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Newcastle Metro Area For Newcastle, N Tyneside, Gateshead, S Tyneside, South Northumberland



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Old January 19th, 2012, 09:13 AM   #121
BigLebowski
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No offence, but unless you need the car in your job, I don't really understand why anyone would choose to drive from Tynemouth to Newcastle when there is a mostly reliable Metro service with season tickets that are pretty reasonably priced.

I don't really see what can be done about the Coast Road at the bottlenecks mentioned, it can't be widened without demolishing houses. Chilllingham-Benton Rd is the main route to the Longbenton site so the roundabout joining it to the Coast Rd is never going to be quiet.

As for the standard of the public getting worse, Tommy rot. I use that line all the time and I never see any disorder on it.
I do unfortunately, based just behind St James Park, but client visits take me as far as Hexham, Morpeth and Amble. I'd gladly get the Metro otherwise and have an entirely different set of whinges!
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Old January 19th, 2012, 09:28 AM   #122
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I do unfortunately, based just behind St James Park, but client visits take me as far as Hexham, Morpeth and Amble. I'd gladly get the Metro otherwise and have an entirely different set of whinges!
Have you tried the 'bottom road', i.e. through North Shields, past the Tyne Tunnel, Willington Quay, past Segedunum, through Low Walker, Walker Road, City Road, Quayside, Forth Bank and St James' Boulevard?
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Old January 19th, 2012, 10:02 AM   #123
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"bottom road" is my favourite route back I call it the scenic route particularly the Low Walker area as much going on.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 10:11 AM   #124
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As for the standard of the public getting worse, Tommy rot. I use that line all the time and I never see any disorder on it.
You can only speak as you find, of course. The last time I took a Metro in that direction it was a zoo.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 06:33 PM   #125
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Seamaster - without wanting to get too political again, would a gentlemen of your political persuasion acknowledge that privatisation of public transport has resulted in poorer levels of service for passengers? This is not a provocation... just a legit question.

To put forward my opinion, privatisation can work with buses, as long as regulation is sufficient to ensure fair access for all. I do think the Metro provides an interesting model of public ownership, private operator. Most people probably concede that DB Regio do a better job than Nexus did, but with a cast iron contract and very tight regulation.

But by contrast Arriva & Stagecoach have made a right shambles of the bus network when given free rein to run it for-profit with minimal regulation.

I think we don't need buses in public ownership or drivers employed by the government, but we need bus routes, fares and timetables designed for quality of service rather than max revenue.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 06:58 PM   #126
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Privatisation's been a mixed bag. It only works where there's genuine competition (eg in air travel where greater competition has delivered a multiplicity of different cost/service carriers and driven down prices). Where public monopolies have been replaced by private ones the result has been predictable. But I'm certainly not dewy eyed about the bad old days of British Rail, which was a national joke.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 09:23 PM   #127
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private ownership of bus routes probably makes more sense in a place with increasing ridership - competition on routes can in theory drive improvements. of course if you have increasing amounts of passengers then public ownership would appear to be working fine so no need to privitse (ie London).

Bus ridership in this area is declining, and it's leading companies to cut and cut and cut to try and claw back money. but that simply starts a vicious circle where less and less people ride and more are forced into cars. the situation has gotten so bad that it now needs to be taken back into state ownership. many essential routes simply aren't going to turn a profit and the private owners have turned their backs on them, reduced frequences, used smaller buses, less streets served or just cut altogether.

on a related note it pisses me off when i see buses stuck in traffic - bus passengers shouldn't have to pay for the selfish decisions of some car drivers. there are a lot of people who could make plenty of journeys without resorting to putting the keys in the ignition, and if they didn't do that and instead took the bus much of that congestion would disappear, benefitting everyone.

our streets and roads simply aren't built for comprehensive car ownership - driving licences should be a privilege, not a right. increase age of licencing to 21 unless you can prove you need it (living in a designated area, or travel for work), which would reduce cars on the street, increase public transport ridership and have the additional benefit of taking many irresponsible drivers off the roads. also make bans for offences harsher - ie caught drink driving should be a multiple year ban minimum (im talking about 4 years plus here).
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Old January 19th, 2012, 10:16 PM   #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Ellwood View Post
Have you tried the 'bottom road', i.e. through North Shields, past the Tyne Tunnel, Willington Quay, past Segedunum, through Low Walker, Walker Road, City Road, Quayside, Forth Bank and St James' Boulevard?
I think we have a winner.....will try that tomorrow.

Just to clarify, my original point wasn't a rant against the paucities of public transport (my immediate area of Tynemouth and N Shields is very well served) but more about the lack of progress in the road infrastructure over the last decade - the knock on effect, as has already been pointed out, includes that buses get all too frequently caught in the gridlock, negating the PT option anyway.

As Wj_Gibson pointed out, urban density rules out certain improvements (Chilli road roundabout, Corner House etc), but surely we could've addressed at least one more than the Tyne Tunnel over the last 15 years? Silverlink, Testos, Tyne Bridge/Central Motorway, Western Bypass et al will only just get worse, and tarting up the odd Metro station is not going to alleviate this.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 10:37 PM   #129
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Let's not forget the huge amount paid in taxes by car drivers, should they turn to public transport then the govt. will have to tax bus fares.

The main reason I don't use public transport is the behavior of the low lifes that infest it, especially off peak.

It will be a cold day in hell before you catch me on the loser cruiser.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 11:23 PM   #130
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Let's not forget the huge amount paid in taxes by car drivers, should they turn to public transport then the govt. will have to tax bus fares.

The main reason I don't use public transport is the behavior of the low lifes that infest it, especially off peak.

It will be a cold day in hell before you catch me on the loser cruiser.
I travel by bus a lot, off- and on-peak, and by and large I've found people are fine.
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Old January 19th, 2012, 11:54 PM   #131
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on a related note it pisses me off when i see buses stuck in traffic - bus passengers shouldn't have to pay for the selfish decisions of some car drivers. there are a lot of people who could make plenty of journeys without resorting to putting the keys in the ignition, and if they didn't do that and instead took the bus much of that congestion would disappear, benefitting everyone.

o
Why should bus passengers who are also road users not suffer the same congestion as other users? Why should they be some sort of sacred cow and get preferential treatment?

What annoys me are the bus lanes. Traffic would flow much better if the majority of vehicles, the cars, could use all of the road and not just one lane!
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Old January 19th, 2012, 11:54 PM   #132
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Why should bus passengers who are also road users not suffer the same congestion as other users? Why should they be some sort of sacred cow and get preferential treatment?

What annoys me are the bus lanes. Traffic would flow much better if the majority of vehicles, the card, could use all of the road and not one lane!
think about it for, oh i dunno, 10 seconds, and you might discover the answer. cheers.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 12:07 AM   #133
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Originally Posted by WilfBurnsFan

I travel by bus a lot, off- and on-peak, and by and large I've found people are fine.
Absolutely - I use public transport of some stripe virtually every day of the week, and would be hard pressed to recall a single unsavoury incident. Maybe I'm oblivious - I invariably deploy both headphones and book whilst in transit.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 12:26 AM   #134
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I am probably going to get shot here.......

I use the metro reasonably regularly with little hassle [apart from the odd loud shell suit]. However what really annoys me, yes as a driver are [some] cyclists; path-road-path, red lights, I ll cross em, one way street, doesn't apply to me.

Yes I know that s a generalisation, but I regularly - how regularly - probably once a week - nearly end up with a cyclist on my bonnet when they re riding the wrong way along city rd, down Gibson st or up Crawhall. If I honk they swear and I can't help thinking that if they ended up on my bonnet I d be the one left answering difficult questions.

OK rant over, but some clearer regulation as to what the position of cyclists and traffic regulations wouldn't go amiss.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 12:54 AM   #135
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i think the prob with cyclists is that it's a liminal form of transport - it truthfully neither belongs wholly to the road or to the pavement. it's usage in modern terms is an after-thought at best, and a bit of a danger primarily to the cyclists themselves.

a place like copenhagen seems to deal with it best - bike lanes pretty much everywhere, grade or otherwise separated in many places, specific road markings for cyclists, in fact there's even a separate set of traffic signals just for cyclists. in turn everyone is educated on the matter and knows their responsibilities regarding themselves and one another- better than the confused state we have in the UK.

of course they have a far greater proportion of cyclists and it is engrained into their culture, with over a third of all commuters using a bicycle for at least part of the journey.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 01:12 AM   #136
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i think the prob with cyclists is that it's a liminal form of transport - it truthfully neither belongs wholly to the road or to the pavement. it's usage in modern terms is an after-thought at best, and a bit of a danger primarily to the cyclists themselves.

a place like copenhagen seems to deal with it best - bike lanes pretty much everywhere, grade or otherwise separated in many places, specific road markings for cyclists, in fact there's even a separate set of traffic signals just for cyclists. in turn everyone is educated on the matter and knows their responsibilities regarding themselves and one another- better than the confused state we have in the UK.

of course they have a far greater proportion of cyclists and it is engrained into their culture, with over a third of all commuters using a bicycle for at least part of the journey.
I agree. I ve no beef with cyclists, it's more that the rules such as they are, are unclear; are they pedestrians, vehicles, both. You need 'predictability'. I suspect with more clarity it would be safer for cyclists too.

There are obviously bigger issues to do with 'design' of roads, cycleways etc, but a simple highway code type statement to the effect of if you're on the road follow the traffic signals would, I am sure help.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 01:22 AM   #137
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I agree. I ve no beef with cyclists, it's more that the rules such as they are, are unclear; are they pedestrians, vehicles, both. You need 'predictability'. I suspect with more clarity it would be safer for cyclists too.

There are obviously bigger issues to do with 'design' of roads, cycleways etc, but a simple highway code type statement to the effect of if you're on the road follow the traffic signals would, I am sure help.
broadly agree but then you'd have cyclists riding in the middle of the road like cars, which obviously wouldn't work. the fact they ride alongside traffic rather than in it marks them out as a distinct difference. in cities especially cyclists are occasionally going to have to be more aggressive or they'll get HGVs turning on them at junctions and getting squashed to death.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 11:21 AM   #138
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Originally Posted by BigLebowski View Post
I think we have a winner.....will try that tomorrow.

Just to clarify, my original point wasn't a rant against the paucities of public transport (my immediate area of Tynemouth and N Shields is very well served) but more about the lack of progress in the road infrastructure over the last decade - the knock on effect, as has already been pointed out, includes that buses get all too frequently caught in the gridlock, negating the PT option anyway.

As Wj_Gibson pointed out, urban density rules out certain improvements (Chilli road roundabout, Corner House etc), but surely we could've addressed at least one more than the Tyne Tunnel over the last 15 years? Silverlink, Testos, Tyne Bridge/Central Motorway, Western Bypass et al will only just get worse, and tarting up the odd Metro station is not going to alleviate this.
Well if the Coast Road ever does link up as dual carriageway with the Central Motorway then that would be this piece of congestion taken away from the eastern approaches to the City. Course the planners and engineers would have to work out a better system of road crossings and slipways to get rid of the traffic lights. However I cannot see this in my life time.
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Old January 20th, 2012, 12:17 PM   #139
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broadly agree but then you'd have cyclists riding in the middle of the road like cars, which obviously wouldn't work. the fact they ride alongside traffic rather than in it marks them out as a distinct difference. in cities especially cyclists are occasionally going to have to be more aggressive or they'll get HGVs turning on them at junctions and getting squashed to death.
Oh I didn t mean as far as that - not riding in the middle of the road etc. I just meant simple things like stopping at red lights and going the 'right' way if you re on the road
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Old January 20th, 2012, 01:35 PM   #140
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Well if the Coast Road ever does link up as dual carriageway with the Central Motorway then that would be this piece of congestion taken away from the eastern approaches to the City. Course the planners and engineers would have to work out a better system of road crossings and slipways to get rid of the traffic lights. However I cannot see this in my life time.
Well, as you'd have to build the additional carriageway on the south side of the current road, you'd be eating into a bus depot, a big cemetery at Jesmond Road, and a big old people's home at the junction with Sandyford Road.

The north side of the road consists of half a mile of four story town houses that house dozens of small businesses, a big Holiday Inn hotel and Jesmond Metro station.
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