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Old March 16th, 2010, 01:41 PM   #1
Andrew
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Newcastle and the North East OPEN SPACES - Allotments, Parks, Denes, etc (Apart from "Town Moor" which has its own thread)

Are they allotments I see in the top right corner of the aerial image of Castle Leazes Moor above? If so, why were they got rid of? There's such a shortage of allotment space and this is exactly the kind of use that I think parts of the town moors should be given over to. Allotments would allow the moors to become more useful to the community without losing important green space.
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Old March 16th, 2010, 02:26 PM   #2
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Quote:
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Are they allotments I see in the top right corner of the aerial image of Castle Leazes Moor above? If so, why were they got rid of? There's such a shortage of allotment space and this is exactly the kind of use that I think parts of the town moors should be given over to. Allotments would allow the moors to become more useful to the community without losing important green space.
iirc the Freemen got rid of those allotments because they felt that doing so would make the Leazes Moor more economically viable as an area for grazing (ie with the allotments there, the land available for grazing was too small).

.

Last edited by Newcastle Historian; July 25th, 2011 at 03:08 PM.
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Old March 16th, 2010, 04:03 PM   #3
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the allotments and the nuns moor cricket ground were reclaimed as open space because the parliamentary act that is required to develop the moor requires that there is no loss of total area ie when the proposed new ground was put forward.these areas were opened up by the freemen in anticipation of a positive outcome for the club and there was also an option for temporary car parking on nuns moor with a mesh type material preventing erosion of these grassed areas to support solutions to traffic problems in the application. my friend was moved from his allotment on leazes moor for the same reason.

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Old March 16th, 2010, 04:34 PM   #4
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So let me get this straight - they got rid of the allotments to free up net space for the stadium? FFS...

They should put allotments back onto the different sections of the Town Moor, it's an ideal location for them and there's a huge lack of them. If anyone's interested in encouraging/forcing the council to provide more, message me - there's a way of doing it if you can get five signatures.
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Old March 16th, 2010, 04:58 PM   #5
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im not sure that theres a shortage in newcastle. he immediately got a replacement in fenham and you can get one at south gosforth easily,there were several vacant plots on leazes moor at that time as well.the point about the moor is that it is common land and hence its custodians have to have a certain proportion of it open to the public as well as respecting rights of way.i agree there is plenty of brownfield space around which is basically scrub that could be used for allotments although soil contamination is a big problem on tyneside.
on another note, i am a resident of leazes and at that time there was a very big divide in opinion locally about the new stadium. dolly potter got the headlines leading the opposition but spent little time in her house while most of the "friends of leazes park" were from outside the area. i am still undecided if the pay back of a top class new arena on strawberry place,improved setting of the magnificent leazes terrace (comparable to bath but overwhelmed), an actual increase in landscaped parkland,and a showcase stadium for the city outweighed the drawbacks for spittal tongues and leazes moor. even in leazes village many were for the plan.the worst part of the whole affair was democratically elected councillors being prevented from voting just because they were season ticket holders-on presumption of bias. this set a ridiculous precedent of what constituted vested interest-should a tesco shareholder be able to vote on an asda development for example.it meant the proposal never stood any chance of being passed whatever its merits.incidentally this ruling was not repeated in livepool for lfcs stanley park proposal.

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Old March 16th, 2010, 05:35 PM   #6
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Councillors did vote in Liverpool on this basis, but by doing so the Ombudsman found they had acted improperly and the subsequent High Court decision set a legal precedent.

There is a significant waiting list for allotments in many parts of the city at present.
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Old March 16th, 2010, 06:00 PM   #7
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amazing that councillors are prevented from voting because of something as minor as having a season ticket (most of them just reflecting the preferences of their constituents in fact) while mps can be (paid by various means) lobbyists but can still vote on related topics! a democratic mandate given to an elected person should not be divisible and you have to rely on that person to exclude themselves if they had a major vested interest. it would be a poorer society if we saw a conspiracy at every corner!
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Old March 17th, 2010, 05:35 PM   #8
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Quote:
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... i agree there is plenty of brownfield space around which is basically scrub that could be used for allotments although soil contamination is a big problem on tyneside. ...
There is plenty of brownfield space which can be used for development (such as a new stadium, arena etc.), thus allowing the uncontaminated green space to be partially used for things like allotments. With all the available brownfield land (much of it more accessible than Castle Leazes Moor), it just strikes me as absolutely crazy to propose a new stadium where they did.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:17 PM   #9
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There's definitely a big shortage of allotments in the city and providing new ones seems pretty low on the council's list of priorities. To be fiar to them, not many cities have provided any new ones for decades and few councils will be willing to give over developable land that they can generate a capital receipt from to a use that generates next to no cash at all.

Hnece the use of the Town Moor, as somewhere that can't be built on anyway, would be a perfect idea.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:21 PM   #10
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There's definitely a big shortage of allotments in the city and providing new ones seems pretty low on the council's list of priorities.
There is a new allotment strategy being drawn up for the council at the moment. This may lead to changes, if it is approved.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:26 PM   #11
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I know, I actually know someone helping them develop it. Apparently there was a lot of resistance from councillors in the beginning - I'll ask how it's progressing and see how it's developing.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:31 PM   #12
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We wanted an allotment a while back, but the waiting list was so long!


BUT (just a thought) this is an interesting discussion, that might be a good 'source of reference' to people who want to know about allotments (availability/policy, whatever) at some time in the future.

No one would think to look for that info on a "Newcastle as it Might Have Been" thread!

What would be a more suitable thread for this conversation, I can't think.

Town Moor perhaps??
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:35 PM   #13
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Town Moor perhaps??
A lot of provision isn't Town Moor, though.

Maybe a merged thread for all Newcastle parks, allotments and open space issues, to include the Moor?
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:38 PM   #14
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In my ward (North Heaton) there genuinely isn't a lot of undeveloped land available for this purpose, unless you start using areas of parks or playing fields. I contacted the University recently to enquire gently about the possibility of them surrendering an underused portion of their playing field at Red Hall Drive but they weren't interested.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:39 PM   #15
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Quote:
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A lot of provision isn't Town Moor, though.

Maybe a merged thread for all Newcastle parks, allotments and open space issues, to include the Moor?
Yes, true, they are not all Town Moor.

But, we do have a healthy, well used 'Town Moor' thread, which is a good thread to have for that "unique" area, so how about a new thread for all other open spaces (as we don't have one) called . .

Newcastle - All Open Spaces, Parks, Allotments etc (Excluding Town Moor)
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:40 PM   #16
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Yes, true, they are not all Town Moor.

But, we do have a healthy, well used 'Town Moor' thread, which is a good thread to have for that "unique" area, so how about a new thread for all other open spaces (as we don't have one) called . .

Newcastle - All Parks, Open Spaces, Allotments, issues etc (Excluding Town Moor)
I'd vote for that.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:41 PM   #17
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I must admit I'm not a fan of allotments. To me they seem to be outdated and were only around when people didn't have gardens, most people do now. They also seem to be made up of bits and pieces of junk and look to much like shanty towns and in alot of cases are used for people to take in people's rubbish and burn it. I have a real hatred for the people who have an allotment near people's houses and decide to burn rubbish during the sumer month's thus making sure noone nearby can enjoy the weather in their own homes/gardens because of the smell and toxins. It also means that people can't open their windows in the hot weather incase it smel's people homes out.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:44 PM   #18
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Five years ago, there were loads of empty allotment plots; there is now a big waiting list and lots of younger people have taken them on as part of the drive towards more environmentally friendly "local food". The local allotment in my area is fantastic - a real community and the plotholders have put a lot of time and money into building a clubhouse, terrace, and other facilities, as well as maintaining beautiful allotment plots.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:44 PM   #19
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Quote:
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Yes, true, they are not all Town Moor.

But, we do have a healthy, well used 'Town Moor' thread, which is a good thread to have for that "unique" area, so how about a new thread for all other open spaces (as we don't have one) called . .

Newcastle - All Open Spaces, Parks, Allotments etc (Excluding Town Moor)
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Originally Posted by WilfBurnsFan View Post
I'd vote for that.

OK, I'll arrange this via a mod, as we will need to get all of this excellent "Allotments" conversation transferred out of this thread and into the new one. Might take a day or so, then we can re-convene on the new thread.

LATER EDIT - Our new thread certainly didn't take a 'day or two' . . it took a matter of minutes, thanks to our mod b4mmy.

The 'first post' of this new thread doesn't look like a first post (as it is referring back to "something else above") but that soon starts to make sense after you have read a few posts in!!

This should prove a very useful thread in the future, I think.

Last edited by Newcastle Historian; March 17th, 2010 at 08:27 PM.
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Old March 17th, 2010, 06:46 PM   #20
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True about fires, people with allotments near housing should be sensitive to this. But lots of people haven't gardens (or anything more than a yard or so in front of the house - those in flats or small houses or Tyneside flats - still a lot of those around. And although they may look a bit scruffy, isn't it great that there are still bits of ground that aren't regulated into boring, bland homogeneity?
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