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Old May 9th, 2005, 01:19 PM   #1
ncon
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efek di jakarta/indonesia dengan pembukaan kasino di singapore (bahasa language only)

post u'r opinion

(kita mengambil topik ini seriously)

apahkah jakarta harus mempunyai kasino juga?
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Old May 9th, 2005, 01:30 PM   #2
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soalnya di jakarta kan ada juga orang2 yg kaya

biasanya mereka kalo mao gamble gede gedean mesti harus ke las vegas
tapi skr singapore membuka kasino and mereka very happy
like this article:

The Electric New Paper :
The little red dot just got hotter
THEY can't wait for it to get going.
Regular travellers from Indonesia have been keenly following Singapore's plan for an integrated resort (IR).

20 April 2005

REPORTING FROM JAKARTA
By Jo Budimanin
tnp@sph.com.sg

THEY can't wait for it to get going.

Regular travellers from Indonesia have been keenly following Singapore's plan for an integrated resort (IR).

They said they often use Singapore as a stopover on flights to other destinations. Now they may be tempted to stay longer.

Many rich Indonesians frequent Singapore, and inject a considerable amount of money into top-end property and financial investments.

Indonesians are among Singapore's top tourist spenders with an average of $792 spent per visit last year.

Some even call it their second home.

Now they are excited by Prime Minister Lee Hsien Loong's announcement yesterday giving the go-ahead for two mega resorts to be built in Marina Bay and Sentosa.

WEALTHY INDONESIANS

For years, wealthy Indonesians have travelled around the world for the resorts and casinos.

Mr Eddy Widodo, 65, a semi-retired businessman, is one of them.

Along with his wife and siblings, he frequently goes on weekend cruises. He says it's a holiday with great shows, good food - and a casino.

Like him, the friends he travels with are usually businessmen, between the ages of 35 and 50.

In a few days, the 'big fish' among them can spend $100,000 to $200,000 on such trips.

Mr Widodo said it is about time that a major resort with gambling facilities is developed here.

He said: ''Now Singapore realises that they're losing potential monetary gain to places like Macau and Las Vegas. Singapore has wised up.'

Mr Tino Muljana's daughter - who works in Singapore - has been sending text messages on the latest news.

The 56-year-old visits his daughter every two or three months.

He was all for an integrated resort with major shows, restaurants and other entertainment outlets.

He said: 'I was happy when my daughter told me the news. It will be very convenient. When my wife shops, I can gamble.'

Mr Richard Mangaweang, 33, a magazine editor and a former civil servant, thinks it's about time for Indonesia to consider one too.

He said: 'I think that (legalising gambling) is something we (Indonesia) ought to have done a long time ago. We are clearly losing money from Indonesians going overseas to gamble.

'Islamic teaching forbids gambling, but we can regulate things properly the way the Malaysians do. Allow gambling for non-Muslims.'

Political analyst Effendi Gazali predicted that Indonesians will travel to Singapore in droves.

More Indonesian cash will be spent, not just at the IRs, but on everything from property to shopping.

Dr Hakim Murni, an economics lecturer at Jakarta's Atma Jaya Catholic University, agreed.

FOREIGN INVESTORS

He said there's also the possibility of foreign investors - who may have originally considered investing in Indonesia - moving their funds to Singapore. Because the IRs may make Singapore far more profitable.

Any advantages for Indonesia, then?

Mr Sukardi Rinakit, a political analyst, said there will be a decrease in illegal gambling activities at home as those who can afford it will travel to Singapore instead.

According to Indonesian law, all forms of gambling are illegal.

It is difficult for the government to overturn this law and legalise gambling as opposition by religious leaders is strong. Yet gambling is widespread.

Simple casinos exist in Hayam Wuruk and other areas of Jakarta's Chinatown.

So why not have a legal one in Indonesia too, some are asking now.

Mr Rinakit said: 'Although illegal, gambling continues to thrive business here. It's better to legalise it, so the state can benefit from the taxes.'

But Mr Rudy Bera, a lawyer and member of the Indonesian Bar Association, said the Muslim opposition is just too strong.

He said: 'Legally, it will be a disadvantage for local as well as foreign investors should gambling be legalised in Indonesia, as the law can be easily overturned at any time. The opposing party is too strong at the moment.'


saya bukan tidak setuju degan pembukaan kasino si singapore (itu ide bagus mean asia city also can have kasino)

but yg i afraid is that when indonesian gamble mereka bisa kalah habis habis an

mean there will be lesser wealthy indonesian

kasih tau honestly
saya di sing dah tinggal 7 years dan akhir nya dapet imeg jelek singapore
mereka pikir indo itu poor country but kalo skr lu bilang mereka indo semuanya gak poor (mereka percaya soalnya kita ada proof ) tapi setelah ntar taun 2009 kalo kita bilang mungkin mereka tak percaya soalnya wealthy indonesian nya uang nya abis di kasino sing!

jadi we need u'r opinion
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Old May 9th, 2005, 01:48 PM   #3
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Di genting malaysia ada casino juga kan?
Tapi rasanya orang Jakarta masih ngga ke sana juga buat gambling.
Singapore is closer, though.
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:01 PM   #4
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seakan-akan kita gak mau tapi sebetulnya banyak silent-supporters yg mau kasino di jakarta. kalo udah gitu kenapa gak referendum aja penduduk jkt? seperti opini gw di thread yg laen, ttg kasino lebih baik diserahkan ke provinsi2 masing2 utk nentuin boleh apa gaknya. kalo mau dibuat peraturan nasional kayaknya susah soalnya karakter masing2 provinsi beda2.
singapur buat kasino, gw rasa gak terlalu banyak efeknya utk kita, kan --spt kata sanhen-- di genting juga udah ada. udah lama lagi. emang sih orang indonesia lebih banyak yg ke singapur dibanding malaysia.
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:21 PM   #5
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soalnya kenapa gak banyak orang indo peegi ke genting soalnya di genting hotel nya kurang " GRAND" trus ntar singapore uangnya (gamble nya) pake USD
pasti banyak wealthy orang indo ke singapore

skr aja indo kadang di ejek2 sama orang sing(emang beciin sih tapi bukan semua lah 60%-70%)
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:37 PM   #6
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kenapa pula orang indo diejek oleh orang sing?? dengar kata di thai juga mau bina satu kasino disana... tetapi belum dipersetujui... memang betul hotel dan kasino di genting kurang 'grand' berbanding las vegas dan akan datang di sing...
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:39 PM   #7
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ada khabar angin juga kata genting mungkin menang salah satu dari projek kasino di sing itu... tapi keputusan belum diumum lagi...
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:41 PM   #8
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aku setuju kasino di legalisir di indonesia...sekarang saja banyak yang illegal...dan banyak yang ke sing/malaysia untuk judi.. daripada duit tersebut keluar lebih baik di legalisir aja , bisa jadi masukan yang besar untuk pembangunan (seperti Ali Sadikin taun 70an).
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:48 PM   #9
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apa yg gua takutin itu yah

kaya skr orang singapur itu ngejek2 kalo jakarta itu gak ada orang yg kaya trus kotanya jelek
tapi kalo sekarang (sebelum pembukaan kasino di sing) kita kasih mereka liat mereka bakal kaget/shut up

tapi ntar(setelah pembukaan kasino) mereka ngejek kita terus dan kita gak bisa buat apa2
karena wealthy indonesian nya gamble abis -abis an
mean lesser wealthy indonesia (means also kita gak ada back up kalo kita ngomong indo ada orang yg kaya)

trus think again knapa orang indo masih kaya padahal mereka gamble d kasino LV ?
soalnya pertama

hotelnya mahal
ticket pesawat mahal
jadi mereka mungkin pergi ke lv 2 kali in one year

TAPI skr di sing kan mau buka
hotelnya bayarnya pake SING $ (lebih murah)
ticket pesawat (lebih murah tambah skr ada rute jakarta-singapore)(budget airline)

mungkin mereka bisa pergi ke singapore every weekend
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Old May 9th, 2005, 02:54 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvin
aku setuju kasino di legalisir di indonesia...sekarang saja banyak yang illegal...dan banyak yang ke sing/malaysia untuk judi.. daripada duit tersebut keluar lebih baik di legalisir aja , bisa jadi masukan yang besar untuk pembangunan (seperti Ali Sadikin taun 70an).
emang setuju jakarta mesti ada kasino soalnya di jakarta aja sekarang banyak yg illegal kok

trus duit nya kalo mereka pergi ke sing yah.... uang nya di ambil goverment sing deh mending uangnya di ambil pemerintah indo buat mega project

apa yg bikin me angry is that government singapore gak mau ngakuin kalo second largest tourist coming to singapore/spent in singapore itu orang indo
mereka bilang malaysia second bukan indo yg second( berarti uang government sing mostly come dari orang indo)

mereka juga gak terima kasih orang indo loh (bukan semua mostly lah)
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Old May 9th, 2005, 03:01 PM   #11
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beberapa point kalo INDONESIA bantuin SING(tapi mereka masih ngejek indo)

lagu kemerdekaan sing dibuatin orang indo lahir di sumatra

tempat daerah marina/tempat di mana kasino akan di buat itu reclaimed land
(raw material kebanyakan di ambil dari batam EG: pasir & tanah

INDO supply veg , poultry , air, natural gas dan listrik ke sing

pemain badminton national singapore orangnya dari indo namanya Ronald Susilo!
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Old May 9th, 2005, 03:37 PM   #12
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Ali Sadikin Tetap Minta Agar Judi Dilegalkan
Senin, 09 Mei 2005 | 18:02 WIB

TEMPO Interaktif, Jakarta:Mantan Gubernur DKI Jakarta era ‘70-an Ali Sadikin tetap pada pendiriannya, agar judi di Jakarta dilegalkan.

“Kalau tidak ada judi, Jakarta tidak akan maju-maju,” katanya saat berbicara dalam acara “Terima Kasih Bang Ali”, yang digelar Alumni Institut Kesenian Jakarta di Graha Bhakti Budaya Taman Ismail Marzuki, Senin (9/5).

Menurut dia, hasil dari legalisasi judi bisa digunakan untuk berbagai pembangunan yang ada di ibu kota negara ini. Saat dirinya menjadi gubernur, kenangnya, kas pemerintah provinsi DKI Jakarta saat itu hanya Rp 66 juta, Rp 44 juta subsidi dari pemerintah pusat, dan Rp 22 juta pendapatan asli daerah.

“Padahal, waktu itu penduduk Jakarta sudah 3,5 juta. Dari mana biaya pembangunan untuk menopang penduduk sebanyak itu?,” ujarnya.

Menurut purnawirawan marinir bintang tiga itu, izin perjudian sebenarnya sudah ada di Jakarta sejak jaman Belanda. Namun, saat itu, hanya diperuntukkan bagi orang-orang Cina. “Tapi sekarang juga ada. Yang jaga adalah yang punya senjata,” ujarnya.

Gubernur DKI Jakarta Sutiyoso yang hadir dalam acara itu, tidak menanggapi secara langsung tentang ide Ali Sadikin ini. Namun, dia mengaku kalau dia banyak berguru dari Ali. “Dia tidak takut dikecam atas tindakannya. Sejak saya jadi gubernur, beliau saya angkat jadi penasehat dan guru saya. Saya hanya berusaha jadi murid yang pintar,” katanya. Raden Rachmadi
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Old May 9th, 2005, 03:58 PM   #13
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Memang Judi ini unique ...
Udah dibahas panjang lebar ...
ada yang setuju dilegalkan
ada yang gak setuju ..

Kedua nya punya alasan yang masuk akal dan logis ...

Tapi kalo di jakarta referendum ..... saya sih sudah tahu keputusannya apa ...

Tapi ...
Bolehlah saya personally speaking .....
hati kecilku tetap mengatakan ... tidak setuju kalau dilegalkan ...

Nanti Alasan yang sama bisa dipakai untuk melegalkan prostitusi ...
Nanti alasan yang sama bisa dipakai untuk melegalkan ....... dan .......

JUDI ...
yang menang KETAGIHAN
yang kalah PENASARAN

Temenku banyak yg berjudi .... terutama judi BOLA ....
tapi aneh nya mereka gak mau di bilang GAMBLER ....
trus apa dong ....
Mereka Bilang .... BETTER ..... :-) ......... artinya menjadi Lebih Baik .....
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Old May 9th, 2005, 04:02 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alvin
Menurut purnawirawan marinir bintang tiga itu, izin perjudian sebenarnya sudah ada di Jakarta sejak jaman Belanda. Namun, saat itu, hanya diperuntukkan bagi orang-orang Cina. “Tapi sekarang juga ada. Yang jaga adalah yang punya senjata,” ujarnya.
Kayaknya gue tau siape yang elu maksud Li .... :-)
en
Ane denger-denger .... ente juga cari makan dari die sekarang ? .... Bener Kagak Tuch ?? !!!

Ma'af dech kalo ane salah denger ...... tapi yang ane denger gituh ......
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Old May 11th, 2005, 09:22 AM   #15
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hi guys guess what there is already casino in BATAM!!
the hotel is called PLANET HOLIDAYS HOTEL

this is the details:
Theme: Hotel
Price: US$40-80 » Currency Converter
Comparison: more expensive than average
Address: Jl Raja Ali Haji, Sei Jodoh.
Phone: 433555, 433666
Website: http://www.planetholidayhotel.com/

yes when u check out the website they did not write they have casino there
as it is forced to close down in febuary 2005

tapi indo....... bisa aja hotelnya buka kasino lagi tanpa pengetahuan police hehehe

article:

This is a new-looking and tall hotel located in Nagoya town. It used to hold one of the largest and newest casino in Batam island. But like the other casinos in Batam, Planet Holiday's casino was forced to close in February 2005 by the authorities As the hotel was made with the casino visitors in mind, the end result was a nice, very well-maintained, and comfortable hotel. To me however, this hotel feels kind of cold, just another one of those mass-produced 4-stars hotel with no character catered to the masses. This hotel is very popular with Singaporeans

another one: (people review)

Planet Holiday Hotel: Batam's casino hotel
A tower of 21 floors with 300 luxury rooms and suites, Planet Holiday Hotel is an upper class accommodation focused on its casinos. Rooms have internet access at 20,000 rupiahs per-hour or 500,000 rupiahs per month with unlimited time usage.

My personal view of this casino hotel in my surprise visit to Batam's gambling paradise! travelogue...
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Old May 11th, 2005, 09:34 AM   #16
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batam udah ada 3 kasino resort lho.>>>

liat website ini deh!
http://www.gamingfloor.com/Asian_Casinos.html#Indonesia

enjoy!
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Old May 21st, 2005, 01:09 PM   #17
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kenapa judi ga dilegalin di batam aja?
soalnya kalo di jakarta banyak yg protes..
kyk muslim radikal gtu sepeti FPI ato MUI yg dikit2 bilang haram..
kalo dibatam gw ga tau yah presentase pemilunya.. tp jakarta kan yg menang kmaren PKS partai muslim pasti DPRDnya ngelarang keras soalnya yg duduk disitu kebanyakan kyk gtu.. udah gtu ketua MPRnya juga dr pks.. makanya ngelegalin judi di indo susah bgt..
ntar takutnya kalo dijakarta udah dibuka dihancurin lagi..
kyk di kafe2 kemang 2 taun lalu...
i was in the neighborhood pas FPI nge"razia"/"sweeping" kafe2...
serem bgt.. yg ada malahan mereka ngrusakin2 kaca, meja-kursi, etc.. sama mrk ngambilin alkohol yg ad di bar2...
trus ownernya dimintain duit.. padahal mrk udah dpt izin..

back to the topic...

orang indo esp. the indo-chinese.. ituh paling suka gamble... dulu kan mereka suka maen tuh di ANCOL kalo ga salah kata supir gw.. dulu oma gw sering kesitu...
but they banned it right? mereka kan nge-ban gamble di jkt gr2 muslim radikal itu. dan soeharto pd jaman itu stuju gara2 he thought that we didn't need money from gamble... padahal bang ali udah ngebangun jakarta pake uang gamble juga kan..

i think if they built casino di singapore , jakarta ga bakalan ngaruh bgt.. cuz FISKAL masih mahal!!!! if they hapus FISKAL it will affect alot thou...
aplg banyak skrg budget2 air...

duit dr gamble tuh besar bgt sebenernya buat pembangunan indo.. but they ban it! benci kan? malahan kalo dibuat gamble bakalan dpt banyak devisa ato malahan bisa bayar utang indo yg banyak bgt...

got my point?

cheers.
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Old May 21st, 2005, 09:34 PM   #18
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betul.. legalized gamble itu pasti akan mendatangkan banyak uang untuk pemerintah. Tapi segala sesuatu yang dilegalkan pasti ada efeknya/dampaknya buat masyarakat... Jangan mikir bahwa yang gamble itu untuk yang high class aja, karena legalisasi judi juga harus menganut "gamble for all" (judi untuk semua kalangan), yang miskin ato udah kere pun akan menikmati judi jika sudah legal. Kalo untuk orang high class it's oK untuk ngambur2in duit untuk judi, mau kalah ataupun menang..fine2 aja, tapi bagaimana dengan nasib orang2 yang not well educated ataupun kere/ miskin yang tergiur jadi kaya dengan berjudi??? Orang2 yang tidak mempunyai latar belakang untuk mengambil keputusan yang tepat seperti yang didapat dalam pendidikan dalam masyarakat high class. Apa sudah dipikirin efeknya sampai situ??

Seperti yang kita tahu crime rate di Indonesia itu meroket setelah krisis ekonomi, nah sementara pengangguran masih dimana2, dan pemerintah tidak sanggup memberi lapangan pekerjaan yang layak... Boro2 memberi lapangan kerja yang layak, orang susah/miskin/kere yang bersusah payah untuk berusaha bekerja secara layak seperti berdagang kaki lima... tidak pernah mendapat tempat di lingkungan, malahan selalu diusir dan digusur.. Jujur saja, walaupun PKL itu mengganggu, but they're more civilized than smugglers, burglars, copet, pak ogah cepek, pengemis yang physically tubuhnya masih mampu bekerja... TAPI, pemerintah malah tidak pernah memberi tempat bagi orang2 yang ingin bekerja lebih layak/mulia (berdagang PKL) dibanding pekerjaan2 yang disebutkan diatas.. Anehnya PKL yang justru memberi harapan untuk mencari nafkah secara layak malah dianggap sampah/penyakit masyarakat.... IRONIS kan??

Back to Judi... Yang saya takut bukan karena judi itu maksiat atau bla2... Tapi orang2 yang tidak siap menerima "resiko" berjudi itu lebih bahaya.. Digusur pemerintah karena berkerja secara layak (berdagang/PKL), berubah profesi sebagai penjudi...nanti duitnya dipakai buat judi lagi, siapa tau hoki2an menang. N then mereka lupa untuk bekerja, maunya berjudi melulu. Hal ini mungkin tidak terlalu masalah bagi para "high class", karena money can buy everything, including their happiness. Tapi tidak dengan orang2 kecil, miskin, kere... Mereka tidak pernah belajar financial risk ataupun pelajaran ekonomi dasar. Saya lebih takut lagi... karena kriminalitas akan semakin sulit dikontrol, karena multiplier efek ini...

So, legalized gamble harus melihat SELURUH ASPEK... jangan dilihat dari satu sisi/aspek saja.. For me, legalized gamble walaupun menaruh banyak harapan terhadap kas pemasukan negara, tapi kayaknya masih tidak cocok diterapkan saat ini... melihat masih besarnya gap antara masyarakat "high class" dan "low class"... sangat signifikan... dan ini faktor yang sangat tidak mendukung. Apalagi.... pendidikan kita masih JAUUUH tertinggal dari negara VIETNAM sekalipun!!!! dimana PENDIDIKAN memegang faktor yang SANGAT KRUSIAL bagi pembentukan karakter dan prinsip masyarakatnya..

Kalau Indonesia sudah mapan, maju, murni demokratis, pendidikan maju, gap antara si kaya dan miskin kecil (tidak signifikan).... baru bolehlah memulai wacana / rencana LEGALISASI JUDI.

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Old May 22nd, 2005, 03:57 AM   #19
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eh tapi kalo gak salah denger ya gubenur sutioso suruh beberapa orang ke las vegas katanya di mau buat kasino di jakarta

dan itu lebih bagus!
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Old May 22nd, 2005, 03:44 PM   #20
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tapi kalo gw bilang sih.. buat kasino di jakarta resikonya bakalan tinggi banget..
soalnya di jakarta tuh banyak bgt muslim radikalnya... yah yg kyk gw bialng td.. FPI..
kalo gue suggest sih mending gamble di jakarta tuh legalin separo aja...
what i mean separo tuh they don't have bener2 gamble di kasino.. yah kyk lotto ato pacuan kuda.. itu kan lebih "mengurangi resiko"
dan kalo lotto ato pacuan kuda tuh dimaenin sama both "high" & "low" class sosc.
and its better than togel, or buntut.. yg slalu digrebek...
i think it will reduce crime rate...
if the muslim radikal or MUI ngeluarin fatwa haram & protest thou....
kalo kasino dibuat di batam itu lebih bagus..
soalnya both indo sama singaporean maen disitu..

so.. gimana neh teman2...

cheers..
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