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Old November 17th, 2017, 12:35 AM   #61
AndyGM
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Urgh I'm not looking forward to the Woden light rail announcement. I fear they're going to choose the slow meandering route through Barton and the damn thing is not going to be any good for people actually wanting to commute.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 06:11 AM   #62
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I thought that the route through Barton and Kingston would suit the light rail for the Woden leg. I agree with the commuting sentiment but I feel the Blue Rapid bus between the City and Woden is pretty great as is and that having a better option going around through Manuka would be a good thing too.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 06:36 AM   #63
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The whole original point of the Woden link was to form a spine for future connections to Tuggeranong and Weston Creek.

The last thing anyone travelling from those starting points to the city (i.e. the bulk of the passengers) will want is a choice between a meandering route through Barton, adding ten minutes to their trip, or having to jump off at Woden to catch a bus to the city.

It would be much better to have a direct tram, and instead have alternative busses for Barton until any future Barton-Kingston-Fyshwick link is built.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 03:13 PM   #64
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Any major public transport investment in that direction has to have a stop on the eastern side of parliament house.
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Old November 17th, 2017, 03:16 PM   #65
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Seems pretty unlikely that they would keep the intertown bus service between Woden and Civic if the light rail gets built, no matter which way it goes.

Options 1a/1b are basically the same as the bus route now (except for about one street within Woden Town Centre), and 2a/2b don't stop anywhere that the intertown doesn't but have the stupid kink through Barton added in.

It sort of reminds me of a steam era railway alighnment on the map, not something to emulate


45 or 50 minute peak hour trips from Tuggeranong to Civic seem likely with a bus/tram interchange and a meandering tram trip that goes via an area with basically a lot of government offices and not much else - oh yay
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Old November 17th, 2017, 11:10 PM   #66
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Public feedback on the consultation for light rail stage 2 overwhelmingly favoured the Parkes-Barton route (B) over the more direct route A, and it's fairly clear from ACT government comments that B or some variant of it (such as through Parkes to Kings Ave then onto State Circle instead of National Circuit for the Barton section) will be chosen.

I've been following the discussion closely and it's quite clear that the ACT gov sees stage 2 as an opportunity to better integrate the central national area (the reason for Canberra's existence) with the rest of the city. A light rail line that runs past, without stopping (except at Parliament House, the workplace of those least likely to use it), the increasing number of people who live and work in the inner south doesn't make sense.

And just as important, the Commonwealth is sitting on large areas of undeveloped land along the Triangle-Barton route. As is happening on Northbourne Ave (stage 1), light rail can be an enabler of development in the Triangle and Barton. And unlike stage 1, the Commonwealth will have an incentive to tip some serious money into stage 2 if it serves its landholdings. A senior officer of Transport Canberra indicated to me that they're well aware of this. He also said the Barton route would add only about 5 minutes to the City-Woden trip.

The Parkes-Barton route provides the 'pearls on a string' missing from stage 1. What's more, it could be built progressively from the City end with the first leg across the lake opened to use before construction is complete to Woden.
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Old November 18th, 2017, 03:11 AM   #67
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Completely agree with the above post, going through Barton will better connect the inner south with the rest of the city (increasing patronage) and allow new development on Commonwealth land (allowing for the critical additional federal funding). 5 minutes extra is really nothing given its benefits, and that it is the most popular option.
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Old November 18th, 2017, 03:39 AM   #68
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AndyGM View Post
The whole original point of the Woden link was to form a spine for future connections to Tuggeranong and Weston Creek.

The last thing anyone travelling from those starting points to the city (i.e. the bulk of the passengers) will want is a choice between a meandering route through Barton, adding ten minutes to their trip, or having to jump off at Woden to catch a bus to the city.

It would be much better to have a direct tram, and instead have alternative busses for Barton until any future Barton-Kingston-Fyshwick link is built.
I think an extension to Tuggeranong is years away. Belconnen to Russell and points east are a higher priority.

Until recently much of the impetus for LR in Canberra came from those who saw it as a poor man's inter-town heavy rail system. As it is being implemented for stage 1, LR is better suited to hop-on, hop-off transport for dense urban environments rather than the decentralised poly-centric structure envisaged in the Y-plan for Canberra (thankfully IMO that plan is dead).

LR captures the public imagination when it's used to facilitate an urban rather than suburban form. That's the way it's working in Melbourne, Sydney and the Gold Coast, and that's what planned for Newcastle.
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Old November 18th, 2017, 07:22 AM   #69
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Quote:
Originally Posted by marcfranc View Post
Public feedback on the consultation for light rail stage 2 overwhelmingly favoured the Parkes-Barton route (B) over the more direct route A, and it's fairly clear from ACT government comments that B or some variant of it (such as through Parkes to Kings Ave then onto State Circle instead of National Circuit for the Barton section) will be chosen.
The opinions of the public about the light rail are irrelevant.

Nobody from the south who would actually have to use it would support making it a slow crawl.

I dare them to suddenly announce that they are deviating the intertown (blue rapid) through Barton effective immediately and watch the outroar from the people who actually catch it

Remember, this is the same city where the main reason for opposing the currently u/c light rail is "I live in theodore and i dont think they should build a light rail to gungahlin cos im not gonna use it"

Quote:
Originally Posted by marcfranc
LR captures the public imagination when it's used to facilitate an urban rather than suburban form. That's the way it's working in Melbourne, Sydney and the Gold Coast, and that's what planned for Newcastle.
The trams in Melbourne are a slow disgrace that fulfil the role of buses whilst ruining the traffic flow through the inner suburbs.

Australia is hardly a place to look at for light rail inspiration, apart from the Gold Coast. Go buy a ticket to the US and go ride on one of the excellent and fast longer distance light rail systems like in San Diego.
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