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Old December 3rd, 2009, 01:16 PM   #1
Catmalojin
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DUBLIN: High-rise building policy approved

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Dublin high-rise building policy approved
Thursday, 3 December 2009 11:00



Dublin city councillors have voted to recommend a high-rise policy for the city's new development plan.

The Building Height Policy Amendment would allow future developments in excess of 16 storeys in the city centre at three locations.

Under the proposed changes, buildings of 16 storeys or more would be allowed in Dublin City Centre at Heuston and Connolly Stations and the Docklands.

Mid-rise buildings of up to 16 residential storeys would be allowed in Phibsboro and residential developments of up to eight storeys would be allowed across the inner-city.

The outer-city would have residential developments of up to six storeys, with the exception of five areas where buildings of up to 16 storeys would be allowed in Ballymun, North Fringe, Pelletstown, Cherry Orchard and the Naas Road.

However developments within 1km of a Dart, mainline or metro station could have an extra two storeys in office height.

It is also being proposed that Georges Quay will revert to a maximum of eight storeys and that Grangegorman and Clonshaugh Industrial Estate revert to low-rise pending local area plans.

The changes to building height were agreed by 28 votes to 18 at a meeting of councillors last night and will go for public consultation in the New Year.

Story from RTÉ News:
http://www.rte.ie/news/2009/1203/dublin.html

Last edited by Catmalojin; December 3rd, 2009 at 03:14 PM.
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Old December 3rd, 2009, 09:20 PM   #2
rocky
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Hey, Im not familliar with Irish Politics, what does public consultation means? who will have to approve this? isnt it already approved?


edit ; sounds awesome thought, exept for connolly st, there is not much space for towers there.

The building boom is over yes but in three years it can be back at it. The stock exchange will probably boom again next year, and everything starts again...

Last edited by rocky; December 3rd, 2009 at 09:27 PM.
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Old December 3rd, 2009, 09:20 PM   #3
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I fear this is coming too late. The building boom is over. The docklands is as flat as a witch's tit. I can't see that changing any time soon.
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Old December 3rd, 2009, 09:48 PM   #4
nordisk celt83
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Permission will still ultimately have to come from an bord pleanala, who don't approve anything over 4stories!
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Old December 3rd, 2009, 10:20 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by nordisk celt83 View Post
Permission will still ultimately have to come from an bord pleanala, who don't approve anything over 4stories!
I realise there is a conservative attitude in ireland to tall buildings, but can anyone any ideas why this is the case?
I suspect it stems from a culture or mindset that has tended to be anti urban perhaps?
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Old December 4th, 2009, 02:44 PM   #6
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I think your all forgetting the fact that atm there are 5 towers with full planning permission planned for the docklands area - all over 120m. So it's not like this is needed anyway.
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Old December 4th, 2009, 08:59 PM   #7
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I think your all forgetting the fact that atm there are 5 towers with full planning permission planned for the docklands area - all over 120m. So it's not like this is needed anyway.
There's not 5 towers over 120m with full planning permission planned for the docklands area, there's 2...U2 tower and point village.
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Old December 6th, 2009, 09:33 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by odlum833 View Post
I think your all forgetting the fact that atm there are 5 towers with full planning permission planned for the docklands area - all over 120m. So it's not like this is needed anyway.

Dude, you might of got away with saying that 2 years ago but not now. I don't know where you got 5 from!! Technically there are two, and there is not a hope in hell that point village tower will EVER be built. And as for U2 tower youl be waiting a long time for that. The only half tallish building going ahead at the moment is Montevetro, and at 63 metres its pretty embarrassing that its the tallest building in the city.

This policy is most definaltey needed, to stop the urban sprawl of Dublin. Dublin has an urban landmass of the same as Berlin with only 1/3rd the population. The city planning is an absoloute joke.

We need to build up!!!!
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Old December 7th, 2009, 01:18 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by rob mc View Post
Dude, you might of got away with saying that 2 years ago but not now. I don't know where you got 5 from!! Technically there are two, and there is not a hope in hell that point village tower will EVER be built. And as for U2 tower youl be waiting a long time for that. The only half tallish building going ahead at the moment is Montevetro, and at 63 metres its pretty embarrassing that its the tallest building in the city.

This policy is most definaltey needed, to stop the urban sprawl of Dublin. Dublin has an urban landmass of the same as Berlin with only 1/3rd the population. The city planning is an absoloute joke.

We need to build up!!!!
Exactly - the docklands, at present, were planned far too low-rise. The effect is that it appears rather 'flat'. It'd be great to see some clusters of medium rise blocks rising up to a group of higher towers forming a cluster that works well together. So much more living/work space could be created and this would result in extra contributions gained from the planning system which could be directed towards improving the infrastructure.

If Dublin Port moved location so much land would be opened up for redevelopment. It's location there doesn't seem to make much sense - even with the tunnel.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 08:48 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rob mc View Post
This policy is most definaltey needed, to stop the urban sprawl of Dublin. Dublin has an urban landmass of the same as Berlin with only 1/3rd the population. The city planning is an absoloute joke.
Although I agree with the policy, I gotta pull you up on the bit about Berlin. The idea that Dublin and Berlin are geographically the same size has been widely quoted on Internet discussion groups, but it just isn't true.

Have any of the people who requote this actually compared Berlin aerial photos from Gmaps and Dublin side by side? Berlin is a far larger city, geographically, than Dublin, at least twice as big.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 09:38 PM   #11
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there is no density problem in the docklands, the new developments in the docklands are dense enough, the density problem of dublin is that once you are 2 kilometers away from the city center, its a majority of semi detached houses.

I am for highrises, as extra density is a plus, but realisticly, you can build a high density city without highrises.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 11:04 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by rocky View Post
there is no density problem in the docklands, the new developments in the docklands are dense enough, the density problem of dublin is that once you are 2 kilometers away from the city center, its a majority of semi detached houses.

I am for highrises, as extra density is a plus, but realisticly, you can build a high density city without highrises.
It nevertheless has resulted in a 'flat' built environment in the docklands area which has the potential to accomodate more substantial and varied buildings, of mixed heights, and is in such a great position to do so given it's size and location between the city centre and the sea. The rest of the city is hardly welcoming to mid rises never mind high rises and this has to be one of the areas of least resistance in this regard. It could accomodate more residents and economic activity comfortably, without feeling claustrophobic. It also adds capacity for expansion of future office space and economic activity in the central area of the city. Basically the current arrangement just seems to undersell the city - in that it has much more potential waiting to be unleashed.
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Old December 7th, 2009, 11:58 PM   #13
rob mc
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rocky View Post
there is no density problem in the docklands, the new developments in the docklands are dense enough, the density problem of dublin is that once you are 2 kilometers away from the city center, its a majority of semi detached houses.

I am for highrises, as extra density is a plus, but realisticly, you can build a high density city without highrises.
Yes, you can build a high denisty city without highrises, but what has that got to do with anything? Dublin is neither high density nor does it have highrises. We either go one way or the other, and at the moment we are still building semi detached houses which are the problem in the first place.
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Old January 12th, 2010, 01:45 PM   #14
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Site launched to gather opinions on Dublin skyline
12/01/2010 - 07:24:35

A new website goes live today for the public to have their say on keeping high-rise buildings off the Dublin skyline.

Managers will post a seven-year development plan online including efforts to get 15% of people coming into the city centre using bikes.

Michael Stubbs, assistant city manager, said the aim is to let as many people as possible see the draft vision for Dublin.

“We want to hear how people think we can best balance the needs of a growing, dynamic city with the need to protect and conserve the elements that give the city its identity,” he said.

The plan says that Dublin is a low-rise city and should remain so while high rise buildings should only be considered in areas such as the western outskirts and the docklands.

“We want to create a shared vision of success, with an emphasis on employment, community engagement and open governance,” Mr Stubbs said.

“We hope as many people as possible will look at the draft plan for their neighbourhood and give us their views on how it should develop over the coming years.

“The new city development plan will keep us on track to making Dublin a capital city where people will continue to choose to live and work and visit.”

The website www.dublincitydevelopmentplan.ie is live until March 12 and hosts videos of how the city will grow and forums for people to give their views.

The council said the vision for Dublin up to 2017 aims to create a compact and green, well-connected city with a resilient economy.

BreakingNews.ie
Quote:
New Dublin city draft plan puts a halt to rezoning of land for housing

OLIVIA KELLY

Wed, Jan 13, 2010


NO NEW lands will be rezoned for housing in Dublin city until after 2017, under the new draft city development plan which has been released for public consultation.

Assistant city manager Michael Stubbs said there was already sufficient residentially zoned land to meet demand and that some land which had been zoned residential under the last development plan would be rezoned for other uses.

Undeveloped land which had been zoned solely for housing is now being considered for a newly created zoning “Z10A”. This zoning would be similar to the existing Z10 zoning which allows for mixed use development of residential, commercial and retail in urban centres, but would have lower densities.

The new zoning would be suitable for suburban land previously zoned only for housing, Mr Stubbs said.

“Introducing this new outer suburban zoning will strengthen the development of communities by allowing a variety of uses instead of mono use.”

Live-work units and units for small start-up companies would be possible under the zoning, Mr Stubbs said.

While the main strategy of the last development plan was to expand the inner city towards Heuston Station and the docklands, the new plan focuses on consolidating and improving the city and inner-suburban centres such as Ballymun, Finglas, Rathmines and Phibsborough.

Efforts are to be made to improve the appearance of the city quays, eliminate derelict buildings in the city centre and make the city more pedestrian friendly.

However, the redevelopment or improvement aspirations for many areas will require the return of investment from private developers. The plan acknowledges that schemes will be advanced as “priorities and resources permit”.

The draft plan, which proposes standards for building heights and environmental principles, as well as zonings, is open for public consultation until March 12th. It can be viewed and submissions can be made at www.dublincitydevelopmentplan.ie. Video submissions can be made at the council’s Wood Quay Venue.

© 2010 The Irish Times
Site can be found here: http://www.dublincitydevelopmentplan.ie/index.php

Last edited by Catmalojin; January 13th, 2010 at 02:16 AM.
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 04:40 AM   #15
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I wonder will this mean that we see the sale of air space above Heuston and Connolly stations to maximise the potential for development.
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 02:08 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by Viking74 View Post
I fear this is coming too late. The building boom is over. The docklands is as flat as a witch's tit. I can't see that changing any time soon.
You speaking on behalf of the witch community?
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 03:35 PM   #17
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You speaking on behalf of the witch community?
A bit of variety down there would be nice though. Nearly all the buildings are around the same height - flat city. It's nice but flat. The only real focal point is the new bridge and the NCC. It's killing me that both the Watchtower and U2 building are on hold.
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 04:50 PM   #18
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agree
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 05:34 PM   #19
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Totally in favour of highrise in the docklands, and hopefully the port at some stage, but no where else in the city.
In fact, I'd love if they demolished the old high-rise in the city-centre e.g o'connell bridge house, hawkins house and even the central bank. Obviously they're eyesores because of their era, but I'd hate to see them replaced with something of similar bulk...

Wondering if others feel the same?
On the UK forums, it seems people are happy with high-rise buildings right in the heart of a city, which I'd hate to see in Dublin.
Would any one here be happy to see scrapers in the old city centre?
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Old January 23rd, 2010, 05:54 PM   #20
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Originally Posted by niterider View Post
I realise there is a conservative attitude in ireland to tall buildings, but can anyone any ideas why this is the case?
I suspect it stems from a culture or mindset that has tended to be anti urban perhaps?
I know it's a late response, but I think it's because tall buildings constructed in the 1960's were of poor quality and in bad locations, which has cultivated a negative impression of tall buildings here in Ireland.
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