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Old August 19th, 2011, 01:32 PM   #1
Micrav
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LATVIA | Railways | Dzelzceļš

Company A/S Passenger has attributed the new tender of electrical trains to CAF, a Spanish company, the wining model is CIVITY. It is a huge blow to RVR-Bombardier association and also for Latvia in general. For RVR because it is their main activity. Ok, they lost the tram tender because they were not manufacturing trams for a while, but Electrical trains is their speciality. Money goes away of Latvia again and is not spent for local salaries, so lowering again the balance of Latvia and lowering the income. Maybe RVR did not do the right thing to be competitive, they did not hire designers to change the company products, image and strategy?

I don't have answers, the fact is there. My question now is "Will RVR close or partnership with Bombardier will survive and work for other products for Eastern market?"

There is still the big market of high speed train for the Baltics. One day Berlin-Warsaw-Moscow will be connected and also Warsaw- Riga-Tallinn-St-Petersburg. Western european gauge will reach Kaunas soon too. There is need to revive standard connections between Riga, Kaunas, Vilnius and Tallinn...

You can read the full article on db.lv here

Here are pictures of the new exterior and interior. Sure, the quality, the practicality, the design, the service is there!
Source of images: www.db.lv, probably CAF and Vitālijs Stīpnieks, Dienas Mediji











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Old August 19th, 2011, 02:08 PM   #2
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Only, small reward is that RVR will be subcontractor of CAF. For which amount, I don't know. You can read the full article extracted from RVR website:

http://www.rvr.lv (still very poor website for RVR and not updated, sorry, the press release is not in english, use google translator if you wish)

AS „Rīgas Vagonbūves rūpnīca” paziņojums masu medijiem
Rīga, 2011. gada 29. jūnijā

RVR tika piespiesta izstāties no „Pasažieru vilciena” rīkotā konkursa. Uzņēmums zaudējis apmēram pusmiljonu eiro

Papildus noteikumi, kas tika izvirzīti AS „Pasažieru vilciens” rīkotajā konkursā par elektro- un dīzeļvilcienu piegādi, neļāva RVR tajā piedalīties kā pilntiesīgam dalībniekam (ģenerāluzņēmējam). RVR ir spiesta izstāties no konkursa un pieņemt „Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles, S.A.” (CAF) piedāvājumu kļūt par tā apakšuzņēmēju.

Atbilstoši AS „Pasažieru vilciens” rīkotā konkursa kvalifikācijas posma sākotnējiem noteikumiem, RVR iesniedza pieteikumu dalībai konkursā par elektro- un dīzeļvilcienu piegādi sadarbībā ar „Bombardier Transportation” (RVR kā ģenerāluzņēmējs, BT kā apakšuzņēmējs). Abi uzņēmumi noslēdza sadarbības līgumu un uzņēmās savstarpējas saistības.

Šis līgums nodrošināja uz eksportu orientētas vilcienu ražotnes izveidi Latvijā. „Bombardier” tai garantēja investīcijas, mūsdienu tehnoloģiju pārnesi, iekārtu piegādi, kvalitātes kontroli un personāla apmācību.

Pēc tam, kad noslēdzās kvalifikācijas posms, Pasūtītājs izvirzīja RVR un „Bombardier” tandēmam īpašu papildus prasību par solidāru atbildību. Atbilstoši tai, ja šie uzņēmumi uzvarētu konkursā, apakšuzņēmējam (BT) ģenerāluzņēmēja (RVR) vietā nāktos pilnībā atbildēt Pasūtītājam (PV) par to, vai ģenerāluzņēmējs pilda (nepilda) savas saistības: piegādāt vilcienu sastāvus un apkalpot tos 30 gadu garumā. Šāda prasība, zinot nozares globālo pieredzi, skan pavisam absurdi, turklāt tā diskriminē RVR un nostāda to nevienādās pozīcijās attiecībā pret citiem konkursa dalībniekiem. Turklāt šāda prasība nav izvirzīta nevienam citam konkursa dalībniekam, jo neviena cita dalībnieka apakšuzņēmējiem nav jāuzņemas solidāra atbildība par ģenerāluzņēmēju.


Ņemot vērā to, ka konkursa pirmā posma noteikumi neparedzēja šāda veida prasības apakšuzņēmējiem, RVR un BT slēgtais līgums par sadarbību paredzēja klasisku atbildības sadali ķēdē „apakšuzņēmējs (BT) – ģenerāluzņēmējs (RVR) – Pasūtītājs (PV)”.

RVR vairakkārt iesniedza sūdzības Iepirkumu uzraudzības birojā, lūdzot novērst šo un arī citas pretrunas vai neprecizitātes konkursa nolikumā, kas apdraud godīgas konkurences principus. Tomēr lielākā daļa RVR pretenziju netika apmierinātas.

6. maijā, kad no IUB tika saņemts pēdējais oficiālais atteikums, kļuva skaidrs, ka RVR faktiski tiek dzīta strupceļā. „Bombardier” tam izvirzīto PV prasību par solidāru atbildību novērtēja kā neadekvātu, jo tā neatbilda šī konkursa sākotnējiem noteikumiem, kā arī konkursu rīkošanas starptautiskajai praksei.

Tādā veidā „palēninātas iedarbības mīna”, ko jau sarūpēja iepriekšējā PV valde, beidzot „detonēja”. Notika tas, ko tik uzstājīgi centās panākt viens no konkursa dalībniekiem – „Stadler”, vairākkārt pieprasot nepielaist RVR līdzdalībai konkursā. RVR ir spiesta to pamest ģenerāluzņēmēja statusā, jo tā apakšuzņēmējs „Bombardier” nevēlas pildīt PV absurdās prasības.

Rezultātā Latvija ir zaudējusi nopietnu kapitāla un tehnoloģiju investoru. Rīgā netiks uzcelta RVR un „Bombardier” kopējā rūpnīca. RVR zaudējumi, ko radīja piespiedu atteikšanās no dalības konkursā kopā ar BT, pēc provizoriskiem aprēķiniem, ir apmēram pusmiljons eiro lieli.

Nokļūstot šādā sarežģītā situācijā, RVR pieņēma cita konkursa dalībnieka – spāņu uzņēmuma „Construcciones y Auxiliar de Ferrocarriles, S.A.” (CAF) izteikto sadarbības piedāvājumu, piekrītot kļūt par tā apakšuzņēmēju.


Paziņojumu sagatavoja RVR preses dienests
29243077
rvr.info@inbox.lv
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Old August 19th, 2011, 03:10 PM   #3
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With all these new trains coming into our railway, does that mean that our railroad network and stations with their respective stops are going to get renovated just like in Estonia?
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Old August 19th, 2011, 03:49 PM   #4
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. Of course. Sooner or later they'll have to do that. Other way the height between platform and vehicle floor will be too large. As you can see there is no steps under the door in the vehicle.

Quote:
Technical Characteristics
DIMENSIONS

:: Cab car length:21.500 mm
:: Intermediate car length: 16.200 mm
:: Carbody width: 2.880 mm
:: Minimun floor height: 600 mm
:: Train height: 4.300 mm
:: New wheel diameter: 850 mm
Our platforms' height sometimes even 0 mm (from the top of the rail). So 60 cm is too high for a step.

Last edited by Denis_Msk; August 19th, 2011 at 03:57 PM.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 07:50 PM   #5
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Any idea when they will start doing that? Because no way people can use these trains without raised platforms. Old grannies having to jump up 60 cm

Pasažieru Vilciens has 145 stop in Latvia. Where will they get the money to reconstruct all of them?

The trains look great by the way
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Old August 19th, 2011, 08:00 PM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Micrav View Post
Only, small reward is that RVR will be subcontractor of CAF. For which amount, I don't know. You can read the full article extracted from RVR website:
The reward is that we get brand new, modern, awesome, fast, quiet trains, instead of the 50 year old cattle cars we now have. RVR can go screw themselves for all I care. They have never made a modern train and they wanted to participate in this as a main contractor? They don't even have drawings for such a train. If their partnership with Bombardier is so promising, they can continue it without the Pasažieru Vilciens contract. I don't see why tiny little Latvia screws up their business plans so much. I just hope EU does not take away the 100 million LVL they plan to give us for the trains because of this.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 08:25 PM   #7
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Better CAF in an honest way than RVR through lies and bribes, IMO.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 08:49 PM   #8
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Lol @ you all, RVR will built most of those CAF trains. And, as I said like 50 times already, whole contest was under risk several times because of PV's illegitimate wish to gain Stadler's win.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 09:07 PM   #9
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Stadler was the best choice.

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Originally Posted by Rebasepoiss View Post
Better CAF in an honest way than RVR through lies and bribes, IMO.
What? RVR junkyard (literary) does not have enough money for bribes.

Last edited by ABC LV; August 19th, 2011 at 09:13 PM.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 09:27 PM   #10
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Interesting that the floor height is 600mm while the platform height standard is 550mm so there still will be 5 cm step?
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Old August 19th, 2011, 09:30 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bebrs12 View Post
Interesting that the floor height is 600mm while the platform height standard is 550mm so there still will be 5 cm step?
That's normal. All Stadler FLIRT trains have a low-floor height of 600mm, for example.
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Old August 19th, 2011, 11:56 PM   #12
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Congratulations! Atleast you now have some clarity about your new trains (dare we say that it's no surprise that CAF won?)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jelgavnieks View Post
Pasažieru Vilciens has 145 stop in Latvia. Where will they get the money to reconstruct all of them?
Our stations & station platforms reconstruction is largely funded by EU,so I think same applies for Latvia - shared funding by local railway companies and EU.
It doesn't necessarily mean that all stations will be instantly rebuilt. Just think of the scale of this task For example,about 110 stations get new platforms here,but this doesn't cover all stations in Estonia. Some of them will be rebuilt later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jelgavnieks View Post
The reward is that we get brand new, modern, awesome, fast, quiet trains, instead of the 50 year old cattle cars we now have. RVR can go screw themselves for all I care. They have never made a modern train and they wanted to participate in this as a main contractor? They don't even have drawings for such a train. If their partnership with Bombardier is so promising, they can continue it without the Pasažieru Vilciens contract. I don't see why tiny little Latvia screws up their business plans so much. I just hope EU does not take away the 100 million LVL they plan to give us for the trains because of this.
I totally agree with you. Getting new,modern passenger trains to Latvia is more important than trying to resurrect smth,which has been long dead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jānis View Post
Lol @ you all, RVR will built most of those CAF trains. And, as I said like 50 times already, whole contest was under risk several times because of PV's illegitimate wish to gain Stadler's win.
I thought it was the RVR who stirred up trouble and was trying to derail the procurement. Stadler simply got fed up with all the BS and that's why they filed a complaints.
So,in a way they got what they wanted. Imho,RVR will assemble trains,but CAF will build them in Spain.

Btw,I hope that there won't be any issues with CAF trains. They lost here,because their offer didn't meet final train specifications and some of those specifications were related to suitability to Northern European climate & overall weather proofness of trains
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Last edited by Tin_Can; August 20th, 2011 at 12:05 AM.
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Old August 20th, 2011, 10:48 AM   #13
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Tin_Can, как вам ваши новые поезда, нравятся?! И подорожали ли билеты из-за этого?
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Old August 20th, 2011, 01:12 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Прибалтиец View Post
Tin_Can, как вам ваши новые поезда, нравятся?! И подорожали ли билеты из-за этого?
I hope you don't mind,if I give my answer in English. My Russian is bit too rusty :P

It's hard to say anything about our new trains right now (we get our first new train in next year) - details are really sketchy and right now we basically only know that we get Stadlers and we know how they will look like (I mean the livery) Not exactly smth,what you can build your opinion upon
Anyway,I personally like them already As they will be based on Stadler Flirts used in Finland and these are really sexy trains

And no,ticket prices aren't affected by train purchase. Here train tickets are (and most likely will remain) one of most stable public transportation tickets in terms of cost.
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Old August 20th, 2011, 01:29 PM   #15
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More pics from here:





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Old August 20th, 2011, 08:44 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin_Can View Post
I hope you don't mind,if I give my answer in English. My Russian is bit too rusty :P
Clearly, I understand that English is easier
I thought that the new cars you have there ... nothing comparable in the real soon!
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Old August 20th, 2011, 10:57 PM   #17
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The passenger train project envisages rebuilding of platforms in train stops as well. "All inclusive" project.

Regarding RVR - they were hopeless as main contractors, unfortunately. They (and we in general) should be lucky as hell that they were contracted by CAF to make bodies for trains. Thus the company still will has a choice to survive.
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Old August 21st, 2011, 08:22 AM   #18
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Looks like Lithuania is the only Baltic country that's buying different types of trains in small numbers at a time. Latvia and Estonia have both opted for large bids. Estonia will receive 38 trains and Latvia....how many trains does this bid include? Sorry, if this has been said before.

Anyways, I'm glad that someone other than Stadler won in Latvia because now there will be some difference in rolling stock among the Baltics.
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Old August 21st, 2011, 11:44 AM   #19
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34 EMU's and 7 DMU's. Maybe someone know the size of current PV fleet? Can't find on their website.
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Old August 21st, 2011, 01:12 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bebrs12 View Post
34 EMU's and 7 DMU's. Maybe someone know the size of current PV fleet? Can't find on their website.
While the number of new EMU's probably covers Latvian need,the number of DMU's looks really small. Are there any plans of buying more later?
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