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Old February 22nd, 2013, 03:16 AM   #2221
pesto
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I think it means it wasn't going to happen this soon in any case.
That sounds right. Some thought it would be done by now in spite of the NFL and every owner with an opinion saying the deal offerred by AEG did not work (nobody wanted to sell part of the team or give up rights to football related revenues). And the NFL seems to be serious about having a very strong ownership and management group, and a real showplace, not a stadium squeezed into a cramped area.

By next year, I hope the new AEG owners will have gotten Farmer's and the possibilities for the Dodger Stadium parking lots sorted out; but who knows? And that doesn't mean that the Rams, Chargers or Raiders will be available; none of them seem desperate to come to LA and now appear to be working seriously with local groups at getting new stadiums.
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Old February 22nd, 2013, 10:00 PM   #2222
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http://www.nypost.com/p/news/busines...v85RCbWSwPrINL

Apparently, bids are low on AEG and Anschutz may not sell.

On its face, this seems to be bad news for Farmer's since Anshutz is reportedly not interested in football as a fan and doesn't believe the economics of Farmer's Field works. If no one else is interested, then it's not obvious where we go next. Maybe Dodger Stadium or Industry.

But a buyer may yet emerge; or perhaps selling off in parts would motivate a buyer for just the Farmer's project.
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Old February 24th, 2013, 03:12 AM   #2223
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ya, i dont put too much weight behind what the NY Post says. that rag is always off
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Old February 24th, 2013, 04:43 AM   #2224
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ya, i dont put too much weight behind what the NY Post says. that rag is always off
Yup. Growing up I was always told to pay attention to the New York Times and the Washington Post. And avoid the New York Post and the Washington Times.
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Old February 24th, 2013, 04:54 AM   #2225
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Hehe, turns out that the NYT has all the celebrated plagiarism cases.
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Old February 24th, 2013, 06:29 PM   #2226
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Yup. Growing up I was always told to pay attention to the New York Times and the Washington Post. And avoid the New York Post and the Washington Times.
Sounds like you had a traditional East Coast gentry education. "Remember your social class, son, it will never fail you!"

In any event, the Post article has been picked up by pretty much everyone and sounds perfectly credible. But who knows?
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Old February 24th, 2013, 06:32 PM   #2227
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Yup. Growing up I was always told to pay attention to the New York Times and the Washington Post. And avoid the New York Post and the Washington Times.
That was before Rupert Murduck bought these paper, now they are a lot more like Fox News.
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Old February 25th, 2013, 11:41 PM   #2228
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http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/J...s-Angeles.aspx

Report that the NFL and Guggenheim are meeting re building a stadium to NFL's liking in Chavez Ravine. This seems consistent with Guggenheim's low bid for AEG and with their insistence on NOT saying the Dodgers will stay in Dodger Stadium.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 01:05 AM   #2229
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http://www.sportsbusinessdaily.com/J...s-Angeles.aspx

Report that the NFL and Guggenheim are meeting re building a stadium to NFL's liking in Chavez Ravine. This seems consistent with Guggenheim's low bid for AEG and with their insistence on NOT saying the Dodgers will stay in Dodger Stadium.
I was wondering about that possibility a month or two ago...
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Old February 26th, 2013, 02:10 AM   #2230
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I was wondering about that possibility a month or two ago...
I think it's safe to assume they have been talking for some time; the NFL has preferred DS for years and, for example, it is known that Chivas approached Guggenheim about a soccer stadium in Chavez Ravine within days after their purchase of the Dodgers.

I suspect that idea sharing is over and now each side has a negotiating team with development, operating, legal, financial and PR people involved. But, as we know, the AEG bidding is still going on and it could be that Guggenheim figures they can get more out of alternative development. Still plenty of fun ahead.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 05:13 AM   #2231
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Very interesting.

I wonder if they'd really opt to raze Dodger Stadium in favor of an NFL venue after spending nine figures on a remodel. Hard to comprehend just throwing away a $100 million, but I guess it's all about the bigger picture.

If they could put an NFL stadium up there without demolishing Dodger Stadium, what happens with the Convention Center site? I recall Leiweke met with representatives from the Angels months back. A backup plan?
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Old February 26th, 2013, 05:41 AM   #2232
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Very interesting.

I wonder if they'd really opt to raze Dodger Stadium in favor of an NFL venue after spending nine figures on a remodel. Hard to comprehend just throwing away a $100 million, but I guess it's all about the bigger picture.

If they could put an NFL stadium up there without demolishing Dodger Stadium, what happens with the Convention Center site? I recall Leiweke met with representatives from the Angels months back. A backup plan?
The site either has to be a football stadium or a remodeled convention hall. LA can't afford its convention center to be any smaller than it already is.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 05:41 AM   #2233
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Very interesting.

I wonder if they'd really opt to raze Dodger Stadium in favor of an NFL venue after spending nine figures on a remodel. Hard to comprehend just throwing away a $100 million, but I guess it's all about the bigger picture.

If they could put an NFL stadium up there without demolishing Dodger Stadium, what happens with the Convention Center site? I recall Leiweke met with representatives from the Angels months back. A backup plan?
Artie Moreno has also met with Roski/Industry, but he's going to use these locations as leverage. Regardless of how much he wants to capture the L.A. market, moving out of O.C. just wouldn't be smart, and plenty of Angels fans in the I.E. that go to games too.

Plus, Moreno can probably get some public money out of Anaheim with a hotel tax and build a new stadium in the parking lot.

Depending on the AEG sale and if say the NFL ends up not in downtown, I wouldn't be surprised if AEG went for a smaller scale Farmers Field for the Galaxy. The Home Depot Center (soccer stadium) is obviously just 10 years old, but AEG could see bigger long term profits with say a 35,000 seat (with the ability to expand) retractable roof downtown stadium. The retractable roof would still be crucial for the convention center. Then maybe convert the HDC soccer stadium into a strictly outdoor concert venue like Verizon Amphitheatre in Irvine.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 05:53 AM   #2234
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The site either has to be a football stadium or a remodeled convention hall. LA can't afford its convention center to be any smaller than it already is.
I assume that anything built on the site of the North Hall involves building new space to replace what is lost (and hopefully expand).
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Old February 26th, 2013, 06:00 AM   #2235
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I assume that anything built on the site of the North Hall involves building new space to replace what is lost (and hopefully expand).
Well that's my point. If you are making that assumption, then you are inherently saying that a baseball stadium to host the Angels will not be built on the site.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 06:10 AM   #2236
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Well that's my point. If you are making that assumption, then you are inherently saying that a baseball stadium to host the Angels will not be built on the site.
Can't you do something akin to what AEG currently plans to do with Farmers? Add convention space in the area between the south hall and the stadium.

Or is there some reason a baseball stadium precludes additional convention space?
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Old February 26th, 2013, 06:26 AM   #2237
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Can't you do something akin to what AEG currently plans to do with Farmers? Add convention space in the area between the south hall and the stadium.

Or is there some reason a baseball stadium precludes additional convention space?
You can't put a baseball stadium on that site and still maintain the same amount of convention space. The Farmers Field project would tear down the West Hall, which still has to be replaced. In order to both replace and increase the space of the West Hall, they would have to build both Pico Hall, as well as Farmers Field as a multi-purpose facility with useable convention space. Baseball stadiums are very poor when built as a multi-purpose facility. The justification for Farmers is that it would be able to host lots of other events like soccer, bowl games, concerts, trade shows, etc. So if you tear down the West Hall and replace it with a baseball stadium, you would inherently suffer a net decrease in square footage of useable convention space.

The Angels to LA thing was just speculation, not a serious proposal.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 07:53 AM   #2238
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If the NFL really wants an iconic stadium in Chavez Ravine, I suppose that they would go easy on relocation fees and generous on building contributions. It could be a deal that Guggenheim and some owner can't refuse. But just speculation on my part.

It would seem to make sense to keep DS there, since hotels, restaurants, mass transit, etc., would get year-round use (maybe 90 baseball games and 10 football games, plus concerts, etc.). Plus I find it hard to imagine that the Dodgers would give up those views and spend 500M-1B to replace something that will be pretty nice after the current improvements.

The Convention Center could be expanded or not depending on the city's view of likely business.
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Old February 26th, 2013, 08:48 AM   #2239
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I've been pretty averse to football at the Dodger Stadium location for the last couple years. Now that the Guggenheim group is involved instead of the previous Dodger owners, I'm warming to the idea. In order to gain my full endorsement, though, public transit must be addressed. Design-wise, the downtown site is limited because of its dimensions. It would certainly be much easier to build an iconic stadium at Chavez than downtown. And the way Guggenheim does things, it could very well become the best stadium in the world. We're talking on the level of Allianz Arena, Donbass Arena, Moses Mahbida (what I consider to be world-class stadiums)





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Old February 26th, 2013, 07:13 PM   #2240
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I think we are in the same place now. Transit is clearly a big concern and I would want to see something like dedicated-lane bus service from Union Station and Sunset/Vermont Red Line. But this is mostly to correct baseball problems; football shouldn't be so bad pre-game since the crowds arrive over time to tailgate. Post-game could be pretty grim but it's Sunday evening or night. Monday night would be bad pre-game but by the time it ends it's past 9:00.

Some really nice stadiums, but one of the plusses of DS is the views. You would have to have something that at least shows off the hills, DT and the ocean (when the fall smog permits). I would expect fabulous lighting at night and the views at night could really be stunning.

And, as you say, Guggenheim is a class act and the NFL has every reason to make this a winner.
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