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Old June 29th, 2015, 06:03 PM   #41
FloridaFuture
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So basically when they say "6 stories of residential" in that description I think what they're saying is floors 1-5 plus floor 9.
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Old June 29th, 2015, 07:50 PM   #42
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Confusing. Is it concrete/steel construction, frame, or a combination of both? I emailed them about that.
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Old June 29th, 2015, 08:16 PM   #43
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I'd still prefer if those houses and big oak trees were somehow saved.
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Old June 29th, 2015, 09:49 PM   #44
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Would've been nice to have one 2600 sq. foot retail space (that could be subdivided) instead of two 1300 sq. ft. retail spaces but I guess it was necessary in order preserve that Hollywood Drive thing that is still part of the project.

If it had been one larger space it could have accommodated a restaurant or something more substantial. 1300 square feet more or less restricts what can go in those spots to corner stores, dry cleaners, small clothing boutique stores, maybe an ice cream place and stuff like that. By comparison, Chipotle's average 2580 square feet, while Cold Stone Creamery averages right around 1300 square feet.
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Old June 29th, 2015, 11:47 PM   #45
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Quote:
Originally Posted by FloridaFuture View Post
Would've been nice to have one 2600 sq. foot retail space (that could be subdivided) instead of two 1300 sq. ft. retail spaces but I guess it was necessary in order preserve that Hollywood Drive thing that is still part of the project.

If it had been one larger space it could have accommodated a restaurant or something more substantial. 1300 square feet more or less restricts what can go in those spots to corner stores, dry cleaners, small clothing boutique stores, maybe an ice cream place and stuff like that. By comparison, Chipotle's average 2580 square feet, while Cold Stone Creamery averages right around 1300 square feet.
Maybe outside seating can help alleviate that a bit. Would look nice on Grand Central there especially by the church building.

Hopefully they can save the houses. So many places could use beautiful old homes like that including the Heights or Ybor.

Why the change do you all think? Was there pressure applied by the city?
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Old June 30th, 2015, 12:50 AM   #46
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BTW, looking at the elevation drawing it looks like the name of this project is "Altis", not Atlis.
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Old June 30th, 2015, 01:14 AM   #47
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^yep you're right
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Old June 30th, 2015, 02:52 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by For_F-L-O-R-I-D-A. View Post
Maybe outside seating can help alleviate that a bit. Would look nice on Grand Central there especially by the church building.

Hopefully they can save the houses. So many places could use beautiful old homes like that including the Heights or Ybor.

Why the change do you all think? Was there pressure applied by the city?
As far as outside seating goes, the developer as opted for the minimum 6 foot sidewalks which doesn't leave much space for outdoor seating (originally they were shooting for 5 foot sidewalks but the city pointed out they had to have 6).

I think there were two changes that were totally independent of each other, but the developer said they were dependent on each other so they could avoid saying "our original design sucked": the retail and the whole rooftop amenity/sun deck/pool deck/3 unit addition.

The retail might of been complaints from neighbors, and the city may of mentioned it in passing, but I doubt it was a situation where the city was like "retail or no approval." However it also just makes too much sense for the developer. They lose out on a whole two residential units (it seems like they literally turned two residential units into retail without touching anything else) which won't even hit their total profits from residential unless the building becomes literally 100% occupied. They can charge the retail units more especially with OE and UT guaranteeing some degree of foot traffic, and in the long run it'll lead to a stronger neighborhood which will allow them to justify higher rents. Plus the project still needs a variance for the trees and has to deal with historic preservation so it could be a case in which they added retail to get the city off their back on other issues.

The whole rooftop addition was definitely to make the project more appealing to prospective renters/to justify higher rents and I have to wonder how much of it has to do with Related putting up a waterfront project a few blocks away that won't skimp on amenities as possible competition. There are site plans of the Related project with the city according to the portal, though the site plans themselves are not on the portal. I have to wonder if the developer of this project caught wind of what was on them. Anyway those three units on the 9th floor that lead out to the sun deck are going to be amazing. This project is barely shorter then the Minarets and Urso Hall at this point so the views will be top notch and not even Related's project will block their DT view. Leading out to a big sun deck is just icing on the cake. I expect those three units to command top dollar per square foot and go in a blink of an eye. The pool deck at the 8th story is also a huge selling point as that will also have great views. The building will also just look a lot better from above. Only about half of the garage building in the center will be parking on the 8th floor, a quarter will be 8th floor pool deck and a quarter will be 9th floor units and sun deck. The fact that this thing is twice as tall in the center as it is along Grand Central/Cleveland will make it aesthetically different especially with living spaces up there in the center above the rest of the project. It's almost like an amenity tower in the middle of the project.

Anyway I'm glad all of this happened for sure. There are still some question marks in regards to the trees and historic preservation but it's difficult to straight up bash the project.

BTW I sent in a tip regarding this news to the TBBJ. Maybe we'll see an article about it tomorrow. They reported on the project when it was first unveiled.

Wow this post was a lot more ranty then I intended. Oh well.

Lastly, for those of you that don't bother with the portal, here's the 8th/9th floor site plans. Definitely different from what we're used to:



And here's the elevation I posted earlier showing how this makes an amenity tower so to speak in the middle of the project:

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Old June 30th, 2015, 03:44 AM   #49
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^You should totally crosspost much of that as a comment under the Altis post on the URBN page.

If I had to guess, I would say the Caspers had something to do with bettering this.
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Old June 30th, 2015, 09:22 AM   #50
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Maybe they can expand the space still for the retail? Is the leasing office bordering the retail there?
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Old June 30th, 2015, 01:16 PM   #51
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Quote:
Building gets taller, retail added as developer revamps multifamily proposed near Oxford Exchange
Ashley Gurbal Kritzer
Tampa Bay Business Journal
Tuesday, June 30, 2015, 6:45am EDT

A South Florida developer who wants to build near Oxford Exchange has proposed a taller, mixed-use building for the site in response to requests from the surrounding neighborhood and city planners.

Altman Development Corp., based in Boca Raton, submitted a new site plan and updated documents to the city last week that now show Altis Grand Central as a nine-story building with 274 residential units and 2,614 square feet of specialty retail — two 1,300-square-foot spaces that front Grand Central Avenue.
More here

http://m.bizjournals.com/tampabay/bl...developer.html
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Old June 30th, 2015, 07:58 PM   #52
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Quote:
A South Florida developer who wants to build near Oxford Exchange has proposed a taller, mixed-use building for the site in response to requests from the surrounding neighborhood and city planners.
How about we stop requesting and start requiring?
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Old June 30th, 2015, 08:06 PM   #53
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Quote:
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How about we stop requesting and start requiring?
To be honest, I think they should use more incentives. Just having requirements is going to limit developments and it is not really fair to the owners of the property.

Incentives leave the door wide open for development IMO.
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Old June 30th, 2015, 08:43 PM   #54
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^ You can have incentives as well, but there are plenty of things that are not cost prohibitive and are essential to creating a better environment.

If a developer or property owner cannot afford to provide the things that are necessary to improving the community, then the community cannot afford to have them developing that property.
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Old June 30th, 2015, 09:46 PM   #55
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Isn't that what good zoning and codes do?
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Old June 30th, 2015, 10:22 PM   #56
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^Right. We don't have those. Not for walkable urbanism to flourish anyways.

Incentives would certainly be helpful with some things. But codifying things helps too. Banks love to give the developer crap when financing, about every little thing. If something a little different is the law though, and isn't some special waiver the city gave a developer, banks really can't start their crap with the developer.



I still want that porte cochere off of Grand Central. Put it on the side, and replace its frontage on Grand Central with a wee bit more commercial space. Or a little courtyard type space with a fountain or something... No curb cuts on Grand Central.

And where are the cycling amenities? Are there any that we know of yet?

They're already giving Cleveland St the cold shoulder. The sides look like crap because they're not covering the garage well. At least get Grand Central's frontage done right.
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Old July 1st, 2015, 12:07 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jasonhouse View Post
^Right. We don't have those. Not for walkable urbanism to flourish anyways.

Incentives would certainly be helpful with some things. But codifying things helps too. Banks love to give the developer crap when financing, about every little thing. If something a little different is the law though, and isn't some special waiver the city gave a developer, banks really can't start their crap with the developer.



I still want that porte cochere off of Grand Central. Put it on the side, and replace its frontage on Grand Central with a wee bit more commercial space. Or a little courtyard type space with a fountain or something... No curb cuts on Grand Central.

And where are the cycling amenities? Are there any that we know of yet?

They're already giving Cleveland St the cold shoulder. The sides look like crap because they're not covering the garage well. At least get Grand Central's frontage done right.
It would be nice if they moved their leasing office to a different side of the building and made room for more retail. As for Cleveland, I think people have a hard time thinking about it being anything but a frontage road to the Selmon at this point.
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Old July 1st, 2015, 01:19 AM   #58
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I don't disagree, I'm just saying, the developer only has one short side to worry about. In other cities, NIMBYs would be all over these guys. We all get what that does to costs, we all know even messing around changing the design costs some money. Hence why sometimes just getting certain things you want in certain places put in the zoning saves everyone time and aggravation. The good news is, these guys are going to make plenty of money in this location. Plenty. Some of the classiest joints in town are across the street. They need to add to that. Looking like a Hampton Inn out front with the drive-thru ain't gonna quite cut it.
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Old July 1st, 2015, 03:41 AM   #59
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Why couldnt they just do this from the beginning
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Old July 7th, 2015, 07:08 PM   #60
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Quote:
Oxford Exchange owner says proposed apartments could quash Grand Central's potential
Jul 7, 2015, 12:50pm EDT
Ashley Gurbal Kritzer

A proposed apartment project on Grand Central Avenue could hinder the neighborhood from reaching what the owner of Oxford Exchange says is its true potential: becoming a walkable shopping district.

Altman Development Corp., based in Boca Raton, has asked the city to rezone 2.51 acres at 504 Central Ave. to make way for a 274-unit apartment building. In late June, Altman updated its proposal to include two 1,300-square-foot retail spaces.

The first public hearing on the development is scheduled for Aug. 20.
more here

http://www.bizjournals.com/tampabay/...partments.html
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