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Old April 13th, 2017, 05:35 PM   #21
saerdna99
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Wondering if they are banking on Vinik's developments having enough retail to suffice? Even so, not having retail still doesn't make sense to me. You have Place, Skyhouse, etc. within a block, but nothing beats having a spot in your building.
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Old April 13th, 2017, 05:37 PM   #22
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Looks like two units per floor with 180 degree views.
I'd like to see some revised renderings. Were any posted?
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Old April 13th, 2017, 05:48 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saerdna99 View Post
Wondering if they are banking on Vinik's developments having enough retail to suffice? Even so, not having retail still doesn't make sense to me. You have Place, Skyhouse, etc. within a block, but nothing beats having a spot in your building.
They're skipping retail out of convenience, and there's still a good amount of empty retail in the neighborhood. The problem is, one day there will be a lot more demand for retail, and we'll be stuck with that dead zone on Channelside Drive. Not good.

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Looks like two units per floor with 180 degree views.
I'd like to see some revised renderings. Were any posted?
Yep, two units per floor (on average) so views will be 180 degrees to 270 degrees or more per unit

No renderings are available, just the elevations I posted.
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Old April 13th, 2017, 06:07 PM   #24
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They're skipping retail out of convenience, and there's still a good amount of empty retail in the neighborhood. The problem is, one day there will be a lot more demand for retail, and we'll be stuck with that dead zone on Channelside Drive. Not good.
It's not only not good it violates the Channel District special zoning code. So hopefully it will be denied.

As for retail demand in the area, there is less retail space available now than at anytime in the last 10 years despite hundreds of thousands of square feet being built. The problem is Mecury itself owns too much retail that isn't full. Not that channel district has too much retail.

The drive the point home, the only retail that Mercury doesn't own that's still available in the area are:
  • Slade Meridian facing retail (which isn't full because it's too narrow)
  • Two smaller retail spaces in the towers (Which are both very awkward spaces)
  • One larger space in Skyhouse
  • Two spaces at the Fitzgerald (which just opened)

They could all probably fit inside just one of the larger spaces in GCAK. A normal sized retail space there will be very successful
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Old April 13th, 2017, 07:17 PM   #25
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Leaving this URBN post here:

Quote:
Earlier today we posted that Mercury Advisors is seeking a non-substantial change request for a 36 story condo tower at Whiting and Channelside. We oppose this project because it lacks retail space despite having a large amount of frontage along Channelside Drive and also frontage on Whiting. Since the project isn't going up for rezoning, there will be no public hearing on the project.

Therefore, we're asking that everyone writes letters to the city, explaining that the project should be denied for lacking retail. Here are the various ways to send such a letter:

Gloria Moreda
Land Development Coordination
1400 North Boulevard
Tampa, Florida 33607
Phone: (813) 274-3100, Option 2
Fax: (813) 259-1799
Email: [email protected]

The project specifically violates Sec. 27-204(b)(1) of the city of Tampa's code, which states:

"All developments shall provide residential, office, neighborhood serving commercial uses, including general retail, restaurant, and/or personal services, and said uses shall be located on the ground floor and may extend to the second floor and above for a specific user. Furthermore, the location of said uses within the ground floor assists in the creation of pedestrian interaction and connectivity to the public right-of-way."
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Old April 13th, 2017, 07:26 PM   #26
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I forgot how far south this building goes, but doesn't this project still leave a small lot of land unused between the garage and the tower? I don't see anyone trying to build something there considering the small size, so why not add a park with enough space for outdoor seating and add a restaurant there?
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Old April 13th, 2017, 08:09 PM   #27
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I forgot how far south this building goes, but doesn't this project still leave a small lot of land unused between the garage and the tower? I don't see anyone trying to build something there considering the small size, so why not add a park with enough space for outdoor seating and add a restaurant there?
Answered my own question, the Port Authority owns the remaining empty land between Del Villar and the parking garage. So I emailed Gloria and suggested possibly having the Port Authority leasing the land to the city and/or the developer and allowing a small plaza on the land. Move the stairwell and the utility rooms (I'm guessing that's what those rooms are) to the southwest corner and that should open up enough space for a restaurant for that corner.

Because honestly, what is going to be placed there by the Port Authority? Right now, it's only used for parking for RVs and how many people are actually driving their huge RV through downtown and Channelside and looking for a space?
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Old April 14th, 2017, 03:07 PM   #28
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Deadzone?....lol

So, if you are of the mindset that you need to be able to stroll down any given street and have a hip store you want to pop into, maybe...then its good.

...most of those future residents here will be perfectly happy without the retail.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 05:22 PM   #29
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Deadzone?....lol

So, if you are of the mindset that you need to be able to stroll down any given street and have a hip store you want to pop into, maybe...then its good.

...most of those future residents here will be perfectly happy without the retail.
No idea why you insist on settling for less. Especially when less is illegal. It's almost as if you have a vested interest in it.

The left one is what we'll see from Channelside Drive forever at the ground floor.

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Old April 14th, 2017, 05:59 PM   #30
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So with Brian's logic we should force parking but not retail.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 06:01 PM   #31
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More details from the Times article

Quote:
The previously-planned robotic garage, which would have had an automated storage and retrieval system for cars, has been abandoned for five levels of a traditional parking garage.

Mercury Advisors also will not be pursuing LEED certification for the space, a designation for energy-efficient and environmentally-friendly buildings. Instead, Stoltenberg said, they will work to get a similar certification, but didn't have more specifics. The building will still have an emphasis on sustainable materials and construction.

Stoltenberg expects construction to begin within about a year.
http://tbtpics.tampabay.com/news/bus...hannel/2320282
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Old April 14th, 2017, 06:40 PM   #32
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I don't really understand Brian's reasoning for a developer to break a code that should no doubt put any project DOA. Within 5 years, you'll have at least 400~ more people living in Channelside. You'll have a full service grocery store that will attract more interest in living in Channelside, but also more traffic in the surrounding area. USF Medical School will be open and so will the office building right next door. I'll even wager that the lot where Phase II of The Place will be under construction and the block south of the Slade. Add in the hotel on the corner of Kennedy and Meridian that I almost forgot about. By the time this thing is completed, almost all of the above will be completed or close to. Setting up a more livable and lively neighborhood. I don't think Mercury would have any issue setting up at least one restaurant within their project.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 08:03 PM   #33
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Quote:
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Move the stairwell and the utility rooms (I'm guessing that's what those rooms are) to the southwest corner and that should open up enough space for a restaurant for that corner.
I'd like to see some retail too, but aside from what's required or desired, given the small size of the lot and the ramped configuration of the parking garage, it would be hard to fit in. It looks like there's a mid-level on the south end, making it impossible to add retail on the ground floor. I bet retail was only really feasible when the car elevator was still in the design, but those are very expensive.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 08:26 PM   #34
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^The site is over half an acre, some/all of the ground floor parking plus the lobby and all that stuff could be moved to the 2nd floor.

What happened is they put like no effort redesigning this when they lost the robotic garage. That's what was freeing up space for retail in the first iteration of the plans. All they would have to do is make the garage 6 stories instead of 5 and the problem would probably be solved. And a 6 story garage isn't even that tall for a 36 story tower.

Regardless, these aren't excuses that somehow excuse the developer from following the ordinance that requires retail. They have to design their project around ordinances, ordinances don't get enforced around developer's wishes.
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Old April 14th, 2017, 08:40 PM   #35
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Quote:
"...ordinances don't get enforced around developer's wishes."
No, here they just get pushed aside.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 04:42 AM   #36
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Speaking of mercury advisers/ GCAK, the large retail in between the east building of GCAK and ventana seems to have sold. There is fencing all along the back parking lot, blocking off access. I briefly spoke to a GCAK security guard saturday evening inquiring whats going on back there.

He informed me that a 'trucking distribution center' will be moving in. Kind of a weird choice, but i guess they are just happy to be able to rent it out. Ill try to snap a picture of it tomorrow.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 03:08 PM   #37
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It is not settling, it is accepting of what owners want to build and where residents want to live.

Not everyone believes Tampa will be a bustling city of pedestrians enjoying walking long distances in the extreme weather, carrying small bags and giving up their cars for the exciting life in the big city.

I love seeing how the area is becoming more walkable but I am also aware of the logistics of our area and don't think complaining about everything that isn't what I want is very mature or realistic.

Sorry, I enjoy the growth here and support most of the area development...shoot me.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 03:12 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by saerdna99 View Post
So with Brian's logic we should force parking but not retail.
No with my 'logic' we should accept the fact the car is here to stay. Not only is it here but it is absolutely necessary to navigate this sub-urban landscape.

Most of the retail locations have been vacant, people aren't as successful with tea houses and cafes...and patrons aren't that supportive, not enough to make them successful.

With my logic, we would let the market decide and not a handful of non-stakeholders making armchair decisions for those actually taking the risks.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 04:27 PM   #39
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No with my 'logic' we should accept the fact the car is here to stay. Not only is it here but it is absolutely necessary to navigate this sub-urban landscape.
It's not. Maybe for you it is.

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Most of the retail locations have been vacant, people aren't as successful with tea houses and cafes...and patrons aren't that supportive, not enough to make them successful.
A lot of this is just conjecture and guessing. If you take out Channelside, which was never meant to serve the neighborhood, most of the retail in the District isn't vacant. Channel Club and Fitzgerald are bringing way less retail than the demand from their ~600 plus units and the Hampton Inn's 241 hotel rooms will bring.

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With my logic, we would let the market decide and not a handful of non-stakeholders making armchair decisions for those actually taking the risks.
Why do you let the market decide with retail but not parking? You're not pro-market you're pro inflicting your lifestyle on others. You're no less of an armchair on the micro-apartment project then we are on retail. The difference is our cause is good and yours isn't.
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Old April 17th, 2017, 06:12 PM   #40
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Brian- you're making an armchair decision right now. Otherwise state some facts with links. You say you want free market yet you're arguing we should mandate one thing and not the other. That's not free market. Like others here I'll stop replying to your nonsensical responses so we do not clog this thread.
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