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Old January 5th, 2011, 01:59 PM   #1
Kurdish_Medes
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Kurdistan historical real maps 1074 and 1893

I am going to give some informations about Kurds According to Turkish Sources you can look at them


This map was made Mahmud al-Kashgari in 1074
Look at the map you can see middle east ( Erdul Ekrad ) in Arab
ic Country of Kurds

Source http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kâşgarlı_Mahmud








The map of Ottoman Empire was made in 1893 during Abdul Hamid II
There is Kurdistan If you Arabic alphabet There is wide land called Kurdistan It means that Kurdistan was present before Turkey


Source http://tr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osmanlı_İmparatorluğu





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Old January 5th, 2011, 02:40 PM   #2
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I think a political thread under the "baghdad cafe forum" may be more appropriate than the pictures forum since I can expect this thread to attract quite a heated debate!!
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Old January 5th, 2011, 03:26 PM   #3
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this proves those people wrong that rant about and say "Kurdistan never existed and that they came form the space" . well done bro some more truth about of our ancestors land in the region. this has to be shown to countries like US EU and UNs it a good start for the Kurdish cause as a whole.

so is Mahmud al-Kashgari a kurd or an Arab
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:11 PM   #4
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lool the maps still stay welayat al mosul , welayat baghdad and welayat al basrah ...and kurdistan in those 3 welayats ...
+ ive also seen in many maps tht the full gulf cost is Welayat al Basrah ! i thnk its also their in ur map ... but too bad we dnt have tht big basrah anymore !
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:14 PM   #5
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not to mention the difference between 'geographical entity" above like "syria" which actually covers multiple wilayets including haleb, sham, quds... which are today split into several countries (sham and haleb - syria), with quds split between israel and jordan.

But of course using the logic above all should belong to "Syria" since the levant area was called that
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:17 PM   #6
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nd btw , Erbil , Sulaimaniya and Duhok are all in welayat al Mosul lol
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:25 PM   #7
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and Amidiya is part of wilayet van? we should give it back to turkey?

i also noticed that Gaza was not part of quds. so it really belongs to Egypt. wow. i never knew that.

wilayet beirut is interesting. so lathiqiya in syria belongs to it?
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:27 PM   #8
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Thats Iraq ... the difference now is that they took Areas from us in the gulf like Kuwait and the Coast .. and gave us parts from the Arabian desert which r saudi lands -.- seriously screw UK for tht -_-
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Old January 5th, 2011, 04:30 PM   #9
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btw can u DELETE the HUGEEEEEEE pic pls ! u already put there in a small size !
nd its also there in my reply !
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Old January 5th, 2011, 05:14 PM   #10
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This thread can be continued on the specific "Kurdistan Politics" over on the Baghdad cafe sub-forum.

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1292751
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Old January 5th, 2011, 05:58 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alankurdi View Post
this proves those people wrong that rant about and say "Kurdistan never existed and that they came form the space" . well done bro some more truth about of our ancestors land in the region. this has to be shown to countries like US EU and UNs it a good start for the Kurdish cause as a whole.

so is Mahmud al-Kashgari a kurd or an Arab
He was an Uighur Turk

Anyway, the region known as Kurdistan is a geographical not political entity, just like Turkestan (which is a generic term used to name a specific geographic region, not a previously existing state).

PS: BTW, I thought everyone already knew that the region was historically called Kurdistan
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Old January 5th, 2011, 06:04 PM   #12
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yeah i wasn't referring to any member on here , i have seen people say that in other websites like militaryphoto and political forum. not here tho i should have emphasized on that. my bad

also it was a region yes not a state i agree also but there has been recent Kurdish states few times not under "kurdistan" though but those people say "even kurdistan region" doesnt exist and that kurds came from Russia and Turks call kurds in turkey mountain turks even though they were there before turks.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 06:22 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alankurdi View Post
yeah i wasn't referring to any member on here , i have seen people say that in other websites like militaryphoto and political forum. not here tho i should have emphasized on that. my bad

also it was a region yes not a state i agree also but there has been recent Kurdish states few times not under "kurdistan" though but those people say "even kurdistan region" doesnt exist and that kurds came from Russia and Turks call kurds in turkey mountain turks even though they were there before turks.
There were Kurdish-Turkish ruled emirates, but they were Muslim emirates usually Kurdish-Turkish alliance border states at the periphary of the Byzantine Empire (Ghazza states used to wage Jihad on the Christians) as well as Turkish-Kurdish-Armenian, as well as Kurdish-Armenian alliance states. Before that the region was ruled by various nations extending from the Persians, to Byzantines to the Arab Dynasties, etc. Also I think there was a brief Kurdish state in N.Iraq formed by Barzani's father, but I'm not sure.

The mountain Turk thing existed for only a brief period, and then it was dropped because even those who coined the term knew that it was unrealistic.

PS: This is the first time I heard that there are people claiming that Kurds came from Russia, interesting

PPS: The Ottomans recognised the Kurds (Ekrad) as a distinct people native to the region. Also the first Kurdish uprisings in Turkey were to reinstate the Ottoman Caliphate, not to form an independent country (that's why they were known as the Sharia army, not Kurdish army).
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Last edited by Turknology; January 5th, 2011 at 06:30 PM.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 06:32 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alankurdi View Post
yeah i wasn't referring to any member on here , i have seen people say that in other websites like militaryphoto and political forum. not here tho i should have emphasized on that. my bad

also it was a region yes not a state i agree also but there has been recent Kurdish states few times not under "kurdistan" though but those people say "even kurdistan region" doesnt exist and that kurds came from Russia and Turks call kurds in turkey mountain turks even though they were there before turks.
We owe this 80's junta.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 06:38 PM   #15
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We owe this 80's junta.
yes, and the majority of Turks as a people in general have never had problems with Kurds, that is why intermarriage is very high. my Aunt on my dad's side for example is married to a Kurd who is from a very powerful Kurdish family in Diyarbakir (not Turkified Kurds, but the real deal). And my uncle on my mom's side is married to an Alevi Kurd from Kars, despite my family being sunni Turks on both sides.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 07:24 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Turknology View Post
There were Kurdish-Turkish ruled emirates, but they were Muslim emirates usually Kurdish-Turkish alliance border states at the periphary of the Byzantine Empire (Ghazza states used to wage Jihad on the Christians) as well as Turkish-Kurdish-Armenian, as well as Kurdish-Armenian alliance states. Before that the region was ruled by various nations extending from the Persians, to Byzantines to the Arab Dynasties, etc. Also I think there was a brief Kurdish state in N.Iraq formed by Barzani's father, but I'm not sure.

The mountain Turk thing existed for only a brief period, and then it was dropped because even those who coined the term knew that it was unrealistic.

PS: This is the first time I heard that there are people claiming that Kurds came from Russia, interesting

PPS: The Ottomans recognised the Kurds (Ekrad) as a distinct people native to the region. Also the first Kurdish uprisings in Turkey were to reinstate the Ottoman Caliphate, not to form an independent country (that's why they were known as the Sharia army, not Kurdish army).
Yeah the kurdish 'leaders' sheiks after WW1 were a bunch or restarted twats! we have only them to blame for not having a country today, but I don't look at the past too much, the future is what counts.

Off course not all religious leaders are stupid, for example saladin did very well for himself, however kurdish leaders after WW1 were retarded, and there is no hiding it.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 07:41 PM   #17
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Yeah the kurdish 'leaders' sheiks after WW1 were a bunch or restarted twats! we have only them to blame for not having a country today, but I don't look at the past too much, the future is what counts.

Off course not all religious leaders are stupid, for example saladin did very well for himself, however kurdish leaders after WW1 were retarded, and there is no hiding it.
not quite as retarded as the shia sheikhs and ayatollahs of southern Iraq, who spent 80 years in servitude to a small minority
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Old January 5th, 2011, 08:10 PM   #18
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not quite as retarded as the shia sheikhs and ayatollahs of southern Iraq, who spent 80 years in servitude to a small minority
Although with kurdistan where kurds form a majority, I suppose it would have posed a threat to the west, becuase:-

-It would have had big gas/oil reserves
-It would have had a lot of water (see Turkey)
-Quite a decent population today, without all the genocide/killing that kurds have gone through.
-Decent sized country.

The above it not very much liked by the west, and so a combination of the above and stupid leaders is what made us end up where we are today.
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Old January 5th, 2011, 08:45 PM   #19
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Yeah the kurdish 'leaders' sheiks after WW1 were a bunch or restarted twats! we have only them to blame for not having a country today, but I don't look at the past too much, the future is what counts.

Off course not all religious leaders are stupid, for example saladin did very well for himself, however kurdish leaders after WW1 were retarded, and there is no hiding it.
Saladin was a military general, not a sheik
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Old January 5th, 2011, 08:48 PM   #20
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Saladin was a military general, not a sheik
I said, religious leaders as in someone highly influenced by Islam, though most of his generals etc were kurds too.
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