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Old November 17th, 2017, 08:04 AM   #1261
Centurio
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris B View Post
https://farm5.staticflickr.com/4574/...471390ca_c.jpg
It's not the most exciting development, and the wall will take a bit of getting used to.
I have to say this is pretty awful. Yes, perhaps it might be OK to have a coach park here. But, there is no need for it to looks so bloody grim!

Bricks, railings (and it seems "renders") by Lidl?

The path is pathetic and only adds to the grimness.

There is zero "public realm" consideration put into this, and as such this should go in the bin.

There is absolutely no need for this to look so utterly sh*t (in fact, there is an opportunity to make the place look better!), and such a "that'll do, get the builders in" approach shouldn't be tolerated. Bit by bit, in various different ways and in different places, Liverpool is being ruined in a way that may see that coach park become redundant.

I would also point out that if that land at Kings Dock where the coaches currently go was being put to more substantial, intensive use perhaps the council could have banked on receiving more income via retained business rates and associated economic growth, in order to offset the cost of better realm. That's one of the benefits of building a functional economy.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 12:05 PM   #1262
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It may not be busy with pedestrians, but who in their right mind would risk being squashed against the wall whilst walking on that narrow pavement. Surely this would fail planning on safety issues alone.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 04:22 PM   #1263
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The Port Authority Building is a huge dump, making St Johns seem pleasant. Unfortunately for us we can only dream of a NYC style replacement!
And like 'St John's Precinct' is the gateway to NYC for people transferring from JFK, by Carey Bus, to Manhattan.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 11:34 PM   #1264
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It may not be busy with pedestrians, but who in their right mind would risk being squashed against the wall whilst walking on that narrow pavement. Surely this would fail planning on safety issues alone.
There's a wide open walkway with a clear verge between the road and path on the other side. This footpath looks adequate to me, but if you're concerned about safety, you can cross the road. It also looks like there are planters built into recesses, so presumably they'll be used to soften the wall over time with climbers.
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Old November 18th, 2017, 11:14 AM   #1265
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It's no different to any other road FFS
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Old November 18th, 2017, 12:46 PM   #1266
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Originally Posted by jetsetwilly View Post
There's a wide open walkway with a clear verge between the road and path on the other side. This footpath looks adequate to me, but if you're concerned about safety, you can cross the road. It also looks like there are planters built into recesses, so presumably they'll be used to soften the wall over time with climbers.
"That'll do. Get the builders in."
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Old November 18th, 2017, 01:34 PM   #1267
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Not Liverpool but Sunderland. A new bridge is opening over the Wear.

Free at the point of use.
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Old November 18th, 2017, 02:34 PM   #1268
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It's no different to any other road FFS
The pavement does look quite narrow on the render but it's probably just a bad image. How wide is the current pavement there? Is there actually any on that side at all? I can't remember.
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Old November 29th, 2017, 06:07 PM   #1269
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http://northgate.liverpool.gov.uk/Do...PRD_DC_PLANAPP

Page 7, Figure 3 - The Strand Tunnel

Discuss.
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Old November 29th, 2017, 06:19 PM   #1270
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chris B View Post
http://northgate.liverpool.gov.uk/Do...PRD_DC_PLANAPP

Page 7, Figure 3 - The Strand Tunnel

Discuss.

Very important. And should include new underground concourse for James Street station stretching across to an entrance on the river side of the road.
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Old November 29th, 2017, 06:31 PM   #1271
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Interesting to see LJLA and Speke as destinations. It would really unlock the Speke estate to be on a 'Central Line'... and the benefits to the airport go without saying.

All of this is a no brainer and I know I say it a lot but it would be a straight forward affair in London and given we still share the same government as the capital it shouldn't be beyond the realms of possibility to make this all happen.

What's the Rocket interchange all about? anyone?
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Old November 29th, 2017, 06:39 PM   #1272
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What's the Rocket interchange all about? anyone?
It was mentioned on here a couple of months ago. In short the proposals call for the primary Edge Lane - M62 route to be sunk into an underpass, the flyover demolished, and the remaining routes, including Queens Drive, to be sent around a large roundabout.
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Old November 29th, 2017, 07:22 PM   #1273
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It was mentioned on here a couple of months ago. In short the proposals call for the primary Edge Lane - M62 route to be sunk into an underpass, the flyover demolished, and the remaining routes, including Queens Drive, to be sent around a large roundabout.
So (minus the underpass) returning the area to what it actually was before?

I wonder if it will free up some space for development?
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Old November 29th, 2017, 07:39 PM   #1274
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So (minus the underpass) returning the area to what it actually was before?

I wonder if it will free up some space for development?
Pretty much, yeah. As for development land, here's something I threw together in Photoshop a while ago, showing how a re-imagined junction there might work, as well as some potential freed up land in yellow for development -

Original image from Google Maps. Copyright to Google. Shown here for informational purposes only.

Of course, while in principle it ticks a number of boxes, how you implement it without causing a queue of traffic for miles in every direction for a couple of years during construction is anyone's guess.

Back with The Strand Tunnel, is it even feasible that a road could drop down far enough from the end of Parliament Street, to be able to safely pass beneath Queens Dock? This also seems to fly in the face of other more recent proposals that would see the current over-engineered Parliament Street/Sefton Junction changed to a more conventional T-junction. With those plans realised, there definitely would not be enough space to burrow under Queens Dock.
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Old November 30th, 2017, 10:00 AM   #1275
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Living near the San Giovanni interchange between Line A and the new Line C here in Rome. Much of the delay in the opening of the new line has been due to tunnelling Line C under Line A. This entailed creating a new frame to contain the existing Line A station which is about 20 metres below street level to allow the deeper Line C to pass under it.

Knowing this, is it possible to build a Strand tunnel under the waterfront either over or under the Queensway tunnel, noting that at the level of the three graces the existing tunnel is starting to reimmerge and also has a branch off to the Strand?
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Old November 30th, 2017, 10:33 AM   #1276
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Living near the San Giovanni interchange between Line A and the new Line C here in Rome. Much of the delay in the opening of the new line has been due to tunnelling Line C under Line A. This entailed creating a new frame to contain the existing Line A station which is about 20 metres below street level to allow the deeper Line C to pass under it.

Knowing this, is it possible to build a Strand tunnel under the waterfront either over or under the Queensway tunnel, noting that at the level of the three graces the existing tunnel is starting to reimmerge and also has a branch off to the Strand?
There's the railway tunnel too, which passes under Mann Island and I presume is pretty shallow given its age.
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Old November 30th, 2017, 10:34 AM   #1277
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You're right forgot about that one
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Old November 30th, 2017, 01:27 PM   #1278
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A Strand tunnel would be around 2 km in length - so a similar length to the Kingsway tunnel. It would be prohibitively expensive if it was technically feasible.
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Old November 30th, 2017, 02:01 PM   #1279
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Why isn't cut and cover for the strand technically feasible? I guess the obvious answer is that there's something already underneath?
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Old November 30th, 2017, 02:46 PM   #1280
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There was significant disruption caused by the works to move utilities for the Merseytram, which only needed a comparatively narrow and shallow path to be formed. I can only imagine the work needed to clear a path through the various utilities that must run along and across The Strand, and that is just preparatory work really. That's before we get to the actual removal of huge quantities of earth and building it in a very congested area, and before we get to rather larger potential obstacles like the Birkenhead tunnel, the railway tunnel, and the Liverpool ONE underground car park access tunnels.

Perhaps a diversion under the docks, costs aside, is at least practically the better option?
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