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Old October 24th, 2013, 08:13 PM   #81
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Quote:
Originally Posted by isaidso View Post
That looks quite decent. What's behind the lack of greenery though? I'm assuming scarcity of land dictates no room for trees and landscaping? It wouldn't kill them to add another 10 feet in front of these houses for green space though. I also notice British houses typically build a brick/stone wall in the front. It gives everything a bleaker look, imo. What's the reason for all the walls?
You will find some of these type homes with more space at the front, I think it's a waste personally, I'd rather have the extra space at the back. The walls just make a divide between the public path and the private property, again not all homes of this type have them but many do.

I suspect the lack of greenery is just the builders being cheap (it is social housing after all) leaving it to the residents who will usually add hanging baskets, pot plants etc out front. In a private development you would usually find more landscaping by the developer
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Old January 15th, 2014, 01:54 AM   #82
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Londrina

Vista Bela, opened in 2011, it's the largest social housing project financed by the federal government called Minha Casa, Minha Vida (my house, my life) in Brazil. 630,000 m² of area, counts with 2,712 units, to house 10,000 people. 1,500 workers were employed during the construction.

Summer and soybeans:


Winter and the wheat:

Flávio Conceição

More info
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Old January 15th, 2014, 01:37 PM   #83
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Originally Posted by Sweet Zombie Jesus View Post
You can easily have a lot of greenery on that size of building setback, but in new builds there isn't much as I imagine they'll leave the gardening to the inhabitants.

As for public housing in Glasgow, we tend to be well known for bleak peripheral housing estates and tower blocks, but there's been quite a few good quality projects going on in inner city areas recently. Not exactly beautiful architecture but much better than the previous generation of concrete boxes.

Duke Street:


Govan:






Finnieston:
These are actually pretty good designs and the materials don't look cheap either.
I could see myself living in one of these.
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Old January 16th, 2014, 11:37 AM   #84
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In Australia, particularly in the state of New South Wales, in the 1960s and 1970s, public housing estates consisting of mainly detached or terraced housing were built on the outskirts of cities and most towns with populations of about 2,000 or more. These can range in size from small collections of a dozen or so houses in smaller towns, to the Mount Druitt estate in Sydney, a public housing estate consisting of predominantly detached housing with nearly 40,000 residents. However, many of these properties have now been sold off to private buyers, so most aren't true 'ghettos' anymore. In some areas, mainly inner city ones, high rise public housing apartment buildings were also constructed around the same time.

As the detached, terraced and apartment based public housing built in the 60s and 70s New South Wales was constructed cheaply, there were only a few styles of houses and apartment buildings that were replicated throughout public housing estates. This can be seen clearly on Google Street View.
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Old January 21st, 2014, 10:35 PM   #85
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Public housing in Brazil look like concentration camps. They should take example from Spain or Glazgow, judging from these pictures.
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Old January 21st, 2014, 10:49 PM   #86
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North America and Europe watched their projects to become out of control crime infested ghettos. Brazilian projects became mainstream neighbourhoods and as people keep improving their houses, and after few years you can't even tell there was a project here.

Definitely Brazil shouldn't look to those countries as an example as they've clearly failed.

P.S. You should note British GDP per capita is 3.5 times larger than Brazil. It's not like the South American country has enough money to build luxury public housing projects.
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 01:24 AM   #87
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Why do you always get so aggressive when someone even the slighest criticises Brazil?

Maybe they should have looked at Europe and North America and thought about how to NOT do it? Because those Brazilian public housings sort of looks like public housings in Europe and North America from 1950-1990. The types that have failed miserably over time. Usually they didn't do bad in the beginning, but became crime-ridden, poverty-strucken ghettos as time passed.

The things that are wrong with them are not things that are hard or very expensive to avoid neither.

Why build them so isolated and far from everything else?
Why build them as free-standing buildings instead of city quarters?
Why so much space between buildings (or building clusters)?
Why so monotone design?
Why are everything in the same colour?
Why not diversify the area a little and build some middle-class apartments in the mix? And of course some business and leisure.

Whole areas filled with only public housing, or housing for the poorer part of society, are a recipe for disaster. Just look at Europe and North America and see what happens when you do that.
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 01:53 AM   #88
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why do you always get so aggressive when someone even the slighest criticises Brazil?
What is aggresive about my post? And since when this specific housing project defines Brazil? I just said it's reasonable, no matter in which part of the world it's located. I was talking about the project, not about Brazil.

Actually you're always insisting to type Brazil when answering my posts? Why is that? Why my nationality is always relevant to you? Do I mention your nationality? That's very weird. I've told you that.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Maybe they should have looked at Europe and North America and thought about how to NOT do it? Because those Brazilian public housings sort of looks like public housings in Europe and North America from 1950-1990. The types that have failed miserably over time. Usually they didn't do bad in the beginning, but became crime-ridden, poverty-strucken ghettos as time passed.

The things that are wrong with them are not things that are hard or very expensive to avoid neither.
I understand you have a very insular mindset, but it's not only Europe and North America that have experience in public housing projects. Brazil has doing it since always as well. I've posted in this very thread stuff about it. Brazilian projects didn't fail, but became regular neighbourhoods. In Brazil, the families own the houses. That's those projects succeed down here.


----------------------------------------------------------------


Your serie of questions shows how you don't know the subject but still insist in this self-righteous attitude:


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why build them so isolated and far from everything else?
They're not isolated, but contiguous to the urban area. They're built where there are space available. Money doesn't grow on trees. In cities they're replacing slums, they're usually built on top of it. There aren't slums in Londrina, so no space available on the urban fabric. The city must expand to the edges, not only public housing, but upscale gated communities as well.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why build them as free-standing buildings instead of city quarters?
They're city quarters.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why so much space between buildings (or building clusters)?
Modern urban codes. Hong Kong style development is not allowed anymore. You must have enough space for light and breeze circulation.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why so monotone design?
I don't know. Why not hiring those flashy high profile architects? Are you paying?


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why are everything in the same colour?
Ditto.


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Why not diversify the area a little and build some middle-class apartments in the mix? And of course some business and leisure.
Why on earth a middle-class Brazilian would buy an apartment in a public housing project?


Quote:
Originally Posted by KeanoManu View Post
Whole areas filled with only public housing, or housing for the poorer part of society, are a recipe for disaster. Just look at Europe and North America and see what happens when you do that.
I understand you know nothing outside your bubble, but as I explained Brazil has PLENTY of experience in building public housing and they never failed like European and North American ones. So spare us of your superiority complex.
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 02:17 AM   #89
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Yuri S Andrade View Post
...
Yuri, I think you really need a little bit of auto-criticism. I can understand that you don't agree with my opinion that this type of architecture and urbanism is catastrophic, but judging from your posts it seems that you think it is pure perfection which it definitely isn't.

The problem with this development definitely isn't the alledged lack of space and money, but only the lack of will for good planning. You don't need to hire expensive, world class architecture firms for this project. I'm sure there are quite enough tallented Brazilian architects which could, for a reasonable price and on the same plot of land, design an urbanistically and architecturally well planned, socially mixed development with enough cultural, commercial ,recreational and other infrastructure.

A really well planned neigborhood can not only be a permanently pleasant place to live for its inhabitants, but also a new cultural and commercial center for a wider area, louring people from other places and even tourists creating a positive loop of development and prosperity for once socially deprived people. Looking at deplaurably monotonous and even depressive atmosphere of this area, I doubt even locals will be spending much daytime here, let alone anyone from outside.
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 02:31 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BE0GRAD View Post
Yuri, I think you really need a little bit of auto-criticism. I can understand that you don't agree with my opinion that this type of architecture and urbanism is catastrophic, but judging from your posts it seems that you think it is pure perfection which it definitely isn't.
Auto-criticism? You REALLY started very bad your post. Are you suggesting I projected the houses? Could you elaborate?


Quote:
Originally Posted by BE0GRAD View Post
The problem with this development definitely isn't the alledged lack of space and money, but only the lack of will for good planning. You don't need to hire expensive, world class architecture firms for this project. I'm sure there are quite enough tallented Brazilian architects which could, for a reasonable price and on the same plot of land, design an urbanistically and architecturally well planned, socially mixed development with enough cultural, commercial ,recreational and other infrastructure.
Well, you're wrong. I don't think you can talk about lack of will when the government, of not a wealthy country, is building millions of houses and actually giving them to the poorer. Do you have any idea of the costs involved. That's not a beauty peageant nor should it be.

And if you paid attention on my posts (I actually live in Brazil), you woudn't bring this socially mixed nonsense. That really shows you don't know Brazilian society, its dynamics and therefore shouldn't be delivering such strong opinions on a subject you don't know about it.


Quote:
Originally Posted by BE0GRAD View Post
A really well planned neigborhood can not only be a permanently pleasant place to live for its inhabitants, but also a new cultural and commercial center for a wider area, louring people from other places and even tourists creating a positive loop of development and prosperity for once socially deprived people. Looking at deplaurably monotonous and even depressive atmosphere of this area, I doubt even locals will be spending much daytime here, let alone anyone from outside.
Tourists?!?! Ok, I'm done.
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 03:24 AM   #91
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lol don't argue with this yuri guy, I had to abandon several threads when I corrected some of his data, or had a different opinion, because he kept complaining to the mods, just ignore his posts and talk about everything except for Brazil
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Old January 22nd, 2014, 08:38 AM   #92
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Guys, please... I don't want to close threads but you all have to calm down a bit, okay? I don't like closing threads but let's just be a bit more calm and civil. Thank you.
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Old January 24th, 2014, 05:02 PM   #93
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Okay, no more posts on this issue please. Any further posts will be deleted. This thread could be a decent discussion, don't turn it into your own personal flame wars.
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Old March 3rd, 2014, 08:08 PM   #94
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Public housing for the 'less fortunate' people in Singapore
and it cost a bomb as well, a 3 bedroom apartment would cost about USD300k

image hosted on flickr

sengkang west by Thaiyotakamli, on Flickr

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My neighbourhood by Thaiyotakamli, on Flickr

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Singapore by Thaiyotakamli, on Flickr

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Sengkang by Thaiyotakamli, on Flickr
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Old March 3rd, 2014, 10:22 PM   #95
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If it costs that much, then it's hardly for the less fortunate is it? Are those HDB blocks (and therefore unavailable to the many foreigners and guest workers that come to Singapore)?
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Old March 4th, 2014, 04:23 AM   #96
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Quote:
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If it costs that much, then it's hardly for the less fortunate is it? Are those HDB blocks (and therefore unavailable to the many foreigners and guest workers that come to Singapore)?
Yes only for Singapore citizens only. This is a public housing and for the smallest unit which is one room flat would cost usd40-50k, these flats really for those in need.

Foreigners can only rent the public housing
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Old March 11th, 2014, 10:46 PM   #97
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WingWing View Post
Yes only for Singapore citizens only. This is a public housing and for the smallest unit which is one room flat would cost usd40-50k, these flats really for those in need.

Foreigners can only rent the public housing
They look very nice for public housing !
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Old March 13th, 2014, 02:18 AM   #98
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Originally Posted by Yuri S Andrade View Post

North America and Europe watched their projects to become out of control crime infested ghettos. Brazilian projects became mainstream neighbourhoods and as people keep improving their houses, and after few years you can't even tell there was a project here.

Definitely Brazil shouldn't look to those countries as an example as they've clearly failed.
Did you actually read the post at all? He said the exact same as you: Glasgow is famous for having failed ghettos, which is why we're now building new housing that is not going to create such ghettos and is more similar to mainstream neighbourhoods, like the flats above: you cannot tell those are social housing, they look exactly the same as ordinary private flats.

Besides, the reason Glasgow's housing schemes were so bad is because they were built cheaply and without any kind of facilities or transport infrastructure. They simply moved people out of 'slums' into poorly designed suburbs which were exactly the same as the slums, only without the sense of community that slums have. And then they built huge tower blocks, which were even worse than the slums if anything because there was not even enough space for children to play, and they created fortress-like compounds which naturally spawned youth gangs.

But we learned from our mistakes, and our violent crime rate has dropped by an almost unprecedented amount in the past 20 years. So, as I said, if you had read the post, you would realise Brazil has a LOT to learn from us, since you have similar problems with gangs and slums that we had 70 years ago.
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Old March 14th, 2014, 10:19 PM   #99
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In the Northern US states and Canada mostly living in rooming house ,basement tents and apartments.Canada like to build highrise apartments the tower in park concept and make use of lot of basement tents.

In the southern US states mostly small single story houses and some places trailer park.
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