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Old November 25th, 2012, 11:56 AM   #5301
ChrisZwolle
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If motorways are far from the cities it is not useful for urban traffic, especially amongst larger cities. If it is closer to cities or encircles them partially, you can take a lot of surface street traffic onto the motorway, reducing urban congestion. Timișoara, a city of over 300,000 people is served by just one exit 10 kilometers outside the city.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 12:05 PM   #5302
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Brasov will have a modern by-pass almost at expressway standard. That will be enough to serve decongestion for the city, especially since it will not be used by other traffic (which will be carried by A3).

As for Timisoara, it is good thing that the city benefits from a motorway at all, even though 10 km away. In the initial EU plans, Timisoara was not cought under A1. Following insistence from the RO Gov, the EU accepted to "pull" the motorway route south and thus extend the lenght of A1 to Timisoara (32 more km), and that's why you get that weird U shaped motorway near Timisoara.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 02:11 PM   #5303
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
If motorways are far from the cities it is not useful for urban traffic, especially amongst larger cities. If it is closer to cities or encircles them partially, you can take a lot of surface street traffic onto the motorway, reducing urban congestion. Timișoara, a city of over 300,000 people is served by just one exit 10 kilometers outside the city.
Timisoara already has 2 motorway exits, Giarmata and Izvin. But, yes it is true that A1 doesn't serve at all urban traffic in Timisoara, like it happens at Arad or Sibiu.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 04:41 PM   #5304
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Originally Posted by Le Clerk View Post
As for Timisoara, it is good thing that the city benefits from a motorway at all, even though 10 km away. In the initial EU plans, Timisoara was not cought under A1. Following insistence from the RO Gov, the EU accepted to "pull" the motorway route south and thus extend the lenght of A1 to Timisoara (32 more km), and that's why you get that weird U shaped motorway near Timisoara.
Not again!

Beside the obvious advantage of providing access to the A1 motorway to Timisoara and Lugoj, the selected route which is currently under construction is only 16 km !! (not 32!) longer then if A1 would have followed the same path as DN7 through the Mures Valley. Therefore, one one hand, the detour was small compared to the advantage of connecting two more cities to the motorway.

But more then that, the current route of A1 Arad - Timisoara - Lugoj - Deva is CHEAPER then the direct route Arad - Deva, due to the difficult geography of then Mures Valley between Ilia and Arad. The direct route would have called for a lot of viaducts, excavations and tunnels, for over 80 km - similar to what the Olt Valley will ask for - as opposed to being constructed on plains from Arad and up to Faget, with only 18 km accross mountains on the "longer" route.

Bottom line: the "detour" by Timisoara it was small (16 km), it was economically important and it was a lot cheaper then a direct route. It was the logical choice, both for Romania and EU. And that's why the motorway went that way.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 04:45 PM   #5305
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ChrisZwolle View Post
If motorways are far from the cities it is not useful for urban traffic, especially amongst larger cities. If it is closer to cities or encircles them partially, you can take a lot of surface street traffic onto the motorway, reducing urban congestion. Timișoara, a city of over 300,000 people is served by just one exit 10 kilometers outside the city.
really...vancouver 4 milions ppl 3 exits from highway 1 to city center caa 20km
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Old November 25th, 2012, 04:54 PM   #5306
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Originally Posted by Baiazid View Post
Not again!

Beside the obvious advantage of providing access to the A1 motorway to Timisoara and Lugoj, the selected route which is currently under construction is only 16 km !! (not 32!) longer then if A1 would have followed the same path as DN7 through the Mures Valley. Therefore, one one hand, the detour was small compared to the advantage of connecting two more cities to the motorway.

But more then that, the current route of A1 Arad - Timisoara - Lugoj - Deva is CHEAPER then the direct route Arad - Deva, due to the difficult geography of then Mures Valley between Ilia and Arad. The direct route would have called for a lot of viaducts, excavations and tunnels, for over 80 km - similar to what the Olt Valley will ask for - as opposed to being constructed on plains from Arad and up to Faget, with only 18 km accross mountains on the "longer" route.

Bottom line: the "detour" by Timisoara it was small (16 km), it was economically important and it was a lot cheaper then a direct route. It was the logical choice, both for Romania and EU. And that's why the motorway went that way.
I don't remember reading this again on the Romanian forum, if that's what you mean, also because I don't have time to read all the posts in the numerous infrastructure threads there.

Anyway, from what I read, the initial route was directly from Arad to Deva, but it was changed in order to catch Timisoara too. As for the technical reasons, I do not dispute them, but again, I am pretty sure I read many times that the initial route was also an option.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 05:14 PM   #5307
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I don't remember reading this again on the Romanian forum, if that's what you mean, also because I don't have time to read all the posts in the numerous infrastructure threads there.

Anyway, from what I read, the initial route was directly from Arad to Deva, but it was changed in order to catch Timisoara too. As for the technical reasons, I do not dispute them, but again, I am pretty sure I read many times that the route was changed there.
There were many debates up to 3-4 years ago about the route that A1 was to follow from the RO/HU border to Deva. Various interests led to several alternate routes and even at various point at which the motorway was supposed to cross the border. I remember one route was from south of Nadlac and the straight to the Mures Valley, passing half way between Arad and Timisoara (25km away from each of them) However, those were exclusively STUDY alternate routes. There was never a submited and aproved project of such a motorway, modified at a later time.

The only projoected version, submited and agreed with EU was the one currently under construction. And the reasons to chose it were very-very logical, technical and economical.

On the other hand, it is also true that all the debates were highlighted at that time by the press, with the specific "I have no idea what I'm talking about" attitude. Which in turn induced into the public the legend that the motorway is today "a lot longer", thus more expensive, just for the sake of the people in Timisoara. And that false legend led further to endless regional debates about who's more entitled to have access to a motorway sooner then the others.

Fortunately, that legend seemed to have died out. Hence my "not again!" when we repeated it. It looks like the legend is far more resilient then I thought.

So I have to repeat the conclusion: the current route was selected for the following reasons, in that order:
1. The current route is cheaper
2. The current route serves the most urban areas possible
Note: The current route is only 16 km longer then the direct route.
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Old November 25th, 2012, 07:56 PM   #5308
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The current route of A1 between Arad and Deva (bypassing Timişoara and Lugoj) has yet another major reason it was chosen for: it provides a perfect layout for the construction of the "southern (read: main) arm" of Corridor IV, Lugoj-Caransebeş-Herculane-Tr.Severin-(Craiova?)-Calafat-BG!

Last edited by scurt/2; November 25th, 2012 at 08:50 PM.
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Old November 28th, 2012, 09:47 AM   #5309
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It's official: the second carriageway for Cernavoda-Medgidia opens today.
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Old November 28th, 2012, 10:50 AM   #5310
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Tomorrow according to capital.ro
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Old November 28th, 2012, 12:38 PM   #5311
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contract cancelation for Romstrade

http://www.zf.ro/business-construct/...trade-10355103
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Old November 29th, 2012, 07:33 AM   #5312
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Quote:
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Tomorrow according to capital.ro
Yeah, today. They keep moving the dates for the godamn politicians to have time to inaugurate.
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Old November 29th, 2012, 01:20 PM   #5313
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Hmm, Cluj bypass is still not completed...

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Old November 29th, 2012, 01:23 PM   #5314
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Quote:
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Hmm, Cluj bypass is still not completed...

They are dealing with a land side from what I have seen. Very slow progress indeed. Maybe they don't have a technical solution yet.
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Old November 29th, 2012, 02:07 PM   #5315
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They are dealing with a land side from what I have seen. Very slow progress indeed. Maybe they don't have a technical solution yet.
land slide?
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Old November 30th, 2012, 09:11 AM   #5316
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Yes, yes, of course land slide.

They tried few times to make the hill stable, but there is even a small spring... I think they didn't found a 100% OK solution yet... Some voices said they shouldn't work there because the land is not stable and will cost a lot of money to make the hill stable...
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Old November 30th, 2012, 09:01 PM   #5317
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Some awesome pics of A1 works:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny550394 View Post
Viaduct Aciliu







Quote:
Originally Posted by Danny550394 View Post
Sacel


Saliste
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Old November 30th, 2012, 09:05 PM   #5318
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Quote:
Originally Posted by claudiu_ne2000 View Post
...datorita vantului...timpi mari de expunere mi-au facut figuri...dar tot am scos ceva











deocamdata astea


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Old November 30th, 2012, 09:08 PM   #5319
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WTF. the same pics 3 times?
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Old November 30th, 2012, 09:10 PM   #5320
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C'mon! I'm still working on this!
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