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Old January 29th, 2016, 02:39 AM   #1
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Projects & Discussion | WATERLOO ESTATE

SMH

http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/revealed-h...28-gmgl8x.html


Revealed: how and why housing at Waterloo beat Sydney Uni for a rail station

Date
January 29, 2016 - 10:55AM

Jacob Saulwick
City Editor

New rail station at Waterloo

Instead of Sydney University, a new station will be installed at Waterloo according to Sydney Metro. (Vision courtesy Sydney Metro)
The vote was four-four.

When a state government plans a new rail line, one might imagine the views of the transport department and the treasury would be telling in how the line will work.

But not in Sydney these days. In 2016, the city's pressing need for affordable homes is squeezing other concerns to the margins.

Joanna Loko with her two daughters; Vanessa Loko and Talitha Loko and Vanessa's children Wesley and Oswald Jesse Terapo (baby). Photo: Dominic Lorrimer

When the Baird government's Cabinet Infrastructure Committee met in late December to decide the route of the $10 billion metro line through central Sydney, the seven ministers present were armed with the advice of their departments.

The Treasurer, Gladys Berejiklian, the Transport Minister, Andrew Constance, and the Roads Minister, Duncan Gay, were of one view. They thought the line should run west of Redfern Station and include a stop at Sydney University.

A Sydney University stop would be used by many more people than the other option, a stop further east at Waterloo. More passengers would help ensure a better financial return for the project.

Health Minister Jillian Skinner also backed Sydney University. A stop there would be the closest rail station to Royal Prince Alfred Hospital.

But lined up against these four were two ministers with housing responsibilities.

UrbanGrowth NSW, the development agency under the responsibility of Planning Minister Rob Stokes, had made no secret of its desire to build thousands of new apartments around a Waterloo stop.

The Social Housing Minister, Brad Hazzard, was also at the meeting. He could see how new apartments at Waterloo could pay for the reconstruction of 2000 existing dwellings in the area.

And Stokes and Hazzard had the support of the Deputy Premier and Police Minister, Troy Grant, who reflected the cops' enthusiasm for dismantling the Waterloo towers.

The eighth vote and the premier's prerogative, then, was Mike Baird's.

And, according to multiple people in the room, it was the opportunity to rebuild the estate at Waterloo that swayed the premier's decision.

CONT. ↑ & ↓

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/revealed-h...#ixzz3yablSqFI

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Old January 29th, 2016, 05:14 AM   #2
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some new info and stuff carried over from Green Square thread

Waterloo Estate

The NSW Government has announced a new Metro Station at Waterloo.

The station will improve transport connections for local residents, and also drive the delivery of significant new housing and generational social renewal in the area.

Transformation of the area over 15-20 years will see the complete renewal and replacement of all social housing as a minimum,
integrated with planning for new public parks, community facilities and jobs.

The future renewal will also see affordable housing alongside social and private housing.

UrbanGrowth NSW has been developing an Urban Transformation Strategy to guide future growth on
government owned land in the Central to Eveleigh study area that includes Waterloo Estate.

While some tenants may need to relocate on an interim basis into other housing in the local area,
many will be able to move directly into the new social housing as the site is redeveloped.

http://www.centraltoeveleigh.com.au/...aterloo-estate

Raglan st






george st






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Old January 29th, 2016, 05:20 AM   #3
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Old January 29th, 2016, 05:35 AM   #4
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Good! Thanks.
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Old January 30th, 2016, 02:11 AM   #5
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smh

Extension & clarification of some aspects of the decision in favour of Waterloo.
•••

Mike Baird the deciding vote as cabinet chooses housing over university
Date
January 30, 2016 - 12:15AM

Jacob Saulwick
City Editor


New rail station at Waterloo

Instead of Sydney University, a new station will be installed at Waterloo according to Sydney Metro. (Vision courtesy Sydney Metro)

How housing won the day

Mike Baird kyboshed​ the hopes of four of his most senior ministers in casting his deciding vote against a Sydney University rail station in favour of his social housing agenda at Waterloo.

The decision to build a station at Waterloo was made so the rail line could trigger the development of thousands of new apartments in the area, which would in turn pay for the reconstruction of low-cost housing.

NSW Premier Mike Baird and Treasurer Gladys Berejiklian. Photo: Peter Rae

At the Cabinet Infrastructure Committee meeting organised to make the decision, which was announced on December 16, the Premier sided with three other ministers who supported a Waterloo station, sources told the Herald.

The Premier's vote over-ruled the position of four ministers who supported a Sydney University station, which would have been used by many more people than a Waterloo station.

CONT. ↓

Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/nsw/mike-baird...#ixzz3ygJpaaTv

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Old January 30th, 2016, 12:47 PM   #6
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Ugh, that map illustrates how perfect the existing airport line was for a new station at Waterloo. We could have had both the uni and the housing.
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Old January 30th, 2016, 11:17 PM   #7
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Well, I don't think a 4-4 outcome truly reflects the disparity of the vote. It's a case of the tail wagging the dog. Ironically, the ministers responsible for funding and delivering major infrastructure and services apparently only had equal weighting as those with ancillary responsibilities.

I think it would be fair if the minister whose portfolio owns the delivery of the project, in this case Transport/Constance, should have a 2x weighting. But, I suppose you could argue Baird should have a greater than parity vote also.
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Old January 31st, 2016, 05:23 AM   #8
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What is the configuration of the airport line tunnels at Raglan Street ?
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Old January 31st, 2016, 08:48 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mandonov View Post
Ugh, that map illustrates how perfect the existing airport line was for a new station at Waterloo. We could have had both the uni and the housing.
Yes, it sure does. They could have dug up the whole first block (North of Raglan St) to build a cut and cover station box.

I’m still not convinced that a station on the existing airport line was not feasible. I think it’s been too easily dismissed.

I’d like to know what engineering challenges they thought they were going to face, what the cost would have been and, how long the existing line would have needed to be shut down for. The airport line did not need to be fully shut down. You could have still run a shuttle service from Wolli Creek to the airport stations, Mascot and Green Square and, Campbelltown via East Hill trains could have been redirected via Redfern and Sydenham.
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Old January 31st, 2016, 11:13 AM   #10
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A few things to consider with the Airport line, if you look at the Sydney's Rail Future document they are looking to run 20 DD trains through the Airport line from Campbelltown, East Hills and the SWRL, so no Metro and a lot of capacity taken before trains even hit the Airport line. I think they may be looking at it from the aspect that the Metro will have more than enough room to take the extra passengers unlike the existing line and not only passengers from the station precinct but feeder buses from Botany road etc.
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Old January 31st, 2016, 12:55 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OZ Rails View Post
A few things to consider with the Airport line, if you look at the Sydney's Rail Future document they are looking to run 20 DD trains through the Airport line from Campbelltown, East Hills and the SWRL, so no Metro and a lot of capacity taken before trains even hit the Airport line. I think they may be looking at it from the aspect that the Metro will have more than enough room to take the extra passengers unlike the existing line and not only passengers from the station precinct but feeder buses from Botany road etc.
So put the Revesby stoppers in the tunnel, and all Campbelltown Leppingtons on the surface tracks. Trains from as far as Campbelltown could terminate at Central terminal platforms anyway
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Old January 31st, 2016, 01:03 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Eco-rat View Post
So put the Revesby stoppers in the tunnel, and all Campbelltown Leppingtons on the surface tracks. Trains from as far as Campbelltown could terminate at Central terminal platforms anyway
I was expecting someone to say this, well you don't know what their plans are for the local Illawarra tracks and you would also need a lot of works at Revesby to turn 20 TPH and as with existing plans I don't think you will be able to terminate those trains at ST.

There is also the point that they would be expanding Cityrail by adding another station to the Airport line and I think they are trying to avoid this, so no Metro = no new stations.

Last edited by OZ Rails; January 31st, 2016 at 01:11 PM.
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Old February 1st, 2016, 01:03 AM   #13
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Should we keep this thread for the urban renewal project, and train talk in the metro thread?
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Old February 3rd, 2016, 05:28 AM   #14
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Not so sure as the title of the thread is 'Waterloo Estate & Metro' as the two projects are inextricably linked & co-dependent, so chat about the metro isn't out of order.

I think it will be quite a while before we see any concrete building proposals & I was in two minds about starting the thread b/c of that, but it's set now so we're ready for when something substantial does happen. All the current residents have to be moved and there will be a lot of resistance and crap about 'me rights' and 'poor little old ladies being hurled cruelly onto the streets', then once they have prised the current occupants out, there's the demolition and the endless planning & approval process before buildings rise.
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Old February 5th, 2016, 09:33 AM   #15
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When the new station was announced, they said the renewal would be a staged approach over 15 to 20 years, and that relocations won't start till next year.

So still a looonnng way to go.
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Old February 11th, 2016, 08:01 AM   #16
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http://sydneymetro.info/home/documents/32208/download

The site boundary for Waterloo station is mapped - the entire block of Botany Rd, Raglan St, Cope St and Wellington St
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Old February 11th, 2016, 08:19 AM   #17
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waterloo station boundary map

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Old February 11th, 2016, 09:44 AM   #18
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Rpt. my comment in Transport forum:

With a bit of a think, I can see a certain logic in the location in that it will give them free rein to build the metro and the station without interfering with the demolition of those not so charming HC estates and constructing their replacements. That way is also the way for less political shenanigans with the removal and replacement of the current residents as some will have to be dragged kicking and screaming from residences they do not actually own.

Perhaps a policy of shifting the troublemakers to the exotic climes of the SW might encourage co-operation, after all, most of them will end up in better residences one way or the other.

It is also true that the location may help with the glacial mayhem of Botany Road, a small shift to the east and south, just a block or two, would also help more with the similar traffic conditions that are enjoyed on Elizabeth and Bourke streets.
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Old February 11th, 2016, 12:21 PM   #19
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By-the-way, the red rectangle in the yellow station area is the little church: it will be the sole survivor apparently.
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Old February 11th, 2016, 12:25 PM   #20
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it boggles the mind that the station is being built on private property considering the size of the government's land holdings behind cope street (i.e waterloo estate).

as suggested above by Brizer, it's probably a more political decision more than anything. imagine the uproar and noise from evicting the tenants in the low rise social housing... much easier to build the station first and then evict everyone.

personally would have thought the station would be more suited within the waterloo estate (closer to danks st) given redfern station is about 500m from that chosen botany road location.

Last edited by hotchicken; February 11th, 2016 at 12:52 PM.
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