like a prison. It's neat how they got as close to "no rooms, just concrete" as they could without obstructing the view too much or too little usable space. The core's 30 feet wide, the outside walls are a few feet and no other internal supports which for a non-mechanical floor is about 4/5ths or 5/6ths living space and 1/5ths or 1/6ths structure and utilities (like stairways). Even the floors are thick concrete and load-bearing which unless I remember wrong is unlike most modern skyscrapers. Has anyone been to Syracuse? There's a brutalist building near I-81 in South Syracuse (the ghetto side) that looks like a vertical concrete bunker (though not a skyscraper, only barely a high rise). I wonder if it's a public housing project.

Last edited by NYC87; December 16th, 2017 at 12:53 AM.
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Old December 16th, 2017, 03:23 AM   #3748
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It's c. 60 feet wide and 1428 feet tall.
80 feet wide by 60 feet deep ...
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Old December 16th, 2017, 03:59 AM   #3749
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80 feet wide by 60 feet deep ...
Height-to-depth ratio doesn't have the same ring to it.
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Old December 16th, 2017, 04:20 AM   #3750
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Originally Posted by NYC87 View Post
Height-to-depth ratio doesn't have the same ring to it.
That's what she said.

(Sorry)
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Old December 16th, 2017, 04:22 AM   #3751
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I do not understand what the fuss is all about. The east and west sides of the building have a curtain wall made of glass, terracotta, and aluminum. The curtain wall is the architectural finish of the building (i.e. it conceals the concrete structure). Where there is an opening in the concrete wall, the occupants can see out the building since glass always coincides with the openings. End of story.
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Old December 16th, 2017, 08:12 AM   #3752
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https://www.instagram.com/p/Bcu5nXPn...y=ryleypoblete
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Old December 16th, 2017, 02:41 PM   #3753
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It's already tall and skinny!
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Old December 16th, 2017, 03:21 PM   #3754
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The next floor (after the current one is done) should be the first setback I believe.
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Old December 16th, 2017, 08:07 PM   #3755
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Originally Posted by streetscapeer View Post
The next floor (after the current one is done) should be the first setback I believe.
According to the diagram, there are 9 floors above the two mechanical floors before the setback occurs at 637.5 feet (at an open windbreak floor). It looks like they are currently working on the 6th floor above the mechanicals, so 3 more to go beyond that before the setback.

The building website for years had a very simplistic diagram (just vertical lines; see bottom pic), that suggests that the setback is at about 600 feet, but I'll believe the more detailed diagram for now.




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Old December 17th, 2017, 02:00 AM   #3756
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Originally Posted by SMCYB View Post
It's already tall and skinny!
Mundane outer borough lowrise in the sky. 142 floors of that.
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Old December 17th, 2017, 05:14 AM   #3757
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SMCYB View Post
That's what she said.

(Sorry)
T ****
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Old December 17th, 2017, 03:38 PM   #3758
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Originally Posted by NYC87 View Post
Mundane outer borough lowrise in the sky. 142 floors of that.
???
This made zero sense, what are you talking about?
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Old December 18th, 2017, 02:29 AM   #3759
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???
This made zero sense, what are you talking about?
It looks like a mundane short outer borough apartment building except they forgot to stop. Since residential rooms without windows are illegal in the city, mundane apartment buildings that are rectangular prisms are usually pretty narrow by 1428' building standards (you can have big ones that are like 300x75ftx6 floors but they have buttloads of courtyards in that rectangle for air and sun). Of course it's only cause we know it'll be 1428 feet that we know it'd be 142 floors if the stories were 10 ft and terrace-less like mundane apartments. They're of course not trying for that look so the only time it'll look like a mundane outer borough lowrise in the sky is during a few months of the construction.

The high ceilings (15.5 feet apart) also make Steinway look even thinner than it really is. If you've walked up and down 10 foot residential floors your whole life (like me) your brain pictures something 1.55 times smaller and that'd only be 1,998 square feet to the outer edge. Which is about the footprint of a typical 3-floor outer borough prewar tenement (or a standard Manhattan lot which was designed for the smaller buildings of 1811. (so long ago Napoleon was winning and the city had a 2-floor height law (3 for avenues)). They probably thought one 2,000 square foot lot would always be enough for most stuff and never envisioned that 200 years later the city would have 250 lot museums with 5 floors and floors that filled multiple long blocks and the streets between to the brim (like the post office). They certainly wouldn't guess that a building of mundane height 2.24 lots wide would be illegally small. So 3 lots is the minimum for a skyscraper (unless the anti-sliver law only covers the longer side which I don't know)).

Last edited by NYC87; December 18th, 2017 at 02:49 AM.
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Old December 18th, 2017, 07:32 PM   #3760
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The speed with which this beautiful building is rising is astounding. In Sydney, buildings a quarter of the height take longer to complete. But New York is after all the hub of high rises and I bow down to your city in awe.
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