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Old August 25th, 2012, 12:55 PM   #61
Puritan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Göttkendorf, after 1946 Gutkowo
(...)
Near church from all old crosses removed german notes, left only one where is written in polish. I can't imagine why?
It's probably People's Republic of Poland "achievement" ...

and now Republic of Poland some true achievement's

Zweisprachige Ortsnamen in Polen

8 III 2012 - 798 cities/villages

http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?...20120510085449

The German language is used in certain areas in Opole Voivodeship (German: Woiwodschaft Oppeln), where most of the minority resides and Silesian Voivodeship (German: Woiwodschaft Schlesien). The German Minority electoral list currently has one seat in the Sejm of the Republic of Poland (there were four from 1993 to 1997), benefiting from the current provision in Polish election law which exempts national minorities from the 5% national threshold.

There are 325 Polish schools that use the German language as the first language of instruction, with over 37,000 students.

Bilingual communes in Poland

The bilingual status of gminas (communes) in Poland is regulated by the Act of 6 January 2005 on National and Ethnic Minorities and on the Regional Languages, which permits certain gminas with significant linguistic minorities to introduce a second, auxiliary language to be used in official contexts alongside Polish.

German newspapers:

"Masurische Storchenpost"
"Schlesien heute"
"Wochenblatt.pl"
"Oberschlesien"
"Oberschlesische Stimme"
"Mitteilungsblatt"
...

etc. etc. etc.



Have you any examples from Lithuania? European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages? Bilingual communes? Bilingual signs?

Have you seen renovated Wrocław railway station with restored old german signposts like
"DURCHGANG ZUR FLURSTRAßE“ ?

It's only small example of German heritage revival in Poland.


It's unimaginable right now in Wilno/Vilnius/Вільня.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:00 PM   #62
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Originally Posted by RS_UK-PL View Post


OT: Pre-war Danzig/Gdansk was completely destroyed during WW2 and today's Gdansk is a really crappy copy of what was there before It was a such a beautiful city...

Link: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1486666
Your sarcasm is showing

Anybody with even half a brain is fully aware of what splendid job your countrymen did rebuilding that city.

Aside from maybe Warsaw, no rebuilding effort anywhere on the planet can compare with that kind of success.

My only criticism, and it's a relatively mild one given the then recently preceding history, is that it was a tad dishonest to deliberately obliterate any and all evidence of it's post 1793 history.


.

Last edited by Judge Roy Beam; August 25th, 2012 at 01:14 PM.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:21 PM   #63
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Puritan View Post
It's probably People's Republic of Poland "achievement" ...

and now Republic of Poland some true achievement's

Zweisprachige Ortsnamen in Polen

8 III 2012 - 798 cities/villages

http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?...20120510085449

The German language is used in certain areas in Opole Voivodeship (German: Woiwodschaft Oppeln), where most of the minority resides and Silesian Voivodeship (German: Woiwodschaft Schlesien). The German Minority electoral list currently has one seat in the Sejm of the Republic of Poland (there were four from 1993 to 1997), benefiting from the current provision in Polish election law which exempts national minorities from the 5% national threshold.

There are 325 Polish schools that use the German language as the first language of instruction, with over 37,000 students.

Bilingual communes in Poland

The bilingual status of gminas (communes) in Poland is regulated by the Act of 6 January 2005 on National and Ethnic Minorities and on the Regional Languages, which permits certain gminas with significant linguistic minorities to introduce a second, auxiliary language to be used in official contexts alongside Polish.

German newspapers:

"Masurische Storchenpost"
"Schlesien heute"
"Wochenblatt.pl"
"Oberschlesien"
"Oberschlesische Stimme"
"Mitteilungsblatt"
...

etc. etc. etc.



Have you any examples from Lithuania? European Charter for Regional or Minority Languages? Bilingual communes? Bilingual signs?

Have you seen renovated Wrocław railway station with restored old german signposts like
"DURCHGANG ZUR FLURSTRAßE“ ?

It's only small example of German heritage revival in Poland.


It's unimaginable right now in Wilno/Vilnius/Вільня.
Sorry, what is unimaginable in Vilnius? I don't underrstand what you talking about? If question is about polish minority in Lithuania. "Umaginable" thing is not true. More, now it is everything imaginable.

Poles, russians has own radio station's, info portals, newspepers, renovated schools. You are talking nonsenses. Come to Lithuania and you will see.

Lithuanian minority has much more problems with education, cultural things in your glory Poland.

Let's see to polish tolerance to minorities.

Bubeliai, Poland. Monument for lithuanian poet Albinas Žukauskas
Monument like this is not one.


http://g1.delfi.lt/images/pix/file48856470_126d2ea7.jpg

From now I will not talk about polish nationalism ideas and other things like this.
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>> MY PHOTO THREAD ABOUT LITHUANIA
>>MY PHOTOS FROM KLAIPĖDA (MEMEL)
>>> OLD LITHUANIA




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Last edited by Depeched; August 25th, 2012 at 01:34 PM.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:25 PM   #64
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The fact is that today's Poland does not have major problems with minorities, there is no problem with showing the past, areas that were under the rule of German, Czech, etc.. as seen in the example of Gdansk, Wroclaw and many other cities. Our attitude to Russia only requires first wound healing (maybe sometimes...).

Today's Lithuania has a lot of problems with finding their own identity. Probably due to the fear of the annihilation of the nation - it's a tiny country somewhere at the end of the European Union, independly existing for several years and threatened Polish and Russian influences, with large minorities of both countries.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:41 PM   #65
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barto_S View Post
large minorities of both countries.
Lithuania:

83%Lithuanians
7% poles
6% russians
4% others

Poland after war don't have any minority problems (sorry man), because all nations from there were just cleaned.

Ok, Talk what just you want. But if you want to try talk about Lithuania, look in facts, but not in level "something said that".
I could say absolutely the same for Poland and so what? It is emotions but not decisions.
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>>MY PHOTOS FROM KLAIPĖDA (MEMEL)
>>> OLD LITHUANIA



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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:44 PM   #66
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From now I will not talk about polish nationalism ideas and other things like this.
You're abolutely right!
Please continue with posting images of once East-Prussian places!
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:52 PM   #67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Sorry, what is unimaginable in Vilnius?

- bilingual street/city signs

- bilingual signs in public/private transport

- the bilingual status of communes, which permits certain gminas with significant linguistic minorities to introduce a second, auxiliary language to be used in official contexts.

+ nonsense law

"Vilnius District authorities disallowed to name street after Polish author Julian Tuwim"

http://www.15min.lt/en/article/cultu...#ixzz24YdAdG9q


etc.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 01:56 PM   #68
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Thanks for Poland that this city was not just demolished.
Elbing/ now Elbląg.



























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>>MY PHOTOS FROM KLAIPĖDA (MEMEL)
>>> OLD LITHUANIA




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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:06 PM   #69
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Wischwill/Viešvilė. Lithuania

Article about small former Easter Prussia town Viešvilė. What is going there now?
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>>> OLD LITHUANIA



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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:06 PM   #70
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Beautiful shots

Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Thanks for Poland that this city was not just demolished.
Elbing/ now Elbląg.
Elbing/Elblag 1945




More: http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=1515133
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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #71
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Lithuania:

83%Lithuanians
7% poles
6% russians
4% others

Poland after war don't have any minority problems (sorry man), because all nations from there were just cleaned.

Ok, Talk what just you want. But if you want to try talk about Lithuania, look in facts, but not in level "something said that".
I could say absolutely the same for Poland and so what? It is emotions but not decisions.
in your statements is so much aggression, ignorance and lack of respect for an another man. Above all it's hard to take someone at his level discussions. Based on the example ofyour behavior don't be surprised that we have this bad image of Lithuanians in Poland. I believe that not everyone in Lithuania is so crazy
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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barto_S View Post
The fact is that today's Poland does not have major problems with minorities, there is no problem with showing the past, areas that were under the rule of German, Czech, etc.. as seen in the example of Gdansk, Wroclaw and many other cities.
Oh, you remember famous German Silesians, Prussians and Pomeranians in your public sphere now? I always found it strange that almost no monuments and street names had anything to do with the region/city/town/village. Good that these times are over and people like Gerhart Hauptmann, Arthur Schopenhauer or Max Born finally get the recognicion they deserve... where else in the world would a village *not* name a street after a local Nobel price winner.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:17 PM   #73
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Thanks for these photos, WWII was terrible.

Lithuanian museum wants to rebuild extinct village on Curonian Spit
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>>> OLD LITHUANIA



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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:31 PM   #74
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Another not bad pre war East Prussia map


http://infrastruct.files.wordpress.c...1/preussen.png
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Old August 25th, 2012, 02:39 PM   #75
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Gerdauen. After 1946 - Железнодоро́жный. Kaliningrad district. Russia

image hosted on flickr

http://farm5.staticflickr.com/4102/4...53e99703_b.jpg
photo by Dmitri Korobstov

image hosted on flickr

photo by Dmitri Korobstov

image hosted on flickr

photo by Dmitri Korobstov

image hosted on flickr

photo by Dmitri Korobstov

image hosted on flickr

photo by Dmitri Korobstov
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Last edited by Depeched; August 25th, 2012 at 02:45 PM.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 04:00 PM   #76
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
You maybe forgot what it mean occupy other state capital, what just destroyed our relationships between our states about 20 years and later. Vilnius never was part of Poland, exept 1920 - 1939.
As the other Polish forumer already stated, in early 20th century the majority of Wilno inhabitants were Polish, with signifcant Jewish population, and only <3% Lithuanians.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_...Vilnius_region

And in terms of 'deeper' past, the elites of the former Grand Duchy of Lithuania, which was a multi-cultural country with Ruthenian majority, had chosen to freely polonise, as they considered Polish language and culture as more prestigeous.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
As I see, this thread reveal that poles have a lot of complexes about historical questions. And with this you have a lot of problems with all neighbors.
Lithuanians have more complexes than the Poles. Trust me.

And, as already stated by other forumers, Poland doesn't have problems with other neighbours, apart from Lithuania.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Do you think that mosurians and other slavonics very wanted to "back" for his Great mother Poland? I don't think so. What is showed plebiscite after WWI.
Fail. I already posted a comment regarding manipulation and falsification of the plebiscite by Germans.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
What is more, This thread is not about Poland expansion ideas. We are talking about East Prussia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
From now I will not talk about polish nationalism ideas and other things like this.
Look at that little Samogitian scoundrel again. Knowing Polish sensitivity to history, he opens a controversial thread, and when Poles dare to react, he is veeeery surprised by Polish 'nationalism'. If you just stay in your lovely Samogitian swamps, everything will be fine.

Well done in getting some melting in the virtual pot done, mission accomplished.

Quote:
Originally Posted by uunxx View Post
Oh, come on, do you really want to steal Vilnius from Lithuania? Let's brag about Polishness of Wilno and then we'll talk about how Gdańsk is not German. If we want to be treated seriously we should have some limits.
As already said, this thread wasn't opened by Poles.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Let's see to polish tolerance to minorities.

Bubeliai, Poland. Monument for lithuanian poet Albinas Žukauskas
Monument like this is not one.

http://g1.delfi.lt/images/pix/file48856470_126d2ea7.jpg
Haha, there you go. If such incidents take place in Poland, they are done in hiding, are condemned by the authorities and certainly prosecuted.

In Lithuania, on the other hand, we can witness how young 'patriotic' Lithuanians in broad daylight invade the private property of an elderly man in a town inhabited by Poles in 90% and take off the sign with a Polish name of the street.

Lithuanian tolerance at its best!




Quote:
Originally Posted by Depeched View Post
Poland after war don't have any minority problems (sorry man), because all nations from there were just cleaned.
Oh, and what happened to some other ethnic communities living in Lithuania until World War 2?

Didn't some brave Lithuanian 'patriots' assist their Nazi masters with cleansing their former Jewish and Polish neighbours?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Collabo...r_II#Lithuania

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ponary_massacre
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Old August 25th, 2012, 05:17 PM   #77
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ja.centy, it's piontless to speak with this narrow mind Lithuanian guy. That's what he says is full of the same stereotypes. Note the absence of his culture - he writes the name of the Poland and Poles with small letters on purpose.

It's better to enjoy the beautiful pictures in this thread than discuss/feed the trolls.
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Old August 25th, 2012, 07:01 PM   #78
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Karasek View Post
I always found it strange that almost no monuments and street names had anything to do with the region/city/town/village. Good that these times are over and people like Gerhart Hauptmann, Arthur Schopenhauer or Max Born finally get the recognicion they deserve... where else in the world would a village *not* name a street after a local Nobel price winner.
Any surprise there? It's understandable that, following German occupation and crimes, there was huge hostility in Poland towards everything and anything German-related. In particular in the lands, which had been part of Germany before WW2. Hence, I believe there's nothing to be surprised of in this regard.

I also think that it would've been an evolutionary sequence in the social development of Polish nation and in PL-DE relations after 1945 to get to the stage, where pre-War German heritage may be embraced by the locals. But it's still quite a fragile issue/phenomenon, I suppose.
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Old August 26th, 2012, 12:48 AM   #79
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Somebody shut this thread down.
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Old August 26th, 2012, 03:18 AM   #80
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Why?

The posted pictures are quite interesting and the conversation though a bit spirited at times has for the most part proved to be both informative and educational.

I can't speak for anyone else, but I have gained a greater appreciation of number of opposing viewpoints expressed here.

And I see that as a good thing.

Your mileage may vary.
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