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#1 ·


Victory over battle to buy derelict hotel Jul 29 2005
By Catherine Jones, Liverpool Echo

A DERELICT Liverpool hotel with a compulsory purchase order on it is to be bought by the council.

A planning inspector today ruled in favour of the council against Shook Kwan "Jimmy" Wong, the owner of the Scandinavia hotel at the corner of Nelson Street and Duke Street.

The news comes seven weeks aftera public inquiry in Liverpool, and after the Bishop of Liverpool wrote to deputy prime minister John Prescott urging a speedy decision.

It could mean the city could be in possession of the building by October.

Mr Wong appealed aftera compulsory purchase order (CPO) was served on him last year by the council, which claimed regeneration of Ropewalks was hampered by his inability to repair the building, which is on the ECHO's Stop the Rot hit list.

This is the first completely successful CPO through the ECHO's Stop the Rot campaign.

The council has signed an agreement with developers Downing for a £14m hotel, offices and residential scheme on the site at the corner of Nelson Street and Duke Street.

Council leader Mike Storey said today: "This is a powerful message to those people who let our architectural heritage go to rack and ruin.

"We as a city will take relentless action. This shows we mean business. I hope the redevelopment would be completed for 2008."

Mr Wong said today he had not been officially informed about the decision.

At the inquiry he claimed European funding "half-promised" in the mid-1990s had been diverted to other schemes, including the Tea Factory in nearby Wood Street.

He has planning permission-for a restaurant, witha snooker hall, oriental museum and a roof garden.

Plans would 'enhance character' of the area

INSPECTOR Laura Graham listened to three days of evidence at the public inquiry last month and visited the Scandinavia hotel site. She ruled in the council's favour, saying its proposals would:

. Enhance the character and appearance of the conservation area.

. Provide improvements to the public realm through the provision of a new pedestrian route along the original route of Cummings Street.

. Offer a vibrant mix of uses, including a building for use by the local community.

. Accord with the provisions of the development plan.

The inspector said while Mr Wong's plans would bring existing buildings back into use and strengthen the Chinese identity of the area, there were "considerable doubts" over whether he had the necessary funding or could deliver his plans.

The recommendations conclude: "I am satisfied there is a compelling case in the public interest for the compulsory acquisition of all interests in the order land."

Sailors' home

THE Scandinavia hotel was built in the mid-19th century on the corner of Nelson Street and Duke Street. It was a home for sailors from Scandinavia, later became a furniture factory and snooker hall, but has been empty for 25 years.

In 2001, Downing submitted plans to demolish the building and an adjacent factory and replace it with a six-floor hotel, restaurants, bars, offices, apartments and basement car park.

The subsequent revised plans include maintaining the original facade on Nelson Street.
 
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#227 ·
romablue said:
Bad Community by poor design...

Tony, I feel that one of the reasons why these sorts of estates fail is the fact that they lack all the facilities to generate a community spirit. The same could also be said for many modern apartment developments, since they often screened off from the street level. Here in Italy and other countries where apartment living is the norm, the aim is always to have active street levels with shops and bars, which remain open until at least 8pm on all developments.
Maybe Liverpool needs to think more on some of its new developments because I tend to believe that much of downtown Liverpool has little active frontage and subsequently places like Ropewalks are not frequented by many people, leaving the small minority of morons rule small areas (as per previous post). Modern developments whether they be security screened apartments or small cul-de-sac developments of semis don't resolve these problems.
Theres definatly something in that. there's very little community minded spirit in our little, newly gated community (it alway had gates - it just didn't always have locks) . I would truely welcome / have a hand in some kind of community initiative - I'm just at a loss as to how to go about it.

A lot of it has to time scale I suppose. We love our flat but we're aware we couldn't really afford to buy it. Further more it's not sutitble for bringing up kid s in, nor is the surroudning area. thats where those little houses come into their own, you could bring up kinds and still enjoy city life - mind you looking at the frankly scary inhabitents of westmoreland drive something tells me they arn't big on the down town liverpool city life.

So if there was a big community initiative, how long would anyone be a part of it?
 
#228 ·
All of the points below are good ones, though Roman Blue hits the nail.

Low density is not doing anything beneficial for those who currently live in them, so upping the scale will only help people to get out of the coinditions they now suffer. Even if downtown booms the peole on this estate would still have to commute!

The problem that RB identifies is the nub of the problem... they are not provided with amenities, but even if LCC and LCVS etc where to try they couldn't be maintained as there are too few people.... low density means this cannot be resolved.

Tenements are the perfect solution for inner city families, it is how they do it is NYC, Paris, Barca etc... we are not genetically progrmmed to need a garden... none residential on ground floors (enables doctors and social provision as well as commerce) good open space, ownership etc are the perenial issues under debate, but that does not mean we should give up and maintain those horrible estates!
 
#229 ·
Wormella said:
Theres definatly something in that. there's very little community minded spirit in our little, newly gated community (it alway had gates - it just didn't always have locks) . I would truely welcome / have a hand in some kind of community initiative - I'm just at a loss as to how to go about it.

A lot of it has to time scale I suppose. We love our flat but we're aware we couldn't really afford to buy it. Further more it's not sutitble for bringing up kid s in, nor is the surroudning area. thats where those little houses come into their own, you could bring up kinds and still enjoy city life - mind you looking at the frankly scary inhabitents of westmoreland drive something tells me they arn't big on the down town liverpool city life.

So if there was a big community initiative, how long would anyone be a part of it?
Wormella, its interesting that you feel that a flat is not suitable for bringing up kids. My parents take the same angle when they come and look at our small apartment in Rome. The fact that our block is full of families, young couples, singles and old people adds to the community spirit (even though we all argue at condomnium meetings.. great fun :) ), it is also true that not having gardens forces people out into the street and especially parks in the afternoon. What in italy is called the 'passagiata' (stroll), you go out to see and be seen by others. OK the climate is different in Liverpool and this has an aspect but when I was a kid growing up in my parents semi, we rarely played in the garden (partly because my dad didn't want his mini chelsea show garden wrecked) so I normally kicked a football in the street.
 
#230 ·
The notion that we have all been smothered with that suburban, semi detached housing is 'preferential', indeed, superior, to the mess of urban living, is tied to all sorts of unhealthy middle class notions of community.


Stay in the house, watch the telly, tend the garden, you can visit your folks ten miles away... we have the technology to live a 'virtual community/neighbourhood'... but the consequence is all sorts of decline in civic society and helps breed anti social notions and behavious.... if your neighbours are not worth talking to and sharing a little life with then there is nothing wrong with burglarising the fuckers... if you get my drift!
 
#231 ·
romablue said:
Wormella, its interesting that you feel that a flat is not suitable for bringing up kids. My parents take the same angle when they come and look at our small apartment in Rome. The fact that our block is full of families, young couples, singles and old people adds to the community spirit (even though we all argue at condomnium meetings.. great fun :) ), it is also true that not having gardens forces people out into the street and especially parks in the afternoon. What in italy is called the 'passagiata' (stroll), you go out to see and be seen by others. OK the climate is different in Liverpool and this has an aspect but when I was a kid growing up in my parents semi, we rarely played in the garden (partly because my dad didn't want his mini chelsea show garden wrecked) so I normally kicked a football in the street.
it has less to do with the actual flat - it's not really big enough for us two let alone a 3rd person however small, but the community surrounding it.

My parents live in Barcelona and have a similar set up to your in Rome by the sounds of it and no one there hesitates to bring up kids in thier flats. but they are surrounded by play grounds and little parks - there is none of that provision. if we had anywhere we could go for a stroll and feel happy letting the kids play in it wouldn't be an issue, but the climate in our little 'community' is that they wouldn't be welcome even as residents.

There are other reasons we couldn't live in the flat indefinatly - we do want a garden, we're keen to grow more than just windowsill chilli plants
 
#232 ·
So what cues should Liverpool take from that? To start looking at the Rome/Barca way or carry on with the absurdly disabling 'Levittown' way that we do now... One provides the basis for good community and urban living, the other calls for chronic isolation, unless you have a £40k salary to mitigate the dysfuntionalism... causing immense ecologiocal as well as societal damage in the process!
 
#238 ·
crane is up on the scheme down at the bottom of duke street

2 x tower cranes now in ropewalks

also noticed a nice little sign has gone up to mark the entrance to East Village and that the vacant commercial space next door to sapporo is being done up. Not sure who has let it, but i'll let you know as soon as a sign goes up.
 
#239 ·
buggedboy said:
crane is up on the scheme down at the bottom of duke street

2 x tower cranes now in ropewalks

also noticed a nice little sign has gone up to mark the entrance to East Village and that the vacant commercial space next door to sapporo is being done up. Not sure who has let it, but i'll let you know as soon as a sign goes up.

Got a shot of that one from the MSCP in Hanover St.


An old end terrace has been done up opposite this on Duke St, Elysian fields up the road has a core growing, a large new build is mostly built near FACT, and the old Terrace on Seel St is seeing substantial shoreing up activity, along with numerous other projects. So the whole area is really buzzin with activity.
 
#242 · (Edited)
I know some scaffolding is up on Wolstenhome sq, but don't know what is going on there, or by who, but at least it's another bit of the jigsaw being placed. The Scandinavian Hotel is a big project that needs to see some action before the masses descend during 2007/8.

Wolstenhome Sq May 2006.
 
#243 ·
buggedboy said:
crane is up on the scheme down at the bottom of duke street

2 x tower cranes now in ropewalks

also noticed a nice little sign has gone up to mark the entrance to East Village and that the vacant commercial space next door to sapporo is being done up. Not sure who has let it, but i'll let you know as soon as a sign goes up.
What's actually going on this site with the new crane(s)? I need to know so I can update the crane count. :)
 
#244 ·
Doug Roberts said:
Called in here for a couple, thick walls of the old bridewell makes this place cool inside, well worth a visit.














Great Doug,

I had a few drinks and an excellent meal in their last year - definately worth a visit.

`Ropewalks` is a sleeping giant.....of a district.

Disney used the `Ropewalks` area some years ago to film a historically set maritime film - unfortunately I don`t know the name?
 
#245 ·
Paul D said:
What's actually going on this site with the new crane(s)? I need to know so I can update the crane count. :)

I think its the pierse homes project, backing onto Gradwell Street.

by the by, the next door site, where the old kitchen supply stockings used to be has started being fenced off in advance of demolition.

i think its for this other project

http://councillors.liverpool.gov.uk/Published/C00000307/M00004727/AI00024873/$Item43741DukeStreet.docA.ps.pdf
 
#246 · (Edited)
buggedboy said:
I think its the pierse homes project, backing onto Gradwell Street.

by the by, the next door site, where the old kitchen supply stockings used to be has started being fenced off in advance of demolition.

i think its for this other project

http://councillors.liverpool.gov.uk/Published/C00000307/M00004727/AI00024873/$Item43741DukeStreet.docA.ps.pdf
Thanks I've got something already for Pierce Homes but it's clearly somewhere else.Is the other crane you mentioned in the Ropewalks a new addition or is it for Elysian Fields?
 
#248 ·
buggedboy said:
its elysian fields. two in total so far, but will hopefully be four/five within six months when the following also go on site:

Duke St/Slater St junction (LV say its imminent)
86-90 Duke St (on opposite corner) - due on site in september
Duke St (Iliad)
Excellent thanks for clearing that up,Duke Street is a gem and I can't wait until it's finished.Is the terrace that's been refurbished on Duke Street one of those big Georgian terraces where the big issue are or the one facing or are we still waiting for them to be done up?
 
#249 ·
frenson just had an applicstion approved for the row opposite the big issue.

i think the project is also going to rebuild a new frontage on the other side (Parr st). Not sure when its going on site though.

there are a few noticable gaps in development though, so best get crackin. it could great street if they get it right.

However, its going to be more piecemeal than say, York st (the next one over), where Maritime housing are effectively rebuilding the whole street apart from the bottom (Arts Village). There is some really tidy refurbishment going on and i can see a nice little street developing there.
 
#251 ·
Paul D said:
Frenson don't exactly fill me with confidence because they have a habit of leaving things derelict for ages so I hope some pressure is applied to them to get a move on,the Ropewalks is one of my favourite downtown areas.
Frenson have had 2 applications to demolish 118-126 Duke st(where the big issue is) turned down. They have now got an application to renovate them but don't expect anything soon.
 
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