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Old December 20th, 2015, 09:01 AM   #1861
Eddard Stark
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the good effects of competition. NTV and TI are trying to outdo each other

I am sure it will have good effect long term on both supply and the quality of it
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Old December 20th, 2015, 05:51 PM   #1862
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I'm curious what effect had on planes flying between Rome and Milan...
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:12 PM   #1863
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In 2007 about 2.4 million people flew Rome-Milan, mainly with Alitalia and high yields (sometimes very high yields)

In 2014 only 1.4 million people flew Rome-Milan, still dominated by Alitalia but with very low yields

In 2007 it was by far the most important national flight route in Italy, in 2014 it is the third, after the Rome-Catania and Rome-Palermo routes
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:13 PM   #1864
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As a comparison in the same period the Rome-Catania passed from 1,4 million passengers to almost 2 million

Without HSR, probably today the Milan-Rome route would be close or above the 3 million passengers
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:15 PM   #1865
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And this still does not factor in the reduction of time necessary between the two capitals of Italy.

Next year, if all goes well, the fastest trains will take only 2:20 minutes instead of 3 hours.

The route will be devastated I think, I cannot imagine many people still flying after that, except for hub-servicing reasons. But there are very few norther italians that use FCO as a hub
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:19 PM   #1866
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Milan itself is the best hub in Italy for long distance flights, right?
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:40 PM   #1867
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Quote:
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Milan itself is the best hub in Italy for long distance flights, right?
It depends. Fiumicino has more intercontinental flights than Malpensa, but Milano airports have better flight connections to other European hubs.

Fiumicino also have double the movement of Malpensa. To prop Malpensa, they should close Linate altogether.

Alitalia did try to compete with the new high speed services in 2009 with "expedited check-in", promising "curbside to jetway" transit times of less then 25 minutes for boarding, it didn't work out though.
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:44 PM   #1868
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Quote:
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Milan itself is the best hub in Italy for long distance flights, right?
Milan Malpensa is not a Hub, so the question is pretty clear. There is only one, which is FCO

THEORETICALLY the best place in Italy to have a hub would be some place around Milan, with easy access from the rest of nord italy by train/car and without the competition of a nearby city airport

But - alas - that is not the case
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:47 PM   #1869
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Quote:
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Alitalia did try to compete with the new high speed services in 2009 with "expedited check-in", promising "curbside to jetway" transit times of less then 25 minutes for boarding, it didn't work out though.
That was their entire strategy

in a few years they had to be saved again, and the company sold to Abu Dhabi.

We are a bit OT, but it is interesting to see the impact of HSR on Alitalia

Some other data?

In 2007 the Milan-Naples connection (through Linate) ratched 840K passengers. In 2014 it was only 630K.

The overall number of passengers rose, so this is significant. Also considering Milan-Naples by train is still a longish journey
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:51 PM   #1870
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Another smallish route:

Verona-Rome

330K in 2007, less than 200K in 2014
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Old December 20th, 2015, 08:53 PM   #1871
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Less impact in the Venice-Rome route

From 600K to 530K
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Old December 27th, 2015, 06:48 PM   #1872
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Does anyone know what types of turnouts are used on the Italian High Speed Lines? I’m interested in the different possible speeds for the diverging tracks. I tried to measure some turnouts in the surrounding of Napoli (in Google Earth) and found a turnout length of about 125 m (between begin of the switch panel to the end of the crossing panel). I think this turnouts will allow a speed of 160 km/h. Perhaps higher speeds are not needed in Italy.

Is also known how the alignment of these turnouts is build? I prefer what I called the German alignment with a first transition curve from the turnout entry to the turnout curve and a second transition curve form the turnout curve to the turnout end. The other alignment is mostly used in France and has only the second transition curve. Resulting in a relative high jerk at the turnout entry.

Thanks in advance.
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Old March 14th, 2016, 12:21 AM   #1873
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Hi!

I read that between Milan and Rome the High speed line will be upgraded from 300 km/h to 350 km/h because frecciarossa 1000 trainsets are capable of this speed.
As I know it will be done this year, but does anybody know the exact date when this will happen?

Thanks in advance!

Last edited by zsbuum; March 14th, 2016 at 12:28 AM.
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Old March 14th, 2016, 03:30 PM   #1874
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It will be upgraded to 350km/h, yes, but not the entire line. Just the stretch Milano - Modena, AFAIK, and Rome-Naples.

Florence-Bologna and Chiusi - Rome will remain as they are now, 300 and 250 km/h. Chiusi - Florence will be upgraded to 300 km/h.

No idea about the date, though. Maybe with the December timetable change?
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Old March 14th, 2016, 05:38 PM   #1875
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narkelion View Post
It will be upgraded to 350km/h, yes, but not the entire line. Just the stretch Milano - Modena, AFAIK, and Rome-Naples.

Florence-Bologna and Chiusi - Rome will remain as they are now, 300 and 250 km/h. Chiusi - Florence will be upgraded to 300 km/h.

No idea about the date, though. Maybe with the December timetable change?
Thanks for the detailed explanation narkelion!
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Old March 14th, 2016, 10:26 PM   #1876
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narkelion View Post

No idea about the date, though. Maybe with the December timetable change?
Nah, too bad, I'm probably taking the Naples-Rome train at the end of July. I was hoping it would be running at 350 km/h then. But 300 km/h is good enough
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Old March 15th, 2016, 12:49 AM   #1877
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Thanks for the detailed explanation narkelion!
I forgot about the Milan-Turin stretch, that will be upgraded to 350 km/h except a bend on Ticino River.
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Old March 16th, 2016, 06:15 PM   #1878
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Quote:
Originally Posted by narkelion View Post
It will be upgraded to 350km/h, yes, but not the entire line. Just the stretch Milano - Modena, AFAIK, and Rome-Naples
Are those slab track?
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Old March 16th, 2016, 09:47 PM   #1879
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No, AFAIK there aren't slab track sections in Italy, except some tunnels (like the two longest between Bolzano/Bozen and the Brenner Pass, on the Pondebbana railway and maybe in the Bologna city tunnel) and a test section between Rome and Florence (HSL).

And certainly there are no slab tracks on HSLs, excepts on the two sections cited above.
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Old March 16th, 2016, 10:25 PM   #1880
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zsbuum View Post
Thanks for the detailed explanation narkelion!
Is this the reason why the travel time between Milan and Rome is to be cut by 40 minutes?

What are the before and after travel times between Milan and Naples?
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